We’ve known for a while (unofficially) that American Airlines is planning on refreshing its long haul product, and there’s an exciting update regarding that.
In this post:
American’s new Boeing 787 configuration
American Airlines already has 46 Boeing 787s in its fleet, and has a further 43 Boeing 787s on order. When all is said and done, American will have one of the largest Boeing 787 fleets in the world. Unfortunately American has been having issues with Boeing 787 delivery delays, so we’re having to wait a bit longer than planned for new jets.
Nonetheless there’s an interesting update regarding that, as the always knowledgable @xJonNYC has some insights about what we can expect. It’s expected that American’s upcoming Boeing 787-9s (to be delivered starting in 2023, hopefully):
- Will feature just 244 seats, compared to the current configuration that features 285 seats
- This will include 51 business class seats, 32 premium economy seats, 18 Main Cabin Extra seats, and 143 economy class seats; for reference, current 787-9s have 30 business class seats, 21 premium economy seats, 36 Main Cabin Extra seats, and 198 economy class seats
- These planes will have all new business class seats with doors, plus all new premium economy seats
- These planes will have a business class walk-up bar in the galley near the second set of doors, plus Viasat Wi-Fi
This represents a massive change to how American is currently configuring its Boeing 787s, both in terms of the number of seats, and in terms of the product.
American’s new Boeing 787 business class
There’s still nothing official about what business class seat we should expect on these new American Airlines Boeing 787s. We do know that back in 2020, American was testing new business class seats, and there seemed to be two options under consideration.
One product being considered was the Collins Aerospace Super Diamond seat with a door, similar to what you’ll find on the Airbus A350-1000s of both British Airways and Etihad Airways. American currently has reverse herringbone seats on most of its Boeing 787s, so this would be a logical evolution.
The other product being considered was the Adient Ascent seat, which otherwise debuted on Qatar Airways’ Boeing 787-9s. What makes this product unique is just how customizable it is, as the configuration can differ significantly between airlines.
Either product would of course be a nice improvement over what American currently has.
Why would American make Boeing 787s so premium?
The most significant development with these new Boeing 787-9s is just how premium American is planning on making them. Does this signify American wanting to become a more premium airline? Personally I wouldn’t read too much into that.
American has struggled for years with how to configure its wide body jets, and we’ve seen configurations changed several times:
- On the one hand, there are synergies to having a consistent configuration, so that planes can easily be cycled throughout the system efficiently
- On the other hand, not all markets have the same amount of premium demand; American has generally taken the approach of cramming as many seats as possible into jets, and that has largely applied to 787s up until now
There have long been rumors of American wanting to adjust its configurations on wide body jets, so my guess would be that these new planes would essentially create a new subfleet for premium markets. The plan is for these Boeing 787-9s to become American’s flagship aircraft, eventually replacing the Boeing 777-300ER.
For example, American’s 787-9s have historically not had enough premium seats for some routes to Hong Kong, London, Sao Paulo, Tokyo, etc. So American has sometimes flown the Boeing 777-300ER to these destinations, even though the planes may have offered too much non-premium capacity.
It’s clear that American is trying to make sure it has a jet that works in premium markets but has better economics than the 777-300ER, and that’s exactly what this will be.
Bottom line
By 2023, American should start taking delivery of more Boeing 787s featuring a new premium product. While we’ve known that we should expect a new business class seat, up until now we didn’t know just how premium these jets were going to be.
It sounds like American’s upcoming Boeing 787-9s will feature 51 business class seats, which is 70% more business class seats than current 787-9s have. Premium economy will similarly be going up in seat count, while economy will be going down in seat count.
It’s exciting to see this development from American, and I can’t wait to learn all the details.
What do you make of American’s plans for premium Boeing 787-9s?
Please can you start flying to South Africa. United and Delta can do it, so you can too on your new aircraft type which can easily cope with such a long flight,
Given that DL and UA are currently arm wrestling over the frequencies to serve Cape Town, using up the last available flights for US airlines, there won't be any new service between the US and S. Africa on US airlines unless the S. African government is willing to change the treaty
The trend is clear and all depends on which side of the wealth scale you or your company are on. With half the 8 billion people slowing creating up the economic scale, businesses of all kinds are booming from consumerism. It’s inevitable that airlines will cater to money as the wealth gap continues to widen. So I guess good for you lucky few and growing. But there will always be demand for cheaper seats for...
The trend is clear and all depends on which side of the wealth scale you or your company are on. With half the 8 billion people slowing creating up the economic scale, businesses of all kinds are booming from consumerism. It’s inevitable that airlines will cater to money as the wealth gap continues to widen. So I guess good for you lucky few and growing. But there will always be demand for cheaper seats for people who don’t need pampering for a few short hours. Priorities
So does this now make AA and UA"s OTHER 787s INFERIOR - since we have a thread about DL's INFERIOR A350s? After all, UA STILL has 787s that do not have direct aisle access in business class and EVERY ONE of AA and UA's 787s have less space in economy than the A350.
So American has sometimes flow the
Typo ^^
@ Tom -- Fixed, thank you!
So I presume first class will be phasing out, as this Premium 787-9s will be the flagship fleet.
AA's problem is its "soft" service and its cabin service is just so lackluster that even a fancy seat can't rescue its reputation too much. I hope the new product will come with better training for F/As, improved F/A staffings, and better catering. Stop using Covid as an excuse to cut service!
I am cautiously...
So I presume first class will be phasing out, as this Premium 787-9s will be the flagship fleet.
AA's problem is its "soft" service and its cabin service is just so lackluster that even a fancy seat can't rescue its reputation too much. I hope the new product will come with better training for F/As, improved F/A staffings, and better catering. Stop using Covid as an excuse to cut service!
I am cautiously optimistic. I will love to see the product but will not that anxious to fly it.
Agreed Adrian, have flown 5M on AA, the human soft side has deteriorated to the lowest possible level, it is unrecognizable compared to the 90’s
Conclusion:
More premium seats on long-haul = less available premium seats on domestic feeder or connecting flights.
Less available premium seats on domestic flights = less complimentary upgrades?
Maybe, but the effect is miminal. There is actually a benefit for a higher chance of upgrades into Business on these routes as there are more seats available.
51+32+18+143=244 seats, not 235. This is basically the same configuration UA has with Polaris but with three more J seats and an extra row and a half of W at the expense of E+/MCE seats.
Get the catering right, that is also very important. US carriers struggle in this part of the product.
US carriers don’t “struggle” with catering. They consciously make the decision to go cheap, resulting in an inferior product.
Nationalize the US airlines-government supported carriers like Qatar and Emirates can provide the service they do because they are state sponsored.
LOL. Please tell me this is a joke
Or because Emirates/Qatar have cheaper Labour and operational cost?
Average age of EK flight attendant vs average age of AA flight attendant?
Social contribution taxes in UAE vs USA?
Labour unions at Emirates or Qatar?
Etc.
Finally some GOOD AA news! Hey Lucky, which of the 2 new seats would you prefer? I know both are an upgrade, but still: Collins or Adient???
So 50 less seats overall means everyone gets more leg room?
I know, LOL!
At least the big spenders (or points grifters)
still get the crappy AA FA service.....
Jooooooooooorge. Show us your greeeeeeen caaaaaard.
Wow, lots of comments about terrible AA customer service in first/business class?
With all of AA debt and no differentiate products, wonder how long AA lasts.
Some companies achieve critical forward mass which allow them to keep sliding forward but eventually gravity/market reality will slow them to a stop.....
Lucky - pls recheck math? that adds up to 244. thanks!
The dearth of MCE seats is just another reduction in loyalty benefits. Unless you book early your choice is to pay up for PE or sit in a miserable seat
Less seats equals more expensive seats?
They should consider putting First on some of these 787-9s, too. Otherwise the Flagship First dining facilities' lifetimes will only be as long as the 777-300ERs, which is... a decade or two?
If American received average fares to justify adding MORE premium seats, then this might make sense - but American has trailed Delta and United in average fares on most of American's international network for years.
The unit costs for a low density configuration - just as for United - will soar. The difference is that United gets high average fares to fill those seats while American does not.
It is noteworthy that with...
If American received average fares to justify adding MORE premium seats, then this might make sense - but American has trailed Delta and United in average fares on most of American's international network for years.
The unit costs for a low density configuration - just as for United - will soar. The difference is that United gets high average fares to fill those seats while American does not.
It is noteworthy that with these changes, Delta's A350s will seat more than 60 more passengers than American or United's "premium" 787 configurations.
Given that DOT data shows that Delta and United get very similar average fares and Delta has much smaller premium cabins on its international fleet, either AA and UA don't get the average fares to really justify the size of their premium cabins or DL gets much higher average fares in coach. Both likely do happen, with the latter due to the fact that DL has no international economy seat that has as little space as the AA or UA 787 or 777 economy seat.
As has been the case for years, the chances are high that American is expecting aircraft to fix its revenue problem - and that has never worked in the real world.
But when I ask commentors keep telling me first class/business class subsidizes economy class. Mr. Dunn, you always speak with facts, that I respect. Is economy subsidizing the higher classes? Or is it too complicated with fare volatility? If steerage is a drag, then why did the Titanic have poor Mr. Dicaprio down below? Where they being charitable? I can't seem to get answers to this question. I even tried View From The Wing, the...
But when I ask commentors keep telling me first class/business class subsidizes economy class. Mr. Dunn, you always speak with facts, that I respect. Is economy subsidizing the higher classes? Or is it too complicated with fare volatility? If steerage is a drag, then why did the Titanic have poor Mr. Dicaprio down below? Where they being charitable? I can't seem to get answers to this question. I even tried View From The Wing, the Thought Leader in Travel: CRICKETS. Can you help please? This poor website can't afford notifications for replies but I will circle around on my own. Thanks!
It must be tiring being SO much smarter than everyone at American and United yet your grand strategic visions are reduced to blog comment sections. It's almost like your ideas and thoughts are only worth a blog comment section...
@Tim, To paraphrase the language usually found in prospectuses and forward-looking statements, "Past performance is no guarantee of future results."
With all due respect, Prove that this won't work. To paraphrase myself, It's "not a crime" for an airline to have different configurations on some of its aircraft when it's warranted. United has a few of its widebodies in a domestic configuration. So do ANA and JAL. There are long-haul markets that don't need...
@Tim, To paraphrase the language usually found in prospectuses and forward-looking statements, "Past performance is no guarantee of future results."
With all due respect, Prove that this won't work. To paraphrase myself, It's "not a crime" for an airline to have different configurations on some of its aircraft when it's warranted. United has a few of its widebodies in a domestic configuration. So do ANA and JAL. There are long-haul markets that don't need a lot of premium seating, and there are some that do. Why not configure aircraft to meet various market characteristics? All American has to do is number its newer planes differently from its current 797-9s to differentiate them. I'm guessing American will probably do something like that to differentiate its new A321XLRs from its standard A321NEOs. This isn't rocket science (And I often ask myself what rocket scientists say in these situations).
You constantly criticize American for having an "inferior product" compared to your "perfect airline" - an observation that has merit in some areas. But now, you're cynically and hypocritically criticizing the airline when it addresses some of the aspects of its product that you routinely criticize. That sounds a lot like hyper-partisan politicians who automatically criticize "the other party" for engaging in exactly the same kinds of questionable behavior they do.
DOT data are flawed for this kind of analysis. They don't tell the whole story. And they never will because they aren't meant to. So Delta's A350s are going to seat more than a Boeing 787-9? The A350's size sits between the 787-9 and 787-10. In "plane" English, it's a bigger aircraft. Comparing the two is akin to comparing a rooster to a capon. They're different birds, to use a common euphemism. Is Airbus paying you to promote its aircraft? I sometimes wonder ... But I digress ... You constantly regurgitate DOT stats because you apparently believe they reinforce the liquidation narrative your rhetoric so often implies. As Mark Twain observed, "There are three kinds of lies - lies, damned lies, and statistics."
Ghost,
do you realize that the DOT has published profitability by global region (using airline's own data) through the 3rd quarter of 2021 and Delta was profitable in all 3 global regions while United lost $600 million and American lost over 3X that amount?
Of course the future does not equal the past but when United was not profitable flying the Pacific even pre-covid despite being the largest airline across the Pacific, you have...
Ghost,
do you realize that the DOT has published profitability by global region (using airline's own data) through the 3rd quarter of 2021 and Delta was profitable in all 3 global regions while United lost $600 million and American lost over 3X that amount?
Of course the future does not equal the past but when United was not profitable flying the Pacific even pre-covid despite being the largest airline across the Pacific, you have to wonder what has changed and why AA will succeed using a strategy that hasn't even worked for UA.
Jorge George,
the number one thing that stands out in AA and UA's strategy is that they both think that they will make money with big premium cabins even while having some of the most inferior coach cabins among global carriers.
For example, American’s 787-9s have historically not had enough premium seats for some routes to Hong Kong, London, Sao Paulo, Tokyo, etc. So American has sometimes flow the Boeing 777-300ER to these destinations, even though the planes may have offered too much non-premium capacity."
Um..yeah, no. This all absolutely incorrect. AA made a decision several years ago to reduce the business class cabin on the 787s to make room for Premium Economy. The 77W was...
For example, American’s 787-9s have historically not had enough premium seats for some routes to Hong Kong, London, Sao Paulo, Tokyo, etc. So American has sometimes flow the Boeing 777-300ER to these destinations, even though the planes may have offered too much non-premium capacity."
Um..yeah, no. This all absolutely incorrect. AA made a decision several years ago to reduce the business class cabin on the 787s to make room for Premium Economy. The 77W was the mainstay of HKG, LHR, GRU, and NRT (with one also flying MIA-EZE). AA hasn't "sometimes" flown the 77W to these destinations. It was a deliberate decision to fly a plane with a First Class cabin on those routes. The 77W and the A321T are the only AA planes that have First Class. Whether that was a good decision or not is another matter, but that was the pre-COVID strategy. AA will likely not resume HKG at all. LAX-HKG was axed permanently. DFW-HKG is a long way from resuming.
AA's 787s aren't quite premium heavy enough and so this strategy, if it actually comes to fruition will be to cater to the future long haul route map for AA where the 787 will be needed to fly ultra-long haul routes.
The 77Ws are unlikely to go anywhere. The oldest is 10 years old. They will be around for a while and if things ever normalize, resume their role as the plane for GRU, EZE, LHR, HND, and where slots are limited (e.g LHR) and demand is strong. Eventually, I can see AA ditch First and put an updated biz seat across the planes that still have First.
It's too bad HKG has not opened back up. Asia's World City certainly has not kept up to the slogan.
You're not necessarily contradicting each other.
Bit of a chicken&egg scenario here: did AA choose to fly an aircraft with F on those routes because it felt they necessitated the F cabin; or simply because the planes that had the F cabin also happen to provide sufficient overall premium uplift?
I don't know the actual answer to that, and would happily bet that you don't either. Few outside of Ft.Worth's C-suite would.
However, if this...
You're not necessarily contradicting each other.
Bit of a chicken&egg scenario here: did AA choose to fly an aircraft with F on those routes because it felt they necessitated the F cabin; or simply because the planes that had the F cabin also happen to provide sufficient overall premium uplift?
I don't know the actual answer to that, and would happily bet that you don't either. Few outside of Ft.Worth's C-suite would.
However, if this new cabin does indeed come to fruition, and take its place on any given combo of those routes long-term, then it does lend credence to the idea that their interest was more in the latter scenario (overall premium availability) than in offering a specific F product to any of the given destinations, even the oh-so-vaunted LHR.
Qatar all the way
Sounds Great but i hope they improve the Service that today depending the routes its very regular to terrible ! Specially the crew to most of the latín american routes !!!!! It willl be Great planes but terrible Service !♂️
Doug Parker's US Airways was the first to bring reverse herringbone to the US on the A330 in the early 2000s.
Discount DP and his cronies have always said that a superior hard product is what makes business class. In the sense that this results in more sales and better monetized upgrades, they're right.
Don't expect AA to become "more premium", but expect proliferation of their J and PE products, which in turn...
Doug Parker's US Airways was the first to bring reverse herringbone to the US on the A330 in the early 2000s.
Discount DP and his cronies have always said that a superior hard product is what makes business class. In the sense that this results in more sales and better monetized upgrades, they're right.
Don't expect AA to become "more premium", but expect proliferation of their J and PE products, which in turn become way less premium.
Expect atrocious service, on line with spirit in J/F.
Any plans to replace the Zodiac seats on the 787-8 with the Super Diamond or even the mentioned Adient seats?
I imagine the 788s and select 772s with zodiacs will be reconfigured first, then the rest of the fleet.
I'll believe it when I see it. Not sure that more premium seats given the level of service and food at AA is something that anyone really cares to see. 52 Jetblue Mint seats? Now that's something to talk about.
Agreed. They can put any premium seat they like, but once you talk to a member of crew or when your food is placed on your table, you’d be naïve for assuming AA could ever do “premium” for realsies.
All for not if there isn't a level of food and wine catered on board which befits the label premium
For me an ultra premium 787 will have added plastic blinds that can be button controlled like the BA FIRST windows, even manually operated traditional window blinds would be a huge step up from my personal comfort perspective. Just as I like personal air vents above me on long haul jets (this something the US carriers are often better for), I also like to control the light into my areas. Sorry but I always avoid...
For me an ultra premium 787 will have added plastic blinds that can be button controlled like the BA FIRST windows, even manually operated traditional window blinds would be a huge step up from my personal comfort perspective. Just as I like personal air vents above me on long haul jets (this something the US carriers are often better for), I also like to control the light into my areas. Sorry but I always avoid the Dreamliner due to the (for me) horrible windows on anything except night flights.
This sounds like a nice improvement. That said, I think the 787-9 on AA (and most 77-2 and all 77-3 of AA) still offers the best US carrier hard product in biz. Now the 787-8? Ugh. Polaris is ok but the aisle seats are minimal privacy, ditto Delta (don’t even bring up DLs dated a330s…).
I’m somewhat happy to read this, but it still doesn’t negate the miserable economy experience that AA offers on the 787. As EXP I had to book a same-day flight SCL-DFW and there were no premium seats available; my middle seat in the first row of Y was the least comfortable flight I’ve ever had. Hopefully this results in more same-day availability for those premium seats.
Did the author say that the 789s will replace the 777-300ERs without Flagship First? So does that mean long term AA plans to phase out FF? The hard product is dated and the soft product is about the same as business in the air. However, I really do enjoy FF dining at LAX or DFW before boarding an international flight. Or at least I did pre-pandemic.
There will be lots of OPUPS from Y to PE and good luck sitting in the last row of J near the bar. You will be bumped into every 3 minutes and hear constant noise of football fans cheering at the top of their lungs. I guess rows 1-3 will be the quieter part of the cabin with only the FA chatter from the galley to contend with.
How about some new routes to SE Asia post pandemic ?
AA suffers the same issue as DL as they don't really have a sufficient hub for launching SE Asian operations.
The overwhelming plurality of stateside O&D for which is going to be split between LAX and SFO.
Yet SFO is spoken for by UA, and the overall raw power of LAX is diluted by the sheer number of foreign flags offering competitive 1stops: from ultra-cheap coach fares on the secondary mainland Chinese carriers, to...
AA suffers the same issue as DL as they don't really have a sufficient hub for launching SE Asian operations.
The overwhelming plurality of stateside O&D for which is going to be split between LAX and SFO.
Yet SFO is spoken for by UA, and the overall raw power of LAX is diluted by the sheer number of foreign flags offering competitive 1stops: from ultra-cheap coach fares on the secondary mainland Chinese carriers, to heavily discounted premium fares on the Middle Eastern carriers (both of which were the case pre-Covid).
Exciting development. I believe AA will have the second highest number of business class seats on any 789, just behind Japan Airlines with 52 seats.
These seat options are terrible for couples who travel together. American needs to understand many couple travel together on vacation an prefer 2 seats that DONT have a wall between them!
Speak for yourself. I prefer 12 hours of quiet time away from my spouse!
I agree. To bad they can’t run some planes on the heavy tourist routes like Tahiti and Hawaii with the 2-2-2 seating like Air Tahiti Nui has installed. My wife and I actually prefer a good PE seat to the claustrophobic cubbyholes it seems most like. If I was still fly on OPM solo I can sort of understand it.
Maybe the new seats need to called first class, and the ATN style seats can...
I agree. To bad they can’t run some planes on the heavy tourist routes like Tahiti and Hawaii with the 2-2-2 seating like Air Tahiti Nui has installed. My wife and I actually prefer a good PE seat to the claustrophobic cubbyholes it seems most like. If I was still fly on OPM solo I can sort of understand it.
Maybe the new seats need to called first class, and the ATN style seats can just be called business. I’m sure the OPM fliers can talk their boss it to paying for first class.
Also wonder how the folks who like to be constantly “looked after” and pampered will square that with their also strong desire for worthless doors.
Russ: those seats exist in premium economy. sit with your spouse the whole time!
If you're so whipped that your psyche can't handle the concept of being more than a few inches from your spouse for a few hours, despite knowing that he/she is in a seat right next to you...
...then you've got far bigger problems than anything AA or a seat manufacturer can solve.
IJS
It was a few years ago when AA removed business class seats from 788 & 772 frames. More J seats are always welcome so hopefully this plan sticks. This does not bode well for flagship first.
AAL is at a premium disadvantage on premium transcon routes like JFK-LAX with their current A321Ts while DL and UA fly 767s and 757s with much higher premium seating, it only makes sense for them to do with as a high-J config simmilar to what BA had on their 744s for the JFK-LHR flights.
As for the cutting of Flagship first, honestly I don't care. The delta between F and J is so thin...
AAL is at a premium disadvantage on premium transcon routes like JFK-LAX with their current A321Ts while DL and UA fly 767s and 757s with much higher premium seating, it only makes sense for them to do with as a high-J config simmilar to what BA had on their 744s for the JFK-LHR flights.
As for the cutting of Flagship first, honestly I don't care. The delta between F and J is so thin now that it basically doesn't matter and at AA, there's no reason to market and train on F when 99% of premium consumers will be perfectly well serviced by J. AA doesn't need a halo product like EK's F because that's not what the brand is aiming at or needs.
So eventually they will be replacing the B777-200s / B777-300s with B787-9s wow
Also losing 60 premium seats including 8 flagship first class seats with 51 premium seats
Eventually replacing the B777-200s with 37 premium seats with 30 premium seats in the B787-9s.
From my understanding this will make it hard using the SWU’s and I expect AA will devalue their program soon because more and more people will be able to...
So eventually they will be replacing the B777-200s / B777-300s with B787-9s wow
Also losing 60 premium seats including 8 flagship first class seats with 51 premium seats
Eventually replacing the B777-200s with 37 premium seats with 30 premium seats in the B787-9s.
From my understanding this will make it hard using the SWU’s and I expect AA will devalue their program soon because more and more people will be able to accumulate points faster with the Loyalty Points program
Updating the hard product is one thing, they need to do something about the cabin crew service in the premium cabins. Incredibly poor service experienced LAX to MIA, then 2 weeks later MIA to LHR. Rude and awful cabin crew especially to London on 4 April.
Sounds like this is the beginning of the end for American’s international first class, which is sad if so.
Just flew a 787-8 from PHL to CDG. No amount of a nice seat , I was in 1 L would compensate for the bad service. I thought only MIA crew of AA was bad.. It looks like it is SYSTEMWIDE.
Can you miss an Airline/ Yes I do, I miss my Qatar Flights.. I used to fly regularly MIA DOH CDG rather than take the direct AA flights..
Not sure why one would post the doctoral degree here
"Ultra Premium" but they're not planning to put a Flagship First in there?
And 32 Premium economy seats means they're gonna squeeze 4 rows of 2-4-2 layout, for "Ultra Premium" this sounds a bit tight for a 787!
There's a chance (not saying it's what they'll do) that with some staggering, it could be 5x rows of 2 seats each on the outside rows (20 seats) plus 4x rows of 3 in the middle rows (12 seats) making 32 seats total. Arrangement will be 7 abreast, which is a common setup on 787s.
They should have a business class option for loved ones traveling together. When you're traveling with a loved one, you don't want there to be a wall. I'd rather sit closely with my boyfriend in economy than have a wall between us in business class. I don't know many women that wouldn't feel that way unless they don't really like the person they're traveling with
Agree 100%. UA gets this right with their honeymoon seats every other row.
You're on a plane, not a motel room.....
Sit closely? What are you up to?
Seems odd to run a garbage domestic product and a super premium intercontinental product. Maybe they think people won't notice the domestic product?
I needed to call AA yesterday for my domestic F flight today. There was a two hour callback window. I'm not spending $10,000 on a intercontinental ticket when they won't answer the phone.
This seems to be a problem with most airlines these days, with some horror stories with premium airlines such as Singapore Airlines. It's the typical covid excuse two years later. On a side note, any chance you reached out to AA via Twitter? They have a great Twitter team and can handle most anything you throw at them.
I always thought upcoming 789s would be to replace 772s. Hence the need for more J seats. Even currently 772s have more J than 787s. The lighter confit would also enable 789s to fly longer routes.
I'm all for a good seat and more premium seating on planes but just don't get the fascination with doors. I mean if it was like some of the middle eastern carriers that had true privacy with a partition and door that goes to the roof that is one this but people still walk by the can look in on you. I never cared in the least about it since I am not a privacy...
I'm all for a good seat and more premium seating on planes but just don't get the fascination with doors. I mean if it was like some of the middle eastern carriers that had true privacy with a partition and door that goes to the roof that is one this but people still walk by the can look in on you. I never cared in the least about it since I am not a privacy zealot but, even if I was, is it REALLY that big a deal a "door" is on the seat that goes up to maybe peoples' waist as the walk by? How petty are you Ben and others that fascinate about such trivial matters?
Came here to say the same thing. I first flew DeltaOne back in December and the door on mine was broken. I can't say I would have noticed the difference though. People walking by can still see you regardless of whether the door is open or closed, and when you're sleeping you can't see anything either way.
And a door on a reverse herringbone seat seems even more pointless since you're not even angled...
Came here to say the same thing. I first flew DeltaOne back in December and the door on mine was broken. I can't say I would have noticed the difference though. People walking by can still see you regardless of whether the door is open or closed, and when you're sleeping you can't see anything either way.
And a door on a reverse herringbone seat seems even more pointless since you're not even angled at the aisle. I guess if you're very self-conscious about the person across the aisle craning their neck to see what you're watching on TV worries you, you'd want a door but otherwise it just seems pointless.
It is Ben's job to care about small and "trivial" matters when it pertains to business class seats.
As for doors they seem to provide nothing when done on certain configurations. That latest Sam Chui ethiad a350 video from this week it was laughable how low the door heights were basically providing no privacy.