On my Singapore Airlines Boeing 787 business class flight from Singapore to Ho Chi Minh City, I was seated in front of someone who wasn’t at all happy with his flight. While I think his frustration was potentially valid, the way he went about providing feedback was so wrong…
In this post:
What caused the issue on this flight
Singapore Airlines is known for its incredible inflight service, even on a short 90 minute flight within Asia. In reality the crew has well under an hour to perform the entire inflight service — the seatbelt sign is on for the first 5-10 minutes, and then the cabin has to be prepared for landing roughly 30 minutes out. That’s not a lot of time to serve 36 passengers a full meal.
The way the service works on this sector in business class, there’s one flight attendant in each aisle with a cart, and they serve both the meal and drinks. Then an additional flight attendant comes down the aisles with the bread basket, and also to refill any drinks. Then the cart is rolled back down the aisle to collect trays and offer additional drinks. The crew really has to hustle on sectors like this.
The guy behind me had ordered a special meal, and the crew generally brings these out to passengers first, separate from the trolley, with a glass of water on the tray. Some will appreciate getting their meal first, especially on this flight, but not this guy…
Man accuses crew of “ruining” his meal
Around 40 minutes takeoff I was served my meal, drink, and offered a selection from the bread basket. I should mention that I was in the second to last row, so I was (understandably) among the last to be served. Then the flight attendant got to the person behind me, in the very last row. Below is how that conversation started.
“Hello Mr. XYZ, have you enjoyed your meal? What can I get you to drink?”
“No, you spoiled my meal. I’m now done, and you haven’t offered me any drinks or bread.”
“I’m so sorry Mr. XYZ, may I get you anything now?”
“No, you’ve ruined it. I don’t want anything anymore, it’s too late.”
At this point the cabin manager realized that something wasn’t quite right, and came over to speak with the passenger. He just went on and on and on, explaining how his flight had been ruined, and how Singapore Airlines isn’t competitive anymore.
The cabin manager couldn’t have handled the situation more professionally. “I am very sorry Mr. XYZ, thank you so much for the feedback, I can understand how this was frustrating.” But every time she apologized, he just made another negative comment. “As an employee I think you should be very worried about the future of the airline.”
The crew had stuff to do, but the guy kept the cabin manager by his seat for at least 10 minutes, and just kept complaining and complaining. It took a lot of restraint for me to not turn around and tell the guy to be quiet and leave the crew alone already. Before landing when I used the lavatory, I did apologize to the cabin manager on his behalf, and commended her for how professionally she handled the situation.
Right before landing, she once again came by the guy’s seat, and said “Mr. XYZ, once again I am so sorry and I appreciate the feedback, I hope you will give us another chance.” Interestingly I think he might have been a mileage runner type (or something), based on the fact that he said he was flying to Ho Chi Minh City to position for a ticket on Qatar Airways. Then he also talked about often flying to Karachi (a city known for cheap premium fares).
The issue with this situation…
The thing is, the passenger’s feedback wasn’t actually wrong. Service flow does matter, and I can appreciate how it’s not ideal to be served a meal without your drink of choice. Heck, it’s something I commented on in my recent posts about flying with Gulf Air.
At the same time, in this case I can also appreciate the other side of the coin, which is that this is a very short flight, and the service has to be rushed. It’s probably not practical for the crew to serve each person who ordered a special meal first (there were quite a few of them), then offer them drinks and bread, and then serve the rest of the cabin.
Maybe special meals just shouldn’t be served in advance, but then again, that would also complicate the service flow. Also keep in mind he was in the worst seat possible for this, since he was in the last row. If he were seated toward the front of the cabin, this would have been a non-issue.
I see both sides here. That being said:
- I think there’s nothing wrong with providing feedback if your experience isn’t great, but be polite — “I know this is a short flight and the crew is working hard, but I just wanted to share that it would be nice to be offered a drink around the same time as my meal, so I can enjoy them together”
- It’s absurd to start accusing the crew of ruining or spoiling his meal — it’s illogical, and it’s also unnecessarily accusatory and inflammatory, when the crew was extremely friendly and working hard
- If you’re going to complain in a serious manner, at least have a resolution in mind — in this case the guy just wanted to whine, because he didn’t even want a drink anymore, since his experience had already been “ruined”
- Often it’s clear that people just want to vent, and want to feel like they’re getting some attention and being listened to; the crew did that really well here, and I think he got off the flight with a more favorable impression because of that
- I can’t help but wonder how this would have played out on an airline in the United States; I doubt most flight attendants would kneel down and listen to this guy ridiculously chew them out for 10 minutes, and I wouldn’t blame them
Bottom line
Singapore Airlines crews work exceptionally hard on these short sectors within Southeast Asia. They try to serve a great meal, provide drink refills, and have attention to detail with the direction logos are facing and how the tray is set up.
A passenger with a special meal order wasn’t happy that his meal was brought out first, but he wasn’t offered a drink beyond water until everyone else was, around 20 minutes later. While I can appreciate that’s not ideal (and it was made worse by his seat assignment), the way he went about complaining was neither constructive nor kind.
Please don’t complain like this, folks…
What do you make of this Singapore Airlines complaint situation?
SIA is not what it used to be. I avoid it whenever I can. But being obnoxious to the crew doesn’t make the airline any better. I suggest passengers consider alternatives to SIA.
platy-- you should be suspended from this.
SIA is not what it used to be. I avoid it whenever I can. But being obnoxious to the crew doesn’t make the airline any better. I suggest passengers consider alternatives to SIA.
Anthony Bourdain said it best…
“I am not a fan of people who abuse service staff.
In fact, I find it intolerable.
It’s an unpardonable sin as far as I’m concerned, taking out personal business or some other kind of dissatisfaction on a waiter or busboy
Or
Cabin Crew for this matter…
It’s hard enough in the service industry, and not getting any easier, muppets like this don’t deserve the time or attention given.
Think he got a mouth, if he really wants a drink or he was left out on the bread, just open his mouth or press the call button.
Why wait until all the meals being served then hollered about the service
On the other hand, is normal to have push the cart to those having their special to offer them a drink as this is Biz class
Probably due to the time constraint and the various demands on the flight(esp on SIA)they might have overlooked
May I ask the race of the passenger?
Ya guess is as goid as mine, going to Karachi and most probably ordered a vegetarian meal, doubt its Kosher
If you’ve lived in Asia you can probably guess he’s Indian
That was definitely very rude. It could have been much worse though; did you hear about this incident? https://twitter.com/SouthAsiaIndex/status/1611413351766319110?s=20&t=fXwpq4YbfSG9jX0UdQZFDw
Karachi...enough said.
Singapore airlines has degraded significantly since the pandemic. I flew twice with them business class from Manila to Mumbai in September and November 2021 on their A380’s and every flight offered meals heated and kept warm with foil wrapping, basic menu choice's, stale cheese and bread, planes that were dirty from long term storage and seats that had at least 2 or 3 electrical issues per flight. Wifi poor, cabin service poor - no better...
Singapore airlines has degraded significantly since the pandemic. I flew twice with them business class from Manila to Mumbai in September and November 2021 on their A380’s and every flight offered meals heated and kept warm with foil wrapping, basic menu choice's, stale cheese and bread, planes that were dirty from long term storage and seats that had at least 2 or 3 electrical issues per flight. Wifi poor, cabin service poor - no better than a 3 star airline these days. Delays on all flights, strong smell of aviation fuel on one return flight out of India. I will never fly this airline again - its a shadow of it’s former self.
SQ spent a lot on PR and don't forget this is a government owned airline. Extensive privileges are reserved only for government officials and senior members of GLCs even though they paid the cheapest fares are not frequent travellers and are not a member of Krisflyer or SQ Club. of Obviously this is another one piece written by a supporter or beneficiary of this group.
There is nothing wrong to providing feedback especiaally when...
SQ spent a lot on PR and don't forget this is a government owned airline. Extensive privileges are reserved only for government officials and senior members of GLCs even though they paid the cheapest fares are not frequent travellers and are not a member of Krisflyer or SQ Club. of Obviously this is another one piece written by a supporter or beneficiary of this group.
There is nothing wrong to providing feedback especiaally when you are paying for expensive ticket and did not get the service you deserve.
I dont know where you get the idea that government officials and senior members of GLCs get extra privileges, paid the cheapest fares, and not members of krisflyer. They pay whatever the public or companies with corporate accounts pay. Maybe you confused Singapore with one of our neighbouring countries.
Any so called privilege would be
- them being part of krisflyer or highflyer ("Corporate" krisflyer)
- being like a minister and being...
I dont know where you get the idea that government officials and senior members of GLCs get extra privileges, paid the cheapest fares, and not members of krisflyer. They pay whatever the public or companies with corporate accounts pay. Maybe you confused Singapore with one of our neighbouring countries.
Any so called privilege would be
- them being part of krisflyer or highflyer ("Corporate" krisflyer)
- being like a minister and being recognized. Just like if you're an influential enough influencer.
a am a shame to see those powerful travellers or some only use the card point to get a business seat, the guy had no manners and no respect for the cabinet crew if a was there surely will tell him to shut up.
You Americans spend your money without expecting much in return, bribing people with "tips" to get people to actually do their job. And then you justifiably and loudly complain that flying is a terrible experience -- well, ahem.
Yes, this is justified. He paid for a service, which he didn't get. Bravo.
Some people don't have the emotional intelligence to comment to a service provider as you do. The problem is in his own mind. A form of entitlement. People act that way when they shit up on so he is doing it others. This is an example of a lack of human decency and a lack of introspection. If you act kindly and generously to others it always comes back to you. Maybe not immediately but...
Some people don't have the emotional intelligence to comment to a service provider as you do. The problem is in his own mind. A form of entitlement. People act that way when they shit up on so he is doing it others. This is an example of a lack of human decency and a lack of introspection. If you act kindly and generously to others it always comes back to you. Maybe not immediately but at least you can walk away knowing you did the right thing. Do the right thing people. Act righteously but don't be a dick like this person. My wife and I deal with idiots like this all the time. I wouldn't pander to him and his complaints sound really petty.
I booked a flight for my girlfriend from Singapore to Manila and she was not served any meals or beverages. None of the cabin crew even bothered to clarify with her on the meals or beverages. I have sent a complaint on this matter to SQ service department and have not had a reply yet. im not sure why SIA is deemed as having good service standards but personally i have never experienced any exceptional service standards on SQ flights.
Did you have "operated by Scoot" somewhere on the itinerary? If everyone is served a meal, no way your girlfriend doesn't get one unless she didn't want it.
There is absolutely no way that a SQ flight could ever not serve food or drink.
It likely would have been scoot economy so uhhh, maybe check first next time.
Agree with Ben that this guy's way of complaining was way over the top. There is a right way and a wrong way to complain.
I've noticed too that SQ can struggle with serving the back rows of their premium-heavy layouts well. I recall flying SIN-HND where about 40% of the cabin is business class and I was sitting in the back of a fully-packed J cabin. The hot towel came cold and the...
Agree with Ben that this guy's way of complaining was way over the top. There is a right way and a wrong way to complain.
I've noticed too that SQ can struggle with serving the back rows of their premium-heavy layouts well. I recall flying SIN-HND where about 40% of the cabin is business class and I was sitting in the back of a fully-packed J cabin. The hot towel came cold and the crew was clearly struggling to get to the back J rows for food and drinks in a timely fashion. Wasn't a great SQ soft product experience and being in the back did affect it.
I also have extremely poor service both on the ground and inflight with Singapore Airlines. There was a massive thunderstorm the night that I was supposed to fly out and I called their reservations desk asking to rebook the flight for the next day as there was severe weather and I had no means of transportation to get to the airport. They charged for SGD 300 per person change fee. Lost my special meals and...
I also have extremely poor service both on the ground and inflight with Singapore Airlines. There was a massive thunderstorm the night that I was supposed to fly out and I called their reservations desk asking to rebook the flight for the next day as there was severe weather and I had no means of transportation to get to the airport. They charged for SGD 300 per person change fee. Lost my special meals and seats request. Reservations agents were extremely impolite and unwelcoming. Crew were so fake and robotic. No sense of customer service whatsoever. BS about being the world’s leading airline. On the other hand a Star Alliance US airline was so much better and accommodating. SQ is just terrible!!!!
Yours is the only opinion that matters, it seems.
You must get tired of all the world's ratings companies calling to get your opinion all the time.
Where's your travel insurance?
As someone who lives in Karachi, allow me to apologise on that person's behalf!
I think it’s always the process on most good airlines , that, when a SPML is delivered that water is the standard by which that meal is presented, with an explanation that “drinks” will follow when the service begins - I have no idea ,but thinking this is probably a VGML of a certain sub continent person that is in question here,and that there is always an expectation that VIP service is expected, rudeness is...
I think it’s always the process on most good airlines , that, when a SPML is delivered that water is the standard by which that meal is presented, with an explanation that “drinks” will follow when the service begins - I have no idea ,but thinking this is probably a VGML of a certain sub continent person that is in question here,and that there is always an expectation that VIP service is expected, rudeness is never acceptable , considering the length of the flight everyone is luckyto have received the service that they did.
@Lucky - I don't think it was your place to apologize. It simply had nothing to do with you. You could have thanked them for a great flight, great service, etc.
Having said that, the guy seems like a total tool and did act very inappropriate.
Probably should not have a full meal service on such a short flight
Sounds like what SA should do is serve everything on a single tray including drinks for all meals special order or not. It’s a short flight. There is no need to have a full blown meal service.
As for the excessive complainer. Sounds like he’s trying to get extra free miles or voucher. Sometimes it’s just easier to give it to them to shut them up. There will always be people like him in the world. Thankfully they are minority.
It seems he does indeed have a valid complaint, but saying his meal was ruined was a bit dramatic. When the cabin mgr asked if he wanted anything, he should have said yes, give me some ff points to offset my frustration.
I was on Singapore Airlines from SFO to SNG a few years ago and something similar happened to me. Meals were served in premium cabin but then something happened & most attendants...
It seems he does indeed have a valid complaint, but saying his meal was ruined was a bit dramatic. When the cabin mgr asked if he wanted anything, he should have said yes, give me some ff points to offset my frustration.
I was on Singapore Airlines from SFO to SNG a few years ago and something similar happened to me. Meals were served in premium cabin but then something happened & most attendants disappeared for over 30 minutes. I never got a drink refill whoke eating and it was annoying. I mentioned it after they removed my tray and then they served me constantly for a few hours until I had them stop.
My problem with FAs & restaurant waiters are they walk thru the space not making eye contact... usually looking at the floor. Huge no-no!!! All service industry people should constantly scan the room making & catching eye contact.
Thanks Ben for giving some advice about how to complain effectively. The passenger behind you sounds like he follows the faceless blogger who writes "Compensation Clinic." Poggel boasts of getting huge points rewards for the slightest imagined problem through browbeating staff. This gives readers unrealistic expectations.
I think you did a good thing speaking to the cabin manager like you did. She had shown commendable restraint and I'm sure your acknowledgement of that was appreciated.
This reminds me of the stories of guys trying to impress their date by dumping on the server. He probably almost gets a woody thinking about how tough he was.
Yes, I agree this guy sounds like he was being a bit of a diva. But I'm inclined to agree with his feedback.
If you are the very first person served your meal, and the last person served a drink, that is not a well executed service flow. The goal of the drink service should be to get people their drinks as quickly after being served the food as possible.
Drinks accompany food. This is...
Yes, I agree this guy sounds like he was being a bit of a diva. But I'm inclined to agree with his feedback.
If you are the very first person served your meal, and the last person served a drink, that is not a well executed service flow. The goal of the drink service should be to get people their drinks as quickly after being served the food as possible.
Drinks accompany food. This is basic. If a restaurant ever didn't serve a drink until 30 minutes after serving your food, that would be terrible service. The same principle applies on flights.
If United did this, it would be one thing, because their crew are terrible at everything they do. But on Singapore, it doesn't seem crazy that someone might expect to be served a drink at the same time as, or shortly after, having been served their meal.
If you are seated towards the back of the cabin and you have received a special meal, then as soon as it is delivered, tell the FA you would like your drink to enjoy with the meal rather than later. 90% of them will interrupt their routine to go get you your drink. If you get pushback ask nicely again pointing our you will most likely have finished your meal before the normal drink service...
If you are seated towards the back of the cabin and you have received a special meal, then as soon as it is delivered, tell the FA you would like your drink to enjoy with the meal rather than later. 90% of them will interrupt their routine to go get you your drink. If you get pushback ask nicely again pointing our you will most likely have finished your meal before the normal drink service reached you.
Being polite is the key. Asians find angry confrontations very challenging and take it personally.
@ Michael
It wasn't a one-hour fight, as you choose to characterise. The route is typically scheduled at about 2 hrs 10 mins, thus perhaps 100 minutes in the air (minus the time taxiing to / from runways).
The standard of service needs to be assessed by the advertised product and the price paid, not by your personal perceptions of other airlines or / and countries.
I'm not quite sure what your point is in your point. Customer service, no matter your standing is not a license to demean any person. You have a problem that you won't accept them correcting yourself, maybe you need to take up a medium of transportation that doesn't include contact with society.
This gentleman is just a grumpy one and no matter what the flight crew did to try to please him . I would have spit on his meal and thank goodness he he wasn’t married to me …..
Definitively obnoxious and glad to know that no one here (well, almost no one) would act like that on an airplane.
On the other hand. . .
It does seem to be the goal of this blog to disect every aspect of airline customer service in a profoundly judgemental way. The criticism is delivered publicly and not targeted (or rarely targeted) at an individual but it's not that different from Mr. Obnoxious. Would anyone be surprised if he turned out to be a reader?
I disagree. His comments were unreasonable. It sounds like he ordered the special meal just to be served first. Everyone knows if you're in the back you will likely be served last. At least he got the special meal that he ordered. It is not that it has to be served first. They did serve him a drink and bread like everyone else. Also as you said it's a short tight flight and difficult to get all of the safety and service done.
That’s an unreasonable assumption. People have dietary and religious restrictions leading them to order special meals. Don’t agree with behavior of this passenger though. Been through this same situation in SQ on a short flight where bread was served after my special meal was almost over (and I was seated second row where crew served bread in reverse order). However, I was rather happy and grateful to see the bread options (garlic bread/cheese crackers) and...
That’s an unreasonable assumption. People have dietary and religious restrictions leading them to order special meals. Don’t agree with behavior of this passenger though. Been through this same situation in SQ on a short flight where bread was served after my special meal was almost over (and I was seated second row where crew served bread in reverse order). However, I was rather happy and grateful to see the bread options (garlic bread/cheese crackers) and how delicious they were.
As former SIA crew, we see this a lot mostly with Award pax and people making status runs. The objective is to recoup some money via compensation but unfortunately they take it out on the crew which is not fair.
Exactly....... A real piece of work!! Mr. Obnoxious should be made to fly BC on Air India, so he gets a "Golden Shower" and really has something to complain about! ;-)
The travel hacking community is usually the main culprit in all these situations along with AA elites. I work for Cathay and we see this sort of behavior in lounges, on board and at check in. Even the hotel chains have similar problems. i wish Ben and OMAAT would publish something on travel etiquette and pin it in all the travel hacking and American Airlines groups.
And serial complainers should also realise that there is a data base with all their correspondence, or they are stupid enough to write comments on blogs, which despite being using pseudonyms, can easily be identified.
Many of them also appear to have mental health issues.
People with a mindset of optimization (whether we're talking mile/point hackers, quant finance types, programmers, to name 3 communities I'm at least on the periphery of with a lot of people with that mindset) are rarely, shall we say, the most well-adjusted folks.
(All three are especially prone, in my experience, to over optimize for one environment and then go ballistic when they environment changes on them... figuring out that optimizing for resilience is the...
People with a mindset of optimization (whether we're talking mile/point hackers, quant finance types, programmers, to name 3 communities I'm at least on the periphery of with a lot of people with that mindset) are rarely, shall we say, the most well-adjusted folks.
(All three are especially prone, in my experience, to over optimize for one environment and then go ballistic when they environment changes on them... figuring out that optimizing for resilience is the most important thing was life-changing for me)
Agreed. I’m someone who books long haul business only on awards and NEVER complain. Can’t stand people like this who give us a bad reputation. I’ve never had a bad experience on SIA. I will have a few choice words for them if they’re behind me acting like this in the future
Hey Ben
Having just flown DEL-SIN-MEL/SYD-SIN-DEL, 3 pax (me in first and my parents in business), I think I’ve a decent right to comment. When it comes to on board service, crew, seats as well as airport lounge service, I think they’re 5 star, but when it comes to their helplines, call Center and their management, this is the worst airline ever, they openly make false statements (thankfully even in written, I’ve proof now, and...
Hey Ben
Having just flown DEL-SIN-MEL/SYD-SIN-DEL, 3 pax (me in first and my parents in business), I think I’ve a decent right to comment. When it comes to on board service, crew, seats as well as airport lounge service, I think they’re 5 star, but when it comes to their helplines, call Center and their management, this is the worst airline ever, they openly make false statements (thankfully even in written, I’ve proof now, and will be sending a notice ) , make false claims on the telephone and then backtrack, they mentally harass you to the point when you just can’t take it any more and in the attempt that you just stop caring, which I did unless they again messed up my first suites at SYD airport, and though their mail and all showed me in suites , their ground staff didn’t agree, it’s not a question of monetary compensation but the fact that they think they can Harris someone over 4 months and get away, is unpardonable, and this is when I booked 3 premium class tickets , can’t even imagine how they maybe prioritising economy passengers, let me know if you’d like to know details and proofs for a write up cheers
Dude! Nobody wants you to write anything up if you're going to write like this. What you've written isn't even a sentence!
Also, shame on you for parking your parents in the back while you enjoy first class.
Maaaaaate! Did you proof your comment before posting? That was the most atrocious piece of codswallop I’ve ever read. By all means, send SQ (and we can only presume that’s the airline you are referring to, as you didn’t once specify) your Karenalicious complaint, as they will be in hysterics reading your unintelligible dribble.
Yeah, this guy should be blocked from posting in future. If he's incapable of understanding what a sentence is, he's just wasting our time as readers.
Same tateless smoked salmon, and uninteresting dessert on my flight 3 days ago SIN BKK. Crew were amazing but the food and winw quality beyond what SQ nown for. Was seated last row and had plenty of time to eat but the J was quite empty.
I'm a krislyer member but just decided to leave the program as I think not to fly SQ so often following the post covid cost saving.
Ben.
I've noticed lately your review posts are getting shorter. No menus, fewer pics. :(
I don't like the fact that sometimes you paste a link to drinks and menus instead of just posting a picture.
You do have a good blog going, but clean it up. Give people what they want. And a credit card write up every day is annoying. I know it's how you get paid, but come on man. Every day day?
@ Luke -- Just to clarify, this isn't my review of the flight. This is a teaser post I wrote just as I got off the flight. Then, as I've been doing for nearly 15 years, I'll have a very detailed review post in the coming weeks, once I'm back at home and have the time to do so. You can find all my flight reviews at this link, and I think you'll find that...
@ Luke -- Just to clarify, this isn't my review of the flight. This is a teaser post I wrote just as I got off the flight. Then, as I've been doing for nearly 15 years, I'll have a very detailed review post in the coming weeks, once I'm back at home and have the time to do so. You can find all my flight reviews at this link, and I think you'll find that they're even more detailed than ever before:
https://onemileatatime.com/reviews/airlines/
As far as menus go, I always post the full menus in the flight reviews. For hotels it's tricky sometimes, since the reviews have hundreds of pictures, and it can be a tough balance. But I always do it for flights.
And while I post something about credit cards most days, I certainly don't publish a credit card review every day. Keep in mind that for many OMAAT readers (including me, for that matter0, maximizing credit cards is the primary way they are able to book premium cabin travel.
I believe the behavior of the person berating the flight attendant was completely unacceptable. This was a minor service flow that could have been addressed with a polite comment to a flight attendant. The patience and professionalism of the cabin crew is commendable.
great inside,
for sure the SQ staff are all well tained, so all passanger need to remain in polite manner of provide the feedback to the crew.
Remember respect to other,
An excellent analysis of the cabin services and the challenges they face during a short haul. Air travellers should be more retrospective and shouldn’t expect services be similar on the ground.
Flying United domestic First Class today I was served a different breakfast than I preordered. I assumed it was a mistake and rang the call button. The FA immediately responded, I explained the issue and he asked me to wait a moment. He quickly came back and explained they had not boarded enough of the meal that I had chosen. He apologized profusely and offered to let me keep the meal he had served or...
Flying United domestic First Class today I was served a different breakfast than I preordered. I assumed it was a mistake and rang the call button. The FA immediately responded, I explained the issue and he asked me to wait a moment. He quickly came back and explained they had not boarded enough of the meal that I had chosen. He apologized profusely and offered to let me keep the meal he had served or pick any snack box they always seem to have. I kept what I had been served and shrugged it off. As I deplaned, he handed me an apology card worth $25 or 1,250 miles. I had been polite and understanding. I was quite surprised by this gesture from United!
Obnoxious complaining is the national sport of tiny Singapore. Have also witnessed crude behavior at top NYC restaurants by Singaporean bankers who somehow think this conduct is somehow in any way acceptable. It isn't. Other patrons noticed — just as Ben noticed. They were ridiculous, and they looked and behaved like morons.
Thank you for the apology, I am certain the crew appreciated it.
Totally agree.....................
You apologized to the crew on behalf of the stranger? What!? OMG wow, that is creepy.
@ Jordan -- "Hey, I'm really sorry you had to deal with that, you handled the situation very professionally." You could argue it wasn't my place, and that it was unnecessary, but... creepy?
Don't listen to Jordan Ben....... He just doesn't understand your trying to reinforce that this dufus was really out of line with his continued whinning!!
Good job Ben, I would have done the same thing. It was the polite thing to do!
By coincidence the only time i ever apologised to a crew member for another passenger’s rude behaviour was on Singapore Airlines between Male and Singapore. The lady seated in front of me in business went on a long rant because she asked for warm water for her water bottle and they brought hot, and she then started a long tirade about their terrible in flight service.
I had to go and tell the crew...
By coincidence the only time i ever apologised to a crew member for another passenger’s rude behaviour was on Singapore Airlines between Male and Singapore. The lady seated in front of me in business went on a long rant because she asked for warm water for her water bottle and they brought hot, and she then started a long tirade about their terrible in flight service.
I had to go and tell the crew later that I thought there service was just fine and I’m so sorry you have to be polite to such rude passengers.
I would have felt validated if I were the flight attendant. Maybe there are a few cultures where the gesture wouldn't be appreciated (I'd be hesitant to do it in Japan), but an empathetic show of appreciation is generally well recieved.
Also, it's important to reinforce that you can apologize that someone had an experience without being the perpetuator (ie "I'm so sorry that happened to you…").
yer mom is creepy
Why did this obnoxious passenger not push the call button at the beginning when he first received his meal ??
> I did apologize to the cabin manager on his behalf, and commended her for how professionally she handled the situation.
The Cabin Manager likely appreciated a bit of sanity check from you that other person is way out of line, unfortunately that wouldn't help much.
I don't know if it works like this, but what could be good was provide your contact info and offer to back up their version of the story as...
> I did apologize to the cabin manager on his behalf, and commended her for how professionally she handled the situation.
The Cabin Manager likely appreciated a bit of sanity check from you that other person is way out of line, unfortunately that wouldn't help much.
I don't know if it works like this, but what could be good was provide your contact info and offer to back up their version of the story as an objective bystander, if the asshole files a complaint and management decided to reprimand the crew.
I think for someone to make a scene because they didn't get their drink with their meal on a 1 hour flight indicates an incredibly privileged and coddled person. As the author pointed out in many other countries (not just US) passenger would have not been catered to. I feel bad for the Singapore Air crew.
There have been a few articles on Singapore media and social media channels lately of people complaining about relatively mild issues on Singapore airlines. It seems to be feeding others who seek attention as well, and this is likely one of them. I predict this guys story will show up in channel news asia in a day or so.
Ben, I rather read one of your repetitive praises of how great a Four Seasons you visited is, than these dispatches from the Moral Police.
@ Michael_FFM -- You know, I don't expect any single person to enjoy every post I publish on this (free) blog, as I think that would be an unrealistic expectation.
@Ben: what drives your revenue? Page views? If you think your content is so valuable, feel free to charge people to visit your site and see how revenues develop.
@ Michael_FFM -- SHUT UPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP!
Are you ok?
So don’t read it. No one is forcing you. Get a grip
This is not a one off incident at Singapore Airlines. I have gone through this situation many times and this happens to me everytime I preorder a meal. They don’t serve drinks or water with the preorder meals and I have also noticed many times the crews ignored me without asking me when they ask my co-passengers about their choice for drinks. All preorder meals in Economy class comes with some lousy inedible desserts and...
This is not a one off incident at Singapore Airlines. I have gone through this situation many times and this happens to me everytime I preorder a meal. They don’t serve drinks or water with the preorder meals and I have also noticed many times the crews ignored me without asking me when they ask my co-passengers about their choice for drinks. All preorder meals in Economy class comes with some lousy inedible desserts and for the rest, they offer a small tub of ice cream. Once a cabin crew was so angry with my daughter when she asked for an ice cream with her preordered kid’s meal.
Very similar situation to what I experienced two months ago. I was flying A380 DOH-BKK in F (obviously using miles, why would I otherwise comment here) and a few hours before departure 1 out of the 8 seats besides mine were booked. Much to my surprise, the F cabin ended up being completely full. I was seated in 1K and there was a couple seated in 1C and 1E respectively, and the guy wasn't even...
Very similar situation to what I experienced two months ago. I was flying A380 DOH-BKK in F (obviously using miles, why would I otherwise comment here) and a few hours before departure 1 out of the 8 seats besides mine were booked. Much to my surprise, the F cabin ended up being completely full. I was seated in 1K and there was a couple seated in 1C and 1E respectively, and the guy wasn't even fully settled into his seat and started to complain to the flight attendant, who served pre-departure drinks, on how awful and humiliated they felt of being denied entry into Al Safwa First lounge. At first I found it quite odd, because they were seated in F on a long-haul flight. But later on, when sitting in the onboard bar and chatting with another passenger who told me his wife got upgraded from C to F due to her oneworld Emerald (the rest of the family remained in C), that the couple next to me also received a complimentary upgrade due to an overbooked business class.
Almost everyone within the points and miles wold knows that Al Safwa access is only granted when flying on paid First Class (whether cash or miles). Same as one only receives the amount of award miles of the ticketed class, not the class one might get a complimentary upgrade to. And knowing how professional the staff is at Al Safwa, I am sure they explained in detail why access was being denied. However, this guy wouldn't shut up about it to enjoy his (complimentary upgraded) First Class experience - and yes, he received caviar and Krug - but instead chose to make a big fuss about the missed out experience of Al Safwa. It really dampened the mood of all passengers in the cabin. The crew remained as calm, apologetic and professional as one could wish for, but I still felt really bad for them.
HChris,
QR Platinum flying QR business class can access Al Safwa lounge. That was true at least as of October last year.
Did the passenger press his call button or request attention from the flight attendants after his meal was served without a drink? If it was that important to him to have a drink with his meal, it seems like it would have been easier for him to call the issue to their attention while they were doing drinks for other passengers.
@ John
Well the author seems to know all the details of this incident and perhaps can enlighten us all further....;)
@ John -- I didn't notice any call button being pushed (and Singapore crews are usually very good at responding to call buttons).
I mean I could imagine ringing the bell to get a drink for yourself when the cabin crew are currently doing a drinks service, but starting from the other end of the cabin, might also be frowned upon by those who study fellow passenger's behavior.
I have a similar complaint about domestic flights on Delta. A good flight leader (they aren't called pursuers on domestic flight) takes first-class meal and drink orders BEFORE departure. Even on short routes without meals, there is ALWAYS a drink service in first-class. Waiting until airborne to take drinks and then making each drink individually is an incredible waste of time and does lead to frustrations like this customer's complaint.
What is you drink of choice?
"A Negroni, Spagliatto... with prosecco in it..." lol
I travel long haul business with SQ EK and TG. I’m also celiac. Customer service stuff ups are the norm. Nothing better than ordering a gluten free meal and then being offered bread. The SQ book the cook program has no allergen information. If I then order off that there is no way of making any other parts of the meal gluten free. Best part is staff have no concept of allergy. The most frustrating...
I travel long haul business with SQ EK and TG. I’m also celiac. Customer service stuff ups are the norm. Nothing better than ordering a gluten free meal and then being offered bread. The SQ book the cook program has no allergen information. If I then order off that there is no way of making any other parts of the meal gluten free. Best part is staff have no concept of allergy. The most frustrating component is that it is hard to work out other options when your 40,000ft in the air. The stewards approach on a a380 leg back from Europe was to ask me what I want. My response was I don’t know what’s on your full a380. She considered it rude.
I think there is a huge gap between the service promised and the service delivered. I don’t think I’m being difficult when all my dietary requests are loaded into their system often. I check on boarding that they actually load my meals. It’s a 50% success rate.
On 14 hour and 8 hour legs these kind of stuff ups really suck.
So I don’t think anyone is being harsh in their feedback. I think the general standard has dropped. When we are all paying 30-40% more for tickets post Covid. The airline should do better.
I know I’m usually 1 person in a few hundred on a flight. So percentage wise I don’t matter
Just flew SQ biz BKK-SIN and SQ Y SIN-DPS and loved both flights.
On biz leg, somehow we were assigned “Kosher” meals though we are and selected vegetarian.
The crew apologized came back in 5 mins with an option of fried rice, and assembled a new meal, don’t know how for 3 of us!! Not sure if these were crew meals but I just love SQ
I flew SQ a few months ago and feel like the product isn’t as nice as it was in 2019.
I ordered a book the cook meal which wasn’t catered. The FA blew me off and didn’t apologize until I brought it up again (to her credit she got the cabin manager who came with an ipad and profusely apologized).
I later got an email which erroneously claimed I booked too late (but...
I flew SQ a few months ago and feel like the product isn’t as nice as it was in 2019.
I ordered a book the cook meal which wasn’t catered. The FA blew me off and didn’t apologize until I brought it up again (to her credit she got the cabin manager who came with an ipad and profusely apologized).
I later got an email which erroneously claimed I booked too late (but I put the selection in 2 weeks before departure…)
I think they have a lot of inexperienced crews and facing hiccups getting back up to schedule.
This appears to be a service failure on the part of SQ. It is reasonable that the drinks be served so that they can be enjoyed with the meal. If the special meal is being served outside of the trolley system, then so should the drinks that go with that meal.
If the workflow does not allow for that, then the core work process is derelict. Otherwise, if the crew stepped outside of their...
This appears to be a service failure on the part of SQ. It is reasonable that the drinks be served so that they can be enjoyed with the meal. If the special meal is being served outside of the trolley system, then so should the drinks that go with that meal.
If the workflow does not allow for that, then the core work process is derelict. Otherwise, if the crew stepped outside of their workflow, then they messed up.
This passenger's frustration was entirely understandable and the feedback was entirely appropriate.
FWIW IME cabin managers on SQ don't dirty their hands with basic tasks, like meal service, so I'm not sure that your claim that the cabin manager was stuck for some minutes is particularly relevant.
Was book-the-cook and /. or rebooking of meals per the onboard menu available fo this fight? If so, IME SQ pushes customers to make their meal choices ahead of the flight - which appears to greatly facilitate service since people have have already made their meal choices.
In my recent experience of SQ business class, the service was faultless, per the standard expected from an airline with an excellent reputation for service.
Found the obnoxious complainer
@ Aussie
Do you complain, if you don't get the product / service you've paid for...?
It's not about the act of complaining, it's how you do it. It's clear from this comment that you're one of the people who don't know how to without being a jerk.
You can complain obnoxiously or complain respectfully. How you will be seen is two totally different people.
@ platy -- So do you think the way the passenger expressed feedback was appropriate? Because you're very quick to defend him here and have a lot to say about this situation (you've commented more than anyone), but you seem to refuse to acknowledge that the way he communicated wasn't polite?
And the cabin manager on this flight was working a lot serving other passengers.
I have a question for you, platy. Looking at your...
@ platy -- So do you think the way the passenger expressed feedback was appropriate? Because you're very quick to defend him here and have a lot to say about this situation (you've commented more than anyone), but you seem to refuse to acknowledge that the way he communicated wasn't polite?
And the cabin manager on this flight was working a lot serving other passengers.
I have a question for you, platy. Looking at your comment history, you primarily comment to try to pick apart my posts and what I write. You sometimes say "love your blog, but..."
If you do enjoy the blog, how about positive reinforcement sometimes? How about commenting on the things that you enjoy, rather than just things you don't enjoy? I pour a lot of time into this blog, and if you do in fact enjoy it (as you claim to when you criticize), don't you think that would be justified?
Hey Ben, just throwing some positive reinforcement your way. I like your blog as do thousands of others. I've learned so much from it that it's worth coming back to often. The posts that don't interest me or for whatever reason don't appeal to me, I just ignore. Haters gonna hate, just ignore them.
@ snic -- Thanks, I really appreciate it! :-)
@Lucky
I have praised your blog on a number of occasions and included my specific reasons for ranking yours as the best travel blog I have ever read.
It's your choice to reject that repeated positive feedback and (sadly, in my view) claim that it wasn't offered in in good faith.
On this particular occasion, and in your answer to your question above, I am not condoning rude behaviour by this or any other...
@Lucky
I have praised your blog on a number of occasions and included my specific reasons for ranking yours as the best travel blog I have ever read.
It's your choice to reject that repeated positive feedback and (sadly, in my view) claim that it wasn't offered in in good faith.
On this particular occasion, and in your answer to your question above, I am not condoning rude behaviour by this or any other passenger.
No, with your "permission", I'll risk expressing a dissenting opinion on the events, which you describe...
I question whether the "outrage" you (and others) have confected about this event to be more unfortunate than whatever "outrage" the aforementioned passenger expressed in his alleged "obnoxious" conversations with the crew following a service issue (which you acknowledge occurred).
FWIW it would also trouble me to think that another passenger was eavesdropping a conversation I was having with a crew member or another passenger over a period of 10 minutes or more! WTF?!
Sure, if voices were wantonly raised or profanities uttered (you don't claim such, but please update, if these factors were in play), I would expect the attention of others to be directed at such a conversation.
Now, it's just me, but, unlike you, I personally wouldn't get involved by saying anything to the crew specifically about the person / conversation in question.
I would (and have on any number of occasions) go out of my way to praise crew who are clearly having a bad day or having to deal with difficult customers.
For the record, I was once in broadly similar to your good self. It involved some American dude transferring from LAX through SYD to MEL and the bags hadn't kept up with his connection. He was having a bit of meltdown in the front of a QF 747-400 as we were settling into our seats.
Instead of having a go at him for berating the cabin crew (as you describe being tempted to do), I reassured him regarding the airline's excellent record and best intentions. He calmed down.
The crew came and thanked me and I was invited to the fight deck (pre 911) and offered the jump seat for the descent and landing into MEL.
Everybody involved left the aircraft happy.
@ platy -- You need a strong dose of politeness, humility and reasonability!! Possibly forced down your throat......
@ GLCTraveler
..and that, folks, is the sound of the sad gasp of a pithed frog, rendered braindead, but still croaking inanities...
This is actually typical SQ regardless of flight length or special meal. Meal flow is always a mess. Drinks and meal are not coordinated ,among other issues. The standard to avoid this, used by many airlines is to serve drinks first while food is being prepared and then people typically have a drink when the food arrives or worst case they top their wine or water etc up from the cart when the meal arrives....
This is actually typical SQ regardless of flight length or special meal. Meal flow is always a mess. Drinks and meal are not coordinated ,among other issues. The standard to avoid this, used by many airlines is to serve drinks first while food is being prepared and then people typically have a drink when the food arrives or worst case they top their wine or water etc up from the cart when the meal arrives. SQ just makes a “meal” of it for some reason. No point arguing with the crew over it for 10 minutes but SQ needs to change the flow. It doesn’t work.
A good number of your recent posts are complaining about people during your travels. Did the pandemic leave you with rose tinted glasses of "how it used to be" and you're jaded to find out it's the same or worse than before, or perhaps you're just getting older/crankier, or maybe people are generally just complaining a lot more? LOL
Indeed - I'm struggling to work out why a customer service issue, which was none of the author's business, and didn't affect him, was really any of his concern.
In fact, it's kinda creepy to be listening in to somebody's private conversation with the crew.
It is in an airplane. With the way this is written, do you really think the person was being quiet? Lol... I can't with some of these comments. Maybe this is why Americans are known for being brash and loud
It is Ben's business when he was forced to listen to the pettiness for 10 minutes.
@ ML
..."forced to listen to"...give it a break...there's no mention that the passenger was being loud...SQ headphones would ordinarily be available in business class in the event the author didn't have access to a personal pair of NC headphones?!
@ platy -- Oh c'mon. It was creepy that I heard this "private" conversation? I had taken my headphones off to communicate with the flight attendant because she had just finished serving me. She served this guy next. I naturally overheard it, and I only paid more attention to the conversation once I heard how rudely he was talking to the flight attendant.
Ben concluded his post with why he wrote this. It's a gentle reminder to us readers and travelers to "Please don’t complain like this, folks".
@ XPL
Sure...but he also added some unnecessary stuff about Karachi, etc., as if that was even relevant...
I disagree. I've been on Singapore flights between Sin and Kul. They serve FULL meals on a very short flight. It's a prime example of people not appreciating what they are getting. Singapore could easily drop to a you get a glass of water on this flight and that's it. I mean what kind of fine dining experience are people expecting on a hour long flight. I have watched the crew jump out of their...
I disagree. I've been on Singapore flights between Sin and Kul. They serve FULL meals on a very short flight. It's a prime example of people not appreciating what they are getting. Singapore could easily drop to a you get a glass of water on this flight and that's it. I mean what kind of fine dining experience are people expecting on a hour long flight. I have watched the crew jump out of their seats and go around serving bread where they are practically throwing out at you because time is so short mis like the Nascar tire change in the air episode. Damn people will find anything to be offended by.
@ Bob
But we're not talking about a very short fight at all.
Nor are we talking about a fine dining experience.
Nor are we talking about being offended.
We're talking about simply serving the drinks with the meal.
Perhaps a nice way of telling you all to chill the F out.
It's a travel blog. He writes about interesting stories.
Serve the ‘special’ meals w/water…
As I was reading I thought, sounds like he was Indian or Pakistani . Then you mentioned Karachi.
The vilest passenger I came across on my recent round the world trip was an obnoxious American, ironically on an SQ business class flight - coughed his lungs out without ever trying to stymie the flow and strutted around like, well, a typical dumb, arrogant, self-entitled American....;)
American, or privileged white man from the U.S.A? There's a difference =)
Yes, the casual use of blanket statements about Americans. What an intellectual stimulating conversation.
@ Icarus -- For what it's worth, he didn't appear to be Indian or Pakistani. He says he flies to Karachi a lot, and I kind of got the sense it might be because there's good fares from there (based on how he talked about it).
I don't think Singapore even flies to Karachi. They stopped in 2010. Karachi is not a fun or suitable airport/destination for mileage running. It's more likely the guy actually had to go there for other reasons. They area surprising nu.ber of foreigners who work in Karachi (I fly to Karachi a few times a year.
As is said in Singapore, "so kay poh wah."
What a sad life this man seems to have.
What a douche! Lol
Easiest solution - serve the entire meal on a single tray rather than faffing around with drinks, bread baskets, etc.. You can eliminate one crewmember position and reduce passenger interaction as well.
Easier said than done. Those carts can only hold so much and loaded with meals alone, can weigh a good 70 - 80 kgs. Add drinks and breads to that, and the fact that at start of service they are often being pushed uphill as the aircraft is still in the climb, that is simply not practical.
I did a Rt to FRA from JFK on Singapore in spring 2022, business one way and first the other. I was completely underwhelmed especially with the First product, incompletely stocked bathrooms, cold food relatively tasteless and fairly indifferent service. I used miles for my trip and I felt I was treated differently than apparent paid passengers. Nevertheless, we certainly stretched out, enjoyed the hard product and were polite. I have another trip on SQ...
I did a Rt to FRA from JFK on Singapore in spring 2022, business one way and first the other. I was completely underwhelmed especially with the First product, incompletely stocked bathrooms, cold food relatively tasteless and fairly indifferent service. I used miles for my trip and I felt I was treated differently than apparent paid passengers. Nevertheless, we certainly stretched out, enjoyed the hard product and were polite. I have another trip on SQ in 2023 but only because they were $1000 per ticket less costly in J than other regional carriers, after my experience I would wonder what the big deal is and whether their service edge, better than US carriers for sure, has slipped.
Robert Isom is that you?
@Sean M
But if SQ did that, they'd end up being like any old sad airline from the U.S. And I'm pretty sure the last thing SQ would do is take its cue from UA, DL or AA..... (I've included six (6) acronyms for your pleasure.)