A few months ago we learned how United CEO Scott Kirby had reportedly approached American CEO Robert Isom about the concept of a merger. American “rejected” this for obvious reasons, arguing there was no way this would get regulatory approval. Nonetheless, Kirby made his case publicly about how this would be good for consumers.
As it turns out, before Kirby approached Isom, he actually approached Delta CEO Ed Bastian about the concept of a merger between those two airlines.
In this post:
The idea of a Delta & United merger was floated in 2025
The Wall Street Journal is reporting that last year, Kirby made a phone call to Bastian about the concept of a merger between United and Delta.
Delta leaders reportedly discussed the approach and merits of a potential deal as part of preliminary due diligence, and talks didn’t progress, as both companies moved on from the proposal. Then months later, Kirby tried the same thing with Isom.
Kirby’s ambition is to build one US mega carrier, and he has used a “trade deficit” argument to support this concept being good for consumers. The idea is that the US has more international service from foreign carriers than on local carriers, and the way to address that is to build an even more powerful airline.
Bastian, meanwhile, has been consistent in arguing that there shouldn’t be any consolidation between big US carriers, and that any consolidation would center around the smaller players.
In 2025, Delta and United accounted for 90% of the US airline industry profits. At the moment, United has a market cap of $38 billion, while Delta has a market cap of $56 billion. While there had long been talk of United possibly buying JetBlue, in recent times, Kirby has argued that the deal isn’t big enough to make sense.
I’d love to know what’s going on in Kirby’s head
If United and Delta could get regulatory approval for a merger, of course they’d do so, since they’d dominate the market, and would have so much pricing power. The issue here is how one gets regulatory for such a deal, because it would unarguably be awful — like, truly, truly terrible — for competition.
Surely Kirby knows this, and my guess is that he just thinks that if there’s ever a chance that something like this would be allowed, it would be while President Trump is in office. Kirby has been doing everything he can to flatter Trump, and maybe it was all in anticipation of this “ask.” But even so, it’s just beyond reasonable.
As I explained when United floated the idea of buying American, one can’t possibly put into words how bad it would be for the competitive landscape if two of the “big three” carriers merged. But Kirby’s argument seems to be a combination of grasping at straws, and hoping to make people patriotic, or something:
- Kirby basically acknowledges fares would go up (he has made it clear that even when oil prices go down, he hopes United can keep fares up and boost margins), but he’s saying fares don’t matter, but instead, value is what counts; people don’t want cheap tickets, they want a nice experience!
- This concept of creating a competitive airline globally is what would be worst for competition, since it would essentially destroy the balance of joint ventures, which is what keeps long haul airfare competitive (it’s useful to have three sets of these, one with each of the “big three” alliances)
- Then there’s just talk of the US economy in general, and this is where it gets the most ridiculous; Kirby talks about how the combined airline will have lots of union jobs, will strengthen US aircraft manufacturing, etc. (that’s already happening, and for that matter, United has also been ordering hundreds of Airbus planes)
I was hoping that Kirby’s argument in favor of such a deal would be a bit more sophisticated, but it really isn’t. It’s essentially just somewhere between trying to call in favors to Trump, and trying to pose as being patriotic. The idea is to completely overlook concerns about domestic competition by making this all about international service.
Bottom line
We recently learned how United CEO Scott Kirby came up with the idea of buying American. Even before that, though, he reportedly approached Delta about such a deal, but was quickly rejected. Kirby’s proposal to build a mega US carrier would be great for investors, and no one else.
I have to assume that Kirby knows this, and is just trying to convince himself otherwise. The timing here also isn’t a coincidence, because clearly he believes he has a “once in a lifetime” opportunity to make this happen, while Trump is in office. But even Trump wouldn’t do this to the American people… right?
What do you make of Kirby’s proposal for United and Delta to merge?
International carriers provide more international service... thats because, if you have a choice, why would you fly a shitty US airplane internationally. Most INTL carriers are way better across the board (most). There are some Americans (who are clueless) think the US Airlines are safer but not when you compare them to most European and Asian airlines.
Any mega merger would make the cost of flying go way up and the service levels would take a further decline.
In reality, the US is the world's largest aviation market and carriers typically carrier a higher percentage of traffic to/from their home country than foreign carriers do.
Kirby has been rather vocal about the US having a share gap in the international marketplace but that is partly because the US has pretty open aviation markets and so there is often more foreign carrier service to a market than there is US carrier service; there...
In reality, the US is the world's largest aviation market and carriers typically carrier a higher percentage of traffic to/from their home country than foreign carriers do.
Kirby has been rather vocal about the US having a share gap in the international marketplace but that is partly because the US has pretty open aviation markets and so there is often more foreign carrier service to a market than there is US carrier service; there is more S. Korean carrier service than on US carriers - even though DL and KE has a JV but it is also true to Taiwan and there are no JVs between US and Taiwanese carriers.
add in the Middle East carriers - which use big planes and there has long beeen more ME carrier service - and it isn't hard to see why there is more foreign carrier service.
Despite Kirby's justification for wanting to see a more balanced level of service on US carriers between the US and the world, UA's largest fleet of longhaul capable aircraft is the 789, the smallest fleet type and UA is pushing the range of that aircraft by adding more premium seats while reducing the total number of seats - so UA's own fleet choice doesn't speak to it wanting to take steps to increase US carrier share.
and all of the big 3 are primarily domestic so any consolidation between US carriers reduces competition in the US market - and that is simply not in the interest of anyone except the carriers that want to consolidate.
Since AA and DL have both told UA they are not interested in consolidation, it is and will be Kirby's unfulfilled pipe dream to see a more consolidated US airline industry so he can achieve through mergers which he has not been able to figure out how to do under the current airline environment.
The only two international routes to/from the US that the 789 can't handle are NYC-SIN & NYC-SYD. UA is over 40% larger internationally than #2 with 57 more widebodies currently and 130 new ones coming in the next five years compared to just 54 for #2. The 787-10 is perfect for Europe, and UA will have 75 of them before #2 gets its first.
to absolutely no surprise, you continue to conflate size with being able to be the best and also fail to consider real world economics in your assessment of aircraft cababilities.
UA can and is stretching the legs of the 789 by removing seats and putting more premium seats on the aircraft but the 789 is still substantially more performance limited than the 359 and certainy the 35k.
UA could fly LAX-SIN and JFK-BOM but they...
to absolutely no surprise, you continue to conflate size with being able to be the best and also fail to consider real world economics in your assessment of aircraft cababilities.
UA can and is stretching the legs of the 789 by removing seats and putting more premium seats on the aircraft but the 789 is still substantially more performance limited than the 359 and certainy the 35k.
UA could fly LAX-SIN and JFK-BOM but they will be able to carry very little cargo and and will have much worse per seat economics against every other potential competitor that will use larger aircraft and some will also have lower labor costs; UA is perhaps the only major airline in the world that uses the 789 as its longest range aircraft for good reason - the 350 simply has better economics and capacity including for cargo.
Even if UA goes for the 779, UA will have boxed itself into a corner in terms of performance and economics compared to the world's other large global carriers.
You love to extrapolate UA's potential but do not do the same for other carriers. ie DL is getting rid of older 767s while UA is not while DL has no older generation 777s anymore but UA is one of the world's largest operators of them.
and UA already has the largest fleet of 787-10s which is ideal for TATL markets but it, along w/ every other attribute you love to cite, does not translate into an earnings advantage.
and none of this changes that Kirby clearly does not believe that he can win in the marketplace as a standalone carrier - because he has tried to merge w/ 2 of his megacarrier competitors - only to be rebuffed by both.
The chances are very high - as I have said all along - that UA will remain a distant player in the domestic marketplace and second tier in just about every financial metric including profitability
THAT is what you cannot admit to be the truth as much as you don't like it.
The Timcel would (falsely) have you believe that UA is some distant also-ran domestically.
In reality, the Big 4 have ~75% share, with 1-2 points separating 1 vs 4.
Timbits, were you always a failure as a DL analyst, or did you start mediocre and just turn to sh!t over time?
As the experts will tell you the 787 is far more efficient, flexible and effective for the vast majority of the international destinations to/from the US and carries the load better than the 359 in many cases (see JNB). The 35X will be a performer, but larger planes are only money makers if you have the high yield demand to fill them. It is not a great plane for an airline that is trying to...
As the experts will tell you the 787 is far more efficient, flexible and effective for the vast majority of the international destinations to/from the US and carries the load better than the 359 in many cases (see JNB). The 35X will be a performer, but larger planes are only money makers if you have the high yield demand to fill them. It is not a great plane for an airline that is trying to reestablish itself against a market leader that is 147% larger in the Pacific. And before you get too excited about one quarter, the entire system cargo is relatively small even compared to just Pacific PRASM alone, much less system PRASM.
UA has SFO, 2x the cargo revenue, 2.5x the Pacific revenue and is 40% larger internationally than DL. UA has 57 more widebodies currently and 130 new ones coming in the next five years compared to just 54 for DL. The 787-10 is perfect for Europe, and UA will have 75 of them before DL gets its first. DL has seven more gates in LAX and some 35Xs that are planned to start arriving in 2027. Good luck. DL will need it.
2025: PRASM - CASM
UAL: 16.18 - 16.46 = -0.28
DAL: 17.37 - 19.31 = -1.94
2025 System cargo revenue $m
UA: 1,779
DL: 900
∆: 879/900 = 98%
2025 Pacific revenue $m
UA: 6,878
DL: 2,787
∆: 4,091/2787= 147%
United has publicized its desire to merge with American and now Delta. They are making noise with going public about giant mergers. Then when JetBlue reconfigures their fleet and declares bankruptcy they will “settle” for buying JetBlue. The gov will approve the merger. Delta and Americans leverage in stopping the merger will be lessened due to these announcements.
except DL came before AA - which shows not only how much more valuable is but also how much Kirby is petrified of DL's TPAC expansion.
and, no, just because he gets told yes on the third time when that is equally bad for everyone else.
what kind of parent are or were you that you gave into your kids on their 3rd request even though it was equally as bad as the first two?
LTD says, "except DL came before AA - which shows not only how much more valuable is but also how much Kirby is petrified of DL's TPAC expansion."
Do you claim to be a psychic in addition to an 'analyst'? Too funny.
American needs to merge with Alaska
No. Keep them separate. Alaska has some decent redemptions on American at times. However, it feels like they’ve noticed that we’ve noticed, so they’re tying up those loose ends.
The moment Spirit left, fares have doubled, with little to no last minute decent fares. Spirit kept the US3 in check.
Yes, Frontier is the bottom feeding airline now, but even its rates have increased...
Everyone loved to hate on Spirit (without ever flying them) - they were very nice once you tried them. Well, you all got what you wanted. HIGHER FARES!!
Imagine what will happen when two of the US3 merge.
Bottom-feeding airlines attract botton-feeding customers. It's good that airfares have gone up since it economically eliminates the hoi polloi. Back to the 60s.
I guess the middle section of the Venn diagram between team sports fans and avgeeks isn't necessarily the largest, but sports teams will just call any other team to see if they can float a trade even if the possibility is zero.
And for a car dealer metaphor, you should entertain the people who say they're just there to kick tires because you never know the percentage of them that will turn into actual buying customers
That would have been very amusing.
I find it curious that Kirby floats these ideas when they seem incredibly unlikely to happen but I suppose it doesn’t hurt to think outside the box. I warm to his public persona but he’s interesting.
*don’t warm, rather.
I like it. Ring up your competitors, troll them with talks of an impossible merger, send their strategists off to spend a week looking at the offer, knowing they'll reject it anyway. Boss.
boards have to entertain all kinds of scenarios.
It really didn't take any more time for DL or AA's boards to reject Kirby than it did for him to call UA's board to ask permission to propose those deals.
He is a loser that can't figure out how to achieve his goals on his own; either his goals are out of line w/ what is achievable or he is utterly incompetent.
Feel free to pick...
boards have to entertain all kinds of scenarios.
It really didn't take any more time for DL or AA's boards to reject Kirby than it did for him to call UA's board to ask permission to propose those deals.
He is a loser that can't figure out how to achieve his goals on his own; either his goals are out of line w/ what is achievable or he is utterly incompetent.
Feel free to pick one of the previous two options but this is the greatest repudiation of his leadership ever. The fact that DL kept it under wraps for so long (I suspect someone there finally leaked it) speaks volumes about their leadership skills and desire to not damage a competitor's reputation even if it should be.
He’s grown market cap at a rate 50% higher than your teet suckled DL since he became CEO.
Mic drop.
the only mic drop is from simpletons like you that cannot accept that DAL is still worth 41% more than UAL as a company even though UA flies 10% more ASMs.
Just because UA was an even worse mess 10 years ago doesn't mean that it has moved into any kind of leadership position other than ego and denial.
If Kirby was convinced that UA could achieve parity with AA, DL and WN in...
the only mic drop is from simpletons like you that cannot accept that DAL is still worth 41% more than UAL as a company even though UA flies 10% more ASMs.
Just because UA was an even worse mess 10 years ago doesn't mean that it has moved into any kind of leadership position other than ego and denial.
If Kirby was convinced that UA could achieve parity with AA, DL and WN in the domestic market, he wouldn't have proposed either the AA or DL merger.
but UA can't achieve domestic parity with the rest of the big 4 so his best proposal is a merger with one of those carriers even though it was DOA before the idea ever left his mouth.
THAT is the level of leadership from Kirby. He can't figure out how to lead UA out of its current predicament so his best answer is to eliminate the competition.
LTD says, "UA can't achieve domestic parity with the rest of the big 4"
This poor ignorant little guy can't understand simple percentages. DL has 7% more domestic market share which he thinks is a HUGE deal. But DL is going to overtake UA in the Pacific where UA has 147% more revenue. He also likes to tout a good Q2 for DL cargo, but UA had 98% more cargo revenue in 2025. And for...
LTD says, "UA can't achieve domestic parity with the rest of the big 4"
This poor ignorant little guy can't understand simple percentages. DL has 7% more domestic market share which he thinks is a HUGE deal. But DL is going to overtake UA in the Pacific where UA has 147% more revenue. He also likes to tout a good Q2 for DL cargo, but UA had 98% more cargo revenue in 2025. And for the first five months of 2026 DL's cancellation rate is 45% higher than UA.
US domestic mainline market share (passengers) 2016/2025
DL: 16.4%/17.8%, +9%
AA: 17.2%/17.3%, +1%
SW:18.2%/16.9%, -7%
UA: 13.0%/16.6%, +28%
∆ DL 17.8 - 16.6 = 1.2/16.6 = 7%
2025 Pacific revenue $m
UA: 6,878
DL: 2,787
∆: 4,091/2787= 147%
2025 System cargo revenue $m
UA: 1,779
DL: 900
∆: 879/900 = 98%
I know exactly whats going on in Kirby's head - dementia.
Kirby and Nocella are nice guys; I’m sure they find a spot for Bastain at the combined carrier.
This freakin' guy... naw, Kirby's just trying the Trump-thing of getting in the news at all costs; start and stop controversy over PBI-DJT? Perfect. Talk mergers that shouldn't happen. Excellent. What next? Bunch a baby? Sure. No consequences. All PR is good PR.
*punch (or, why not punch a bunch!)
Anita's Rule #82: Never underestimate Scott Kirby's willingness to ask... or Tim Dunn's willingness to declare it proves every theory he's ever posted.
except he didn't talk about this - at least openly.
DL did its due diligence and, as any of the big 4 would have done, politely said "NO" behind the scenes.
Kirby didn't float this because he wanted the media attention but somehow the WSJ managed to find about it anyway.
when he tried w/ the AA attempt, he went public, undoubtedly because there are alot of AAL investors that probably did like the...
except he didn't talk about this - at least openly.
DL did its due diligence and, as any of the big 4 would have done, politely said "NO" behind the scenes.
Kirby didn't float this because he wanted the media attention but somehow the WSJ managed to find about it anyway.
when he tried w/ the AA attempt, he went public, undoubtedly because there are alot of AAL investors that probably did like the idea of selling out to UAL even if the anticompetitive elements of UA-AA were just as real as UA-DL.
You and others can't stand that Kirby's own ACTIONS are much more indicative of what he believes in his heart than what he says on his lips.
All of the new aircraft that UA is taking - and all of the new gates at IAD and IAH can't overcome the fact that UA still has the 4th largest domestic network on its own aircraft and there is little to no likelihood that will change even as the feds (the ones that some people think UA will just buy off) have extended capacity limits at ORD and EWR for another year.
Baby, I wasn't inviting a rebuttal. I was checking to see if your keyboard still had a space bar.
yes, it has a space key and it also has all those letters - which I most certainly will use in a response to you.
"I’d love to know what’s going on in Kirby’s head"
Who knows? But finding out starts with a visit to a neurologist, a psychiatrist, and possibly some time in a institutionalized care facility.
That said, the fat orange Nazi would push through provided that he would somehow stand to make hundreds of millions of dollars (more?) in personal gain, so corrupt is he and his RICO partners in their "government" "administration."
why do you and others find it necessary to drag the president - regardless of who it is - into this?
Actual data, not speculation, is that the current DOT blocked UA's growth at EWR under Kirby's direction because it resulted in repeated operational meltdowns even as Kirby blamed the DOT for failing to manage the ATC system. He later sucked up them for how great of a job they were doing - but you...
why do you and others find it necessary to drag the president - regardless of who it is - into this?
Actual data, not speculation, is that the current DOT blocked UA's growth at EWR under Kirby's direction because it resulted in repeated operational meltdowns even as Kirby blamed the DOT for failing to manage the ATC system. He later sucked up them for how great of a job they were doing - but you can't put words back in someone's mouth after they have been said.
and then Kirby hatched the notion that UA could push AA's hub out of ORD and aggressively dumped capacity, resulting in the DOT, yet again, capping ORD flights and forcing UA to walk away from the idea that it could crush AA's ORD hub - so he then talked about acquiring (not merging but acquiring AA).
The evidence is quite overwhelming that UA and Kirby have not obtained the favor from the feds that he wants.
The notion that he could succeed at merging two of the big 3 airlines is simply not supported by evidence
"why do you and others find it necessary to drag the president - regardless of who it is - into this?"
Not dragging the president "regardless of who it is" - dragging the fat orange Nazi. Because he's the most corrupt "president" in the history of the USA, and involves himself (read: micromanages) in decisions that no honest president would, all to enrich himself, his family, and his cronies, over and over and over again...
"why do you and others find it necessary to drag the president - regardless of who it is - into this?"
Not dragging the president "regardless of who it is" - dragging the fat orange Nazi. Because he's the most corrupt "president" in the history of the USA, and involves himself (read: micromanages) in decisions that no honest president would, all to enrich himself, his family, and his cronies, over and over and over again at the expense of hundreds of millions of US citizens and billions of others around the world.
Enjoying the new forever war? Hope so, because it shows no signs of abating.
And this "merger" Kirby wanted would have led to higher prices for all Americans, just because the fat orange Nazi's greed is insatiable.
At this point it needs to ask if he is ok. Not making light of anything, but seriously is he ok?
In Trump's third term, the merger amongst United, Delta, America, Southwest and Jetblue will be complete and we'll have the national carrier we crave, Trump Airlines.
Will we finally be ‘great’ again, then? *sigh*
Smart intelligence gathering by Kirby. He is a crafty guy! Love the bravado.
Probably just leaning the Overton Window of acceptable negotiating terms. He knew it was never going to happen with DL - more about taking that learning and moving on to the much weaker and gettable play, AA. Or back to B6 at some point.
UA is a thriving F100 company, with other industry players jealous of both intangible and tangible...
Smart intelligence gathering by Kirby. He is a crafty guy! Love the bravado.
Probably just leaning the Overton Window of acceptable negotiating terms. He knew it was never going to happen with DL - more about taking that learning and moving on to the much weaker and gettable play, AA. Or back to B6 at some point.
UA is a thriving F100 company, with other industry players jealous of both intangible and tangible assets. Will keep growing. Only a biased, deranged incel would suggest they are going to “fail. Lol.
while you desperately try to defend Kirby and UA, confirmation of the failed DL talks - DL had no choice but to do its due diligence before telling them to F off - followed by the same thing at AA simply confirms that UA knows it cannot build a domestic system comparable to what AA, DL or WN has and may not even be able to get back into JFK, a huge strategic hole that,...
while you desperately try to defend Kirby and UA, confirmation of the failed DL talks - DL had no choice but to do its due diligence before telling them to F off - followed by the same thing at AA simply confirms that UA knows it cannot build a domestic system comparable to what AA, DL or WN has and may not even be able to get back into JFK, a huge strategic hole that, even though Kirby inherited rather than created, Kirby did the worst strategic mistake in the airline industry by giving DL 1/4 of LGA slots for $60 million net when he was an exec at USAirways.
DL has outsmarted Kirby and UA for 20 years and Kirby is tired of being humiiliated when he desperately wants to be seen as the smartest guy in the room - which he clearly is not.
DL politely did its due diligence and said "no"
How the WSJ managed to unearth this tidbit is unknown but it confirms what I have said for years which is that it would be easier for DL to grow TPAC - which is the only regioh where UA has an advantage than it would before UA to grow a domestic system proportional in size to UA's overall size in ASMs.
all the defense in the world won't change that UA is strategically failed and they think they can buy out competitors rather than compete.
Since Kirby became CEO:
UA market cap +373%
DL market cap +245%
Quite the “failure”.
The only failure ‘round these parts is Tiny Handed Timmy, writing his same 100,000 pro-DL words per day, with everybody laughing at him. Get professional help already.
and still #4 in the US domestic market.
As Ben notes, as much as Kirby wants to couch this as about international travel, it is about the domestic size which UA cannot achieve on its own.
you hitched your wagon to the wrong star and can't stand to admit that someone far smarter than you saw that this would all come to pass while you were still fixating on flying domestic configured 737s all over the world on a seaonsal basis just to add more dots to UA's route map
Most of us on this site like to talk about the flying experience, route network, new planes, new expansion, etc. UA wildly successful on all those! It’s why they are #1 in NYC and have the biggest int’l route network. Bravo!
You, OTOH, treat your airline like a sports team. Which is truly bizarre. A psychologist would have a field day with you. “Failure in his career, ditched at his company, now roots for them...
Most of us on this site like to talk about the flying experience, route network, new planes, new expansion, etc. UA wildly successful on all those! It’s why they are #1 in NYC and have the biggest int’l route network. Bravo!
You, OTOH, treat your airline like a sports team. Which is truly bizarre. A psychologist would have a field day with you. “Failure in his career, ditched at his company, now roots for them in a weird Stockholm Syndrome scenario”.
A true outcast from society you are.
and yet you are the one that retorted with growth in market size - which is a financial metric rather than about the flying experience.
So, yes, you and rebel and Andy and the rest of uyou do want to talk about financial metrics but only if you can spin them to show that UA is superior.
When someone tells you that UA is still in second or place, you incessantly argue that those metrics...
and yet you are the one that retorted with growth in market size - which is a financial metric rather than about the flying experience.
So, yes, you and rebel and Andy and the rest of uyou do want to talk about financial metrics but only if you can spin them to show that UA is superior.
When someone tells you that UA is still in second or place, you incessantly argue that those metrics don't matter - even if they are more improved than other carriers.
No one has argued that UA hasn't done a great job of resurrecting itself from the ashes it was in 25 years ago including in the world's most expensive airline bankruptcy. but UA has hit a wall esp. in its efforts to grow domestically and that is why Kirby is desperate to find a way to achieve what I have said for years it could not do - which is grow into the first place domestic position.
and UA's market cap is still just 70% pf DL's.
Round and round we go - you are a broken record.
UA's rate of domestic route expansion is 2x DL - plus, a far broader int'l map as DL that you for sure know. Any decent analyst (aka, not yourself) would know that there isn't only one winner in this industry - lots of different ways to win.
I really DGAF that UA is #2 in a few areas (esp. profitability) - YOU are the...
Round and round we go - you are a broken record.
UA's rate of domestic route expansion is 2x DL - plus, a far broader int'l map as DL that you for sure know. Any decent analyst (aka, not yourself) would know that there isn't only one winner in this industry - lots of different ways to win.
I really DGAF that UA is #2 in a few areas (esp. profitability) - YOU are the obsessed weirdo about DL being #1 in every category. And take PERSONAL offense every time someone suggests DL is inferior at something. Guess what - you can't fly the DL refinery or the AmEx relationship. Nor can you fly the 15 ATL-MCO routes a day.
I *actually fly* UA (vs. you who sit in your basement in retirement), and reasons why they are far better than DL for me:
- bigger / broader route network in NYC
- part of a much better global airline alliance
- more premium seats
- more extra legroom seats
- I don't have to wait in endless lines to get in my airport lounges
- Much much much better loyalty program
- Better app
- Starlink very quickly a game changer
except you and your ilk most certainly do want to talk about absolute statistics and not just growth metrics and you want them to include financial metrics.
You are simply incapable of admitting that UA is really #2 in most metrics not related to size.
What you actually post speaks much more loudly than what you say matters to you.
and regarding NYC, the size difference in NYC between DL and UA is smaller than...
except you and your ilk most certainly do want to talk about absolute statistics and not just growth metrics and you want them to include financial metrics.
You are simply incapable of admitting that UA is really #2 in most metrics not related to size.
What you actually post speaks much more loudly than what you say matters to you.
and regarding NYC, the size difference in NYC between DL and UA is smaller than in LAX.
and yet I have repeatedly said that NYC is a divided market between DL and UA with both winning 2 of the 4 size metrics.
I am the one that has the objectivity while not a single "UA fan" has admitted what I just posted despite it being the truth.
as for your long list, UA can't seem to turn all of that into a profit advantage despite flying 10% more ASMs.
UA does not exist to make you happy.
It is a for-profit business and it does not do what it does as well as DL.
Just admit that UA is a second tier airline and business that cannot achieve what DL has in financial metrics or AA, DL or WN have in the domestic market - and so Kirby wants to take one of them out even as DL focuses its growth on the west coast and TPAC.
Kirby showed his vulnerability and DL is growing exactly there.
Would have never passed regulatory approval. As far as the experience, he does have a point to a certain degree. The ULCC business model does not work with the cost structure in the US save for maybe smaller niche markets. Frontier Airlines is trying to move away from the strict ULCC model. Spirit tried and failed.
It's expensive to fly a plane. Increasingly we will go back more towards the 1970s. Lower income people will...
Would have never passed regulatory approval. As far as the experience, he does have a point to a certain degree. The ULCC business model does not work with the cost structure in the US save for maybe smaller niche markets. Frontier Airlines is trying to move away from the strict ULCC model. Spirit tried and failed.
It's expensive to fly a plane. Increasingly we will go back more towards the 1970s. Lower income people will go back to the bus and those flying might something better than being shoved in a tiny seat with no legroom for hours on end. $49 fares do not and never will work.
and yet DL has been the biggest beneficiary of the collapse of the ULCC model and even segments of the LCC model.
DL gained more from NK's collapse because of NK's size at DTW, DL has grown its share relative to B6 at JFK and BOS - and continues to grow there, and WN retreated from ATL after 15 years of trying to be a second competitor to DL. For the first time since...
and yet DL has been the biggest beneficiary of the collapse of the ULCC model and even segments of the LCC model.
DL gained more from NK's collapse because of NK's size at DTW, DL has grown its share relative to B6 at JFK and BOS - and continues to grow there, and WN retreated from ATL after 15 years of trying to be a second competitor to DL. For the first time since deregulation (almost 50 years), DL has no viable competitor in ATL, where it operates the world's largest hub.
in contrast, Kirby tried to run AA out of ORD and the feds stepped in because of the damage that UA's plan would do to US aviation and consumers, WN is growing again - it has the largest overlap by metro area with UA of the big 4, and DL has announced that it intends to aggressively grow on the west coast and TPAC, the only regions where UA has an advantage.
While it chased adding Nuuk and Mongolia to its route map, DL has outstrategized UA at achieving what matters - size in the world's most important markets and profitability that UA can't and never can match on its own.
We're not going to go back to lower income people flying buses. What everyone forgets is how rich Americans are. Give or take a Luxembourg, we have the highest disposable income on earth. Now don't get me wrong healthcare costs mean that in certain metrics we're less wealthy than Europeans, but disposable income is what matters when it comes to things like booking travel.
So if the $49 fares disappear and become $199 fares (which...
We're not going to go back to lower income people flying buses. What everyone forgets is how rich Americans are. Give or take a Luxembourg, we have the highest disposable income on earth. Now don't get me wrong healthcare costs mean that in certain metrics we're less wealthy than Europeans, but disposable income is what matters when it comes to things like booking travel.
So if the $49 fares disappear and become $199 fares (which to a degree they already have) Americans are still going to fly
" even Trump wouldn't do this to the American people ? " Hi you must be new here. Welcome
Kirby is the DJT of the US airline industry. Talks a lot, says the least. United has narrowed the gap with Delta, but it isn't there yet, and likely won't be. UA will neither merge with AA nor DL. What will perpetuate further US airline industry consolidation is the massive US recession looming, and the US government debt default.
Good. Might be just what DL needed to knock it out of it's complacency.
Why do you think join ventures keep prices down?
Does the fact that ba/ib/ay/ei all get a share of every tatl not mean they have less inclination to lower fares?
Why aren't saying that, as if they exist in a vacuum and aren't fiercely competing with DL+AF+KL+VS and UA+AC+ LH+LX+OS+SN, for every dime over the Atlantic?
Whoopee, another 200+ comment thread where people are going to summon, goad, argue with, lampoon, lambaste, and even impersonate "Tim Dunn"; praying with every breath, that he'll show up and give them the clown-show that they they desire . . .
. . . and then pretend to hate it, when he does exactly that.
I swear this blog's chat, is really a covertly-conducted psych study.
The most premium of psych studies.
All they're doing is feeding the addiction of a deeply unwell person.
And then all those psychos will rage at you for calling out their lunatic behavior
I’d argue they’re equally unwell if not more unwell
Tim is mentally unwell and never uses facts or data, just statements without even an attempt at data.
Other users use data for the most part when replying to him. It's a comment section and there's no issue pointing out Tim Dunn's erratic and deranged behavior.
If you don't like it, don't read it.
I wonder who’s more lunatic, guy who obsesses about DL, or people who willingly gets ragebaited by guy obsessing about DL?
It seems all that success and fame of record quarters and running the most well oiled airline have made someone very delulu
Also Ben, one issue with your website in a new addition. As a guest commenter, why am i being forced to subscribe to newsletter to post comment? (The check box) I know it helps your website with clicks but seems a bit excessive to subscribe newsletter to post comments. That is very unheard of in most websites that allow comment function
Oh boy. Buckle up people!
For safety, buckaroos!