I’ve stayed at the St. Regis Deer Valley several times, and in past reviews I’ve called it my favorite ski points hotel in the United States. Well, I think I’ll be avoiding this hotel going forward.
We returned to the property this weekend for a ski getaway, and the stay was almost comically bad, as we moved rooms three times in two days. I’ll assume that we just had really bad luck when it comes to our issues, though the service recovery isn’t what you’d expect from a hotel charging rates like this (and that’s being very polite).
For what it’s worth, the hotel was charging over $4,000 per night for base rooms during our stay (we redeemed Bonvoy points). In fairness, it’s also Sundance right now, though you’ll see the rates are pretty consistently $3,000+ per night during peak ski season, which is wild, but also just reflects the current reality of “luxury” hotel pricing.
Let me share what happened, in chronological order…
In this post:
Our fireplace was broken upon arrival
We arrived at the St. Regis Deer Valley at around 9PM. One of my favorite things about this hotel is how most rooms have fireplaces. Being used to warmer temperatures in Florida, there’s something so cozy about turning on a fireplace while looking out at the snow. The fireplaces in the rooms are one of my favorite things about this hotel.
The second we walked in the door we turned on the fireplace… and it didn’t work. Okay, stuff happens. So I picked up the phone next to the bed to let the hotel operator know, and that phone didn’t work either. Fortunately there was a second phone in the room, but it doesn’t exactly paint a great picture of the hotel’s quality checks when you pick up a broken phone to report a broken fireplace.
Anyway, the hotel sent up two friendly engineers, who tried to fix the fireplace. After about 15 minutes, they realized it was a bigger issue, as apparently the wiring in the fireplace had melted. They said they’d come back the following day to fix it. Okay, stuff happens, it’s not a huge deal.
The hotel ambassador reached out
The following morning, I received an email from the “hotel ambassador,” with the subject line “How Is Your Stay at The St. Regis Deer Valley So Far?” I imagine this is an email that goes to guests who have certain Bonvoy elite status, and had nothing to do with what happened the evening before. Here’s what the email said:
Good morning Mr. Schlapping– Allow me to introduce myself – My name is [name], and I serve as the Hotel Ambassador at the St. Regis Deer Valley. As a Titanium Elite member, we are honored to host you and will do all we can to ensure your time with us exceeds your expectations. Our goal and promise is simple: “To Make the Everyday Exquisite”. Please allow me the opportunity to assist with any needs that may arise. I am available via email or directly at [phone number].
Okay, so forgetting that she misspelled my name (is copying and pasting that hard?!), I appreciated the idea behind this. Fantastic, the hotel wants to exceed my expectations, and “make the everyday exquisite.” So I sent her a very nice email just expressing my experience the evening before:
Thanks so much for reaching out, I appreciate it!
I’m a big fan of the St. Regis Deer Valley and have stayed here several times before. We arrived to our room yesterday to find that the fireplace was broken. We called down and maintenance came up. They were very friendly, but said they needed more time to fix it, and would come back this afternoon. On top of that, the phone next to the bed doesn’t work. That’s not a huge deal since there’s a phone on the desk that does work, but I think there’s maybe room for some more attention to detail when it comes to ensuring room amenities are working correctly.
Anyway, if there were any way to fix the fireplace as soon as possible, that would be great. Thanks, and I hope you have a great weekend!
Here’s her response to my email:
I just checked with Engineering and the part came in today and Engineering will be coming up around 3:30 to fix. If the phone on the desk is not working, please let them know when they are there.
That was the extent of the response. There was no “I’m sorry,” or “I understand your disappointment.” Also, if she’s the point of contact who is supposed to exceed expectations and assist me with any needs, couldn’t she let engineering know about the issue with the phone, rather than telling me to let them know (since I wasn’t planning on being in the room when they were fixing the fireplace)?
The fireplace still didn’t get fixed
In the afternoon, I got a call from the front desk that the engineers were ready to fix the fireplace, so I asked them to take care of it while we were out for the evening. We returned to the room in the evening, and I tried to turn on the fireplace, but it still wasn’t working.
So I went down to the front desk. I explained the issue we had, and asked the front desk agent if he saw any notes about the fireplace having been fixed. He stated that the case showed as having been closed in his system, which meant that it should be fixed. I explained that wasn’t the case, and he said he’d send engineering up again.
About 45 minutes later, the front office manager called me, and said that they weren’t able to fix the fireplace because they wouldn’t have enough time to do so, as it would take two to three hours. He said the engineers could return the following afternoon to finish the work.
At this point I told him to just not bother. While a fireplace is a nice amenity, I didn’t want to coordinate our entire stay around getting a fireplace fixed. It’s a nice amenity to have, but I didn’t want to base my entire stay around getting this fixed.
What surprised me was the complete lack of any service recovery attempt by him. Look, I share feedback with hotels because I want them to know where they need to do better, and not because I want anything. I’m not a certain blogger who has a post every week sharing how he screws hotels out of compensation.
But you’d think that in this situation the hotel would offer some minor gesture. Like, maybe a round of drinks, or a small credit, or something, just to acknowledge the inconvenience being experienced. But there was no attempt at that.
Challenges with getting Advil
The following morning, Ford had a headache due to the altitude (we live about six inches above sea level in Miami, and the altitude here gets to us). So at around 7AM I went to the front desk to ask if they had any Advil.
They indicated that they didn’t, but that the hotel’s gift shop would have it, and that opens at 8AM. Okay, we’d have to wait, but fair enough. So at 8AM I went to the gift shop, only to find that they didn’t have any Advil. So I went back to the front desk just to make sure they didn’t have Advil anywhere.
Honestly, I’ve never stayed at a luxury property that didn’t have Advil available, either for purchase or just complimentary, let alone a property trying to charge $4,000 per night. The St. Regis Deer Valley claims to have “the finest service” and to desire to “exceed expectations,” and to promise to “make the everyday exquisite.”
The front desk agent recommended I could take the shuttle into town to find Advil. Honestly, for any half decent luxury property, the correct answer in this situation should be that someone from the hotel will go to buy it, since they’re missing a basic amenity. Never mind that I had already waited an hour for the gift shop to open, based on misinformation from the front desk.
So at this point I asked to speak to the front office manager, to politely share my overall experience so far. My issue wasn’t the Advil — it was just the crappy service and managing of expectations, and we hadn’t even been at the hotel for 36 hours.
At this point I talked to front office manager Lexi, who was very professional. She was the first person I interacted with who actually understood how customer service is supposed to work. She was apologetic and tried to find solutions without making excuses, rather than the apathy I experienced from everyone else (the front office manager the night before, plus the “hotel ambassador”).
She immediately offered to send someone into town to get Advil (though I think they actually ended up finding some on property, because it was brought to our room five minutes later). She also said she’d look into the fireplace situation.
She called the room about 30 minutes later, and explained that they realized it would take several days for the fireplace to be fixed, but she offered to move us to a similar room with a fireplace, which was much appreciated.
In hospitality, you just want to feel understood, and Lexi did a great job of that. She proactively said she’d waive our resort fee. I thought that was a nice gesture, at least (after all, these fees are sort of a scam to begin with).
Our new room had no hot water
We packed up our bags and headed to our new room. Indeed, the fireplace did work, which was much appreciated. We unpacked once again, and Ford went skiing. Meanwhile I got ready to get into the shower, only to realize that… the shower had no hot water. It wasn’t just that the water wouldn’t get hot, but it was literally ice cold.
So I went back down to the front desk to talk to Lexi. “Lexi, I really appreciate you moving us, you’ve been so professional. We love the fireplace in the new room. I hate to do this to you, but there’s another problem, as the shower has no warm water.” She was obviously horrified, and said she’d immediately send engineering up. I told her we would be at lunch, and asked her to get in touch with me regarding what they find.
During lunch, Lexi called me and told me that the shower couldn’t be fixed. At this point she offered to move us to a suite, and she said she checked the suite to make sure that both the fireplace and shower were working correctly. Hah. Sure enough, the shower and fireplace were working, and everything was fine.
An $11.88 apology for the issues
To cap off this mess, the hotel sent up an amenity as an apology. It was a bottle of sparkling wine. The hotel is known for its signature champagne sabering every night, and it even has a Moët & Chandon tent. Surely they’ll give us a decent bottle of champagne as an apology, after we’ve moved rooms twice in a matter of hours?
Well, you’d be wrong. Instead they sent up an $11.88 bottle of sparkling wine. Guys, Korbel costs more than that. If this were any cheaper, it would be the Duc de Paris I was served in China Southern first class (as longtime OMAAT readers will remember!). I mean, Air France pours significantly nicer stuff in economy.
The sad reality of some “luxury” points hotels
While I’ll dedicate a separate post to this, I just wanted to briefly touch on how luxury hotels are more expensive than ever before, while offering less than ever before. And it’s especially bad with the hotels belonging to the major global hotel groups that have loyalty programs, because they seem to get away with crappy service, but people still stay on the hamster wheel.
This hotel is regularly charging over $3,000 per night for base rooms in ski season. Now, I’m not a moron, I’d never pay those kinds of prices at this hotel. If I were to drop that kind of cash, I’d book Cheval Blanc Maldives or a Singita safari, where you’ll actually have a memorable experience.
But it’s tricky, because I have to imagine a huge percentage of rooms at this hotel are booked with points, and it makes it kind of tough to manage expectations. Like, if you’re staying at a hotel that’s charging $4,000 per night, should you expect decent service? When a hotel tells you that their goal is to exceed your expectations and to “make the everyday exquisite,” and then asks you how your stay is, should you believe that they actually care? Should those of us redeeming points just shut up and expect nothing?
For example, last ski season we stayed at Airelles Val d’Isère, which was less than half the cost. In Europe, the small luxury hotel groups still care about guest experience. They charge a lot, but they truly “make the everyday exquisite.” I mean, just as the standard welcome amenity, you get a bottle of Dom Perignon 2013.
Meanwhile while the St. Regis Deer Valley is charging $4,000 per night, you don’t get any sort of welcome amenity, and if they really screw up, they give you a sub-$12 bottle of sparkling wine.
How do you reconcile what the hotel claims to be, and what it actually offers?
Bottom line
We had a quick weekend getaway to the St. Regis Deer Valley to ski. Unfortunately our stay ended up consisting of being in three rooms over the course of two days, with the first room having a broken fireplace, and the second room having no hot water.
To me, the most basic thing that a hotel can offer is functioning room amenities. That’s not just something you expect at a luxury property, but even at a limited service property off the highway. The St. Regis Deer Valley fell short there.
I very much appreciate how professional Lexi was, though my other interactions with management staff really left a lot to be desired. For so many hotels nowadays, the only thing “luxury” is the pricing…
What do you make of this St. Regis Deer Valley experience?
Stay at the Goldener Hirsch, Auberge next time!
Ben really has pointed out the sad truth of American luxury hotels these days. I recently stayed at the Park Hyatt NYC in one of their top one-of-a-kind suites paying cash. The service standard has declined so much compared to a few years ago. I had to try really hard with their management to get things right - and they did make it right at the end but it took like 6 phone calls with different people over 4 days.
A person with the title of hotel ambassador should probably pay a bit more attention to detail. I would tell that person straight to their face, but not in a Karen way. This is who you said you are. This is what you said you would do.
I echo everything people have said about skiing in Europe instead. So much cheaper (even when considering plane tickets), not really that much further for most, usually better snow, a lot less crowded, and way, way better food and hotels. We skied in Zermatt last year after Park City the year before. I will say the Waldorf-Astoria (on points) in Park City was a much better experience for us than you had at the St....
I echo everything people have said about skiing in Europe instead. So much cheaper (even when considering plane tickets), not really that much further for most, usually better snow, a lot less crowded, and way, way better food and hotels. We skied in Zermatt last year after Park City the year before. I will say the Waldorf-Astoria (on points) in Park City was a much better experience for us than you had at the St. Regis - upgraded to a suite with two fireplaces and a washer and dryer, pretty good location, and great service. The only reason to consider the St. Regis instead is that it is next to Deer Valley whereas WA is all the way on the other side at Canyons, Park City (both are ski in, ski out though).
Also had a great experience at Waldorf Astoria Park City. The hard product is nice if a touch outdated (even after 2019 room refresh), but I was really impressed by service.
This is fascinating to me because I have worked at both, and the WA is an absolute disaster behind the scenes.
Beautiful hotel but awful place to work.
Americans are getting what they’ve deserved. Arrogance and self entitlement exacerbated by MAGA and other entitled groups. Tension in the society is at its highest. How you expecting someone to service you when everyone's proud of themselves? Also, I don’t think benefits and compensation of the employees at the bottom of the food chain are so significantly different between “luxury” and “next-to-highway” properties to have a special care.
???MAGA must u bring politics into this??? A true liberal...
"I’m not a certain blogger who has a post every week sharing how he screws hotels out of compensation."
Hahahah I love this. Hi John, hi Sebastian!
While there are problems at many hotel chains, particularly after Covid, I think that Marriott is having more trouble than most. Marriott is more deferential to hotel owners than their competitors. Hyatt isn’t a perfect company, but they are often parting ways with hotel owners that don’t live up to their standards. This rarely happens with Marriott. And Marriott could care less about frequent travelers.
As someone who lived in Park City up until recently, I'm not too surprised. The entire town is a giant money grab for the super rich. Something like 60-70% of the housing is 2nd or 3rd homes occupied only a couple weeks a year (at $3.5M avg price).
There's plently of people out there for whom dropping $4k/night is not a big deal. Deer Valley sells out during many weekends, and the lift ticket...
As someone who lived in Park City up until recently, I'm not too surprised. The entire town is a giant money grab for the super rich. Something like 60-70% of the housing is 2nd or 3rd homes occupied only a couple weeks a year (at $3.5M avg price).
There's plently of people out there for whom dropping $4k/night is not a big deal. Deer Valley sells out during many weekends, and the lift ticket prices there are eye-watering.
Sometimes this sort of thing results in high standards through competition. Don't think that's the case in Park City recently.
Also, while it used to be less crowded skiing duriung Sundance, that's no longer true.
Sadly I paid cash and was in the two bedroom residence. The fireplace did not work. The TV did not work. The butler service involved somebody just picking up the phone and I was paying a lot more than 4k per night. Service was terrible. We did not even get an 11.88 bottle of cheap sparkling wine. I am no longer staying at any luxury group (particularly in the USA) with the exception of the Peninsula group. They still seem to know how to do service.
Everywhere I go, it seems like hotels are materially less apologetic when they mess up a customer’s stay.
Used a Hyatt Guest of Honor award for secondary rooms booked for a relative at the same time as I was staying. Got walked twice — yes, literally twice — for the same one-night stay due to a gap in communication between the hotels. And neither a refund of the award stay nor any material gesture...
Everywhere I go, it seems like hotels are materially less apologetic when they mess up a customer’s stay.
Used a Hyatt Guest of Honor award for secondary rooms booked for a relative at the same time as I was staying. Got walked twice — yes, literally twice — for the same one-night stay due to a gap in communication between the hotels. And neither a refund of the award stay nor any material gesture of apology for the double inconvenience of being walked.
Had an airport hotel where there was no hot watered whatsoever in the shower, something only discovered at like 4:30am during a 3 hour stay. No material apology from the hotel.
The era of 100% satisfaction guaranteed stays is more or less over. Hotels think we are all easily replaceable customers or even a nuisance for having reasonable expectations and demands for a fully functional stay, and so they (mis-)treat us as such. And this is whether at the top end hotels in a place or anything more widely affordable.
Actually for a St. Regis the experience sounds quite good. My experience is that they offer near to no service (at breakfast, at the "butler service", at housekeeping, at the reception) and in the end try to make nice by offering something small.
I totally understand Bens frustration with the property, but at least Lexi sounds like she managed to solve the problems quickly at least.
I just checked out of the montage deer valley this afternoon - It’s not just the st Regis that suffers in this market - service there was just fine and the hotel shuttles really need to be more frequent and offered later at this price point. I cross shopped the st Regis and didn’t see rack rates a 4k, but it was a close-in booking. The stein residences is the best property here, but I always thought the st regis was 2nd. Do you still agree after this?
Totally agree. Great post.
I’ve noticed the same thing. At Hyatt who used to have great customer service and valued their globalists, and made things right when things went wrong, now they could care less and Hyatt doesn’t enforce program rules at all. Park city Hyatt place claimed they were a resort and denied late checkout this weekend, and room was filthy. Heater broken said too bad.
It is a pity they didn't have it on sale, now we missed out on the article complaining about $30 Advil in a ski-hotel
Coincidentally I worked at this property for a summer during college. Yikes, sorry to see service standards have slipped… Might’ve had to do with Sundance, but even little things like the sparkling wine are tough to see. The bottle we used for our recovery/delight amenity was far nicer than that Charles de Fère (and was actual champagne), and we handed it out like candy. If a guest mentioned their flight was delayed—sparkling wine and a...
Coincidentally I worked at this property for a summer during college. Yikes, sorry to see service standards have slipped… Might’ve had to do with Sundance, but even little things like the sparkling wine are tough to see. The bottle we used for our recovery/delight amenity was far nicer than that Charles de Fère (and was actual champagne), and we handed it out like candy. If a guest mentioned their flight was delayed—sparkling wine and a cheese plate. If their hike got cancelled due to rain—sparkling…you get the idea. If what you described had happened, we would’ve pulled out every bell and whistle in the building. And I opened that gift shop after hours for a guest on more than one occasion to procure advil, motrin, whatever for guests….exactly your situation. And if not, one of us went into town. It’s an excellent property nonetheless—encourage you to give it another shot sometime soon. Sundance isn’t an excuse but maybe an explanation…hope it hasn’t genuinely gotten this bad
I've stayed here a few times. Beautiful property and I've had mostly good service, but they also think $20 per day credit covers the breakfast amenity for Platinum guests, when one entree + coffee is over $30 for most choices before you even get to tax/tip. They're cutting corners.
Isn't Charles de Frere what UA serves as a PDB in Polaris?
We had a great 5-night stay at St Regis Deer Valley over Xmas. It was pretty flawless and the service was over the top. Granted there was no fireplace in our “basic” room.
I agree with virtually everything you write Ben, but I think you’re being overly harsh in writing them off and chalking it up to a problem with “luxury hotels.” Yes, the rates are ridiculous, but as you said, perhaps very few of...
We had a great 5-night stay at St Regis Deer Valley over Xmas. It was pretty flawless and the service was over the top. Granted there was no fireplace in our “basic” room.
I agree with virtually everything you write Ben, but I think you’re being overly harsh in writing them off and chalking it up to a problem with “luxury hotels.” Yes, the rates are ridiculous, but as you said, perhaps very few of us are actually paying cash — I certainly wasn’t.
Yes, they could have handled it better, but I think going during Sundance, on top of being peak ski season, has got to make it super hard on the staff.
PS. The front desk had Motrin or something when I asked — it may not have been Advil — but they did offer me something.
“Yes, the rates are ridiculous, but as you said, perhaps very few of us are actually paying cash — I certainly wasn’t,”
Paying is paying, the method or currency used is irrelevant. A hotel lives up to service expectations they themselves set, or they do not.
This St. Regis clearly did not.
“The method of payment is irrelevant” is not a statement grounded in reality. I find it *very* relevant when I can choose between usd and some bunk boy points…
It did for us
Oh my,
Sounds pretty bad!
Every time you mention Duc de Paris I can’t stop laughing for days!
As always a big thank for your fantastic blog!
Oh my,
Sounds pretty bad!
Every time you mention Duc de Paris I can’t stop laughing for days!
As always a big thank for your fantastic blog!
This property is awful and should have the St. Regis name pulled from it. I have stayed there several times but never during ski season. The rooms are barely luxury and definitely do not warrant the ridiculous prices they get in the winter.
The pool area is an embarrassment. I think they finally replaced the worn and faded cushions but it isn’t clean and pool service lets dirty dishes and drinks pile up.
...This property is awful and should have the St. Regis name pulled from it. I have stayed there several times but never during ski season. The rooms are barely luxury and definitely do not warrant the ridiculous prices they get in the winter.
The pool area is an embarrassment. I think they finally replaced the worn and faded cushions but it isn’t clean and pool service lets dirty dishes and drinks pile up.
Your experience doesn’t surprise me from my experience there even though I never had those issues myself.
Obviously it’s in an amazing location and could be an amazing property. If only they would reinvest the profits they’re making nightly and bring this property up to what St. Regis standards should be.
Sorry to hear that! If it helps to know for future stays, we are here at the waldorf for the weekend and were greeted by the most friendly staff. Also got upgraded to a bedroom suite with a full kitchen and lots of dining and living space!
For better or worse (and noted on this blog ad nauseam), the operational business model at major chains is: properties themselves are the customer, and the individuals staying are merely the product. Thus zero incentive for even passable customer service. Manage expectations accordingly.
First world problem. Oh my!
YRU here?
Agreed, this is such an out of touch post. The apology wine wasn't expensive enough!
This blog is entirely dedicated to first world problems, you dolt.
I agree with you and in this post-Covid era, luxury brands or even normal high end brands have quality issues. THey are charging more and giving less. All these brands create these cute names for new modern chains, but they provide little in reality. Service is the problem here, and the new batch of hospitality students is simply not up to par. The problems are most severe in the US. I no longer waste any...
I agree with you and in this post-Covid era, luxury brands or even normal high end brands have quality issues. THey are charging more and giving less. All these brands create these cute names for new modern chains, but they provide little in reality. Service is the problem here, and the new batch of hospitality students is simply not up to par. The problems are most severe in the US. I no longer waste any points or cash on these high end hotels in the US. I save it for Asia and Europe. Now I understand why Airbnb continues to be popular! What a sad state of affairs in the hotel industry in US!
The problem is only in the US. This country lost its touch. I don’t spend money in the US for leisure, only if I am on business. You get way more for your money in Europe.
Hah! You get way more for your money just about anywhere else.
It’s a global problem. I have run into a drop in service delivery quality and meaningful service recovery efforts at hotels in every continent (save Antarctica) in the last three months. The hotels deem it affordable to write off “complaining” customers and to even deal with bad public reviews online and just ignore most of word of mouth criticisms and their consequences. In some ways this “who cares” way of hotels doing business is part...
It’s a global problem. I have run into a drop in service delivery quality and meaningful service recovery efforts at hotels in every continent (save Antarctica) in the last three months. The hotels deem it affordable to write off “complaining” customers and to even deal with bad public reviews online and just ignore most of word of mouth criticisms and their consequences. In some ways this “who cares” way of hotels doing business is part and parcel of hotels thinking it better to have a lower occupancy while maintaining high rates than to boost occupancy by heavily discounting rates.
We live in a ski town in the US. I would never. And I mean never. Lay down the cash to ski in a typical North American ski resort for a week. Our experiences in Japan and Europe on ski vacations so far exceed the North American experience in terms of value and experience.
Skiing even in “expensive” Norway and Switzerland — not to ignore cheap skiing in Sweden — is a bargain in comparison to the major/internationally famous ski resorts in the US. Lift tickets, lodging, any equipment rentals, and ski lessons are much cheaper for me in Europe than in the US. In part, that is why I now typically hit ski slopes in Europe more often during a ski season than I do in the US....
Skiing even in “expensive” Norway and Switzerland — not to ignore cheap skiing in Sweden — is a bargain in comparison to the major/internationally famous ski resorts in the US. Lift tickets, lodging, any equipment rentals, and ski lessons are much cheaper for me in Europe than in the US. In part, that is why I now typically hit ski slopes in Europe more often during a ski season than I do in the US. And that is even as I tend to have more hotel point redemption options around ski areas in North America than in Europe.
interesting enough I had this same place booked for this coming weekend. I ended up cancelling within cancellation period as I heard similar horror stories from last years ski season and even some similar stories during offseason. To top it off they sent near threatening pre-cancellation emails reminding me that even though it was a point reservation, if I cancelled past the deadline they would give me back my points but put a charge of...
interesting enough I had this same place booked for this coming weekend. I ended up cancelling within cancellation period as I heard similar horror stories from last years ski season and even some similar stories during offseason. To top it off they sent near threatening pre-cancellation emails reminding me that even though it was a point reservation, if I cancelled past the deadline they would give me back my points but put a charge of $12,000 on my credit card! I know this point cancellation problem at high end Marriott's has been written about before but that was the icing on the cake! Moved to a 3 bedroom VRBO mid mountain for about the same price for 4 days as 1 night there ---and never looked back.
To me it’s not just frustrating when expensive hotels fail to deliver basic expectations, it’s when much cheaper hotels do it better.
I was at an LXR hotel last weekend and it took 4 attempts to get more tea bags for the room. At a Hampton Inn id literally just walk downstairs.
Likewise, any Hampton would have advil in the 24 hour mini mart. Some would probably have it behind the desk for free.
I find myself using my points exclusively for Hampton Inn, Fairfield suites, Element, Hyatt place etc. Basically when the rate is $300 due to some event or holiday and i can use $100-150$ in points for the stay and everytime i stay at one of these type of hotels i come away impressed, especially in small towns where the owner takes pride in their investment. Luxury stays should go to real luxury hotels where points dont give you anything.
This is why I try to avoid “ luxury resort factory”…
How can anyone making less than a million a year justify 3 or 4 grand a night??
I would throw away the "making less than a million a year" part. No matter how much money I'd have, I just can't see how can *any* hotel be worth that much money. No matter how good it is.
There are PLENTY of hotels worth 5k+ a night. But they are usually in remote locations where the hotel and resort are part of an overall experience. Usually at that rate to in many places you'll be in a standalone cottage or villa so you're paying for privacy and comfort too.
The most infuriating thing about most high end US ski properties like the one you stayed at (also my fave once upon a time) is you pay for a room the price you’d for a grand suite at the Badrutt in St Moritz and the service is almost entirely in the hands of kind, sometimes relatively untrained South American exchange students on a J visa. The hotels and resorts basically use them as highly qualified...
The most infuriating thing about most high end US ski properties like the one you stayed at (also my fave once upon a time) is you pay for a room the price you’d for a grand suite at the Badrutt in St Moritz and the service is almost entirely in the hands of kind, sometimes relatively untrained South American exchange students on a J visa. The hotels and resorts basically use them as highly qualified for other fields (some are med students or law students) and this fast learning hard working ultra low cost labor force, under the disguise of a student visa granted by the US government, saving big on labor cost while charging you as if you were attended by golden Keys concierges. A shameful practice among several others
One of the problems are all the only fans and crypto people that made so much money fast who will pay $10k for 2 nights and not care about customer service. Hotels capitalize on that so "if X spending $10k on a room doesnt care about the fireplace not working, maybe next person booking with points wont care"
I am a profession hotelier and reading this was a real downer. We seem to have lost our in recovering from COVID, but the real fault here is not the team members, but the training and leading by example of the leadership team starting at the top and perhaps even higher than that. For the service recovery to be this poorly handled and for the lack of communication fromn shift to shift there can be...
I am a profession hotelier and reading this was a real downer. We seem to have lost our in recovering from COVID, but the real fault here is not the team members, but the training and leading by example of the leadership team starting at the top and perhaps even higher than that. For the service recovery to be this poorly handled and for the lack of communication fromn shift to shift there can be no excuse other than leadership is not instilling a culture. Marriott has systems that, if implemented and used, would have tracked and flagged the problems are unresolved. While the hotel (leaglly) should not give away Advil, they should always have that available for sale. I agree with one of the commenters that you should be compensated which would be a refund of at least half the points paid for your two night stay plus some additional for your efforts.
Why pick the exact time of the Sundance Festival to ski? That's asking for giant crowds all over. If I want to have an enjoyable relaxing trip to New Orleans I'm not going to visit during Mardi Gras.
Talk about missing the point…
This is irrelevant. A room should function properly and staff should adequately take care of guests. If it can’t handle things properly during peak season they don’t deserve the business
Absolutely not true
I always go that week and
Most people are at movies and meetings-slopes and Hotels are actually less busy
Fairly well known that Sundance is busy at park city but ski slopes pretty wide open. Main impact is dinner resys and they are not too hard to book with a little planning.
It's the best time to ski in Park City because the Sun Dance crowd mostly doesn't. Hotels are full and the hills are empty. I live local, and it's the best time to ski at Deer Valley.
Ben: Duc de Paris--great deep cut! The last time I encountered it was on a luxury cruise line that advertised free Champagne ahead of an art auction. Second, I think that you should outright ask for at least one of your nights to be complimentary. Even if they decline, it will be a nice anecdote to bookend your review.
Ben, we regularly stay at Four Seasons properties. We work with Ford to get virtuoso perks. Historically when something is broken or is just a subpar experience I have reached out to management to share my experience and thoughts. No bitching or wanking. In majority of the time we have received vouchers for free nights on par with the number of nights we stayed.
I agree with you on the point of sharing your...
Ben, we regularly stay at Four Seasons properties. We work with Ford to get virtuoso perks. Historically when something is broken or is just a subpar experience I have reached out to management to share my experience and thoughts. No bitching or wanking. In majority of the time we have received vouchers for free nights on par with the number of nights we stayed.
I agree with you on the point of sharing your experiences.
I agree with you on “major” loyalty programs lacking. Your power is your dollar. As you mentioned I’m sure you’re not going back anytime soon. Pity the person who paid that rate!
Ben, I'm like you. I'll tell hotels that there is a problem because I want them to fix it not because I want compensation. But if you don't act like that blogger we all know, they don't even seem to bother apologizing anymore. In December I stayed at the Lodge at Sonoma and there were several problems -- the thermostat clearly needed to be replaced, there were sulfer deposits in the heating system and our...
Ben, I'm like you. I'll tell hotels that there is a problem because I want them to fix it not because I want compensation. But if you don't act like that blogger we all know, they don't even seem to bother apologizing anymore. In December I stayed at the Lodge at Sonoma and there were several problems -- the thermostat clearly needed to be replaced, there were sulfer deposits in the heating system and our outside fireplace didn't work. It had rained our entire stay, but the last night was cold and clear and we wanted to use the outdoor fireplace -- and it wouldn't come on. We didn't want to spend our last night dealing with engineering so we gave us and used the indoor fireplace which also was somewhat flaky but would come on. There were also service issues in the restaurant and randomly added (some mornings at breakfast and some not).
On checkout I let them know the maintenance issues that needed to be repaired and said nothing about the service. They said thanks for telling us -- not one word of apology. Interestingly, I received a post stay survey and replied sharing the maintenance concerns and said that I'd choose a different hotel in the future. Apparently they're fine with me choosing a different hotel as there was no response to that either.
Like you, I don't get it. A simple apology and maybe an offer of a free bottle of wine if I came back would have done wonders to make me feel like they actually cared. Clearly they don't.
I cannot help but wonder if it's obvious to the front desk staff that a guest has paid a cash rate or with points. Of course if they do a little digging it could always be identified, but is it obvious from the moment they bring up your room profile? Surely the service should be the same, similar to paying cash for a flight vs a points booking or upgrade, but I wouldn't be surprised...
I cannot help but wonder if it's obvious to the front desk staff that a guest has paid a cash rate or with points. Of course if they do a little digging it could always be identified, but is it obvious from the moment they bring up your room profile? Surely the service should be the same, similar to paying cash for a flight vs a points booking or upgrade, but I wouldn't be surprised if their remedy would have been far more 'exquisite' if it was in fact a cash paid rate. I was at the Fairmont Pacific Rim in Vancouver and my fire alarm low battery alert started going off at 1AM. They offered me a half bottle of mediocre shiraz for the pain of having to move hotel rooms as the engineers couldn't fix it. I moved rooms at 2AM. I was shocked and they wouldn't do anything else to compensate.
Yes, it’s very obvious what kind of rate is booked, and the payment settlement goes via different routes for a regular paid rate vs a point redemption rate.
The US hotels have greatly degraded in ALL catagories since covid. And they don't even care anymore. There is no longer any effort or customer service or anything no matter how much you're paying. They just don't care.
I just stayed at a Westin in a major city and was upgraded to a suite thankfully because I had to sleep on the couch since the bedroom part had zero heat. The temperature was 11...
The US hotels have greatly degraded in ALL catagories since covid. And they don't even care anymore. There is no longer any effort or customer service or anything no matter how much you're paying. They just don't care.
I just stayed at a Westin in a major city and was upgraded to a suite thankfully because I had to sleep on the couch since the bedroom part had zero heat. The temperature was 11 degrees and no heat. The engineer tried to fix it and by 11pm could not. Since I was not about to change rooms at that hour since I was leaving the next day, I slept on the couch. They plain just don't care about anything customer related and the sooner you realize that and expect nothing, the happier you will be. My advice: STAY HOME!!
Good service recovery and gesture. If you wanted something “comped” you should have asked. Sounds like a great vacation.
A Walmart sparkling bottle is an insult. If I switched rooms and had a worse problem I would be pissed
Anyone who thinks st Regis, ritz Carlton is a luxury brand in US is terribly mistaken. They have better finishes than say a Weston or a W, but in terms of service standard, they are a Marriott to the bone. These “luxury” prices are basically a way for Bonvoy to bonvoy you. You think you are getting 3-4K values and only morons pay full prices at a four seasons, rosewood, or a Cheval Blanc. But...
Anyone who thinks st Regis, ritz Carlton is a luxury brand in US is terribly mistaken. They have better finishes than say a Weston or a W, but in terms of service standard, they are a Marriott to the bone. These “luxury” prices are basically a way for Bonvoy to bonvoy you. You think you are getting 3-4K values and only morons pay full prices at a four seasons, rosewood, or a Cheval Blanc. But the truth is those cash only hotels do actually have luxurious services for the most part whereas service recoveries barely exist for these so call “luxury” hotels by Marriott. Miles/ points strategy works for luxury airline experiences but doesn’t work for luxury hotel stays imo,
I’ve given up on US based vacations and global chains unless there are no other options.
I’ve spent time a few years in a row at hotels in Europe that are fantastic and a fraction of the price of American chain “luxury” hotels.
An example is The Hotel Rocatel in Canet de Mar near Barcelona. It’s run by a family and you will see the owner at the front desk all day, every day....
I’ve given up on US based vacations and global chains unless there are no other options.
I’ve spent time a few years in a row at hotels in Europe that are fantastic and a fraction of the price of American chain “luxury” hotels.
An example is The Hotel Rocatel in Canet de Mar near Barcelona. It’s run by a family and you will see the owner at the front desk all day, every day. You will see his brother-in-law at the front desk at night.
The housekeeping staff are the kindest warm hearted people who I see working there year after year.
The hotel is right on the beach and a 5 minute walk from world class restaurants.
Have a question before you arrive or need a dinner reservation somewhere? Just email the owner and he’ll deal with it for you.
You get genuine personal service and hospitality.
The price? €125/night from mid July to end of August, €90/night for the rest of the year for a double with balcony and sea view.
I’m surprised they had vacant rooms to move you to during peak ski season/ Sundance.
Tells you something about the hotel, then, if people aren't booking it even during this time.
At $4000/night I’m surprised any of the rooms were taken. Aren’t all the Republicans complaining about how hard it is to live in this economy?
In my experience post pandemic, certain brands are slapping outrageous rates on rooms to see who is dumb enough to pay. Service is horrible and corporate is on a money grab. I’ve stopped traveling as much hoping that the industry corrects itself as people vote with their feet. Or maybe this is just the new normal and we have to pay more and expect less.
Welcome to the new norm of customer service in the US. BTW, you can ski in Europe for a fraction of the cost of skiing in the US. Just saying.
And the food and eating experience on Europe ski areas is significantly better then the high school cafeteria experience on American mountains.
Exactly! I'm on my way to ski at the largest ski area in Austria in a week. My accommodation includes breakfast and a five course meal every night for 14 nights for a fraction of what you'd pay in the U.S.
Don’t forget the ambience of all that cigarette smoke.
But you also have to deal with Europeans when you ski in Europe and I’ve never met such nice people on the ground that then put skis on and act like every ski lift line is a mosh pit or stampede to run over others
Because in vali lines are short and people are respectful
Just to add to it a day pass if you are not a season pass skier in Europe is a THIRD of what you’d pay at Epic resorts
"Honestly, I’ve never stayed at a luxury property that didn’t have Advil available, either for purchase or just complimentary"
Don't expect any in China!
After I ran through my dozen travel Tylenol, two hotels were like, "Western medicine, ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ "
Lol, I have to chime in here. "Western medicine" is just a common way we refer to modern medicines like Advil, Tylenol, etc, as opposed to traditional Chinese medicines (TCM). They are easily accessible through delivery apps, if not in stock at the hotel. Usually they can be delivered in under 30 mins (even for prescription drugs, but I guess pharmacies only recognize Chinese prescriptions).
For foreigners, I guess the easiest way might be...
Lol, I have to chime in here. "Western medicine" is just a common way we refer to modern medicines like Advil, Tylenol, etc, as opposed to traditional Chinese medicines (TCM). They are easily accessible through delivery apps, if not in stock at the hotel. Usually they can be delivered in under 30 mins (even for prescription drugs, but I guess pharmacies only recognize Chinese prescriptions).
For foreigners, I guess the easiest way might be to ask front desk to order on their phone, and you repay the employee.
The only way to get these places to budge is to name them and shame them like this. The rest of the review ecosystem (Trip Advisor, Google, etc ) is completely gamed and increasing irrelevant. I hope they can do some deep reflections about what level of service and preparedness any place trying to charge 3K a night should deliver.
I know where I'm not welcome -- the blog is only for ski snobs, and I don't even know where Deer Valley is located. With some research I found that it's in Park City, Utah, with a 35% Mormon population. Which might explain why they don't know one bottle of alcohol from another. You're lucky to be getting anything at all at a Marriott, considering its tradition. But what's the difference between this place and...
I know where I'm not welcome -- the blog is only for ski snobs, and I don't even know where Deer Valley is located. With some research I found that it's in Park City, Utah, with a 35% Mormon population. Which might explain why they don't know one bottle of alcohol from another. You're lucky to be getting anything at all at a Marriott, considering its tradition. But what's the difference between this place and a Super 8? Obviously, it has "engineers," while the other place has maintenance men.
Related: no Advil or anything else for headache in Lufthansa's First Class Terminal in Frankfurt. They told me to walk to the main terminal and find a pharmacy myself.
Europeans don’t hand out pain pills like sweets like they do in America. Not trying to be controversial here, just being honest. I’ve seen BA and Virgin cabin staff apologise to passengers, saying they can’t even hand over a couple of their personal stash of paracetamol. Fortunately my wife travels with a suitcase of tablets in the overhead and was able to share hers.
Germany has a very strong pharmacy lobby, and so basic painkillers like paracetamol and ibuprofen are only available at actual pharmacies. And they charge a lot for them too.
In Sweden, basic pain reliever medications like that are available at every major grocery store. There used to be a pharmaceutical shop monopoly in the country, but it was fortunately broken up. But even before it was broken up, such basic medicine was available at ordinary grocery stores in the bigger Swedish ski resort towns.
Without a doubt, skiing is much more affordable for Americans in Europe than for Americans in America. Skiing in...
In Sweden, basic pain reliever medications like that are available at every major grocery store. There used to be a pharmaceutical shop monopoly in the country, but it was fortunately broken up. But even before it was broken up, such basic medicine was available at ordinary grocery stores in the bigger Swedish ski resort towns.
Without a doubt, skiing is much more affordable for Americans in Europe than for Americans in America. Skiing in Italy, Austria, France, Switzerland, Norway and Sweden has been jokingly cheap compared to what it has cost me to do shorter ski trips in Utah and Colorado. Companies like Vail eating up so many other major resorts in North America has made things far more costly for American skiers than it used to be. And the snow conditions and predictability are more variable than they used to be. Heck, this season Gulmarg in India was completely barren at a time when it would typically have been packed with snow evena decade ago.
I've learned my lesson when it comes to Marriott. It actually took me learning it twice, but to every extent possible, I will avoid them.
I know you're a travel blogger, so it's kinda your job to go to these places... but let's just be honest...
They DO. NOT. GIVE. A. FAAUUUUUCCCCK.
(And they basically want you to know it)
Cheers.
I appreciate articles like these. Shines a light on service misshaps and it's amazing how simple things at luxury hotels just simply go unnoticed. Sending up a cheap bottle of sparkling wine is a bad look for a hotel at the level of St. Regis. Especially when pricing is as high as it is.
I also think that some of it is “our” expectations when we book using points. When folks are getting things for “free” I think they’re less likely to point out deficiencies in the hotel. After all, you’re getting a $4k for free. That t also flows down to the staff who feel like you’re whining because you’re sting their for free, and they have paying customers to attend to.
I think you're right that staff sometimes think this way. Too bad, because they're 100% wrong. Hotel ownership chose to be part of Bonvoy. The property offered the room for a price, which Ben and Ford paid. Hotel offered, customer accepted. How is that not "paying in full"? There's zero logic to the "freeloaders" view of award stays. If hoteliers want to be paid only in cash, get out of Bonvoy. And let us know...
I think you're right that staff sometimes think this way. Too bad, because they're 100% wrong. Hotel ownership chose to be part of Bonvoy. The property offered the room for a price, which Ben and Ford paid. Hotel offered, customer accepted. How is that not "paying in full"? There's zero logic to the "freeloaders" view of award stays. If hoteliers want to be paid only in cash, get out of Bonvoy. And let us know how that works out for them. Maybe Ben's well-reasoned uninflammatory coverage will get their attention. Sadly I doubt he'll revisit this particular property and the hotelier will have to live with the Great Truth of 2024: The Internet Never Forgets.
BIG disappointed, to read how cheap anf unprofessional a so called Luxury brand is handling little errors, but charging highest prices!
This happened to me, also at the St. Regis Cairo last year, . . till today on all the things that property messed up during my stay, had never been really acknowledged, the Service at the hotel and Restaurants there were unbelievable low key and unfriendly in any way. At the end, i...
BIG disappointed, to read how cheap anf unprofessional a so called Luxury brand is handling little errors, but charging highest prices!
This happened to me, also at the St. Regis Cairo last year, . . till today on all the things that property messed up during my stay, had never been really acknowledged, the Service at the hotel and Restaurants there were unbelievable low key and unfriendly in any way. At the end, i was supposed to pay for Breakfast, that was included in my booked rate, My Suite was so dirty, filthy und damaged (in the bathroom), that this Ben stay at the Deer Valley St. Regis was nothing, compared. Also Titanium Bonvoy but paid cash for my stay, luckily not nearly as much as Ben's Budget Hotel was charging on the paid rate. It's a Mess, how such properties get away with being so lousy! My personal loyalty is shifting immensely since these Loyalty programs are getting less and less interesting too. Back to Prepaid package deals, in Europe sometimes a better deal too. ;-)
You get, what you pay for, does NOT count anymore in ANY US travel related business! Simple as that.
We recently stayed at the Intercontinental San Francisco using points. At check-in we asked about a platinum room upgrade but were told that there were no rooms available. The receptionist went in the back to ask and while he was away we heard three other guests receive room upgrades. When the receptionist came back we mentioned the other people getting upgraded and he told us that if you make your booking within 24 hours you...
We recently stayed at the Intercontinental San Francisco using points. At check-in we asked about a platinum room upgrade but were told that there were no rooms available. The receptionist went in the back to ask and while he was away we heard three other guests receive room upgrades. When the receptionist came back we mentioned the other people getting upgraded and he told us that if you make your booking within 24 hours you miss their once a day upgrade sweep and are not eligible.
Once we got to the room there was a card on the nightstand explaining that they had switched the alarm clock off. Next morning (Sunday) we were woken up by the alarm clock going off. Later in the morning the maid entered the room without knocking and I was stood naked after taking a shower.
I mentioned these issues at check-out and received a “I’ll let housekeeping know” but no apology. I would bet $1 million dollars that she didn’t tell anyone.
This hotel was charging over $2,000 a room due to a conference being in town.
You will need to check the IHG T&Cs. Platinums don’t get upgrades in Intercontinentals. How about getting the Ambassador membership instead?
I’ve always been given upgrades at Intercontinental. The other three guests were given platinum upgrades.
Based on my experience, it’s hard to find good service at mountain resort hotels. For example I’ve stayed at about 15 Park Hyatt properties. They’ve all been fantastic except the Beaver Creek location. Several times that I’ve stayed there, the service was below average to horrible in my opinion.
Have you been to Park Hyatt Niseko in Japan? A mountain resort that might change your mind about mentioned service standards
Without even going to PH Niseko which is great, most 2-3 stars in Europe would blow his mind away
Without even going to PH Niseko which is great, most 2-3 stars in Europe would blow his mind away
Part of the problem may be that housing is scarce and expensive in the area making it challenging to attract and retain good staff.
So who is this other blogger complaining at hotels for compensation?
I am asking for a friend.
Sebastian Powell
.... those Germans . . . ;-) :-) :-)
i do say so, as i'm 1 of them! . . . but don't lie like some others do, just to be in the headlines.
AKA Loyalty Lobby . Well worth daily reading as it a a very good website BTW. just take the compensation clinics with a shrug.
Loyalty Lobby has its principal blogger and a secondary blogger. The one being referred to is the latter — not the Finnish writer, but the American writer for the site.
I really like Loyalty Lobby. LoyaltyLobby.com serves me very well and it’s one of the principal blogs that I follow in this space.
LL Sebby would have hit the jackpot here, likely free stay + few thousand in cash + few hundred thousand in points + free ski pass for the next 10 years + next stay confirmed suite upgrade + Sundance VIP tickets + Christopher Nolan's party wristbands etc. I always wonder why I mostly get treated like @Lucky at Deer Valley (nothing) vs like Sebby anywhere (at least half night free)
I feel bad for him...
LL Sebby would have hit the jackpot here, likely free stay + few thousand in cash + few hundred thousand in points + free ski pass for the next 10 years + next stay confirmed suite upgrade + Sundance VIP tickets + Christopher Nolan's party wristbands etc. I always wonder why I mostly get treated like @Lucky at Deer Valley (nothing) vs like Sebby anywhere (at least half night free)
I feel bad for him though, at least a quarter of his stays have problems.
Just like that little kid who seems to get bumped off every United flight.
Very unfortunate, not only did this kid missed most his original flights, he got banned by the airline too.
Still wondering what secret does he hold that not a single hotel chain dare to ban Sebby or OJ.
Only Bali seems to have the balls.
I sympathise with the problems you experienced, but I would recommend that everyone should travel with painkillers rather than rely on a hotel to provide these for you. It is frustrating that the shop there didn’t stock this.
There is also liability on the part of hotel if they provide you medication. Not all headache is the same. Some headache could be due to more severe cause.
"...luxury hotels are more expensive than ever before, while offering less than ever before...". You have summed up the state of the "hospitality" industry in the US since COVID, including not only luxury but all hotel levels, airlines, cruises and restaurants. I am considering quitting the points/status/credit care game all together as you simply don't get you paid or are promised.
It’s a pity that people like Lucky were cheering on Covid-era restrictions. Remember how terrified he was?
@ Anibal - yup. Lots of us also remember the family members we lost to COVID. Indeed, it was terrifying - just ask any of the millions of people who lost beloved family and friends to a disease that could have been slowed down if only arrogant a******* wore a mask for three weeks.
China wore masks for three years, and in spite of this, everyone there got infected and millions died. Masks don’t block viruses, Ralph.
How many family members did you lose?? Multiple?? Talk about dramatic post. And before you even attempt to go down a certain path you paranoid people like to go, I did mask and I have gotten 5 shots.
His mother was immuno-compromised. If I had a parent or other near and dear one very susceptible to complications or worse from a highly communicable disease like Covid-19, it would make perfect sense to be very cautious and hope that others too take precautions to protect themselves, others and the community as a whole.
Can’t be a true nationalist while being opposed to sensible vaccination advocacy for the nation.
1) I'm not a nationalist, not sure where you got that idea. I am an open-borders globalist.
2) Vaccinations are sensible—for vaccines that work. The covid shots neither stopped transmission nor meaningfully slowed the progression of disease.
3) As it happens, my mother was also immunocompromised during the pandemic. However, my mother was also smart enough to know that masks don't stop the spread of viruses, and wasn't narcissistic enough to demand that...
1) I'm not a nationalist, not sure where you got that idea. I am an open-borders globalist.
2) Vaccinations are sensible—for vaccines that work. The covid shots neither stopped transmission nor meaningfully slowed the progression of disease.
3) As it happens, my mother was also immunocompromised during the pandemic. However, my mother was also smart enough to know that masks don't stop the spread of viruses, and wasn't narcissistic enough to demand that people mask around her. She didn't even mask herself.
Long ago I often stayed at an Airport Hotel at FRA, Towers floor. During a dull moment I mentioned that they kept forgetting the evening chocolates and the tube of moisturizer which was great for using during flights. They actually dug up both but explained to me that this was the new direction they were following, no more chocolate and no more moisturizer. My estimate of the cost was about one Euro.
Another piece of evidence that the service/hospitality industry in the US has no hope.
I stopped vacationing in the US and spend 99% of my vacation time abroad, and I cannot be any happier.
Ben, have you ever been to the Arrabelle in Vail? The best skiing resort I have ever stayed at, highly recommend it. 10/10
Just another proof that stupid people will pay for anything thats branded "luxury".
This is why you are better off skiing in Europe. It’s generally much less expensive and much better service. Plentiful business class availability to get there during the winter as well. Just not as good snow quality as Utah.
@ Bret -- Yeah, while ski quality is better in the US, otherwise the culture and value around skiing in Europe is in a completely different league. Some of the best hotels in the world are in ski destinations in Europe, while in the US you primarily have these luxury factories. However, in this case we had limited time so wanted to minimize travel time, and were also visiting friends in the area.
Ben - consider the Fairmont Banff Springs next time. We found the Canadians very friendly and hospitable. And Banff Spring’s elevation is below Denver’s, so you won’t feel the altitude as badly. Charming mountain town, at any time of year.
Must be owned by the same people that run Oman Air. ;)