An OMAAT reader (who asked to remain anonymous, for the purposes of this post) shared a very strange story with me. He was able to board a flight, then temporarily removed so that a ticket issue could be addressed, and then denied boarding. What exactly happened here?
In this post:
Traveler removed from United aircraft, denied boarding
A traveler shares what he calls the most outrageous treatment that he has ever received from an airline. This happened on Friday, May 2, 2025, and involves United flight UA1905, from Chicago (ORD) to Pittsburgh (PIT), where the OMAAT reader was traveling with his elderly father. According to the traveler’s version of events:
- The traveler and his father were on standby for this flight, and arrived at the gate about 20 minutes ahead of boarding, and were given boarding passes well ahead of boarding starting
- The traveler and his father boarded when their group was called, and everything seemed fine, and they were waiting for the door to close
- Shortly before the door was supposed to close, a gate agent approached the man’s seat (and another passenger’s seat), asking the two to follow her to discuss something, and to take their things with them
- He complied, but clarified that he’d able to board the plane once again; the gate agent confirmed, and said there was just a minor problem in the system, and they needed to verify a few things
- Upon arriving back at the gate, the other gate agent told the man that it was going to take too long to sort out the issues, and the plane would be leaving without him
Let me of course emphasize that the traveler was told by the initial gate agent that he’d be allowed to get back on the plane. Also note that the passenger’s elderly father was still on the flight and wasn’t deplaned, despite them being on the same ticket.
The agent then explained that there was a system error with the ticket. The reader of course wonders how he was able to board his flight if there was an issue, why the issue wasn’t sorted out earlier, and why he was lied to about being able to get back on the plane. It gets worse:
- The traveler realized that he had left his cell phone in the seat back pocket, but the gate agents refused to retrieve it
- The traveler’s elderly father was “confused and distressed,” as he relies on his son to help navigate airports; he asked to get off the plane, but was denied
- So not only was the elderly father separated from the son, but the son didn’t have his cell phone, to stay in touch with his father
When it came to compensation, the supervisor offered the passenger a $350 flight credit. The traveler said he found that to be shocking for the amount of embarrassment, distress, and inconvenience, so the supervisor upped the offer to $500, but said he couldn’t give any more.
The traveler was ultimately rebooked on a flight three hours later. When his father landed in Pittsburgh, he asked a United gate agent why his son was kicked off the flight. That gate agent reportedly claimed it was due to a weight restriction. However, the pilot reportedly overheard that and refuted the claim, stating he had no idea why the man was kicked off the flight, as there was no weight restriction.
United handled this situation very poorly
Obviously we only have one side of the story here. If I were to reach out to the airline, they almost certainly wouldn’t be willing to discuss individual customer complaints with me, for obvious privacy reasons. So let me share my analysis of the situation.
First of all, it seems pretty clear that the traveler was taken off the flight for something outside of his own control. So it’s not that he was actually intoxicated or belligerent, or something, since he was offered compensation for the inconvenience.
At a minimum, the customer service shown here was absolutely pitiful, and shows a basic lack of humanity:
- He was told that he’d be able to get back on the aircraft, when that wasn’t the truth
- When it was discovered that he left his cell phone on the plane, they refused to get it
- The traveler’s elderly father wanted to deplane, but wasn’t given the right to do so, separating the traveling party
Logically, some might wonder why the traveler wasn’t more assertive. As he explained to me, “normally, I would have been more forceful before just walking off, but I was exhausted as it had been a long travel day managing my elderly father.” Fair enough!
I’m curious what actually prompted the issue, though. I asked the traveler for more details on his ticket. He explained that he was on an Aeroplan award ticket, which involved travel on both Copa and United, and this was the last segment of the itinerary. A few thoughts:
- Once you clear standby for a flight, you’re considered confirmed, and should be treated the same as any other passenger
- If there was an issue with the ticket in the background, that should’ve been handled before the passenger was allowed to board the flight, and not after
- What makes zero sense here is that there was seemingly an issue with the one traveler, but not with his father, even though they were traveling on the same ticket
In terms of compensation, the traveler should be eligible for the standard involuntary denied boarding compensation, based on my reading of this. Since he arrived at his destination between one and four hours late (on an international ticket), the airline should pay an amount equal to 200% of the one-way fare, with a $775 maximum.
Since this was an award ticket, that amount would be based on the lowest published fare in the market. In reality, that probably wouldn’t end up being much more than $500, though it should be cash, rather than a United voucher. Whether the airline offers any additional compensation, though, is anyone’s guess.
I suspect the issue in getting a resolution here is that the gate agents may not have correctly filed this incident in the computer for what it actually was. I’d be shocked if they properly registered this as an involuntary denied boarding situation.
Bottom line
A traveler cleared standby on a United flight, only to then be removed shortly before the door closed, due to a supposed issue with his ticket. That’s despite him being told that he’d be allowed back on the plane, and he even ended up being separated from his elderly father. I don’t know what exactly caused this issue, but one thing is for sure — United didn’t handle this well.
What do you make of this strange United denied boarding incident?
Don’t fly united. You never know what they might do to you.
I wouldn’t fly these days for anything Guess what United I will go out of my way to never ever fly you nor any connected flights again. What the ?
Hey! At least they still have their teeth, so .. baby steps for United.
I wouldn’t fly these days for anything Guess what United I will go out of my way to never ever fly you nor any connected flights again. Why are you blocking this comment?
Malicious incompetence.
United lied to their costumer is enough for me not to fly on their stinking airline...
If there is one thing I've learned about United by reading all these stories about United, it is to never fly United! Are they intentionally trying to put themselves out of business?
This was an "express" flight operated by another airline. Write it correctly.
I fly United all the time but lately these airlines have become way to cocky with themselves. Rest assured United Airlines there is other ways of transportation.
Poor judgement, uneducated staffing seems what’s happened here with some form of discrimination and lack of respect
The supervisor was standing in cow poop in making a low compensation offer and saying that he could not go higher. Leads are allowed up to $2000 for compensation, and supervisors have skies the limit. Unless the rules have changed, supervisor is poor at their job.
That separating of him and his elderly father who needed his assistance is what should qualify for a healthy and successful lawsuit.
United is absolute trash nowadays. Just had a flight with them booked revenue first class delayed Because of mechanical issues first leg was delayed 5.5 hours. This caused me to miss connecting flight. Next flight out was full, so I had to wait 22 hours to catch next available flight. They down graded me to basic economy in a middle seat even though they had 1st class available... I still have not been refunded the...
United is absolute trash nowadays. Just had a flight with them booked revenue first class delayed Because of mechanical issues first leg was delayed 5.5 hours. This caused me to miss connecting flight. Next flight out was full, so I had to wait 22 hours to catch next available flight. They down graded me to basic economy in a middle seat even though they had 1st class available... I still have not been refunded the difference.. they offered $200 credit.. I had to pay for hotel, lunch, dinner, breakfast, and lunch, and clothing.
I used to fly 2x/week for work. So glad I've stopped that. All airlines suck, so i try to avoid all of them, unless forced.
The thing that stuck out to me is: who put their cell phone in the nasty seatback pocket? Those things are disgusting. Also - that's the #1 place people forget things so don't stick something in there you aren't willing to lose. You can buy a cheap airplane pocket organizer on Amazon or elsewhere for around $30 that will help free your hands for all your junk you don't want in the overhead like your...
The thing that stuck out to me is: who put their cell phone in the nasty seatback pocket? Those things are disgusting. Also - that's the #1 place people forget things so don't stick something in there you aren't willing to lose. You can buy a cheap airplane pocket organizer on Amazon or elsewhere for around $30 that will help free your hands for all your junk you don't want in the overhead like your tablet, cell phone, any cables you need, a snack, medicines, anti-bacterial wipes (wipe everything the minute you sit down, including the overhead AC nozzle to help avoid getting travel sick), and I always carry a spare phone charger and then wash the pouch after every few trips. It just hangs from the pocket and then I have access to all the stuff I need and can keep my foot area clear by leaving my backpack in the overhead and get rid of any worries of leaving anything or having it get disgusting in the seat back pocket.
Thinking the same thing. Put it there and you might forget it....Oops, that what he did.
It's important to remember that we're the weirdos, guys. Not in a mean way. It's just...I was talking to my cousin the other day, he was planning a trip. I asked what kind of plane he was flying on and how he picked his seat and what lounges he'd be using...and he gave me the most baffled look and told me he just bought the ticket and picked a seat that was available.
Most people...
It's important to remember that we're the weirdos, guys. Not in a mean way. It's just...I was talking to my cousin the other day, he was planning a trip. I asked what kind of plane he was flying on and how he picked his seat and what lounges he'd be using...and he gave me the most baffled look and told me he just bought the ticket and picked a seat that was available.
Most people aren't aware / don't care about sanitation on planes or many of the other things we think about. That's not bad or good - just an awareness thing.
The airlines do not give a RIP about you. Imagine if he had refused to follow the agent off the plane? They would have called the police and physically removed him.
There are very few "good airline employees".
NTSB Needs to severe punish these airlines financially or deny them access to gates. It’s the only way the abusing behavior of airlines . Now passengers have no recourse
National Transportation Safety Board, NTSB, investigates accidents. Nothing at all to do with customer service issues. Please know what you're talking about before posting.
This happened to my 6 year old sister on former Eastern Airlines, We were on standby out of Miami. My Mom and two year old sister were sitting in the middle of the plane. My six year old sister was in first class and I had front of rear cabin. We were seated and ready to leave when two intoxicated passengers showed up and wanted their seats.. So the gate agent chose my sister and...
This happened to my 6 year old sister on former Eastern Airlines, We were on standby out of Miami. My Mom and two year old sister were sitting in the middle of the plane. My six year old sister was in first class and I had front of rear cabin. We were seated and ready to leave when two intoxicated passengers showed up and wanted their seats.. So the gate agent chose my sister and another man to leave the plane. Course at 6 my sister started screaming because they were not looking for her Mom. I mean they were taking her off the plane and was ready to close the door. I can only tell you that my Mon was fit to be ready for a fight. We must have had 6 or more gates watching my Mom take apart those agents. We lost our clothes and she declared she would be reporting this to Mr. Rickenbacker at Eastern's main office.
We did get home two days later when they finally made room on a flight to Atlanta. I am not sure what came about from this but my father was a pilot for Eastern.
Given that it was United, the passenger should just be grateful that he wasn’t physically attacked by the airline staff and dragged off the plane bleeding.
You refuse to deplane.
It’s United. Last time someone tried to refuse, they assaulted him and dragged him off the plane bleeding and crying.
And they got a lot of money in turn.
This is what happens on a Star Alliance Airline @E39 hahaha.
Kidding aside, this is not unexpected of United Airlines based on all of the content writing from OMAAT. UA left passengers on the plane or leaving their ‘cheap’ colleague behind. No matter how you look at this, the GA was totally in the wrong and unsympathetic.
Many years ago, this happened to me returning with my partner and friends from the Caribbean. I thought I would have to return earlier for work and then didn't. The airline cleared me to board on stand-by. The flight stopped in St. Croix to pick up more passengers before continuing to Miami and then to LAX. When the plane got to St. Croix the agents asked a few passengers to deplane "to get different seat...
Many years ago, this happened to me returning with my partner and friends from the Caribbean. I thought I would have to return earlier for work and then didn't. The airline cleared me to board on stand-by. The flight stopped in St. Croix to pick up more passengers before continuing to Miami and then to LAX. When the plane got to St. Croix the agents asked a few passengers to deplane "to get different seat assignments". So I decided to go ahead and comply, leaving my partner and friends on board. Long story short. They did not rebound me. What I learned that day is possession is 9 tenths of the law! NEVER give up your seat once you are in it. Several other passengers refused to deplane and they continued on. Now granted this was in another time -- the 90s. Flying was very different then. But nevertheless, I will never deplane voluntarily once on board.
TYPICAL UNITED AIRLINES!!! I used to fly them, occassionaly. But after a few instances of poor customer service on the ground AND IN THE AIR I QUIT FLYING THEM!!!
I always fly First Class, I am a bigger boy and enjoy the bigger seats. I asked for a Bourbon and Coke and the flight attendant brought me a Jack Daniels and Coke. Similar, but DEFINETLY NOT THE SAME!!!
I FLY DELTA EXCLUSIVELY, I...
TYPICAL UNITED AIRLINES!!! I used to fly them, occassionaly. But after a few instances of poor customer service on the ground AND IN THE AIR I QUIT FLYING THEM!!!
I always fly First Class, I am a bigger boy and enjoy the bigger seats. I asked for a Bourbon and Coke and the flight attendant brought me a Jack Daniels and Coke. Similar, but DEFINETLY NOT THE SAME!!!
I FLY DELTA EXCLUSIVELY, I HAVE OVER 5 MILLION MILES WITH THEM!!!
Even when I did not have a lot of miles, I NEVER RECEIVED POOR CUSTOMER SERVICE FOR OVER 35 YEARS!!!
YOU DO HAVE A CHOICE UPON WHICH YOU FLY, STOP PUTTING UP WITH THE BU!!$H!T!!!
LOL They weren’t “on the same ticket,(not possible) they were in the same PNR. Are you sure you’ve traveled before?
Like splitting hairs? I suggest many (maybe most) seasoned travelers would say "on the same ticket" instead of "on the same PNR" with great frequency. Seasoned travelers know the colloquial former is equivalent to the technically accurate latter. But, many in the general population would knot now what "same PNR" means. Thus, the great communicators would say "same ticket," knowing both seasoned travelers and novice will understand what's being communicated.
If you are traveling with an elderly parent or a child, never be separated for any reason.
If he had refused to deplane, UA could then say he was belligerent and the bouncers / thugs could have escalated the situation, bloodied up the passenger and dragged him off just like what they did to Dr David Dao in 2017.
Poor training, poor customer service, arrogant, insensitive and aggressive attitude towards customers. United just cannot escape the ghost of Dr. Dao. Maybe because it isn't even trying.
And this is why I don’t and ever fly United any more. They are the worst if the worst and their union has everything to do with it. Along with their severely nasty old flight attendants who are the laziest in the industry.
They should be fired on the spot! They treated this man like he was trash! I say get a good lawyer and sue to the maximum.
It is atrocious the pax son should drag the airline all gate agents etc to
Superior court consumer law court
With jury trial
For causing mental agony and emotional distress and made his elderly father to have stressful journey
He decline credit vouch
Both father and son should claim
Compensation
Another example that there's no limit to lies an airline employee will tell a customer.
Unsanctioned family separation is questionable at the border. For an airline or anyone to justify as a system glitch is tone deaf and inexcusable!
I'd love to know, @Ben, when you publish a post such as this if airlines (or hotels) reach out for further details? Or even in your own reports if service providers (Cairo airport obviously did ) will reach out to address the matter?
This was a DOT violation. He should have been given the $745
are so many negative articles about United and American Airlines. I am at a loss as why anyone would choose to fly with them.
Are you Tim Dunn?
Sheesh, what's wrong with an honest question?
Well, the vast majority of us fly routes where we don't have an option to choose between nonstop flights across all of the legacy3. If I want nonstop within the US, I have no routes where all 3 fly and just a couple where there is a choice of 2. I often have a choice to fly one of the 3 nonstop, with the other 2 as connections. Often, I have no choice but to...
Well, the vast majority of us fly routes where we don't have an option to choose between nonstop flights across all of the legacy3. If I want nonstop within the US, I have no routes where all 3 fly and just a couple where there is a choice of 2. I often have a choice to fly one of the 3 nonstop, with the other 2 as connections. Often, I have no choice but to opt for a flight with a connection. And, yes, other things factor in. Would I opt for a $900 flight on my preferred airline, leaving at 7am and arriving at 6pm (with a long connection) instead of a $600 flight from 10am to 4pm? Life is tradeoffs. One would pay a high "price" to eliminate 2 of 3.
So this anonymous passenger shared his experience with you (the article author).
Passenger clearly provided very specific details... such as
• exactly where the phone was left
• exact dollars in both the initial and final compensation amounts
• a specific recount of what was discussed between them and the agents
• the denial of his father's request to debaord
Passenger even went a step further and provided a...
So this anonymous passenger shared his experience with you (the article author).
Passenger clearly provided very specific details... such as
• exactly where the phone was left
• exact dollars in both the initial and final compensation amounts
• a specific recount of what was discussed between them and the agents
• the denial of his father's request to debaord
Passenger even went a step further and provided a speculated 3rd party conversation involving weight policy and the pilot's alleged response
Passenger also indicates serious concerns for his fathers heath and wellbeing by explaining that without the phone, he wouldn't be able to contact dad.
SO....all of this and the passenger didnt provide a conclusion?
Passenger never mention what the problem with his was?
Passenger never provided closure on the situation with dad?
Passenger just puts this outrageous scenario in your lap and walks away.
He gives you the what but not the why?
Well im going to speculate this-
Events true or not, this article is written to intentionally draw reaction from the readers
Could United be charged with elderly abuse in this case?
@KJ
I just don’t know baby. I just don’t know. I’ve been racially profiled by United twice for being white. Only once with American for being white as Executive Platinum. When I used to non rev they would bully me and do whatever they pleased you have no recourse on a buddy pass.
The only thing accurate about this story is that yes, indeed, you only have one side of it. Anybody can write nonsense not based on facts or actualities of what happened. Once you actually determine what happened, get back to us. In the meantime, this is just dribble. Shame on you for even posting this garbage.
What’s your role at UA, Anna?
Anna, shame on you for reflexively taking the side of a corporation with a record of mistreating customers instead of one of your fellow flyers who has articulated their side of the story in a manner that suggests credibility.
Sometimes I wish there was an “unhelpful” button.
Yuppers 100%
Typical United services.
Gate agents, like the police, apparently, can just lie about things. Insist all the overhead storage is full... When it isn't. You know. Just flat out lie.
Amen to that!
Airlines make it up as they go. You have no way to have them tell you the truth. They will offer you peanuts for macadamia nuts and not even blink. The biggest con is overbooking & then act as though it's your fault you have no seat. They are wolves in the proverbial sheep's clothing and they don't care!
They sure do! Can't believe how many people are willing to shill for airlines like United the have a record of dishonesty and even having their passengers violently dragged off airplanes.
It’s UNITED. Duh.
The first issue was he was flying stand by,this ticket is a reduced price seat offered to employees and their families.paying customers always have priority over standby.they are the last to board and don't even get assigned seat until 30 min takeoff.sorry your seat was given to a paying customer, but you left your phone in the backseat and your father sitting there.i hope the person whom benefits you were flying on didn't lose them...
The first issue was he was flying stand by,this ticket is a reduced price seat offered to employees and their families.paying customers always have priority over standby.they are the last to board and don't even get assigned seat until 30 min takeoff.sorry your seat was given to a paying customer, but you left your phone in the backseat and your father sitting there.i hope the person whom benefits you were flying on didn't lose them or their job.nexr time buy a confirm ticket ,you shouldn't have a problem
@ Rick -- You might want to read the post again...
They didn't give the seats to anyone else so.... Faulty logic Rick.
I once had a guy seated next to me kicked off a flight (YVR-SFO) because of a ticketing issue. The GA claimed he never payed for the flight and shouldn't have been allowed to board. I guess it was a system glitch where the ticket detached from the UA PNR somehow, as the guy said he was connecting from LH and had no issues taking his first flight. Keeping partner bookings in sync (especially during...
I once had a guy seated next to me kicked off a flight (YVR-SFO) because of a ticketing issue. The GA claimed he never payed for the flight and shouldn't have been allowed to board. I guess it was a system glitch where the ticket detached from the UA PNR somehow, as the guy said he was connecting from LH and had no issues taking his first flight. Keeping partner bookings in sync (especially during flight changes) is always a dodgy affair.
Then UA upgraded #1 on the waitlist to his seat.
I don't believe one word of this guy's story.
What is the basis for your disbelief?
For me, it's the fact that the passenger claimed it was an AeroPlan award ticket, but that he was placed on standby.
That is not possible unless he missed an earlier flight.
Seems like a minor discrepancy that could likely be easily clarified. What about the rest of his story?
I guess my basis of disbelief is pretty much the same as other's basis of belief. The whole story sounds concocted by someone who didn't get what he wanted.
@Ben I appreciate you writing this story. I have elderly parents who generally will always go along with whatever an airline employee tells them. I sometimes worry about their congeniality and tendency to comply without a fuss leading to unscrupulous people like this taking advantage of them.
For the rest of you who are carrying the water for United on this - shame on you. If we fail to stand up for each other against...
@Ben I appreciate you writing this story. I have elderly parents who generally will always go along with whatever an airline employee tells them. I sometimes worry about their congeniality and tendency to comply without a fuss leading to unscrupulous people like this taking advantage of them.
For the rest of you who are carrying the water for United on this - shame on you. If we fail to stand up for each other against governments and corporations that seek to subdue us and take advantage of us, then no one will fight for us.
Agreed. Authoritarian bootlickers usually think they'll be exempt from mistreatment because they follow along and parrot the company line. Newsflash - you'll be on the receiving end of this kinda thing someday, and you'll find out how it feels to be mistreated and then disbelieved.
Sheesh. This is a non story until you have better facts. Retelling hearsay and lopsided stories diminishes your cred badly.
Shamelessly taking the side of the airline over your fellow traveler does nothing for your credibility, Wayne.
I hate it when a person (or a website) states some vague and lame computer related excuse, such as “there is a system error”, or even worse “Something went wrong.” Recently, when a website stated the latter, I called Customer Support, and, amazingly, got a live human being. I told them that “anyone on the street” , with no knowledge of the problem I was facing, could have said “Something went wrong!” If humans do...
I hate it when a person (or a website) states some vague and lame computer related excuse, such as “there is a system error”, or even worse “Something went wrong.” Recently, when a website stated the latter, I called Customer Support, and, amazingly, got a live human being. I told them that “anyone on the street” , with no knowledge of the problem I was facing, could have said “Something went wrong!” If humans do not know why a computer is misbehaving, then give the job back to the humans!
So, could he have simply refused to deplane and request (very nicely) they should resolve this without his presence? Here's my phone number if you need to talk to me.
Then we might be seeing Dr. Dao, Part II.
And, of course, that's the point. No way, no how they'd risk a Dao repeat. Plus, I'm not suggesting he defy an order to deplane. I'd just make them order me to do so while repeating the phrase: "I need to stay aboard and tend to my father." The question was in a post-Dao context: can they legally andcwithin company policy make he deplane once boarded for non security/disruption issues?
They happily would have arrested him and no compensation at that point
Rules are made up all the time. This incident was outrageous at minimum! I worked in the airline business (but no more) and I could tell you thousands of made up lies. All airlines do this. Simply sue and place on record. Maybe someday the FAA investigate and do something for the traveling public.
Not just airlines but just about everyone. I recently had to seat with this in a hospital for my dying mother. They never bother asking what I did for a living. If they had they would have known, a hospital much much larger than theirs and I know when they are full of crap. I had to school their inexperienced doctors.
Moral of the story : Never deboard, because once you do, you lose all your leverage
.
Yeah, great advice. What would have happened after repeated requests for him to deplane, they would have made everyone deplane and brought the police to forcibly remove him and put him in custody/under arrest. You can thank Dr. Feelgood for that.
Before publishing something like this, a responsible, ethical author would confirm both sides of the story...
I'm not sure what is more ridiculous, the fact that you prematurely posted this, or the amount of money that clown is demanding for his 'embarrassment'
@ Dman -- Respectfully, how do you propose that I learn both sides of the story? Fly to O'Hare and ask every gate agent if they were the one involved here? Airlines aren't going to talk to bloggers on the record about individual customer service issues, for obvious reasons, since that would be a privacy violation.
I think his point is: don't post the story, because you don't have both sides. I respectfully agree.
I disagree with both @Dman and @Questions. By that logic, if United refuses to comment to the press or Ben, the story will never get reported. That gives United editorial control over Ben's content.
You do so by reaching out to UA's communications people and let them know that you've got this story that has been presented to you and you're going to run it on your blog. If UA declines to comment then you note that in the post. However, if they do comment, then you have their side of the story for comparison. As you note, this is only one side of it. I have heard plenty...
You do so by reaching out to UA's communications people and let them know that you've got this story that has been presented to you and you're going to run it on your blog. If UA declines to comment then you note that in the post. However, if they do comment, then you have their side of the story for comparison. As you note, this is only one side of it. I have heard plenty of stories where a situation appears to be horrible and then when I get all the facts from both sides the truth turns out to be much different than what was initially presented from the one side who came to me with a complaint.
I agree not OMAAT worthy.
Disagree strongly @Cbchicago - it would have never occurred to me that this could happen, and I'm glad ben wrote about it so that I'm more aware and improve my street smarts when it comes to some of the games that can be played.
Don't agree @Cbchicago
If this occurs with me I'll remember this story.
Damn, a lot of ual ghost accounts on this story.
Based on the history of corporate public relations when the spotlight hits their misbehavior, corporations are generally more likely to distort truth or withhold critical information when facing public backlash. Another commenter mentioned Dr. Dao - United Airlines' initial response to that incident demonstrates this pattern - they first apologized only for "re-accommodating" passengers rather than the violent removal, then their CEO "emphatically stood behind" staff in an internal email that leaked, only changing their...
Based on the history of corporate public relations when the spotlight hits their misbehavior, corporations are generally more likely to distort truth or withhold critical information when facing public backlash. Another commenter mentioned Dr. Dao - United Airlines' initial response to that incident demonstrates this pattern - they first apologized only for "re-accommodating" passengers rather than the violent removal, then their CEO "emphatically stood behind" staff in an internal email that leaked, only changing their approach after losing $1.4 billion in market value. Corporations typically prioritize damage control and shareholder value over immediate transparency, often only admitting full responsibility when financial consequences make it unavoidable.
To be fair, Dao had it coming.
If you're aiming for dark satire, well played. If serious, hard nonconcurrence. No passenger "has it coming" when they're physically dragged and bloodied for refusing to give up a seat they legally purchased. Dr. Dao suffered a concussion, broken nose, and lost teeth during his forcible removal from an overbooked United flight that he had every right to remain on. United later settled with him in court and admitted wrongdoing, recognizing there was no justification...
If you're aiming for dark satire, well played. If serious, hard nonconcurrence. No passenger "has it coming" when they're physically dragged and bloodied for refusing to give up a seat they legally purchased. Dr. Dao suffered a concussion, broken nose, and lost teeth during his forcible removal from an overbooked United flight that he had every right to remain on. United later settled with him in court and admitted wrongdoing, recognizing there was no justification for how he was treated. We should expect better from airlines and not blame victims of corporate overreach.
What happens now as a result of Dr. Feelgood is that they will deplane everyone and either cancel the flight or have the cops remove and arrest him/put him in custody, thus massively inconveniencing innocent pax. Sorry - like it or not - when you're on a plane, do what they say. Then sue if it's truly unjust. That's your recourse.
This is a pretty common occurrence. You are on standby, you clear and are issued a BP. You board.
Meanwhile, another passenger on the flight who was expected to misconnect shows up and the gate agent boards them instead and kicks you off.
This has happened to me several times. The airlines dispute that IDB compensation is required in these instances.
I've literally never had this happen to me and I've flown standby quite a lot.
+1 happened to me, even after boarding. AA.
+2, happened to me on pre-merger US
Looks like I'm blessed then, especially if a partner at a big law firm and member of high society like Arps has had to deal with this.
Inadequate training.
Unqualified hire.
Poor management.
This post is going to make everyone stay seated for sure and not get off the plane for a bait and switch scam lol CASH UP FRONT is the name of the game.
Definitely if you are told to bring all your things with you, it seems like there is near certainty that you are not getting back on and you should bring your elderly father with you.
@ Farnorthtrader -- Yes and no. In fairness, just about any time that you're asked to get off the plane, they'll tell you to take your belongings with you, even if they intend to let you back on. That's just standard procedure, in the event that things don't go as planned.
Weird victim blaming there Farnorthtrader.
And it gets worst.
Not sure about protocols but claiming to have left a phone on a departing plane seems like a security risk to me.
Europeans even divert because a phone and it's owner is separated by a mechanical seat. This one is separated from the flight.
Can't say I would've chosen to leave my elderly father who REQUIRES assistance to get around by himself on a plane just because a FA randomly decided I should either. My response would be "ok but 'my stuff' includes this other ticketed passenger, my 80yo father".
Probably needed a seat for crew member. I've seen them when desperate to move crew to another area dump customers off.
That's vile and another reason to not fly United.
Father must be able to tell us who sat in his son's seat when the plane took off ....?
Did UA hired them from AA gate agents in MIA?
Some details are clearly missing. I also was waiting to read if someone went down and took his seat.
I can vouch that sometimes, on a rare occasion, there are odd ticketing things that won't manifest themselves until the agent tries to close the flight after boarding.... especially on a ticket that has had modifications while en route, segments added or subtracted, etc. It may even allow boarding at that point (depending on the...
Some details are clearly missing. I also was waiting to read if someone went down and took his seat.
I can vouch that sometimes, on a rare occasion, there are odd ticketing things that won't manifest themselves until the agent tries to close the flight after boarding.... especially on a ticket that has had modifications while en route, segments added or subtracted, etc. It may even allow boarding at that point (depending on the airline's system, I'm more familiar with Sabre and Navitaire). But the agent can't close the flight as it'll say such and such PNR has an issue like out of balance, which may happen if international segments were changed and the taxes were different and not every agent knows how to fix it or is able to fix it (as a manager I've always had fare override and if it was a small amount I'd just force a debit or credit misc charge to offset).
All that said, usually in such a situation, it won't allow the flight to close if anybody on the same PNR is on. It may be different tickets but same PNR and it's at the PNR level.
I also always trained my agents that if you take one person in a party off of a plane, you better take all of them off. Because I've had a couple of times where the plane left without someone and the rest of the party decided to try and hold the flight hostage by refusing to sit down, or standing in the aisle after pushback to force a gate return (which meant everyone in the party is coming off and getting a refund).
I'm sure it wasn't put in as an IDB. Airlines recently take those extremely seriously. If you're going to take an IDB, then there is a trail of actions to complete. Like logging the fact that volunteers were solicited, amount, when, and who did the talking.
In the event of a ticketing issue... that wouldn't be an IDB. If it were weight and balance, that wouldn't be subject to an IDB, just rebooking (as it's aircraft safety) and whatever volunteers were offered - though volunteers must be solicited first. Even at Spirit, if a flight was oversold and it looked like people would likely all make it because of earlier cancel/misconnect or near a holiday, I'd authorize the ticket counter to go ahead and find a couple of people and at the initial check in point, just buy them a ticket on another airline. No need to issue compensation... just, hey, you're flying on us to FLL, having a 2 hour connection, then going to Tampa. How'd you like to get on a nonstop to TPA on Southwest leaving in an hour? Great, buy the tickets. May have not needed them but it's worthwhile insurance especially if 2 hours later you lose that attractive re-accom option.
Well NedsKid, sounds like you're a thoughtful professional and that the person who tricked this passenger is not.
Thank you for the education, Nedskid.
Thanks for the exceptional input and sounds like what could have happened. The real issue is not allowing his father to come off and of course making sure he had is cell phone. I also agree it's not an IDB situation but if this recount is true UA owes him some form of monetary compensation.
Glad to contribute.
Yeah, not allowing his father off (and not making him come off) was a huge error. I of course have the benefit of corporate CRO training and know Part 382 intimately, so I would have told the agent that my father is not able to assist himself in the event of an evacuation thus I was traveling as his safety companion and assist, as regulation allows an airline to require, thus...
Glad to contribute.
Yeah, not allowing his father off (and not making him come off) was a huge error. I of course have the benefit of corporate CRO training and know Part 382 intimately, so I would have told the agent that my father is not able to assist himself in the event of an evacuation thus I was traveling as his safety companion and assist, as regulation allows an airline to require, thus the airline is now responsible for his care including bathroom functions. And that this is now a disability situation so I need a CRO. But, very few people could conjure up that whole line at the right moment....
After having a very bad accident and having to travel once in a wheelchair to relocation across country to be with family, and AA failed to assist me plane in timely manner, get me off the plane (the flight attendants saying well can't you just hobble up the jetway, we need to go), and then abandon me for 45 minutes once I was in a chair (all with correct notation on my PNR), I was their worst nightmare. I met someone with a Director title at the hub that day.
United definitely owes compensation (the $500 voucher really probably is all they can do without major corporate input, I can tell you outside of limited IDB situations cutting a check to a passenger requires a lot of hoops and definitely has to go through legal and various corp departments). This is assuming everything else in the story is true at face value, of course.
I have seen this happen for a couple of valid reasons:
1. Customer was drunk/beligerant
2. Stanby ticket got reversed
3. This is the most awkward but I have seen this happen when the customer was so large they needed two seats but hadn't purchased two. Perhaps with weight issue wasn't plane related...
Still they should have disembarked dad as well.
None of those seem to apply to this scenario, Mark. This United person behaved in a loathsome manner.
How does a standby ticket get "reversed?" if you have a boarding pass, you have a confirmed seat, no?
To the wronged party:
Tell the whole story straight, including every single word the bad actor said, please. It's not our responsibility to ask a thousand questions, to eventually learn the piece that's missing from the narrative.
I'm not saying UA is in the right, here. That seems vanishingly unlikely. But I simply don't believe that this story includes every relevant, interesting word said by UA personnel when this went down.
Frustrating read. Next topic.
@DenB is obviously very fortunate to never flown enough to deal with incompetency.
Might I suggest doing this on AA at MIA.
Entitled much? You don't want to read it, don't read it. But complaining about it because you simply assume it's incomplete is far more frustrating than the article. I'm sure you're the life of the party and weddings and birthdays.
Curious that your comment seems to subtly shade the tricked passenger here, DenB. When a person is already in a stressful environment and suddenly surprised by an out-of-left-field move like being tricked off a plane, adrenaline kicks in and it can be difficult to remember every single detail. They'll likely do their best and the totality of the circumstances and testimony should provide sufficient narrative.
While you did acknowledge that UA was not likely in...
Curious that your comment seems to subtly shade the tricked passenger here, DenB. When a person is already in a stressful environment and suddenly surprised by an out-of-left-field move like being tricked off a plane, adrenaline kicks in and it can be difficult to remember every single detail. They'll likely do their best and the totality of the circumstances and testimony should provide sufficient narrative.
While you did acknowledge that UA was not likely in the right, it's intriguing to me that UA is not on the receiving end of your skepticism. Is it merely because they've yet to issue an official statement? Or because you reflexively take the perspective of the corporation?
I'll tell it to you straight - you come across as carrying the water for UA and aiming undue skepticism to the wronged party.
Of course our priority when running into situations like this should be recording every word said, so @DanB can have every detail necessary to finally pass judgment.
Wow that's a lot of piling on, guys.
I agree with the majority opinion that UA behaved badly here, and I said so. I gave offence and I've been dressed down at level 10.
It's frustrating reading these incomplete conflict stories. Maybe I frustrate easily. Maybe I/we shouldn't comment when frustrated?
Why was he flying standby on an award ticket ?
Missed flight ? Tried to get in an earlier flight ? What happened to the other person they pulled off the flight ?
@ John -- He was on standby because he was trying to get onto an earlier flight.
Ben you should know better than to write that both the passengers and his elderly father were travelling on the same ticket. You can't have two people on one ticket, every passenger need to have their own ticket, even if they were on the same booking.
Ticket… itinerary… Semantics… I love the internet
there's not one single person who will read that line and not understand it to mean "ticketed on the same PNR"
Well considering I don't know what the f*ck a PNR is then I'd say you're wrong and that there's at least one person.
He should be glad that United didn’t try to beat the sh.. out of him, unlike in Dr Dao’s case…
Dao fought with the police which makes it his fault.
Baffled at the tendency of some to carry the water for heavy handed and sometimes violent actions by "authorities" to put civilians into submission. Some see to have a real problem with civilians nonviolently asserting themselves and not immediately acting like whipped dogs in response to official intimidation.
@Andrew while United staff didn't physically remove Dr. Dao, they called aviation security to do so, and the force used was so excessive that the Chicago...
Baffled at the tendency of some to carry the water for heavy handed and sometimes violent actions by "authorities" to put civilians into submission. Some see to have a real problem with civilians nonviolently asserting themselves and not immediately acting like whipped dogs in response to official intimidation.
@Andrew while United staff didn't physically remove Dr. Dao, they called aviation security to do so, and the force used was so excessive that the Chicago Department of Aviation stated the incident "was not in accordance with our standard operating procedure" and placed multiple officers on administrative leave Wikipedia, resulting in a concussion, broken nose, and lost teeth CNN that led to a settlement.
@Christopher video evidence shows Dao verbally refusing to leave his seat People, but there's no evidence he physically fought with officers; rather, United's CEO later admitted Dao was not at fault, stating "No, he can't be... no one should be treated that way, period," Wikipedia and the company settled his lawsuit and changed their policies regarding passenger removal.
I'm equally baffled at why some feel what Dr. Feelgood did by making the rest of the pax in that plane - all innocent - suffer because of his tantrum is a good thing. Thanks to him, they now simply deplane everyone, have the cops drag their sorry behind off the plane, and either cancel the flight or massively delay it, thus inconveniencing dozens of pax. It's the compete, total selfishness and me-first attitude that's...
I'm equally baffled at why some feel what Dr. Feelgood did by making the rest of the pax in that plane - all innocent - suffer because of his tantrum is a good thing. Thanks to him, they now simply deplane everyone, have the cops drag their sorry behind off the plane, and either cancel the flight or massively delay it, thus inconveniencing dozens of pax. It's the compete, total selfishness and me-first attitude that's sadly all too common these days. What if you had been desperately trying to get to a hospital to say goodbye to a loved one? Or attend a funeral? Sorry, sunshine, hate to break it to you, but the world doesn't revolve around you. He - and this pax have recourse. Simply deplane and sue.
United didn't touch a hair on Dao's head. The police used reasonable force when Dao refused to leave when asked nicely.
Dude even United said that they did Dao dirty and you know it.
The refusal to communicate to the father to deplane is the most maddening one - whether he was elderly or not.
Setting aside the moronic comments, something doesn't add up here. Something wrong with his ticket? Weight and balance? None of this makes sense. There seems to be something missing.
That being said, the father should have been allowed to deplane with the son and of course his phone retrieved (since the passenger believe he'd be able to reboard).
if it was an award ticket issued by AirCanad/Aeroplan, how were they on standby?
Poorly handled, but no one mentions another traveller being sent down to take the occupied seat. I first thought the story was going there. Cleared standby due to late arriving customers not LIKELY to make it… they make it… give them the seats back and stand bys go on original flight 3 hours later. But no?! (Even that scenario would be plausible but require better handling.) Compensation rules out staff stand by.
Arrival agent...
Poorly handled, but no one mentions another traveller being sent down to take the occupied seat. I first thought the story was going there. Cleared standby due to late arriving customers not LIKELY to make it… they make it… give them the seats back and stand bys go on original flight 3 hours later. But no?! (Even that scenario would be plausible but require better handling.) Compensation rules out staff stand by.
Arrival agent may have been reading notes put in by previous agent. Pilots time to intercede was back at the incident with carry on items being left on his aircraft without the owner. Very odd.
Trumpf is at fault and should be impeached because this man lost his seat.
(You okay? Looks like you're having another psychotic break. We care.)
Did you know Dr.Dao happened under Trump and he condemned United for that.
He condemned the actions of those who stormed the Capitol, also. In a word, so?
“Obviously we only have one side of the story here”
I’ve enjoyed the recent OMAAT Unverified Stories From Randos series.
Can’t wait to see what’s next!
I hope that when you report your own injustices in the future, people will grant you more benefit of the doubt than you are currently willing to provide others now.
Seriously - where's the humanity? Appropriate skepticism, sure. But given the opaque nature of these megacorporations, reporting on stories like these is how systemic issues get fixed.
History tells us that the reflexive response of these corporations is to deny and obfuscate as much...
I hope that when you report your own injustices in the future, people will grant you more benefit of the doubt than you are currently willing to provide others now.
Seriously - where's the humanity? Appropriate skepticism, sure. But given the opaque nature of these megacorporations, reporting on stories like these is how systemic issues get fixed.
History tells us that the reflexive response of these corporations is to deny and obfuscate as much as possible until they're hit with an avalanche of attention or evidence. Remember Dr. Dao? His 2017 forceful removal from an overbooked flight only led to reforms because it spiraled into a PR disaster when passenger videos went viral on social media and cost United $1.4 billion in market value, largely due to the company's initial defensive response before eventually apologizing and reaching a settlement.
Having seen the inside of these PR operations at megacorps, when a regular person is able to clearly state their issue, I'm inclined to give them more of a benefit of the doubt than corporations who have a demonstrated history of attempting to evade responsibility for their actions.
And the fact that the traveller appears to be an existing OMAAT reader, and so have seen Ben's take-downs of unreasonable claimants, suggests less likely to be being unreasonable.