A few weeks ago I covered how Delta Air Lines revealed plans to open a second Delta One Lounge at LAX, making it the first airport where the airline has two Delta One Lounges. This is interesting, as it’s clearly part of a broader growth strategy by the carrier at the airport. There’s now an update, as this lounge has opened as of today, as we were expecting (thanks to a scoop by JonNYC), so we also have all the details.
In this post:
Makeshift Delta One Lounge LAX Terminal 2 now open
Delta is known for its excellent Delta One One Lounges, and there are currently locations at four airports, in Boston (BOS), Los Angeles (LAX), New York (JFK), and Seattle (SEA).
The original Delta One Lounge LAX opened back in 2024, located in Terminal 3, and it offers a great experience. At only 10,000 square feet, it pales in comparison to the one at JFK, which is around 40,000 square feet. But still, Delta’s network at LAX also isn’t as big.
That brings us to the news — as of June 30, 2026, Delta has opened a second Delta One Lounge at LAX, in Terminal 2, which is open daily from 7AM until 10PM. However, the process by which this is happening is rather odd. We’ve just seen this Delta One Lounge open in an “initial phase.” Then in the second half of 2027 the Delta One Lounge in Terminal 2 will undergo a full renovation, before opening again in 2028, with the finished product.
The initial facility is more of a makeshift setup, which has taken over the space of the former Virgin Atlantic Clubhouse Terminal 2 (before it moved to Tom Bradley International Terminal), and it’s located on the terminal’s mezzanine level. The lounge is roughly 4,000 square feet, with seating for around 75 guests.
Delta highlights how the emphasis with the new Delta One Lounge is on all things culinary, with a consistent dining experience to what customers have grown accustomed to in the other Delta One Lounge at LAX. So there’s a la carte dining throughout the lounge with a rotating menu, with current options including lamb bolognese with house-made lumache pasta, hamachi crudo, and classic French onion soup. An extensive drink list is also available, including cocktails prepared by a bartender.
The lounge also has three showers, four cabana-style bathrooms, and a bar. Then there are portable monitors and wireless chargers as well.
Passengers who choose to use this lounge can use the Delta One check-in facility at Terminal 3, including the direct security channel access. Then they can receive Delta transportation (via a golf cart) directly to the Terminal 2 Delta One Lounge.
Among the premium international lounges of the “big three” US carriers, this is the first time that we’ve seen two of these lounges at one airport… and LAX isn’t even among Delta’s biggest hubs!
I am curious how they’re going to manage crowding between the two lounges. People will probably go to the lounge closer to their gate, or maybe to the Terminal 3 lounge, out of habit. How will Delta properly distribute guests, especially since ideally you don’t want to tell a business class passenger to schlep to Terminal 2, after they’ve arrived at the Terminal 3 lounge?
Separately, in 2027, Delta also plans to open a new Sky Club in Terminal 2, which will be roughly 11,000 square feet. This represents a renovation of the Sky Club that closed in 2024. Eventually Delta will have a total of four lounge spaces at LAX, totaling 60,000 square feet.
This is part of Delta’s huge LAX growth plans
Typically, the “big three” US carriers love their fortress hubs, where they dominate the market, and control a majority of the traffic. This allows them to efficiently funnel passengers into their larger network, and also gives them more pricing power.
LAX is unique in that it’s an airport where American, Delta, and United, all have a hub. It’s the only airport where that’s the case. Over the years, we’ve seen the airlines kind of take turns being the slightly dominant airline (I guess you could say they’re LAX vers), but it’s just a really tough market.
You’d think LAX would be super lucrative, but it’s just not anywhere close to the most profitable hubs, due to the amount of competition. On the international front, you have so much service from foreign airlines, which often have much lower cost structures than US carriers. Furthermore, given how market share is distributed pretty equally, it’s also hard for any one airline to make huge money on credit cards, or to have much pricing power.
As things currently stand, there’s no denying that the Delta One Lounge LAX gets busy late at night (before the transpacific flights), but other than that, the lounge doesn’t get that crowded.
What’s odd about Delta is that it has spent recent years building up its hub in SEA as a long haul gateway, largely as an alternative to LAX. However, with growth constraints, plus the pressure of being number two behind Alaska, we’e now seen Delta shift growth back to LAX.
We’ve just seen Delta launch flights out of LAX to Hong Kong (HKG), and the airline also plans to launch Manila (MNL) flights in 2027. Side note — that HKG route must be buh-leeding money, particularly with current oil prices.
In the time since the second Delta One Lounge LAX was announced, we’ve learned more about Delta’s goal of dominating LAX, as the airline sees a “once in a generation” opportunity. While some growth is definitely possible, I tend to think history repeats itself, and I can’t imagine any ramp-up will be terribly profitable. But perhaps Delta views it as part of a larger strategic interest.
Bottom line
As of June 30, 2026, a second Delta One Lounge at LAX Terminal 2 has opened, complementing the one that opened in Terminal 3 in 2024. The temporary Delta One Lounge in Terminal 2 will remain open until the second half of 2027, at which point it will close to undergo a full renovation, before then opening again in 2028.
Admittedly the original Delta One Lounge is rather small, but still, this is the first time we’ve seen a US carrier open two premium international business lounges at the same airport. We know Delta plans to grow at LAX, though I’m curious just how much growth is in the cards.
What do you make of a second Delta One Lounge LAX?
This one is so lame compared to the main one. Should’ve just kept to one, and actually open a D1 at ATL before 2029…
Terminal 2 is horrible. Small and overcrowded. The terminals are supposed to be renumbered, which makes sense. Hence 2-3 will become 2 as it’s effectively one with two concourses.
Delta should pay for the reconstruction so it matches the current t3, and just as t4 and 5 are being entirely rebuilt.
random question.
Lucky, are the Delta 50 seat in F NEOs out in service yet? You really need to get on one and check out the service. I'm really curious how they're staffed.
You mean the aircraft that should have lie-flat but only has recliners? That one?? *yawn*
I don't understand why they are opening this now, if they are just going to close it down in 6 months for an entire year? Surely it would just make sense to start the renovation now and get it over with ASAP.
nice lounge but I don't understand the complete a la carte service vs buffet build out.
The last thing I want at a lounge is the expectation of tipping from an underpaid non-delta employee which this type of service format has ingrained in it (and has happened at the JFK D1 lounge as an expectation per other bloggers).
Also, having to pay for better drinks?
Then don't tip? No one is forcing you to tip. I've been in these lounges plenty and there was never an expectation to tip.
You're boxing ghosts that aren't there, in order to make up criticism about something that is a non-issue.
you have no soul if someone who is clearly paid minimum wage is walking around putting food on your table, taking your order, etc and you don't even think to tip. That just isn't an issue at Flagship and Polaris lounges. it's a different set up to serve food.
And yes, the expectation of tipping at D1 lounges has come up a few times on various blogs.
It's not the job of the customer to subsidize the wages of the corporations that employ them.
If you have so much empathy, the right thing to do is to actually stop tipping. You are further enabling companies to depress their worker's wages since they know idiots like you will tip them instead.
If you weren't so hypocritical, then you'd realize that it's better to stop tipping, so that the minimum wage workers you care about can be better off long-term.
I'll be sure to keep your ethics of screwing over a service employee in mind to shove it to the man next time. And I'll be sure to tell the waiter that I'm doing them a favor.
You're a moron.
You are actively sabotaging the cause you care about, it's so obvious and hilarious you're trying to argue it.
If service workers are paid properly, have sick pay, paid leave, and basic labor protections, then tipping stops being a moral necessity and becomes, at most, an optional extra. In that kind of system, bringing water, taking an order, or doing other normal parts of the job are simply what the wage is for.
US tipping culture exists because employers underpay workers and expect customers to make up the difference. If that isn’t the case...
If service workers are paid properly, have sick pay, paid leave, and basic labor protections, then tipping stops being a moral necessity and becomes, at most, an optional extra. In that kind of system, bringing water, taking an order, or doing other normal parts of the job are simply what the wage is for.
US tipping culture exists because employers underpay workers and expect customers to make up the difference. If that isn’t the case where you live, then there’s much less justification for treating tips as socially required.
And the US has a corrupt criminal president who made one billion in cryptocurrency during his first year and has no interest in improving the lives of most people.
That lounge looks absolutely stunning! Can’t wait to check it out next time I’m on a puddle jumper flying out of T2
there's nothing wrong with offering a domestic a321neo on LAX-EWR but it does betray that Delta has little premium demand or contracts in LAX -- same reason they can't fly LAX-LHR on their own metal -- they're currently scraping the bottom of the barrel. Delta keeps telegraphing how weak their LA point of sale is... we should realize it and accept it. It shouldn't be a surprise. They've long been in the weakest position at...
there's nothing wrong with offering a domestic a321neo on LAX-EWR but it does betray that Delta has little premium demand or contracts in LAX -- same reason they can't fly LAX-LHR on their own metal -- they're currently scraping the bottom of the barrel. Delta keeps telegraphing how weak their LA point of sale is... we should realize it and accept it. It shouldn't be a surprise. They've long been in the weakest position at LAX and SoCal vs Star and Oneworld.
Putting a domestic plane on a premium route like LAX-EWR really just betrays how they're doing in LA -- still nouveau riche, like their scale there and their customer base -- also demonstrated by how little premium demand DL appears able to sustain on their own even on a route like LAX-PPT where they're the only US3 carrier on the route even though AA has long had a strong presence on the route via TN.
too bad you don't actually have facts and data to support your assertions.
What DL does have is profits and lots of them from their interior 4 US airports that have average fares that are well in excess of what AA and UA get from their interior US airports.
You do realize the DOT has data on this stuff, don't you? Don't make me post it
"What DL does have is profits and lots of them from their interior 4 US airports that have average fares that are well in excess of what AA and UA get from their interior US airports."
yes. They're called monopoly hubs.
When have I ever questioned where Delta makes money? I know it's from their monopoly hubs. You're the one that has always questioned that lol
How this has anything to do with DL...
"What DL does have is profits and lots of them from their interior 4 US airports that have average fares that are well in excess of what AA and UA get from their interior US airports."
yes. They're called monopoly hubs.
When have I ever questioned where Delta makes money? I know it's from their monopoly hubs. You're the one that has always questioned that lol
How this has anything to do with DL betraying their weak LAX point of sale? not sure, but you enjoy your Sunday.
Max is happy to dodge the questions, when he's confronted about his delusional takes on the LAX lounges.
Why don't you share which LAX Oneworld lounge is better than the LAX Delta One lounge that isn't the Qantas F lounge?
sounds like you just answered your own question, yolo ;)
Delta's LAX-PPT nonstop route has been canceled for over 1 year. Discontinued June 2025.
yeah. that was my point but bad grammar from me.
Thanks for disqualifying your own statement and proving my point.
Oh yolo, this is why it's best that you stay inside your ATL bubble. ;)
I hope you enjoyed your weird statements. You disqualify the best lounge at LAX from your criteria to meet your own narrative. There are a lot of great lounges at LAX. The Oneworld QF F Lounge is largely considered the best. But I do hope you've enjoyed this weird back and forth with yourself. Of course the D1 lounges are nice lol
I didn't disqualify it at all, I said very clearly, Qantas F is at best comparable, but the fact many flyers have cited it's significantly declined, means it's arguably worse tbh.
And it's silly because you want to force a comparison between a first class lounge to a business class one. The fact that a first class lounge doesn't distinguish itself over a business class one, is more of a statement than anything.
You are...
I didn't disqualify it at all, I said very clearly, Qantas F is at best comparable, but the fact many flyers have cited it's significantly declined, means it's arguably worse tbh.
And it's silly because you want to force a comparison between a first class lounge to a business class one. The fact that a first class lounge doesn't distinguish itself over a business class one, is more of a statement than anything.
You are the one that made bold claims about Oneworld lounges, without an actual basis in what's the current state today. "LAX is a OneWorld stronghold on lounges", which is untrue given all the business class Oneworld lounges are signifcantly worse than the Delta One lounge.
Your incessant rage and hatred for anything Delta related is bizarre. Factual analysis doesn't mean someone is inside an "ATL bubble". It just means we live in reality.
"And it's silly because you want to force a comparison between a first class lounge to a business class one. The fact that a first class lounge doesn't distinguish itself over a business class one, is more of a statement than anything."
Yes, and you're responding to ME and a comment I made in which the OP was discussing lounges overall, including first and business.
If you don't like the topic, stay out of it....
"And it's silly because you want to force a comparison between a first class lounge to a business class one. The fact that a first class lounge doesn't distinguish itself over a business class one, is more of a statement than anything."
Yes, and you're responding to ME and a comment I made in which the OP was discussing lounges overall, including first and business.
If you don't like the topic, stay out of it. Agree to disagree about the quality of the QF lounge. You pretty clearly have never been it but insist on popping on here to say nothing.
But you also already have an opinion about the quality of the lounges at LAX. So do I. I honestly don't get two sh*ts if you agree with me. You've posted many times and don't seem able to put your employer to the side in your analysis but again... they're opinions. calm down.
QF F lounge is easily accessible by any OneWorld elite (EP or PP) so yes, it is comparable since similar lounge access isn't on all alliances. Perhaps you've read about one of the reasons Lucky values Oneworld status so much?
Cue the long lines of DL LAX TCON flyers on standard recliner A321 NEOs getting turned away and raging...can't wait!
Ah, because those lame recliners aren’t actually D1… woah, that’s really, really lame.
Also always great to welcome Delta to the lounge party, a very late welcome, but a welcome. Your competitors already have or have announced Business class lounges at all their interior hubs too -- when will Delta announce anything similar? before anyone asks, no. The ATL d1 lounge is still a leak, not a delta announcement
How many years did sTD tell us that business class lounges don't matter since SkyClubs are "SO GOOD!"
Also always great to welcome Delta to the lounge party, a very late welcome, but a welcome. Your competitors already have or have announced Business class lounges at all their interior hubs too -- when will Delta announce anything similar? before anyone asks, no. The ATL d1 lounge is still a leak, not a delta announcement
How many years did sTD tell us that business class lounges don't matter since SkyClubs are "SO GOOD!"
Then now they have D1 lounges and sTD can't imagine how the network ever worked without them lol
Skyteam has become a real tour force when it comes to lounges at LAX. Two Delta one lounges, the new Air Korean business and first class lounges, Virgin Atlantic lounge, and the new Air France lounge. On top of that the Delta SkyClub is one of the best in their system. Business class flyers going out of LAX have a real choice now.
cute comment from someone that obviously doesn't know anything about alliance lounge agreements or ever flies from LAX. Props to DL for their two lounges but LAX is a OneWorld stronghold on lounges from accessibility to experience.
Experentially, the Delta One lounges are better than all of the Oneworld lounges at LAX though? Only Qantas F stands a chance, and many reports have cited it going downhill.
The Air France, VS Clubhouse (small but the food/drink is high quality), and Sky Clubs are all solidly better than the Alaska and Admiral's Clubs, and roughly on par with AA's declining LAX Flagship lounge.
"the Delta One lounges are better than all of the Oneworld lounges at LAX though? Only Qantas F stands a chance, "
Thanks for disqualifying your own statement and proving my point.
Seriously? Go back to your Atlanta hole. You above all people have made clear you have no experience in any lounge, LAX or otherwise lol
Lol you're not serious right? The very author of this blog you're commenting on factually agrees with what I've stated. He's rated the Delta One lounges as being among the very best in the world, and clearly the best in the US.
Name a single LAX Oneworld lounge better than the LAX Delta One lounge that isn't the Qantas F lounge.
You seem to have a deep obsession and hatred for Delta that's preventing you from being objective.
"Name a single LAX Oneworld lounge better than the LAX Delta One lounge that isn't the Qantas F lounge."
so the answer to the best lounge at LAX is disqualified because it's the answer to the question? lol. Ok, yolo. Enjoy your day
Fly LAX all the time, including international business, SkyTeam, Oneworld and Star Alliance (it's my favorite US airport regardless of its many detractors). Oneworld has traditionally been the powerhouse there, but has struggled the last few years. The shinning star that is the Qantas F lounge badly needs an update, and the scheduled update can't come soon enough. The Oneworld business lounge just received a modest update - I admit I haven't visited that one...
Fly LAX all the time, including international business, SkyTeam, Oneworld and Star Alliance (it's my favorite US airport regardless of its many detractors). Oneworld has traditionally been the powerhouse there, but has struggled the last few years. The shinning star that is the Qantas F lounge badly needs an update, and the scheduled update can't come soon enough. The Oneworld business lounge just received a modest update - I admit I haven't visited that one recently and look forward to experiencing it. The AA flagship lounge has not kept up with the Delta One Lounge or United's Polaris lounge (when is the darkened corridor with the Flagship First Dining sign going to start serving proper service again). I even have a soft spot for the Alaska lounge, if there's ever room for a visit. But this is all academic.
Objectively SkyTeam has many more options today than it did just a couple years ago. Most of the business class options are new or recently opened or recently refurbished. If I was given a free pass for any lounge at LAX, it would be for the new Delta One between terminals 2 and 3 (I would miss the Qantas F Calamari, but the hamachi crude is damm tasty). All three alliances have their strengths, and Oneworld isn't the crowned king it use to be at LAX.
But I can't use the any of the Skyteam lounges as a porn set like they clearly did when they put the fire pit in the OneWorld lounge in TBIT.
Ben, posts: “I’m curious just how much growth is in the cards”.
Not long to wait now Ben, before Walter Mitty Dunn will issue chapter and verse on his only topic of conversation.
by every document and contract in the public domain, Delta still has a long term disadvantage to AA.
Does LAX have a clause in leased spaces that it must be utilized? Why else open a likely very mediocre D1 lounge for two years, then close it for renovations just as you start to (possibly) greatly increase international traffic through the airport?
feels a little like preparing the ground for a retreat from SEA
Pretty sure SEA is out of space. Even AS has moved their focus to Portland because of it.
@jetiquette.
no. AS has said they'll try to move more connecting traffic to PDX vs SEA where it makes sense.
Something AS can do, Delta can't, as you note.
Genuinely embarrassing for DL that they ignore their three captive audience airports with a lack of a D1 lounge. Sure the lemmings will still fly them of course.
Those three airports also have more clubs than the others so at least there's more options.
Thanks for updating the article, Ben. With the 2028 milestone, perhaps they're trying to get this done before the 2028 Olympics and plan to introduce a large slate of D1 flights internationally at that time to LAX to capture the increased tourism, and want to make a good impression (increase NPS).
Textbook 'competition' vs. 'monopoly' behavior. DAL neglects its own headquarters (ATL), because it has a fortress hub there. Meanwhile, LAX is one of the more competitive and egalitarian markets in the country... so, 2 D1s!
I mean this is true for any airline? None of the best lounges in the US are at fortress hubs.
Why do you think JFK has the best AA lounges and not PHL or CLT?
This is not some kind of strategy unique to Delta.
Not always true - Uniteds largest Polaris lounge is at SFO.
But then on the other side theyve resisted putting one in DEN.
United's Polaris competes against all the Asian carriers at SFO. It is exactly the same as what Yoloswag420 said.
Super, Asian carriers don't have squat at SFO. JAL dropped their lounge (use the trash BA lounge), Eva is in the A gates (so they use the trash BA lounge), CX (also use the trash BA lounge), ANA uses the Polaris lounge, CI has their *own* trash lounge that isn't even worth a Priority Pass visit (also used by Air China), KAL uses the AF lounge, and Starlux uses Alaska's lounge.
The only good asian...
Super, Asian carriers don't have squat at SFO. JAL dropped their lounge (use the trash BA lounge), Eva is in the A gates (so they use the trash BA lounge), CX (also use the trash BA lounge), ANA uses the Polaris lounge, CI has their *own* trash lounge that isn't even worth a Priority Pass visit (also used by Air China), KAL uses the AF lounge, and Starlux uses Alaska's lounge.
The only good asian lounge in the whole airport is Air India, who pulled an absolutely mythic reverse uno card with their latest lounge. Singapore and Asiana.
Sorry, *Singapore and Asiana also use that lounge.
@Andrew - that's great, and yet the majority of people still prefer to fly Asian carriers anyway, so United is forced to compete heavily thus the Polaris lounge being a competitive edge.
@yolo
the comparison you're looking for here is: AA has a Flagship lounge at PHL and DFW and is building one in CLT.
Delta has never had one at their four core monopoly hubs.
I believe LAX will re
number the terminals.
T1 , 2-3 become 2, Tom Bradley - 3 , t4-5 become 4, 6 and 7-8 - 7.
2 and 3 are basically one with two concourses. It makes sense to have different lounges to avoid customers walking longer distances.
In other news, the eagle's nest is still the LAX AA regional terminal. It was built in 1988, when Terminal 5 (RIP) was renovated. It requires a bus ride to/from T4, and then you still have to walk 5 minutes in an underground corridor to get to the street.
I don't agree with TD on DL's superiority in general (international carriers often win in my book), but for those defending AA at LAX, you must not fly them much...
If anyone needs yet more evidence of how little Queen sTD knows or uses data, just look below.
Dogmatic statements about Delta on the West Coast and the power/consolidation of power there to Latin America, among other locations --
Reality: Delta is shrinking West Coast to Latin America capacity by more than 30% this year vs last.
sTD: AA is cutting LAX while Delta continues to grow.
Reality:
1. AA...
If anyone needs yet more evidence of how little Queen sTD knows or uses data, just look below.
Dogmatic statements about Delta on the West Coast and the power/consolidation of power there to Latin America, among other locations --
Reality: Delta is shrinking West Coast to Latin America capacity by more than 30% this year vs last.
sTD: AA is cutting LAX while Delta continues to grow.
Reality:
1. AA has more gates long term at LAX than Delta or UA but their terminals are under construction.
2. despite that, AA is still growing more in absolute and percent terms than Delta at LAX in 2026.
Keep making stuff up, sTD. It's all you know how to do.
instead of incessantly looking to fight:
AA is cutting routes where it chose to pick a fight with UA; UA won this round.
AA might still be up in LAX cap but it is still cutting routes which UA is adding.
both statements are true no matter how much you want them not to be.
DL's growth at LAX post covid has been directly at AA's expense.
Get back w/ us IF AA actually succeeds at winning back that share including in the TPAC market at LAX.
just walk away.
quit arguing
"instead of incessantly looking to fight""
No is fighting you. What is written above is called showing others how much you say but how little you actually know. You make that Very easy. Your dogmatic statements are completely made up, quite often.
Quit making nonsense up.
Pretty obvious that AA added IAD and CLE as a direct response to UA at ORD.
By most accounts, United lost the ORD battle with AA via...
"instead of incessantly looking to fight""
No is fighting you. What is written above is called showing others how much you say but how little you actually know. You make that Very easy. Your dogmatic statements are completely made up, quite often.
Quit making nonsense up.
Pretty obvious that AA added IAD and CLE as a direct response to UA at ORD.
By most accounts, United lost the ORD battle with AA via the FAA (you can read the transcripts to see Patrick Quayle having a complete meltdown with the FAA about the results) so why would AA keep routes that United would naturally be strong on like Dulles (when AA flies DCA 2x daily) or CLE?
I'm not going to make that statement above more dogmatic than it needs to be. I'd qualify the "lost the battle" as the battle within the last two years, not the long term ORD battle which is still alive and well and United still maintains Chicago local corruption on its side.
PIT and CMH surprise me but Delta also doesn't dare fly either route ;)
But let's also look at reality. LAX to PIT and CMH are in the schedule for 2027 and bookable.
So while you're trying to create a fake narrative of eliminated routes with PIT and CMH, it isn't true. They're cut for 3 months and more likely due to terminal space at LAX for AA as the terminal construction cuts gates from August to October. But hey, we'll see if AA cancels PIT and CMH long term. They had the opportunity to do that with the short-term suspensions but chose not to.
AA is the biggest carrier of the US3 in PIT and CMH easily. AA is about 50% bigger than United in PIT and more than 50% bigger than United in CMH (using flights for this metric). That doesn't really scream "United is kicking AA out of the route" but logic and reality have never bothered you. Why should they now?
United is the biggest of the US3 in CLE (and obviously IAD) so it's not a surprise that they would do better on the routes.
But the takeaway: Delta is "growing" and on track to dominate LAX, per you, but Delta doesn't fly to ANY of the 4 airports and isn't the biggest at any of the 4 cities mentioned.
Keep trying, Tiger.
AA is cancelling flights. It has even been picked up by non-aviation financial sites.
AA is canceling two routes where United is naturally stronger and AA has limited gate space at LAX and has to prioritize.
AA is suspending two routes for 3 months where they are the stronger carrier.
Delta is too weak to fly any of the four ;)
LET THEM FIGHT!
Ben, you are being accused of deliberately seeking out Delta news items to ensure that Walter Mitty Dunn, will produce and post a mammoth amount of gobbledygook. The likes of which attract other readers to post. It has been fun reading these offerings, checking out the statistics and expanding my knowledge of U.S. airlines.
However, when one actually drills down into Walter’s rhetoric, it is not uncommon to find flaws. As Walter is unable or...
Ben, you are being accused of deliberately seeking out Delta news items to ensure that Walter Mitty Dunn, will produce and post a mammoth amount of gobbledygook. The likes of which attract other readers to post. It has been fun reading these offerings, checking out the statistics and expanding my knowledge of U.S. airlines.
However, when one actually drills down into Walter’s rhetoric, it is not uncommon to find flaws. As Walter is unable or unwilling to acknowledge questions about his post, one has come to the conclusion that he is well deserving of the nickname ‘Walter Mitty’.
The facts that you and our friend 1990, are rarely drawn into the Walter Mitty Dunn threads, speaks volumes. One is as much amused by silence as by the posted comments. One trusts that Walter continues to elevate your click count and thereby allowing you more points for review flights.
thank you for demonstrating that you are fixated with me - and you, not me, generate so many clicks for Ben. congrats for helping him out.
and, specific to this article, DL IS going to grow LAX int'l and will do it with significant structural advantages including the largest portfolio of nationwide corporate contract revenue as well as the A350-1000 which will be the most capable and effficient aircraft serving Asia from the US.
DL...
thank you for demonstrating that you are fixated with me - and you, not me, generate so many clicks for Ben. congrats for helping him out.
and, specific to this article, DL IS going to grow LAX int'l and will do it with significant structural advantages including the largest portfolio of nationwide corporate contract revenue as well as the A350-1000 which will be the most capable and effficient aircraft serving Asia from the US.
DL appears to have managed to get into MNL which will be its new market for 2027 with SIN to follow perhaps with a winter 2027-28 start but certainly by the summer of 2028.
DL's confirmed 35K fleet of 20 aircraft will be delivered over a very short 2+ years.
Never stop, Aero. Keep going. More clicky.
Not YOU Walter, nobody is “Fixated” with YOU. Like many other contributors to this website, one seeks to obtain even a modicum of insight into your true aviation experience.
You choose to blurt out meaningless Delta biased gobbledygook, time after time, without any reference to facts, expecting nobody to challenge you. You are rudely ignorant when it comes to answering questions about YOU Walter, or, your passenger experience. That passengers perspective is sadly lacking...
Not YOU Walter, nobody is “Fixated” with YOU. Like many other contributors to this website, one seeks to obtain even a modicum of insight into your true aviation experience.
You choose to blurt out meaningless Delta biased gobbledygook, time after time, without any reference to facts, expecting nobody to challenge you. You are rudely ignorant when it comes to answering questions about YOU Walter, or, your passenger experience. That passengers perspective is sadly lacking from your posts.
You present a Delta Airlines business analyst prospective and are incapable of accepting that many contributors herein are looking at the worldwide aviation industry from a passengers perspective. You post NO evidence of any personal passenger experience onboard any airline or aircraft.
You are simply Ben’s ‘click-bait’ of the first order Walter, a fact that you should not accept as flattering. The nickname “Walter Mitty” is rightly deserved.
Didn’t Ben recently put out an article about the A321 NEO special configuration? TD insisted how it is going to be a game changer and blow away all competition?
Not sure about what DL is going to do with its west coast operations for the long term but I do not see how they can ever dominate it. DL could not make Seattle to Hong Kong work so can they make Los Angeles to Hong...
Didn’t Ben recently put out an article about the A321 NEO special configuration? TD insisted how it is going to be a game changer and blow away all competition?
Not sure about what DL is going to do with its west coast operations for the long term but I do not see how they can ever dominate it. DL could not make Seattle to Hong Kong work so can they make Los Angeles to Hong Kong work? Are they just going to steal market share from other U.S. carriers because I cannot see many people switching from CX to DL on this route? DL could not make its intra-Asia flights work either left over from the days of Northwest Airlines. Is it because the Asian carriers are just too premium for DL and I am using premium as in of a higher value rather than of a higher yield.
I said that the fixation with the product being just a little bit above everyone else isn't what makes or moves market share and premium revenue.
while the internet incessantly argues about starlink vs. viasat/amazon leo and AA/UA's vs. DL's lie flat business class seat, the biggest factor is whether a carrier serves a market or not.
NW's NRT hub was not consistently profitable when DL merged w/ NW even though DL tried to move...
I said that the fixation with the product being just a little bit above everyone else isn't what makes or moves market share and premium revenue.
while the internet incessantly argues about starlink vs. viasat/amazon leo and AA/UA's vs. DL's lie flat business class seat, the biggest factor is whether a carrier serves a market or not.
NW's NRT hub was not consistently profitable when DL merged w/ NW even though DL tried to move the hub to HND. another round of HND routes became available just after covid started which sealed the fate of DL's beyond Tokyo routes.
DL decided during the covid that the 35K would provide the competitive advantage in performance and costs which no other US carrier can match - because DL is the only carrier that operates or will operate the A350.
The A350-1000 is simply the most capable and cost efficient longhaul aircraft available and that won't change for years.
Since UA has all but decided it won't fly the 350, DL is going to use the 5 years minimum before UA gets the 777X to build out the Pacific on the west coast and LAX has far more strategic value than SEA because of the much larger local market.
DL will regrow its Asia (East Asia, South Asia, and Middle East) presence and LAX will be one of the biggest beneficiaries of new flights.
Walter, once again you have systematically FAILED to respond to Stanley C, in any manner whatsoever which is pertinent to his post. You regurgitate gobbledygook from previous posts which have absolutely no relevance whatsoever to the topic under discussion.
I have become convinced that Ben only allows you to post such nonsense without recourse, due to your usefulness as a click generator.
you mean that you can't accept that the biggest factor is not starlink vs leo or between different versions of lie flat narrowbody products but simply whether an airline flies the route and has a competitive product.
AA, B6, DL and UA all will have lie flat narrowbody products and high speed WiFi.
Other factors including the ability to develop new markets and sustain them during a high fuel cost environment are bigger determinants of...
you mean that you can't accept that the biggest factor is not starlink vs leo or between different versions of lie flat narrowbody products but simply whether an airline flies the route and has a competitive product.
AA, B6, DL and UA all will have lie flat narrowbody products and high speed WiFi.
Other factors including the ability to develop new markets and sustain them during a high fuel cost environment are bigger determinants of growth and size.
as we have just seen, AA is cutting LAX while DL and UA continue to grow. DL just simply has more growth potential at LAX
“ as we have just seen, AA is cutting LAX while DL and UA continue to grow. DL just simply has more growth potential at LAX”
AA is growing lax flights 7% YoY in 2026.
AA’s growth, during construction of their terminals, is higher in percent and absolute terms is higher than delta at lax in 2026.
Keep trying to make sh*t up and you’ll always get called out, sTD
regardless of what they are doing for the year, aeroroutes includes a list of LAX and LA basin routes that AA is cutting for at least a two month period for the late summer into the fall - which probably means they will be cut as the year progresses.
Keep in mind these are all part of AA and UA's perpetual pi78ing match and UA, in this case, appears to have the upper hand for now.
remain in denial and others will present the facts that prove you are wrong.
"regardless of what they are doing for the year,"
Aka. "Yes, I just made that up about AA and anecdotal routes since I never look anything up. But here's another dogmatic statement to accompany it since I have no idea what I'm talking about"
sTD, learn how to use data-based arguments. You're an idiot.
@Aero that is so true but really typical of TD to just avoid answering the direct questions. Once again, like with many posts he refuses to answer the questions directly. It is like someone can ask him do you like eating oranges and he will answer the question by not really answering the questions and just go off tangent and starts telling you something that has nothing to do with oranges.
Super, I have been reading that some analysts are saying that Delta’s revenue breaks down thus:
Aviation generates about 48% of operating profit.
Loyalty/credit-card activities generate about 46%.
Other activities generate about 6%.
Could this be why analysts often describe Delta airlines as being loyalty businesses that happen to operate aircraft.
max
Again, I noted that AA might still be up for the year in LAX capacity but they are cutting routes including ones in which they chose to fight with UA.
Neither statement is incorrect as much as you want to argue otherwise.
aero.
DL gets a significant amount of its profits from non-transportation sources but even using your data, the majority of its profits come from air transportation. and the biggest...
max
Again, I noted that AA might still be up for the year in LAX capacity but they are cutting routes including ones in which they chose to fight with UA.
Neither statement is incorrect as much as you want to argue otherwise.
aero.
DL gets a significant amount of its profits from non-transportation sources but even using your data, the majority of its profits come from air transportation. and the biggest benefit of the 35K is in its enormous cargo capacity at low costs so it will be able to close the gap in cargo revenue across the Pacific esp on longer routes where UA has the only US carrier service.
and the question still remains as to what other airlines have been doing for the past 48 years that they haven't figured out how to generate revenue more efficiently than DL and generate higher profits as a result.
Everyone is trying to copy DL's strategy to get DL-level profits and yet there are structrural advantages which DL has which cannot be copied.
and specific to LAX, it is a combination of Amex, DL's industry leadership in corporate travel revenue, and the 35Ks which will allow DL to do what no other US carrier has done.
and let's not forget that UA's SFO hub lives off of revenue from LAX so DL will be dealing a significant blow to UA by succeeding at a lot of the markets from LAX that UA provides the only US carrier service from SFO.
sTD,
your backpedaling is always amusing but let's be clear. You had no idea what AA was doing at LAX much less how it compares to your beloved Delta
and "again, I noted that AA might still be up for the year in LAX capacity "
1. No. you didn't say that because you clearly didn't know that.
Here is your quote:
“ as we have just seen, AA is cutting LAX...
sTD,
your backpedaling is always amusing but let's be clear. You had no idea what AA was doing at LAX much less how it compares to your beloved Delta
and "again, I noted that AA might still be up for the year in LAX capacity "
1. No. you didn't say that because you clearly didn't know that.
Here is your quote:
“ as we have just seen, AA is cutting LAX while DL and UA continue to grow. DL just simply has more growth potential at LAX”
2. No. AA is not cutting at LAX while DL and UA continue to grow. AA is growing more than Delta in absolute and percent terms in 2026.
You can just say "I'm an idiot and I made things up, per usual" then move along. You might actually get some respect.
I'm wondering about possible deeper integration with the other Skyteam airlines and whether part of the plan might be to move more of them over?
Absolutely not, airlines are getting more restrictive, not more open with their lounge access policies. If anything Delta set the precedent to limit access to business class lounges on JV airlines only, United followed suite recently.
@Gray Absolutely not. For example, DL and CI do not get along very well. DL is a bully. Look at what they did to CZ which is a reason why they left ST.
CI is not part of a JV w/ DL; in fact, no Chinese or Taiwanese airlines are part of JVs with any US airline.
China Southern is an equity partner of American just as China Eastern is for DL.
Tim does it once again. Yeah, TD I know that CI and DL are not in a JV but like I said these two airlines do not get along and so yeah of course they would not be in a JV.
And yeah why is CZ pairing up with AA and why did CZ leave ST? Because DL is a bully and made CZ like a secondary partner in ST in favor of MU.
Seriously Tim, before you get into any more heated discussions with others it may go better for you if you actually directly answer the questions posed to you instead of beating around the bush and not really answering the questions. I am sure others can ask you those questions again but you will never directly answer the questions especially if it puts you in a nonsensical position.
Just flew into T2 this weekend and looked up at the old sky club and virgin clubhouse, remembering many good drinks and burgers there (at the clubhouse, not sky club, ha!) and wondered what they were going to do with the space. So do you think they’ll put the D1 lounge in the old VS space and the new Sky Club where the old one was? That VS space was really small! I can’t imagine them fitting in an equivalent experience to the D1 space currently in T3…
As a sidebar, AA has a lounge in the TBIT at LAX as well. Around Gate 152 +/-. Perhaps a gate or so away from BA's usual gate.
Temporarily replace the club lost to the LAX T5 gentrification.
Nice views. No restrooms.
Perhaps the current D1 lounge will be converted to a SkyClub and the new D1 lounge will be the only D1 lounge?
No. The current D1 Lounge will serve D1 flights out of T3. The new one is for D1 flights out of T2.
They will operate two D1 lounges
LAX is my home airport, which is a blessing and curse as an award traveller. T2 has been under construction for a while, but once it opens, DL will have serious real estate at LAX and will dwarf AA's T4 upgrades. I think DL might make a play for expanded Europe connectivity from LAX. MNL will be their ~6th Asia destination and they've done well with their Australia routes. They only fly to CDG after...
LAX is my home airport, which is a blessing and curse as an award traveller. T2 has been under construction for a while, but once it opens, DL will have serious real estate at LAX and will dwarf AA's T4 upgrades. I think DL might make a play for expanded Europe connectivity from LAX. MNL will be their ~6th Asia destination and they've done well with their Australia routes. They only fly to CDG after letting VS take the LHR route. International carriers have little to no competition on other routes that DL flies to from other hubs.
LAX vers hahah... I love this joke.
They should spend that money on getting new product on their premium transcons. It's so weird to have such great ground services and then blow it when you step on the plane. Even AA 321T are better than what they have as Delta One. I've flown AA exclusively since that trip. Delta One at LAX is great until you step on the plane.
Agree!
I will say I agree but it depends on the aircraft. If I'm flying on an A350 or A339NEO I would say the experience on the ground extends to the air. But if I'm flying on a 767 or the A330CEO I agree the D1 lounges are phenomenal but then I get on the aircraft and its disappointment like what am I paying for.
I'm glad they will finally refurbish the A330EOs which should...
I will say I agree but it depends on the aircraft. If I'm flying on an A350 or A339NEO I would say the experience on the ground extends to the air. But if I'm flying on a 767 or the A330CEO I agree the D1 lounges are phenomenal but then I get on the aircraft and its disappointment like what am I paying for.
I'm glad they will finally refurbish the A330EOs which should have been refurbished during or right after covid. and those 763s should have been retired 3-5 years ago but Delta didn't have enough widebodies on order to retire the entire fleet.
Speaking of lounges, new Sidecar at LAS is pretty impressive. Menu order service. Lobster roll, truffle fries, impressive cocktails, aqua panna or pellegrino, small and relaxing reprieve from a typical crowded cc lounge. Amazing authentic service too. Great buildout. 10/10
This development illustrates broadly how Delta struggles in Seattle, which until now, has subsidized the SEA operation via profitability from other hubs. The reality is AS is SEA's airline, not Delta. The bulk of Delta's long haul intercontinental network out of SEA has not worked. LAX is their only alternative and it is not a great one. Yields are tough out of LAX. There is a lot of capacity and competition from Asian carriers across...
This development illustrates broadly how Delta struggles in Seattle, which until now, has subsidized the SEA operation via profitability from other hubs. The reality is AS is SEA's airline, not Delta. The bulk of Delta's long haul intercontinental network out of SEA has not worked. LAX is their only alternative and it is not a great one. Yields are tough out of LAX. There is a lot of capacity and competition from Asian carriers across the Pacific and for that matter, to Europe as well. Delta is pumping billions into LAX for years and so it needs to add there to show for it.
feel free to compare profits between DL and AS, or any other US airline this year.
If DL has figured out in 48 years of deregulation how to amass a collection of hubs that can bankroll DL's ventures on the west coast, then WTH has every other airline been doing for the past 48 years that they haven't figured out what DL has mastered?
If DL can make LAX and SEA work with the profits...
feel free to compare profits between DL and AS, or any other US airline this year.
If DL has figured out in 48 years of deregulation how to amass a collection of hubs that can bankroll DL's ventures on the west coast, then WTH has every other airline been doing for the past 48 years that they haven't figured out what DL has mastered?
If DL can make LAX and SEA work with the profits it gains from its other hubs including NYC and BOS plus ATL DTW MSP and SLC, then woe to the other airlines that choose to stand in DL's way
Whatever dude. At skyrocketing oil prices, subsidies won't matter much. But keep drinking the Kool-Aid.
just watch profits (or lack thereof) at each carrier worldwide and the cuts each carrier makes esp. post summer
DL is going to get stronger as a result of this crisis.
LAX will be a big beneficiary
TD: "feel free to compare profits between DL and AS, or any other US airline this year."
Okay. I'll compare DL to "ANY other US airline THIS year" just like you said.
Skywest, 1st Q 2026 Net Profit Margin: 10.56%
Delta, 1st Q 2026 Net Profit Margin: 6.87%
Anything else I can do for you?
seriously? you're just trolling.
SKYW's livelihood and future is determined by AA, AS, DL and UA.
You do highlight how desperately you and others cherrypick a single data point to ignore years-long trends.
among large jet carriers, DL is by far the most profitable - which gives them the financial strength to grow.
It isn't a surprise that DL has been able to grow NYC, BOS, SEA and LAX while no other carrier has...
seriously? you're just trolling.
SKYW's livelihood and future is determined by AA, AS, DL and UA.
You do highlight how desperately you and others cherrypick a single data point to ignore years-long trends.
among large jet carriers, DL is by far the most profitable - which gives them the financial strength to grow.
It isn't a surprise that DL has been able to grow NYC, BOS, SEA and LAX while no other carrier has done anything close to what DL has done in other large competitive markets.
Walter, you post “No other carrier has done anything close to what DL has done in other large competitive markets”.
The common known FACT is that Delta Airlines is a very Mediocre airline when compared with other airlines in the World Competitive Market …. yes?
Break out from your mother’s basement Walter, see and experience World Class Airlines and stop trying to convince yourself that there is no better airline on this planet than a very mediocre Delta Airlines.
Tim, if you are going to say Delta did financially better than "any other US airline" be prepared to have Delta compared to "any" other US airline. Your words, not ours.
Delta didn't beat "all" other US airlines. And some other numbers were not better than other airlines besides Skywest, too. Did you look at the pre-tax numbers?
United: Adjusted, $500m. GAAP, $900M
Delta: Adjusted, $532m. GAAP, -$214M
Delta is showing a quarterly loss...
Tim, if you are going to say Delta did financially better than "any other US airline" be prepared to have Delta compared to "any" other US airline. Your words, not ours.
Delta didn't beat "all" other US airlines. And some other numbers were not better than other airlines besides Skywest, too. Did you look at the pre-tax numbers?
United: Adjusted, $500m. GAAP, $900M
Delta: Adjusted, $532m. GAAP, -$214M
Delta is showing a quarterly loss under Generally Accepted Accounting Principles. And there's over a BILLION dollar difference between Delta and United using GAAP in pre-tax profit! How is Delta beating everyone again?
But you'd likely ignore the GAAP numbers because those don't help you, (Delta had a loss!). Instead, you'd probably point at and shout about Delta's 0.3% higher "raw" pre-tax profit margin (United, 3.4%... Delta, 3.7%) - trying to turn "0.3% better" into a Big Deal! Just like you try to make Delta's mishandling baggage rate (0.35% better) a Big Deal!
But you also think United's posting 1.17% better on-time arrivals, and 1.2% fewer cancellations than Delta isn't a big deal, so mathematical consistency isn't your best ability.
Fascinating how badly Delta did in the first quarter, with rising fuel costs, despite having their own refinery. I thought that helped out Delta's numbers by a billion per year! If that DID produce the windfall you always claim, that means Delta's operation is actually financially WORSE than it looks, as the $$$ the refinery adds to the bottom line helps disguise the airline's operational issues themselves. So weird!
And - yet again - even if you are 100% correct, and Delta is far and away the single, one, best leader in airline financials ... you're providing great reasons to buy their STOCK.
Meanwhile, their failing lie-lat seat plan, "late to the party" WiFi upgrades, reduced service on shorter flights, higher cancellations, lower on-time rate, smaller route structure, etc. are great reasons to NOT buy their airline TICKETS.
How does this illustrate it? SEA literally just got a D1 lounge.
"The bulk of Delta's longhaul intercontinental network out of SEA has not worked" -> false. The majority of Delta's longhaul flights do very well out of SEA, AMS (up to 2x in summer), CDG, HND, ICN, etc. Even TPE has caught up to the other airlines running it, and sometimes higher load factors.
There was data that showed that SEA is one of...
How does this illustrate it? SEA literally just got a D1 lounge.
"The bulk of Delta's longhaul intercontinental network out of SEA has not worked" -> false. The majority of Delta's longhaul flights do very well out of SEA, AMS (up to 2x in summer), CDG, HND, ICN, etc. Even TPE has caught up to the other airlines running it, and sometimes higher load factors.
There was data that showed that SEA is one of Delta's highest performing international stations. Delta does struggle with domestic, and if you had cited that there would be a more interesting discussion, instead I can tell your entire comment is nonsense that your parrot without any real thinking
SEA has a high percentage of domestic flights that feed International - and so the revenue that is prorated to the domestic leg - all most "analysts" can see since they cannot access international revenue - is proportionately low.
The people that post and comment about DL's domestic revenues never seem to understand that DL's domestic operation at SEA is intended primarily to support its international operation which makes for lower revenue on the domestic...
SEA has a high percentage of domestic flights that feed International - and so the revenue that is prorated to the domestic leg - all most "analysts" can see since they cannot access international revenue - is proportionately low.
The people that post and comment about DL's domestic revenues never seem to understand that DL's domestic operation at SEA is intended primarily to support its international operation which makes for lower revenue on the domestic connecting leg since revenue is prorated over the two (or more) segments.
but the bigger question is what other airlines have been doing for 48 years of deregulation that they can't stand up and maintain hubs like SEA is for DL and still post industry leading profits.
TD: *(makes claim about Delta being #1 via some supposed metric)
PP: *(provides data showing the claim is inaccurate)
TD: *(repeats claim, with added qualifier)
PP: *(provides more data to show the revised claim is also inaccurate)
TD: *(ignores post)
"Someone familiar with the situation" at Delta told me that it is to specifically serve international long-haul flights departing from Terminal 2 gates.
And yet no Delta First Lounges in ATL, MSP and DTW, much bigger markets than LAX. Please someone explain this crooked logic to me.
Captive markets don't need extra investments to keep people spending money with DL. Competitive markets do.
Super, I have been reading that some analysts are saying that Delta’s revenue breaks down thus:
Aviation generates about 48% of operating profit.
Loyalty/credit-card activities generate about 46%.
Other activities generate about 6%.
Could this be why analysts often describe Delta airlines as being loyalty businesses that happen to operate aircraft.
It's really not hard to understand.
Those markets are "captured" on both the aggregate passenger, corporate contract, and credit card ubiquity, fronts. Do Delta doesn't have any reason to rush, at any of them.
The coastal hubs however, have fierce competition, and any carrier that falls behind on amenities, risks losing market and corporate clients. So they get priority.
Monopolies are bad for consumers.
It's why we need EU261. Oh wait, wrong argument.
The reality is that ATL is a second tier market, and just simply can't support the yields that NYC or LA can support, and therefore, that drives higher competitive pressure.
1990, is lounge access such an egalitarian subject? We are already talking about the top 10% of people that would even have access to any lounge. Whatever the worlds best airline decides to do at ATL...
It's why we need EU261. Oh wait, wrong argument.
The reality is that ATL is a second tier market, and just simply can't support the yields that NYC or LA can support, and therefore, that drives higher competitive pressure.
1990, is lounge access such an egalitarian subject? We are already talking about the top 10% of people that would even have access to any lounge. Whatever the worlds best airline decides to do at ATL is really irrelevant. Should airlines be forced to build lounges at FWA, MDT, SBN, etc.? The airlines already do offer lower cost tickets to markets with lower wealth, even outside of EAS routes.
Maybe Mandami will build a city owned lounge at JFK, now that's an idea!
"(I guess you could say they’re LAX vers)"
Is that a pun? If so, I didn't get it.
Gay joke. Gay men are typically tops, bottoms, or a mix of both (versatile/vers).
Yes, some of us know about this already. Too much information.
I'm surprised. Ben seems like the type who'd be -TERRIFIED- that someone might see his peen in a spa (where everyone else is nude anyway) or public shower, so it's sorta shocking to see a sex joke from him. lol
I have said for years that Delta intends to be the largest international carrier as well as domestic carrier at LAX.
This is just another step in that direction.
as for LAX-HKG, UA already is bleeding money on the route. DL is just going to push them over the edge.
remember, UA made $1.6 billion less than DL in 2025; that gap will grow as DL gains benefits from the refinery and UA finally...
I have said for years that Delta intends to be the largest international carrier as well as domestic carrier at LAX.
This is just another step in that direction.
as for LAX-HKG, UA already is bleeding money on the route. DL is just going to push them over the edge.
remember, UA made $1.6 billion less than DL in 2025; that gap will grow as DL gains benefits from the refinery and UA finally decides to settle w/ its labor unions for higher pay.
2026 and 2027 will be the years for DL to use its riches to take what it needs - more Asia and more Latin America.
@ Tim Dunn -- "as for LAX-HKG, UA already is bleeding money on the route. DL is just going to push them over the edge."
Lol, so to be clear, do you think Delta will bleed money on the route as well? Or instant, massive money maker?
DL could very well lose money, Ben.
But UA has far more capacity and cost in the market and it is doubtful that DL can't exceed UA's revenue per flight while having lower cost per passenger.
DL intends to consolidate its power on the west coast, to Asia and to Latin America in 2026 and 2027. They have the profits to outlast other carriers.
Just.
You.
Wait.
and See.
@ Tim Dunn -- "They have the profits to outlast other carriers." So you think Delta will do a bunch of unprofitable flying in order to "outlast" competitors? And they're going to do that rather than flying profitably out of their fortress hubs?
"DL could very well lose money, Ben."
There is no "could," there.
Someone posted the numbers a while back, and LAX-HKG is not only the lowest yielding longhaul route in United's entire system, but also the lowest for any USA airline departing the continental USA. United also doesn't command a notably smaller fare than Cathay.
Barring undisclosed subsidy of some sort, there's no world in which Delta, which has higher costs than either of those...
"DL could very well lose money, Ben."
There is no "could," there.
Someone posted the numbers a while back, and LAX-HKG is not only the lowest yielding longhaul route in United's entire system, but also the lowest for any USA airline departing the continental USA. United also doesn't command a notably smaller fare than Cathay.
Barring undisclosed subsidy of some sort, there's no world in which Delta, which has higher costs than either of those two, is going to come onto that route with a single flight, and command a higher fare than Cathay; and considering that its overall costs tend to be higher than United, it's going to be met with the same fate.
Delta is chasing network benefits long-term. They're going to lose their behind, on the per-segment "profitability" for this route, just like United is doing.
and DL knew all of that when it decided to enter the market.
Yes, DL will outlast other carriers who might end up a little smaller (and mayge alot smaller) after the dust settles on this crisis
and, no, Ben.
Not a bunch of unprofitable flying.
But perhaps a new major international route per year that is strategically important long term and where DL believes it can take share.
If DL and Amex' math...
and DL knew all of that when it decided to enter the market.
Yes, DL will outlast other carriers who might end up a little smaller (and mayge alot smaller) after the dust settles on this crisis
and, no, Ben.
Not a bunch of unprofitable flying.
But perhaps a new major international route per year that is strategically important long term and where DL believes it can take share.
If DL and Amex' math says DL needs to be in certain cities, then the math is much more in DL's favor than for someone that already flies a bunch of money-losing capacity.
I've said for years that the only reason why UA doesn't make profits as high as DL is because UA is so fixated on size that it flies so much money-losing capacity.
DL is just getting started in proving how shallow UA's profits really are
"DL intends to consolidate its power on the west coast, to... Latin America in 2026 and 2027. They have the profits to outlast other carriers."
Oh... Delta is consolidating power on the west coast? Like LAX to Latin America?
In 2026, Delta is shrinking LAX> Latin America by nearly 30%.
Oh wait. Maybe you meant SEA> Latin America?
Well. In 2026, Delta is shrinking capacity by 36% on SEA > Latin America
SEA>...
"DL intends to consolidate its power on the west coast, to... Latin America in 2026 and 2027. They have the profits to outlast other carriers."
Oh... Delta is consolidating power on the west coast? Like LAX to Latin America?
In 2026, Delta is shrinking LAX> Latin America by nearly 30%.
Oh wait. Maybe you meant SEA> Latin America?
Well. In 2026, Delta is shrinking capacity by 36% on SEA > Latin America
SEA> Asia? flights are 100% FLAT YoY in 2026.
You always spin a good yarn, but as I've always tried to tell you, trying to make up dogmatic statements with ABSOLUTELY no idea what you're talking about always comes back to bite you in the butt, buddy.
I will give you this... With the enormous drop in capacity by Delta on the West Coast to Latin America, you're right that in 2027, you're likely to spin a good tale about 10% seeming massive while ignoring that it's still massively lower than Delta's own capacity in 2025. ;)
Keep trying, slugger. One of these days you'll get something right. A broken clock Is right twice a day.
But again... do try to make it harder to prove you wrong. You make it sooooo easy. I almost get bored using data to prove you wrong.
To butcher a quote "What you (intend) to do isn't necessarily what you're gonna do" - Gia Gunn. They can intend all they want, but getting the largest slice of the pie at LAX is very unlikely.
"As for LAX-HKG, "UA already is bleeding money on the route. DL is just going to push them over the edge."
Gonna add that to my "Things Tim Predicted that Didn't Come True" bingo card for a few years from now. But I'm gonna need a bigger card.
"Gonna add that to my "Things Tim Predicted that Didn't Come True" bingo card for a few years from now. But I'm gonna need a bigger card."
We really need to start noting these down.
I just wish I kind find his posts from last year about how DL took a lead they would never give up during the EWR runway-closer/weather meltdown last April/May.
"2026 and 2027 will be the years for DL to use its riches to take what it needs - more... Latin America."
Someone better let Delta know about your plans for them in Latin America. They're shrinking capacity in that region in 2026 year on year by nearly 7%.
It appears Delta is using their riches to lick their wounds and retreat ;)
we might need a review of the shuttle to t22, must be pretty far away from the main terminals :)
@ Ben Holz -- Hah, whoops, thanks. Fixed.
I looked at Delta's loads on their new LAX/ HGK flight during the first 30 days and BC is running at 80% capacity. ECY is full every flight. Maybe they will not lose that much money on this route after all.