Well, I think I’m going to have to take back some of the credit that I gave SWISS for how it handled the compensation for my canceled flight…
In this post:
My money from SWISS has gone missing!
Back in August, I wrote about my compensation claim with SWISS regarding a canceled flight. Specifically, SWISS had canceled my flight for technical reasons, leading to a significant delay. Fortunately EU261 regulates what compensation airlines in Europe owe you for irregular operations.
Not only was SWISS on the hook for paying for my hotel room, but the airline also owed me €250 in cash compensation. Now, airlines often try to weasel their way out of paying this by making up excuses about the cause of the cancelation or delay. Fortunately my experience was seamless, at least at first. The airline responded to my request in a matter of days, and I just had to follow a link to enter my bank account information for the compensation.
As soon as I did that, I received an email stating the following:
We just processed the bank transfer to the bank account you have indicated. You should receive the payment within four to ten working days.
Well, there’s only one slight problem… it has been nearly six weeks, and the money never showed up in my bank account. I’ve followed up a couple of times with SWISS asking if the airline could confirm that the transfer was successfully made, but haven’t received a response.
Is this an honest mistake, or…?
I can’t help but wonder if this is an honest mistake on SWISS’ part, or if there might be more to this. As mentioned above, many airlines try to avoid paying EU261 compensation however they can. Usually that comes in the form of not being honest about the reason for a cancelation, though when that’s not so easy, is it possible that the airline just repeatedly tries to make passengers follow up regarding the payment?
My bank account is with Chase, and I’ve confirmed that they don’t have any record of a transfer of this amount having been made (or having been attempted, as far as they can see). So then I started searching online, and I’ve seen several reports (like this one) of SWISS doing the same to others.
In some cases the airline claimed that the attempt to make a transfer failed, but of course the airline made no attempt to reach out to the customer and inform them of this. For that matter, the airline makes it seemingly impossible to follow up and check on the status of a transfer.
So for now we can make this as “developing.” I’m just curious if anyone has had a similar experience, or any tips on how to proceed.
Bottom line
I recently had a SWISS flight cancel due to an issue within the carrier’s control. Fortunately the airline swiftly approved my compensation claim, and I figured that would be the end of it. That hasn’t proven to be the case, though, as the money never showed up in my bank account. I’ve reached out to SWISS a couple of times with no luck, so I’m not sure what exactly to make of this.
What’s your take on this — is SWISS intentionally doing this to avoid paying compensation, or is this an honest mistake?
I am currently about to provide the banking information to SWISS for delayed luggage (which they only provided 50%)
Did you use the international code for the bank key?
Worried about your experience that I'm going to have the same.
Following this thread. I am owed a delayed baggage refund from September. They agreed to pay 100% of my receipts submitted but I’m unable to fill out the form properly, even though I took it to my bank and they tried to help (TD Dominion)
The same thing happened to me and I'm still trying to resolve it. They promised a refund and confirmation email within 1-2 days and it's been 2 weeks and there's nothing. It's not an accident. I've flown dozens if not hundreds of flights with other airlines and never had an issue. Swiss Air is literally criminal with how they are trained to handle this. Let me know if you figure out a solution. I'm just going for a credit card dispute at this point.
What are you going to do about it, if anything?
Keep in mind you may have a better chance as a blogger in dealing with it compared to an "ordinary person"
When getting compensation in the EU. I prefer using companies such as AirHelp to get the compensation (Yes, they take 30% of your compensation) but at least you get something.
LH initially denied my claim for basic necessities due to delayed baggage citing that I never provided itemized receipts (I did and contested), they then sent money to my account through SWIFT after a few days.
They're not being held accountable by EU regulations. My flight was cancelled late Sept 23 in Geneva as we boarded. They said they needed to do a bird check. Obviously made up since there were no birds and nothing wrong with the plane. But they refuse to compensate as required.
Unfortunately, Swiss service is deteriorating. I've had Swiss refuse to compensate for delays caused by their own technical failures. I also had the experience of a compensation payment that was delayed about 6 months to a Swiss account. In the past, Swiss would pay compensation for delays, lost luggage, and downgrades in about 3 days. Those days are over and seems that Swiss is becoming a budget carrier with a steep drop in its service level.
It is a generał issue across the whole Lufthansa group. My bag was delayed in Paris with LH. I claimed some basic purchases and surprisingly after three days I got an email confirming my claim and asking for my bank account details. I provided them with a German IBAN. It was on 13 July. After three months no money in my account. No feedback to my further inquiries. Good luck Ben!
Even pre-Covid, Swiss was notoriously bad at refunds. Even after I agreed to a $1k fee, it still never showed up for months for my two business class flights.
I ended up contesting with Chase. That turned out to work - Swiss won't even respond to them and it will default to the customer...
I had to write them multiple times and then resort to contacting the aviation authority of the departure country which in turn pushed them and they sent the money rather quickly.
Swiss airlines is scumbag airline and should be avoided at all costs, they should fail.
On a 1 week trip they managed to delay 1 flight making me miss connection, not provide support or compensation, delay the baggage that arrived the day before my...
I had to write them multiple times and then resort to contacting the aviation authority of the departure country which in turn pushed them and they sent the money rather quickly.
Swiss airlines is scumbag airline and should be avoided at all costs, they should fail.
On a 1 week trip they managed to delay 1 flight making me miss connection, not provide support or compensation, delay the baggage that arrived the day before my return and cherry on top return flight canceled and rescheduled later that day... If it weren't for the aviation authority I'd be left with nothing because of course they lied about the reasons of the delay/cancellation.
SWISS and the entire Lufthansa Group is no longer a good choice. They are just super-expensive group of low-cost airlines.
You are lucky. My flight was cancelled a couple of weeks ago due to technical reasons, and they keep denying my claim, and send a copy and paste of the same message. I don't know who to escalate to anymore as it's the third time I respond with a detail analysis of EU regulations, and I literally get the same message, the same one saying: please do not respond anymore. I am appalled, and I...
You are lucky. My flight was cancelled a couple of weeks ago due to technical reasons, and they keep denying my claim, and send a copy and paste of the same message. I don't know who to escalate to anymore as it's the third time I respond with a detail analysis of EU regulations, and I literally get the same message, the same one saying: please do not respond anymore. I am appalled, and I have no idea to complain to (flight was GVA-NCE). I had the same issues with Easyjet on the same route a month before, and my claim was accepted in 24 hours, and paid in 48 hours. Swiss is notably bad for this, but I am in shock!
Thank you for your message of 26 September 2023.
I regret my message of 25 September 2023, did not meet your expectations.
Your file has been reviewed and I can inform you that your flight had to be delayed due to an unexpected flight safety shortcoming. On behalf of SWISS and its cooperation partners, I apologize for the inconvenience you had as a result.
The aircraft scheduled to operate the rotation had a technical problem. Since the repair was taking a long time, but we still wanted to guarantee that your flight would operate as soon as possible, a replacement aircraft was provided. However, the dispatching of this aircraft has again been associated with a waiting period.
Considering that safety is SWISS’ first priority, all reasonable measures were taken to prevent the delay. I must deny your claim for compensation in application of regulation EC261/2004.
Although I well understand your irritation in view of your experience, I hope you understand that I cannot grant a favourable response to your request for the reasons explained.
I appreciate your understanding and hope to serve you again under more favorable circumstances.
Welcome to Swiss Airlines.
The whole Lufthansa group. Penny counters.
Had the same issue with Wizz Air - basically said funds were on the way but never arrived. In the UK, airlines sometimes sign up to alternative dispute resolution schemes which arbitrate as independent 3rd parties on what the outcome should be. These outcomes are legally enforceable. I sent a deadlock letter to the airline saying if I didn't receive any news in X days - I'd raise a dispute with the scheme. Given that...
Had the same issue with Wizz Air - basically said funds were on the way but never arrived. In the UK, airlines sometimes sign up to alternative dispute resolution schemes which arbitrate as independent 3rd parties on what the outcome should be. These outcomes are legally enforceable. I sent a deadlock letter to the airline saying if I didn't receive any news in X days - I'd raise a dispute with the scheme. Given that they'd already admitted they were going to pay me - this would be a straightforward dispute resolution but takes time and effort on both parties. The threat got me my money in 1 week.
Give them the IBAN number of your German bank account (if you have any) or
Absolutely this! If I'm claiming EU261 from a European airline I always use my European account. It's faster and there's less chance of things going awry since they're all within the (roughly) same banking system. Using my credit union here in the States I can see things going haywire. Though, to be fair, when I've had to recoup monies from UA for cancelling for a tech reason, it was pretty seamless to my US account....
Absolutely this! If I'm claiming EU261 from a European airline I always use my European account. It's faster and there's less chance of things going awry since they're all within the (roughly) same banking system. Using my credit union here in the States I can see things going haywire. Though, to be fair, when I've had to recoup monies from UA for cancelling for a tech reason, it was pretty seamless to my US account. But keeping them geographically "isolated" seems to be the trick, despite the sheer amount of technology involved that SHOULD make all of this painless.
My experience with Swiss is good in this regard, they paid back within a reasonable timeframe. During peak times it might take a bit longer, so maybe you need some patience.
If I compare to other airlines, Swiss is still much better - with other airlines it can take up to one year to get a small amount of money back, if at all (with some cases I gave up..).
Good luck, I am confident you will get your money back soon.
Pro Tip, ask for a check, yes a real check.
1. It is traceable if they send it by registered mail.
2. Your privacy is protected. Your bank details are not swimming around on some poorly protected airline IT system just waiting to be hacked.
To cash in a check in Swiss Franc in the US, would be prohibetly expensive in currency conversion and fees.
A cheque / check in 2023? Sent by registered mail? Words escape me…
Err, not going to happen... it's 2023 and most of the developed world doesn't use checks anymore. Except the strangely backward US banking system!
So there is ONE Flyertalk post from 2021, and that's a pattern. Sure
Since US banks are quite backwards when it comes to international transfers, it is sometimes less than straight forward to make it go through.
Not quite the same but I had missing miles on a business class ticket on AA. It took them 6 months but probably would have gone in forever. Every time I called the outsource support would say it's been taken care of wait 30 days. After 5 months I compiled all the communication and emailed them to all the AA marketing dept emails I could find with a note that if nobody handles this then...
Not quite the same but I had missing miles on a business class ticket on AA. It took them 6 months but probably would have gone in forever. Every time I called the outsource support would say it's been taken care of wait 30 days. After 5 months I compiled all the communication and emailed them to all the AA marketing dept emails I could find with a note that if nobody handles this then I will take more decisive action. Then they finally fixed it. Why does it always have to reach those extreme?
My wife and I recently had United Airlines cancelled 3, yes 3 days in a row our international flight back from Zurich to San Diego!!!!! United after 4 weeks said they would comply with the 600 Euros per person per day. I am NOT holding my breath but at least they did not dispute or argue the claim.
Hola,
Tengo problema similar con LH, kienes , swapuwa dw vaeios reclamos se dognaron indormar ke debido mal tiempo, no estan obligados dar compensacion alguna. Sin embargo ese dia 19 de agosto de 2023, vuelo LH1376 ha sido demorado mas de 3 hs sin explicacion alguna ese dia. Ademas tanto en Frankfurt como en destino- Gdansk, el tiempo fue perfecto, sin nubes ni lluvia.
Parece que LH tiene otros mapas de tiempo o...
Hola,
Tengo problema similar con LH, kienes , swapuwa dw vaeios reclamos se dognaron indormar ke debido mal tiempo, no estan obligados dar compensacion alguna. Sin embargo ese dia 19 de agosto de 2023, vuelo LH1376 ha sido demorado mas de 3 hs sin explicacion alguna ese dia. Ademas tanto en Frankfurt como en destino- Gdansk, el tiempo fue perfecto, sin nubes ni lluvia.
Parece que LH tiene otros mapas de tiempo o no sabe interpretarlas.Da la impresion que NO kieren hacerse cargo ninguno por esta demora.
at
Que ?
I flew Swiss twice: first and last time. It was business flight Hong-Kong to Zurich about 4 years ago. Seat very hard and uncomfortable, crew with zero interest in passengers, zero personal approach, food was mediocre and so minimal that even two different breakfast did not satisfy me. And a few more issues.
Complaint resulted in insulting 5000 miles compensation for 2 passengers.
I am still waiting for compensation from the July 30 flight that ITA canceled. We had an experience with Air France that was amazing. All we did was upload the information and within 14 working days each of us had $650 in our bank account.
Would you please update your original post?
The big issue is the money going to a US Bank account that has a routing number. ACHs tend to be tricky across country and why companies often pay by wire instead. Where you given the option of Zelle/Venmo?
Only way I got mine was to use my Spanish account with IBAN in Euro, then transfer it yourself via Wise to USD account. In theory they would do out of EU transfers but it is a recipe for disaster.
During the pandemic I had to cancel some flights on Vietnam Airlines and was told my refund was sent to my credit card but of course it never was and then Vietnam Air refused to ever answer another email about it. I know when I am being lied to, so after about 6 months I filed a complaint with the FAA (Or DoT, whoever handles flight complaints) and the next day got a response saying...
During the pandemic I had to cancel some flights on Vietnam Airlines and was told my refund was sent to my credit card but of course it never was and then Vietnam Air refused to ever answer another email about it. I know when I am being lied to, so after about 6 months I filed a complaint with the FAA (Or DoT, whoever handles flight complaints) and the next day got a response saying "Since they don't fly here we don't have any jurisdiction over them, but I'll send it to them regardless because they don't want to be on our bad side" and lo and behold, I got my refund within a few days. It's worth a try.
Well, the Swiss aren't that good at banking.
It may be tied up with the bank numbers -- ACH vs ABA code. I recently did an EU261 with LH, they were very clear on needing ACH, and it went through seamlessly.
International transfers are very cumbersome.
I don't think it's an international transfer issue. It is limited to the US and Canada that can't produce IBAN but just use domestic account numbers because they think the world is limited to them.
I have a UBS account in the US and in Switzerland among others and I never really got the US account number I have to provide.
> ACH vs ABA code.
ABA (American Banking Association) is only used for domestic US transfers. It can't be used by foreign banks except that in most cases it's the same as your ACH routing ID, which can be used for international ACH.
The other method of international payment is wire transfers, which use the SWIFT code to route to your bank. In this case, however, it moves the money to a US clearinghouse bank...
> ACH vs ABA code.
ABA (American Banking Association) is only used for domestic US transfers. It can't be used by foreign banks except that in most cases it's the same as your ACH routing ID, which can be used for international ACH.
The other method of international payment is wire transfers, which use the SWIFT code to route to your bank. In this case, however, it moves the money to a US clearinghouse bank that then moves it to YOUR account at the regional bank. (Note that if you're using one of the big nations like Chase, BofA, etc. that process is done automatically and doesn't add an appreciable to delay in receipt of funds.)
In my experience international transfers to Chase have occured in 15-30 minutes. International transfers to BNP Paribas have taken a day. All of these were wires, which guarantees the funds on arrival and have no mechanism for undoing the transfer if it goes all the way through. (If some datum is wrong and it is "held" it can be retrieved by the sender...)
Depending on the circumstances of how and where the flight was booked and/or originated or terminated it may fall under jurisdiction of US courts, and this would be ripe for a small-claims case. If that is to be filed, account for all emails (and phone calls to your bank) at a "reasonable rate" (30min per?) and add it at your "research rate" to the amount.
In most cases the simple act of sending the formal notice of the suit is enough to bring settlement to the table in order to get the suit removed and no precedent judgment set.
It should take at most a week for the money to be transfered to a US bank once the claim is approved. I have had recent experience with LOT (denied boarding -> EU261 -> 600 euros), LH (from claim to payment in less than a week, delayed luggage), and KLM (2 weeks total, delayed luggage).
We had a similar issue with Level. We filed claims with Iberia and they approved €600 euro each but then told us that they could only pay us if we had an EU or UK bank account.
I filed a claim with Lufthansa and I received a message that I would get a bank transfer after I send them the bank information. I did but instead of a bank transfer, I received a check in the mail.
I've got a cool story about Swiss - almost exactly 2 years ago I had a one-way JFK-ZRH-DXB on Swiss, business class, non-refundable, paid about $1800 cash if I remember right. A tragic event (a friend passed in an accident) occurred 2 days before departure, I couldn't take the flight. Now I know it's non-refundable, so I didn't blame anyone or expect anything - but about a day before the flight I did write to...
I've got a cool story about Swiss - almost exactly 2 years ago I had a one-way JFK-ZRH-DXB on Swiss, business class, non-refundable, paid about $1800 cash if I remember right. A tragic event (a friend passed in an accident) occurred 2 days before departure, I couldn't take the flight. Now I know it's non-refundable, so I didn't blame anyone or expect anything - but about a day before the flight I did write to them saying "hey, sadly this is what happened, I'm not expecting a refund, but maybe you guys will be kind enough to refund me at least something."
About a month later I get a reply from Swiss - something very cold that said 'we've processed your request, your refund is $27." Which calculates to 1.5%.
Look, again, I didn't expect anything - and that's exactly the point! In my world - nothing would've been better! They could've said: we're sorry this happened, but the policy is a policy, nothing we can do.
Instead, it took them a month to generate a computer response saying we'll give you back 1.5%. Nah, thanks, you're free to keep that. In fact, i'm not sure they even processed that refund, I never checked. Could be same thing as with Ben's.
Long story short - I love Switzerland, and I'm avoiding Swiss in perpetuity.
Isn't that just the airport fees? I believe you are entitled to a refund of airport fees even on non-refundable ticket.
You may be right. If I remember correctly - the response didn't mention anything on what or why they're refunding. Plus, I'm pretty sure the figures (with cents), calculated up to exactly 1.5% of the full price.
But you're bringing up a great point - they should've refunded the airport feed? I'm no expert, but something tells me these would've been more than $27 given it's a business class ticket thru 3 of the world's more expensive airports.
Even for a JFK-ZRH-DXB oneway business class fare purchased today on LX, of the USD1018.50 total TFCs charged, $968.50 goes to LX anyway as YQ/YR surcharges, which would be nonref like the fare. Of the $50.00 left, $25.60 would be the US/XF taxes, which are also nonref if the fare is nonref. Leaving $24.40 of today's ticket price that would be refundable - very close to your $27.00 from 2 years ago. You'd get back...
Even for a JFK-ZRH-DXB oneway business class fare purchased today on LX, of the USD1018.50 total TFCs charged, $968.50 goes to LX anyway as YQ/YR surcharges, which would be nonref like the fare. Of the $50.00 left, $25.60 would be the US/XF taxes, which are also nonref if the fare is nonref. Leaving $24.40 of today's ticket price that would be refundable - very close to your $27.00 from 2 years ago. You'd get back 5.60AY (TSA fee), 17.40CH (ZRH departure tax), 1.40ZR (UAE arrivals fee). That's it. You paid a lot in fare and surcharges, but very little in other TFCs. Put another way, only about 3% of the total you originally paid was for government/airport fees. 97% was LX revenue.
Pulled it all up and checked - the fare was 1,446.40, not the 1900 I claimed. Out of that - $46.40 in airport fees.
For the refund - they said $22.80, not $27, but that number is around 1.6% like I remembered. The figure seems pretty arbitrary, but perhaps could be part of the airport fees?
None of the taxes/fees were percentage based to begin with, but fixed amounts. You'd have paid the same $46.40 and received the same $22.80 back whether you'd bought the very cheapest fare in economy, or the most expensive non-refundable fare in business/first. That's just what the government/airport TFCs for JFK-ZRH-DXB oneway are; low to begin with, and then some are also nonref when the fare is.
You should try airhelp. They got me $950 out of Tap Portugal from last June 2022. Tap is one of the worst airline to deal with. What impressed me really about airhelp is that once they got the money, they emailed me to collect, I filled in the information with my account number and ABA and the money was in my account 2nd day.. Airhelp does take 30% off but I couldnt get anything out of Tap by myself.
Chris (Christopher) Elliott is also great - a travel advocate.
My guess is that it’s an international money transfer problem. There can be fees on both ends of the transaction depending on the banks involved. In my business, I pay significant wire transfer fees between EU banks and my US bank.
Visit airhelp and they will try to get your money/ no prepayment- their fee is one third of the money following wonning the case
Wonder if you can show the paper work and file a claim in small claims court in US ?
This was predicted. Read the comments from your initial post about this. This is right out of the Lufthansa playbook.
Identical experience with Austrian Air (part of Lufthansa/Swiss Group). 5 months of back and forth with Austrian-punting to Lufthansa, Chase and the travel insurance from my Chase Preferred card. Finger-pointing all around. Escalated to senior management at Chase who reimbursed the cost of the ticket but no additional compensation per EU rules from Austrian.
It is probably a technical glitch rather than intentional. I had no issues getting my transfer quickly, although I used an European account with an IBAN.
For those without an account in Europe, WISE should be a suitable option as JS reported.
I think it's time that the EU law is reinforced with penalties for this kind of nonsense. This has happened to me as well with LH and TP where they first deny the claim and then just delay and then I have to get a 3rd party (AirHelp) to get involved and then suddenly they change their tune and I get paid but have to give up 30% of it. It's ridiculous.
Why these bank transfers? Can’t they just send you a check? United owed me on a flight delay from LHR to LAX. It took maybe 3/4 weeks at the most and had the check shortly thereafter. Perhaps because it was a US abased airline but whatever…..get a check if that’s an option.
A cheque / check in 2023?! Seriously?
Maybe send them a telegramme and ask them to send you a cheque…
Instead of AirHelp, you can open a claim with the national enforcement body in the country where the delay occurred. Then you don't need to kick over the 30% or more to the service companies. It took ages, but I was able to get 1200 EUR for 2 tickets a few years back from Norwegian. Flight was exactly 4 hours and 1 minute late. Norwegian denied all EU261 claims with the same Rolls Royce engine letter back when they still flew long haul.
Not just Swiss.
It's a thing of all foreign carriers. I've heard from friends, family, colleagues, and even happened to me.
KLM and SQ just lost my bank transfer from before Covid. I've written off those compensations.
Similar situation with RAM (after a technical diversion to Mali of all places!), they confirmed compensation and asked for bank details. Then sat on this for over 6 months!, claiming that they were still processing the payment. Luckily in the UK you can submit an online court claim, and issue a CCJ if they don't respond/pay within the required time frame... this was in the end the only way to get the money back from...
Similar situation with RAM (after a technical diversion to Mali of all places!), they confirmed compensation and asked for bank details. Then sat on this for over 6 months!, claiming that they were still processing the payment. Luckily in the UK you can submit an online court claim, and issue a CCJ if they don't respond/pay within the required time frame... this was in the end the only way to get the money back from RAM, and they paid the online court fee.
It's sad that we have to resort to this but has been a successful approach for RAM and BA.
Please note, online "small claims court" is only available in UK, for claims against persons/companies also registered in UK. for purchases between approx 600-10,000 gbp.
I would submit again.
Air Canada delayed my bags in June 2022 (last year). They owed me compensation of around $250 USD. Their customer service acknowledged the issue and reached out to me for my banking details, which I provided. Till date, I am yet to see that money in my account. Have reached out on that email thread a couple of times but have gotten no response. Calling them, the response I get is that the appropriate department...
Air Canada delayed my bags in June 2022 (last year). They owed me compensation of around $250 USD. Their customer service acknowledged the issue and reached out to me for my banking details, which I provided. Till date, I am yet to see that money in my account. Have reached out on that email thread a couple of times but have gotten no response. Calling them, the response I get is that the appropriate department is still working on it and the matter will be taken care of soon.
Guess, I will have to mark out a few hours one day to really yell at their contact center supervisor.
I usually just have my EU261 payments sent to my Wise account. This allows me to give Lufthansa my German IBAN. Once received, I transfer as an ACH to my Bank of America account.
That's a great idea. I just opened a Wise account. You should get a commission!
Yes this is a good idea. I know I myself as a Brit find it difficult sometimes getting a payment to go through to the US - ACH vs wire etc. IBAN can't really go wrong