Delta Air Lines Management & Pilot Union Play Hardball

Filed Under: Delta

While American and United have reached agreements with their pilots for paid time off, Delta and their pilots can’t seem to come to an agreement.

Airlines can’t involuntarily furlough employees

US airlines are getting government aid, and one condition of that aid is that they can’t  lay off or involuntarily furlough any employees through at least September 30, 2020.

However, they can do just about anything else to reduce their headcount, if employees will agree. This includes:

  • Getting employees to take a voluntarily leave of absence (unpaid)
  • Getting employees to take a voluntarily leave of absence (paid)
  • Getting senior employees to accept early retirement with partial pay
  • Reducing hours for existing employees

How Delta is reducing their workforce

Delta has already gotten 27,000 of their employees to accept unpaid leave. This clearly reflects the culture at Delta, and how many employees are looking out for the future of the company (since they’re choosing to accept no pay, when they could stay on and continue to be paid).

On top of that, Delta management and ground workers have accepted a 25% pay cut in the form of reduced hours.

Delta isn’t giving in to pilots, though

Pilots have proven to be a different story, as reported by AJC. At both American and United. pilots were the first to get a “deal” for partially paid leave, where they could take time off while being paid a good portion of their regular salary.

But negotiations between Delta management and the Delta chapter of the Air Line Pilots Association (ALPA) haven’t gone so well:

  • Delta asked pilots to accept a 20% reduction in guaranteed flight hours, which would essentially be a pay cut for all pilots
  • The union wouldn’t accept any form of involuntarily pay cuts for pilots, and wanted management to look at options that would allow pilots to volunteer instead, like a voluntary paid leave of absence

But Delta isn’t down with providing paid leave to pilots, even though American and United have. Why? Because Delta management doesn’t think it’s “right or consistent with their values” for pilots to get paid leave, “when more than 27,000 Delta colleagues are taking unpaid leave.”

Why is Delta being adamant here?

As I said earlier, American and United both quickly came to agreements with their pilots, offering them paid leave options, even when they didn’t initially offer flight attendants the same.

Why is Delta a different story? This likely comes down to the unionization efforts at the company. Delta’s pilots are one of only two work groups at the company that are unionized (the other group is flight dispatchers). There have been efforts for years to get flight attendants and other work groups to unionize as well, and those efforts were recently ramping up once again.

Clearly management is concerned about the optics here, because you can bet that during unionization efforts it will be brought up that “hey, they only gave the unionized employees paid leave, while everyone else got unpaid leave.”

Bottom line

This is going to be a situation to watch. Delta pilots just want what pilots at other airlines are getting, while it’s clear that Delta management is very concerned about the optics of this situation.

This definitely at least partly comes down to concerns over other work groups unionizing in the future, and this being used to support that drive. Beyond that, I think it’s also because Delta takes more of a “team player” approach to running their business compared to other airlines, and it doesn’t seem fair when everyone is making a big sacrifice, except one work group.

  1. Delta is the best airline by far because of the 25,000+ who voluntarily took leave and those taking a 25-50% pay cut during this time. Flying is to be down 85+% during April and leave it to the pilots who think they should be paid in full, that’s sad…. Even AA and UA have come to an agreement during this time. You stay classy DL pilots!

  2. Management and ground grounds “accepted” a 25% reduction in hours?
    It wasn’t a choice. Lol. The delta voluntary unpaid leave was so high because it was accompanied by the only other choice: 25% reduction in pay.
    Meanwhile, Ed Bastian only removed the small salary component of his pay, nothing about total compensation reduction for him.

  3. “Delta’s pilots are the only unionized workforce at the company.”

    Incorrect. The other union is PAFCA (Professional Airline Flight Controllers Association), who represent roughly 450 flight dispatchers.

  4. Lol….DL is asking for $$ billions dollars of tax payer money for everyone to continue to be paid in full like there is robust flying everywhere..come on, let’s get real and be rational….. As for Ed Bastians “small” salary component, I am guessing his stock at 1/3 the price it used to be is also worth considering. Anything else worth noting as to why the decisions DL management is making is stupid?

  5. “everyone is making a big sacrifice, except one work group.”
    Even Delta management has admitted that for most employees, unemployment pays as much or even more than they would make staying on. The idea that these employees are sacrificing is blatantly false.
    Pilots on the other hand would take a significant pay reduction going on unemployment which would require sacrifices from their families. Pilots already offered to sacrifice MORE than these other employees (who once again are being fully paid by the government) and because of optics, management chose not to accept those savings. The bailout from the government is meant to pay all employee salaries, not be used as a slush fund for whatever management wants
    The pilots have been complaining about the huge stock buybacks for years. That money would be very helpful right now. This is a crisis of revenue not cost. No amount of slashing payrolls will make up for no one flying.

  6. Like the middle east 3, I have thought that if hard time hit, DL’s relationship with employee would hit the skids and it is. . . FA’s could unionize and the Pilot’s deal is a mess compared to AA and even UA (who I never give any credit too since Kirby is a moron). The old NWA folks are starting to rise up against the old DL guard and they are bringing the newbies with them. Interesting scenario for sure.

  7. @Greg

    Let’s be very clear what it means for a pilot to be making a “huge” paycut. Even if they were to also accept a 25% pay reduction, they are still paid at least double what most at even headquarters make. Your right unemployment + stimulus will payout equal to or better to ground employee pay because of the amount they make vs the pilots. And pilot’s are sacrificing because a 25% still wouldn’t make them eligible for the stimulus payout? Again let’s put this into perspective in $$ terms.

    As for the stock buybacks, that is complete garbage in DL terms. Employee’s got more than there fair share with the best Profit sharing payout of any company ever.

    Let’s not forgot.. UA and AA pilots have both accepted reduced pay and they are paid LESS than DL pilots….What are we missing here?

  8. @Anon

    As a UAL pilot I can say you are incorrect as a whole UAL pilots make more than Delta pilots because there are so many more pilots making wide body pay at UAL , though the hourly wage on a particular plane may be a dollar more per hour at DAL.

    Additionally any pilot at UAL that is taking a surplus reduction line did so on a completely voluntary basis this month and got 50 hours of flight pay to stay home. Yes the flight hours are down so pilots staying at work are generally going to make less some will pick up time and make the same or more.

  9. @30west

    That’s not being incorrect, that is a completely different conversation to compare pay by the number of wide bodies in ones fleet. Ironic to bring up that point though at a time when DL is actually flying more passenger/cargo wide bodies than UA currently. So I guess DL pilots are still making more?

    As it being a voluntary decision… What good is it from a business standpoint?

  10. I find your inference very odd here:
    “Delta has already gotten 27,000 of their employees to accept unpaid leave. This clearly reflects the culture at Delta, and how many employees are looking out for the future of the company (since they’re choosing to accept no pay, when they could stay on and continue to be paid).”

    To me it is unlikely that people are doing this out of loyalty to the company. It seems more likely that they have family obligations (e.g. due to school closures) or as someone mentioned above, chose this rather than a pay cut through reduced hours. I also agree with the commenter who said that “accepted a 25% pay cut” is perhaps not the best description.

  11. @ [email protected] — Interestingly at other US airlines they didn’t get anywhere close to as many volunteers as Delta did. I’ve actually had several Delta employees leave comments here saying things along the lines of “I accepted leave because I care about my company.” Why do you think so much higher of a percentage of Delta’s workforce volunteered compared to other airlines?

  12. @Lucky
    Because the other airlines didn’t provide 25% pay cut as the only other option. Only Delta did that.

  13. @Greg @anon

    I would like to see a source that says most employees taking voluntary leave are making as much or more on unemployment. That’s not how unemployment works. Not counting the one time stimulus check from the Feds, the maximum weekly benefit amount in most states for unemployment is $300-500, including Georgia.

  14. @ Ed — To be clear, Delta asked people to cut hours so that they’d make less. It’s not a straight 25% cut in terms of hourly pay. However, this only applies to ground workers and not to flight attendants or pilots, and the reality is that other airlines people are also being paid minimum hours. The end result isn’t very different.

  15. @TM….the federal government is adding an extra $600 per week to all unemployment claims for up to four months. That is how people are getting an amount equivalent to their normal rate.

  16. The reason a large number of Delta employees took unpaid leave is they were part-timers who work low level jobs for the travel benefits. They most likely were NOT the major bread-winner for a family as most of Delta’s pilots are. Without knowing the demographics at the other carriers it’s hard to compare apples to apples. Delta’s concern about the “optics” will not help them in their ongoing contract talks with it’s pilots.

  17. @Lucky

    That’s just not true. Delta didn’t “ask”. Where can you find anywhere that this was “optional” for all but Pilots and Flight Attendants? Ask implies consent. There wasn’t a “no” option.

    Delta is taking away 1-2 days of work per week from all but Pilots and Flight Attendants.
    If a ground worker works 8 hours per day, 5 days a week, and sometimes takes an extra shift, they could work anywhere from 40 hours to 48 hours/ week.

    Delta never said anywhere that it was 25% off 48 hours. They said employees would now only work between 3-4 days a week. Do you really think with the complete lack of flying that there will be any extra shifts for ground employees to pick up on those 3-4 days they’re allowed to work?
    Delta’s plan is a ~25% reduction off a normal 40 hour workweek. That’s obvious just in the wording of “only work 3-4 days/ week”.

    At American, Southwest, and United, full time employees are making the minimum 40 hours/week. They aren’t scheduled for more than 40 hours, true. But, they aren’t making 75% * 40 hours/week. It’s not the net-net same thing at other airlines as it impacts poorer employees. It’s only Delta.

    At a minimum, the average Delta employee that only worked the normal 40 hours a week is now only allowed to work 75% of their normal 40 hours, significantly worse off than an American, Southwest, or United ground employee.

    The end result is very different.

  18. @Kevin M- he actually said just that- “Delta’s pilots are one of only two work groups at the company that are unionized (the other group is flight dispatchers)”.

  19. I’m a Delta FA based in LAX. I wouldn’t necessarily describe my fellow flight attendants as “part timers” or “not the bread winners” of their household. Certainly if not the “bread winner” they heavily contribute to the financial situations of their respective households. Voluntary unpaid leaves for the month of April were offered to us on March 13th shortly after ED optimistically stated there would be a 40% reduction in flying(which has gone up to 80% as of now). At the time, 7000 flight attendants took the unpaid leave, more than any other work group. The number is now higher. This was done before any of us knew we would qualify for unemployment as this leave was voluntary. Obviously, people took this leave because we were able to make it work with our individual financial situations but also in an effort to help our company out as much as possible. Things have drastically changed since then but I do think this speaks directly to our “team player” culture at Delta. I think most of us understand that management is trying to financially position us in a way that we can come out of this mess. We all know this is going to be hard on everyone but for the company to survive this and be successful in the future we have to all do what we can. Going forward we are being offered longer leaves and split lines. I also want to make a point that most LAX flight attendants fly between 85-100 hours a month which is not insignificant. The cost of living in socal is just too high. So going on unemployment for those FA’s who are at the top of the payscale(working over 12 years and currently almost 60% of my base) is quite a pay cut as well.

    I know things are different with the pilots. They can’t easily switch from airplane to airplane and the training and time that it would take for them to do that is not insignificant. That comes into play with most senior pilots flying widebody planes and with international flying almost at a complete standstill it’s not like the company can just throw them on a 737. In the long run it may be better for the company to offer them some kind of paid leave. Personally, I don’t find 20% reduction in guaranteed flight hours unreasonable because I would assume they’ll get paid that whether they fly or not so in essence for most pilots that would be a paid leave without calling it “paid leave” since the flying isn’t there but I admit I don’t really know whats going on with their situation as it’s completely different from mine. I think most rational people can understand that the pilot situation is different from everyone else’s in the company.

    As for ground employees, they are offered the same unpaid leaves as flight attendants with the same benefits. For employees not taking a leave, they were told that their work schedules would be reduced by 25%. Ground employees who take the leave will be offered their full work schedule when they return from leave. I can’t see how any airline can offer their full time ground employees a full work schedule if they don’t get enough of them to take voluntary leaves when flight capacity is reduced by 60-80% depending on the airline. Financially that just seems untenable. I mean the work just isn’t there……

    Anyway my point was that no company is perfect and we certainly have our problems but overall the culture at Delta is one of being a “team player” and not so adversarial between the employees and corporate management as it seems to be at other companies.

  20. One major point in the timeline was left out of the article… Delta and DALPA were actually the first of the big three airlines to reach an agreement on partial pay for staying home, known at Delta as Special Incentive Lines (SILs). DALPA agreed to delay their monthly bidding timeline for April schedules in exchange for SILs paid at, IIRC, 55 hours/month.

    At the last minute, after agreeing to offer SILs as a remedy for not meeting their contractual obligations for the bidding timeline, Delta announced that they would not award any SILs after all. After reneging on their agreement with DALPA, the company seems surprised that the pilots are less willing to agree to other concessions.

  21. Say what you want I work for Delta I see it this way if we all don’t do our part for the company stay afloat everyone is without a job when this is over. I took LOA with out even considering that unemployment benefits I might get. And to say that we all did for we make more on unemployment that’s not true. I can make more money working a full shift possibly twice the amount unemployment pays. I believe in the company that will keep my job and willing to make the sacrifices necessary for our company. If where you guys that speek so negative about the company I work for is check the facts first and look at it the way I see it I could get pay cut or I can get some time off and once we come back I’ll be back toy full pay perty quick versus the pay cut it would take for ever to make what I make know. If I can do it the pilots can do it to. Everyone say the pilots would sacrifice but we the ground employee’s sacrificed for the pilots to take their big chunk when it was time for profit sharing No body said anything about that right. Pilots claim with out them the airline would not work but without all of us they would not be employed we get everything done for them we load ,we fix, and we fix equipment others need to get that flight on its way. So back to it we should all make a sacrifice!…. PS sorry I’m not the best write but I can do may things other can’t!… Stay safe folks.

  22. Pilots didn’t “take a big chunk of profit sharing”, we were paid by the company their contractual obligations based on earnings triggers. Quite frankly the ONLY reason any other employee group receives profit sharing is because Delta didn’t like the optics of just paying the pilots (what we were contractually due)…so although we pay union dues, we do so on behalf of most of the other employee groups.
    To think that the pilots aren’t “team players” is a bold-faced lie by management…we agreed to let the company re-run our April schedule and saved them almost 100 million based on that alone. We’ve offered similar solutions that our peers at other airlines are receiving… we’ve even had the company agree only to go back on their word. Bad financial planning (buy backs) isn’t an excuse to guilt any employee group to take an unpaid leave.
    It’s disingenuous for the company to parade the 27,000 employees taking unpaid leave as a reason for the pilots to fall in line….those employees are collecting unemployment amongst other benefits and for a lot of them, that makes them “whole”.
    In short, what are the pilots asking for? Exactly what their pilot peers are receiving elsewhere. The reason we’re not getting it? Management is fearful of other employee groups on property unionizing.

  23. Let us also not forget the payroll grants the government is offering to keep employees on at full pay. The company choosing to NOT use them is only doing so out of concern for the shareholders…not the employees; pilots, ground or otherwise.

  24. “Beyond that, I think it’s also because Delta takes more of a “team player” approach to running their business compared to other airlines, and it doesn’t seem fair when everyone is making a big sacrifice, except one work group.”

    Especially when that one work group makes waaaayyyyy more than most of the others.

  25. Let us not forget the pilots are just glorified bus drivers. Meanwhile the engineers that actually know how to design and repair the systems that they operate were team players and willingly accepted LOAs.

  26. Two things:

    1. There are many work groups where individuals can make money doing something else other than Delta. They could take the leave, keep the flight benefits and get a job elsewhere doing anything else. Pilots can’t just find a job that pays the same. All our other options are flying, and all of those jobs are dried up. Most pilots I know, including myself are the only source of income for their entire family. That’s not easy to replace.
    2. Pilots have long memories, and they remember all the times they “sacrificed for the good of the company”. Pay cuts, furloughs, contract concessions, retirement wiped away…. And they know that the company will never repay their sacrifice unless it’s in writing. Profit sharing isn’t Delta’s generosity, it’s contractual. They negotiated it, and must deliver it. The pilots here are trying to make sure they don’t get screwed down the line.

    Note: Delta is burning goodwill with it’s pilot group by offering SIL’s to get a LOA signed, then promptly revoking them because it was convenient. They had the same deal as AA and UAL, but Delta balked out.

  27. Bottom line: All of those other employee groups that are not unionized have had multiple opportunities over the years to vote and become part of a union. And they all voted that down! Now that the current downturn has forced Delta to make cuts, these employee groups have no voice to prevent unilateral cuts in pay. The pilots, on the other hand, have a negotiated contract in place that allows for negotiations with the company, and prevents the company from unilaterally dictating involuntary pay cuts. And that is the value of voting for a strong union!

  28. The ignorance and jealousy displayed in these comments are ridiculous.
    1) The only reason all the employees have any profit-sharing is because the pilots negotiated it back before bankruptcy when their pay, benefits, work rules and retirement were being destroyed. Management threw that as a bone to the pilots not thinking they would ever have to pay that much. To keep the ‘optics” (meaning they don’t want any other group unionizing), management extended the profit sharing to all employees. Management has been trying (with some success) to reduce profit sharing for years now that they had to pay out large amounts. They tried to take most of it away from the non-union employees but the pilots voted it down and the company (after much blowback from the other employees), had to reinstate it. Now management celebrates the profit sharing as if they are so benevolent even though they tried to get rid of most of it. Hypocrites….
    2. The pilot’s union came to the company immediately after the international shutdown to offer help. Company and union came to an agreement to re-bid the April bid and offer reduced pay incentive lines. April re-bid saved $100+ million and incentive lines would have saved $10’s millions each month. In the meantime, company offered unpaid leave to non-union employees (some were coerced to take). Many took them. Now, because of the optics, company reneged on their agreement with the pilots and demanded a 20% pay cut. Union offer of the reduced paid incentive lines and an early retirement program would save company more money. Company walks away. Why? Because they don’t want to pilots to be seen as getting a better deal than non-union employees. So because of optics, the company is foregoing $100’s millions of concessions from pilots. It’s obvious that the company is more interested in optics than saving money. So obviously they don’t need the money. 2 points here: first, unpaid leave has been offered to the pilots and some of them took it. So yes, pilots are participating. Second, the demographics of those taking the unpaid leave is vastly different than the pilots. Almost all the pilots are the sole financial providers of their families while many of the other employees are not. Many are part-timers. Plus, at their pay, many of these employees will be fully compensated on unemployment and many will get a pay raise. It’s simple math. For those who took leave out of pure loyalty to Delta, good for them, but you are being naive. This is a revenue problem, not a payroll problem. Payroll is now completely being covered until the end of Sept due to government grants, so no need for pay cuts, etc. Company needs money to cover other costs which are available to them in private and government loans.
    3. There is no trust in Delta’s management team. Yes, some employees believe their rhetoric and drink the Kool-aid, but here are some facts. After raping the pilots in bankruptcy in 2006-2007, and stealing their pensions, gutting work rules and enacting nearly 50% pay cuts, and after Delta making insanely record profits for the past 8 years ($5 billion plus most years), the pilots pay is still less (with inflation) than 15 years ago. Management has enforced draconian work rules every chance they have gotten, gutted insurance and have been unwilling to negotiate in good faith a new pilot contract over the past year. So what has happened to the profits? Much of it (over $10 billion) has been wasted in stock buybacks that have enriched the shareholders (a little) and management (a lot). Pilots have seen this song and dance before and are not going to fall for it again. Pitting the rest of the employee groups against the pilots has been a sad move by management for the past 30 years and the pilots aren’t going to be swayed by this manipulation.
    In the end, if the other employee groups don’t like the pilots being able to stick up for themselves, then unionize. Sorry you don’t like the optics, but the pilots pay for representation to protect their interests against a greedy and self-serving management team. It’s time like these that having a union pays. The pilots have always done what is best for Delta but they will not be taken advantage of, lied to, and manipulated by a dishonest management team.

  29. @ Stan: a certain employee group at Delta is beginning to conjure up memories of Eastern Airlines. “We’re more important than the rest of the peasants here.” “Without us, the rest if you unskilled nitwits wouldn’t receive a dime of profit share.” “You wouldn’t even have your low paying, menial tasks if it wasn’t for for us. So, get down on your knees and kiss our feet!”
    No wonder history repeats itself so often.

  30. So far all I’ve heard is Pilots Bad, Everyone Else good….. United and AA Bad…. Delta Good….. Really??? The honest to God truth is there is not a pilot working for the Big 3 that qualify’s for ANY form of Government Help….. That includes unemployment! Leave does not qualify you for Unemployment as many of you are about to find out! Our incomes are to high to get 1-penny of stimulus checks….. our kids don’t get 1 penny of financial aid in college…. normal expenses continue for us just like everyone else…. the government is sending airlines money to pay EVERY EMPLOYEE at their minimum contract pay or pay rate for 4 months…. management shouldn’t be beating any employee group down to keep money and use for other than its intended use…. I’m not a Democrat…. but thank God a Democrat attached September 30th restriction time the stimulus or we would all be home with nothing…..Management will always deal in $$$$$ as touchy feely as they get in good time….. employees are only as good as the $$$ they produce….. try not to forget that!

  31. @Stan Your comments are spot on. Thanks for your setting the record straight and getting the truth out here.

  32. Delta’s pilot union went to Delta management twice with concerns about COVID and getting ahead of it. Management said no thanks. They soon realized they would need help and went to the union asking for relief. DALPA saved Delta over 80 million by reducing pay to the pilots for their April schedule. They also negotiated sick leave rules for COVID and agreed upon partially paid leaves that pilots at UA and AA currently have. The company took the pilot pay cut for April and then decided the paid leaves wouldn’t look good so canceled them. Compared to 2019, the pilots schedules are already down over 20%, the company wants to take it down another 20-40%. This would be a 40-60% pay cut for all pilots instead of implementing the agreed upon paid leaves that other airlines have. The union presented the company with detailed numbers showing that the voluntary paid leaves would save the company as much, if not more, than the involuntary reduction in hours to all pilots. DALPA also presented additional ideas such as early retirement incentives (again AA and UA have done these) but management refuses to do anything that might provide bad optics. The pilots still (after a decade of record profits) have not recovered from the concessions they gave up after 9/11 and BK. They remember what they gave up and after the company reneged on the voluntary paid leaves, they are aware that the company’s primary focus is its optics.
    Bottom line is that the pilot group was the first to offer assistance to Delta and Delta took those concessions and then canceled the rest of their agreements. At the end of April, pilots at Delta will be displaced to different bases and onto smaller aircraft. This combined with the 20%+ pay cut they’ve already taken and the loss of profit sharing means pilots at delta are already facing 30-60% pay cuts. If you put the entire pilot group on unpaid leave, the company would stay in business two additional days. Concessions by the employees will not save Delta. To say the pilot group isn’t doing their share is to be ignorant of the facts.

  33. To be clear about sacrifices:
    The Pilots ARE taking a pay cut by the reduced ALV flight hours every single month.
    And to be clear, the Delta pilots have dedicated their entire lives to flying the passengers safely around the world and have sacrificed as much or more than anyone at Delta .
    Of those who have a short memory or unfamiliar with the history of Delta, the pilots sacrificed their pension ( in addition to drastic pay cuts,duty rigs,medical benefits,multiple quality of life issues etc.,etc ) to save the company during the 2006 bankruptcy negotiations with the assumption that management was going to fairly reinstate same or all these give backs and sacrifices after Delta’s return to record profitability.
    However, after emerging from bankruptcy in 2007, all the other Delta employees pension’s were reinstated (and now fully funded) all, except for the pilots.
    Even with record profits,stock buy backs,management stock and pay bonuses and the fully funded employee pension, the pilots still have no pension.
    How is that not a sacrifice and how is that fair to the pilots ?
    In addition, Pilots, due to the unique job skills,professional standards and medical requirements are forced to retire at age 65. If anyone should have a pension, it should be the ones that are forced to retire ( not by choice or any fault of theirs) but rather only due to their unique job standards,proficiency,testing and other requirements,including medical,etc.
    Any other airline employee can work as long as they want or need to?

    Bottom line is that everyone at all airlines and elsewhere are making sacrifices and struggling with this unprecedented crisis. But to say the Delta pilots are not team players is completely false and ignorant of the facts and actual history and reasons for Delta’s quick and profitable rebound and success after bankruptcy.

  34. This is an opinion piece by an airline passenger with no historical or even recent in depth understanding of how and why these inter-relationships (within each airline) exist.
    It is superficial and lacks any valid background information as to why employees at any specific airline are where they are.
    As for the posters here; many of you have no clue what you are talking about.
    If you are not willing to (carefully) read and debate the issues with Pablo then you are nothing more than a blowhard.
    One step below the author of this article.

  35. OK, well now I have to add that in addition to Pablo we have jb and Dave Dent that have a deeper understanding of the company (and the industry).

  36. All the Negativity, Between the work groups is EXACTLY what management wants. You guys are putty in their hands … Thats why CEOs get payed so much.. Look what they can do.(just read the comments). Bob Crandal was a Genius at that at AA back in the day… We will see what Scott Kirby does at UAL with this whole deal…Fangs haven’t come out there yet… This couldnt be a worse time for work groups to start inner fighting with each other… You Delta Folks have a good airline , dont let management talk u into clawing each others eyes out during this ugly time and wreck it.. Management has golden Parachutes, YOU DONT..

  37. Delta pilots get 16percent in their 401k from delta without putting in a dime. The 25% hours reduction was NOT a choice for ground employees. I thought the CARES act money was to keep employees at full pay??

  38. The NON -unionized workgroups at Delta took the leave because they are brainwashed, and truly fear losing their jobs with no recourse in October. And yes, many will be paid more on unemployment. Again, NON-union and zero leverage. You can also thank the pilots for NEGOTIATING profit sharing for all.

  39. Delta and the pilots did make a deal for a voluntary paid leave program…Delta management unilaterally decided not to honor that agreement.

  40. United pilots have not accepted reduced pay. They have worked out a deal for voluntary surplus lines , which very few pilots are, in fact, taking. So many people on this forum have no clue what they are talking about. Very inaccurate information.

  41. Really gross that other Delta employees are sacrificing to subsidize Delta pilot’s salaries. I stand with the FAs and gate agents who have all down their parts to save Delta. Disgusting that pilots will not do the same and in the end could hurt Delta and thousands of employees for years. So gross to see the unions at airlines sacrifice their junior employees just because they have less years. Unions do great work with pay at times, but people should not get furloughed in the future only based on years. Some of the most junior people provide the best service and care!!

  42. I can already call it here… 10/01/2020 will be the day that thousands up thousands of airline workers will get pink slips! My self included most likely.

  43. Also keep in mind that the reason so many DL employees can afford a leave at this time is due to the fact that most DL employees just got a $12K + profit sharing about a month ago so most of these people can afford it vs unlike other airlines!

  44. I do not feel sorry for any airline pilot working for a major airline. You all have 401k matching at higher levels than every other employee! Don’t feel sorry for you at all!

  45. I am a DL FA and just signed up for that unpaid Leave. I like many others didn’t do this because of any TeamSpirit fussy feeling of the moment but because it makes financial sense. We, unlike unionized Flight Crews, do not have guaranteed base pay/hours. So for us no matter prior flight hours that means no hours flown/no pay. Since there is only about 5% of flying right now that leaves unemployment as the lesser pay-cut. If we had a guarantee we’d be right there with the Pilots negotiating believe me.

  46. I, myself, took the “voluntary” leave at Delta because for one I care about my health and my family’s health. Why on earth would I subject myself to people on the airplane who flying with being infected with the virus? The worst environment to be in in a pandemic and not have protective equipment. Seriously, think about it! Secondly, no union no pay. At first DL said in order to get paid for all your trips that are canceled you will have two options. One, be on call 24/7 for the days you were suppose to work or get a priority pick up later. Well we all know there are no trips. So I beg the difference. It’s not company loyalty or team playing. It’s about survival. And when government kicked in more money for unemployment pay that made all the difference in the world for those that were considering the leave. I would say about 80% of the “voluntary” leaves are from the Flight Attendant group. The company is not looking out for customers or employees whatsoever. They are not giving refunds cause they don’t have the cash. Just ask Warren Buffet why he sold all of his DL stock.

  47. @vbscript2 @Cap’n Bo…If you are Delta employees you filled out the wrong application when you applied to work for Delta..


  48. From distributing 1.6 billion on Feb 14th to begging for government handouts in April, quite the turnaround. You have to ask, if I’m expected to have 6 months cash expenses on hand as head of a household, how on earth can an airline not have more than 6 months cash on hand for such emergencies? The decision to maintain such low cash reserves was a business decision either made by fools, or made in the expectation that in a jam, Congress would step in. I think they should have to burn through a few billion before they start begging, If they go bankrupt, someone else will buy their airplanes and create a new airline company

  49. are you angry. It seems like you filled out the wrong job application when you started your airline career. You have no idea the amount of discipline and dedication it takes to become an airline pilot. If the pilots worked for FREE it would extend the airline’s liquidity for 4 days…this is not our first rodeo with bankruptcy.

  50. @Sparky riiiight, like the zero to hero program at ATP that takes less than a year?. It’s absurd how can sit here to tell me that an airline will only have enough cash for four days of pilots work for free, first I call B.S giving that it takes over 2.6b a year to maintain pilot groups at major legacy airlines. Second; no one here is suggesting you work for free, though, pushing buttons and greeting passengers isn’t a skill. The fact that pilots are the highest paid and yet not taking any concession during these unprecedented times is very low if you ask me. How is it fair for the rest of the workforce groups?. And my job application at an airline is strictly based on family values and marriage commitment, something you pilots know nothing about.

  51. @jar

    If being a pilot so easy and the pay is better why don’t you be a pilot? Maybe it’s not so easy?

Leave a Reply

If you'd like to participate in the discussion, please adhere to our commenting guidelines. Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *