A United Airlines Premier 1K member named Terence sent me an email about a denied boarding situation he faced on a recent itinerary, which I think makes for an interesting story (he has also written about it on FlyerTalk). I can see how something like this can happen, though what’s most disappointing is how the airline is basically denying this happened…
In this post:
United passenger with confirmed seat denied boarding
On June 1, 2024, Terence was scheduled to fly on United from Tokyo (NRT) to Houston (IAH) to New York (LGA). Due to bad weather in Houston, the long haul flight ended up diverting to San Antonio (SAT) to refuel.
While the Houston to New York flight was initially supposed to depart at 4:20PM, he wouldn’t be able to make that, and while on the ground in San Antonio, he noticed that he was automatically rebooked on another flight at 6:35PM. Kudos to United… so far!
After landing in Houston and clearing immigration, Terence headed to the United Polaris Lounge at around 5:50PM. The app wouldn’t let him check-in (which is common during irregular operations), so he immediately went to see an agent in the lounge.
The agent in the lounge issued him a boarding pass for the flight, but without a seat assignment. It’s worth emphasizing that this was a confirmed boarding pass, and not a standby boarding pass (standby boarding passes are clearly marked as such), and the agent also confirmed that.
He then arrived at the gate 20 minutes before departure, but was informed by the gate agent that he was never booked on the flight, that it was full, and that he was only on standby.
He was then rebooked on a flight the next day. He wasn’t offered any hotel accommodation or involuntary denied boarding compensation.
Executive customer care brushes off Premier 1K
Once back at home, Terence sent an email to the CEO’s office. 24 hours later, he received a response from an “executive solutions manager,” who wrote the following:
We expect all United employees to always be friendly, professional and be knowledgeable about excepted documentation. Based on your comments, we did not meet expectations. I appreciate you bringing this to our attention. Although I can’t provide specific details about the internal investigation, please know we take these concerns very seriously.
I am sorry we did not get you to your destination ontime.
I can certainly understand your disappointment, and I’m going to share your comments with the appropriate teams. We’ll use your feedback to review our procedures with your point of view in mind.
On behalf of United, we thank you for reaching out to us and hope to see you on board again soon.
As you can see, the representative didn’t in any way address the passenger’s concerns.
My take on this strange situation
I can totally understand Terence’s frustration, and how this situation is leaving a bad taste in his mouth. First he was involuntarily denied boarding, and then United basically denied that this even happened. On top of that, he’s a Premier 1K member, and was traveling in business class.
We can only speculate as to how he had a confirmed boarding pass for the flight, but was then told by the gate agent that he was never on the flight. Was there some issue with the ticket being reissued? Did the agents remove him from the flight, assuming he wouldn’t make it?
Airline operations can be complicated, and I’m sure it was a chaotic day in Houston, given the weather. I don’t think there was any ill will here. However, when mistakes happen, airlines should take accountability and provide decent service.
So first he had an awful experience at the airport where gate agents denied the reality. That was strike one. Then when he brought this to the attention of what’s supposed to be the best customer service at the airline, he received a generic response dismissing his concerns. Really that’s the most disappointing part of this. United messed up in the first place, and then failed with the service recovery.
With that in mind, I have a couple more thoughts, both regarding what I would have done differently, and what I would do now. If I were in Terence’s situation, I would have gone back to the United Polaris Lounge to try to see the same agent who helped me previously. At a minimum, I’d ask the agent to notate my record regarding what happened, so that there’s a “trail.” But he wouldn’t have been unreasonable to also ask for hotel accommodation and denied boarding compensation on the spot, in line with regulations.
At this point, I think Terence’s best course of action is filing a consumer complaint with the Department of Transportation (DOT). He has basically already gone up the totem pole when it comes to customer service at the airline, with no success. The government route is now the best option. It might not be a fast process, but it’s the most likely to yield results.
Bottom line
A United Premier 1K member traveling in business class is understandably frustrated after he was involuntarily denied boarding, only for both gate agents and customer service to deny it ever happened. While it was a messy day of irregular operations, that doesn’t excuse this level of service, and I hope he gets the resolution he deserves.
What do you make of this United denied boarding situation?
UA 1k here - his mistake was going to the lounge. He should’ve gone straight to the gate and gotten the gate agent to issue a boarding pass with a seat assignment on it.
If you show up 5 minutes before doors close for a flight during heavy IROPs and no confirmed seat assignment, chances are *very* high the gate agent gave your seat to someone else. They’re not supposed to, but they do.
UA should definitely provide him denied boarding compensation though.
This is why you guys need something similar to EU261 regs to force the airlines to properly look after the customer.
UA flies nonstop from NRT to EWR. Perhaps EWR is not as convenient to this particular traveler's final destination as LGA on this day (e.g., perhaps the traveler's car was parked at LGA or the traveler wished to avoid the inevitalble traffic from EWR to Long Island).
For unexplained reasons, the traveler chose a routing from NRT with a stop in IAH, accepting the known risks of potential disruption when booking connecting flights.
Well I am 1K and also got similar situation. My flight from Orange Country to San Francisco got cancelled and United change my reservation automatically next day without any compensation or hotel due to the cancelation wasn't because of United operation. My solution was cancel United flight and immediately book Delta flight was cheaper and better. I had too many bad experiences last year and this year (downgrade my business class to Economy class on...
Well I am 1K and also got similar situation. My flight from Orange Country to San Francisco got cancelled and United change my reservation automatically next day without any compensation or hotel due to the cancelation wasn't because of United operation. My solution was cancel United flight and immediately book Delta flight was cheaper and better. I had too many bad experiences last year and this year (downgrade my business class to Economy class on the day of travel for wedding anniversary, Downgrade confirmed upgraded seat due to system error but refuding PlusPoints on a few days before expiry date without extending the expiry dates so making it invalid, changing my Europe trip by United operation reason but putting me Business class waitinglist on wrong flight and saying only option for me to fix is to cancel the flight and rebook, changing Future credit expiry dates 6 months earlier so making them invalid, etc) I cancelled all my United flights and rebooked them with American .
united airlines does not respect customers. did you not understand that type of business? one solution is DESTROY this airline
While the situation was not handled well by United, I can't help but put some blame on the traveler himself. If you have a boarding pass without a seat number assigned, you would want to be at the gate and talk to the gate agent before boarding starts.
Any seasoned traveler should know its a red flag when you are not assigned a seat. That's standby 101
It's not clear what you are asserting but if it's that a passenger without an assigned seat is in a standby situation ie not guaranteed transport, that's incorrect.
I am a 1K and had a similar situation in San Diego in May. United went out of their way to help me and offered me a hotel and 90$ in food vouchers.
What race was this passenger. Racial bias is everywhere.
This description is likely a mischaracterization of what happened.
When he was “booked” on the flight, he may or may not have been confirmed on the flight. Let’s assume for the moment that he was confirmed on the flight.
If you don’t have a seat assignment when checked in for the flight, you automatically go on the standby list.
It is not unusual that these flights are overbooked and in this case and...
This description is likely a mischaracterization of what happened.
When he was “booked” on the flight, he may or may not have been confirmed on the flight. Let’s assume for the moment that he was confirmed on the flight.
If you don’t have a seat assignment when checked in for the flight, you automatically go on the standby list.
It is not unusual that these flights are overbooked and in this case and under these circumstances, he would have been treated as a denied boarding customer and compensated as such.
What I suspect happened was that he was waitlisted for the flight and this was either not clearly communicated or the passenger attempted to get around that by checking in at the lounge. I believe the latter is the case.
We don’t know what he was actually told in the lounge, so it’s hard to know the facts. If the lounge agent told him to get his seat assignment at the gate (also likely), it would not be a surprise to conclude that there weren’t enough seats on the flight and there were UGS passengers on the list who would have been cleared first.
In that set of circumstances, UA would not be responsible for denied boarding, since he never had a confirmed reservation on the flight.
We aren’t getting the whole story.
You wrote "If you don’t have a seat assignment when checked in for the flight, you automatically go on the standby list."
This is simply not correct. Frankly I'm astounded how many posters have said this is case and done so with such certainty given even a brief reading of the contract a passenger has with the airline would show it's wrong.
People, read and understand what you are agreeing to when you buy an airline ticket.
For those saying the passenger didn’t have enough time to visit the lounge and then get to the gate. The boarding pass shows gate E17. The Polaris lounge is by gate E12. It’s a 2 minute walk at most from the lounge to the gate.
That’s passed Checkin time. If they made it to the lounge at 550pm and the flight was 635pm ; let’s assume the plane landed at 535pm or sooner and they turned on their phone as soon as possible to see on the app they had to check in. I just don’t understand the unnecessary stop at the lounge instead of going to the gate asap .
That sucks sounds like the gate agent was...
That’s passed Checkin time. If they made it to the lounge at 550pm and the flight was 635pm ; let’s assume the plane landed at 535pm or sooner and they turned on their phone as soon as possible to see on the app they had to check in. I just don’t understand the unnecessary stop at the lounge instead of going to the gate asap .
That sucks sounds like the gate agent was a jerk and op had to spend the night at hotel. Did they use a credit card with travel coverage ? Sorry that happened but not worth getting upset over I’d just move on.
And the answer is...
As a UA Million Miler and formerly a 1K for nearly two decades (got off the status "hamster wheel" as I could no longer justify the cost, $24K, for the 1K status), I think that I know what happened here.
Looking at the message that the UA flyer, "Terence", got from UA, I strongly suspect that they received an automated response. The usual giveaway about such responses is that they contain...
And the answer is...
As a UA Million Miler and formerly a 1K for nearly two decades (got off the status "hamster wheel" as I could no longer justify the cost, $24K, for the 1K status), I think that I know what happened here.
Looking at the message that the UA flyer, "Terence", got from UA, I strongly suspect that they received an automated response. The usual giveaway about such responses is that they contain nothing specific about the complaint, like, "your IAH-LGA flight". Terence likely filled out a customer "satisfaction" or "feedback" survey/form about the IAH-LGA trip. They may even have emailed 1K or "corporate" support. In any of those cases, an AI quite likely "read" the complaint and then issued a generic response that simply acknowledged the problem and promised to do better in the future. The other kind of generic email, which would contain some kind of compensation (e.g., miles), is issued when the airline is well aware of a problem or "irregular operation" (IROP) with a specific flight. Though "Terence" had a problem with a prior flight, there was nothing wrong with the IAH-LGA flight for which they were denied boarding. Therefore, as far as UA (or the AI) was concerned, there was no reason to take seriously one of several thousand complaints like it that they get regularly.
Rather than taking their case to the USDOT, Terence needs to speak with or get the attention of a human being at UA (e.g., at 1K desk) or send a letter by snail mail directly to UA corporate. The case is so solid that Terence would get a speedy resolution if they get a human being at UA to hear it. Someone suggested contacting Christopher Elliot. That is a great idea because the case is such a slam dunk that publicizing it, e.g., in the Washington Post for which Elliott often writes, would immediately get UA's attention and get them to do the right thing.
Here's a portion from the delta contract - as an example - so all the pretend lawyers on here can stop their nonsense. I am sure United's is not much different.
"Delta will exercise reasonable efforts to transport you and your baggage from your origin to your destination with reasonable dispatch, but published schedules, flight times, aircraft types, seat assignments, and similar details reflected in the ticket or Delta’s published schedules are not guaranteed and...
Here's a portion from the delta contract - as an example - so all the pretend lawyers on here can stop their nonsense. I am sure United's is not much different.
"Delta will exercise reasonable efforts to transport you and your baggage from your origin to your destination with reasonable dispatch, but published schedules, flight times, aircraft types, seat assignments, and similar details reflected in the ticket or Delta’s published schedules are not guaranteed and form no part of this contract. Delta may substitute alternate Carriers or aircraft, change its schedules, delay or cancel flights, change seat assignments, and alter or omit stopping places shown on the ticket as required by its operations in Delta’s sole discretion. Delta’s sole liability in the event of such changes is set forth in Rule 22, Go to footer note. Delta is not responsible or liable for making connections, failing to operate any flight according to schedule, changing the schedule or any flight, changing seat assignments or aircraft types, or revising the routings by which Delta carries the passenger from the ticketed origin to destination."
It only guarantees transport from X to Y. nothing else.
It particularly doesn't matter if you fly 100 times a year or once every 10 years. "Status" with an airline is meaningless.
He got to wherever he was meant to go. United fulfilled its end of the contract.
all of the major US airlines except for a few ULCCs have committed to the DOT that they will offer amenities for disruptions and those commitments are above the contract of carriage.
The issue, again, is that the customer showed up at the gate 20 minutes before departure without a seat assignment. Whether he was confirmed or not is far less significant than the timeframe before flight. Even US airline that has a standby...
all of the major US airlines except for a few ULCCs have committed to the DOT that they will offer amenities for disruptions and those commitments are above the contract of carriage.
The issue, again, is that the customer showed up at the gate 20 minutes before departure without a seat assignment. Whether he was confirmed or not is far less significant than the timeframe before flight. Even US airline that has a standby system is processing standby and unseated passengers by 20 minutes before departure if not before.
It is very likely that the gate agent paged the passenger, he wasn't there, the agent moved on, and when the passenger showed up, the agent simply wasn't going to go onboard to move passengers even if the international passenger should have been cleared first.
If he knew he was standby, he probably could have watched it all on the UA app; DL does the same thing. but he would only watch the UA app if he knew he was standby.
The airline fared to communicate to him but the passenger was too cavalier for the situation he was in.
The problem, Tim here is that the gate agent said that the passenger was never confirmed on the flight in the first place. I see what you mean with the 20 minute lead time (and I agree - no airline would cut it that close and leave seats unassigned if passengers are waiting) but something didn't sound right in the explanation given by the agent. Except if it was massaged and not super well represented in the communications.
They clear standbys at 30 mins before departure, so if he showed up with less time than that, his would have been seat was given away
Why quote from Delta's CoC's when it's United's that goveren?
Also you aren't quoting the appropriate section. What you should be looking at is the part that describes the airline's obligations to a passenger holding a confirmed reservation.
It's important when trying to understand what an agreement requires of each party is to read and understand the entire agreeement and applicable law.. If you had done that you would see that passengers holding a confirmed...
Why quote from Delta's CoC's when it's United's that goveren?
Also you aren't quoting the appropriate section. What you should be looking at is the part that describes the airline's obligations to a passenger holding a confirmed reservation.
It's important when trying to understand what an agreement requires of each party is to read and understand the entire agreeement and applicable law.. If you had done that you would see that passengers holding a confirmed reservation who are not transported on the flight for which they have a reservation are entitled to compensation.
Some of us have extensive experience with these matters including prevailing in court when airlines fail to live up to their obligations under the contract they have with a passenger.
It doesn't sound like oversales. Were standby passengers boarded? Also, most carriers outline their liability in the event of a flight disruption in their general conditions of carriage. So, the offer of hotel accommodations is usually made when the ticket is purchased. I can't imagine a carrier as big as United would miss this. Carriers aren't under any statutory requirement to remind passengers of what has already been outlined in the contract when a disruption...
It doesn't sound like oversales. Were standby passengers boarded? Also, most carriers outline their liability in the event of a flight disruption in their general conditions of carriage. So, the offer of hotel accommodations is usually made when the ticket is purchased. I can't imagine a carrier as big as United would miss this. Carriers aren't under any statutory requirement to remind passengers of what has already been outlined in the contract when a disruption actually happens.
His only problem was that he traveled United from Tokyo to Houston. What, ANA wasn't an option? It's available to both Houston and NYC.
Also being 1K, I had a situation with United and contacted their president, Mr. hart. Within 24 hours there was a response from an Executive solutions manager which simply said we will address it in one or two weeks. After 16 days, I sent another email which prompted a phone call four days later. Nothing was done to assist or remedy the situation. I doubt anything will be done.
I had a similar UA experience; I emailed
both the 1K and customer care emails, and haven’t gotten any answer re a legitimate issue on a EWR- FCO flight. If this is how they respond (or don’t respond) to a premium loyal client, I consider myself a free agent by the end of 2024.
I'm sure they will be so sad to see you go. United 1K is like being in the smart section of special ed.
I’m in the same boat. UAs Gate Agents have me as a free agent by the end of the year. EWR gate agent intentionally caused 30 min of havoc to the point I had to leave security to get in-person assistance and UA was quite flippant about it.
AA see you soon!
no he didn't have a confirmed reservation. A reservation is only confirmed once a ticket issued. There's no ticket number in the bp. Probably they booked this protection flight yet never reissued the ticket. I have no idea what the ATB card he was given is supposed to be, but whose fault is that? Hint: not Mr 1K. When I worked for UAL 40 years ago I was unsure about what amenity to grant and...
no he didn't have a confirmed reservation. A reservation is only confirmed once a ticket issued. There's no ticket number in the bp. Probably they booked this protection flight yet never reissued the ticket. I have no idea what the ATB card he was given is supposed to be, but whose fault is that? Hint: not Mr 1K. When I worked for UAL 40 years ago I was unsure about what amenity to grant and a senior agent told me that with premier level status just make him happy. That was 40 years ago; now what You get are cut-and-paste form emails from clerks who just want their shift to end so they can home to their video games .
I'm not understanding how you can be so certain the passenger didn't have a confirmed reservation.
First of all it's not true that a reservation is confirmed only once a ticket has been issued. It depends on the carrier and for many, if not most having a confirmed reservation is sufficient. Checking UA's CoCs they says "A reservation for space on a given flight of UA is valid when the availability and allocation of...
I'm not understanding how you can be so certain the passenger didn't have a confirmed reservation.
First of all it's not true that a reservation is confirmed only once a ticket has been issued. It depends on the carrier and for many, if not most having a confirmed reservation is sufficient. Checking UA's CoCs they says "A reservation for space on a given flight of UA is valid when the availability and allocation of such space is confirmed by UA or an authorized agent of UA and entered into the carrier’s reservations system."
Besides the passenger was ticketed. What we don't know if whether the segment he was not permitted to travel on showed confirmed or not in the reservation. What makes you believe that the lack of a ticket number on a boarding pass is proof that the segment wasn't showing "ok" in the reservation record?
Checking the photo if you look at the lower left of his BP there appears to be both his PNR and ticket number but they've been whited out.
This is all very simple. If the passenger had a confirmed reservation and they presented themselves at the gate prior to the cut off time as specified in the CoCs then they were entitled to be transported or are entitled to denied boarding compensation.
Not that I...
Checking the photo if you look at the lower left of his BP there appears to be both his PNR and ticket number but they've been whited out.
This is all very simple. If the passenger had a confirmed reservation and they presented themselves at the gate prior to the cut off time as specified in the CoCs then they were entitled to be transported or are entitled to denied boarding compensation.
Not that I recommend what the passenger did, but United should have either paid them or indicated why they believed no payment due.
This customer deserved better, much better from United, but this was not a situation of being involuntarily denied boarding. The passenger never had a confirmed seat and, given the circumstances, was never going to get on that flight anyway. Instead of giving him false hopes, the lounge agent should have told him the hard truth, booked him on next day's flight and given him hotel and meal vouchers.
This is incorrect. Not having a seat assignment is irrelevant. The only thing that matters is whether they had a confirmed reservation.
I'm surprised that so many posters are confused about this. Just read the Contract of Carriage. It's all spelled out clearly there.
It's also spelled out that they can deny boarding for any reason. Sorry, bur you're the confused one here.
"deny boarding for any reason"
So they can deny people for being black, white, or brown? The contract of carriage says any reason!
This is incorrect. For example an airline that denied boarding claiming, for example, that a passenger was drunk when they were not in order to avoid having to honor a confirmed resevation and avoid paying compensations would be guilty of operating in bad faith.
Again, one needs to read the entire agreement and operative law. Except in certain situations, such as when the government demands an airline provide an aircraft to them none of...
This is incorrect. For example an airline that denied boarding claiming, for example, that a passenger was drunk when they were not in order to avoid having to honor a confirmed resevation and avoid paying compensations would be guilty of operating in bad faith.
Again, one needs to read the entire agreement and operative law. Except in certain situations, such as when the government demands an airline provide an aircraft to them none of which seem to be the case here passengers holding a confirmed reservation who are not transported are entitled to compensation. This is settled law.
Assuming the passenger was holding a confirmed reservatin (but just didn't have a seat assignment) and they presented themselves at the gate when they were obligated to do so, they met their obligations under the contract with the airline. The airline's obligation is then to either transport the passenger in the class of service for which they are ticketed or to pay compensation.
That the airline hasn't done this isn't surprising but it only means the passenger has a legitimate claim for breach of contract against the airline.
ok, does not look good on united- but a high ranking elite not attaching a screenshot of the phone app showing confirmed and not looking up the seat map?
Who really cares about this story?
Businessman flies a lot. One time his flight got messed up. After his flight got messed up, he didn't get exactly what he wanted.
Boo Hoo. Cry me a river.
Show me more pics of International First Class please.
If you can afford or have the miles to fly First Class...then you should care about this passengers experience...
And you also cared enough to comment.
Such feeble minds...
I actually don't care about a guy that is able to fly so much on someone else's dime that he considers himself to have "status".
I also have actually read several contracts of carriage which clearly state there is no guarantee to seat you on one particular flight. You have a guarantee to a seat on a plane at some time.
The feeble mind belongs between your ears, my dear.
You are confusing the right to a given seat on an aircraft to the right to be transported on a seat in the class of service (ie coach, business or first class) on the flight for which you are holding a confirmed reservation.
You are correct that a passenger does not have a right to a certain seat (although they may when the airline charges an additional fee for a given seat) but they do...
You are confusing the right to a given seat on an aircraft to the right to be transported on a seat in the class of service (ie coach, business or first class) on the flight for which you are holding a confirmed reservation.
You are correct that a passenger does not have a right to a certain seat (although they may when the airline charges an additional fee for a given seat) but they do have a right to be transported on the flight they are booked on in a seat.
So there's the right to a given seat, vs the right to a seat. You are talking about the former and that's not the case with this passenger. They aren't complaining the were flown but not on the seat that they had reserved. They weren't flown at all on the flight for which they apparently had a confirmed reservation.
It's easy to confused the two but important to understand the difference.
Well it would be nice if the airline lived up to its contractual obligations. If they aren't and at a minimum they failed to provide any indication they had in their response then they are free to deny any one of us boarding for flights we have a confirmed reservation for.
You should probably read the full "contractual obligations" next time you buy an airline ticket. Nowhere does it say you have a guaranteed seat.
They can deny anyone for whatever reason.
Nice try, though
This is incorrect. A passenger holding a confirmed reservation has a right to be transported on the flight for which they hold the confirmed reservation in the class of service that they purchased or be paid compensation if the airline fails to do so. They don't have a right to a specific seat on the aircraft but it has to be in the class of service they were ticketed in.
I suggest reading each airliene's...
This is incorrect. A passenger holding a confirmed reservation has a right to be transported on the flight for which they hold the confirmed reservation in the class of service that they purchased or be paid compensation if the airline fails to do so. They don't have a right to a specific seat on the aircraft but it has to be in the class of service they were ticketed in.
I suggest reading each airliene's CoC's which the goverment mandates be made available for your inspection and the applicable DOT regulations.
Both are clear that an airline that fails to transport a passenger on the flight in the class of service for which they are ticketed and doesn't pay compensation is in violation both of DOT regulations and is in breach of contract.
This is settled law. It's not rocket science.
As a 1K myself, the response is totally in line with my experience. As United relishes in their financial successes, they are more emboldened to take advantage of their top customers. I have found myself in a similar situation and lack of care/ownership over the issue from the Executive team. Since their food remains practically inedible and their program is becoming just like Delta's, I've contemplated making the switch to Delta. At least they have...
As a 1K myself, the response is totally in line with my experience. As United relishes in their financial successes, they are more emboldened to take advantage of their top customers. I have found myself in a similar situation and lack of care/ownership over the issue from the Executive team. Since their food remains practically inedible and their program is becoming just like Delta's, I've contemplated making the switch to Delta. At least they have edible food onboard their flights - isn't it sad that it's come to that level of minutiae? It's a race to the bottom.
I agree. UA 1k means almost nothing. In January, UA canceled my flight because of crew shortage. Called 1k line, basically told "too bad, nothing we are going to do about it." Same useless options as on app. Had to book new itinerary on AA at much higher fare.
Always wonder who are the people who take the side of the big corporation over an individual who did nothing wrong ?
He showed up 20 mins before his flight- that’s where he went wrong.
He was ALREADY checked in. He had a confirmed boarding pass, just waiting for the seat assignment (which is not entirely uncommon, though it's a stress to get a good seat, but even that is either automated or assigned by the gate agent based on elite status) . Everything else is automated. So arriving at the gate 20 minutes before boarding had NOTHING to do with him not being boarded.
The folks writing these comments must not be frequent flyers???
This is correct. United (Rule 5, section D1© only requires that passengers be present at the gate at least 15 minutes prior to scheduled departure. There is no indication that the reason the passenger was denied boarding was because they failed to do that but rather was informed they weren't booked on the flight. Either they had a confirmed reservation or they didn't and that's the crux of the matter.
Sorry that's D1c. Autocorrect wasn't happy with the ().
Assuming he actually was at the gate on time. You only know what the customer writes….
Per the boarding pass, boarding was to begin at 18:00 and end at 18:20, with gate departure at 18:35. The article also states he arrived at the gate 20 minutes before departure which would have been 18:15, five minutes before boarding was to close. 1K status or not, I would not have arrived at the gate that far into the boarding process unless I had an assigned seat on my boarding pass.
I don’t think arriving at the gate earlier 45 minutes instead of 20 minutes and speaking to the gate agent would have hurt their situation. I don’t understand the stop at the lounge.
I recently was flying United (one way as I was returning on Delta) from ABQ to PTY via IAH. I was not allowed to check in online the day before and later learned that was because I had to show an agent proof of my return. I of course had preassigned myself seats, but when I arrived at the counter, the agent said I no longer had a seat on either the leg from ABQ...
I recently was flying United (one way as I was returning on Delta) from ABQ to PTY via IAH. I was not allowed to check in online the day before and later learned that was because I had to show an agent proof of my return. I of course had preassigned myself seats, but when I arrived at the counter, the agent said I no longer had a seat on either the leg from ABQ to IAH or IAH to PTY. The agent gave me the typical United brushoff telling me to go to the gate. I said no, not until she called a supervisor to meet me at the gate. She did so, and when I arrived at the gate the supervisor had reassigned my original seats. I am a million mile flyer with United and gold for life, so I have had much experience with this sort of unfortunate behavior. Sadly, it often requires very demanding behavior.
United. Say no more
Not the same thing. Per United's CoCs seat assignments are not guaranteed. Transport with a confirmed reservation is.
You might not have been happy about this but United met their obligations. It goes both ways. Passenger should not only know what they are entitled to but what they are NOT entitled to.
There's a lot of frustration in the thread and comments of who is to blame, and comments about the contract of carriage and the DOT. It shouldn't be this way, but here's the truth....you're not in control and very, very few of we passengers have any meaningful leverage with the airlines. The cost of going to court, even small claims court, likely exceeds any payment you'll receive. On top of that the standard contract of...
There's a lot of frustration in the thread and comments of who is to blame, and comments about the contract of carriage and the DOT. It shouldn't be this way, but here's the truth....you're not in control and very, very few of we passengers have any meaningful leverage with the airlines. The cost of going to court, even small claims court, likely exceeds any payment you'll receive. On top of that the standard contract of carriage is filled with exceptions benefitting the airlines and giving them the right to ignore vast swaths of the contract under irregular operations.
I've complained twice to DOT twice. The first time was crickets and the second when I pointed out that the airline falsely claimed the reason for a delay was weather related I received a threatening email from the airline. I was thrilled...clearly the airline was acting in bad faith. I forwarded that email to DOT with the original complaint number, and .....crickets again.
You can only control your own actions. Check in early, get to the gate early, know the alternative routings and talk to more than one person at the airline when someone tells you they can't do anything (look for the agent with grey hair and be nice). If you absolutely have to be somewhere on a given day and time, plan on arriving a full 24 hours early. If you can't, bring your sangfroid.
I think this is a good assessment. There is nothing a passenger can do to force an airline, or anyone else for that matter to live up to their contractual obligations if they choose not to do so. Therefore the best thing is to have a plan for if things go wrong like the poster suggests.
However that's a separate matter from claiming damages later if the airline breaches their contract or fails to...
I think this is a good assessment. There is nothing a passenger can do to force an airline, or anyone else for that matter to live up to their contractual obligations if they choose not to do so. Therefore the best thing is to have a plan for if things go wrong like the poster suggests.
However that's a separate matter from claiming damages later if the airline breaches their contract or fails to comply with applicable law. The OP is appears to be complaining about both. With regards to the first, the OP could have done more to make sure they got a seat on the plane as people have pointed out. But that doesn't mean that UA doesn't owe the passenger for having to failed to transport them.
Two completely separate issues and I would hope the posts have helped some readers to understand both so that they can minimize the chances of not being boarded themselves but also how to pursue compensation when they have been and are entitled to it.
The nonsense Americans are accepting from their airlines to me as a European is mind boggling anyway. Yet here we are, with a comment section full of air chair experts with apparent Stockholm syndrome defending the airline’s behavior. The only thing missing is a comment informing us that customer rights equal communism…..
Dutchturd must be living in a bubble. Many reports of people having to sue Lufthansa, Finnair never paying out compensation, etc.
@Dutchturd, your european mind should be focused on having a functional country that doesn’t rely on daddy (USA) for money and protection and mommy (Russia) for oil.
We will leave NATO once trump wins this year.
Completely besides the point my dear Amritpal. Have you ever heard of the OECD’s PISA ranking and ever wondered why the rest of the world knows so much more? But your response still kind off proves my point that folks in the US are defending their abusers.
No, he was on standby . The agent at the club was likely busy as well and direct him to the gate, where his seat would be processed, and the flight was full of disrupted customers .
The airline was out of rooms because of the weather and Mr. Terrance did not receive a courtesy room as a result.
Then he writes an e mail and he got an auto response . End of the story.
Did you not read the part of the post that says "Stand By" is printed on the boarding pass, and in this case it wasn't, and that he was therefore a CONFIRMED passenger?! In fact, did you not read the part of the blog that said he had been automatically rebooked (e.g., CONFIRMED) due to the schedule delay (which is completely common, and is 99% automated).
I really have to assume you are not a...
Did you not read the part of the post that says "Stand By" is printed on the boarding pass, and in this case it wasn't, and that he was therefore a CONFIRMED passenger?! In fact, did you not read the part of the blog that said he had been automatically rebooked (e.g., CONFIRMED) due to the schedule delay (which is completely common, and is 99% automated).
I really have to assume you are not a frequent flyer and don't know how these things work....or are supposed to work? Do facts matter to you?
End of story is that UA botched the situation.
No, the boarding passes do not read standby . They just have no seat assignment . The problem is that you believe anything you read.
Really I'm surprised how many posters haven't taken the simple step of reading and understanding the contract between themselves and the airline.
None of what this reader says is relevant. If a passenger has a confirmed reservation they are entitled to transport. Once again I can only suggest read what you are agreeing and what the airline is obligating themselves to.
I had this happen to me on a United itinerary that included one flight on Copa metal. We had to divert from Panama and go to Costs Rica. I was going to miss my connection and reached out to a United agent through the app and rebooked on a flight the next morning. Once I got to Panama I had an agent at a check in desk print my boarding pass confirmed with seat assignment...
I had this happen to me on a United itinerary that included one flight on Copa metal. We had to divert from Panama and go to Costs Rica. I was going to miss my connection and reached out to a United agent through the app and rebooked on a flight the next morning. Once I got to Panama I had an agent at a check in desk print my boarding pass confirmed with seat assignment before going to the hotel. The next day I show up and was denied boarding even the plane was not completely full and was told I was on a flight in the afternoon. I had to spend hours on the phone with United and they rechecked me in completely through the system. I was compensated decently enough: $500 voucher, free change to stay an additional day when I asked for it to make up for time missed, and assigned extra legroom seats for the flights home.
It sounds like he was always on standby for the 6:35 flight, but that wasn't clearly communicated by anyone in the process (app, lounge agent, gate agent, email rep). I feel like he has a gripe about the communication, but "involuntary denied boarding" is a leap.
It's not clear this is the case but if it is then the agent in the lounge really cocked up. They had an obligation to be truthful with the passenger. Whatever happened United should have gotten to the bottom of i and either told the passenger they didn't have a confirmed reservation and was on standby (which seems unlikely since that would normally be on the BP) and compensate them because of the agent's negligence...
It's not clear this is the case but if it is then the agent in the lounge really cocked up. They had an obligation to be truthful with the passenger. Whatever happened United should have gotten to the bottom of i and either told the passenger they didn't have a confirmed reservation and was on standby (which seems unlikely since that would normally be on the BP) and compensate them because of the agent's negligence or come clean that they did have a confirmed reservation and pay up for the denied boarding.
1) What is the USDOT going to do for the passenger other than just file it as another compliant; seems useless to me. Maybe Christopher Elliot would want to step in on this one for the publicity value (), but he does get results.
2) The passenger is NOT to blame; if the story is full and accurate.
3) Don’t whine about status privilege. I don’t read anything in this post claiming that he is....
1) What is the USDOT going to do for the passenger other than just file it as another compliant; seems useless to me. Maybe Christopher Elliot would want to step in on this one for the publicity value (), but he does get results.
2) The passenger is NOT to blame; if the story is full and accurate.
3) Don’t whine about status privilege. I don’t read anything in this post claiming that he is. This is about BASIC customer service.
4) If reported correctly, it was a confirmed boarding pass, so his arrival at the gate 20 minutes before boarding has NOTHING to do with the outcome. The only benefit of arriving earlier earlier at the gate would have been to angle for a better seat assignment, but that should be done automatically by the gate agents based on elite level. Even if standby, arriving at the gate earlier would make NO difference, as it’s automated, and only would have affected him if he had shown up later than the 10 minute rule, in which his seat could have been released. That is NOT the case in this scenario.
It was botched customer service, if the story reported is accurate.
Personally found better success getting personalized, actual responses from the 1kvoice email when I need to complain.
That said, yeah I think this is somewhat on him showing up late, not being more proactive to get a seat assignment, etc.
The United response looks a lot like the Swiss response that you posted about earlier--same stock paragraphs, same non-response. This is going to be a chronic problem going forward as companies "AI" customer (non)service functions.
United is an awful airline with nasty people (especially gate agents) working there. They crossed me once over a decade ago and I have never set foot on their plane again. In this case, not excusing United's behavior, if I were Terence, a seasoned traveler knowing that I had been rebooked, I would have gone straight to the gate after landing to make sure that I'm on it but no, he wants to enjoy himself at the lounge. He's partially to blame for his own misfortune.
There's more than a touch of the DYKWIA to this story. OK, so the weather turned to crap, ops fell apart, and you were delayed getting home. That's annoying, but hardly the end of the world. 1K status didn't make a difference because there are a couple hundred thousand of them, and at the end of the day it's not that special. Surely he didn't expect United to drag another pax off the aircraft at...
There's more than a touch of the DYKWIA to this story. OK, so the weather turned to crap, ops fell apart, and you were delayed getting home. That's annoying, but hardly the end of the world. 1K status didn't make a difference because there are a couple hundred thousand of them, and at the end of the day it's not that special. Surely he didn't expect United to drag another pax off the aircraft at T-15 minutes just to accommodate a 1K?
"SEAT ***" says it all. He didn't have one allocated. Unless by some miracle another pax failed to board after checking in, he wasn't getting on that plane.
This is not correct. All that's required is a confirmed reservation. Failure to transport would be denied boarding.
In my experience, a boarding pass with no seat number = STANBY.
What other reason could there possibly be to not allocate a seat on a boarding pass other than there not being a seat left to allocate?
If it is close to departure the gate agents take control of the seating and are the only ones who can assign seats. That way someone in the lounge isn't screwing up a seating change the gate agent is working on.
That's just not true. While its not typical to be confirmed on a flight with no seat. It doesn't mean you're not confirmed on the flight
It still doesn't mean you have a seat. If the flight checks in full you don't fly.
This is exactly it!
So you have a boarding pass - with no seat. It doesn't say you are on standby, but it doesn't say you are confirmed either. How are you meant to know the deal?
I would be very hesitant to leave that agent in the Polaris lounge without them making a call to the gate and getting me a seat printed on my BP especially as a top tier FF.
If you have a confirmed reservation that's all you need.
The way you know is by reading the agreement you have with the airlines. Few passengers do this unfortunately.
to be fair, Texas has been hammered by heavy rains and stormy conditions for months. Airline operations are bound to be negatively imp;acted.
The lounge agent probably did know the customer was standby but pushed him out the door given that he/she has done more rebooking in the last couple months than in for years before.
The biggest takeaway is that it was downright foolish to show up at the gate 20 minutes before dept. w/ no seat assignment.
I agree it wasn't prudent however if the agent knew the passenger was only standby and didn't say so that is unconscionable.
But the real lesson of the story is that the passenger should have checked their reservation because that, not the boarding pass, is the governing document to see if the reservation was confirmed or not.
Of course a passenger needs read the airline's CoCs to know this. Few due, as indicated by the...
I agree it wasn't prudent however if the agent knew the passenger was only standby and didn't say so that is unconscionable.
But the real lesson of the story is that the passenger should have checked their reservation because that, not the boarding pass, is the governing document to see if the reservation was confirmed or not.
Of course a passenger needs read the airline's CoCs to know this. Few due, as indicated by the misinformation being posted by others in these comments.
United gate agents are known for clearing stand bys early, closing the boarding door early, etc. Now why the pax didn't go to the gate to get a seat is beyond me, but i bet the pax was confirmed, but then the gate agent gave his seat to a standby just before he got there.
Also, if he is saying T-20, was it really? or was it T-14.5?
I know one thing if the lounge could not give me a seat I'd be hoofing it down to gate immediately or as soon as the agent came on duty. As seasoned traveler should know not having an assigned seat is not a place to want to be in. Waiting until T-20 is crazy.
Moreover, if you're confirmed why can't the lounge provide you a seat assignment unless the flight is overbooked? The issue is...
I know one thing if the lounge could not give me a seat I'd be hoofing it down to gate immediately or as soon as the agent came on duty. As seasoned traveler should know not having an assigned seat is not a place to want to be in. Waiting until T-20 is crazy.
Moreover, if you're confirmed why can't the lounge provide you a seat assignment unless the flight is overbooked? The issue is that at T-20 the GA isn't going to take the time to go onboard and start asking for a volunteer to take a later flight.
At some point seat assignment turns over to the gate and a res agent can't book a seat. Assuming that's what happened here, and we don't know but it seems likely, then what should have happened is that the gate agent would have assigned the passenger a seat when she showed up if the passenger presented themself before the cut off time.
What's possible, likely even, is the either the passenger missed the cut...
At some point seat assignment turns over to the gate and a res agent can't book a seat. Assuming that's what happened here, and we don't know but it seems likely, then what should have happened is that the gate agent would have assigned the passenger a seat when she showed up if the passenger presented themself before the cut off time.
What's possible, likely even, is the either the passenger missed the cut off, the gate agent began reassigning seats early or the flight was overbooked. If it was the first, it's on the passenger. If the second, then on United. But again the lesson here is if you don't have a seat assignment you are more at risk of not being transported so get to the gate early and present yourself. Or if the lounge agent will do so, and many will, have them call the gate and have them put you on the list for a seat. Not as good as going in person but an option for long layovers where you'd rather hang in the lounge.
Dumb story. And he was issued a boarding pass with no seat. A “confirmed” reservation without a seat assigned on your boarding pass means you are on STANDBY!!!!!
Wrong, standby is not the same as missing an assigned seat
This is incorrect. Per to the United's Contract of Carriage, which is the governing document, the only thing that's required is a confirmed reservation. There is no need to have a boarding pass, let alone one with a seat assigned. Denied compensation is due merely by virtue of having a confirmed reservation. This is pretty much standard across the industry.
I encourage everyone to read and understand what the CoC for when purchasing a ticket....
This is incorrect. Per to the United's Contract of Carriage, which is the governing document, the only thing that's required is a confirmed reservation. There is no need to have a boarding pass, let alone one with a seat assigned. Denied compensation is due merely by virtue of having a confirmed reservation. This is pretty much standard across the industry.
I encourage everyone to read and understand what the CoC for when purchasing a ticket. Knowing, rather than guessing, what your agreement ntract with the says will go a long ways to understanding what each of you have agreed to.
"He then arrived at the gate 20 minutes before departure"
Im sorry but any seasoned flyer like him knows to get to the gate a little earlier than when boarding is already underway when you dont have an assigned seat. Dude was spending every last second in the lounge, im sure the gate agent was calling his name before boarding and when he didnt show they gave his seat up.
This does not seem likely if you actually look at the timeline. He allegedly got to the Polaris lounge at 5:50 PM before a 6:35 PM flight, which indicates he probably wasn't there to enjoy a shower, a relaxing dinner, and a few drinks at the bar but simply that this was the best way to get an agent to manually check him in and get a ticket. Since pretty much every seasoned flyer *also*...
This does not seem likely if you actually look at the timeline. He allegedly got to the Polaris lounge at 5:50 PM before a 6:35 PM flight, which indicates he probably wasn't there to enjoy a shower, a relaxing dinner, and a few drinks at the bar but simply that this was the best way to get an agent to manually check him in and get a ticket. Since pretty much every seasoned flyer *also* knows that lounge agents are much more likely to help him than a frazzled gate agent busy with a million other things.
That leaves just 25 minutes between showing up at the lounge and arriving at the gate, which also has to account for getting help from the agent and walking to the gate itself. That leaves barely enough time to get a cup of coffee.
I came here to say this exact same thing. You nailed it, Chris
With T-45 minutes I'd probably just go right to the gate. At that point the flight is under the control of the GA and what the lounge can do is limited. Now given he was a 1K the GA should have called the gate and asked if the gate could assign a seat. At that point if the GA tells the lounge to go fish the lounge representative can at least immediately re-accommodate.
None of this matters and is purely speculation. Either the passenger had a confirmed reservation and presented themself at the gate before the cutoff or they didn't. According to the passenger the gate agent didn't claim they'd cancelled his reservation because they failed to arrive at the gate as required. Of course we don't know if the passenger is lying but if United isn't offering denied boarding compensation presumably that's because there is a legitimate...
None of this matters and is purely speculation. Either the passenger had a confirmed reservation and presented themself at the gate before the cutoff or they didn't. According to the passenger the gate agent didn't claim they'd cancelled his reservation because they failed to arrive at the gate as required. Of course we don't know if the passenger is lying but if United isn't offering denied boarding compensation presumably that's because there is a legitimate reason for denying it. But United hasn't given any such reason and the onerous is on them to do so.
Resolving these sorts of things is exactly what customer service is supposed to do. Unfortunately they appear not be interested in doing their jobs.
It's true that the passenger wasn't as prudent they could have been but that doesn't relieve the airline of their contractual obligations.
If they had a confirmed reservation and was at the gate before the cutoff then they had a right to be transported.
S— happens however if UA gave him a call and offered him comp in addition to apologies, it might be resolved. Most likely they have , but you like to post an entire story about a third party without all the information.
This blog is becoming like a gossip column written by Hedda Hopper or Louella Parsons
"This blog is becoming like a gossip column written by Hedda Hopper or Louella Parsons"
And yet here you are, reading and commenting on the gossip as if it were written by Hedda Hopper or Louella Parsons.
What a rotten response. They're slipping. Usually United has better software than the AI that responded. I wonder if Kirby is squeezing the programming budget now too.
Why ? It’s polite. Typical yank who thinks the only apology is cash. Americans have taught the world one thing - greed
There are worse things happening in the world and missing a flight is nothing compared with them.
"There are worse things happening in the world and missing a flight is nothing compared with them."
You're right, of course, but this blog isn't about Darfur, it's about travel.
Perhaps you should try Googling "worst things happening in the world" and get your information from there.
Saying they expect their employees to be knowledgeable about “excepted” documentation (instead of accepted) likely was written by a human not AI. ;)
Agree with Gregg. A DOT complaint is about the equivalent of a BBB complaint. The airline might give it a second look but isn’t going to move heaven and earth and drop everything to make it right.
Had this exact situation happen to me last month with American (I am Platinum Pro). Checked in fine, with boarding pass on first leg, nothing on second despite having selected seat 2A. Get to Charlotte and stop at customer service for a boarding pass. I received the same pass as the customer in the article: a boarding pass confirming my flight status but no assigned seat. Was told to confirm my seat assignment with the...
Had this exact situation happen to me last month with American (I am Platinum Pro). Checked in fine, with boarding pass on first leg, nothing on second despite having selected seat 2A. Get to Charlotte and stop at customer service for a boarding pass. I received the same pass as the customer in the article: a boarding pass confirming my flight status but no assigned seat. Was told to confirm my seat assignment with the gate agent. I go to gate agent and she tells me I'm on standby. I show her in the app that I'm set for seat 2A, but that I don't have a boarding pass. Calmly explained I checked in day before, same as I always do and showed how I was booked in full fare economy (I did not mention status). She shrugged and said she couldn't "help me" even though I was booked on the flight. I calmly took a seat and she eventually called me up after everyone had boarded and there was a no-show. A bunch of others were also involuntarily bumped.
It was a hard travel day due to weather, which I've had plenty, but the whole process didn't make sense to me.
At least based on my experience, you are overestimating the effectiveness of complaining to the DOT. I've complained about a range of issues in the past two years, including airlines failing to provide a full refund after canceling my flight, refusing to offer the published flexibility in their schedule change policy, and a deceptive marketing email. Compared to writing to the normal customer service channel, writing to the DOT just leads the airline to say...
At least based on my experience, you are overestimating the effectiveness of complaining to the DOT. I've complained about a range of issues in the past two years, including airlines failing to provide a full refund after canceling my flight, refusing to offer the published flexibility in their schedule change policy, and a deceptive marketing email. Compared to writing to the normal customer service channel, writing to the DOT just leads the airline to say "no" more verbosely, often without addressing the substantive issues raised in my complaints. The DOT rarely takes action, and the airlines definitely seem to know this when responding to customer complaints.
I think this is correct. The only exception would be refunds where the DOT has imposed fines so when there is no dispute over whether a refund is actually due a letter from DOT likely would push getting you money back along. But for anything else if a passenger hasn't been able to resolve the matter by communicating with the airline directly the only option is to either let the matter go or file a...
I think this is correct. The only exception would be refunds where the DOT has imposed fines so when there is no dispute over whether a refund is actually due a letter from DOT likely would push getting you money back along. But for anything else if a passenger hasn't been able to resolve the matter by communicating with the airline directly the only option is to either let the matter go or file a lawsuit, typically in small claims court.
Frankly I find this very comforting. If whatever went wrong isn't important enough to warrant suing then letting it go is probably the right answer. And if it is then use the forum that has been specifically created to resolve disputes in a cheap, fast and easy manner. As far as I can tell people spend enormous amounts of time posting to forums or whatever more because they want to vent about how badly they've been mistreated and the purpose is to get other people to agree with them. That's legitimate I guess but if the goal is to reach an accommodation the better course of action is to put the matter in front of a neutral party that renders a decision and has the power to enforce it.