On the evening of January 2, 2024, two aircraft collided at Tokyo Haneda Airport (HND), leading to a major accident with fatalities. In the few days since this incident, a lot of details have emerged about what happened, and it almost feels like the more we know, the more questions there are about how something like this could happen. There are some pretty surprising details emerging…
In this post:
Japan Airlines A350 & Japan Coast Guard plane collide
This incident happened at 5:47PM on Tuesday, January 2, 2024, and involves two aircraft:
- A roughly two-year-old Japan Airlines Airbus A350-900 with the registration code JA13XJ; this plane was operating flight JL516, which was just landing on Haneda Airport runway 34R after completing an 80-minute flight from Sapporo
- A roughly 16-year-old Japan Coast Guard Bombardier DHC-8-300 with the registration code JA722A; this plane was supposed to be departing Haneda Airport runway 34R right after the Japan Airlines A350 landed
Long story short, the two aircraft were on the runway at the same time, and collided. The below video shows the explosion that occurred from the impact, as the A350 continued barreling down the runway on fire (while you can barely see the much smaller turboprop).
On the Japan Airlines A350, all 359 passengers and 20 crew members managed to evacuate. While there were no human fatalities, at least 17 people from the A350 have been injured, and it’s not clear how serious those injuries are. Unfortunately (this breaks my heart), there were two animals in the cargo hold that also didn’t survive.
There were six people onboard the Japan Coast Guard aircraft. Tragically, five of them have lost their lives, while one is in critical condition. Ugh, that’s just awful… my thoughts are with those onboard and their families.
It’s absolutely shocking to look at what was left of the Japan Airlines A350 the morning after the accident, after the fire raged on for hours. It’s such a testament to how well built aircraft are, that everyone could safely evacuate the A350, despite there being an impact at over 100+ miles per hour, plus this plane ultimately burning to the point of a hull loss.
This accident represents the first-ever hull loss of an Airbus A350, as well as the only hull loss of a Japan Airlines aircraft in the last 40 or so years.
Japan Airlines has a fleet of A350-900s that exclusively operate domestic flights, and they’re in a high density configuration with 369 seats. The airline has 16 of these Airbus jets, with an additional two jets on order. This is separate from the A350-1000 that Japan Airlines will soon start flying, as its new flagship long haul jet.
The Japan Airlines’ A350s evacuation wasn’t without issue
Looking at video footage of the evacuation, I’m impressed that most people left their carry-on items behind, as they’re supposed to. That can be the difference between life and death, and it’s where Japan’s culture of following rules comes in handy. There’s video footage from inside the aircraft during the evacuation, and as you’d expect, it’s scary.
There were a variety of issues and challenges with the evacuation:
- The emergency announcement system stopped working during the evacuation, so flight attendants had to scream and use megaphones to communicate with passengers and one another
- Only three of the eight emergency exits were used for the evacuation, as the crew evaluated which exits could safely be used based on the location of the fire
- While the A350 is certified to be evacuated within 90 seconds, the plane only completed its evacuation 18 minutes after it came to a stop; that sure makes you wonder why this was so delayed
The crew deserves credit for getting everyone off the plane safely. They evacuated a burning A350 with no fatalities, and they did so with no public announcement system, and with only being able to use three exits. Furthermore, the crew members were the last people off the aircraft, and the captain apparently passed through the entire cabin to make sure there was no one left, before he got off the plane himself.
What caused the accident at Tokyo Haneda Airport?
Of course investigations involving a hull loss can take months or even longer, as there’s a lot to learn from these situations. However, we already know a lot about what happened.
The arriving Japan Airlines A350 had received landing clearance for runway 34R, so the plane had permission to land. Meanwhile the departing Japan Coast Guard DHC-8 had only been given clearance to taxi to runway 34R and hold short, and not to enter it. Specifically, here’s the relevant transmission:
Air traffic controller: “JA722A, Tokyo tower, good evening, number one, taxi to holding point C5.”
Pilot: “Taxi to holding point C5, JA722A, number one, thank you.”
The pilot of the Japan Coast Guard plane confirmed the instruction to wait at the holding point, so one has to wonder how the plane ended up on the runway. As you can see, this isn’t a case where the controller gave incorrect instructions, or where instructions weren’t read back correctly. Did the pilots get thrown off by being told they’re “number one,” for some reason, or what possible explanation is there?
Here’s the most shocking part of this. The Japan Coast Guard plane wasn’t just taxiing onto the runway right as the Japan Airlines A350 was landing, but rather it had been sitting on the runway for over 40 seconds, before it was rear-ended by the landing Japan Airlines A350. You can hear some of the ATC audio and see a depiction of that below.
That makes this situation even more shocking. Did no one realize something was off, whether it was the air traffic controllers, pilots of the Japan Airlines A350, or pilots of the Japan Coast Guard aircraft?
There is one other major factor that plays into this. The Haneda Airport warning lights that indicate if a runway is clear were out of service at the time of this accident. This has been the case since December 27, 2023, so it started several days before the incident. There was a NOTAM about this (this is a notice to pilots that they’re supposed to read prior to operating a flight), so it’s something pilots should have known.
The Japan Coast Guard aircraft was about to perform a flight to deliver aid following Japan’s earthquake. One has to wonder if the pilots were rushed and exhausted, didn’t fully read the NOTAMs, and then interpreted being “number one” plus the lack of runway warning lights as an indication that they were cleared for takeoff?
Bottom line
A Japan Airlines Airbus A350 and a Japan Coast Guard Bombardier DHC-8 collided on runway 34R at Tokyo Haneda Airport. The A350 managed to be evacuated with no human fatalities, while tragically five of the six people on the Japan Coast Guard aircraft died.
The Japan Airlines A350 had been given permission to land, while the Japan Coast Guard turboprop entered the runway without permission, and sat there for over 40 seconds before being hit.
As this accident is investigated, the big question is why this happened. Why did the Japan Coast Guard plane taxi onto the runway without permission? Why didn’t anyone notice that a plane was sitting on the runway for over 40 seconds without permission? Why did it take so long for the plane to be evacuated?
What do you make of this Tokyo Haneda Airport incident?
Very sad but a good outcome for the crew and pax on the A350 - I’m assuming that the Airbus was committed to the landing and there would have been no possibility to abort the landing
I have been on multiple aborted landing, especially while on LH metal. It seems their operating rules demand aborting if the runway is not visibly clear from 1000M. Was it really impossible to see the incursion? I have read thy small aircraft was there a few minutes.
The 'plane ended up off the the right of the runway, so facing almost north.
Was this a deliberate choice by the pilots to have the engine on fire in a a less dangerous position relative to the wind?
Your article is not in line with other media reports regarding evacuation. It has been reported that evacuation was mostly finished within 7 minutes after the aircraft came to stop, with some passengers still on board and in state of shock. It took the captain 11 minutes to reassure them to leave the aircraft and he/she was last to leave approx 18 minutes after the incident. Maybe you should check it out?
With the collapsed front noise of the plane, that lower the slides. Likely made it a little quicker to get off. Less hestitation, and maybe more at a time. No steep slide in front of you.
It’s not necessarily a bad thing that it took 7 minutes before evacuating. Most of the passengers did evacuate within 90 seconds, and obviously the crew was just working out what the safest way to do it was. Clearly they decided right given there weren’t even any serious injuries for those on the A350.
This ended well, thanks to luck and to a well constructed plane. Everyone should have been off it 7 minutes earlier though. This was a frontal collision, it is understandable that people in the nose were dazzled - thankfully they recovered in time.
The warning lights being U/S may be a moot point, since apparently they’re only utilized in low visibility conditions, which was not the case at the time of the accident.
Looks like the Japanese government is going to buy JAL a new aircraft.......
We were on the HND-SFO flight that was taxiing when this happened. I must give credit to our flight crew - they were amazing - they were incredibly professional, helpful and calm considering that they themselves weren't getting a whole lot of information. Because of the delay, we taxied to a safe spot and were allowed to use our devices - which is when we read about and got messages from loved ones finding out...
We were on the HND-SFO flight that was taxiing when this happened. I must give credit to our flight crew - they were amazing - they were incredibly professional, helpful and calm considering that they themselves weren't getting a whole lot of information. Because of the delay, we taxied to a safe spot and were allowed to use our devices - which is when we read about and got messages from loved ones finding out what happened. The crew tried to do everything in their capacity to help us and take care of us, including serving food & refreshments, while still not knowing when we will depart or if the flight will be cancelled.
"Allowed to use your devices"? Gate-to-gate device use has been allowed for years now. Were you taking a flight in 2012?
Jenny, did you fly into the comments section on your broom?
Appreciate the snarkiness :) While gate-to-gate device usage is allowed, the nature of usage is subjective to the airline and local regulations. Most commonly passengers are still required to either turn on airplane mode or turn off their devices. And I don't think majority of passengers pay to connect to wifi - which in this case wasn't available until we were above 10K ft anyway. However, I should have been more specific - instead of...
Appreciate the snarkiness :) While gate-to-gate device usage is allowed, the nature of usage is subjective to the airline and local regulations. Most commonly passengers are still required to either turn on airplane mode or turn off their devices. And I don't think majority of passengers pay to connect to wifi - which in this case wasn't available until we were above 10K ft anyway. However, I should have been more specific - instead of allowed to use our devices, more appropriately when we could connect to a cellular or wifi network.
...which is still not enforced, anyway. I haven't put my phone into airplane mode in over 20 years, given that modern cell signals don't interfere with aircraft navigation. People are such sheep!
Baaaaaaa
As a former cabin crew member, it was standard procedure to shout commands, rather than use an intercom system. For example, the commands given passengers at the back of the aircraft from that cabin crew may be different than the commands given at the front of the aircraft. In addition, a flight attendant is going to be moving around, evacuating passengers and really can't be tethered to an intercom cord no longer than a few feet.
While there’s a lot to be praised, there’s a lot to be answered:
1. Why did the coast guard plane end up on the runway? Was it the runway warning lights being out of service? Should the global standard change to runways requiring immediate warning light repair?
2. Did the JAL pilots have a visual of the plane on the runway? Could they have aborted landing? Many of us have been in aborted landings where...
While there’s a lot to be praised, there’s a lot to be answered:
1. Why did the coast guard plane end up on the runway? Was it the runway warning lights being out of service? Should the global standard change to runways requiring immediate warning light repair?
2. Did the JAL pilots have a visual of the plane on the runway? Could they have aborted landing? Many of us have been in aborted landings where even a wheel has touched before aborting, so it’s often not too late. Could this have been like the Asiana crash at SFO where the FO saw they were going to impact the water’s edge and didn’t warn the captain due to culture and rank? Japanese culture is more similar to Korean culture than different in this age and respect factor.
3. The Wall Street Journal reports the JAL press conference stating that from time of landing until the final passenger evacuated it was 18 minutes! I wonder if that is accurate? The videos certainly show passengers sitting inside the plane for a while before evacuation began. Some of that was certainly necessary to evaluate the fire and which exits were useable, but was too long taken? Were we seconds from a large number of fatalities?
4. Should we move to a global standard of window blinds being opened for take off and landing? I know I’ve had FAs in countries that enforce say that they need a visual of engines from their jump seats. This incident surely makes the case for this being global.
I once was on a plane landing at JFK and suddenly we went up, because someone was on the runway that we were about to land on.
Aside from the evacuation, you also have to give kudos to the JAL pilots for keeping the aircraft on the centerline to stopping point. Failure to control or trying to avoid the Dash-8 could've resulted in cart-wheeling or veering off into ditch. Also a bit fortunate (at least for JAL) that it was a big aircraft vs a small one; had it been 2 737s in the collision, the results would've been very different.
Did the Coast Guard plane had its beacon and strobe lights working? So others can see you.
I'm surprised that the flight numbers haven't been retired as they're still being used. Korean immediately retired the flight numbers from the Cebu accident. Same for Asiana 214.
Moving on, it just shows you how well built modern jets are. Usually tragic events nowadays are caused by some form of human error or faulty maintenance practices and not a design flaw with the aircraft itself (exception would be the MAX)
it's been a day... Asiana didn't retire the 214 flight number until Augsut 2013, a month after the accident
Even the Japanese government has released enough information to indicate that the Coast Guard aircraft was in the wrong place.
There are a number of serious lapses that prevented any one of multiple safety checks from preventing the accident and every one of them has to be evaluated.
This could have been much, much worse and it is beyond sad that structural deficiencies contributed to the loss of the Coast Guard crew that were...
Even the Japanese government has released enough information to indicate that the Coast Guard aircraft was in the wrong place.
There are a number of serious lapses that prevented any one of multiple safety checks from preventing the accident and every one of them has to be evaluated.
This could have been much, much worse and it is beyond sad that structural deficiencies contributed to the loss of the Coast Guard crew that were trying to help their fellow citizens that were already in severe need.
Good Advice that bears repeating. I always dress in 100% cotton shirt and pants. I wear walking shoes. I remember reading years ago that you should be prepared to evacuate via slide and walk on broken glass even though you will probably never have to.
The FAA should ban removal of anything from overhead bins during an evacuation. Anyone found with/seen doing something: FINED. And for that matter, they need to band any ridiculous footwear on flights, at a minimum if your seated on an exit row. Someone wearing high heels or flip flops is a danger to the whole plane.
I'm sure that'll make a difference. If the obvious risk to their life and the lives of others doesn't stop this behavior, a potential FAA fine totally will!
Is it just me or is nothing developing in Japan anymore aside from that Maglev train? They're already behind Korea and China in software, hardware, behind with Korea in salary, GDP per capita, avg net worthstandard of living, and military too. Their economy is now behind Germany. They literally peaked in 80s and 90s. Toyota was even faking safety tests for 30 years. Japan has fallen behind
What an ignorant and inappropriate comment! How is economy of Japan related to this accident????
What's the point of you making this foolish and ridiculous statement? You being a Korean want to start a war or something? You have something to prove? Is Korea that much better. You people also have your problems!
And yet Japan does have nearly twice the Fertility Rate of Korea (1.26 kids per women vs 0.72). Korea is genociding itself iva toxic K-Pop culture.
At least the Japanese have edible food unlike the Koreans that somehow think rotting vegetables “kimchee” constitute an appetizer.
All of this is so totally irrelevant to Ben's post... but kimchi is delicious. And fermentation (not rotting) has been an appreciated method of food (and beverage!) preparation the world over for millennia.
Kudos to the Japanese pax.
I know here in the U.S. we would have had fatalities on a plane like this, since everyone would try and take their bags.
That’s why the FAA should pass a mandate prohibiting the opening of overhead bins in the event of an evacuation. Doing so may lead to fines and imprisonment . This should be included in safety announcements on all flights taking off in the US.
We need to get the luggage back in the bottom. Only pillows, blankets, and soft (small) bags. I've been on flights where I'm terrified the overhead will open up and dump 200 lb suitcases on us.
Not necessarily true. In the U.S., passengers do NOT take their luggage when they see a lot of smoke and fire.
In 1991, a USAir (now American Airlines) 737 landed almost on top of a Skywest (Delta Connection) Metro III. The USAir passengers evacuated but did not take luggage. They saw a huge fire.
With the JAL incident, video show a lot of flames seen from the windows.
That was 33 years ago. Look at any accident since, and you'll see hordes of pax running with full-sized carry ons. People in the US think we don't need to pay attention to *all* the laws because, you know, we're smarter, and we only follow the laws that we like, and ignore the ones we don't. It wasn't that bad until we had a president who normalized it, then started undermining regulatory bodies, law enforcement agencies, and the entire judiciary...
I also think it's due to the fact that Japan does not have the obesity and health issues that we have in the US. Often when I'm sitting in First (which I pay for out of pocket) I see people boarding that I cannot imagine being able to evacuate within 90 seconds. Not to mention the people they would be blocking. Had this been a flight in the US sadly I think all or most would have perished.
A good reason that the FAA should mandate one free checked bag
I’ve read many commenters on various forums say that they’d take their bag containing IDs, medication etc. The replies noting that these items will be of no use when you’re dead are just lost on them. Some people are just so selfish. Literally no physical possession is worth the risk of losing human life.
I wonder if there’s pursuit of technology to remotely lock overhead bins for takeoff and landing. I’ve even seen people stand...
I’ve read many commenters on various forums say that they’d take their bag containing IDs, medication etc. The replies noting that these items will be of no use when you’re dead are just lost on them. Some people are just so selfish. Literally no physical possession is worth the risk of losing human life.
I wonder if there’s pursuit of technology to remotely lock overhead bins for takeoff and landing. I’ve even seen people stand up and remove bags during taxi after landing. It would be good technology for all flight purposes let alone emergencies.
I landed at Haneda at 5am local time today. No delays. About half of departing flights are cancelled mainly due to “change of aircraft”.
I know many have already said this but, KUDOS to the JAL flight team on getting everyone out safely and orderly. Sadly, even with this same crew, I don't see this happening on a similar incident in the states. It would be a nightmare and a "every man and woman for themselves", along with "needing" to get off everything they have with them.
ODD ARRIVAL INFORMATION
Check the flight status of the flight on the JAL website....
JAL516 15:50 — 17:35
16:15 Departed
(Gate 12)
17:46 Landed
(North Wing)
Delayed due to late arrival of aircraft.
----
The home page has a link to an apology.
Collision Incident Involving Japan Airlines Flight JAL516 and Japan Coast Guard Aircraft
We regret to inform you that on the evening of January 2nd (Japan time), JL516...
ODD ARRIVAL INFORMATION
Check the flight status of the flight on the JAL website....
JAL516 15:50 — 17:35
16:15 Departed
(Gate 12)
17:46 Landed
(North Wing)
Delayed due to late arrival of aircraft.
----
The home page has a link to an apology.
Collision Incident Involving Japan Airlines Flight JAL516 and Japan Coast Guard Aircraft
We regret to inform you that on the evening of January 2nd (Japan time), JL516 was involved in a collision with a Japan Coast Guard aircraft during its landing at Haneda Airport, resulting in a fire on the runway.
Our thoughts and prayers are with the deceased members of the Japan Coast Guard.
We have confirmed that all passengers and crew on our flight were evacuated.
We would like to assure you that we will provide our full cooperation in the investigation of this unfortunate event.
January 2, 2024
Japan Airlines
Don't airlines usually grey out their websites when accidents like this happen? Didn't Asiana 214, Korean's accident in Cebu have their websites greyed out?
US airlines probably call it an "enhancement"
Huge kudos to that crew for getting everyone off in time before it became a fireball. Amazing. It just goes to remind that THIS is what they are there for. Helping you find space for your 5 oversized carry-ons and answering the call bell to give you more drinks while you complain about them not being pretty or thin or smiling enough? Those are extras. They are literally there to save our lives.
Needless to say, helping you find space for your carry-ons, smiling, and answering the call bell in no way diminish their ability to respond in this situation. Indeed, good customer services presumably may increase trust in the crew that could lead to higher compliance in emergencies. If flight attendants don't care about doing the service part of their jobs, I'm less likely to trust that they'll do the safety part right too.
I agree customer service is important, but my point is that I think a lot of people take flight attendants for granted and treat them as only your own personal waitress in the sky. Although I agree that crew should also care about service, first and foremost flight attendants feel that they are there for safety not just to be seen as catwalk runway model waitresses in the sky.
They have multiple duties as part of their jobs.
That sucks for them doing that job.
CNN reports one of the pilots saying there was an explosion 10 minutes after the evacuation was completed. So while any big fire is unpredictable and, therefore, potentially deadly, this incident was not that close a call.
Evacuating 379 people out of just 3 exit doors could definitely eat up that 10 minute margin if not performed efficiently
Japanese news says the airport will reopen today (Wednesday). It is now 11:55 pm Tuesday in Japan
The airport opened early, opening Tuesday night.
Delta's 4:50 pm departure to Seattle made it out but the Detroit flight scheduled to leave just after the crash was canceled.
The coast guard Dash 8-300 was carrying earthquake relief supplies.
In the past, passengers tend to take baggage if there's no smoke in the cabin.
What condition was the Dash 8 in ? That plane was on a mission in response to the earthquake. Curious to see the aircraft maintenance log.
Anyone that takes carry on bags with them when evacuating a plane should face imprisonment . In that instance physical assault should be deemed as self defense.
That is a bad idea. There have been cases where airlines evacuate but where they are over cautious. Airlines, particularly American Airlines, are very stingy if your stuff gets stolen.
There was no large scale taking of luggage with USAir 1549 landing on the Hudson River nor with the USAir 737 which landed almost on top of a Metro III at LAX in 1991.
Yeah, how awful it would be to face a fine or prison for taking your luggage and slowing everyone else down so much that pax burn to death... Jeez.
British Airways poor treatment of the passengers evacuated from BA038 is partly to blame.
They were kept in an isolated area without food, and I think one bottle of water, for four hours.
One detail I remember is that even for those in J (who had the contacts to complain in the media afterwards), BA would not pay for taxis home (max 136 pax * GBP200 = USD40k, after a 777 hull loss)...
British Airways poor treatment of the passengers evacuated from BA038 is partly to blame.
They were kept in an isolated area without food, and I think one bottle of water, for four hours.
One detail I remember is that even for those in J (who had the contacts to complain in the media afterwards), BA would not pay for taxis home (max 136 pax * GBP200 = USD40k, after a 777 hull loss) but eventually agreed to guarantee to the taxi companies the fares for those passengers who had left their wallets (and in some cases train tickets) on board.
I worried at the time about the impact on behaviour of future passengers.
My takeaway was to not only have on until after take-off shoes suitable for running over glass, but also passport and wallet.
Interesting that many here take is that it was Japanese society having an adherence to following instructions to a tee which contributed to the success of the evacuation.
In fact, according to Av Herald, passengers were quoted as saying that the only crew instructions were to "Please stay calm and remain seated." What then happened was that a large group of passengers ignored the instructions and started evacuating on their own. Everyone else then...
Interesting that many here take is that it was Japanese society having an adherence to following instructions to a tee which contributed to the success of the evacuation.
In fact, according to Av Herald, passengers were quoted as saying that the only crew instructions were to "Please stay calm and remain seated." What then happened was that a large group of passengers ignored the instructions and started evacuating on their own. Everyone else then followed.
So much for that theory. Or else a burning aircraft is the one thing that motivates the Japanese to suddenly say to heck with the rules.
It's Japan. A country where the whole western world thinks perfect.
I'm wondering did anyone in this comment section has a close Japanese person, lived there, or even visited Japan for a short period before. Can't say that Japan is a bad country - it's undeniably a good country, but don't think they're perfect.
The ideas of meiwaku (迷惑), which made Japanese society to be loved by the western people, might sound ideal,...
It's Japan. A country where the whole western world thinks perfect.
I'm wondering did anyone in this comment section has a close Japanese person, lived there, or even visited Japan for a short period before. Can't say that Japan is a bad country - it's undeniably a good country, but don't think they're perfect.
The ideas of meiwaku (迷惑), which made Japanese society to be loved by the western people, might sound ideal, this has caused a lot of problems in Japanese society. Japanese people are almost forced to be overly disciplined, or they're isolated from the society. If you're a victim of whatever accident and you 'broke the harmony' by reporting it, you'll be expected to apologise for 'breaking the harmony' - which makes Japanese society 'look' perfect, because people are afraid of consequences they'll face.
To the people who wrote such biased comments here, do you still think it's really a good society?
Should have said 'crime' or 'incident' instead of 'accident'...
Far from perfect and xenophobia is prevalent. No protection for LGBTQ
Why should there be protection for LGBTQ or whatever? What is supposedly "right" in the West is not seen as such in the East. In many parts of the world, the LGBTQ crap is nonsense and does not deserve special treatment. Don't think that your view about this issue is right.
You’re a bigot and the one that’s full of crap, AI. Love is love - be better starting this new year, okay?
AI = Al, typo lol
I would hope, and I don't think, that people are not suggesting that Japanese society is totally perfect in all ways of life. I think people are just making the suggestion about this specific situation that an evacuation this quick, orderly, obedient and calm would not necessarily have happened in certain other places.
Yet in the end people are praising them here for something that didn't happen as a result of Japanese society. Not criticizing, just pointing out that what really took over was human extinct. Which is far more powerful than the group collective when a plane is burning around you.
If we are to trust new information releases from Japanese news outlets, the "In fact, according to Av Herald" doesn't look very accurate now.
It is explained that protocols have been followed and the passengers didn't just evacuate themselves. I mean where could they go unless they also opened the doors themselves?
CNN is reporting that the overwing and rear exit doors did not function. All passengers had to exit from the front doors.
No details but the report did not imply that the exits were blocked by flames. Maybe damaged by the collision and jammed.
Although CNN does have a picture of the plane burning and the emergency slide is down at the rear of the aircraft.
The cabin crew would not have allowed passengers out over the wings due to the fire. That's not a malfuction, but common sense (something NONE of the US cable networks have). Smart thinking by the crew, lives saved. God bless and prayers to the passenger and families for the dead, dying and survivors. Horrible day for sure.
In cases of fire, opening some exit doors can make things worse, not better, because it allows the fire in to the cabin - see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_Manchester_Airport_disaster
If an engine is on fire, pilots try to stop with the engine downwind of the fuselage, but that is not always possible.
If wind is blowing fire towards the fuselage, only the doors on the other side should be opened.
It's important for as many people...
In cases of fire, opening some exit doors can make things worse, not better, because it allows the fire in to the cabin - see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_Manchester_Airport_disaster
If an engine is on fire, pilots try to stop with the engine downwind of the fuselage, but that is not always possible.
If wind is blowing fire towards the fuselage, only the doors on the other side should be opened.
It's important for as many people as possible to understand this, so the cabin crew don't have to spend effort stopping passengers trying to open the doors which would make things worse.
CNN reported that not all of the emergency doors opened. Is that true?
We will have to wait for details of this one, but after some other accident on landing where opening the door caused flames to be blown into the cabin, the crew are supposed to give some thought to which doors to open rather than just open every one which is not damaged.
First day of 2024: earthquake
Second day: plane crash
What an awful start of 2024
really too bad netflix didn't continue their "death to 2020" and "death to 2021" as a netflix orignal series
First day of 2024: earthquake
Second day: plane crash
Third day: mass murder attempt at Akihabara, a busy subway station in Tokyo. A woman started stabbing people, stabbing 3 men before she was tackled and the knife kicked away.
Looks like they're already partly reopened and using 34L for incoming flights now (the incident was on 34R), as QR812 just touched down with EK312 right behind it. I was actually at the observation deck about an hour before this happened, and I'm glad I left beforehand.
Sadly, appears 5 dead now, all on the Dash. Only captain seems to have made it out. Does look like a pilot deviation. Awful and sad story all around.
We were on the taxiway when this occured (in JL2 HND -SFO). Still inside the aircraft as of 4 hours after the incident.
With scarce information I can't say for sure, but it is likely that given the flight origin/destination and timing, majority of passengers would be people living in Japan. I'd bet the extremely orderliness of local population (regardless of nationality) have helped with evacuation.
In Japan, people can finish boarding a 787/350 in just 10 minutes. If you wanted to, you can time to arrive at the airport 30min before departure, spend 5min in security, another...
With scarce information I can't say for sure, but it is likely that given the flight origin/destination and timing, majority of passengers would be people living in Japan. I'd bet the extremely orderliness of local population (regardless of nationality) have helped with evacuation.
In Japan, people can finish boarding a 787/350 in just 10 minutes. If you wanted to, you can time to arrive at the airport 30min before departure, spend 5min in security, another few walking to the gate, and still make it with ease for boarding 10 minutes before departure.
I flew JAL only once, recently from LAX to NRT, and I was stunned at how late before departure they started general boarding and yet the doors closed not only on time but a few minutes early!
To be honest, I agree Japanese people board fast. But there are two major factors that show down the boarding process in US. First, checked bag fee makes more people to bring more carryon. Second, complex boarding groups makes more people confused.
So true about the checked bags. I flew Frontier twice a few years ago. Not sure if they still do it, but then they were charging more for a carry-on then for checking a bag. Boarding went so much quicker. Just look how much the overhead bins have had to grow over the last 20 years.
That being said, I think the entire world pretty much does the checked bag fee for lower-end tickets these days. Long haul flights on traditional carriers are usually an exception though.
LOL, tell me you know nothing about Japan without telling me. The vast majority of the local population there is ONE nationality, Japanese. They are not fond of immigrants. A basic understanding of their country/culture would show you that.
Hmmm, are you sure you know much about Japan? As a British national who has been living in Japan for the last 15 years or so, I can say it's still more welcoming than many other places. And there are over 3 million non-Japanese living here...not insubstantial.
Right. Not only is their immigration bureau empty most of the time and a regional airport like Chitose will never have any tourists visiting. /s
Incredible that everyone on the A350 survived. A testament to a great aircraft.
Low fuel load on a landing aircraft probably helped. Imagine the fireball on take-off with full tanks.... :(
Of course if it happened on takeoff the circumstances would have been quite different. What I was alluding to was how the A350's structure held on despite hitting the Dash (as evidenced by the damage on the nose and the left engine nacelle). A different aircraft may have had a completely different sequence of events assuming everything else unchanged.
exactly. This is more luck than anything else.
Just to add context to the to the story behind the Japan Coast Guard plane, they were on a mission to carry emergency equipment/supplies to the recent Noto peninsula earthquake.
*The JCG plane and its crews have a permanent base station in Haneda.
Between this and the earthquake from yesterday, has been a pretty awful start to the year for Japan...
That plane evacuation is a testament to Japanese discipline, professionalism and selflessness.
Can you imagine if this happened on an American flight? Survival would be dismal as passengers are too busy taking selfies, too fat to extricate themselves from their seats, grabbing their overhead luggage/botox kits and/or getting offended when cabin crew misgender them during emergency directives.
Very sad regarding the coast guard crew though.
Aussies are just as fat and obnoxious, mate.
Not really!
Americans take the lead in obesity - check the stats!
"getting offended when cabin crew misgender them during emergency directives."
The best part of your whole statement.
This one takes the cake. Imagine the lawsuits for being misgendered during the evacuation. LOL!
@JP another example of things which have never happened, and never will happen, in an air crash.
Pot kettle black. Americans and Australians are just as fat, lazy and entitled.
@aussie - what a weird and unnecessary rant to go on. Five people are dead but the priority for you is to make some crappy comments about an entirely different nationality and then swerve into saying something about gender that I 100 per cent guarantee would never happen. Never let a tragedy go by without using it to make so cheap political points heh?
Unfortunately, what he described is America today.
@santastico - except it's not "America today," it's some ridiculous stereotypical fever dream. Please tell me about a recent US air crash where evacuation was delayed because "cabin crew misgendered passengers during emergency directives". Five people are dead and someone's decided to use that tragedy to make some weird and demonstrably incorrect point about gender.
@James just realised how stupid I was to write such comment...
@James: Hear hear. It's shocking to see someone so engrossed in their conspiratorial media bubble that they perceive everything (including something as tragic as a collision between a jumbo jet and a plane carrying supplies for earthquake victims) through the lens of "woke-left tyranny".
Shouldn't have poured nuclear wastewater for all your neighbors to drink.
Thanks for the helpful comment.
Weirdo.
That's true but that has nothing to do with this case. Even the Japanese citizens were against that decision. Maybe blame the US instead...
You are beyond pathetic.
Seriously?! Winner of Ignorant/Asinine Comment of the Year 2024.
Piss Off Pooh Bear
Shouldn't have caused a famine. This one had real impact.
傻逼
Douchebag.
Yup another ignorant Chinese making ridiculous statements
THIS is why cabin crew (flight attendants) deserve every single penny of the raise that they’re asking for. Job well done to aviation’s first responders!
Just the Japanese ones.
@ w t Pooh
Agreed. Rather exploitive to compare Asian discipline and service to schill for a raise on a US carrier at this time.
Honestly what better time to talk about how well trained ALL crews are worldwide. In fact US airlines have an incredible safety record. The US airline evacuations that have happened have been just as successful. This is the perfect time to discuss how underpaid cabin crew are
I'm sure cabin crew will perform better if they don't receive raises and feel like their labor isn't compensated fairly. "The beatings will continue until morale improves" always works well as a management tool.
Only because American travelers are stupid idiots and it’s a shame cabin crew in the states have to deal with that
This is why you NEVER wear flip-flops, sandals, or high heels on a plane. NEVER as your primary footwear.
My shoes are always on below 10,000 ft. Laced only, or well-secured velcro straps sneakers. It just can't be said enough. I remember a former head of the FAA saying once "Always be prepared to run through fire in an emergency on the runway".
I've had to evacuate an aircraft on the runway before. You're...
This is why you NEVER wear flip-flops, sandals, or high heels on a plane. NEVER as your primary footwear.
My shoes are always on below 10,000 ft. Laced only, or well-secured velcro straps sneakers. It just can't be said enough. I remember a former head of the FAA saying once "Always be prepared to run through fire in an emergency on the runway".
I've had to evacuate an aircraft on the runway before. You're running. Can't run fast in flip-flops or high heels. I have a pic of a passengers shoes at MDE airport last month. 10-inch heels, and she sat in the exit row!! SMH.
I always think back to that CO DC10 story, that aborted take-off at LAX on its way to Hawaii. As passengers evacuated, they had to run through fire, and most of the severe injuries were on their feet. Sandal wearers to Hawaii.
Let's be smart in 2024. No sandals, flip-flops or high heels on planes.
Glad everyone made it out ok at HND.
I'll admit, I've worn slides from check-in to landing as it's easier going through security, but in the interest of safety, I'll be wearing the proper footwear from now on. I usually wear slippers during the cruise on a long-haul flight. On a short flight, I just take them off during the cruise and put shoes on when I have to go to the toilet or walk around.
Same, I never take my shoes off until we are the in air for a few minutes at least. I always cringe when passengers put on slippers some airlines give you before take off. Even a lot of travel Youtubers do that in their vlogs and they fly all the time. Great advice to be giving Jordan - hopefully it is never necessary but always good to be prepared.
And not to put on slippers in J and F (although in this particular case, does not apply since it’s a domestic flight), until after take off and put on regular shoes before landing.
I do the same. Always. And it amazes me how many people aren’t prepared for an emergency landing.
Agree 100%. It shocks me to see FAs on US airlines wearing high heels shoes and boots. How can that be safe?
@Santastico, while they do wear high heels and boots in the airport and concourses, a majority of them switch to flats or low heels once onboard.
Majority does not mean all. I have seen many FAs wearing high heel boots on planes. That should be forbidden.
EVA Air FA shoes are flat heeled black shoes.
It seems like this is being a little too risk adverse and not considering how likely this is. This is an exceedingly rare event and the chances that it will happen to YOU are vanishingly small. You could also say that you should avoid synthetic materials and wear less flammable clothing every time you fly, but that would be excessive too.
Let people enjoy their flip flops or other comfy footwear on flights and focus...
It seems like this is being a little too risk adverse and not considering how likely this is. This is an exceedingly rare event and the chances that it will happen to YOU are vanishingly small. You could also say that you should avoid synthetic materials and wear less flammable clothing every time you fly, but that would be excessive too.
Let people enjoy their flip flops or other comfy footwear on flights and focus on the much greater risks in life like driving to the airport.
You know one can always take out their heels or flip flops right to run?
I thought you are supposed to remove your shoes before using the slide? If that's the case, then shoes that are easy to kick off would make more sense than lace-up shoes.
More information - the aircraft collided with the JAL A350 was the Japan Coast Guard's Bombardier DHC-8-300, and from that aircraft, the first officer was hurt but the status of five other crew is unknown.
Japan's new year is starting tough - they had a major earthquake on 1st Jan (the Japan Coast Guard aircraft was on its mission to deliver the supply to the affected region), and now first hull loss of JAL aircraft...
More information - the aircraft collided with the JAL A350 was the Japan Coast Guard's Bombardier DHC-8-300, and from that aircraft, the first officer was hurt but the status of five other crew is unknown.
Japan's new year is starting tough - they had a major earthquake on 1st Jan (the Japan Coast Guard aircraft was on its mission to deliver the supply to the affected region), and now first hull loss of JAL aircraft in last 39 years, as well as the first A350 destroyed...
It was the captain who has been escaped, my bad. The evacuation for the rest of the crew is ongoing.
Update: captain escaped Japan coast guard plane is severely injured. And 2 officers onboard the plane were confirmed dead. Status of 3 more officers are not confirmed yet.
Second update: other than the captain, all 5 officers onboard the Japan Coast Guard plane are confirmed dead. My thoughts and prayers are with their families…
Incredible story and hopefully reports are correct that nobody has died.
Can’t help but think that Japanese passengers would be smart enough to follow the rules and leave their carry ons onboard and therefore save lives.
Reports are that the passengers behaviour during evacuation was exemplary, as expected with Japanese people.