In the past, I’ve written about the evolution of the miles & points hobby over the years. There’s no denying that a lot has changed — the whole hobby has gone a lot more mainstream, and points are also much easier to earn than ever before, yet at the same time, the programs aren’t as useful as they used to be.
In this post, I’d like to pose a broad question that has been on my mind lately. As we all know, the major US airlines essentially operate as loss leaders for their loyalty programs — they might not make a lot of money actually directly transporting passengers, but they do make a lot of money from their programs.
Not only are the “big three” airlines already generating billions per year in revenue from these programs, but they still see a ton of upside. I want to talk about that a bit. These programs get less and less useful by the year, yet there’s no end in sight for consumer interest. Will something eventually have to change, or…?
In this post:
Airline loyalty programs are becoming a tough sell for consumers
Obviously everyone should join airline loyalty programs and earn miles for the flights they take anyway, since there’s no downside or opportunity cost to doing that. However, that’s also not where airlines are making money.
Ultimately the way airlines make money with their loyalty programs is by getting consumers to apply for their co-branded credit cards, and have other qualifying partner activity (like booking hotels or rental cars through their portals). Generally speaking, the biggest incentive for consumers is supposed to be that they can earn elite status and earn miles for credit card spending. But how exactly are consumers supposed to be enticed, at this point?
When it comes to earning elite status, back in the day, the biggest benefit was complimentary first class upgrades on a space available basis. Nowadays airlines sell a vast majority of their first class seats (including selling cheap last minute upgrades), so upgrade percentages have gone way down. Maybe going back many years, a top tier elite might get upgrades 80% of the time, while now they might get upgrades 20% of the time, if they’re lucky.
Beyond the benefits you’d get from a basic co-branded airline card, the actual perks of elite status just largely aren’t worth pursuing. And I say this as someone who is obsessed with airline loyalty programs, and who has had top tier status with one airline or another since I was 15 years old. After 14 years, I finally said “you know what, I’m done chasing AAdvantage Executive Platinum,” because I realized I was earning it out of habit, rather than for any particular good reason.
I think the other thing that has really intrigued people about airline loyalty programs is the ability to redeem miles for first and business class experiences. Sure, maybe most people can’t do it consistently, but the intrigue of being able to redeem for flights that might otherwise seem unaffordable has certainly been one of the things that makes many people engage in these programs. It’s kind of like going to a casino, and knowing you can win big.
The current state of premium cabin award availability to and from the United States is really, really sad. Admittedly this is due to a combination of many factors, including that airlines are increasingly restricting award space to their own members, there’s increasing competition for these seats, there are tools that automate the process of finding award space, etc.
To give one example of how things have changed, try redeeming Air Canada Aeroplan points for transatlantic business class at this point. Sure, maybe you can lock in Lufthansa first class within two days of departure. But at this point, Lufthansa and SWISS business class award availability has basically dried up, United has restricted business class award space to its own MileagePlus members, and it’s not like Air Canada has many reasonably priced long haul business class awards.
Similarly, look at American AAdvantage. I’d argue that AAdvantage is actually the best of the lot at this point, as the program makes a fair bit of premium cabin award space available on American flights. But want to travel on Etihad, Qatar Airways, etc.? Well, I hope you’re not planning on originating in the United States…
What’s the actual value proposition of these programs at this point?
To the credit of airlines, there’s actually no sign of the interest or success of these frequent flyer programs slowing down. That’s despite the fact that I almost feel like they operate in a vacuum, and think that consumers don’t have alternatives.
I hate to say this, but when non-miles & points people ask me for credit card or elite status tips nowadays, I kind of tell them not to bother with many airline programs. I typically encourage people to earn cash back with their credit cards, or at a minimum, earn rewards with transferable points currencies, and then transfer to foreign programs.
I used to be able to easily tell people “hey, here’s why earning miles & points is super valuable,” but that’s just not the case anymore. Like, what’s my pitch supposed to be?
- “If you’re fine planning travel within 48 hours of departure and can position to any gateway, you too can fly Lufthansa first class!”
- “Oh yeah you can book All Nippon Airways first class, just refresh Seats.aero every 10 minutes to see when the one first class award seat across the entire calendar next opens up”
- “There might not be any Qatar Airways business class award availability now, but if the airline launches a new route, maybe it’ll load a bunch of business class award space by mistake, and then you can book that… I’ve heard Mogadishu is lovely!”
I’ll also often ask people outside the miles & points hobby about their existing strategy, and how they use their airline miles, and the answers are… almost always pretty uninspiring. Like, they don’t seem terribly delighted with what they’ve been able to book, but that doesn’t stop them from continuing with their strategy.
Let me be clear, I still think there’s value in maximizing credit card rewards, and taking advantage of big welcome bonuses, spending bonus categories, etc. But what’s the actual value proposition of specifically wanting to earn points or get a credit card with a major US airline, beyond just a free checked bag benefit, or something?
I guess I’m curious if I’m alone with having this perspective. Ultimately consumers often make decisions against their own best interests, so is the continued growth of airline revenue from loyalty programs reliant on consumers making bad decisions and not maximizing their rewards, or is there something else I’m missing? I suppose the common belief is that “I live in X city and fly Y airline most often, and therefore I should use the credit card from Y airline for my spending.” I guess that’s exactly what airlines want, even if it doesn’t make much sense to me.
What’s interesting about Delta, as an example, is that the airline has really tried to sort of turn itself into a “lifestyle brand.” Now, that absolutely blows my mind, but it’s true. It does feel like some people have Delta credit cards and spend on them simply because they love the brand so much… or what else is the justification?
Bottom line
The miles & points industry has evolved massively over the years. The changes are a mixed bag, as I’ve covered in the past.
However, what I find most interesting is that the success of the “big three” US carriers is so heavily reliant on the continued revenue growth of their loyalty programs. That’s despite the fact that actually justifying engaging extensively in these programs is becoming a tougher sell, between the decreasing value of elite status, plus the increasingly limited ways to get outsized value with miles & points.
Consumers have choices in terms of their credit card spending, yet airlines seem to have people sold on the concept of using their co-branded credit card simply because they fly a particular airline frequently. Will these programs continue to be more and more lucrative for airlines, or is there a point at which this trend will reverse?
Where do you stand on the evolution of airline loyalty programs? Can the “big three” US airlines do no wrong with these programs, or is there a point at which consumers may actually shift their behavior?
How does this change your point valuations for programs?
Knowing that you put thought into that I am curious how this plays out. Aeroplan being useless to get to Europe in J has to be a big de facto devaluation, no?
Totally agree with Evan. It used to be nice. Do your work, gain points and then enjoy them. Not anymore.
As a complete know-nothing about this points collecting game, hence my following this website to gain more knowledge, my conclusion is simple.
As we wish to choose our destinations, airlines, flight times and dates, seating class, one values choice, space, comfort and convenience, etc, over any cost savings and the hassle associated with airlines points programs.
Life is too short for me to be tied to any corporation who will never return my loyalty....
As a complete know-nothing about this points collecting game, hence my following this website to gain more knowledge, my conclusion is simple.
As we wish to choose our destinations, airlines, flight times and dates, seating class, one values choice, space, comfort and convenience, etc, over any cost savings and the hassle associated with airlines points programs.
Life is too short for me to be tied to any corporation who will never return my loyalty. Besides, as there are no pockets in shrouds and the current UK Labour government is hell-bent upon taxing everyone to penury, we choose not to ride the airline/card companies merry-go-round.
I concur, airlines have squeezed pretty much all of the alpha out of the equation. I'm sitting on millions of points that I can spend at 1 cent per point for bad economy class itineraries.
Now what?
Long ago in the loyalty infancy I booked two F tickets from the US to Germany on TWA. With that booking I also received a one week Hertz rental and one week at a Marriott. Total cost…50k miles. Not each. Total. Real BIS miles with multipliers for class of booking. My how far we’ve come. Or not.
@ Ben, et. al. -- While I do not deny your premise that a) upgrades for elites are far more infrequent today than in days past; b) award space has dried up and/or is often restricted to members of *that* specific airline program (versus partner or alliance airlines); and c) Miles & Points have gotten progressively worth less and less over the years, I think it's a matter of YMMV.
YTD, I have been upgraded...
@ Ben, et. al. -- While I do not deny your premise that a) upgrades for elites are far more infrequent today than in days past; b) award space has dried up and/or is often restricted to members of *that* specific airline program (versus partner or alliance airlines); and c) Miles & Points have gotten progressively worth less and less over the years, I think it's a matter of YMMV.
YTD, I have been upgraded to domestic First on 44 percent of my flights with my primary carrier. I easily scored two r/t Business tickets to Japan on JAL on points for travel this past May. (Indeed, I get two tickets in J every year for travel to Europe or Asia going back to 2017) I have found r/t Business award tickets on transcontinental flights to JFK, BOS, and MIA earlier this year. My status is equivalent to oneworld Sapphire,* and all these award tickets were acquired with airline miles. (Transferable miles are mostly used for accommodations or occasionally for intra-European travel on ITA.)
That’s a pretty good summary. Once I had “lost” my Platinum status with QF and found myself scouring the web for reward seats, I found it simpler to book a premium economy seat to my desired destination and just put in an upgrade request for Business Class. If I wasn’t successful, so what? I can still enjoy the Premium cabin. Regarding using airline-branded credit cards, once they’re hooked you in with the bonus miles for...
That’s a pretty good summary. Once I had “lost” my Platinum status with QF and found myself scouring the web for reward seats, I found it simpler to book a premium economy seat to my desired destination and just put in an upgrade request for Business Class. If I wasn’t successful, so what? I can still enjoy the Premium cabin. Regarding using airline-branded credit cards, once they’re hooked you in with the bonus miles for signing up, it's not really worth the effort to maximise points, as I’ve found that the points-earning rules can be significantly reduced along the way.
The only things worse than airline loyalty programs are hotel and retail loyalty programs, which are complete scams now. I keep track of my credit card points, but nothing else is worth signing up for since they don’t care about your loyalty anyway, only your data to profit from.
And despite this post, I see more of those purple Amex Delta Reserve cards than ever. So what gives?
1) A lot of people value simplicity more than the “game” aspect of maximizing points and miles. This population is very different than the population from 10-15 years ago that came up on the Chase Sapphire Reserve, transferable points, etc. Much of this population may simply be paying out of pocket for premium flights instead of...
And despite this post, I see more of those purple Amex Delta Reserve cards than ever. So what gives?
1) A lot of people value simplicity more than the “game” aspect of maximizing points and miles. This population is very different than the population from 10-15 years ago that came up on the Chase Sapphire Reserve, transferable points, etc. Much of this population may simply be paying out of pocket for premium flights instead of relying on points.
2) If you take a decent amount of paid flights (either paid for out of your own pocket, your small business revenues, or your employers pocket), you tend to want your spending to add to your organic points earnings
3) Your airline card gets you benefits (lounge access, Resy, companion passes, whatever) that you value.
So it is simple - you like the product, you have the money to spend in cash on certain things, and your card gets you stuff you value. Maximizing is not something you focus on. The wealthiest people I know don’t maximize points - they earn a lot of money and spend how they please. Airline programs add on to that.
I'm in the small minority, but I think mileage programs have never been better for those with above average knowledge. CC points are constantly flowing and have never been easier to earn + all the advanced alert systems and websites which tell you when the best seats open up and a little bit of flexibility and you can always fly in biz/F for a low cost. For the average consumer things have undoubtedly gotten much...
I'm in the small minority, but I think mileage programs have never been better for those with above average knowledge. CC points are constantly flowing and have never been easier to earn + all the advanced alert systems and websites which tell you when the best seats open up and a little bit of flexibility and you can always fly in biz/F for a low cost. For the average consumer things have undoubtedly gotten much worse, but anyone reading this blog should be in at least the top quartile.
I’m not sure how it is in the US, it for me as a very frequent Traveller (LX HON and AF Ultimate), there are still benefits:
1. Preferred treatment if anything goes wrong. This has become a HUGE problem with LX and LH (and pushed me towards AF), but I know that I have absolutely nothing to worry about when something goes wrong. You can count on the best service level at every point.
I’m not sure how it is in the US, it for me as a very frequent Traveller (LX HON and AF Ultimate), there are still benefits:
1. Preferred treatment if anything goes wrong. This has become a HUGE problem with LX and LH (and pushed me towards AF), but I know that I have absolutely nothing to worry about when something goes wrong. You can count on the best service level at every point.
2. Since unbundling, best seat access has actually become a thing.
3. First class upgrade vouchers. Now available with AF and was always the case with LX and LX. Now, you can only usually have these confirmed just a day or two ahead, so that’s a little annoying and it wasn’t like that before. But I just managed to use some voucher to upgrade CDG-GRU to La Premiere last week and used vouchers on LX to upgrade a friend ZRH-DXB on both legs.
4. Lounge access is still differentiated for HON and Ultimate (AF has designated ultimate areas separated from the normal lounge…sometimes it’s a rope, but in Paris, there are a few of them and they are all hidden. I’m sitting in one now and there isn’t a soul here). LH gives F lounge access which is super top notch.
The problem with all of the programs now is: availability. I don’t seem to have too much trouble finding it, but the dynamic pricing is a huge disincentive: at AF I have come across even Biz class return CDG-GRU for 600,000 points. That’s just insane. La premiere is always 600,000….i remember before the pandemic flying LH F with mom for around 300,000 miles…that’s gives you an idea of the extraordinary devaluations that have occurred in a relatively short period of time…that’s the crux of the problem.
I think now the “game” is to separate “status” from the “miles”. I don’t even barely bother to look at my mileage balances anymore as mileage tickets have become insanely expensive. This is where the model broke for the consumer. The “miles” are practically worthless now…
I do wonder if this will turn around…but it’s doubtful…
Now, truth be told, a lot of my travel is corporate travel. I would never be able to maintain these statuses without the business travel as well…so the whole loyalty game probably makes zero sense anymore. Stump up for the best ticket you can afford and that’s it.
I have 170k chase points in an account I have to shut down to restructure debt. What program makes the most sense to transfer to considering I’ll lose them all if I don’t transfer
Rather than go for EP anymore (I've been an AA loyalist since 1991), I'm status matching to other programs to get lower level status in the domestic airlines, so I can always choose a seat and board early on a nonstop flight. That's the plan now, and so far it's working quite well! No more stress about trying to connect somewhere to earn my precious status!
Airlines are hurting themselves in the eyes of the consumer across multiple avenues:
1) degradation of program benefits - upgrades are almost non-existent, priority security screening is not an issue with better TSA programs, lounges are over-crowded and mediocre at best.
2) redemptions rates are outrageous - trying to earn a free flight used to be $25,000 in spend, now with dynamic pricing and 0.01 redemption rates on vast majority of flights it...
Airlines are hurting themselves in the eyes of the consumer across multiple avenues:
1) degradation of program benefits - upgrades are almost non-existent, priority security screening is not an issue with better TSA programs, lounges are over-crowded and mediocre at best.
2) redemptions rates are outrageous - trying to earn a free flight used to be $25,000 in spend, now with dynamic pricing and 0.01 redemption rates on vast majority of flights it takes $100k+ to earn a free flight. No thanks.
3) flight prices in the US are crazy. $1,000 used to be outliers and now they are the norm. Try to go anywhere that is a leisure destination from February to May at any reasonable time and prices are outrageous. Dynamic pricing is also a major frustration to consumers that makes them feel like they are getting screwed. Search for a route 1-2 times and you need to jump through so many hoops to get back to original prices.
Miles and status used to keep me loyal. Now with so many cuts, changes to earning status, and other financial factors I have 0 loyalty. It’s all about cost. I’m flying whatever gets me there fastest, cheapest in whatever cabin makes sense. My loyalty was built up over 20 years of travel to my preferred airline and that’s gone. Good luck to them when economy goes further south when they need me. I might be in the minority but I’m rooting for an economic downturn so that some of these companies that have squeezed the (US) consumer get their day of reckoning.
I am happy to say that the situation is different in Europe, when it comes to premium seat availability. My routes are usually towards Asia, and I do not have major problems finding award seats. Qatar plenty, Lufthansa group with a little flexibility, Singapore and Cathay less, but also…
So, the situation is a lot less frustrating if you’re based in Europe, and the basic idea - miles against expensive seats - still works…
I still haven’t figured out why anyone would still want to be loyal to Delta and accumulate their miles, when all Delta has done is give middle finger to its most loyal customers.
The redemption are always at astronomical prices and they’re the worst wasn’t free first class upgrades.
Ben,
1. Right on with your observations.
2. The continuous devaluation of points according to my calculations is at least 25% per annum across all FF programs.
3. Airline service will continue to degrade since executives are focusing on non flight revenue streams for profitably and are defocused on improving their core competency in providing reasonable airline service at a reasonable cost (how long are Delta and United going to continue with...
Ben,
1. Right on with your observations.
2. The continuous devaluation of points according to my calculations is at least 25% per annum across all FF programs.
3. Airline service will continue to degrade since executives are focusing on non flight revenue streams for profitably and are defocused on improving their core competency in providing reasonable airline service at a reasonable cost (how long are Delta and United going to continue with flying aircraft well beyond the max 25 years that the manufacturers recommend)
4. Are you going to go out of business or are the credit card referrals still profitable?
5. Why not deregulated US domestic flights to be operable by foreign carriers... Singapore Airlines, Qatar, Emirates etc are operating profitably and paying big bonuses to all employees and have superior service.
@ThrowAwayBrain sure is triggered today. She on fire! (Or maybe people just want to see her on fire?)
It's normal this time of the year, we're preparing for the 5th November celebrations.
I would rather credit my flights to foreign partner airlines if their miles didn't have a hard expiration date (most asian ailines). For a casual flyer or modest credit card spender, it can take years to accumulate enough miles for that aspirational redemption but you'll never get there if your miles expire before then.
This is something that airlines like United at least get right. If other airlines dropped the miles expiration, I would ditch...
I would rather credit my flights to foreign partner airlines if their miles didn't have a hard expiration date (most asian ailines). For a casual flyer or modest credit card spender, it can take years to accumulate enough miles for that aspirational redemption but you'll never get there if your miles expire before then.
This is something that airlines like United at least get right. If other airlines dropped the miles expiration, I would ditch UA in a heartbeat.
Having said that, status with the US airlines can still be useful for a more comfortable positioning flight. Nice to have but not worth chasing.
I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. These programs are just not that valuable anymore. Being diamond, 1k, exec platinum, etc just means they you get free checked bags, and can pick your seat for free. Honestly, to your point it’s not like I’m not going to take free money or perks, but I’ve completely stopped moving my business at the margin based on FF programs, I just take the most direct routing...
I think you’ve hit the nail on the head. These programs are just not that valuable anymore. Being diamond, 1k, exec platinum, etc just means they you get free checked bags, and can pick your seat for free. Honestly, to your point it’s not like I’m not going to take free money or perks, but I’ve completely stopped moving my business at the margin based on FF programs, I just take the most direct routing and convenient time now regrdless of airline (ok well maybe not spirit etc).
Other than to get Sign Up Bonus or top off for an award, I do not worry about air miles or collecting status.
I find Chase to Hyatt and Hilton Amex HHonors… at least today …the most predictable and stable points venue.
First and business international is just too unpredictable. AA, AS, and Flying blue in the back of bus is at least available….
As I approached retirement, my business travels significantly decreased. I weaned myself off the airline frequent traveler merry-go-round. I told anyone who would listen that “My status is not having status”. Never felt better. You guys aren’t getting your upgrades anymore. A free checked bag for your loyalty? Whoopdydoo! Boarding Group #4 instead of #6? That’s nice. Post-retirement, it feels even better. We fly about four meaningful trips per year; PE across oceans and continents,...
As I approached retirement, my business travels significantly decreased. I weaned myself off the airline frequent traveler merry-go-round. I told anyone who would listen that “My status is not having status”. Never felt better. You guys aren’t getting your upgrades anymore. A free checked bag for your loyalty? Whoopdydoo! Boarding Group #4 instead of #6? That’s nice. Post-retirement, it feels even better. We fly about four meaningful trips per year; PE across oceans and continents, and extra leg room economy domestically. F if I’m feeling plucky and the upcharge doesn’t exceed $1 / minute. No airline loyalty! Don’t want it and don’t need it!
I do agree with you. I’m a senior on a budget and have relied on a few programs in the past to help subsidize travel. Unfortunately this has become difficult due to the lack of award options or the enormous number of miles/points needed. Sadly I’m not able to travel much anymore
AA advantage does not have any access to Qatar, Cathay ex Asia through all of 26 into October. I am sure those carriers have access to connections on AA. It’s time that if those programs don’t stop this access to own program only they should lose partner status, antitrust immunity and no longer be allowed to sell flight beyond its arrival port. It is just plan wrong and I hope government kills the credit card...
AA advantage does not have any access to Qatar, Cathay ex Asia through all of 26 into October. I am sure those carriers have access to connections on AA. It’s time that if those programs don’t stop this access to own program only they should lose partner status, antitrust immunity and no longer be allowed to sell flight beyond its arrival port. It is just plan wrong and I hope government kills the credit card game as it has become a joke, ok, buy some miles but no longer earning on buying groceries.
Realtedly, as a content idea, would really love to see you do a series of reviews on the international premium select cabins. At least on the Big 3 US airlines and potentially also their major partners. Given these trends, I would think a lot more readers would find this relevant and useful.
Is that actual premium economy or the 'Y with a bit more legroom' sort of thing
I meant the actual premium economy cabins that use seats similar to domestic first class - Premium Select on Delta, Premium Plus on United, Premium Economy on American
Yes, it's quite interesting that these don't seem to get a lot of reviews while they can vary quite wildly in terms of the passenger experience.
Ben, a very timely and soul-searching deep dive. Had long term loyalty to EAL, CO, and finally UA. In the beginning upgrades were the norm and FC Tix plentiful, Then not. My only reminder of the lobster days is my lifetime Premiere 1K. Living in Europe, my last remaining Benny is access to excellent LH and other Star Alliance clubs.
You ask where is this all going. Pay very close attention to the retail and...
Ben, a very timely and soul-searching deep dive. Had long term loyalty to EAL, CO, and finally UA. In the beginning upgrades were the norm and FC Tix plentiful, Then not. My only reminder of the lobster days is my lifetime Premiere 1K. Living in Europe, my last remaining Benny is access to excellent LH and other Star Alliance clubs.
You ask where is this all going. Pay very close attention to the retail and restaurant businesses. That who is paying for all your bennies. Yes, they get customers from credit card programs. But most don't. However, the rates these merchants, especially the smaller ones pay, are escalating sharply, forcing lower profits or higher customer costs.
Ben, it won't happen immediately, but some merchants are charging customers a fee to use their cards. And still others are no no longer taking plastic, except for debit cards,
We don't have this problem in Europe because of bank regulations, limiting rates. And perhaps you don't know this, but most Europeans either use debit cards, or have cards that must be paid off every month.
I still fly biz or FC. But I use an old fashioned payment method: cash.
Loyalty... to whom, why and what for? About 10-15 years ago, airlines killed the loyalty programs they created in the 1980s and 1990s. They swapped flying client loyalty for extra income from both passengers and non-flying customers alike as long as they are cardholders. I used to be an AA Executive Platinum loyal customer. In the past 10 years, I don't mind which airline I fly as long as it's safe, the flight is convenient...
Loyalty... to whom, why and what for? About 10-15 years ago, airlines killed the loyalty programs they created in the 1980s and 1990s. They swapped flying client loyalty for extra income from both passengers and non-flying customers alike as long as they are cardholders. I used to be an AA Executive Platinum loyal customer. In the past 10 years, I don't mind which airline I fly as long as it's safe, the flight is convenient and the ticket is cheap –the same criteria I use to buy stuff at any store.
@C7edw
"...In the past 10 years, I don't mind which airline I fly as long as it's safe, the flight is convenient and the ticket is cheap –the same criteria I use to buy stuff at any store."
Exactly this. For me, this has always been the case. Well the ticket in the cabin I prefer is at a price point I am comfortable with, would be the only clarification I would make.
For OPM flyers, its essentially tax free cashback for their miserable lifestyle. No harm in collecting some miles while not paying.
I don't care airline loyalty at all since I know sooner or later they will screw you over. To me there is also very little benefit to status with airlines. My points are generally used to transfer into an airline with a good redemption for a business class tix. That ticket grants me most of the benefits of elite status so who cares.
I just booked a trip for 2 with miles. AF J from USA west coast east, Polaris home, QR J on a leg from Tunisia to Doha…
I didn’t use any special award booking sites. Just AF, BA, United websites. Yes I paid 100k AF miles for that leg, but that’s a reasonable price. It’s not the lowest price, but the trip you can book is better than the
I am 71 and got into the Loyalty game when it all begain in the early 80s. Boy was it fun then. Mainly because redemptions were reasonable and easy to access. Being a United 1K in the late 80s and early 90s meant something....As did being a Lifetime SPG Platinum. At the turn of the century it started to get more challenging though being an EK Platinum 12 yrs ago was still significant. As was...
I am 71 and got into the Loyalty game when it all begain in the early 80s. Boy was it fun then. Mainly because redemptions were reasonable and easy to access. Being a United 1K in the late 80s and early 90s meant something....As did being a Lifetime SPG Platinum. At the turn of the century it started to get more challenging though being an EK Platinum 12 yrs ago was still significant. As was being HON with LH 10 yrs ago. The decline in value for loyalty has been steep in the past decade and at this point of time I have to say that I am not sure it is worth all that much. One can rarely if ever redeem for a free F on AF or EK or QF....heck even on BA. A million BONVOY points still dont score you more than a basic free room at a luxury resort. To ask "Is it worth it?" is a legitimate question.
I have gradually migrated to Amex Membership Rewards and/or Chase Ultimate Rewards because the flexibility of these currencies and the ability to monetize the benefit without the "agida" of Airline and Hotel programs seems a better alternative to the rat race.
You speak of it having been fun in the 80s; I couldn’t agree more. My travels were much tamer than yours, but in the early 90s was when triple miles were a thing. Each segment. I was traveling a lot of manageable, short trips that involved four USAirways legs. I had more miles and upgrade certificates than I knew what to do with. The halcyon days for sure.
I think US Airlines are sitting on a profit bubble with Loyalty Programs that isn't fully sustainable. It really comes down to buyer motivation and how quickly people clue in to the hole. When we accrue FF miles, we're occupying one of two personas:
The Flyer - We buy tickets for cash (with our money or our employer's) and travel based on our preferences. For doing this, we get rewarded by the program in terms...
I think US Airlines are sitting on a profit bubble with Loyalty Programs that isn't fully sustainable. It really comes down to buyer motivation and how quickly people clue in to the hole. When we accrue FF miles, we're occupying one of two personas:
The Flyer - We buy tickets for cash (with our money or our employer's) and travel based on our preferences. For doing this, we get rewarded by the program in terms of FF miles and status.
The Credit Card User - We make purchases living our lives and we want rewards for doing so. We're looking for value from those rewards and we believe that sometimes the best value is in FF miles.
For the Flyer, Loyalty programs used to offer so much vaue for the Economy flyer that they encouraged irrational purchasing. Economy flyers would buy more expensive tickets and deal with more travel headaches, all for a good shot at a seat at the front of the plane and FF Miles they could get crazy good value out of. Because airlines are largely phasing out those upgrades by driving incremental revenue, they're draining that willingness to make irrational purchases. I'm still happy to get FF Miles from my preferred airline, but I'm not going to go out of my way to get them. In a way, this is freeing as a consumer, since I was going to take that flight anyway, I don't need to care as much if the FF mies are worth as much as they would be in another program. I think US Airlines don't mind trading irrational spending for incremental revenue because they're depending more and more on the second persona.
For the Credit Card user, there's actual hard value in the points they're earning since there's an opportunity cost against cash back. If FF Miles don't return better value, there's no reason to accumulate them. This is where airlines are riding customer ignorance for as long as it lasts. In the CC world, it seems there's a hard floor of 1.0 CPP compared to cash back. In reality, that hard floor is higher. Cash is worth more than FF Miles at the same exchange rate. Better to have $100 in cash that $100 worth of SkyMiles. If I'm going to restrain what my rewards can buy, I have to see better value. This might seem to line up fine with what airlines are doing, but 1.0 CPP isn't the real floor. The real floor is 1.25 CPP because that's what you can get from the Chase travel portal. Since that's much more flexible than FF Miles with a single airline, my question for any Airline hoping to get my CC spend in their program is "how much better than 1.25 CPP are you going to do?". If you let me book any ticket I want, you have to do a little better. If want want me to chase down rare rewards, you have to do a lot better. An Airline that can't even hit the floor shouldn't see a dime from CC revenue, even if the customer likes the airline.
This why I think the gravy train will slow as consumer awareness grows. Delta, for exampe can continue to do well with the Flyer just by offering a reliable, reasonable operation. For a savvy Credit Card user though, they'll either need to forgo that revenue or get SkyMiles back up in the 1.4-1.8 range consistently while placing no limits on booking. If they want to make award availability harder to come by, they'd probably need to go up to 1.8-2.5 CPP. I'll bet that would make the financials less rosy.
Purely a leisure traveler so hard to maintain status. AA Plat and won't even make Gold this year. Focusing on the transferable points currencies to get the redemptions I want.
I've never considered pursuing status until this year, getting Atmos Silver via award flights and CC spend on the Summit card. Next year I'll pursue Atmos Gold, mainly because the CC spend will be mostly organic (and I can pursue the 100K companion award). I'll use that to gauge the value of pursuing Atmos Gold in the future (I can easily maintain Silver going forward with Summit card spending alone).
When it comes to the...
I've never considered pursuing status until this year, getting Atmos Silver via award flights and CC spend on the Summit card. Next year I'll pursue Atmos Gold, mainly because the CC spend will be mostly organic (and I can pursue the 100K companion award). I'll use that to gauge the value of pursuing Atmos Gold in the future (I can easily maintain Silver going forward with Summit card spending alone).
When it comes to the value of points/miles, I've decided that I'm not going to worry about getting the best deal and focus on getting to where I'm going. I'll still look for saver fares, but I also spent 140k Avios to fly Qsuites in February rather than holding out for a saver fare to show up. If I can find a better option, I'll sure switch to it, but I'm comfortable knowing I'm set for my trip.
I fly Alaska regularly, but buy their Saver fares, which only generate 30% of the TQM of other classes of travel. My calculation is that I save more on the cheap seats now than I'd earn in points later on.
If airlines are selling seats at loss to help fun their mileage programs, why not take advantage of the cheapest way to get from point A to B?
I fly once a year TATL and once a year TPAC in J. I choose by schedule and fare. I never much think about the miles, except to make sure my AA miles don't expire. This provides me enough miles for my once a year domestic F flight. I'm happy for the bonus, but don't count on it lasting. I never think about status.
It's been this way for YEARS, honestly. You have to have a multi-pronged approach. Looking at our flights this year I think we've done nearly a dozen permutations of Cash, Cash equivalent points purchase, Points, Transferrable points, MUAs, PlusPoints, etc.
Having even a tiny bit of flexibility is always a huge asset in finding deals. Knowing how to use the various search tools out there is also essential. The only real change I've been...
It's been this way for YEARS, honestly. You have to have a multi-pronged approach. Looking at our flights this year I think we've done nearly a dozen permutations of Cash, Cash equivalent points purchase, Points, Transferrable points, MUAs, PlusPoints, etc.
Having even a tiny bit of flexibility is always a huge asset in finding deals. Knowing how to use the various search tools out there is also essential. The only real change I've been considering (and you alluded to here) is that there's heaps of good partner deals on American, and all of my OneWorld eggs are in the British and Qantas baskets right now... Might try to change that in 2026.
I agree and disagree with this. AA and to a lesser extent, AS are really the only domestic programs worth earning miles in any more. Close-in JAL availability is still plentiful enough to make those miles valuable, but other than that, I don't really collect any domestic airline miles any more. You are right that availability is nearly gone on a lot of routes. I have friends in Brazil and with UA locking all their...
I agree and disagree with this. AA and to a lesser extent, AS are really the only domestic programs worth earning miles in any more. Close-in JAL availability is still plentiful enough to make those miles valuable, but other than that, I don't really collect any domestic airline miles any more. You are right that availability is nearly gone on a lot of routes. I have friends in Brazil and with UA locking all their J availability down to their own devalued program, I'm pretty sure I'm just going to be booking cash Y fares and hoping for a cheap paid upgrade at this point for all South America travel. I have my honeymoon coming up in 2027, I'm going to burn pretty much all my MR and UR on that and I don't think I'll be trying as hard to earn miles after that. It's unfortunate, but the walls really are closing in as far as booking premium cabins, and if I can't book premium cabins, I may as well focus on cash back. You're right that status is nearly worthless now too. I scored AA Plat Pro vis challenge during Covid and that was fun because travel was still down and upgrades were plentiful but I'm sure that's not the case now, and don't even get me started on lounge access. If there is always a wait list exceeding your layover length, then what's the point?
It's come to a point that the lowest level (for example, silver) is beneficial but the higher levels are not worth any effort.
100% - once you can select seats for free and get free checked bags, you’ve basically maxed out the value.
On UA, Gold is the sweet spot for lounge access and E+. But it boggles the mind they expect $12k spend; which is what used to earn 1K
BAD! Article says "As we all know, the major US airlines essentially operate as loss leaders for their loyalty programs — they might not make a lot of money actually directly transporting passengers, but they do make a lot of money from their programs."
That might be like saying the husband is the leader and the stay at home wife (or husband of the husband) is the loss leader. No, both are important.
I completely agree with this article. I did get a Fidelity card recently - and I'm up 18% (in the 5 months I've owned FXAIX), which is the opposite of miles. Is that sustainable? Probably not at that rate. But long term, it will appreciate versus this airline mile ecosystem.
Loyalty can help with very niche cases (unpopular routes for upgrades), but frankly it definitely isn't worth me spending $10-15k / year so I can...
I completely agree with this article. I did get a Fidelity card recently - and I'm up 18% (in the 5 months I've owned FXAIX), which is the opposite of miles. Is that sustainable? Probably not at that rate. But long term, it will appreciate versus this airline mile ecosystem.
Loyalty can help with very niche cases (unpopular routes for upgrades), but frankly it definitely isn't worth me spending $10-15k / year so I can visit an international business/first lounge a few times a year.
I think it depends on your individual situation. I fly semi-regularly for business. We are restricted to economy tickets unless flying overseas. The main benefit as a Delta GM is the frequent upgrade to C+, which makes a difference returning after a long week on a client site. Likewise the priority check in and early boarding make travel just a bit easier. I get just enough Skypesos to cover a domestic flight or two for...
I think it depends on your individual situation. I fly semi-regularly for business. We are restricted to economy tickets unless flying overseas. The main benefit as a Delta GM is the frequent upgrade to C+, which makes a difference returning after a long week on a client site. Likewise the priority check in and early boarding make travel just a bit easier. I get just enough Skypesos to cover a domestic flight or two for me and my wife each year, so that's a money saver for me. This adds up to real value because as a business traveler I'm not paying Delta with my own money.
Do I bank Skypesos for that annual splurge trip? Of course not - credit card points are far more effective. Do I wish first class upgrades happened more often? Absolutely. Would I advise someone paying for flights with their own money to chase airline status? Never. But it works in my particular situation as long as I keep realistic expectations.
I feel you. The cost-benefit analysis doesn’t make sense anymore. I have a couple of million miles ”in the bank” that I try to use, but I’ve stopped chasing status (since the benfits aren’t there anymore) and am somewhat looking forward to becoming a free agent and just book with whatever airline has the cheapest business class ticket.
Maybe I'm an outlier but I continue to see benefit in pursuing status (Delta in my situation). 95% of my travel is for work and is largely international, but we are limited to economy or at most premium economy if the price is within a certain window. I'm also based in a city that is not a massive Delta operation, so my upgrade percentage is still quite high on domestic flights. Diamond gives me upgrades...
Maybe I'm an outlier but I continue to see benefit in pursuing status (Delta in my situation). 95% of my travel is for work and is largely international, but we are limited to economy or at most premium economy if the price is within a certain window. I'm also based in a city that is not a massive Delta operation, so my upgrade percentage is still quite high on domestic flights. Diamond gives me upgrades that I can use for the critical flights over the Pacific. I fully agree that miles redemptions are pretty lousy for anything aspirational, but I can book domestic flights for personal trips at an acceptable rate for what I need.
I've never understood the idea of chasing status just to have it, but as a tool to improve my business travel comfort it remains valuable.
and does your company have a corporate or negotiated agreement with Delta? Do they have it with any other airline and, if so, why do you choose DL?
The point is that the calculus of status changes when someone else is paying for the ticket; DL carries more corporate and negotiated revenue than any other US airline - probably any airline in the world.
Your company spends the money, you get the mileage and you...
and does your company have a corporate or negotiated agreement with Delta? Do they have it with any other airline and, if so, why do you choose DL?
The point is that the calculus of status changes when someone else is paying for the ticket; DL carries more corporate and negotiated revenue than any other US airline - probably any airline in the world.
Your company spends the money, you get the mileage and you get to decide how to pursue the status.
and there are many more loyal DL passengers in their non-hub cities than people realize. DL has figured out far better than AA or UA how to serve both small and medium sized cities that have decent amounts of business travel as well large cities that have high concentrations of corporate travel.
AA had the potential to rival DL but has strategically failed to DL in NYC, LAX and BOS while UA is far too focused on flying to exotic secondary and tertiary international cities that have no corporate travel value.
Chasing status doesn't make sense but when someone else pays for your travel and you get to choose how to maximize the loyalty program benefits, it can be a very lucrative proposition for you as a business traveler. Delta realized how to focus on that segment and do it better than any other airline - probably on the planet.
and then they have built the Amex system for people that do much of their own travel spending for business or leisure and DL has still integrated Amex into its corporate travel agreements.
While I love Delta for the convenience of non stop flights (I live in a Delta hub), anytime I had a trip to Asia that involved a connection, I gave up any loyalty to Delta and flew an Asian airline. If I had to connect somewhere to go to Singapore, Hong Kong, Jakarta, etc... I would always fly to SFO or LAX on Delta and then fly business class on Singapore or Cathay onwards. The experience was night and day.
We don't have a negotiated agreement with any of the airlines. As long as I book a US flag carrier I can go with anyone (assuming pricing is within a reasonable range of the cheapest option).
I chose Delta primarily because of best connections when I was mostly flying domestic. Once I transitioned to international I saw no need to switch that up, particularly since they also have great connections for my Europe needs...
We don't have a negotiated agreement with any of the airlines. As long as I book a US flag carrier I can go with anyone (assuming pricing is within a reasonable range of the cheapest option).
I chose Delta primarily because of best connections when I was mostly flying domestic. Once I transitioned to international I saw no need to switch that up, particularly since they also have great connections for my Europe needs and a strong schedule for Japan.
At this point I'm one trip a way from million miler so there's that pull to stay the course, plus I'm generally more than happy with the quality of service so there's nothing to push me away. I never looked at status as a way to get free aspirational flights but just as a way to smooth the journey, which it still does for me.
thanks for the additional color.
It is interesting that you note that you are required? to book a US carrier for international travel. That is interesting in light of the comment directly above yours.
I suspect your company is not alone and the number of people that book US airlines in competitive markets because of policies like this is a lot higher than the anecdotal comments on aviation social media would suggest
I am talking old days when I worked for a multinational company. When you have too many employees, you have to use a travel system elected by the company and usually the system will give you the best fares so within a range of price you can only select the flights that fall into that bucket. I was lucky that flying business class on Singapore and Cathay was always within the price range of flying...
I am talking old days when I worked for a multinational company. When you have too many employees, you have to use a travel system elected by the company and usually the system will give you the best fares so within a range of price you can only select the flights that fall into that bucket. I was lucky that flying business class on Singapore and Cathay was always within the price range of flying Delta. Now, more and more companies that are smaller and more nimble are letting employees go directly to an airline website and book their tickets. That was my case for the last 11 years and Delta was my first choice for the convenience of non stop flights but when having to connect anyway I always hopped around and got what was more comfortable within a decent price range.
and that is why DL's push to gain share in major markets has worked well for them, just as it has for the "national airlines" of other countries.
The US industry was deregulated almost 50 years ago; DL figured out better than its competitors that being the largest legacy carrier in as many cities as possible is what will result in the greatest revenue.
Network and loyalty programs work hand in hand
I got tbh Ben, AAdvantage still delivers for me both in terms of redemptions as well as in terms of upgrades. One World Emerald here. Of course things could be better, but I’m not despondent about the state of the program.
If one can make the mid level where they might get EP/MCE/CP complimentary than it's likely worth chasing status. If you're a more well to do consumer that only flys 2-4 times a year (there's more of these kind of flyers than people think) you're better off just buying the best priced premium(or EP/CP/MCE) that fits your schedule needs.
I think the thing you're missing is that today, having airline status and co-brand credit cards makes traveling in economy significantly better.
With mid-level airline status, you get access to Economy Plus / Comfort Plus / Main Cabin Extra seats for free at time of booking. These seats make traveling in economy significantly more comfortable as you get extra legroom seats at the front of the plane. With American and Delta, you also get free...
I think the thing you're missing is that today, having airline status and co-brand credit cards makes traveling in economy significantly better.
With mid-level airline status, you get access to Economy Plus / Comfort Plus / Main Cabin Extra seats for free at time of booking. These seats make traveling in economy significantly more comfortable as you get extra legroom seats at the front of the plane. With American and Delta, you also get free alcoholic drinks. With Delta, you also get early boarding and better snacks (basically the first class snack basket) on flights > 900 miles. These tickets often sell for $100+ per flight and they make traveling in economy significantly better - so it is a big benefit to get these seats at time of booking for free, especially if you fly many flights per year with the airline.
Preminum Airline co-brand credit cards provide access to airline lounges which makes traveling significantly more comfortable, especially if you are traveling in domestic economy, where full meals are not served. Given the price of food and drinks at airports today, it is logical for many consumers to get these cards for lounge access.
For a frequent biz traveler it provides a ton of value. I earn status on flights work is paying for. Sure, upgrades are slim, but I’m taken care of during irrops and get confirmed on a different flight or I’m number 1 on the standby list. Also, earning 11x miles per dollar instead of 5x is pretty great.
Another thought is not just award availability, but the massive rapid redemption inflation as well. Skypesos,...
For a frequent biz traveler it provides a ton of value. I earn status on flights work is paying for. Sure, upgrades are slim, but I’m taken care of during irrops and get confirmed on a different flight or I’m number 1 on the standby list. Also, earning 11x miles per dollar instead of 5x is pretty great.
Another thought is not just award availability, but the massive rapid redemption inflation as well. Skypesos, United has gotten worse, AA’s huge deval this year. Not to mention hotel points deval...
When they started minting miles based on "spend" and OPM flyers started earning thousands on a single ticket, that's when inflation hit.
I do think a lot of people in hub cities default their loyalty to one carrier.
I live near a Delta hub and on a popular route the upgrade list each time is so long that only the very top tier would even get a comfort plus upgrade.
There also seems to be some social currency for certain people to mention they have status.
The airlines have done a solid job of...
I do think a lot of people in hub cities default their loyalty to one carrier.
I live near a Delta hub and on a popular route the upgrade list each time is so long that only the very top tier would even get a comfort plus upgrade.
There also seems to be some social currency for certain people to mention they have status.
The airlines have done a solid job of making people proud to have a high annual spend with their company. For other business it would seem weird to mention your level of spending with a company. For example not many people would care to know if someone spent more than $10k per year at Costco.
As most things in life, it all depends on ones specific situation. When I was younger and working and traveling for multinational companies, I was very into airline and hotel loyalty since I was basically getting "free" miles and points as my company was paying for my travels. It was nice to have status, get upgrades since corporate policy was strict and I could not book a suite or sometimes business class. Fast forward to...
As most things in life, it all depends on ones specific situation. When I was younger and working and traveling for multinational companies, I was very into airline and hotel loyalty since I was basically getting "free" miles and points as my company was paying for my travels. It was nice to have status, get upgrades since corporate policy was strict and I could not book a suite or sometimes business class. Fast forward to today, I work by myself, I pay for my trips and I love the freedom of me choosing where and how to spend my money. I totally gave up on hotel loyalty since the pandemic and currently only have status from credit cards. I basically have had zero nights in most top hotel loyalty programs in the past few years. I stay where it is more convenient for me and give preference for small boutique hotels. As for airlines, the loyalty comes from convenience. I am "loyal" to Delta because I live in a Delta hub and Delta happens to be the most convenient airline for my needs. What do I mean by convenience? Non stop flights. Now, I will always have status with Delta because I am a 2MM miler but I will not go out of my way to book with them. If I am located in a city where another airline is more convenient, I will chose that airline vs Delta.
My main interest in loyalty programs was always collection of points and miles. Have had many J-class award flights and free hotel nights in the past.
Alas, every year I am more disillusioned about these programs. I used to like Miles and More (am still Senator), however, M&M, together with LHG services, in the last years deteriorated so much that I do not see any benefits anymore. Not even J-class award with LH. Same...
My main interest in loyalty programs was always collection of points and miles. Have had many J-class award flights and free hotel nights in the past.
Alas, every year I am more disillusioned about these programs. I used to like Miles and More (am still Senator), however, M&M, together with LHG services, in the last years deteriorated so much that I do not see any benefits anymore. Not even J-class award with LH. Same goes for BA. Meh. The competition has simply evolved...
This year I made KrisFlyer my main program, just because SQ services, on the ground or in the air, are simply on another level. I do not have high expectations of the program itself, but let's see.
Within a few years, the airlines will simply set aside most of their saver availability seats for its status members. That alone will provide the incentive to keep earning status. Given the lack of upgrades, saver availability on key routes is the whole game.
We're starting to see the beginnings of it now (X% off miles redemption if you hold a co-brand card).
"I live in X city and fly Y airline most often, and therefore I should use the credit card from Y airline for my spending" My loyalty is with United not because I love United but because if you live near IAH you can get nonstops to the most locations. If I can fly direct at 10am rather than have to wake up at 3am to connect through Miami to get to Saint Thomas, I'll...
"I live in X city and fly Y airline most often, and therefore I should use the credit card from Y airline for my spending" My loyalty is with United not because I love United but because if you live near IAH you can get nonstops to the most locations. If I can fly direct at 10am rather than have to wake up at 3am to connect through Miami to get to Saint Thomas, I'll pay up for that unless the difference is substantial. So I get their credit card because it makes travelling with them just a little bit easier and I can save just a little bit of money. But sure, as soon as I have to connect no matter which airline, I really don't care if i'm going through United.
While we (readers of this blog) seek out outsized value with business and first international redemptions, I'd be willing to bet that many, maybe the majority, of participants are happy with economy bookings. Points are a way to make travel cheaper/attainable for many, and I think many are more interested in getting to take the trip itself vs. how they get there and back. I've known many people who cash in points to go visit...
While we (readers of this blog) seek out outsized value with business and first international redemptions, I'd be willing to bet that many, maybe the majority, of participants are happy with economy bookings. Points are a way to make travel cheaper/attainable for many, and I think many are more interested in getting to take the trip itself vs. how they get there and back. I've known many people who cash in points to go visit family, be able to afford a trip to Disney, etc.
I've never had anything but a low tier status on an airline or two, and I don't see that changing soon, but I'll keep chasing points for now. I'm lucky to have a fair amount of flexibility in my travels to make use of them. Though my current effort to find a way home from NZ in business on an upcoming trip I feel is pushing my luck...
I’m happy with economy bookings, especially on better foreign airlines. Flew all over Asia in coach with my family this summer, and it was great—because we loved the places we went. Based on this blog post, I think Lucky might actually be moving over to the dark side with me. When you’re buying tickets for a family of four or more, chasing seats up front isn’t worth it. Points are still helpful, primarily for their...
I’m happy with economy bookings, especially on better foreign airlines. Flew all over Asia in coach with my family this summer, and it was great—because we loved the places we went. Based on this blog post, I think Lucky might actually be moving over to the dark side with me. When you’re buying tickets for a family of four or more, chasing seats up front isn’t worth it. Points are still helpful, primarily for their refundability on international flights, and a domestic hub airline credit card can be worth it for free bags, but there’s no reason for family leisure travelers to chase airline status and free lounge access for two or three trips a year.
For anyone who's not very tall and/or wide, Y is absolutely fine up to about 4 hours at a time. It starts getting a bit tedious at that point and, to me at least, it gets unbearable at around the 7 hour mark. Anything more than 8 hours and I'm definitely out. However, that doesn't have to mean spending a fortune on F tickets.
For my long haul trips, I use a combination of...
For anyone who's not very tall and/or wide, Y is absolutely fine up to about 4 hours at a time. It starts getting a bit tedious at that point and, to me at least, it gets unbearable at around the 7 hour mark. Anything more than 8 hours and I'm definitely out. However, that doesn't have to mean spending a fortune on F tickets.
For my long haul trips, I use a combination of award tickets and business class offers, even if they require a positioning flight. Where neither option is available, I can still fly in economy but I'll strategically use connections to avoid long segments. Crossing the Atlantic via KEF, going from Europe to the UAE via ATH/IST or West Africa via Lisbon etc means having the opportunity to avoid the claustrophobia and misery that comes with long haul Y flights.
There's also premium economy, but it tends to be pretty expensive for what it is - probably makes sense for certain redemptions though.
My family’s long haul flights this summer on Qatar and Singapore (both booked with miles) in economy were good despite me being over 6 ft. That said, we do a thing where we book a row of three then put the fourth person on the aisle in front of that row. That ensures that the seat in front of me won’t be reclined and provides a little extra shoulder room with a child in the...
My family’s long haul flights this summer on Qatar and Singapore (both booked with miles) in economy were good despite me being over 6 ft. That said, we do a thing where we book a row of three then put the fourth person on the aisle in front of that row. That ensures that the seat in front of me won’t be reclined and provides a little extra shoulder room with a child in the middle seat in my row. Provides a decent experience even when economy is full, which it most often was.
Sylvester Stallone said that you're either in the game or out of the game. The credit card/loyalty program hobby is a game. The average person isn't in the game. Of those in the game, skilled players win & unskilled players don't. Football great Vince Lombardi said that very few have the will to prepare to win. Casually reading the blogs isn't enough. It's not going to be handed to a person. It takes work, experimentation, & persistence.
In the P&M game, Ants eat and Grasshoppers dance!
My theory for the non-enthusiasts like us is more the allure of travel than anything. Ohhhh I can get the gold delta amex for $100 and then go on a free vacation? Amazing! Then they use the miles to fly main cabin to Cancun and are thrilled. Instant brand loyalty, not realizing with their spending patterns it'll take 5-10 years before they can do it again.
I have always found this points and miles stuff crazy. And the justifications used for being involved, from I get a phone number to call when things go wrong to all manner of other excuses amusing. If you have to spend thousands for that security of a number to call, seems to me it would be more financially sound to just purchase travel insurance. So there is little validity to such an excuse.
I...
I have always found this points and miles stuff crazy. And the justifications used for being involved, from I get a phone number to call when things go wrong to all manner of other excuses amusing. If you have to spend thousands for that security of a number to call, seems to me it would be more financially sound to just purchase travel insurance. So there is little validity to such an excuse.
I have only ever reached "elite level" twice. Gold level on AA, last year and this year due to business travel and 1 personal trip each year on AA's partners. I notice no difference in having this level and having none. Same boarding priority provided by work and the gold status; and my personal trips are booked in business class at a minimum.
While I can certainly understand accruing miles organically via work trips, these circuitous routings and mileage run things that people do are just so bizarre and a waste of life.
If the programs have been devalued the continued sucking at the teat is so strange.
I don't chase top tier elite status but being based in a hub get there by default - so maybe that makes it different but for me the 'phone number to call' / priority handling during IRROPS is by far what I value the most.
Those are actually great reasons to stay away from Delta. I'd stick with Southwest until the new rules in January then switch to United.
Alright, here's my deal: I live in Europe, in a town roughly two hours from three airports. Of the big Euro three, only LHG has a hub in one of the airports. IAG has spotty connectivity and complicated routings. AFKL has something like 20 frequencies a day from these airports to CDG and AMS, usually around.
My job involves travel, but, as a public employee, even PE would be considered a luxury.
With...
Alright, here's my deal: I live in Europe, in a town roughly two hours from three airports. Of the big Euro three, only LHG has a hub in one of the airports. IAG has spotty connectivity and complicated routings. AFKL has something like 20 frequencies a day from these airports to CDG and AMS, usually around.
My job involves travel, but, as a public employee, even PE would be considered a luxury.
With Star Alliance and my travel patterns, there's no chance I'd get even FF status. With FB, I'm platinum. Sure, connecting doubles the chances of irrops, but it's half the price. And that magic number works miracles. Sure, every customer should be able to contact someone who can solve their issues, but that's not how it is.
I remember losing 45 minutes in line at the transfer desk, because, in the rush to rebook after a flight went tech, I went through the wrong door and three people got ahead of me. Still, when I went to board my flight three hours later, there were people waiting in line. I don't have to do that anymore, and I pay less for my tickets. How is that an excuse with little validity?
Absolutely, evaluate the cost, and don't take a sucker deal.
As a very-long-time reader, I appreciate your candor on the subject. Other bloggers just want to keep the music playing because they're making a living off their hobby -- why sound defeated when you can pretend everything is fine? You're right, though: redemptions aren't inspiring for most people anymore. In 2012, I was single and took a whirlwind trip around Asia, hopping between Cathay First and fifth-freedom flights in Qatar Business. Now, it's about getting...
As a very-long-time reader, I appreciate your candor on the subject. Other bloggers just want to keep the music playing because they're making a living off their hobby -- why sound defeated when you can pretend everything is fine? You're right, though: redemptions aren't inspiring for most people anymore. In 2012, I was single and took a whirlwind trip around Asia, hopping between Cathay First and fifth-freedom flights in Qatar Business. Now, it's about getting from point A to point B for free, even in economy to that wedding in Indiana. And flying my parents around in domestic first so they feel kinda special. That still means something, but its made me lost interest in far-flung trip reports on airlines I'll never again fly for free. It was good while it lasted!
The appeal of status for me is complimentary upgrades to economy plus. I do a fair amount of domestic business travel and the company policy is that we fly in economy. Some managers don't mind if you pay for economy plus on cross-country flights, but even then we're not supposed to make a habit of it. Being able to book economy plus at no cost makes my trips noticeably more pleasant. Obviously you don't need...
The appeal of status for me is complimentary upgrades to economy plus. I do a fair amount of domestic business travel and the company policy is that we fly in economy. Some managers don't mind if you pay for economy plus on cross-country flights, but even then we're not supposed to make a habit of it. Being able to book economy plus at no cost makes my trips noticeably more pleasant. Obviously you don't need to chase high status tiers for that perk as lower tier status will do. I also fly into a lot of smaller airports on CRJs, and it seems like I get an upgrade to first about half the time with AA platinum status.
I think the value proposition for putting spending on airline credit cards is underwhelming. I think there are cash back cards that make more sense when you factor in the convenience and simplicity.
I find value, but I'm the guy most frequent flyers hate, as I get almost all my AA miles and Platinum Pro status from credit card spend and online shopping. Every year I earn enough for my wife and I to fly business on a nice vacation. In the past few years, we flew business to Spain, Africa in Q Suite, Italy, and more, all with miles. Platinum Pro gets me One World Emerald with...
I find value, but I'm the guy most frequent flyers hate, as I get almost all my AA miles and Platinum Pro status from credit card spend and online shopping. Every year I earn enough for my wife and I to fly business on a nice vacation. In the past few years, we flew business to Spain, Africa in Q Suite, Italy, and more, all with miles. Platinum Pro gets me One World Emerald with the lounge access it entails.
Now, sometimes we have to fly less desirable routes, as in a lay over at LHR on the way to BCN instead of direct (home is IAD/DCA), but I see that as a minor inconvenience especially with access to the BA first class lounge. And, yeah, if on BA there are the surcharges, but it's still far less than paying for business class and far more certain than hoping for an upgrade that will never come. The big issue for me is that AA charges so many miles to fly on its metal and limited Qatar availability. However, I'll check every day, usually multiple times, for better routes and pricing, and that usually pays off, as I'll end up rebooking the trip a couple times, but that's easy to do.
The economics of the programs are entirely inverted at this point, and that includes holding the Centurion or Sapphire Reserve cards. At 5:00 pm yesterday at LGA there was a cluster of 30-40 people in suits huddled around the Sapphire and Centurion lounge entrances in the corner of Terminal B staring at their phones. These are all working professionals paying high annual fees. I just don’t get it. To them, the fee is probably nothing,...
The economics of the programs are entirely inverted at this point, and that includes holding the Centurion or Sapphire Reserve cards. At 5:00 pm yesterday at LGA there was a cluster of 30-40 people in suits huddled around the Sapphire and Centurion lounge entrances in the corner of Terminal B staring at their phones. These are all working professionals paying high annual fees. I just don’t get it. To them, the fee is probably nothing, but isn’t the value of their time worth more than waiting for the “comfort” the lounge would provide? This is especially true at Terminal B at LGA which has a plethora of wonderful and very comfortable restaurants and places to sit and it’s never too crowded. The only logical thing is that they are prestige hunting and have convinced themselves that somehow those lounges are sooooo goood, it’s worth the wait.
As Flying Blue Gold and TK Elite, I find the value in status. Having access to priority check-in, fast track at security and lounges makes all the difference. It's much more relaxing and the time saved adds up over the year if you travel frequently. Free bag saves me around 60€ per round trip (which equals almost 1000 per year for me). Having access to the best seats on the plane for free is also...
As Flying Blue Gold and TK Elite, I find the value in status. Having access to priority check-in, fast track at security and lounges makes all the difference. It's much more relaxing and the time saved adds up over the year if you travel frequently. Free bag saves me around 60€ per round trip (which equals almost 1000 per year for me). Having access to the best seats on the plane for free is also nice.
Miles themselves are quite pointless these days. They're nice to have but I wouldn't bother chasing them. Status is why I'm "in the game".
For a mid-level corporate peon, something like United Club makes a lot of sense. United is your classic reliable mediocrity: will get you there in one piece (teeth don’t necessarily count) and in tolerable discomfort. There’s typically enough corporate travel to quality for Silver or Gold; the accrued miles are enough to cover the fees with some left over.
For personal travel, more or less worthless.
I still care about the programs. There's more to them than auto-upgrades.
Someone I know and respect is doing lots of flight runs this Autumn to renew top-tier status in Flying Blue and Aeroplan and to finish the Turkish challenge. Flying Blue is one thing (sunk cost fallacy: renewal is easier than first-time qualification) but Aeroplan Super Elite is a heavy lift. I have trouble deciding if my friend is the canary in the coal...
I still care about the programs. There's more to them than auto-upgrades.
Someone I know and respect is doing lots of flight runs this Autumn to renew top-tier status in Flying Blue and Aeroplan and to finish the Turkish challenge. Flying Blue is one thing (sunk cost fallacy: renewal is easier than first-time qualification) but Aeroplan Super Elite is a heavy lift. I have trouble deciding if my friend is the canary in the coal mine (status is now the key to The Game), or a status junkie.
Ben is right: AAdvantage auto-upgrades don't work any more. I don't know about UA and I've never flown DL, but on AC, upgrades are metered with eUp coupons, heavily bestowed on Super Elites, whose upgrades clear most of the time. I suspect the problem is worse in the US than elsewhere.
As for availability, supply/demand has reared its ugly head. Lots more people are chasing those JAL and ANA premium seats and lots more people are buying premium seats for cash. When people like us get an availability alert from a paid tool, it's already too late.
Rant: When will AAdvantage scrap their program's disAAdvantage: "Transpacific only" routing rule for USA-Asia. QR, BA happily transport you to Asia from USA but American won't let you book it. BA, QR, AC, UA programs don't have this annoyance.
All are holding back some/most premium availability for their own members (or elites). It makes the game harder. To win, I have to diversify points more. So I adapt: go heavy on ThankYou points, transfer to EVA and get Business Class seats to/from Toronto, while Aeroplan/Lifemiles users whine and moan. It is what it is.
My biggest frustration: secret crafty strategies carriers use to frustrate search tools. Dynamic married-segment availability sets my hair on fire. JL ORD-TYO? Sure, connecting in JFK. So JFK-TYO should be available nonstop, right? Wrong: originate in ORD, you'll connect in NYC. Originate in NYC, you'll connect in ORD. All cuz they're annoyed at seats.aero.
It's all shifting and changing. But the carriers always have distressed inventory (unsold seats close to flight time) and I'm always learning new ways to get at 'em. Ben's glass-half-empty musings are an understandable passing thought at a dark time, but he knows other doors are opening daily.
@Lucky said:
'But what’s the actual value proposition of specifically wanting to earn points or get a credit card with a major US airline, beyond just a free checked bag benefit, or something?'
Certain cards are worth paying the annual fee, such as the Chase United Explorer Card. For someone with no status who checks a bag and wants early(ier) boarding, that makes it worth the annual fee. Beyond that, two things are almost always...
@Lucky said:
'But what’s the actual value proposition of specifically wanting to earn points or get a credit card with a major US airline, beyond just a free checked bag benefit, or something?'
Certain cards are worth paying the annual fee, such as the Chase United Explorer Card. For someone with no status who checks a bag and wants early(ier) boarding, that makes it worth the annual fee. Beyond that, two things are almost always overlooked by the P&M blogging crowd: that card gives the holder access to additional award space, albeit rarely are they 'good' flights from a timing perspective or for layovers, but in some circumstances or for some people...
I also routinely get great Chase offers on that card and over a year, I come pretty close to covering the annual fee. The points I earn from that are not worth counting, but the cash adds up.
But you're right, most people would be better off earning cashback, the most flexible of all rewards, or earning Chase UR points on dining, travel, and quarterly bonus categories and converting them to cash at 1cpp
Yeah it's not like it used to be, that's for sure. There used to be more competition in the US in terms of number of airlines, and fewer frequent fliers, and customer savvy was much lower.
But end of the day, I alternate between American Gold and Platinum. Platinum means free MCE at booking which I find very valuable, especially if I have a trip in international Y. If I have any BA flights...
Yeah it's not like it used to be, that's for sure. There used to be more competition in the US in terms of number of airlines, and fewer frequent fliers, and customer savvy was much lower.
But end of the day, I alternate between American Gold and Platinum. Platinum means free MCE at booking which I find very valuable, especially if I have a trip in international Y. If I have any BA flights booked, it means I can choose seats for free which is serious value-added with two young kids. And obviously earning Platinum means I'll have a bunch of AA miles from the process, which have value unto themselves.
I've migrated a bit in terms of airline loyalty programs as they've all gotten worse, but to be fair I've also moved geographically and that factor into some of the changes. I grew up in USA then moved to Canada, UK, and am based in Italy now with frequent travel to all parts of the world but especially the Middle East.
For years I was a United 1K and then left in 2012 when...
I've migrated a bit in terms of airline loyalty programs as they've all gotten worse, but to be fair I've also moved geographically and that factor into some of the changes. I grew up in USA then moved to Canada, UK, and am based in Italy now with frequent travel to all parts of the world but especially the Middle East.
For years I was a United 1K and then left in 2012 when Smisek made a mess of things to become a BA Gold (I also moved from Los Angeles to London that year). I stayed loyal to BA and Oneworld even after I moved to Italy. I got a Status Match with TK in 2017 which has been easy to maintain and then ITA (AZ) in 2022. In the past year I got status matched with AF and LH and I gave up on keeping my BA status after the changes to their program. Most of my flying is now on LH Group (including ITA) and Star Alliance as well as Air France and SkyTeam.
But why do I still bother playing the game?
I still like to have lounge access when I fly even in economy, and the EU carriers generally have this as a benefit.
I also like to have priority rebooking when things go wrong, and this happens often enough that it's worth it.
But most of all, since I find myself on planes very often, I like to have as seamless an experience as possible with expedited security, lounge access, baggage, board when I want (usually last call), etc for most parts of the world.
It's not about the points and the upgrades for me anymore. I don't rely on those benefits. My credit cards are cash-back instead of loyalty programs. But do I still plan flights based on earning and using status? Sure I do. I've got to fly with someone and I would still prefer to maximise whatever benefits I can get from my flying.
The best way to describe airline loyalty programs in one word is:
"gachapon" or "lootbox"
They're a gamble and almost all of the time the prize one gets isn't worth the spend or effort it takes to get it.
Nope. If you buy LifeMiles instead of paid tickets, your travel gets way cheaper. Book last-minute.
I’m currently elite on all 3 of the U.S. carriers and have been for years. There are only 2 reasons, to me, the status has value.
1. Bonus multiples on tickets. The difference in what you earn per dollar vs. non status is massive.
2. Preferred treatment in irregular ops. I realize this can be spotty but getting thru to better agents quicker and getting the nod on 50/50 situations is easier with status. I have many examples in my career.
SkyPesos are the most pointless points currency.
Well, no they're not. They're like Southwest or JetBlue points. You can redeem them for more-or-less fixed value on Delta, and that'll save you a couple hundred bucks.
Every so often there's some sort of outsized redemption (I did GRU-JFK-DCA in J for 95k apiece in 2022 but they closed that loophole) but most of the time they're just valuable in a fixed currency sort of way
They can work fine on certain routes, the other day I saw some 35k Y redemptions on Aeromexico from Europe to GRU. While I'm not about to sign up to spending 20 hours in the back of the bus, this would clearly be hugely helpful to someone needing to travel due to a family emergency or something. It's definitely more than $350 for that one-way ticket.
They're excellent for some flights which don't touch North America.
@DenB, that Aeromexico redemption clearly did touch N. America as it was via MEX! Not sure whether they'd give the same price for MEX as a destination though.
I was able to find some nice awards in the past year using aeroplan and lifemiles, but it was only possible due to my ability to take positioning flights on a short window of time.
Moving forward, that won't be the case for me, so I wonder if I'd be able to enjoy my points as I used to. If I start losing points due to even more frequent devaluations, I'd be reconsidering everything for sure.
Forgot to add that I loooooooved your honest pitches, @Ben!
These concerns are not industry-wide, they're confined to the big US airlines and I think that they're closely connected to the structural issues of that country's economy.
The job of a pilot is of course very important, but it doesn't really seem to warrant a salary in the order of $400k a year (which means that a single day of sickness causes losses well into the 5 figures even if no actual flights are...
These concerns are not industry-wide, they're confined to the big US airlines and I think that they're closely connected to the structural issues of that country's economy.
The job of a pilot is of course very important, but it doesn't really seem to warrant a salary in the order of $400k a year (which means that a single day of sickness causes losses well into the 5 figures even if no actual flights are disrupted!), in the same way as US stock market valuations don't seem to be supported by the financial performance of many/most listed companies (at the same time, I own some shares in a major, well-run, profitable European blue chip company and the P/E is barely higher than 10).
It doesn't make a lot of sense to expect a piece of the economic landscape (airline reward programmes) to work well when most everything around it is distorted.
@Throwaw...
Nor should a CEO in the USA be paid the multiple millions they often are, yet I hear no one complaining about them. If said pilot is flying me - pay him $100M. Clearly your life is of little value to you. Mine and my love ones are priceless.
First, they're not as priceless as you think. Each human life as a price, determined by the courts in case of a crash
Second, it's a very loose connection (if at all) between pilot salary and flight safety. Following your rationale, I'd claim pilots shouldn't be paid the current 400k; they should be paid 800k so that they fly "twice as safe", right? Remember the pilot is on the flight too, and I don't...
First, they're not as priceless as you think. Each human life as a price, determined by the courts in case of a crash
Second, it's a very loose connection (if at all) between pilot salary and flight safety. Following your rationale, I'd claim pilots shouldn't be paid the current 400k; they should be paid 800k so that they fly "twice as safe", right? Remember the pilot is on the flight too, and I don't think he'd crash the aircraft if he was paid 200k.
TLDR, your post was 100% bull.
@justindev , there are lots of people complaining about executive pay but they're mostly engaged in the politics of envy as opposed to querying the value added by the individuals in question.
At the end of the day, if someone is responsible for managing thousands of pilots, why shouldn't they earn e.g. 20 times what a pilot makes? I know some airline CEOs may earn more than that, but certainly not 1000s of times...
@justindev , there are lots of people complaining about executive pay but they're mostly engaged in the politics of envy as opposed to querying the value added by the individuals in question.
At the end of the day, if someone is responsible for managing thousands of pilots, why shouldn't they earn e.g. 20 times what a pilot makes? I know some airline CEOs may earn more than that, but certainly not 1000s of times more. Ridiculous executive pay is just the tip of the iceberg within an economy in which capital is systematically misallocated.
I think you have made it very clear that your priority on the programs is complimentary upgrades . But the industry has changed What other businesses are there were the premium products are complimentary ? It is not profitable for airlines to, and frequent flyer programs are not longer based on actual flying but spending .
If you own a cobranded credit card , and you make one domestic round trip within the states...
I think you have made it very clear that your priority on the programs is complimentary upgrades . But the industry has changed What other businesses are there were the premium products are complimentary ? It is not profitable for airlines to, and frequent flyer programs are not longer based on actual flying but spending .
If you own a cobranded credit card , and you make one domestic round trip within the states and you check a bag, it is a no brainer , because the card fee pays by it self. Not all customers chase miles to book premium cabins , but just to book a main cabin flight anywhere .
Also , once status is reached , you can select extra space seats in coach that are usually sold around 40-60 usd per leg and it comes with complimentary beverages ( las time I check a beer is 9-10 usd . Also, status members get complimentary checked luggage’s on international flights , with has a great saving value.
The part that you miss and which is very much reality is that Delta along with a few other airlines including British Airways get such a high percentage of their traffic from corporate traffic and that totally changes the calculus of loyalty programs. Delta and BA and a few other airlines win the corporate business and DL's financial success - including from the loyalty program - has come from gaining so much more corporate traffic...
The part that you miss and which is very much reality is that Delta along with a few other airlines including British Airways get such a high percentage of their traffic from corporate traffic and that totally changes the calculus of loyalty programs. Delta and BA and a few other airlines win the corporate business and DL's financial success - including from the loyalty program - has come from gaining so much more corporate traffic than its competitors. DL just said on its earnings call how much higher corporate traffic is up in its coastal hubs. DL used the pandemic, AA and B6' strategic wanderings and UA's EWR meltdown and its focus on exotic but insignificant destinations for corporate travel to grow its corporate revenue in the largest markets in the country. With corporate traffic, the passenger has little to no influence on the travel decision but gets the rewards.
BA has long had the advantage from London and also uses its dominance of the London market to its advantage.
As for premium cabin loyalty awards, DL has long been much less willing to give upgrades into Delta One than AA or UA - and it hasn't had to because of the amount of corporate traffic it carries.
DL also just said that premium cabin leisure demand continues to grow faster than corporate travel - and that does come out of people's pockets but the status still often comes from tickets purchased by someone else. They also said premium leisure demand is sometimes more valuable than corporate traffic and part of their strategy to add more premium seats - including Comfort Plus - is to give corporate and loyal premium leisure traffic the best benefit at the time of booking, not at the airport on a standby list.
The reason why so many can't see the benefits of loyalty programs is because they see them only as something to which they are entitled instead of recognizing how the airline's see them and figuring out how to create win-win relationships for both parties.
I don't play the airline loyalty game and never have. It's a basic strategy, but since 2015 when I got into the rewards world, I only focus on transferable points on cards with great perks. Right now that means I do Platinum, CSR, and Bonvoy Brilliant, with a Freedom Unlimited for everyday spend.
Every few years I'll take the points that have built up and transfer them to some foreign carrier for a first...
I don't play the airline loyalty game and never have. It's a basic strategy, but since 2015 when I got into the rewards world, I only focus on transferable points on cards with great perks. Right now that means I do Platinum, CSR, and Bonvoy Brilliant, with a Freedom Unlimited for everyday spend.
Every few years I'll take the points that have built up and transfer them to some foreign carrier for a first class experience. But I break even or come out ahead on the fees from perks each year. Keeps me sane and always confident I am getting value.
I liked being American platinum for priority check in with family and the ability to book extra leg room seats for free at the time of booking for my family of five (in economy).
Still plenty of availability in océania. I’ve flown a lot of flights to Asia and back using lifemiles and aeroplan. 36k lifemiles for 10 hours on ana biz. Comes and goes but worthwhile.
0n the other hand trying to...
I liked being American platinum for priority check in with family and the ability to book extra leg room seats for free at the time of booking for my family of five (in economy).
Still plenty of availability in océania. I’ve flown a lot of flights to Asia and back using lifemiles and aeroplan. 36k lifemiles for 10 hours on ana biz. Comes and goes but worthwhile.
0n the other hand trying to use sia miles of find cx space is a distant memory. Waitlisting sia first used to be so much fun. Waitlist a ton of awards and eventually get the sms thst space had opened. No more
Yeah the delta thing you point out is really fascinating. It’s bleak on r/delta. Thousands of people complaining about high prices (but then booking anyway lol). Like Stockholm syndrome at this point
As for the rest of your article- at the end of the day it’s a zero sum game and interest in this hobby has never been bigger. There’s also never been a bigger “upper middle class” in the US willing and able to pay for luxury travel so it all leads to slim award pickings
Airline status is a total waste. The problem is that loyalty programs incentivize spend, not decisions. I'd guess the vast majority of US big 3 elites really don't have a choice about who they fly most of the time, as either they're hub captive or their company is buying their tickets. You're giving elite status to those who will fly your airline anyway, but not giving others any reason to even bother to pursue status.
Agreed! I will never fly enough/spend to get a roundtrip international J for 2 at ~700,000 miles. I buy the J tickets I want, and usually generate enough flying miles from that for a "free" domestic trip. The airlines have done such a great job at monetizing their programs to 1 cpp that the flexibility of cash back far outweighs even a theoretical 1.1-1.2 cpp redemption.
I've had Delta's diamond status for 10 years. I'm also nearly a 2 million miler. At this point, the only reason I stay with Delta is my status matters when a bag goes missing, flights get canceled or delayed, etc. I've given up chasing status for points and upgrades.
The loyalty industry's business model is all about convincing members they are getting something of value even when they are not.
As long as the industry can keep doing that, these programs will continue to flourish.
I see this frustrating industry-wide pattern, and I share your views, largely. However, as a multi-year Cathay Diamond status holder who found myself wondering if I should switch over to Singapore, I ended up staying. A few reasons:
1. Recognition. I’m usually greeted by name by lounge staff at LHR & HKG, and they’d be quicker to help me with any questions or other concerns;
2. Lounge access. The “Exclusive Retreat” inside The Bridge...
I see this frustrating industry-wide pattern, and I share your views, largely. However, as a multi-year Cathay Diamond status holder who found myself wondering if I should switch over to Singapore, I ended up staying. A few reasons:
1. Recognition. I’m usually greeted by name by lounge staff at LHR & HKG, and they’d be quicker to help me with any questions or other concerns;
2. Lounge access. The “Exclusive Retreat” inside The Bridge lounge spells the difference between stress and some quiet time in busy travel days;
3. Priority. For emergency bookings, or if things go sideways (e.g. delayed/cancelled flights)
It’s easy to take these things for granted, especially as a frequent premium traveller. But if they’re no longer there, then I personally would have no reason to stay. The value proposition has changed from “earning & redeeming miles” to “they’re more likely to help me and do more if things go sideways before they turn to anyone else”
My warmest to you and your family and a belated well wishes for Yom Kippur
For people that sometimes but not always fly premium cabins, FF program perks such as priority check in (shorter lines at biz counters), priority boarding (getting to board with less stress) and lounge access (esp. outside the US) come in handy. Credit card sign ups are not a big thing outside the US, so you can mostly get those perks either through biz or FF status. But sometimes they dont justify irrational behaviour if ticket price is too high
Personally, I used to spend $30,000 on my Delta card every year to get the MQD waiver and the MQM rewards. Since Delta changed to pure revenue, now I just put Delta spend on the card and keep it for the 15 lounge visit credits every year.
Rule Number one: Do not let any Loyalty Program influence your booking behaviour
Rule number two: never pay anything to obtain additional miles or points or an airline status. Ever.
Rule number three: if you want to fly Business Class to a certain destination at a certain date, find the best deal and pay for it. This will come cheaper than deliberately chasing miles or points and then needing to adjust, origin, destination...
Rule Number one: Do not let any Loyalty Program influence your booking behaviour
Rule number two: never pay anything to obtain additional miles or points or an airline status. Ever.
Rule number three: if you want to fly Business Class to a certain destination at a certain date, find the best deal and pay for it. This will come cheaper than deliberately chasing miles or points and then needing to adjust, origin, destination or dates for availability.
Be a member of all going loyalty programs and collect the miles as you go along. Own one or two useful credit cards as you would anyway and collect any points „along the way“.
Then once every one or two years you’ll have enough miles/points for a booking for two. Chances are 50-50 that you’ll find availability for exactly what you had in mind.
How would 'rule number two' make sense in relation to the KQ status match? £130 got me a baggage benefit equivalent to €35-40 off each AFKL flight for a year even if I only fly them within Europe (if I just go as far as BEY/TLV, it's €80 each way!), plus typically 4 lots of lounge access per return journey. How could this not have been worthwhile?
Rule 3 is subjective nonsense. "Cheaper than needing to adjust"? Totally subjective. Following these rules is NOT cheaper, for me, than my rule: I never buy airline tickets. I acquire cards and Welcome Bonuses, spend bonuses. If I'm low on points, I'll buy points, but never cash tickets. I book nearly all air travel in the week before travel, often in the 36 hours before travel, including the homebound flight when abroad. If you insist...
Rule 3 is subjective nonsense. "Cheaper than needing to adjust"? Totally subjective. Following these rules is NOT cheaper, for me, than my rule: I never buy airline tickets. I acquire cards and Welcome Bonuses, spend bonuses. If I'm low on points, I'll buy points, but never cash tickets. I book nearly all air travel in the week before travel, often in the 36 hours before travel, including the homebound flight when abroad. If you insist on booking 2-3 months ahead and flying on your most convenient day, I promise you're paying a premium for that.
You are actually supporting my case in point. With your kind of "last minute" booking behaviour, you obviously never travel in high season, such as school holidays, Christmas/New Year and Easter or on routes which are so busy that they likely sell out. If you don't mind flying to alternative destinations on inconvenient dates, then go for it!
One cannot decide if you are the sort of traveler who fails to plan, or, simply plans to fail old bean?
Rule number three: if you want to fly Business Class to a certain destination at a certain date, find the best deal and pay for it. This will come cheaper than deliberately chasing miles or points and then needing to adjust, origin, destination or dates for availability.
That's a pretty silly rule, Mike. I'm a family of four. If I want to go to Asia, that's going to cost bare minimum $20,000 to pay cash....
Rule number three: if you want to fly Business Class to a certain destination at a certain date, find the best deal and pay for it. This will come cheaper than deliberately chasing miles or points and then needing to adjust, origin, destination or dates for availability.
That's a pretty silly rule, Mike. I'm a family of four. If I want to go to Asia, that's going to cost bare minimum $20,000 to pay cash. Definitely cheaper to change my dates by a day or two, or add a connection.
CapitalMike, I concur, wholeheartedly.
One came to this website to find out if I was about to miss anything once I finally retired. For the past two decades I had traveled the world at the behest of my masters. At least one and occasionally two or even three intercontinental F/J return flights per month.
Our personal flights are now always Middle or Far Eastern destinations, in F, starting from the right side of the...
CapitalMike, I concur, wholeheartedly.
One came to this website to find out if I was about to miss anything once I finally retired. For the past two decades I had traveled the world at the behest of my masters. At least one and occasionally two or even three intercontinental F/J return flights per month.
Our personal flights are now always Middle or Far Eastern destinations, in F, starting from the right side of the pond. These personal flights were booked through a travel office and heavily discounted due to the buying power of my masters. Believing that this privilege might be withdrawn upon retirement prompted my external enquiries, including this medium.
Like you Mike, I have concluded that the Airline Loyalty Programs are about as much use to me as rocking horse manure would be to a gardener. To add further to my belief, my past masters have offered to continue to allow me to book our personal flights through their good offices. Loyalty rewarded perhaps?
"Rule number two: never pay anything to obtain additional miles or points or an airline status. Ever." In very rare cases (none in my experience) I contend it would be worthwille to spend, say, $1 to cross a status threshold. Make an online purchase that gives you rnough miles to avoid baggage fees next year? Sure. But, the basic contention is correct in my mind.
I let my AA Executive Platinum expire last year, largely due to American having become a delay-prone mess, and a lot less reliable. I have taken more trips this year than in years past, mostly overseas, and flown Business of Premium Economy using points, and at a discount, with percent bonuses when moved, and its been a far better experience than relying on crappy, old airline loyalty schemes that don't really work. I mean, who...
I let my AA Executive Platinum expire last year, largely due to American having become a delay-prone mess, and a lot less reliable. I have taken more trips this year than in years past, mostly overseas, and flown Business of Premium Economy using points, and at a discount, with percent bonuses when moved, and its been a far better experience than relying on crappy, old airline loyalty schemes that don't really work. I mean, who the heck wants to be loyal to a US airline anyway when you can fly better, and farther, on a partner airline of theirs up front?