A longtime reader posed an interesting question to me, which I figured I’d share my thoughts on, and throw out to the community…
In this post:
Do people exaggerate how good first & business class travel are?
A reader who is also a huge avgeek just flew Turkish Airlines business class across the Atlantic. He explained that this was his second business class flight ever, with the previous one being many years ago. Here’s how he walked away from the experience:
While it was definitely a more comfortable way to fly, I kind of felt almost let down.
Let me explain. For years, I’ve read trip reports and watched youtube vlogs of people flying business and first class. And travel bloggers and vloggers always make flying premium cabins seem awesome. To me though, flying business class just felt like getting a seat with more room, the ability to lie flat on an airplane, and at times pretty good food.
Although these perks do make for a better travel experience, sometimes it seems like travel bloggers and vloggers exaggerate the luxury of the premium experience as if you can’t find comfortable seating or good food on the ground.
Don’t get me wrong, it was definitely a more comfortable experience which I would certainly like to do again. But it just seems like some people go a bit over top, describing what on the ground are fairly normal experiences. I certainly don’t mean to bash anyone here or pick on anyone, but this was just a thought I had as someone who flew business class for basically the first time.
He follows that up with the following observation (which couldn’t help but make me chuckle):
Certainly beats economy but if you asked someone on the ground “hey do you want to sleep in a room with 20 other people, some of whom will be snoring, in a bed that is really narrow and less comfy than a couch, and you don’t control when the lights are turned on and off,” I don’t think anyone would remotely want that…
My take on the glamor of premium cabin travel
I’ve been thinking about this question for a couple of days, so here’s my brutally honest take. Let me start by noting that I’ve been fortunate enough to fly millions of miles, and haven’t taken a long haul flight in economy in many years (thanks primarily to the amazing value that can be had with miles & points).
The way I view it, there are two main topics to address here — is premium cabin travel actually great, and in the age of the internet and social media, do people tend to hype it too much?
How I approach premium cabin travel
As someone who has taken hundreds of premium cabin flights over the years, how do I view the glamor associated with premium cabin travel? Here are a few thoughts:
- People love to travel (for many people, it’s one of the main highlights of their lives), and people will voluntarily take ultra long haul flights in economy; so being able to get comfortable for a long journey is a real treat, not in comparison to the bed or food you may get at home, but rather in comparison to economy
- As an aviation geek, I love flying no matter what, as there’s something so fun about being in a metal tube six miles above the earth’s surface, flying at 600 miles per hour, watching the sunrise, etc.; it never gets old
- I think there’s a real thrill to flying first and business class in terms of the deal element for many of us; there’s something so nice about flying a product that would retail for so much, all while using points, and it’s no different than how people on Extreme Couponing get excited about going to the supermarket
- Frankly one of the things that I enjoy most about flying is just the ridiculously impressive logistics of it all; when I travel, I constantly think about all the things that had to happen for a flight to run smoothly, and you notice that even more in premium cabins
- At the end of the day, I view most business class products as being very comfortable ways to travel (especially in comparison to economy), though it’s not usually going to be a life changing experience
- Even after so many years, there are many first class products that still make me downright giddy; for example, showers on the ground don’t excite me, but showers in the Emirates A380 shower suite do
No matter how you slice it, though, hopefully your overall comfort isn’t greater in business class than it would be at home. But then again, when you’re at home, you’re not traveling through the sky in a metal tube. I totally agree about the sleeping situation, though, as I’m a terrible airplane sleeper (for many of the reasons shared above).
In part, the person was a bit let down because the experience just came down to this:
To me though, flying business class just felt like getting a seat with more room, the ability to lie flat on an airplane, and at times pretty good food.
I’d say that’s accurate, though to me that’s something that is worth hyping, given the uncomfortable alternative, which is potentially sitting upright all night, an inch away from a stranger, being served a microwaved dinner, at best.
Social media can make it tough to enjoy travel
A main part of this reader’s question involves travel bloggers and vloggers exaggerating and over glamorizing travel. That’s also an interesting topic. Now, I am a travel blogger, last I checked, so I may be part of the problem. However, I also think not all travel bloggers and vloggers take the same approach when it comes to their content.
Let me say that I struggle to use social media, like Instagram. Why? Because the way people gain popularity is of course by making everything seem perfect or headline worthy, and by selling a dream.
If I post a picture of a business class seat on social media and say “meh, it was an average business class experience, but I did get an amazing deal with points,” people probably wouldn’t be very interested, and many people probably think I’m an entitled jerk.
Meanwhile if someone instead posted a glam shot with the caption “I flew the world’s best first class for $5.60,” or “everything I ate in Japan Airlines first class,” then that would probably get quite a bit more traction.
The reality is that we live in an era where you’ll see just about everything on social media before you actually experience it. Odds are that the version you see on social media will be better than what you actually experience. I think that both sets a very high bar for your enjoyment of something, and also leaves little to the imagination.
The same principle applies to travel more broadly. You see all these amazing pictures of destinations, but then are disappointed when you find that things aren’t necessarily as they appear. That’s probably because the influencer got to the Spanish Steps at sunrise (while everyone else was asleep) in a full outfit and makeup, and then they have a professional photoshoot where they take hundreds of pictures, and they only share the best one. Meanwhile the rest of us are showing up in the afternoon when it’s as crowded as a football stadium, actively dodging selfie sticks and pickpockets.
Bottom line
Are first and business travel hyped too much? Yes and no, if you ask me. I think aviation is a miracle, and I love flying no matter what. The reality is that traveling in a premium cabin is way more comfortable than traveling in economy.
Will a business class experience ever offer the comfort you have at home? No, hopefully not. But when you consider the alternative (economy), and when you take into account just how comfortable and pampered you can be so many miles above the earth’s surface, I’d say it’s still pretty darn cool.
I do think that the internet and social media have greatly changed our expectations of experiences, for better and worse. When it comes to the internet, nowadays you can know exactly what you’re going to get, and I think that takes away some of the excitement and surprise. Furthermore, in the age of “influencing,” there’s no denying that many people create unrealistic expectations of what experiences are like, because it’s quite literally their job to make things look perfect.
Anyway, that’s my take, and I’d love to hear how others feel.
Where do you stand on the glamor and hyping of premium cabin travel?
I think to do it once (with a proper carrier) can be a life long dream for a lof of people and will be a memory to cherish. Unless they flew BA, then they will spend the rest of their lives saying Business or First class is worse than Emirates Economy. For someone to fly say DUB-DOH on Qatar, that'd be a memory. My Mother flew just once long haul business and she always talks...
I think to do it once (with a proper carrier) can be a life long dream for a lof of people and will be a memory to cherish. Unless they flew BA, then they will spend the rest of their lives saying Business or First class is worse than Emirates Economy. For someone to fly say DUB-DOH on Qatar, that'd be a memory. My Mother flew just once long haul business and she always talks about it. I fly long haul business a lot, on corporate tickets, my own money and rewards, but only if 8 hour flight or more. The idea of flying FRA-DXB in Business or First is ludicrous to me, it would actually be a negative experience as 1. Total waste of money 2. To use the lounge, arrange chauffeur and have to interact on the plane in Busoness or First would be just not worth it for 6 hours. 3. If there is a problem the cost of eco ticket won't bother me and I'll just get my own way there with another carrier. While compensation should exist I have several open disputes from last 2 years that are absolutely 100% the airlines fault. For business and First tickets I'm not writing that off on principle. If I fly FRA-DXB, just give me eco window seat and leave me to relax and read for 6 hours. I'll make my own normal way to airport and get there last minute. As an accountant who has worked in banking for several decades, I can assure you, most of the people buying J and F tickets do NOT have the financial position comfortable enough to warrant that expense. That's their choice for sure, but the same people will be working till 70's and end up living in a skip/dumpster. Sure, plenty of people on here can afford the tickets but look at daily capacity in J and F from London to and though UAE and Qatar - a worrying percentage of those tickets are bought on credit cards and overdrafts. Whereas Y is full of people with a vastly more solid financial standing.
The hard product of premium economy to Europe on the big 3 US airlines today is better than business class was 30 years ago. My first flight in business, sorry Connoisseur, was 6-across 39" pitch without IFE except for single projector on a UA 762. It cost $4200 of OPM in 1994. The soft product is probably worse, but other than a good lounge on either end, I really don't care much about soft product...
The hard product of premium economy to Europe on the big 3 US airlines today is better than business class was 30 years ago. My first flight in business, sorry Connoisseur, was 6-across 39" pitch without IFE except for single projector on a UA 762. It cost $4200 of OPM in 1994. The soft product is probably worse, but other than a good lounge on either end, I really don't care much about soft product other than lounges. I rarely drink alcohol on international flights (although I frequently will in domestic F) and the inflight food is about what I'd get if I stopped at Trader Joe's on my way home.
These days, my limit for flying to Europe is $1800, either in cash or in miles, towards a trip total max of $5000 for 11-12 days. So when I can get a business class seat for 60k one-way on United or (probably RIP with dynamic pricing) AA, I will splurge. Otherwise I'm fine with Premium Economy, although in that case I'd prefer a daytime eastbound flight out of IAD, ORD, or maybe BOS if I'm going to London.
The last time I flew coach to Europe was 2000, flying AA as they were matching UA's summer from hell promotions and it was essentially a full rebate of points worth more than the cash price. Still, I decided then that I wouldn't do that any more.
For people on normal incomes, paying for their own tickets and going on holidays with family the equation is very different: would you prefer to travel to Europe 3 times (in economy) over the next few years, or afford to go just once in business class?
Yes and no. It depends. It depends on the cost and the airline and both the hard and soft benefits. I can't say that business class is universally equal. Look at flights within Europe which is basically an economy seat with some better food/service and sometimes the middle seat open. Look at the Mid East airlines with a superior hard and soft product. Then most fall in between. It depends if you know and have...
Yes and no. It depends. It depends on the cost and the airline and both the hard and soft benefits. I can't say that business class is universally equal. Look at flights within Europe which is basically an economy seat with some better food/service and sometimes the middle seat open. Look at the Mid East airlines with a superior hard and soft product. Then most fall in between. It depends if you know and have experienced what it is supposed to look like. It depends if the experience is more than what you expected given these conditions. I think that it is about value and willingness to pay. Some airlines are introducing (or re-introducing) a class of cabin that is in the middle between business and economy but more than premium economy. I think this is a very good idea. The price is more than economy but less than business and the seat goes back about half way to lie down. Less crowded than economy and more than business and a lot of other business touches. With the price much more reasonable than business. May be worth a review.
As first time international business class travellers I have to say we loved it. The food and wine selections were wonderful and the ability to sleep comfortably was just brilliant. We had no jet lag from the long haul flights. Only way to fly!!
What I find odd with any of the classes, is they try and build seating expecting to have everything in arms reach. God forbid you have to reach further than your seat or actually get out of your seat to get something, anything. Do you do this at home when you're on the couch. And, in any 8 to 10 hour period who actually sits in any chair or couch the way they show people...
What I find odd with any of the classes, is they try and build seating expecting to have everything in arms reach. God forbid you have to reach further than your seat or actually get out of your seat to get something, anything. Do you do this at home when you're on the couch. And, in any 8 to 10 hour period who actually sits in any chair or couch the way they show people sitting in an airplane seat, even in BC. You sit just about every other way except facing forward with knees together. One airline that's cottened-on to all the is Finnair with their new BC seat. Finally.
I recently returned from PHUKET on Singapore Airlines, my flights were from PHUKET to SINGAPORE ant then to BRISBANE.
I Had two flights from HELL. My first flight from PHUKET to Singapore the flight crew kept filling up the passenger sitting next to me with TWO GLASSES OF WINE. When I tried to get up to go to the toilet the passenger spilt two glasses of wine down my back, this was witnessed by...
I recently returned from PHUKET on Singapore Airlines, my flights were from PHUKET to SINGAPORE ant then to BRISBANE.
I Had two flights from HELL. My first flight from PHUKET to Singapore the flight crew kept filling up the passenger sitting next to me with TWO GLASSES OF WINE. When I tried to get up to go to the toilet the passenger spilt two glasses of wine down my back, this was witnessed by a flight member but I was not offered any assistance to get cleaned up. I had to sit there in wet cloths.
My flight from Singapore to Brisbane, about two hours into the flight I asked a flight crew member for assistance to convert my seat into the flat bed position, she started to push the button to convert the seat but my foot got jammed between the two sections of the seat, I told the flight crew member that my foot was jammed and she kept on pushing the button which caused me more pain. I reported the to the Flight Crew Manager.
When I returned home I reported this to Singapore Airlines but they tell my that this did not happen.
I have been accused of lying and making up what happened to me.
Shame on SINGAPORE AIRLINES.
IAN STARR
Such a stupid comment to compare flying Vs at home not worth responding ....
I don't really regard premium cabin travel as "glamorous." it's all about function. When I was in my 20s I would have been happy to fold up like a frozen turkey to go anywhere. Some years later I'm less interested in doing this.
Many years ago as a recent graduate I flew ny to Bangkok with a 7 hour layover in Taiwan. This flight was on something like china airlines and economy. It was soo bad I swore I never would fly economy to Asia again and I have he’d to that. Now as I write this I’m sitting in the Qatar first class lounge in Doha waiting for a flight. Is it the most amazing thing ever?...
Many years ago as a recent graduate I flew ny to Bangkok with a 7 hour layover in Taiwan. This flight was on something like china airlines and economy. It was soo bad I swore I never would fly economy to Asia again and I have he’d to that. Now as I write this I’m sitting in the Qatar first class lounge in Doha waiting for a flight. Is it the most amazing thing ever? No that is pure hype, but it’s better than the lounge in jfk I flew out of by miles. I value being able to sleep and having privacy and decent food pretty highly. For these things premium international travel pays off. I like arriving somewhat rested vs if I had been sitting up all night. Part of what I enjoy about travel is the flying so for me it’s worth it. I appreciate they small details that go into a soft product.
With most things in life you pays your money etc.
Flying from Oz to UK I travel business. 12 to 16 hour flights are killers if your in economy. However flying on domestic flights that is up to 5 hours, I will book economy. Qantas domestic is ok especially if your a gold frequent flyer and have free lounge access. This access was a life saver when i missed a connecting flight and had...
With most things in life you pays your money etc.
Flying from Oz to UK I travel business. 12 to 16 hour flights are killers if your in economy. However flying on domestic flights that is up to 5 hours, I will book economy. Qantas domestic is ok especially if your a gold frequent flyer and have free lounge access. This access was a life saver when i missed a connecting flight and had a 8 hour wait.
In my opinion business class should be renamed comfort class . First is Luxury class and one I have been able to experience using loyalty points for upgrade. Come on having a shower at 35000 feet is a bit special.
Most expensive but more comfort in the air
But not your bed at home.Long haul flight is very expensive now a days like Canada.
In many cases it is completely overrated. Personally what is most important to me is space and the ability to get to the restroom without bothering anyone.. Domestically I will take an aisle seat in an exit row with an empty middle and where nobody can recline into me over a 1st class window anyway. Over 6 hrs it depends if it as the right time of day to sleep. Otherwise premium economy may be fine. But the food on Singapore is excellent!
@Lucky —> This is (obviously) a HUGE difference between flying F/J on a long-haul, transoceanic flight, and flying one that never leaves the USA. If I can book a seat in an Exit Row, being upgraded is no big deal on a transcon flight (e.g.: SFO-BOS/JFK/IAD etc.). It would be nice, but certainly not a necessity. But if an exit row is not available, then it’s premium economy at worst, what passes for First on...
@Lucky —> This is (obviously) a HUGE difference between flying F/J on a long-haul, transoceanic flight, and flying one that never leaves the USA. If I can book a seat in an Exit Row, being upgraded is no big deal on a transcon flight (e.g.: SFO-BOS/JFK/IAD etc.). It would be nice, but certainly not a necessity. But if an exit row is not available, then it’s premium economy at worst, what passes for First on domestic (US) carries at best.
OTOH, If I am flying to Europe or Asia, flying in J is what I would define as “essential” and flying in F “would be nice.” (Note: this applies to lie-flat seats ONLY; if all their seats are “angle-seats,” then it’s TAP — which still stands for “Take Another Plane,” it just no longer applies exclusively to Transportes Aéreos Portugueses.)
I got upgraded on a flight home from Abu Dhabi and I was seriously impressed with Etihad's business class A380 seating. Everything about it (apart from the choice of films) was better than the economy seating A380 that we had flown in on. Nicer seats with more room. Nicer drinks menu (including champagne). Beautifully presented meals plus more attentive flight crew (fewer passengers to cater for) It was almost good enough to make me pay...
I got upgraded on a flight home from Abu Dhabi and I was seriously impressed with Etihad's business class A380 seating. Everything about it (apart from the choice of films) was better than the economy seating A380 that we had flown in on. Nicer seats with more room. Nicer drinks menu (including champagne). Beautifully presented meals plus more attentive flight crew (fewer passengers to cater for) It was almost good enough to make me pay for business class again. Unfortunately if I did that I wouldn't be able to travel so often so perhaps I'll do it just for a special occasion.
In 1973, Delta advertised "special round trip fares" in coach from NYC to Miami for $136. There were bigger seats, meals, and checked bags included then. Adjusted for inflation that works out to $925 today. If you flew business class in 2023, it would be closer to $600, and you'd get that bigger seat, a meal, and checked bag, just like 1973. You're still coming out ahead.
Having just flown cross-country in economy class for 7-8 hours (PHL-PDX with a stop in MDW), and late in 2021 flying to Asia in Business class for nearly 30 hours (PDX-DPS with stops in LA and SIN), this 77 year old body has a definite preference for the ability to lie flat as long as it wants. The article does not specifically deal with us oldsters, for whom flying needs to be comfortable
I am lucky to have travelled alot , in this article nobody mentioned price ! Price of buisness class has skyrocketed from last time I travelled to Australia .
Emirates asked for $3500 extra for 1 sector Dxb to Melbourne in buisness !
Even though I could afford it I declined as no bigger seat etc is worth 3500 usd for a 14 hr flight
Hi Ivan
You are correct about the price of business class.
A few tips are book well in advance. If you are using a not well known travel agent then use credit card . One has to be careful of scammers.
I have found cheaper round the world business class tickets than return to a single destination. So if time is not a problem then a RTW ticket is a good option. Hope this helps from a Australian.
I fly business or first because I have back issues. For me it is not about glamour but the ability to walk when I get to my destination.
The pinky in the air crowd will be all for business or first. Truth be told good or bad service can find you anywhere on the plane. As long as I've got an aisle seat I really don't care.
My perspective is slightly different from most - I primarily travel for pleasure and for me, that commences when I enter an airport. I want (rather than need) a Lounge, adequate luggage allowance, chauffeur service, decent bubbles on board and priority security and passport control ,,, or whatever priority lane is available to a premium flyer. Am I a princess? Absolutely! But I do enjoy being addressed by name, eating at a time that is...
My perspective is slightly different from most - I primarily travel for pleasure and for me, that commences when I enter an airport. I want (rather than need) a Lounge, adequate luggage allowance, chauffeur service, decent bubbles on board and priority security and passport control ,,, or whatever priority lane is available to a premium flyer. Am I a princess? Absolutely! But I do enjoy being addressed by name, eating at a time that is appropriate to my schedule, feeling as if I can request hydration whenever the mood strikes, eating on-demand, attempting to sleep in a recumbent position and generally feeling as if I matter ...... pathetic, I know, but part of my knowing that I am on vacation.
For me, it isn't about whether or not the experience in business class is going to blow me away. I'm flying to get somewhere that I can explore that I hope will blow me away. It's about getting from point A to point B. The real experience awaits me at my destination. Now, if I can get to point B more well-rested, more comfortably (especially as I get older and have more aches and pains),...
For me, it isn't about whether or not the experience in business class is going to blow me away. I'm flying to get somewhere that I can explore that I hope will blow me away. It's about getting from point A to point B. The real experience awaits me at my destination. Now, if I can get to point B more well-rested, more comfortably (especially as I get older and have more aches and pains), and a bit less stressed, and I can get all that for a decent amount of miles, then count me in!
My two cents' worth: I'm not bothered about the food and drinks in F or J, but the space has a value to me, being tall. But what's really the best thing about F and J, is the ground experience. Easy and quick check-in, getting speedily through security, a lounge to unwind in, and quick 'n' easy boarding. Now if an airline could offer all that, but with an Economy ticket and at appropriate supplement, I'd go for that.
With Priority Pass, TSA Precheck and airline status you essentially get the same ground experience.
This is a good point: with airline status, I get priority check-in, more luggage allowance, priority security, lounge access, priority boarding, and (most of the time) better seats.
So for short or even medium haul flights the cost for business simply is not worth it, the difference being a bit of low quality food and a somewhat nicer seat or an empty middle seat (in Europe).
Long haul the extra space, and especially this ability...
This is a good point: with airline status, I get priority check-in, more luggage allowance, priority security, lounge access, priority boarding, and (most of the time) better seats.
So for short or even medium haul flights the cost for business simply is not worth it, the difference being a bit of low quality food and a somewhat nicer seat or an empty middle seat (in Europe).
Long haul the extra space, and especially this ability to lie flat and sleep makes a big difference. Though this being the one thing that really matters (given I've got everything else by means of status) it's hard to argue the increasingly steep price differential.
Depends on the airline, but in general Business class is totally overrated and NOT worth the money.
Not too mention how the money could be spent on the ground for much more unique experiences.
If you take 200 flights a year, the extra hours of sleep in somewhat comfortable J/F seat might just make the difference whether your body can cope with it year after year, or not.
Look ...anything's better
Besides it's not 100 years ago, and this isn't a sailing ship or a 6 seat coach with horses, and one that takes months....
Besides . There's dinner to have, maybe drink,, and your doing 700k's an hour.... How good is that..
Best question in a while with intelligent responses.
Living in alohaland, it takes us five or six hours to reach the closest landmass, so we understand the longer haul every trip. In the olden days, taking a plane was like taking a bus, uncomfortable and you weren't driving, but it was tolerable and got you there with the other passengers if you were in coach. Fast-forward to today. People clipping their nails, putting hair...
Best question in a while with intelligent responses.
Living in alohaland, it takes us five or six hours to reach the closest landmass, so we understand the longer haul every trip. In the olden days, taking a plane was like taking a bus, uncomfortable and you weren't driving, but it was tolerable and got you there with the other passengers if you were in coach. Fast-forward to today. People clipping their nails, putting hair over headrests, spilling foods, screaming kids, mass fights on planes, and worse behavior are commonplace.
Remember when travel or an airplane ride was exciting and an adventure? We used to dress up to go to the airport or take a flight, and even be upgraded for doing so. I, like Lucky, love the aspect of flying on a tiny metal tube that takes me to another place on the planet safely and quickly and I never tire of that part. But these days, it's more of an exhausting venture, from the time you have to take yet another shuttle from the car depot crammed next to loud people from wherever, hitting you with their bags as the bus lurches, to the non-service in lobbies, to the crazy lines for security, sometimes even with TSA precheck. Then the usually filthy public restrooms inside of airports, massively overcrowded seating areas without even enough seats to wait for a flight to board, constant noise from tv, people shouting, p.a. system....and it's not much better in lounges if you can find space. The massive increase in expense of tickets and travel in general just adds insult to injury.
And that's even before we get on the plane, wondering if the ground staff will ask us to check our carryon. So when we have a chance at a seat where we can have our own decent individual space, someone not covering us with their hair or super-sized body--which is half the nation now and seats are too narrow no matter how wide anyone is, so supersized or not, those seats are not for humans to be comfortable in. Add to that having to watch their tiny screens or feel our new neighbor's every movement against us, filthy seats and trays, toilets like a prison, surly workers, food all over the floors, etc.....I'll take it.
I don't care about food or drinks or lounges or PreCheck or even boarding first since I'll have luggage space overhead, except on domestic "first class," guaranteed. I don't care if the flight attendant knows my name or what movies they have. I don't care if it's first or business, as long as it is lay flat. I'm certain I'd like Emirates Room or Palace or whatever they call it with the shower, but essentially, I'm renting a piece of real estate for a few precious hours so that I can just feel like a human during and after my trip--something that's been robbed over the past few decades with the masses traveling all the time everywhere. The airlines are a lot to blame here too with stuffing way to many people in ever-shrinking seats, and airports have their part with lack of space and amenities and noise and just making people feel like, and thus behave like bad animals.
Oh, and no one mentions increased safety, but there's way fewer people at the front where there are way more emergency exists. And way fewer people going to drop a bag on your head and less turbulence in the front and also you can elevate your legs for less deep vein thrombosis among other factors. So there's that too....
OK, so that sounds pretty crabby and it is.
But I've found that if I can get a proper seat that lays flat, it makes travel tolerable or even nice again. It ends up costing about twice as much as economy if you aren't buying the crazy expensive seats. Premium economy is about 50% more than economy in my recent experience. Travel is expensive these days. It's a luxury if you want comfort and I do.
Hotels? I don't care that much....Hilton, Hyatt, Marriott....wake up and it's all the same...four white walls, new fake wood floors, no service, but they all have a bed. On the ground is where it's at for me and I find that the adventure is still to be had in parks and museums and just walking thru cities everywhere where the magic of travel still thrives. A comfortable, lay flat seat is a must to start or finish a trip these days.
We are using more gas and resources up front, so my apologies to Greta and the earth....I do travel less now and I hardly drive so I use way less than an average Joe or Jane.
So, I have definitely become spoilt and am an elitist. I live frugally so that I can afford the front when I travel.
But I love this column and blog because it reminds me of a more gracious time of some elegance when traveling and it keeps my mind engaged in a spreadsheet of possibilities of how I might use my precious miles when I do travel. It harkens back to simpler days, more refinement and true enjoyment of travel for travel sake when the cares of us all were fewer and we all seemed to be better mannered and kinder towards each other, when I regularly might have engaged (with a willing seat mate) in a conversation lasting hours, shed some laughter and maybe a tear together without even knowing each other's names.
I guess my motto is a twist on the popular bumper sticker here "Live Aloha" and maybe it's "Travel with Aloha" and sitting up front helps a lot in that.
Flying First Class on ET ADD-FCO-IAD allowed me to sleep @ 10 hours after an exhausting time in Addis. The lie-flat is the primary perk for me, not the food or drink.
Next month my wife and I have lie-flats on UA to AKL. Lie-flats allow us to rest while flying then enjoy activities soon after landing because we won't be zombies.
Having flown millions of miles, I would generally be unwilling to pay more to sit in business/first class instead of coach if I knew I'd have an empty middle seat next to me. Sitting in an emergency exit row with a middle seat free, I generally get more space than domestic first class. I really only value First Class when I'm crammed in the back on a full flight. Sure, int'l business has moments of...
Having flown millions of miles, I would generally be unwilling to pay more to sit in business/first class instead of coach if I knew I'd have an empty middle seat next to me. Sitting in an emergency exit row with a middle seat free, I generally get more space than domestic first class. I really only value First Class when I'm crammed in the back on a full flight. Sure, int'l business has moments of true enjoyment -- like sipping a nice glass of wine at 38,000 feet -- but it's generally a terrible value proposition. I honestly think flying first class is a lot like buying a luxury car: modest REAL value but high perceived superiority over the masses.
I have only flown in business or first class a few times and those times were because of unusual circumstances. I found the experiences to be nice but generally not something I would spend a lot of extra money to get and I don't accumulate mileage fast enough to get them otherwise. I have booked an extra seat in coach for comfort a few times, though. When I see transpacific round trip flights for business...
I have only flown in business or first class a few times and those times were because of unusual circumstances. I found the experiences to be nice but generally not something I would spend a lot of extra money to get and I don't accumulate mileage fast enough to get them otherwise. I have booked an extra seat in coach for comfort a few times, though. When I see transpacific round trip flights for business class and first class seats going for thousands of dollars more than coach seats, I always consider what I could be using the extra cash for. I suppose if I was into high priced hotel rooms, I could get more true comfort for a day or two. Alas, I have much more limited funds so I have to be more practical about my spending.
I'm shocked to learn that some things on the Internet aren't representative of how they actually are.
With that out of the way, there's something to be said to take a page out of the Influencers' tactics in terms of arriving early or staying late. Last year I went on a run across the Charles Bridge in Prague early in the morning with only Influencers and wedding photo shoots as company. Fantastic. A few hours...
I'm shocked to learn that some things on the Internet aren't representative of how they actually are.
With that out of the way, there's something to be said to take a page out of the Influencers' tactics in terms of arriving early or staying late. Last year I went on a run across the Charles Bridge in Prague early in the morning with only Influencers and wedding photo shoots as company. Fantastic. A few hours later the scene was not unlike Coney Island on an August Sunday. Much in life depends on timing.
https://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowUserReviews-g274707-d275507-r854318082-Four_Seasons_Hotel_Prague-Prague_Bohemia.html
As for airline business class, it may well be that it is currently defined more by the deprivations it lacks vs. the benefits it bestows, but it's worth it for me.
I am of modest means and part Scottish which means I'm cheap. We go to Europe to see our grandchildren. We ask ourselves this when there is an opportunity to upgrade, "what would give us more pleasure, spending a few hundred for a better seat, or using that money to have experiences with our grandchildren"?
For at least the last 10 years, I have only traveled in Business class and would not change for anything. It is not about the food or drinks, especially since I don’t drink any alcohol or wine. It is always about better service, comfort on the plane and in a lounge, especially if the airport is crowded. It is about easier travel with dedicated check iin counters and TSA lanes.
After Covid, in 2021,...
For at least the last 10 years, I have only traveled in Business class and would not change for anything. It is not about the food or drinks, especially since I don’t drink any alcohol or wine. It is always about better service, comfort on the plane and in a lounge, especially if the airport is crowded. It is about easier travel with dedicated check iin counters and TSA lanes.
After Covid, in 2021, I had to travel overseas several times and did not want to be near any crowds. Being able to board early and sit with no one next to me was a huge plus and being able to control my immediate surroundings and lie in a flat bed was a bonus.
My next trip is Air France & Emirates Business ( a shower with 5 minutes of hot water does not interest me so business on Emirates is fine) and I can’t wait!
Good food is to a trip what hot water was to a shower 2 generations ago. Some people think it's a necessary luxury, those who can't afford it will justify their lot by claiming cold showers are just fine.
Would you do a post as to which hotel premium credit card is better, Amex Hilton Aspire or Amex Marriott Brilliant (explaining the value benefit for a American domestic traveler as opposed to an American international traveler)?
Try flying between SYD and Europe on a regular basis, and you notice the difference between economy and premium. Your body will tell you. It is not about glam or gluttony, it is about the difference between the inevitable 'molestation' of one's body and being in economy, and the general kindness to all aspects of oneself as a human in premium class. Repeated sojourns of 22 hrs in the air will teach you the value...
Try flying between SYD and Europe on a regular basis, and you notice the difference between economy and premium. Your body will tell you. It is not about glam or gluttony, it is about the difference between the inevitable 'molestation' of one's body and being in economy, and the general kindness to all aspects of oneself as a human in premium class. Repeated sojourns of 22 hrs in the air will teach you the value of the latter, EVEN IF PAYING FULL LOLLY FOR IT YOURSELF!
I agree with what others have said - it's all about being more comfortable on a long flight for me. I don't care what any one things, and I'm not really on social media....
fly regularly between .manchester and Sydney in business now at rip off prices. travelling again at year end this time in premium economy.if you can snooze in front of you t.v. at home, you can certainly do it six miles high!
Over 4 hours business class. Under 4 hours economy. Under 2 hours budget!
I could never pay $$$ for it as, for example, I can easily fly for four hours in economy. But to fly seven hours in business means paying around $700 an hour to be “refreshed”. Honestly take a flight the day before and get refreshed in a $300 a night hotel (our trick is to take 8 am flight from Newark to London and just sleep at the airport…MUCH better than an overnight in business).
That said love a “free” upgrade!
To some people the incremental cost between Y/C/F is nothing. Like some will open a $100 bottle like nothing, but I'll be drinking $10 wine. Certainly to them, the difference in comfort and service will be worth it.
But for "regular" people, you need to remember the extra money you paid to have the "privilege" often gets you more on the ground. Like $300 will get you in a Michelin/Gault Millau restaurant serving you a...
To some people the incremental cost between Y/C/F is nothing. Like some will open a $100 bottle like nothing, but I'll be drinking $10 wine. Certainly to them, the difference in comfort and service will be worth it.
But for "regular" people, you need to remember the extra money you paid to have the "privilege" often gets you more on the ground. Like $300 will get you in a Michelin/Gault Millau restaurant serving you a full course AND wine paring -- as much as I love the satay and lobster in SQ there's just no contest between which is better.
I just came back to New Zealand from Singapore on Singapore Airlines and was lucky enough to be able to fly in their busibess class. While Biz Class seat is obviously more comfortable than Economy, no doubt about it, I still couldn't sleep for a few reasons - meal service took longer (with starter, main, dessert served not at the same time) which made sleeping time shorter (before you need to wake up again for...
I just came back to New Zealand from Singapore on Singapore Airlines and was lucky enough to be able to fly in their busibess class. While Biz Class seat is obviously more comfortable than Economy, no doubt about it, I still couldn't sleep for a few reasons - meal service took longer (with starter, main, dessert served not at the same time) which made sleeping time shorter (before you need to wake up again for breakfast), crew walking up and down all night (preparing for next meal service I suppose) and the bed which was made up by simply flipping your seat back and not enough padding. And with SQ A350 used on this flight, many know that you will sleep on an angle making it really uncomfortable. So, I would say, unless you are a person who is lucky enough to be able to easily fall asleep and if you are prepared to skip all other services in order to grab a longer sleep, which to me is the main perk of flying business class - more room to lie flat, it is indeed, sometimes, a bit overrated. Having said that, of course it is still overall a lot more comfortable and better experience than economy class.
As a frequent business traveler the one thing I would add is at my age 50 my knees and back take more dislike of coach.
When you fly a daylight flight east coast to Western Europe , business or first is not needed. Coach is fine, for flights leaving at 4.30 pm or 5, also not needed. U basically arrive when the tonight show starts, in Europe. All flights over 8 hours if u can afford then for comfort it is fine. Food if done well is a benefit, otherwise who cares. It’s the destination and purpose that counts. Social...
When you fly a daylight flight east coast to Western Europe , business or first is not needed. Coach is fine, for flights leaving at 4.30 pm or 5, also not needed. U basically arrive when the tonight show starts, in Europe. All flights over 8 hours if u can afford then for comfort it is fine. Food if done well is a benefit, otherwise who cares. It’s the destination and purpose that counts. Social media presentation is driving people crazy and I have been laughing about influencers for years, none have ever swayed me to repeat what they have been doing. Nowadays will only travel to secondary or even smaller lesser known towns, stay longer and immerse in local culture. When working, the glamour is part of people’s bragging rights of their success. Enjoy, until retirement and then u will enjoy totally different values and even evaluate flights and hotels different. For example, flights back to US, why do you get a second meal when flight is 7 to 9 hours, usually u grabbed stuff in lounge and in business or first the main meal is sufficient particularly when u can eat on demand. I am happy now that I was able to see the world and had others pay for it, today I will only fly f/c for flights over 7 or 8 hours and exclusively buy tickets overseas (not Cairo). Few back to back Jet Blue AMS to BOS for 1230 EUR in mint versa BOS-AMS for 1899usd.
Love your take on this, Ben. I feel the exact way about flying as you do, and about flying in premium cabin. I don't usually have first/business in the budget, nor does my meager lifestyle allow me to upgrade with points all that often...but when I do, it's all that much sweeter. I aspire to get to where you are, however much I might then get hated on for being entitled, or for not understanding...
Love your take on this, Ben. I feel the exact way about flying as you do, and about flying in premium cabin. I don't usually have first/business in the budget, nor does my meager lifestyle allow me to upgrade with points all that often...but when I do, it's all that much sweeter. I aspire to get to where you are, however much I might then get hated on for being entitled, or for not understanding the plight of the economy traveler. For now though, I'll continue to enjoy flying as much as possible, always enjoying the view from the window seat.
I will say this - as a 1K who flies a lot of red eyes, I absolutely do not want to fly up front
on those flights. I can easily sleep on a plane, and those seats up front are too far away from the window to 'lean' comfortably. I'll take the premium economy window seat , with hopefully an empty middle seat, every time. I'm number 1 on the upgrade list for tonight's...
I will say this - as a 1K who flies a lot of red eyes, I absolutely do not want to fly up front
on those flights. I can easily sleep on a plane, and those seats up front are too far away from the window to 'lean' comfortably. I'll take the premium economy window seat , with hopefully an empty middle seat, every time. I'm number 1 on the upgrade list for tonight's flight and I've already called UA and said, "please, no upgrade." Call me crazy, but I feel strongly about this.
Actually, on domestic short(ish) and medium length flights, I totally get this. Easier to nap in that seat and often less disruption. I'm with you on that for redeyes and super-early flights where I want a nap
At 6'5" tall, economy seats just don't work for me. I do UK - NZ trips at least twice a year. I tried the cramped seats a few times on medium-haul UK - US flights and I was miserable and sore for days after. So, it's not all about the perks.
I'm very blessed to be 27 years old and pushing nearly 200 hours of my life spent in business class... all thanks to points
Completely agree with your perspective and that’s why I’m a fan of the blog. No matter how many times I fly in a premium cabin, it still amazes me that all this comfort is available on a plane. Getting to my destination well rested and, if I fly the right airline, well fed, for me, makes me feel really lucky and privileged. I'm with Ben here: getting a shower, or a fresh espresso or even...
Completely agree with your perspective and that’s why I’m a fan of the blog. No matter how many times I fly in a premium cabin, it still amazes me that all this comfort is available on a plane. Getting to my destination well rested and, if I fly the right airline, well fed, for me, makes me feel really lucky and privileged. I'm with Ben here: getting a shower, or a fresh espresso or even climbing the stairs on a 747 or an A380 will never get old, no matter how much crap people will post on social media.
I could fly Virgin Atlantic Dreamliner prem econ nonstop for as long as they go! I would take a fresh Jersey Mike's sub and two very cold Pepsis
( I'll go to a nice restaurant when I land ).
Two movies, short nap and some work will take care of the 12+ hours.
I wish their FF prog was much better! In addition, I would take far greater prem econ availability at 50k over J/F.
It's been a treat to have the room and comfort in J or F, especially if it's covered by work or from points or an upgrade. I don't take pics or even let my friends know, but I keep myself in the moment and enjoy it.
“It’s not the journey, but the destination.”
On a serious note, flying first class or business class on a long haul flight is on my bucket list.
Let me start by saying I hate flying. I hate everything about it, from the hassle of getting to the airport, the airport itself, the ludicrous hoops they make you jump through in the name of security (most of which don’t make you any more secure), the herding into cramped lounges onto cramped planes - and they’re all cramped - and then sitting for hours in a noisy, bumpy flying baked bean tin, having to...
Let me start by saying I hate flying. I hate everything about it, from the hassle of getting to the airport, the airport itself, the ludicrous hoops they make you jump through in the name of security (most of which don’t make you any more secure), the herding into cramped lounges onto cramped planes - and they’re all cramped - and then sitting for hours in a noisy, bumpy flying baked bean tin, having to queue for tiny cramped toilets, being served tiny portions of indifferent food.
And that’s if your flight takes off at all, or on time, you don’t miss your connections, and the airline doesn’t lose your luggage.
PE, Business or First just takes the edge off, nothing more. And makes you pay through the nose for the privilege, while trying to persuade you you’re having a lovely time.
You’re not. Flying is not a pleasant experience, no matter how much you try to tell yourself it is to justify the ludicrous amount of money you’ve had to pay to get an inch more width or an inch more legroom, or your food on a plate instead of in a cardboard box.
Economy is horrible and any business class seat by comparsion would be night and day... let alone a first class seat.
Couldn´t care less about lounge access and food onboard.
On longhauls, I just need a lie-flat seat to be able to sleep and business gets the job done pretty well.
More and more, I've started asking myself this question: for the price I'd spend for F/J, what kind of experience could I get on the ground?
I could spend an extra $2,000 to fly to my destination in Business Class, and arrive reasonably refreshed. Or I could suck it up, fly in economy, and spend half that price for a few days at a luxury resort in my destination, resting and relaxing before doing whatever...
More and more, I've started asking myself this question: for the price I'd spend for F/J, what kind of experience could I get on the ground?
I could spend an extra $2,000 to fly to my destination in Business Class, and arrive reasonably refreshed. Or I could suck it up, fly in economy, and spend half that price for a few days at a luxury resort in my destination, resting and relaxing before doing whatever business or sightseeing I intend to do.
Sometimes, that isn't possible (especially for short-notice work trips) and I do opt for the more expensive seats. But more often than not, I go with the less expensive (and better) ground experience.
When I was younger, my perspective was: I'll happily take an economy class seat if someone paid me $300/hour to do it. Of course no one ever paid me that, except...saving $300/hour was the same as me paying myself $300/hour. So flying economy class transpacific was absolutely worth it for me.
Today, of course I save even more money by using points and miles to fly J. But in a pinch today I can afford to pay cash now.
I have not flown long haul economy in decades, I started playing the miles game in the late 80s before it even caught on fire. Once you've tasted the finer things in life it is really hard to go back and as you get older it's even harder to think about flying in cattle class for 12+ hours. I take one extensive trip per year, from USA to Europe to Asia for three weeks and...
I have not flown long haul economy in decades, I started playing the miles game in the late 80s before it even caught on fire. Once you've tasted the finer things in life it is really hard to go back and as you get older it's even harder to think about flying in cattle class for 12+ hours. I take one extensive trip per year, from USA to Europe to Asia for three weeks and in business class the whole way on British Airways and Cathay Pacific. I book the trip using 165K Asia Miles (multi-carrier award) and it's worth every mile. For me, the most important things are the lounge, the seat and the champagne; bonus if the inflight food is actually good.
Overrated is relative.
Wealth is overrated.
Premium cabin is overrated.
Environment is overrated.
You go ask Elon Musk, anything commercial First or Coach is the same when you have a Gulfstream.
You go ask Greta, anything commercial First or Coach is same when you're using fossil fuel.
Next Clickbait (so many comments, it works) please.
I flew with qatar air business class and felt amazing, good bed,awesome food,excellent service and q suite and then doha lounge,wow.I then flew with singapore,business class and really felt let down.beds not so comfortable sin to dps seats and lounge disgusting. Sin to ams lounge,amazing. Flight was like dif airline. No comparison to qatar.
Cant wait to fly qatar business again, and again
It is need if you are going to have a fly for more than 5 hours. You need room to handle your back and legs pain. The airplane will use the same amounts of gas, even if you sit in the toilet.
I will take Y class any day over BA's Face-to-Face J class seats!...What a horrendous experience! The worst hard product in the world!...
Everybody is talking about the individual components of the business class flight and overlooking the main principle. When you arrive after a business class flight, you are fresher and less exhausted than you would be after an economy flight. The longer the flight, the greater the benefit. So when I'm travelling for a 4 or 5-day trip, flying business helps me maximize my time on the ground. And when returning home, it helps me hit...
Everybody is talking about the individual components of the business class flight and overlooking the main principle. When you arrive after a business class flight, you are fresher and less exhausted than you would be after an economy flight. The longer the flight, the greater the benefit. So when I'm travelling for a 4 or 5-day trip, flying business helps me maximize my time on the ground. And when returning home, it helps me hit the ground running. That's the real value.
You are the first one to nail it. The experience is great but the money or value is in the enjoyment of the following 3 to 4 days. Who cares about the food. A few drinks when you request them and a good sleep and you are golden upon your arrival. Lounges are a plus but so is the people bar in the flow way.
Let's stop normalising/accepting the shittiness of economy seats in their current format and trajectory. The current conditions are built to which minimum acceptable standards?
The comparison should not be whether F/J is better than the amenities at "home", but whether it's preferable to the actual alternative, a seat in Economy. One hopes that comparison invariably shows F/J is indeed superior to Economy (although I've been on flights where it came close to favoring Economy (cough EgyptAir cough). But even that requires comparing the cost differential. If you a can snag F/J at low cost, using points, miles or whatever,...
The comparison should not be whether F/J is better than the amenities at "home", but whether it's preferable to the actual alternative, a seat in Economy. One hopes that comparison invariably shows F/J is indeed superior to Economy (although I've been on flights where it came close to favoring Economy (cough EgyptAir cough). But even that requires comparing the cost differential. If you a can snag F/J at low cost, using points, miles or whatever, F/J *should* be superior to Economy. But if you have to pay real money -- sometimes several thousands of $$$-- then maybe it's not such a good deal, considering you are safely, if less comfortably, delivered to your destination on the other side of the planet only a few minutes behind those who paid a lot more to sit up front.
I think Lucky basically nails it in his response. You can't compare premium cabins to home and the ground. You have to compare it to the general experience in the sky: economy. I don't think that characterization that it is mainly a bigger seat with slightly better food is too far off base. As a bigger guy, that space is the absolute biggest perk in business or first. I can't imagine 10 hours in a...
I think Lucky basically nails it in his response. You can't compare premium cabins to home and the ground. You have to compare it to the general experience in the sky: economy. I don't think that characterization that it is mainly a bigger seat with slightly better food is too far off base. As a bigger guy, that space is the absolute biggest perk in business or first. I can't imagine 10 hours in a tiny economy-class seat with little room to move.
As for travel bloggers and vloggers, again I agree with Lucky, especially on YouTube. You need to hype things enough to get attention. I think Lucky is very realistic in his content, but to be fair I like the airline and points/miles news here my favorite part. I generally prefer reviews in video format and there are a few YouTubers who I think are less about the hype and more about reality that I follow closely. So far, while I have done four transatlantic trip pre-COVID in business, I have not done any of the real premium experiences, e.g. Singapore, Emirates, etc. The best I have done is AA 777 business and Iberia A340 business. I am booked on Air France's new A350 business this summer. So, I can't really comment on just how over hyped videos are on those "ultra-luxury" offerings.
Another part of the equation is the the Economy class travel has gotten less comfortable across most airlines in the last decade.
On a recent trip I few Eva to Taipei in a 777 with 10 abreast and 30” pitch. The return was on Asiana, 9 abreast with a 32” pitch. It was also a 777, but the difference in comfort was like night and day. The service on Asiana in Economy was more attentive than the service I have received in Business class on other airlines.
My strategy has evolved through time. When I got into miles/points, I just redeemed for business and first (whichever had availability.) I still fly economy since I believe that's the only way to truly appreciate flying in business or first. However, since I can sleep in economy class, I try to save up my miles/points to redeem for First Class ultra longhaul flights as I think First Class is all about the experience whereas business...
My strategy has evolved through time. When I got into miles/points, I just redeemed for business and first (whichever had availability.) I still fly economy since I believe that's the only way to truly appreciate flying in business or first. However, since I can sleep in economy class, I try to save up my miles/points to redeem for First Class ultra longhaul flights as I think First Class is all about the experience whereas business class is just a bigger/more comfy seat. In other words, I mostly fly economy or First class nowadays and that works for me!
Yes it's a First World Problem. Yes I'm spoiled and will only travel on long haul international in Business Class. Many years of corporate travel with that benefit so I am able to use my points for my wife and I on our personal trips and will book/pay for Business. On Domestic flights I'm perfectly fine with an Exit Row or Comfort+, Main Cabin Extra, etc.
On the long haul flights I expect a...
Yes it's a First World Problem. Yes I'm spoiled and will only travel on long haul international in Business Class. Many years of corporate travel with that benefit so I am able to use my points for my wife and I on our personal trips and will book/pay for Business. On Domestic flights I'm perfectly fine with an Exit Row or Comfort+, Main Cabin Extra, etc.
On the long haul flights I expect a relatively large space with the ability to recline and even snooze for a while but like Lucky I don't really sleep well on planes. I expect priority checkin and potentially much better meals and lounge access (my AX Platinum gets me that in most cases). All of that being said I have NEVER picked First Class where it's offerred above Business as fancy champagne and caviar (yuck) are not my cup of tea. Even there while I've never done it I might consider Premium Economy on a long haul daytime flight (like Europe back to US).
Finally I do think that some travel bloggers blow this out too much and set the expectations very high for newbies but for those of us that have been flying for decades we know what to expect and what will make us comfortable.
I just flew JFK-LHR AA104 in J. That is a short 6:30 min flight. The only plus was the seat. AA started beverage service 1:40 min after departure - for this flight it was shortly after midnight. Food was not much better than some of the domestic F. I pre-ordered fish but was served barely warm crab cakes - full of bread but not crab meat. Wines were equally mediocre. Bottom line: I would rather...
I just flew JFK-LHR AA104 in J. That is a short 6:30 min flight. The only plus was the seat. AA started beverage service 1:40 min after departure - for this flight it was shortly after midnight. Food was not much better than some of the domestic F. I pre-ordered fish but was served barely warm crab cakes - full of bread but not crab meat. Wines were equally mediocre. Bottom line: I would rather spend more on a comfortable hotel rather than for ca. 5 hour interrupted sleep on a plane.
Business class is better, but probably would not pay cash for it even though I am in the income range to afford it. If I had to pay cash I would just pay economy or premium economy and pocket the difference.
I would pay with miles, but at the same time I find it rediculous some people take positioning flights and connections just to take a business class flight. A direct flight in economy is...
Business class is better, but probably would not pay cash for it even though I am in the income range to afford it. If I had to pay cash I would just pay economy or premium economy and pocket the difference.
I would pay with miles, but at the same time I find it rediculous some people take positioning flights and connections just to take a business class flight. A direct flight in economy is better than a business class flight with a connection. All those extra hours traveling and having to go up and down multiple times trumps any benefit of business class for me.
Is it overrated? No....but I do think some of the benefits are overhyped. With a couple of exceptions, generally you get a much more comfortable seat and better food. The other 'frills' are all things you can get with credit cards now, priority boarding, security etc. Sure sometimes the premium business lounge (Polaris, Cathay etc) are great, but even that is more instagram worthy than functional; unless you drink/eat a ton plus consume more on...
Is it overrated? No....but I do think some of the benefits are overhyped. With a couple of exceptions, generally you get a much more comfortable seat and better food. The other 'frills' are all things you can get with credit cards now, priority boarding, security etc. Sure sometimes the premium business lounge (Polaris, Cathay etc) are great, but even that is more instagram worthy than functional; unless you drink/eat a ton plus consume more on the plane. It is why I am more than happy to pay much less for a TAP Portugal Executive Class experience (overseas, with the fantastic throne seat) than let's say Air France with their better lounge and champaign. The seat is what matters.
My reason for spending the extra on flying business/first class are based on a couple things. Since the pandemic I've lost my love for flying as a means of travel(and definitely cruise ships, but that's another tale all together). Stories of people wanting to change assigned seats, arguing over seats being reclined, the long wait to board and disembark. If you are flying economy. If you check a bag there's a fee, if you want...
My reason for spending the extra on flying business/first class are based on a couple things. Since the pandemic I've lost my love for flying as a means of travel(and definitely cruise ships, but that's another tale all together). Stories of people wanting to change assigned seats, arguing over seats being reclined, the long wait to board and disembark. If you are flying economy. If you check a bag there's a fee, if you want to board sooner-a fee, a better seat selection-fee. And even if you don't check your bags good luck finding a spot for your carrier on. And the way the airline personnel are becoming carry-on police. Anyway, you get the picture. Even budget airlines have ways to add fees to their low fares. So certainly you pay more for the upgraded fare in business it first class but what you get is the ability to check in without waiting in a long line at the service counter, priority boarding(so you're first on, with a more comfortable seat), which then means first off. It generally means I don't have to listen to babies or small children(generally). I don't drink but there's that perk, and better snacks and meals. But ultimately my checked bags are free my carry-ons go on first and I do as well. Because in the end the flight is long enough, whether I'm going from one end of Texas to the other or across the ocean. I don't want to spend anymore time in that metal tube than I have to.
Is Business class worth it?
The general point of flying Business Class is being far more refreshed after the flight and able to go straight to business, especially if the trip is short, not allowing time for time adjustment.
Other reasons for flying business/first: Being overly tall or overweight. The seats, even US domestic, are larger. Sometimes inside Europe, the business class are not actually bigger seats, just free booze and slightly better...
Is Business class worth it?
The general point of flying Business Class is being far more refreshed after the flight and able to go straight to business, especially if the trip is short, not allowing time for time adjustment.
Other reasons for flying business/first: Being overly tall or overweight. The seats, even US domestic, are larger. Sometimes inside Europe, the business class are not actually bigger seats, just free booze and slightly better meals. And First class just has a blocked middle seat (I'm looking at you Air France).
Back to the original person. He flew Turkish Business Class. While decent the two times I flew it, it is not Emirates, or even Lufthansa. The First-Class lounge in Istanbul is something to discuss!
OTOH, Business Class on Turkish is about 1/3rd the price of Lufthansa. For the price, it is great and far better than sitting in economy.
I agree that social media types overhype First Class. But then they overhype EVERYTHING!
Thanks for your perspective, I flew on American Airlines premium economy in October 2022 to Rome. Not a long trip but I wanted 3 extra inches of leg room. Plus I was looking for a quiet cabin for some shuteye. Seat chart showed cabin was 2/3 full. Not so fast…..at final boarding, the Premium Economy cabin completely filled up with airline employees who were on standby. End result, flight attendants were overwhelmed and aisles were...
Thanks for your perspective, I flew on American Airlines premium economy in October 2022 to Rome. Not a long trip but I wanted 3 extra inches of leg room. Plus I was looking for a quiet cabin for some shuteye. Seat chart showed cabin was 2/3 full. Not so fast…..at final boarding, the Premium Economy cabin completely filled up with airline employees who were on standby. End result, flight attendants were overwhelmed and aisles were always busy and meal choices were not available. So not a good flying experience. Next time I’ll go for Business.
I've noticed the same thing on UA. Premium Economy often seems to be the Employee Cabin. I don't think many people want to pay a lot extra to be in the second-best cabin. I always think the employees flying it are lucky not to have to put up with the cramped conditions in coach. In a perfect world, the coach cabin would look like Premium Economy, instead of cattle car.
Sounds like the problem lies with this reader who can’t differentiate between reality and exaggeration via social media posts. Everyone knows social media anmplifies experiences be it eating at a three Michelin starred restaurant to staying at an overwater bungalow at the Maldives. Heck, after spending hours/ days/ months trying to find that elusive first class tickets on xyz airlines, you bet I’m experiencing that first class seat with rose color lenses! That’s just human...
Sounds like the problem lies with this reader who can’t differentiate between reality and exaggeration via social media posts. Everyone knows social media anmplifies experiences be it eating at a three Michelin starred restaurant to staying at an overwater bungalow at the Maldives. Heck, after spending hours/ days/ months trying to find that elusive first class tickets on xyz airlines, you bet I’m experiencing that first class seat with rose color lenses! That’s just human nature.
I recently booked four flights on Qatar in the world famous Q Suites ....and i ended up travelling only one sector out of four in Q Suites...so be very careful what you think you are paying for.i will never travel on Qatar ever again ..
For me it's all about rest. I fly long haul (10 hours plus) return approximately 7 to 8 times a year. Arriving fresh to client site or to holiday destinations or being ready to maximize time with family on my return is vital. I usually only eat on daytime flights and on nighttime ones it's all about sleep from wheels up until 40 mins to go call. I love being able to sleep 8 or...
For me it's all about rest. I fly long haul (10 hours plus) return approximately 7 to 8 times a year. Arriving fresh to client site or to holiday destinations or being ready to maximize time with family on my return is vital. I usually only eat on daytime flights and on nighttime ones it's all about sleep from wheels up until 40 mins to go call. I love being able to sleep 8 or 9 hours lying down and that's what I pay for. I flew Qatar last year and the bar area they have on a380 was empty. Food was meh, so I just spent time sleeping and lying watching movies. It's definitely overglamorised on YouTube and best to set expectations occordingly.
Completely agree that first and business are more comfortable than coach, but, even when points are used for the seat, there’s still an opportunity cost in using the travel credit cards instead of one that gives cash back for the spend.
I’ve thought of spending on those cards, but it ends up being a good amount of money at the end of the year from what I spend on my Fidelity Visa.
Plus...
Completely agree that first and business are more comfortable than coach, but, even when points are used for the seat, there’s still an opportunity cost in using the travel credit cards instead of one that gives cash back for the spend.
I’ve thought of spending on those cards, but it ends up being a good amount of money at the end of the year from what I spend on my Fidelity Visa.
Plus there’s the idea that you might not get the best routing in order to get the business seat for a decent amount of points. Living in Denver, I love the nonstops to Europe and Asia, and I’m not sure it would be worth it to spend the points to end up wing extra connections for a short overnight flight from the east coast and an extra domestic segment.
I’ve flown in premium cabins to a coastal gateway but still been so tired as I wait for the domestic connection, just wishing I was already home.
Which reminds me, that could be an interesting topic: how much worse are you willing to make your routing (i.e. extra stops, short international segment, etc) in order to get a premium seat for a low amount of miles?
"how much worse are you willing to make your routing (i.e. extra stops, short international segment, etc) in order to get a premium seat for a low amount of miles?" I did that once, flying from SFO to LHR... NEVER again! I'd rather pay cash to fly direct in economy class than ever do that again.
Going back over decades of long haul flying, my perspective has changed dramatically. Back before 2000, economy cabins had fewer seats, wider seats with more legroom and flights often went out with less than full cabins. F and J class cabins were more crowded than today, with recliners and no lie flat seats. Back the. I would have found no value in the greater price for those premium cabins. Today, and yes, I am older,...
Going back over decades of long haul flying, my perspective has changed dramatically. Back before 2000, economy cabins had fewer seats, wider seats with more legroom and flights often went out with less than full cabins. F and J class cabins were more crowded than today, with recliners and no lie flat seats. Back the. I would have found no value in the greater price for those premium cabins. Today, and yes, I am older, so that is also factored into the equation, economy is a difficult ride, and business class is exponentially better. I find the value good and am willing to pay for that. It helps to have the discretionary income to allow that luxury which hasn’t always been the case. If I didn’t have it I’d settle for economy and get through.
I agree with the guy who flew Turkish Airlines and was a bit underwhelmed by business class.
I've been lucky enough to fly long haul business class a number of times but that's far outweighed by the number of long haul economy trips I've done.
Of course, business is better than economy. The space, the lie flat bad, the screens, service and food.
However, I remember my first business flight, when laid...
I agree with the guy who flew Turkish Airlines and was a bit underwhelmed by business class.
I've been lucky enough to fly long haul business class a number of times but that's far outweighed by the number of long haul economy trips I've done.
Of course, business is better than economy. The space, the lie flat bad, the screens, service and food.
However, I remember my first business flight, when laid down to sleep. In the semi darkness, with several people lying very close to me, people walking up and down and audible snoring it suddenly took me back to that youth hostel I stayed in in Prague when I was in my 20s.
So given the choice, business all the time. But, yes, it can be hyped up into some luxury experience which it just isn't.
Blogs are the original social media; your clickbait post titles (which I don’t mind because I see them for what they are, a tool for boosting engagement) are equivalent to other social media post hooks. Trying to separate yourself from other content creators is a strange take.
One option not mentioned is Premium Economy ( Im referring to Long Haul). I've flown Air France, British, Virgin and American. All are excellent as they offer a separate cabin and 2-3-2 or 2-4-2 seating allowing us as a couple to have our own little area on the 2 seat side, plus comfy seats and more leg room. At around $1600 pp r/t from SFO, we find it well worth it.
I sleep on back no movement with lights on or off with noise ( i actually cannot sleep when it's deathlybstill and quiet) all the time at home. So yeah for me it'd be NP
W R O N G ! ! !
".... people probably wouldn’t be very interested, and many people probably think I’m an entitled jerk."
Compared to MANY (maybe too many, wannabe Travelers who just travel for vlogging or blogging, to think they are "SPECIAL", you do a great job, yes! .... mostly!) other who use social media to get ATTENTION and have no knowledge of details or background except what they quickly read on...
W R O N G ! ! !
".... people probably wouldn’t be very interested, and many people probably think I’m an entitled jerk."
Compared to MANY (maybe too many, wannabe Travelers who just travel for vlogging or blogging, to think they are "SPECIAL", you do a great job, yes! .... mostly!) other who use social media to get ATTENTION and have no knowledge of details or background except what they quickly read on the web and think they know it all and brag to be flying high class . . . it's a burden for many years and i'd say it started already in the early 2000's, when i was still working for the airline for 25 years and it got crazy then already, i bet these days it's even worse then back then?
So NO to your Q Ben, "usually" your posts are good if not almost GREAT! . . . preferred by me, compared to some lame Instagrammers or Titter People who just want hits and likes, but have NO GLUE of the basics!
Sooner or later, all those might be going back to be flying tight Coach Class again, back to where they came from before the tripods, Smartphones or GoPros when flying gets as exclusive again as it once was, as at the time i started flying and some REAL qualifications were needed to get such a job.
Almost like thinking of little Ben flying on CONDOR to Florida in his window seat in his younger days, . . . now he has realized how cool it can be flying that same airline again, many years later, with a totally new product, he actually enjoys flying, . . . as a passenger. :-)
This is how hopefully most of those travel bloggers and vloggers will soon go back to there affordable Coach seat or lowcost airlines they grew up with, when people start to learn how non sense most of there videos/photos really are! Simply, because they have NO FACTS, just stupid or maybe even cheap headlines that are as worthless as there blogs!
(my way of looking at things!)
Premium Cabins on planes are rare anyway (globally) and the few airlines that are worth to talk about it, will become fewer in coming years, i bet!
Premium Short haul flights are VERY rare already, to be worth talking about! e.g. in Europe it's only 1 scheduled Airline and maybe 1 VIP charter company from Malta. (Turkish Airlines & AirX)
Part of the psychic lure reflects attaining what was once unattainable. Most people start flying in economy, and you think "how much nicer it must be up there." So when it becomes possible because of points or expense accounts there is initially a real novelty. Now that I fly all the time for business it highlights the more pedestrian reality--international business and domestic first class is really about mitigating (significantly) the unpleasantness of getting to...
Part of the psychic lure reflects attaining what was once unattainable. Most people start flying in economy, and you think "how much nicer it must be up there." So when it becomes possible because of points or expense accounts there is initially a real novelty. Now that I fly all the time for business it highlights the more pedestrian reality--international business and domestic first class is really about mitigating (significantly) the unpleasantness of getting to your destination. It is not about something affirmatively pleasant that you would seek out for its own sake.
Meanwhile, it is easy to become a big baby so that it seems terrible when I find myself occasionally schlumping it in economy.
Bottom line: premium classes have RELATIVE appeal compared to economy but very little ABSOLUTE appeal judged on the merits.
That's true, to a point. In one sense, long-haul travel always has an unpleasant component - you have to sit in one place for hours on end, and then usually you are jetlagged by the end of it, and F/J is all about reducing that unpleasantness. But sometimes an hours-long flight is a blessing, in that you can get work done or take some time to enjoy a movie you wouldn't otherwise have watched. F/J...
That's true, to a point. In one sense, long-haul travel always has an unpleasant component - you have to sit in one place for hours on end, and then usually you are jetlagged by the end of it, and F/J is all about reducing that unpleasantness. But sometimes an hours-long flight is a blessing, in that you can get work done or take some time to enjoy a movie you wouldn't otherwise have watched. F/J enhances those positive aspects, as opposed to simply mitigating the negative aspects. Would I seek out a plane trip to get work done or enjoy a movie? Well, probably not (although I'm with Ben - I enjoy the whole theater and logistics execution of air travel, especially in premium cabins) - but if I have to get from A to B anyway, I might as well use the time beneficially.
And another way to look at it: if one has access to F/J tickets for leisure, one is more likely to choose a vacation destination that requires a long flight. So that actually makes a whole range of *destinations* have greater absolute appeal than they would if one were forced to get there in Y.
This a stupid column. I guess you have nothing else to write about so you are kicking the hornets nest to get people to respond.
I responded because the subject matter interests m. Hope that's OK with you.
Overpriced but not overrated.
My main issue is a comfortable seat. Retired and 71 I only fly for pleasure now and won't put up with being cramped and uncomfortable in coach for anything longer than about an hour flight. It's just not worth it to me, I can be uncomfortable at home for free. Domestic is first class seems about right. The perks of a comfortable seat, passable meal and attentive service make for an enjoyable but not over...
My main issue is a comfortable seat. Retired and 71 I only fly for pleasure now and won't put up with being cramped and uncomfortable in coach for anything longer than about an hour flight. It's just not worth it to me, I can be uncomfortable at home for free. Domestic is first class seems about right. The perks of a comfortable seat, passable meal and attentive service make for an enjoyable but not over the top experience that you can usually get at, for me, an affordable price. I usually fly Delta and their premium select option is perfect for oversees travel. Comfortable seats, decent service is all I need. The price a few years ago in the ~ $1,500 range for for Europe was a great deal in my view. Unfortunately it is now getting close to $3,000. First/business class oversees is nice but over the top and outrageously expensive. I can live without 6 wine choices pseudo gourmet meals and flat seat beds that simulate a coffin.
In addition to flying premium, I look forward to the airport experience: the ease of check-in and clearing security, and relaxing in the airline's premium lounge. It's even all the more enjoyable knowing I used points. Flying business class on international routes is definitely worth it.
I have always thought that the amount of praise given to a new product gets from certain avgeeks is over the top. Than there is the guy with the cringe on his face who hates pretty much every flight except for a certain few airlines. The amount of praise given to a meal sometimes makes me laugh. Also, they are not microwaving your dinner.
Ok but probably the guy is an average person with average salary.
I'm lucky that I can travel business for cheap. Would I pay for it from my money? No. But I also don't earn extraordinary money. People who do for them a business or first class is maybe peanuts like a general train ticket for you. It always depends how you look at it from whose perspective.
Also for the rich people. First class can be even 'economical' compared to private jet.
I don’t think FC/BC is over rated. Just over priced.
In addition to flying in business class, I look forward to the ease of check-in, clearing security and relaxing in the airline's premium lounge. Knowing that I booked with points makes it even more enjoyable. Flying premium that involves crossing oceans is worth it to me.
It’s all about having my own space. Playing seat mate roulette for a 4+ hour flight can truly ruin your day and the start of your vacation. Sure, the bed a huge advantage and the soft product is nice, but I’d do a coach seat for a daytime 8 hour flight if I was guaranteed no seat neighbors
Flown only FC/BC for years now. If I wanted to duplicate my home bed, I'd buy my own plane and outfit it. Seriously STUPID comparison.
We fly internationally except to get to our jump off point. I want to be able to sleep even if it's not my double pillow top bed. I want to have decent luggage storage. I want to have somewhat expedited check in. Don't really care about the food, I'm sleeping...
Flown only FC/BC for years now. If I wanted to duplicate my home bed, I'd buy my own plane and outfit it. Seriously STUPID comparison.
We fly internationally except to get to our jump off point. I want to be able to sleep even if it's not my double pillow top bed. I want to have decent luggage storage. I want to have somewhat expedited check in. Don't really care about the food, I'm sleeping most of the time.
AND the luggage allowance. As underwater photographers, we travel with a crap ton of luggage. The extra luggage travel allowance is worth it.
Our go to carriers are Emirates and Singapore Air. Egypt air international bites.
To the person who mentioned Indonesia airlines, we got nothing but excellent service from Garuda. Sadly, they've been driven pretty much into bankruptcy. Lion Air is miserable even in best class. Batik was surprisingly decent.
My last three flights to Europe in the last 13 months have all been business or first class. Although I'm a former Marine of medium height and build I don't fit in a US airline economy seat anymore.
The pre-flight experience is better and sometimes fantastic, I'm thinking of the British Airways London Heathrow departures lounge, United's Polaris lounge, and even Delta's lounge, where the shock of having great barbecue ribs along with my...
My last three flights to Europe in the last 13 months have all been business or first class. Although I'm a former Marine of medium height and build I don't fit in a US airline economy seat anymore.
The pre-flight experience is better and sometimes fantastic, I'm thinking of the British Airways London Heathrow departures lounge, United's Polaris lounge, and even Delta's lounge, where the shock of having great barbecue ribs along with my glass of champagne was enough to set our journey to Italy off right.
The flight experience is also better: you are definitely treated better by the staff. The food on board can be hit or miss, Delta One was in my opinion a huge miss all the way around when compared to United and British Airways. When traveling a total of 25 hours to get from Alaska to Europe in the winter, those sleeping coffins make all the difference.
On top of that like the author said if you can get them fairly easily with points why not?
I travel alot due to work, often Germany to Asia. To be able to sleep and adjust quickly to the destination timezones are essential for the next day meetings after arrival. Sleep in J-class is bettter than economy.
Always cracks me up the five foot females who complain about business or 1st class. I'm 6'3" and do not fit in the now standard 28" pitch. And I can't sleep: those lie-flat feel like small coffins.
Compared to coach no way it's overrated. Even if you get an aisle or window seat with significant legroom (321 ceos) you can pretty much be assured some morbidly obese passenger will end up in the middle seat with their personage spilling over onto you.
Most of my travel is for business, which limits me to economy or premium economy. But I've had quite a few chances to upgrade to business for free/nearly free. To me, the value of the premium cabin all comes down to comfort and space. I get to board in a shorter line - comfort. I can sit in a seat where nobody is going to bump into me, spill on me, or recline into me...
Most of my travel is for business, which limits me to economy or premium economy. But I've had quite a few chances to upgrade to business for free/nearly free. To me, the value of the premium cabin all comes down to comfort and space. I get to board in a shorter line - comfort. I can sit in a seat where nobody is going to bump into me, spill on me, or recline into me - comfort and space. All the rest of it is worthless. The food is better, but not enough that I'd pay more for it. And like someone else said, wine tastes bad at altitude no matter how good it is. I always hope the lie flat seat will let me sleep, but so far I've slept better in premium economy than I ever have in business.
Good on those whose companies purchase those insane fares to subsidize the rest of the seats for us. But I have a hard time letting go of points for business, let alone my own hard earned funds.
Depends what country you are flying in! Having tried about 25 Airlines, I can say AVOID any airline from Indonesia. Low quality groundstaff who are unhelpful and usually cant speak English. Domestic flights not punctual.
Quite worth it when travelling with a baby under 2, especially when using miles of a program that doesn’t charge (much) for babies.
Rationally, first and business class is never worth it if you have to pay for it using your hard earned cash. I much rather a nicer meals or a better hotel room.
Having said that travelling in first class long haul is indeed a special experience, it's something one might want to do once or twice in their lifetime. I did First from Frankfurt to Hong Kong on CX a few years back &...
Rationally, first and business class is never worth it if you have to pay for it using your hard earned cash. I much rather a nicer meals or a better hotel room.
Having said that travelling in first class long haul is indeed a special experience, it's something one might want to do once or twice in their lifetime. I did First from Frankfurt to Hong Kong on CX a few years back & it lived up to my every expectation! I got to say the onward connecting flight to Sydney on business felt very underwhelming in comparison!
For me I come at it from the opposite perspective by asking the question - would I want to take this trip if it means sitting my 6'3" 210lb self in a coach seat for 6-12 hours? In most instances the answer is no or NO or NOOOOO!!!!, I'd rather take a trip closer to home that won't require a week of stretching exercises to repair my spine. The fact that I can use points,...
For me I come at it from the opposite perspective by asking the question - would I want to take this trip if it means sitting my 6'3" 210lb self in a coach seat for 6-12 hours? In most instances the answer is no or NO or NOOOOO!!!!, I'd rather take a trip closer to home that won't require a week of stretching exercises to repair my spine. The fact that I can use points, miles, and cash (when the other two options don't make sense) to make the trip more comfortable is the magic of of this points and miles game.
Here is a different perspective. Its not how good business class is, but how awful (uncomfortable) it is in economy class.
I travel alot due to work, often Germany to Asia. To be able to sleep and adjust quickly to the destination timezones are essential for the next day meetings after arrival. Sleep in J-class is bettter than economy.
Yes, and it has gotten way worse in recent years with densification of seats (10 seats per row vs previously 9 in a 777, 28 inches seat pitch instead of 34 inches), worse catering, constant upsells, deteriorating airport experience.
The only economy still worth flying is Japan airlines’. The only one remaining with just 9 seats per row in a 777 and just 8 in a 787 as well as sufficient catering.
Premium Economy...
Yes, and it has gotten way worse in recent years with densification of seats (10 seats per row vs previously 9 in a 777, 28 inches seat pitch instead of 34 inches), worse catering, constant upsells, deteriorating airport experience.
The only economy still worth flying is Japan airlines’. The only one remaining with just 9 seats per row in a 777 and just 8 in a 787 as well as sufficient catering.
Premium Economy is something Ben has left out - that’s usually a good enough solution, but value often isn’t there as business only costs marginally more if you book smartly.
The price differential depends a lot on whether it is worth it; I find status to be worthwhile but I do not fly often enough in Y to earn AFKL Plat, I justify paying a bit extra not for the business class experience but the status points I earn. Now, I get three times as much status points for business, but I only could justify an extra 150 to 200 dollars for it. YUL to...
The price differential depends a lot on whether it is worth it; I find status to be worthwhile but I do not fly often enough in Y to earn AFKL Plat, I justify paying a bit extra not for the business class experience but the status points I earn. Now, I get three times as much status points for business, but I only could justify an extra 150 to 200 dollars for it. YUL to LGA is marginally more expensive in First. Schengen flights in business are sometimes only slightly more expensive that economy when you book only one week out.
I can't say because I hardly ever view influencer content on premium airline travel, but this seems like an issue of warped expectations, at least when it comes to business class. Of course flying in a premium cabin doesn't compare to being at home or eating in an actual restaurant. Even the smallest home is going to be more comfortable and even mediocre restaurants will taste better than 99% of airline food I've ever had....
I can't say because I hardly ever view influencer content on premium airline travel, but this seems like an issue of warped expectations, at least when it comes to business class. Of course flying in a premium cabin doesn't compare to being at home or eating in an actual restaurant. Even the smallest home is going to be more comfortable and even mediocre restaurants will taste better than 99% of airline food I've ever had. But at the end of the day, it is worlds better than flying in economy, especially for longer flights (and even moreso for redeyes).
If this post were specifically about international first class, I would tend to agree. Granted, I've only flown international first once (CX from HKG to JFK), and the flight was admittedly excellent, I don't think the gains are substantial enough to warrant the hype. To me, the number one advantage to premium cabin travel is to arrive rested, and first did not really do that any better than business (and yes, I've done the same route in business). Perhaps if you're a very tall or large person, you will get more rest in first class, but otherwise on that front I don't see much difference between the two. Caviar and champagne are nice, but I can just buy that on the ground for far less than the premium between the two classes cost.
Long routes, biz is worth it.
Domestic biz class, forget it. I'm 5'2, I don't need much leg room. LOL
Long haul biz class for me is first and foremost about the lie-flat seat. Then it's the ability to use the shorter check-in line. These are essential to us because we value time. To be able to rest more comfortably during the flight, we are not zombies at our destination and can hit the...
Long routes, biz is worth it.
Domestic biz class, forget it. I'm 5'2, I don't need much leg room. LOL
Long haul biz class for me is first and foremost about the lie-flat seat. Then it's the ability to use the shorter check-in line. These are essential to us because we value time. To be able to rest more comfortably during the flight, we are not zombies at our destination and can hit the ground running.
IMO, the older you are, the more value you find in biz class. I remember when I slept like a baby sitting in economy for most of my flight to Vietnam. Yeah..... can't do that anymore these days.
For most of us in this points and miles game, we already have Prechek, Clear, lounge access via cc perks so I'm essence, we already have the ground experience without having to flying biz.
I don't really care about food and entertainment system. Eating too much just makes me bloated for the rest of the flight. And I usually work for a few hours and sleep for a few hours. Or there's always a good book to read.
how is he an avgeek but doesn’t know turkish is a trash airline for j/f..
My last three flights to Europe in the last 13 months have all been business or first class. Although I'm a former Marine of medium height and build I don't fit in a US airline economy seat anymore.
The pre-flight experience is better and sometimes fantastic, I'm thinking of the British Airways London Heathrow departures lounge, United's Polaris lounge, and even Delta's lounge, where the shock of having great barbecue ribs along with my...
My last three flights to Europe in the last 13 months have all been business or first class. Although I'm a former Marine of medium height and build I don't fit in a US airline economy seat anymore.
The pre-flight experience is better and sometimes fantastic, I'm thinking of the British Airways London Heathrow departures lounge, United's Polaris lounge, and even Delta's lounge, where the shock of having great barbecue ribs along with my glass of champagne was enough to set our journey to Italy off right.
The flight experience is also better: you are definitely treated better by the staff. The food on board can be hit or miss, Delta One was in my opinion a huge miss all the way around when compared to United and British Airways. When traveling a total of 25 hours to get from Alaska to Europe in the winter, those sleeping coffins make all the difference.
On top of that like the author said if you can get them fairly easily with points why not?
To me it's essentially having enough space to properly sit down. I'm 6'7 with really long legs and relatively short upper body, so my legs correspond more to someone who is 7ft. In Economy, I simply can't sit down properly (I've already been offloaded on that ground) and even Business Class is often rather short for me, but at least it works.
The same logic could be applied to all forms of transportation. Is a car ride in a Mercedes drastically better than in a Kia? Of course it's better, but when you list the objective benefits, it starts to feel trivial.
Lie flat is where it’s at. Service, menu, amenities, that’s just gravy.
For me it depends on the flight. I live in DC and go to Chicago and NYC a lot. For short flights like that I find spending points or money for business/first class to be absolutely worthless. It's such a short flight, and the seats are basically the same you got 30 years ago, just with more leg room. I'm 6'4 (about 2 meters) so I do value leg room, which is why when going...
For me it depends on the flight. I live in DC and go to Chicago and NYC a lot. For short flights like that I find spending points or money for business/first class to be absolutely worthless. It's such a short flight, and the seats are basically the same you got 30 years ago, just with more leg room. I'm 6'4 (about 2 meters) so I do value leg room, which is why when going to NYC I prefer taking the Acela as it's cheaper, more comfortable, and when factoring in going to and from airports and all of that, it's basically a wash in regards to travel time. Now if I'm flying more than 5 hours, I will take a business class seat, or at bare minimum premium economy because of the leg room.
What I found interesting is your take on the titles of videos or blogs. I would be more interested in reading the example you gave about mediocre food, but good service. To me seeing that, it screams an honest review. When everyone says omg this first class is the best, do it! That's suspicious to me, especially if it's AA it United or a mediocre airline in general. So don't understand estimate a non flashy headline. I have a YouTube channel (not aviation) and I get routinely great view count's, but I don't make click bait titles or thumbnails, or say like and subscribe. Sometimes being simple is better in that regard.
First, generally, isn't worth it compared to business, simply because the difference between them is incremental not significant. Business is only really worth it if (a) it's an overnight flight, and (b) it's a flat bed as you get to your destination feeling way better than if you travel economy or premium economy. On daytime flights, even 6+ hours (NYC to Europe or AMS to JNB), I'll usually choose economy simply as the additional premium...
First, generally, isn't worth it compared to business, simply because the difference between them is incremental not significant. Business is only really worth it if (a) it's an overnight flight, and (b) it's a flat bed as you get to your destination feeling way better than if you travel economy or premium economy. On daytime flights, even 6+ hours (NYC to Europe or AMS to JNB), I'll usually choose economy simply as the additional premium to fly biz is not usually worth it (2x or more the price), and I'd prefer to use the miles/$ for the next overnight flight!
for it depends on the deal and if im flying alone or not. Let me explain: a great points deal is hard to pass up, especially when it is up front. Now, when I travel with my partner if we can't find a good deal we are perfectly happy in PE/Comfort. If the plane is a 2 seater on the window side in economy we are fine with that too. The difference for us is...
for it depends on the deal and if im flying alone or not. Let me explain: a great points deal is hard to pass up, especially when it is up front. Now, when I travel with my partner if we can't find a good deal we are perfectly happy in PE/Comfort. If the plane is a 2 seater on the window side in economy we are fine with that too. The difference for us is how comfortable we are and us being able to lean on each and just enjoy the start/end of our vacation. Its kind of like our little suite of two. Traveling alone I will almost always opt for F/J just for the comfort of being in a roomier seat and everything else that comes with it. I'm less comfortable being on my own in a row of 3 or 2.
It's not about glamour or opulence or caviar or telling the world "oh, look at us." It's about having busted my butt my whole life so that my wife and I can comfortably travel in retirement. It's about when a person hits 50 years old, one begins to recognize the body's limitations and appreciates incremental comforts. My old body says that Andy 11235 is spot on about those long-haul flights.
To me it is also an "it depends" with a slight leaning towards "if I am honest, it is", especially when comparing First to Business Class.
If I can book business class travel on points or a small surcharge to economy, then I really appreciate the extra goodies Business provides and take in all the "business class glamour" I can. Plus, long overnight flights in eco really crush me.
However! When I have...
To me it is also an "it depends" with a slight leaning towards "if I am honest, it is", especially when comparing First to Business Class.
If I can book business class travel on points or a small surcharge to economy, then I really appreciate the extra goodies Business provides and take in all the "business class glamour" I can. Plus, long overnight flights in eco really crush me.
However! When I have to pay typical business fares compared to typical economy fares then I think much harder, if I *really* need the benefits of business class.
Currently I am planning a couples trip to south east Asia and my main choices are paying 3500€+ per person for a connecting flight business, or about 1500€ per person for a connection involving 2 daytime flights and an overnight-stay at the terminal hotel at the connecting point. If the price difference is in that range, then I probably accept the more unpleasant experience of economy travel and spend the savings on better hotels at the destination.
For me, F/J travel is about comfort, not amazing food (it rarely is) or wine (it all sucks at 40,000 feet) or glamour (I couldn't care less whether anyone knows which cabin I'm in). So I couldn't care less about what influencers are pushing. Influencers are compensated in proportion to how amazing they can make an experience look. I discount what they have to say precisely because of that.
Also, just because influencers do things...
For me, F/J travel is about comfort, not amazing food (it rarely is) or wine (it all sucks at 40,000 feet) or glamour (I couldn't care less whether anyone knows which cabin I'm in). So I couldn't care less about what influencers are pushing. Influencers are compensated in proportion to how amazing they can make an experience look. I discount what they have to say precisely because of that.
Also, just because influencers do things like show up at the Spanish steps at sunrise with a full production crew doesn't mean that you can't also have similar experiences to what their pictures show. You just have to open yourself to serendipity and take your travels off the beaten path. I can't tell you how many truly amazing experiences my family and I have had on vacations, very few of them in the typical tourist spots. Just one example: staying in a tiny villa in the Tuscan countryside with a stunning view of a walled medieval village that I'd never heard of before, enjoying a glass of wine while the sun sets spectacularly over the village and the church bell rings over the valley. I'll remember these evenings of serenity, beauty and joy for the rest of my life, but they aren't on Instagram. Go find your own and forget the influencers.
For me the whole process starting with priority check-in, security, lounge acces boarding, the flight etc ist completely worth it.
Nothing beats arriving at your destination all relaxed (or hangover is some cases ;)) and starting your holiday or stay alert.
Yes, some reviews are abit exergerated; i recently flew QR First SYD-DOH on the A380 and onwards to Europe in J on the 787. After reading all your wonderful reviews about QR i...
For me the whole process starting with priority check-in, security, lounge acces boarding, the flight etc ist completely worth it.
Nothing beats arriving at your destination all relaxed (or hangover is some cases ;)) and starting your holiday or stay alert.
Yes, some reviews are abit exergerated; i recently flew QR First SYD-DOH on the A380 and onwards to Europe in J on the 787. After reading all your wonderful reviews about QR i had extremely high expectations but was rather disappointed. Now, it wasn't a bad exprerience and i there was lots of Krug on the A380 but i was left thinking "what is Ben on when he reviews QR"? Again, it just didn't live up to the expectations.
That said, i'd still use my avios to book QR again.
Although I enjoy riding in first/business, I'm much more interested in the hotel side of the game. Scoring an additional upgrade after applying an SUA to a Hyatt reservation and getting 4 nights in a Premium Suite, for example, is much more valuable to me than a few hours in a decent seat on the plane.
I was lucky enough to read and learn how to mass tons of points to redeem toward F rides. Nowadays, I am fine with J or PE ride. I think I am done with F rides since 2nd time or several times in same F cabin feel underwhelming (i guess i know what to expect, which make it less exciting). I am perfectly fine with flatbed or decent PE chair. Also, I no longer seeks out of way routings because I am getting damn old for that and prefer direct much as possible.
I totally agree with you. Having flown F multiple times transpacific and transatlantic, it's no big deal anymore to me, F is just an upgraded version of Business Class. J and PE are good enough for me.
Thank you for the thoughtful post. I’ve had the same thoughts at times as the referenced commenter, especially after a disappointing experience compared with what I’ve read on blogs (Turkish J was also that for me). But your argument for wonder is a convincing one.
I think the magical success of airlines like ryanair has been in the realization that people will suffer through just about anything for a few hours. However, at the 12 hour mark of a transpac with 2.5 more hours to go, the fact that you are in a "seat with more room" suddenly takes on substantially more value. I think this is where the disconnect lies. Blogs and social media provide endless pictures of amenity...
I think the magical success of airlines like ryanair has been in the realization that people will suffer through just about anything for a few hours. However, at the 12 hour mark of a transpac with 2.5 more hours to go, the fact that you are in a "seat with more room" suddenly takes on substantially more value. I think this is where the disconnect lies. Blogs and social media provide endless pictures of amenity kits, glassware, and appetizing food. This stuff is not why people who fly often want business class seats; rather, it's the reason why people who have already decided to fly business class chose singapore over american.
Beyond the comfort of the seat, the other often overlooked benefit of premium travel is through points/$$ you are essentially buying time. You are more likely to be refreshed on landing and on return, which means you have the ability to maximize your first travel day and not feel destroyed on the return. For those with limited time, adding 2 days to your trip is a big win. Not to mention the flight then becomes almost part of the trip.
Perfectly said. My whole point on why I will make the effort/financial commitment to fly international with a lay flat seat is it is the difference between feeling fine or severely jet lagged upon arrival.
Yeap!! When you have points to burn but no time to spare.
I agree with this point. On a recent trip I flew business TATL so I could start exploring on the day of arrival. On the way back I don't mind flying econ.
"haven’t taken a long haul flight in economy in many years"
Well maybe you should, it would ground you and give you a better perspective.
@ ArnoldB -- What part of my perspective do you disagree with, specifically?
That wasn't meant to be a quip at you. But I do think it would give you an additional perspective on how the majority of people travels and how airlines invest into their different products throughout. E.g. how Lufthansa not only has the same average service in Business Class for years, but has cut down service in Economy dramatically in the past few years (no 2nd meal choice, although they revised that recently; only a...
That wasn't meant to be a quip at you. But I do think it would give you an additional perspective on how the majority of people travels and how airlines invest into their different products throughout. E.g. how Lufthansa not only has the same average service in Business Class for years, but has cut down service in Economy dramatically in the past few years (no 2nd meal choice, although they revised that recently; only a sandwich as 2nd meal even on 13h flights; no more liquor, etc). Which would maybe change your perspective on LH overall for example.
Or on the other hand there are some at least semi-exciting Premium Economy products, like the new Swiss Premium Economy or beyond that products like the "Sleeper row" or upcoming products like economy sleeping pods.
For what its worth I also enjoy your american ULCC-Reviews (Spirit, Frontier etc) that you have every now and then, as that also offers a different perspective aside from the "usual". Same with the non-points "hotel porn" reviews. Although of course short ULCC flights are different from longhaul economy flights (though then again, some transatlantic flights are only 6-7h).
Tend to think that premium travel for me is the convenience and time you save on the ground, especially when we factor in the priority lanes and luggage etc.
When it works, the time saved is worth the extra premium
There can be no doubt - if I want beluga caviar I can go to a gourmet store or order it online. And I am more comfortable in my own bed than on any plane. And were time no object, I could fly economy 12 hours and recover for 24 hours at a modest hotel for far less than the cost of paid business.
The attraction to premium cabins perhaps relates to the fact that when I am on vacation, I somehow just want to do it "right" and experience premium products.
The space and ability to lie flat is totally worth it. Food and other soft stuff is fluff
Anyone who observes my behaviors would conclude that I agree (as I make efforts to be in business).
I get, however, that at a certain point, sucking up economy and padding one's schedule with 24 hours to recover may be the better play.
I feel very similar as the reader who asked the question. While I liked my two biz flights, I am a happy camper on a cheap Y fare. Now I do like priority ground service, but that’s also available with frequent flyer status. Since I do not have enough Cashflow yet to use points on every trip, I’ll stick to Y and use the miles for some F redemptions.