Will Citi Reinstate Expired ThankYou Points?

Will Citi Reinstate Expired ThankYou Points?

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A couple of days ago I shared how I had a lot of Citi ThankYou points expire. Citi closed one of my card accounts due to lack of activity, and Citi has a policy that points from closed accounts expire after 60 days, even if you still have other active Citi ThankYou accounts (this policy is significantly more punitive than that of Amex or Chase, by the way).

I reached out to Citi customer service to see if there was any way my points could be reinstated, given that this was an honest mistake and I continue to be a good Citi customer. I wanted to provide an update regarding that.

Citi “respectfully declines” my request to have points reinstated

I had contacted Citi by phone a few days ago to explain the situation, and was told that I’d hear back within five business days. Sure enough, I had a letter emailed to me from Citi, declining my request to have those points reinstated.

Here’s the content of the letter:

We certainly regret any confusion regarding the 78,959 ThankYou points that expired on June 17, 2021 on your above-referenced account, and we respectfully decline to reinstate them. Our records reflect your account was closed on April 11, 2021 due to no activity for an extended period. A letter dated April 12, 2021 was sent to you advising of the account closure, and explained that any ThankYou points earned through the date your account was closed would be transferred to your ThankYou member account. Furthermore, it was explained that points available for redemption could be redeemed for 60 days after the date the account was closed.

In addition, the ThankYou Rewards terms and conditions state, “If we close your card account due to inactivity, or otherwise convert your card account to a card that does not participate in the program, you must use those points within 60 days after closing or converting your account, or you will lose the points that you earned with the closed or converted account.”

Although we are not able to resolve this matter to your satisfaction, we’d like you to know that your inquiry is important to us and we appreciate the opportunity to respond.

My take on Citi’s response

I’m not trying to shift blame here — ultimately it’s my fault that the points expired. I knew Citi’s policy in the back of my mind, but in this particular case it slipped my mind. That’s probably because the card was closed on me (it wasn’t proactive on my part, so mentally I didn’t go through the same process I usually go through when closing a card), and Citi’s web interface and lack of warnings of points expiring doesn’t exactly help with remembering to redeem those points.

All that being said, this leaves somewhat of a bad taste in my mouth. Here’s the thing — obviously credit card companies are big, “faceless” corporations, but I’ve actually found that overall they offer great customer service in situations where a customer makes an honest mistake. Assuming you’re playing by the rules and are a long-term customer, I’ve found they almost always act in good faith, much more so than airlines.

For example, I’ve had a couple of times over the years where it slipped my mind to pay a bill by the due date, and in those cases the credit card companies were willing to waive the late fee and interest charges, recognizing that this was the exception rather than the norm for me.

It’s one thing if I closed out my Citi account and were no longer a customer, but I continue to have several Citi cards. Heck, between the Citi Prestige and Citi AAdvantage Executive Card alone, I pay almost $1,000 in annual fees on Citi cards. Beyond that, I also spend a lot on my Citi cards, in particular the Citi Double Cash. I think one always hopes that considerations like that are taken into account, but often that doesn’t happen.

Sure, Citi was technically enforcing the rule to a “T,” and that’s fine. But this also changes my perception of Citi’s customer service. The interaction certainly doesn’t make me feel very valued as a customer, but that’s fine, I promise I’ll get over it. 😉

This was my fault, and I learned an expensive mistake. I hope that others at least learn from my mistake. Ideally Citi would update its website to make it more obvious when points expire, and also warn members before their points expire. But perhaps the lack of clarity around that is viewed as a feature rather than a bug.

Bottom line

Citi ThankYou points expire 60 days after an account is closed, so be sure you don’t make the same mistake that I did, and actually redeem them or transfer them to a partner. Based on my experience it seems that Citi has no leniency when it comes to reinstating these points.

Ultimately that’s fair enough, in the sense that Citi is just enforcing rules. It’s definitely something to keep in mind, though…

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  1. Mark

    Wow that's a frustrating situation. Thanks for sharing your experience, Ben. A couple questions for you: Let's say you have 2 cards that earn ThankYou points: the Citi Rewards+ and Citi Premier. (1) If you cancel one of them (or change it to a non-ThankYou card), then only the points earned with that *one* card are subject to the 60-day expiration, correct? (2) If yes, is there a way to see how many points you've earned on each ThankYou card throughout the year?

    1. Art_Czar

      DP on my recent call into Citi's call center based in the Philippines, requesting additional 10k TY points to match the Premier card's in-branch 70k sign-up bonus. CS agent confirmed that they would add 10k and I should see it reflected in my account within 2 days. Checked my account a couple of days later and saw only 5k added.
      With Citi agents its hit or miss!

    2. Chris Parker

      @Lucky for what is worth, last year my wife's Citi card (she only had one but including AA cards) was closed due to inactivity. Same exact case as yours. Never had this issue with other banks and didn't realize the card was closed until I saw my award wallet balance drop. I called them up and they said they can't reinstate the points but if I reopened the card they would put in a request...

      @Lucky for what is worth, last year my wife's Citi card (she only had one but including AA cards) was closed due to inactivity. Same exact case as yours. Never had this issue with other banks and didn't realize the card was closed until I saw my award wallet balance drop. I called them up and they said they can't reinstate the points but if I reopened the card they would put in a request to get them reinstated. It was more than 30 days so it required a hard pull but I got them back! Now what I do is setup one of my small recurring monthly bills on autopay with my citi cards so I don't have to go through that again.

  2. Abey

    CPFB. Had great experience dealing with them

    1. Kyle

      On what grounds does he make a complaint? The policy is absurd, but it's their policy and I'm sure it's thoroughly documented in terms and the email he received. Don't you need some kind of transgression to file a CPFB complaint?

    2. JR

      Even if there are terms somewhere that provide for the forfeiture of points, Citi's failure to provide a heads-up could be construed as a deceptive trade practice, against which the CFPB regulates.

  3. Daniel

    Interesting. I have several premium Chase and Citi cards, and I have found across the board that I usually like dealing with Citi better.

    For example, citi clears my payments automatically, and frees up credit instantly.

    Also, once I called about a large, complex travel purchase, and the Citi pre manually entered the 3X points.

    Not fun to have points expire, but overall citi has been reasonable with me.

  4. JohnF

    I recently opened a Citi Checking and Savings account. I deposited enough to receive Gold status. In the process, I found Citi customer service to be much worse than any other financial institutions I've dealt with (and I've dealt with pretty much all the big ones). They required a lot more paperwork, phone calls, and they bumbled things all along the way. I just received a letter from them apologizing for all the mistakes. This...

    I recently opened a Citi Checking and Savings account. I deposited enough to receive Gold status. In the process, I found Citi customer service to be much worse than any other financial institutions I've dealt with (and I've dealt with pretty much all the big ones). They required a lot more paperwork, phone calls, and they bumbled things all along the way. I just received a letter from them apologizing for all the mistakes. This arrived 4-months after the fact. I like the Citi products, but their customer service is very sub-par. They have a long way to go to catch up with the other banks.

  5. Grogg

    You're being way too nice. Citi's decision to enforce the rule is not "fair enough," and you shouldn't "get over it." Just because the rule can be enforced doesn't mean that it *should* be enforced. Citi's decision is penny wise and pound foolish; there's no excuse for how Citi is treating you. Many companies sadly overlook that it is very hard to acquire to a customer's trust and very easy to lose that trust.

  6. Brodie

    I recently had a similar fail on Citi with a sign up bonus. Two agents told me I would receive the points, however I never did. I opened a complaint and was guaranteed a call back. That never came either. So I am closing my three accounts and moving on. Chase and Amex will get my spend going forward.

    1. Jr

      I'm sure Citi say farewell to customers who are only chasing bonuses.

    2. Brodie

      Interesting assumption. I have been a customer for over a decade.

  7. Endre

    “this leaves somewhat of a bad taste in my mouth” — stop acting like a juvenile. This is solely your fault.

  8. John

    @ Grogg — Presumably @lucky isn’t actually a profitable customer for Citi right? He always pays in full so no interest income but knows how to maximize points earnings and benefits, which are costly to provide. They’re probably losing money on his accounts, and he has a deposit relationship with Chase but not with Citi. Why should they give him something he’s not entitled to under the rules? If he closes all his accounts and...

    @ Grogg — Presumably @lucky isn’t actually a profitable customer for Citi right? He always pays in full so no interest income but knows how to maximize points earnings and benefits, which are costly to provide. They’re probably losing money on his accounts, and he has a deposit relationship with Chase but not with Citi. Why should they give him something he’s not entitled to under the rules? If he closes all his accounts and leaves, they’d probably be better off.

    They really want people who carry balances, or at least heavy transactors who stick with one card — not customers who pay in full and maximize points earnings with every purchase using a variety of different cards. They make no money off people like that.

    I’d note each issuer has its quirks. With AmEx if your payment is even just a day or two late you can forfeit all your points for a month. I have autopay so it’s never been an issue for me but I’m sure lots of customers lose points that way if it just slips their mind for a few days to pay the bill. @Lucky didn’t happen to make that mistake so he doesn’t care but many others have breakage of various kinds.

    To me these are just rules of the game — rules @lucky knows better than anyone and maximizes to his advantage in most cases.

    1. beachfan

      Not really, the most profitable people are high spenders, and I doubt they carry balances. The swipe fees on big spenders add up.

    2. JJH

      @beachfan — Big spenders are *not* terrifically profitable *if* they are maximizing rewards the way @Lucky does.

      First of all most people carry balances on credit cards. Only a minority of consumers pay in full every single month. Banks generally make their money on people who carry balances. AmEx used to be an exception since they had a higher margin on interchange but now they’ve changed their pricing to remain competitive and are making most...

      @beachfan — Big spenders are *not* terrifically profitable *if* they are maximizing rewards the way @Lucky does.

      First of all most people carry balances on credit cards. Only a minority of consumers pay in full every single month. Banks generally make their money on people who carry balances. AmEx used to be an exception since they had a higher margin on interchange but now they’ve changed their pricing to remain competitive and are making most of their money from balances as well.

      Even of the people who do pay in full most are not expert about maximizing rewards. They often put everything on one card that’s top of wallet, which means a lot of their spending is “unbonused.” Banks can roughly break even on a consumer like that if the consumer puts more than $30k a year on each of their cards — anything less and they’re generally losing money, because it costs money to issue physical cards, monitor cardholders’ credit, staff 24/7 customer service, etc. Even on customers spending over $30k on a single card they’re making only a relatively small margin on the interchange since they have to pay the cost of rewards.

      Lucky maximizes rewards — he’s always using the card that gives him bonuses, which are really “loss leaders,” intended to get someone to sign up for the cards but in the hopes they use it for unbonsued spending too. But lucky *only* uses whichever card gives him bonuses on a particular transaction. So the more he spends, the more the bank loses paying for rewards on his account. More spending does not equate to profitability for that kind of consumer.

      Lucky for the banks, most consumers are not like Ben. So they can still make money on average. But they can—and do—lose money on savvy customers who maximize rewards and never carry a balance.

    3. TravelinWilly

      "...the most profitable people are high spenders..."

      Nope.

      The most profitable customers of any card-issuing banks are indeed those who carry balances month-to-month. Swipe fees matter, but those who carry the balances (and pay the associated interest) are very high on the CVM score chain.

  9. beachfan

    Citi was the worst during the pandemic.

    Amex pulls out the stops to find alternative benefits.
    Chase made significant efforts as well.
    Citi charged me full freight for Citi Executive for the year the clubs were closed. This was after several years of very high spend (to earn EQMs). There solution was a discount on the fee in the next year, but I still don't have any business travel in 2021. They did...

    Citi was the worst during the pandemic.

    Amex pulls out the stops to find alternative benefits.
    Chase made significant efforts as well.
    Citi charged me full freight for Citi Executive for the year the clubs were closed. This was after several years of very high spend (to earn EQMs). There solution was a discount on the fee in the next year, but I still don't have any business travel in 2021. They did the same to me on the closing, but I got them to reopen it.

    Maybe you will switch to 4x Amex points on Gold for supermarkets, etc. rather than 5x TYP hostage points. I value TYP at the cash redemption value due to this.

    1. John

      At least Citi offered you something on the AA Executive Card, I was spending 40k+ and they wouldn’t give me anything towards the fee even though clubs were closed. I closed my account. Citi customer service has no real flexibility, it seems. I don’t like Citi anymore after closing my prestige and executive AA card. I don’t spend on them anymore.

  10. ECR

    Would like to know where you would have transferred them had you known they were about to expire (assuming you had no immediate redemption in mind).

    For me, Chase-->Hyatt would be no brainer but Amex/Citi is kindof a grey area, since I value several partners similarly for each issuer.

  11. GBOAC

    @Ben:
    Did Citi give you any warning (and if so how much) about inactivity on your card and that would close it some time shortly thereafter? If they failed to give you adequate notice, then I think you have a strong case against them.

    1. JJH

      They didn’t give him *advance* warning. There’s no rule or provision requiring advance notice of a decision to close a credit account. They just have to send notice promptly after they close it, which they did.

  12. James Camron

    Citi bank has one of the worst customer service I've ever seen. I hate calling them. And actually enjoy calling discover card.

    The day discover releases a card that's 2% cash back on everything and anything like the double cash card. I'm sure my Citi card would be closed due to inactivity as well.

  13. ginger_pickle

    didn't the original post say Citi didn't notify you of the expiring points?

    1. henare

      They didn't. They weren't required to.

  14. Isaac Pollak

    took Citi to small claims court to get 200,000 points back
    before court date they called me
    we made a deal- they send me a check for $2000 and closed my account

    1. Nate nate

      @Ben, can you get Issac to write a guest post about this? I want to learn more.

    2. Jay Castillo

      You may have grounds to take Citi to small claims but clearly Lucky didn't.

  15. Texastoast

    The rules are clearly stated. It's a good rule of thumb to use credit cards at least once every six months. Set up an automatic bill payment with cards that aren't utilized for every day expenditures and that will avoid this issue; unless there is a point expiration date.

  16. Ben

    Totally agree with you Lucky.

    And this leads to a very different perception of Citi than Chase or Amex, where gaming might get you in trouble but they're generally great to deal with otherwise.

    I was just recommending a new premium card to my father and suggested he stay away from Citi Prestige because ThankYou points are too tricky to manage - this is another example.

  17. Gilbert

    While I commiserate with your current Citi situation, may I suggest that you set up an automatic $1 (or larger) contribution to you favorite charity or political candidate using each of your countless credit cards that don’t usually make it into your spending rotation? This would avoid any of them being inadvertently closed for inactivity.

  18. DonP

    I have long had a motto:
    You can’t play the game if you don’t know the rules, tell me the rules and I’ll play your game.
    You admit that they sent you a letter telling you what the rules were. Your card had been canceled due to lack of use and the points would expire after 60 days. You didn’t do something with (AKA spend) those points within the 60 day and you’re blaming… CITI? Really???

  19. Joe1293

    This is why Ctiti
    They explain their rules
    We must follow the rules
    Also you can always reapply for
    Their signup bonus
    I wish Citi used Amex one lifetime restriction
    For their signup bonus

  20. Joe1293

    This is why Citi is the best
    They explain their rules
    We must follow the rules
    Also you can always reapply for
    Their signup bonus
    I wish Citi used Amex one lifetime restriction
    For their signup bonus

  21. AJV

    I had a similar failure to remember to use some 70k TY points when I converted a 2nd Premier card to a DC.

    I was told at conversion about the 60 day rule. I even put a reminder in my calendar but put the wrong date. When 65 days later I went to check my account to move the points I discovered they had been deducted.

    While knowing it was my fault I decided...

    I had a similar failure to remember to use some 70k TY points when I converted a 2nd Premier card to a DC.

    I was told at conversion about the 60 day rule. I even put a reminder in my calendar but put the wrong date. When 65 days later I went to check my account to move the points I discovered they had been deducted.

    While knowing it was my fault I decided to call Citi ready to plead my case. Much to my surprise the CS immediately said she thought she could recover them but it would take a while so could she call me back. About 15-20 minutes later she called back with the great news that my points were once again available.

    Honestly not sure how long I had to xfer/use them but i did so immediately.

    Overall I find Citi CS to be hit or miss (unlike Amex where its close to perfect for me) but this one time it worked out great.

  22. Lars Jensen

    I only see one way to go from here:

    Cancel all cards with City!

    /Lars

    1. Eskimo

      I only see one way to go from here:

      You need to write this 100 times "Citi is not City."

      /Eskimo

  23. T. Anton

    A point was mentioned about the lack of reminders for point expiration. Citi doesn't forget to keep sending their promotional info ad nauseam, i.e.:. "Don't forget about adding an authorized user".
    Other than this issue, Vito's customer service is outstanding.

  24. Anonymous I

    I actually just encountered the same exact case. First Citi just closed my account without my consent. They state they had sent a reminder, but I have never received the email, except "Your Account Has Been Closed". That was a bold move judging Ive been a long customer of the Prestige card.

    Now I just realised that my points has vanished. Last I call and verify with them, they state that only about 600 points...

    I actually just encountered the same exact case. First Citi just closed my account without my consent. They state they had sent a reminder, but I have never received the email, except "Your Account Has Been Closed". That was a bold move judging Ive been a long customer of the Prestige card.

    Now I just realised that my points has vanished. Last I call and verify with them, they state that only about 600 points will expire by end of June, where the remaining 90,000 points does not have any expiry date. So I am in absolute shock now. If they wouldnt return my points, this is absurd! I trust the point when they say not all the points will expire, reality has shown otherwise. I am extremely disappointed with Citi. Their only solution is please write a letter and mail it to a respective address. I guess I might have been in the wrong timeline where things cannot be done online, but can only be resolved by mailing physical letters. Any suggestion from anyone? Ive been robbed quite a lot of points unfortunately.

  25. GBOAC

    DonP mentions knowing the rules. Can someone tell me the rule about Citi cancelling cards for inactivity -- how many months of inactivity results in cancelation? Is it automatic or discretionary?

    1. Anonymous I

      I believe its 6 months or more without any activity.

  26. TProphet

    This is the sort of thing that would just have me respond by closing all of my accounts and walking away. On the other hand, most banks would be better off not doing business with me, given that I am an unprofitable customer...

  27. George Clingan

    Citi did reinstate my expired points, about 10,000. Keep pushing! This policy is bonkers.

    1. Anonymous I

      Nice! How did you manage to get them to reimburse you George? Ive been on the phone with them 3 days in a row, and I am just tired repeating my inquiry everytime. Everyone kept saying yes, you should have known under our T&C, did you read them? I am extremely crossed, the reason I am in this mess is because of what they have said. So they told me none of your points are...

      Nice! How did you manage to get them to reimburse you George? Ive been on the phone with them 3 days in a row, and I am just tired repeating my inquiry everytime. Everyone kept saying yes, you should have known under our T&C, did you read them? I am extremely crossed, the reason I am in this mess is because of what they have said. So they told me none of your points are expiring, the next thing when its gone, oh its your mistake then for not understanding the T&C. This is outrageous!

    2. Anonymous I

      I just spoke with a manager from thankyou basically he understands my problem. His result back to me was I am sorry, theres nothing I can do, we just forfeit your points and I dont see anything else I can do. Seriously?? They literally just robbed me 70,000 points, my annual fee and without any sorry or anything.

  28. Genise

    Perhaps my information is helpful to someone:
    I had a complex International itinerary in 2020 - booked with 190,000 TY points - and the at that time still existing 25% discount of points - that were transferred into my account from another card/account that was subsequently closed. The transferred-in points had an expiration of 90 days, according to the rules.
    All flights were cancelled by the airlines of course. But after many attempts...

    Perhaps my information is helpful to someone:
    I had a complex International itinerary in 2020 - booked with 190,000 TY points - and the at that time still existing 25% discount of points - that were transferred into my account from another card/account that was subsequently closed. The transferred-in points had an expiration of 90 days, according to the rules.
    All flights were cancelled by the airlines of course. But after many attempts with their horrible Connexions Loyalty Travel Center, the points were never refunded.
    Until I filed complaints with the 3 agencies I could find - the CFPB, DOT and BBB to complain about Connexions and their refusal of a refund.
    It only took a week before I received an answer from Connexions Loyalty Travel Center through the CFPB with the excuse that the points were "expired" - which in theory was correct - but would be reinstated.
    I received a FULL refund of all the points without any restrictions and was able to use those 190,000 points again for a new itinerary, just before the 25% discount-of-points ended on April 9th, 2021.

  29. Jay

    @Lucky. The entitlement is so thick I can cut it with a knife. You said you're not shifting blame but that's exactly what you're telling us. I'm not depending Citi but you sound like an spoiled child that is throwing a tantrum because his mommy didn't buy him a new toy, and can't understand why not because they bought him toy before.

  30. Adam

    Ben, you're being too kind. Citi's crappy policy in this context is unique amongst major card issuers, their notice is insufficient, and their refusal to be flexible is pathetic.

    To those calling you entitled... I'm pretty stunned at that take. I've seen entitledness amongst travel bloggers and commenters to be sure ("waaaaah, I was intentionally gaming the system with 4200 $1 charges, and they clawed back the points!!!"), but Ben's complaint is about as valid...

    Ben, you're being too kind. Citi's crappy policy in this context is unique amongst major card issuers, their notice is insufficient, and their refusal to be flexible is pathetic.

    To those calling you entitled... I'm pretty stunned at that take. I've seen entitledness amongst travel bloggers and commenters to be sure ("waaaaah, I was intentionally gaming the system with 4200 $1 charges, and they clawed back the points!!!"), but Ben's complaint is about as valid as I've seen in terms of decrying obnoxious actions by a card issuer.

    As I noted in the related post, I'm in seemingly the same boat (though still waiting to hear back from my followup appeal). Though in my case, I highlighted to Citi that one of their reps explicitly (and, obviously mistakenly) had promised that there were no near-term point expirations coming up, so... we'll see if that changes Citi's take.

    Regardless, I've already shifted all of my personal and business spend to Chase and Amex cards. Can't trust Citi anymore, either to give correct info or to do the right thing (without intensive nagging, at least).

  31. Larry

    @John, Citi and other card issuers still make plenty of money from cardholders like Lucky and many of us who pay their bills on time. Annual fees and merchant processing fees add up nicely. Customer service from banks and credit card companies can and does relate to loyalty, and that goes both ways.

  32. marc

    @john-you obviously have no idea how credit cards work. In addition to the annual fee, they get a percentage of every transaction on that card. They do not lose money with customers. The best customers are those who spend large amounts of money and pay in full every month, thereby allowing them to spend more on a monthly basis. The points they give are a percentage of their profit. The profit is still there or...

    @john-you obviously have no idea how credit cards work. In addition to the annual fee, they get a percentage of every transaction on that card. They do not lose money with customers. The best customers are those who spend large amounts of money and pay in full every month, thereby allowing them to spend more on a monthly basis. The points they give are a percentage of their profit. The profit is still there or they would not give the points. The only time they are temporarily in the hole, is when they give out a large initial bonus on the card. That is why so many banks are doing whatever possible to stop churning, and Amex only gives a bonus once per lifetime per card.

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Grogg

You're being way too nice. Citi's decision to enforce the rule is not "fair enough," and you shouldn't "get over it." Just because the rule can be enforced doesn't mean that it *should* be enforced. Citi's decision is penny wise and pound foolish; there's no excuse for how Citi is treating you. Many companies sadly overlook that it is very hard to acquire to a customer's trust and very easy to lose that trust.

John

@ Grogg — Presumably @lucky isn’t actually a profitable customer for Citi right? He always pays in full so no interest income but knows how to maximize points earnings and benefits, which are costly to provide. They’re probably losing money on his accounts, and he has a deposit relationship with Chase but not with Citi. Why should they give him something he’s not entitled to under the rules? If he closes all his accounts and leaves, they’d probably be better off. They really want people who carry balances, or at least heavy transactors who stick with one card — not customers who pay in full and maximize points earnings with every purchase using a variety of different cards. They make no money off people like that. I’d note each issuer has its quirks. With AmEx if your payment is even just a day or two late you can forfeit all your points for a month. I have autopay so it’s never been an issue for me but I’m sure lots of customers lose points that way if it just slips their mind for a few days to pay the bill. @Lucky didn’t happen to make that mistake so he doesn’t care but many others have breakage of various kinds. To me these are just rules of the game — rules @lucky knows better than anyone and maximizes to his advantage in most cases.

anon

that's an entitled mentality

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