I recognize that often marketing terms mean very little, and perhaps even trying to analyze them is a waste of time. However, that won’t stop me from trying.
Continue reading: What Is A Premium Airline? Are Airline Executives Just Making Stuff Up?
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
premium means having the highest RASM/CASM. I only book the most profitable airline I can find on any given route. no exceptions
The facts are quite simple: When comparing any U.S. airline by World Airline Standards, NO U.S. airline can truly call itself a “Premium” airline.
One only has to read a selection of Ben’s recent reviews for confirmation. Further confirmation can be obtained by consulting any of the World Rankings chronicles.
Their reference group isn't Singapore Airlines or even Aeroméxico. They're premium compared to the US low cost airlines and they theoretically aspire to be more premium than their full service domestic competition.
"Premium" is a functionally meaningless term from a B2C perspective, much like "curated", "luxury", and "elevated"
great discussion.
in terms of "premium" the only part that US airlines are chasing is premium revenue and profits. and as much as anyone wants to believe differently, it is Delta that has done that better than any other airline not just in the US but around the world. DL manages to get people to pay more for its product regardless of whether people think they deliver or not. AA and UA want exactly what DL has managed to achieve.
as for your comparisons in onboard service by mileage, there are a handful of countries that have domestic flights that are 2000 miles long or more - and yet that is common in the US and forms a huge part of the US air transportation system. Comparing a 2000 mile domestic flight to a 2000 mile international flight is part of why the comparison is meaningless.
also, I don't know of an international carrier that has a domestic beverage service that is as extensive as the big 3 US airlines offer including the opportunity to buy beer, wine and spirits/cocktails even on domestic flights - and included for some passengers even in coach.
US airlines are very efficient and work well considering the volume; no other country comes close to handling similar volumes as smoothly.
Unlike in many parts of the world, most if not all US airline flights are from jet bridges. I love to see planes but get so sick of climbing up and down stairs and having a half dozens steps just to get from the gate area to my seat on a plane. E. Asian airlines get it w/ US airlines but much of the world does not.
and service culture in the US is just different. Many US airline employees are pleasant and that is all I expect as an American but the expectations for service culture - which often is perceived as servitude in many parts of the world - is just not a part of US or European culture.
"Are Airline Executives Just Making Stuff Up?"
Good god man, have you been asleep the past 20 years? It's called "marketing" - what we all used to call "complete bullshit". We live in the Age of Lies, brother, in case you haven't noticed...our society is drowning in a sea of disinformation, misinformation, market-speak, spin, outright lies, and complete nonsense. It's as pervasive as the air we breathe, yet far too many willing participants either do not or can not recognize how it is everywhere, even when they're doing it themselves (a bit ironic, for a professional blogger). Yes, everybody - including airline execs - just make stuff up and speak it as easily as taking a breath, every moment of every single day.
Lies, lies, lies, all around, constantly and everywhere. It's the norm. What could possibly go wrong in a world like that?
AA, UA, DL, AS and JetBlue all have aspects of Premium but that is limited. Most people fly in coach. Back in the early jet days coach was premium but no more.
Your domestic flight length comparison doesn't excuse middling-to-poor hard and soft products on US majors.
I've done the GVA to ZRH route on Swiss multiple times and their domestic beverage service was far superior to the big 3 US airlines.
I'm glad US airlines are efficient - but we're talking about premium-ness, not efficiency.
The jet bridge bit is fine but not directly applicable.
Also, implying that service culture is not great in the US, so by extension good service should not be expected on US airlines is so very, very sad.
What rankings to you refer to (Skytrax doesn't count, as it's patently non credible)?
I'm truly curious to know, like, are you considering Condé Nast, other travel publications, and the like? We all know airline rankings are subjective (and that US airlines are in a separate, sad league of their own compared to many of the international carriers), but I'm curious to know you use use for rankings.
Do you mean you only book Emirates as it is the world’s most profitable airline or do you only book the most profitable airline on that specific route of yours?
Air Canada has free beer and wine, plus other alcoholic beverages for purchase, on domestic and north American flights. Porter started it though.
Bastain is more interested in hanging out with Co-eds at Coachella. He thinks hes Singapore Airlines when in reality he is just a glorified Spirit
premium/ˈprēmēəm/ something offered above standard value, whether that means higher quality, an extra fee, or a financial cost.
If you don't think a lie-flat seats, Starlink, new release movies, music, video games, a choice of meals and drinks, humidification while flying the safest airlines in history is premium I think your confusing 'world class' or 'impeccable service' with 'premium'.
Tim Dunn makes several good points to which I would add US airlines give passengers a variety of offerings and do a better job of matching them to what people are willing to pay than ever before. What you and many others on these sites seem to want is to regularly get more than you are paying for while always looking for an angle. It also seems to me many spend inordinate amounts of time, our most precious gift, on finding a 'deal'. Pretty sad actually.
All Due Respect, one reads your response to the Walter Mitty Dunn post and gets the distinction impression that what you would really like to say (but are too polite to actually say it) is “What a typical load of nonsense Walter”.
Walter once again only succeeds in demonstrating his total ignorance of anything but his beloved Big3 and their antics. He has proven time and time again that his post are only of use for one thing …. adding clicks to Ben’s count.
Walter Mitty Dunn is a most infamous example of a waffling politician who spouts a lot but says absolutely nothing of any real substance, yes?
A premium airline is a publicly traded airline that wants a higher multiple than airlines normally get in the public markets.
Similarly, an airline that claims it's a "lifestyle brand" is also trying to get a higher multiple for their stock price.
Yes Tim. Service culture in the U.S. is all about how much you tip and for U.S. airlines it is all about we are only primarily here for your safety so do not expect them to provide any service other than meal times and do not even think about touching the call button or they are going to get you deplaned all in the name of safety.
U.S. airlines’ employees work efficiently considering the volume? Once again that is because they generally do not go above what they are contractually obligated to do and now certain U.S. airlines will stop service even sooner at 18,000 feet all because of safety but it is because of their laziness. If non-U.S. airlines cabin crew can still get the plane ready on time at 10,000 feet then it shouldn’t be a problem for the U.S. airlines cabin crew.
TD, I can say that even on domestic routes in China and Japan they offer better service than the US3 and you do not need to buy food and drinks onboard as those are included in your tickets and you know lounge access on domestic routes are also included in your premium cabin tickets as well as with your airline status. Also, putting aside domestic routes Asian airlines on their intra-Asia flights when compared to comparable length of flights with the U.S. is no contest at all. You can get a hot meal with beverage service even on routes that are 80-90 minutes or even less and at the bare minimum a beverage service. Also, unlike U.S. carriers especially at American Airlines PDB is a given with the Asian airlines and not a hit or miss.
@ rebel -- "...while flying the safest airlines in history." I'm curious, how do you arrive at United being the safest airline in history? I'm not denying that they're safe, but how are they safer than competitors?
Willy one is curious, why do you dismiss the likes of SkyTrax, CNT and your unnamed “Other travel publications” by stating “SkyTrax doesn’t count, as it is patently non credible”.
Please indicate what lies behind your illogical statement?
“Premium” is simply an advertising buzzword.
There are only two types of Airline, World Class and Cattle Class. No U.S. Airline can compete against the World Class Airlines. Anyone who believes that any U.S. Airline is World Class is only fooling themselves …. much like our very good friend Walter Mitty Dunn.
What does the international vs domestic distinction have to do with service levels? Is that a stealth dig at DL because they don't treat Caribbean islands as international destinations? Speaking of the Caribbean, have you ever taken a domestic flight between continental Europe and PTP, FDF, AUA, BDA, CAY etc? Was the service any less comprehensive than what's on offer on an international flight between e.g. France and Germany?
A premium airline is just an airline that says that are.
With all the glazing you and other sites have done of UA, you have actual people thinking UA has made some magical great leap forward, when it's still an incredibly average airline from a global aviation perspective. And incredibly below average when it comes to food.
All this talk of UA "improving" and you have still dog chow for Polaris meals, overcrowded Polaris lounges at SFO, some of the worst FAs for service, a continually devaluing FF program, and a "new" business class seat that other airlines have had for years.
Surely there is an analogy to the LCC model? Premium and ultra premium and the US doesn’t have ultra premium?
I am referring to the airline industry in general that goes years without fatalities compared to decades ago or to private jets (Ultra-premium) that aren't as safe.
If patronizing and promoting airlines from countries that benefit from the Kafala system or benevolent dictatorship's protections doesn't give you pause then at least acknowledge your lack of concern for human and workers' rights. Personally, I wouldn't consider flying on any of those types of airlines, and I don't get off on getting my ass kissed by people working under those conditions.
All I can say is that every full-service airline in the world feels the same in economy class and anyone who doesn't think so is kidding themselves
@ Tim Dunn -- We're waiting to learn which EWR-LAX frequencies UA operates with 737-900ERs, please!! These are the important details!
First, quite funny. Second, fair enough, AeroB13a. Bit of a quixotic self-own on my part to engage in repeated attempts at good faith discussion with individuals who are not willing to drop the blinders.
Totally disagree. PTVs make a meaningful difference on a long flight because coach doesn't have much room so not having to take out an iPad or phone is a bonus.
As such I tend to avoid American on transcon and prefer Delta
The simple answer to this is that a premium airline is one that commands higher yields than its competitors for essentially the same product offering.
The differentiation (brand premium) comes through a combination of hard and soft product. The soft product includes such attributes as schedule, loyalty program, etc.. in addition to the actual service provided.
The product being sold is transportation from A to B. If one airline can charge 10% more than the other, that is the premium airline. Meals and wifi and everything else is just one component of that.
As much as people are dumping on US airlines, I'd rank Delta as well above (say) Lufthansa in coach. If I'm flying BWI-ATL I get free seat selection, PTVs, powerport, free beverage, some biscoff. Do you get anything free in LH coach?
Forgot about that and agree. It's crazy how AA found a way to lower the perception of their economy class when they all suck
Airlines that fly a sufficient number of long haul routes tend to be more "premium"; Airlines that mostly fly domestic routes tend to be "less premium".
It reminds one of the old adage that truly smart people don’t need to tell you they’re smart. Confident people don’t need to speak unless they have something unique to say. But the airline trying to tell you “we’re premium” is likely anything but.
United and Delta, to be sure, are “full-service airlines”. But the quality of that service is mid even on a good day.
you are exactly right and I have said this for years.
For far too many, this definition means acknowledging that DL has achieved what no other airline in the US or the world can do; the most revenue even though several other airlines fly more ASMs.
Delta has simply figured out a better revenue model than any other airline in the world.
The only thing I'd disagree with is that higher profits, or even just getting more people to pay for a flight or service, are what makes an airline a premium one.
That makes for a premium investment, if I want to buy airline stocks. It doesn't guarantee a premium experience by any means, when I buy an airline ticket.
Nope. That makes your sample airline a premium investment, and worthy of a stock purchase.
It, in no way, means the experience on the plane itself, or the flight offerings, will be "premium" - and worthy of a ticket purchase.
Given a choice between two airlines, and flying the same class, and paying with your own money, which one of the two airlines would you choose. That airline is more premium than the other. Carry on this exercise until all possible combinations of airlines have been compared. The top certain percentage, an arbitrary number, would be considered Premium. There may be better ways to do this comparison, but the criterion of same cabin class and paying with your own money and actually flying the route tend to focus the mind.
Marketing folks are high on the list of people whose jobs will by and large be replaced by AI.
I live in Dallas and I am amazed that some of my friends who work in Headquarters always brag about new stuff going on at AA and have never been on another airline like Qatar, Emirates and Singapore to even know what they are like. They get brainwashed at Coporate. It seems like AA idea of luxury is "not SPIRIT".
This is true! It's true that "Alphas" don't have to talk about how "alpha" they are, because it's immediately apparent to everyone who encounters them.
False. There is humane coach out there like NH and EK.
And then there is godawful coach like AC or BA
Look at BA ro LH. Are they premium over Ryanair? Only in price.
Legroom on BA (even in business) is the same as Ryanair. Seat selection, cheaper on Ryanair, especially exit rows.
Even if you bought all the bells and whistles with Ryanair, you end up paying less than a "premium" airline, for a better or at least same product.
Yet people are delusional that BA is somehow premium.
Now that is one very serious joke JP …. I am laughing at you not your post …. 🙂
Aside from the fact that yes, airline execs are making stuff up (duh!), I think products should be considered within a given service band, so to speak. While Marriott is rather meh for various reasons, comparing a Courtyard vs a Rosewood feels like a straw man comparison.
There is no such thing any longer of a USA based premium airline…..none. End of story.
Pan Am, TWA, Braniff, Continental, etc. are gone. Plain and simple the US industry is simply an air bus regardless of cabin or price. If you want service you fly private on domestic or SQ & Emirates overseas. Avoid USA based carriers at all costs especially American Airlines.
There is no such thing any longer of a USA based premium airline…..none. End of story.
Pan Am, TWA, Braniff, Continental, etc. are gone. Plain and simple the US industry is simply an air bus regardless of cabin or price. If you want service you fly private on domestic or SQ & Emirates overseas. Avoid USA based carriers at all costs especially American Airlines.
@Tim
If you strip credit card and points revenue out of the picture, and just look at what people pay for flying, how does the US3 and particularly Delta compare to their overseas piers? Generating revenue from someone using their Delta credit card at Cheesecake Factory says little about what people are willing to pay for the inflight product.
I'll grant the US3 that they are world leaders in credit cards and mileage based revenue. And for some people that is a very premium option. But let's keep the buckets separately.
With your definition, Ryanair is the top premium airline and Delta is a wannabe.
good point actually.
No free seat selection in premium economy on Eva. And no free seats on Lufthansa - even if bought through UA. Both Skytrax 5 -star.
Here I blame Apple but not entirely. Companies have spent the last 2 decades preying on consumer stupidity with the asinine saying "you get what you paid for" to loosely not have to do any research and assume if it's MO expensive it's MO better. Dyson did it next bwith their vacuum cleaners which are also covered in cheap parts like iphones. So now instead of actually use expensive quality parts just market things to death.
Meanwhile Timmy D is the most beta one around (despite wanting to be an alpha). He just gets mogged daily.
@LarrySevers Haha, so true but TD will tell you DL is the most premium. But we know the only thing premium is their premium pricing of the award tickets. Lol.
@JPlat So, Frontier and Breeze are premium and they are comparable to Emirates??
You hamsters have been duped. Maybe one lounge is better than another. Maybe one caterer outshines another. Maybe one airline’s FAs are subjectively mildly friendlier. If you have super-status, perhaps you get a little lovin’ during irrops. But c’mon … if you’re in Economy, you’re in Economy. All three legacies are so-so bordering on garbage. AS and B6 are no better. WN aspires to be as bad as the rest of them.
My wife and I fly internationally once or twice a year (retired with enough $$$); sometimes premium economy but usually J. Except to Mexico and Caribbean, we always fly an international carrier. We have never been disappointed.
In my opinion, there are two definitions of the word "premium" in the airline industry: one used by the U.S. carriers and another used by the ME3 and Asian carriers. Unfortunately, the difference between the two is considerable.
So then, according to TD and Sean M, DL is more premium than the likes of SQ and ANA because of its higher yields/revenues. So, if premium is only measured by that and not by passenger experience then TD and Sean can have a good time together flying economy on Delta rather than on SQ and ANA because you know DL is so much more ‘premium’ than those two airlines. Haha.
You correctly name Kafala system and absolute monarchy (not dictatorship) but you are clueless how it actually works. You also sound like a privileged class member who claimed to care about human and workers' rights, but are oblivious to the culture in which you are sheltered while enjoying the upper middle class status. Up until within last year, all bloggers and readers blamed labor costs when a corporation faced a financial hardship without understanding executive's compensation package, the priorities of Board of Directors members (not those of the company), and investors' interests.
In GCC employment standard practice, the employer will sponsor an employee to work and live in the country. If the employer is the national government or a foreign company, the employee will face less abuse and exploitation. If the employee works for a private family or local business, the chance of exploitation and abuse will rise. His passport can be confiscated and he will work around the clock without receiving a full compensation for his work, if it is a domestic employment. In Kuwait, I lived in a 2500 sq. feet three bedroom three bath flat for 60 Dinars monthly rent. Fully furnished and inclusive. The a/c was big and powerful enough to cool the flat in less than three minutes while the outside temperature was above 40-45 degree Celsius. Complimentary medical & dental coverage plus prescription and an annual r/t airfare to home country in the summer were provided. No out of pocket expenses and co-pay were required. Of course, no income tax. All benefits were built into the monthly salary. No restriction on movement. Employer must issue entry and exit visas to employee when coming into and leaving the country. No American government and business will ever offer such employment package. Wean yourself from corporate news media and immerse yourself into non-profit independent news media to truly understand the state affairs of this country. What you fondly remember and deceive yourself into believing in democracy, civil and workers' rights in this country barely exist anymore. When I arrived in Kuwait three decades ago, I experienced cultural shock when I witnessed how people treated each other. Today, such experience pales compare to what I read and watch what is happening around the country.
Both the US big three airlines and ME big three airlines receive government handouts and corporate welfare. The difference is only the American executives cry wolf about preferential treatment --such exceptional hypocrites.
premium is part economic and part experiential.
DL just happens to have figured out how to generate more revenue and more profit.
knowing where to run your business is as important as how to do it
yes, RYAAY has better profits and market cap but it doesn't get it through higher fares but rather low costs and efficiency
What does flying on an airline have to do with it being premium?
The literal definition of premium is the ability to command an extra fee. If you are able to command that relative to your competitors, you are by definition premium.
You can have the world's most awful passenger experience but still command higher fares than your competitors. That would make you a crappy airline to fly with, but still a premium airline as per the definition of the term.
All the benefits you mention are required to get pilots to fly for those airlines. You failed to mention what happens when pilots, F/As and other employees offend their overseers or want to quit especially before their contracts are up. I know a pilot whose passport was taken from them until they complied with all their airline's directives. You also forgot to mention the lack of adequate crew rest and other safety programs. And most importantly you conveniently didn't mention the indentured servitude of foreign workers on which whole societies are built. Sorry, I wouldn't even consider patronizing such organizations.
Sean M, but premium can also mean of a higher than usual quality and I would think Emirates can deliver on that premium definition more consistently than Delta. Nothing against DL but I think I would get more value for a premium experience with Emirates rather than with Delta.
This is where we can kinda agree Tim. I would say that DL is a premium airline when compared to other U.S. airlines. Also, like I said before Emirates then would be the most premium airline in the world as it generates the most profit globally.
Tim, I think Canada and Australia certainly have 2,000 mile domestic flights, and in Canada, you have two airlines offering robust and free drinks on those routes. Qantas also has a pretty robust offering on domestic flights, and elevated service ex-PER. Aeroflot offers proper champagne domestically.
Of course DL, AA, and UA operate many 2,000 mile international flights, and their service offering is identical to what they'd offer in domestic.
Tim still hasn't figured out that good financials makes for a good stock to buy - not a good airline ticket to buy.