JAL 787 Business Class: Subpar Seat, Good Food & Service

We flew this exact same route a few weeks ago, and had the same thoughts. It’s too narrow and there’s no good armrest. Definitely going to try to avoid this product in the future.

One thing I don't like about JAL is the inconsistency of seat types across the fleet. On the 787 alone, you have 3 types of seats which are the old angled recliner, APEX suites, and reverse herringbone which I don't understand.

Halibut for breakfast?
No thanks

JAL Sky Suite III use Zodiac Aires - a reverse herringbone seat that is configured much dense than other seats of the same configuration in the market such as Zodiac Cirrus (The one used by Cathay Pacific and AA 777-300) and B/E Aerospace Super Diamond(Seat on AA 777-200 & 787, Air Canada).
Zodiac Aires are noticebly more compact as they take space from other passengers like staggered seats - which might explain the narrowness of the seat.

"While Japan Airlines’ western meals are only okay"

Have to disagree there, their western meals are better than what you'll find on many western airlines.

I suppose you received an Amenity kit. Why did you not mention it?

@ José Roberto -- This is just a preview about the things that stood out to me the most about the experience. I go into a lot more detail with the full trip reports, so you can expect details on the amenity kit there. 🙂

@ KG3036_SS -- Yep, though ironically the airline still has such an inefficient configuration. The airline only has 26-28 business class seats between the first and second set of doors on the 777 and 787, while other airlines get up to 30 superior reverse herringbone seats in that space.

I took the same seat for 13h HND-HEL flight (avoiding Russia) and I cannot agree with you more. Quite uncomfortable and at least JAL should provide more substantial pillow.

This seat is designed to provide high-density full-flat seat for medium-haul routes (Japan-SEAsia and Hawaii) and non-premium routes such as long-haul from KIX and NGO but seems to be deployed to more long-haul routes.

Lufthansa’s business class seat (your favorite, and mine) is certainly way better than this.

I promise you the Japanese entertainment selection isn’t much better. As much as I love JAL, I will normally have run out of things I want to watch in Japanese and English on an Australia to Europe run. You often get a better selection of Japanese movies on Cathay and JAL seems to think one or two episodes of a show is enough. (Seriously there are nearly 6000 episodes of Shoten and they only ever put one on the system)

What is the easiest way to know which seat type you are likely to get? I just booked a trip to HKG and now I am nervous. Part id on the 767 so no issue. Other legs are on the 787-800 I believe. Thoughts?

However , not KIX to LOS , no ? LH would route from HND to FRA to LAX , yes ?

The food looks amazing!

I prefer this seat to the Apex suite hands down. The Apex has virtually nowhere to put your stuff but this Skysuite III seat has good space and it easy to get in and out of. Don’t let one bad night’s sleep dictate your choice of bed or airplane seat.

1. While I like the Apex suite better, the Skysuite III is OK for shorter flights (I flew it NRT-SIN). It also has better storage than the window Apex suites which have very little.

2. While JAL’s western meals are usually better than say AA’s int’l J meals, JAL’s western meals are still not nearly as good as its Japanese meals.

3. I’ve flown 4 r/t’s on JAL (10 legs total) and had depleted the entertainment choices after 3 legs. I started loading my iPad up multiple seasons of shows. And reading books. Gasp.

We flew BLK-HND on a JL 777 last year and agree with you completely. It was crowded and lacked storage space.

At this point in our travels we've flown in quite a few flatbeds, both *A and OW products, and this one stands out as the least comfortable within recent memory.

Well, this is disappointing since we are flying same route next year. I was so happy to get the Osaka to LAX flight to avoid going back to Tokyo to catch a flight home, but now I am wondering if that was a mistake. Oh well, still better than economy!

@Ben

There is basically no 777 left with the Skysuite III seats (reverse herringbone). There were all supposed to have been retired, but a few of them continued to fly domestic after the PW engine domestic 777 were grounded. They should have been retired now that all but one A350-900 are delivered and in operation. All of the ones operating domestic were retired, supposedly. But one has been popping up on HND NGO.
So there is 1 left in the fleet, that is supposed to have been retired, but does pop up on short domestic flights.

Comparing to Brussell Air?

I’ve heard many complaints about these seats but you’re the first person to actually offer some detail about why they’re uncomfortable so thank you Lucky.

I’m generally not too fussed about air nozzles but JAL is one airline where I do notice their absence because of their warm cabins. I don’t usually find it an issue on day flights but when I’m trying to sleep I do think it notably detracts from an otherwise very, very good airline.

BLK?

Awful seat for a reverse herringbone. Problems include:

- no leg rest
- poor storage (I disagree Apex is worse.)
- gap between seat and sidewall
- uncomfortably hard seat
- poor recline positions
- bizarrely, the presence of a shoulder belt even though the seat belt is equipped with an airbag. You typically only need one or the other to certify.

This looks to be basically the same, if not the exact same configuration as their intra Asia 787 hard product. Yeah it's pretty awful, but still better than their old non lie flat product. The worst part to me is that uncomfortable shoulder seatbelt strap that just digs into your shoulder.

BNK ?

The 787-8 isn’t equipped with these seats. Instead most of those flying TPAC and to Europe will be configured with the APEX Suite (SKY SUITE). There are also angle flat 787-8s (Shell Flat Neo), though they’re mostly scheduled on intra-Asia flights only.

I thought the denser configuration was what they're looking for, just by looking at the difference of Sky Suite 1/3 on 787-9.
Also, JAL always put Sky Suite 1 on their most premium routes is very telling how they see these two products.

@Ben
Another point, where you in a window or middle seat? The window seats have significantly more footwell space than the middle seats, and the bulkhead window seats a good deal more than the standard window seats.

They prolly meant BKK.

Aww, shoot. I'm scheduled to do NRT -> SFO in the 787-9 with these seats in January. Thanks for the heads up.

That's due to the placement of the lavatories at door 2. JAL places them on the side of the business cabin, making the space of the cabin smaller. Other airlines, like Qatar, place them on the side of the economy cabin, making the space for the business cabin larger.

Thank you for this post. We flew on their J class a few years back and suffered through their very warm cabin temps and their old, decrepit seats. We wanted to give their 787s a chance but now I guess we'll have to find another carrier for our trans-pacific travels...

Are you sure all the aches from your flight aren't just the start of old age? 😉

I usually travel JFK-TYO on JAL’s cubicle-like Sky Suite, which like very much, but I traveled on this JAL Suite III product from LAX to KIX a couple of months ago when Osaka was named as my destination. I had the exact same issues described here!

The seat got so narrow toward my feet that, essentially, my feet and/or legs were uncomfortably constrained in some way while fully reclined, no matter how I twisted my body. It was so bad that I almost wished instead for JAL’s old Shell Flat Neo from, what, 20 years ago (?), which in my opinion was merely a glorified premium economy seat.

I assume this is attempt of a joke.

I have taken these 4 times in total (South-East Asia to Tokyo) and the seats work better for day flights. I'm a side sleeper and not as tall as Ben, so it wasn't so cramped for me. However, the sleeping surface feels pretty rough and no sleep pad is provided for these mid-range flights.

The middle seats have a weird configuration, where in full-recline mode, your seat-mate's feet are directly above or below you and you might end up very close to the floor-level.

On the other hand, ANA's 787 (non-herringbone) also doesn't score much better for me in terms of sleep comfort.

Moral of the story - Try to fly a day-flight!

I enjoy watching the Japanese movies they offer. There are always a couple that are quite good, and that I'd never have seen or known about otherwise.

Thanks for this review Ben. I took 2 flights on JAL a few years ago. One with these reverse herringbone seats and the next with Apex Suites. Loved the Apex suites as I got a true window seat for my ~13 hour flight. Hated the reverse herringbone seats and wondered at that time why you love reverse herringbone seats. Now I know that it's the seats on JAL not reverse herringbone in general.

JAL, if you are reading this, please I beg you get some new pillows for your planes. Lucky is right, they’re like pancakes. I’ve had pillows in economy that are better than this. Everything is so good on Jal except for your sad sad bedding. Also ditch that stupid terry cloth pillow case, it scratches my face.

I find your comment about the entertainment quite inaccurate. I flew on JAL 787-8 (NRT-SFO) and their 767 (NRT-HAN) at the end of September, round trip. The entertainment was more than enough with latest movies and classics, and they offered these movies in multiple languages/subtitles.

Thanks for sharing these details. I only once had the pleasure to travel in the Apex Suite and have since then been looking forward to repeat it.
Do they at least still prepare fresh rice on board? That was together with the selection of Japanese whiskey the other thing that made it my favorite flight ever.

First world problems..lol
Good God..go fly United

Fish is a common Japanese breakfast item. Not surprising to see it as the Japanese (washoku) choice.

I've flown JAL first class R/T LAX - HND (Haneda) and HND - LAX and let me tell you, everything was excellent, from the very minute we board the plane, we were escorted to our "Suite" as they refer to first class seats. Welcome aboard drink was served, we opted out for the Japanese course plus I was very pleased when requested caviar as well.
JAL food and service are among the best in the world.

Hello, how can you know if you are in the sky suite vs sky suite III? Our reservation on the 787 currently just says sky suite

same question here. I didnt realize this was an issue and now it seems important

Just flew to Tokyo with JAL, funny enough the ramen was very average while the salmon penne was great, I went for 2nds

You can call JAL US customer service or look it up on their website as if you are booking a ticket. It requires a little bit of clicking around, but the seat type info is available. I'm going to have the inferior seats on my KIX LAX flight in July, darn. Good luck to you!

Do you think the first row would be any better, or do you think all seats are the same? I'll fly this product later in the year. Thx!

Yikes. I fly this in July. Do you think a first row seat would be mildly better? Thx!

I fly this in July. Now, a bit less looking forward to it. I'll pray they have an extra pillow. If given a choice, would you pick front row, mid-cabin, or the back...if it makes any difference?

Recently flew HND-SFO with Sky Suite III. Agree completely that the seat is terribly uncomfortable for anyone that’s even remotely tall (I’m 6’2”, with size 12 feet). Could not even begin to get comfortable in the seat. I loved the original Sky Suites that JAL has on the 777-300ER that used to fly this route. Even though it seemed the 2-3-2 configuration wouldn’t work, it did.

As for the food, I think JAL’s Japanese meals in business are better than ANA’s offerings. In Cattle/Premium classes, ANA is far superior.