Could a nonstop flight between Miami and North Asia finally become a reality? While it’s anyone’s guess, I wouldn’t be surprised to see it happen in the near future…
Continue reading: Could Japan Airlines Launch Tokyo To Miami Flights?
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
The Japanese traffic to Brazil is probably be enough to warrant this service with code sharing with AA.
@ RetiredATLATC -- I suppose anything is possible, but that seems highly unlikely to me, given that ANA is in Star Alliance, so that would eliminate the benefit of Miami as a connecting hub.
Would not be ideal since there are not loads of connections in Miami. ANA already serves IAD and IAH which facilitate Southern and Southeastern US as well as the Latin American connections. Miami would be largely O&D for ANA, so I would think JAL would be far more likely to go there.
My Japanese friend working in Brazil typically flies via Europe (i.e. Frankfurt) even if it means a longer flight time, due to entry formalities in the US as all passengers must complete immigration even on a transit (as stated in the blog).
Now that ME3 offer decent connection at their hub, flying via US is becoming less attractive.
Currently, Tokyo is connected with most of the US cities which host Consulate-General of Japan - only Miami and Nashville did not have direct flights to Tokyo (Atlanta, Detroit (Delta) and Denver (United) are not served by Japanese airlines). And state of Florida is actively lobbying Japanese airlines - CEO of JAL and ANA met with governor Ron DeSantis this April - so new service by Japan airlines to Miami could be a reality.
However, I cannot imagine direct service to Nashville from Tokyo…
I mean, never say never, but I'm not sure how big the local market is between Miami and Japan? That's gotta be substantial. As of now, there are plenty of ways for people to get from south Florida to and from Japan - many good easy connections over the likes of Atlanta, Detroit, Chicago, Washington, New York, Texas, California. Is there premium demand? That's what sustains a flight like this. Next, you mention connections. The biggest draws in Latin America are deep south america cities / countries such as Sao Paulo and Brazil, Buenos Aires, Chile, and Lima. Mexico City is another big draw but Miami is not convenient for that market. All the big deep south american cities are already served very very well on AA through Dallas, Delta through Atlanta, United through Houston, all the European airlines through their various hubs, and the middle eastern carriers such as Qatar and Emirates. Miami doesnt really stand out.
So never say never, but I'll believe it when I see it, and even then be skeptical if it comes to pass.
As mentioned elsewhere in the comments, most people don't want to fly from Asia to Latin America via the US because it requires going through US immigration. Sterile international transit at MIA would be a game changer (and existed before 9/11, IIRC) but I imagine it is not coming back anytime soon.
It is insanely stupid that the USA doesn't allow sterile transit for international passengers. No, instead you need to go through the entire customs/immigration rigmarole, waiting in long lines, obtaining visas, etc. Why not simply allow connecting pax to stay in their own space. You can have a transit area, where IDs are checked, etc. That's what they used to do back when Iberia actually had a Latin American hub at MIA. It's time for the heavy-handed idiocy to stop, though I' have no confidence that it will, given who is running things right now.
No one is flying from Miami to Tokyo.
And since when are Doha , Dubai , and Tel Aviv in Asia ? It’s called the Middle East.
Go read your maps properly and come back here. Middle East is not a continent, it’s just a geographical area.
The problem w/ Miami to Asia is that the flight overflies multiple hubs that have multiple flights to Asia so there will be very low ability for JL or AA to control prices - on top of the connectivity issues. You could justify a connection to anywhere in Florida via MIA but DL does a far better job of serving the SE - and AA competes in that market set as well via DFW and both hubs also have many Latin/Caribbean destinations for those passengers that are willing to clear US customs.
The reality is also that Haneda airport has a pretty limited number of routes to the US, AA and JL likely want to keep all they have, and the DOT just shot down DL's request to move HND routes - which AA supported.
Japanese airlines can move HND routes w/o the restrictions on US carriers.
JL could add Narita service but local market fares are much higher from HND so the economics of NRT flights are not great and compounded by MIA's geography.
The same is true for BNA which desperately wants Asia service and Japan makes alot of sense - there is alot of Japanese business in Tennessee - but a NRT flight will not work economically while no one is willing to use a HND flight to BNA. BNA's best hope is a DL/KE flight to ICN.
And the best way to increase service to Japan is to get rid of the limitations on HND flights which would allow AA and DL to serve whatever they want from HND even if UA/NH will scream til kingdom come.
It’s crazy that MIA is the only major US airport without nonstop air service to Asia. That said, a Tokyo-Miami nonstop flight will require mostly O&D demand to USA, or connections to Asia for Floridians willing to pay for convenience of Tokyo connections to say Bangkok and China (redeeming for award flights is not a profitable strategy for airlines LOL). There are already Tokyo nonstops to Dallas, Houston & Atlanta providing connections to SE USA. And MIA is most definitely a more difficult airport to connect thru vs. DFW / IAH / ATL.
Being based in South Florida, I would love a nonstop to Japan (I recently flew FLL-IAH-NRT), but I'll believe it when I see it 🙂
Are there any/enough Japanese businesses in the Miami area? DFW has a TON of Japanese companies either with their American HQs here or with large branches. I would think that's something that's taken into consideration when airlines plan out their routes, no?
And VASP used to fly GRU-LAX-Osaka (Kansai).
The single largest Japanese diaspora in any city is in São Paulo.
And since when are Athens , Belgrade , and Dubrovnik in Europe ? It’s called the Balkans...
No way, from Brazil to Japan the answer is Europe or Middle East.
It's almost two years of waiting just to renew an US visa in Brazil.
Years ago, there were rumours of CX starting flights to MIA with the A350 especially with the Swire business in Miami. There were even rumors of moving the YVR-JFK flight to MIA.
I think you have to take South America out of the equation because of the middle east carriers, Aeromexico, Air Canada, Ethiopian and european carriers.
If you have an US visa, you can route thru DFW,JFK/EWR,ORD, IAH, IAD, LAX being ORD, IAH, IAD and even LAX better options, I think.
I could see this being HND-MIA-GRU. Imagine the opportunities that would open.
This totally makes sense from a business / oneworld perspective. Maybe not daily, but a few times a week to start would be huge. AA's domestic operation in MIA could easily support it was well and help it grow.
Next up AA or JAL - PHX to Tokyo, like MIA, PHX has had huge tech growth over the past decade and many high tech manufacturers have moved or added plants from Asia and CA to the PHX area. Again, a 787-8 would be perfect and starting with 4 days a week would be a good start. Remember AA started LHR as seasonal and went 7/365 before the first flight took off.
My friend, you better stop embarrassing yourself.
Where do you think Palestine is? Oceania?
@Dickless3Kingg
Learn basic geography, imbecile.
Yes, Palestine is in Asia. Most of Turkey is too. You'd know that if you had a basic education.
It would make more sense for JL to launch this route. Likely, it will serve Japanese passengers to the US and Central/South America as well as bring pax from SE/East Asia to Miami. ESTA is available for Japanese passport holders.
It's not really crazy when you consider that MIA is literally on the farthest possible side of the country from Asia, unless you count Puerto Rico and the USVI. It's kind of like asking "how does SEA not have more flights to Latin America???"
There are 7 continents, and the Middle East is a region of Asia. Education is your friend.
Given that T-WOV, transit without visa, went away during the Bush administration, I’m not sure what the current has to do with it.
Peter
You’re a disgrace to your family. Read a Bible. How about your people stop trying to monetize everything .
When you have to mock and insult others, you have no valid argument. The world is already cruel as it is and you have to lower yourself to such pettiness. I'm sure all of you are grown ass men. We have to be better than what we oppose. What does one have to gain from calling someone a retard, imbecile?! Does that make your life better? Does it make all your problems go away?! Is it really worth your time? Why not use that time to make someone's life better than bring them down?
Miami's economy hasn't grown "hugely" since the pandemic. The number of people moving to South Florida since 2020 have been offset by an almost equal number who moved out due to increasingly high costs and lack of affordable housing. Miami is not quite the major Fortune 500 company city it would have you believe. It was briefly a center for the crypto industry and that has mostly petered out. Financial services have expanded there, largely on the back of billionaire hedge fund founders who relocated there to exploit Florida's tax advantages, and some employees moved as well. Miami is a mirage and at the next downturn, will look a lot like Vegas did in 2008. Lots of overbuilding, tons of excess office space, and people fleeing its politics and hurricanes.
Many years so, Japan Airlines had a Tokyo-NY-Sao Paulo flight, and many of us used to take that NY-Sao Paulo part regularly, simply because JAL service was better than any US or Brazilian option (and not much more expensive). I wonder if they're hoping for that again, with different fliers filling up each of the segments, though of course with some demand from South America to Tokyo. But I would think going back to NY makes more sense than Miami-Tokyo.
In my opinion, you win the "comment of the day" award by properly noting that the route could be sustained with "behind point" connectivity across SE Asia...as opposed to "beyond point" connectivity beyond MIA. I read your comment just when I had convinced myself that it wasn't viable...you just changed my mind.
Sure, they might get some beyond point traffic, but the behind point does seem more lucrative and certainly more appealing than the required passport/customs clearance required at MIA for international travelers.
The only major connectivity would br Brazil-Japan traffic, and they'd need visas to transit the US.
Not much of an Asian diaspora in Miami, and not much of a desire for Caribbean travel in Japan... also all of this is heavily leisure.
I'd say PHX or LAS is more likely to get service.
Im no expert on this but, there is no where new enough of a Japanese community in South FL to sustain such a route. That's the first thing that comes to mind.
Don't be too surprised. Nashville (BNA) has amassed several companies with heavy Japanese operations/HQs over the last few years, and has been actively pushing for a flight.
If it ever happens, it'll be a long way off, but they're purposely attempting to attract nonstop service to Japan:
https://www.bizjournals.com/nashville/news/2022/12/19/bna-airport-asia-route-faa-runway.html
As opposed to all the others who've been in office since that policy was instituted?
I mean, I've no love for Joe Biden or his administration; but your comment comes off as rather dim, considering the amount of Executive administrations and congressional compositions that have been in place since TWOV went away-- none of whom did anything to reverse it.
Around none... as there's already dozens of ways for passengers to get between all of the above.
Not just rumors, CX themselves came out and said it, and they were one of the original airlines pushing Airbus for what became the defunct "-ULR" version of the A350, which only Singapore and a few government operators ended up purchasing.
I agree with PHX. Lots of fabs and data centers coming on stream. I would be surprised if China Airlines doesn't have a taipei Phx route soon.
I agree! There is some demand between South East Asia and Miami. Many of those fliers currently take the one-stop option from Qatar/Emirates/Turkish, or through Europe. I've flown QR's flight to MIA a few times in the past few years and about half of the plane is coming from South East Asia on my flights.
Back in the day American Airlines used to have a daily direct flight between Miami and Narita with one-stop and change of planes in Seattle. I used to fly (consulting work) the Miami-Seattle route weekly in 1999-2000 and there was a good crowd of Asian passengers. This flight was cancelled shortly after 9/11 but it ran through at least mid-2002. The flight left Tokyo at 6:25 PM and arrived in Miami at 9:19 PM; left Miami at 7:50 AM and arrived in Tokyo at 2:00 PM. That was over 20 years ago so a non-stop is long overdue.
Japan airlines could start from 3-4 flights in the week because of the difficulty with European business. especially, HEL was daily but they are operating 3times in the week for this winter.
The US needs to understand that people transit through airports from international destinations; not EVERYONE wants to visit the US but that it’s a stepping stone to their final destination. Get rid of this stupid non-sterile transit mess, maybe then, the amount of fliers will increase.
They already fly to Las Vegas but I personally think Atlanta would work better than Miami for JAL.
Would almost make more sense for JAL to add another daily flight to LAX, IAH, or DFW, then launch direct service to MIA. There's not enough sustainable demand from Japan or elsewhere in Asia to MIA.
The fact that there's a huge Japanese diaspora in Latin America -- Brazil, but also other countries -- helps, too. Japan benefits from the US visa waiver program, so the transit issue is less important for Japanese citizens.
If the airlines offered to pay for it, I'm sure Homeland Security would take a second look. The problem is that American taxpayers don't want to subsidize foreign airlines.
JAL already has quite good central and south American connectivity. Using a mix of AA and LATAM. JAL did not stop codesharing on LATAM when they left Oneworld. For JAL's frequent flyers, JL code on LATAM flights still fully counts as JL flights, so that side also works as it did when LATAM was in Oneworld.
Toyota moved their US HQ from Miami to Plano, and there is an increasing trend for Japanese companies to move their latin America hubs from Miami to Panama City, or at least big part of the business operations. All in all, I think the argument for JAL to come to Miami is weaker than it has been.
When you have to mock and insult others, you have no valid argument. The world is already cruel as it is and you have to lower yourself to such pettiness. I'm sure all of you are grown ass men. We have to be better than what we oppose. What does one have to gain from calling someone a retard, an imbecile, etc.?! Does that make your life better? Does it make all your problems go away?! Is it really worth your time? Why not use that time to make someone's life better rather than bring them down?
What lobbying would it take to get the US to allow sterile international connections? I mean, it IS the 21st Century after all.
only you managed to read my comments and come up w/ that rebuttal - without addressing a simple fact that I raised.
Grow up, put the glass down and discuss the issues that are presented in the article and by others.
As sexy as the prospect of a new route to Tokyo might be, the Japanese government's Tokyo airport policies and rules make it unlikely that AA or JL will add anything new - unless they simply want to move existing Haneda flights from one US hub to another.
The Japanese government decided over a decade ago that it wants to consolidate longhaul premium carrier routes at Haneda and turn Narita into a low cost carrier airport. Other Asian airports including ICN provide better connectivity to the world than either HND or NRT which divide their role as global hubs. HND is very limited access and until the Japanese government fully transitions HND to be a fully open access single Tokyo airport global hub, airlines will have to make choices between using existing precious assets rather than growing Tokyo air service.
here's the ishiron link. https://twitter.com/ishriona/status/1699384784596668475?s=46&t=zE0D-cmgWZajkBdKkqptjQ
It's Condor to Miami from Frankfurt 3x/week.
Even though Miami as a whole has grown, the market size to Tokyo is still pretty small. The larger markets in Asia - Manila and Jakarta - are larger than Tokyo but have much lower fares. I'm not sure that there is even connectivity from a proposed MIA-HND/NRT flight to serve those connections. I think it'll be hard to ever see a MIA-NRT/HND flight, as there are so many other connecting points to/from South Florida, and the connections/destinations in most demand from Asia are WELL served over other points
Japanese brazilians had brazilian passports. No ESTA, but years to get or renew an US Visa.
JAL doesn’t fly to Las Vegas. Personally I think they would do better in MIA since they have at least some connectivity and would be the only East Asia option as opposed to ATL where they have to compete with Delta and Korean (though it does help that Delta can’t add more ATL-HND flights even if they wanted to).
9/11 eliminated the Travel Without a Visa (TWOV) program that for years, made it easy for those transiting the US to do so. Today a valid US visa (or travel originating in a visa waiver country) is required. I agree it would be nice to bring it back.
Maybe it was just the Latin American bit that was in Miami. They used to have a quite massive presence. A former colleague came from Toyota in the Miami area.
The main issue is that US airports are NOT set up for this sterile transit. US airports were built mostly for domestic use and INTL use is second to that. Plus, most connections at a US hub are INTL to Domestic. Yes there is INTL to INTL but it is no where near the majority... I think if the airlines would be willing to pay to rearrange their terminals, at least at the main hubs, it could work, but the taxpayers aren't going to foot the bill for this... CBP would be very happy for the change as it would get rid of a decent amount of travelers at certain airports... The other answer to this is to try and increase Preclearance locations, but thats a whole other issue.
The premium long haul base vs the LCC base is really an old and outdated concept. HND is running at capacity, and there are still plenty of premium long haul in Narita. But of course, any LCC growth will need to be in Narita, as there are available slots. The latest expansion in Haneda only came due to the US military giving access to airspace they used to control entirely. Hence also the higher level of new US routes. They could give the slots free and have pricing like Heathrow, but it would not really give access to more flights, as the capacity is not there. Though between 11pm and 6am there is still some slot capacity, and it is fairly unrestricted. It just does not work very well for most airlines.
Terminal 3 is not really big enough for the current amount of traffic, let alone any significant expansion.
Why not expand Haneda? Expand where would be the question. It is quite boxed in.
Agree with your SEA to Latin America observation. That said, I think South Florida is untapped potential for Asian investment and tourism. The connectivity for Asians from say China/HK/Taiwan, (and of Floridians who go to China/HK/Taiwan) might fill part of demand for a HND-MIA flight. JL is not looking for just Japanese people to fill this plane.
If you look at JL's HND schedules they have good connectivity to China/HK Taiwan for flights to/from US. I think that's partly why the Miami business community / local gov't has been advocating for a nonstop to Asia. To everyone's point, folks from China/HK/Taiwan hate having to transit thru a US hub vs. connecting elsewhere (i.e. Japan). I am an Asian American based in South Florida, and when I mention Miami to my friends/family in HK/Taiwan, I draw blank stares (vs. other US destinations)!
Please have direct flights from Miami Florida to Tokyo Japan please thanks miami is growing thanks
Us Airlines won't be paying for it anytime soon.
There's more than enough international demand from local traffic.
Keeping it this way means they don't have to worry about competing with foreign carriers for connecting passengers. Thereby resulting in lackluster service especially for connections (lower cost, money saved)
The Japanese traffic to Brazil is probably be enough to warrant this service with code sharing with AA.
My Japanese friend working in Brazil typically flies via Europe (i.e. Frankfurt) even if it means a longer flight time, due to entry formalities in the US as all passengers must complete immigration even on a transit (as stated in the blog).
Now that ME3 offer decent connection at their hub, flying via US is becoming less attractive.
No way, from Brazil to Japan the answer is Europe or Middle East.
It's almost two years of waiting just to renew an US visa in Brazil.
Maybe ANA?
@ RetiredATLATC -- I suppose anything is possible, but that seems highly unlikely to me, given that ANA is in Star Alliance, so that would eliminate the benefit of Miami as a connecting hub.
Would not be ideal since there are not loads of connections in Miami. ANA already serves IAD and IAH which facilitate Southern and Southeastern US as well as the Latin American connections. Miami would be largely O&D for ANA, so I would think JAL would be far more likely to go there.
Currently, Tokyo is connected with most of the US cities which host Consulate-General of Japan - only Miami and Nashville did not have direct flights to Tokyo (Atlanta, Detroit (Delta) and Denver (United) are not served by Japanese airlines). And state of Florida is actively lobbying Japanese airlines - CEO of JAL and ANA met with governor Ron DeSantis this April - so new service by Japan airlines to Miami could be a reality.
However, I cannot imagine direct service to Nashville from Tokyo…
JAL used to fly NRT-JFK-GRU...
And VASP used to fly GRU-LAX-Osaka (Kansai).
The single largest Japanese diaspora in any city is in São Paulo.
I mean, never say never, but I'm not sure how big the local market is between Miami and Japan? That's gotta be substantial. As of now, there are plenty of ways for people to get from south Florida to and from Japan - many good easy connections over the likes of Atlanta, Detroit, Chicago, Washington, New York, Texas, California. Is there premium demand? That's what sustains a flight like this. Next, you mention connections. The biggest draws in Latin America are deep south america cities / countries such as Sao Paulo and Brazil, Buenos Aires, Chile, and Lima. Mexico City is another big draw but Miami is not convenient for that market. All the big deep south american cities are already served very very well on AA through Dallas, Delta through Atlanta, United through Houston, all the European airlines through their various hubs, and the middle eastern carriers such as Qatar and Emirates. Miami doesnt really stand out.
So never say never, but I'll believe it when I see it, and even then be skeptical if it comes to pass.
As mentioned elsewhere in the comments, most people don't want to fly from Asia to Latin America via the US because it requires going through US immigration. Sterile international transit at MIA would be a game changer (and existed before 9/11, IIRC) but I imagine it is not coming back anytime soon.
It is insanely stupid that the USA doesn't allow sterile transit for international passengers. No, instead you need to go through the entire customs/immigration rigmarole, waiting in long lines, obtaining visas, etc. Why not simply allow connecting pax to stay in their own space. You can have a transit area, where IDs are checked, etc. That's what they used to do back when Iberia actually had a Latin American hub at MIA. It's time for the heavy-handed idiocy to stop, though I' have no confidence that it will, given who is running things right now.
No one is flying from Miami to Tokyo.
And since when are Doha , Dubai , and Tel Aviv in Asia ? It’s called the Middle East.
Go read your maps properly and come back here. Middle East is not a continent, it’s just a geographical area.
My friend, you better stop embarrassing yourself.
Where do you think Palestine is? Oceania?
@Dickless3Kingg
Learn basic geography, imbecile.
Yes, Palestine is in Asia. Most of Turkey is too. You'd know that if you had a basic education.
And since when are Athens , Belgrade , and Dubrovnik in Europe ? It’s called the Balkans...
There are 7 continents, and the Middle East is a region of Asia. Education is your friend.
The problem w/ Miami to Asia is that the flight overflies multiple hubs that have multiple flights to Asia so there will be very low ability for JL or AA to control prices - on top of the connectivity issues. You could justify a connection to anywhere in Florida via MIA but DL does a far better job of serving the SE - and AA competes in that market set as well via DFW and both hubs also have many Latin/Caribbean destinations for those passengers that are willing to clear US customs.
The reality is also that Haneda airport has a pretty limited number of routes to the US, AA and JL likely want to keep all they have, and the DOT just shot down DL's request to move HND routes - which AA supported.
Japanese airlines can move HND routes w/o the restrictions on US carriers.
JL could add Narita service but local market fares are much higher from HND so the economics of NRT flights are not great and compounded by MIA's geography.
The same is true for BNA which desperately wants Asia service and Japan makes alot of sense - there is alot of Japanese business in Tennessee - but a NRT flight will not work economically while no one is willing to use a HND flight to BNA. BNA's best hope is a DL/KE flight to ICN.
And the best way to increase service to Japan is to get rid of the limitations on HND flights which would allow AA and DL to serve whatever they want from HND even if UA/NH will scream til kingdom come.
It’s crazy that MIA is the only major US airport without nonstop air service to Asia. That said, a Tokyo-Miami nonstop flight will require mostly O&D demand to USA, or connections to Asia for Floridians willing to pay for convenience of Tokyo connections to say Bangkok and China (redeeming for award flights is not a profitable strategy for airlines LOL). There are already Tokyo nonstops to Dallas, Houston & Atlanta providing connections to SE USA. And MIA is most definitely a more difficult airport to connect thru vs. DFW / IAH / ATL.
Being based in South Florida, I would love a nonstop to Japan (I recently flew FLL-IAH-NRT), but I'll believe it when I see it 🙂
It's not really crazy when you consider that MIA is literally on the farthest possible side of the country from Asia, unless you count Puerto Rico and the USVI. It's kind of like asking "how does SEA not have more flights to Latin America???"
Are there any/enough Japanese businesses in the Miami area? DFW has a TON of Japanese companies either with their American HQs here or with large branches. I would think that's something that's taken into consideration when airlines plan out their routes, no?
Years ago, there were rumours of CX starting flights to MIA with the A350 especially with the Swire business in Miami. There were even rumors of moving the YVR-JFK flight to MIA.
I think you have to take South America out of the equation because of the middle east carriers, Aeromexico, Air Canada, Ethiopian and european carriers.
If you have an US visa, you can route thru DFW,JFK/EWR,ORD, IAH, IAD, LAX being ORD, IAH, IAD and even LAX better options, I think.
I could see this being HND-MIA-GRU. Imagine the opportunities that would open.
This totally makes sense from a business / oneworld perspective. Maybe not daily, but a few times a week to start would be huge. AA's domestic operation in MIA could easily support it was well and help it grow.
Next up AA or JAL - PHX to Tokyo, like MIA, PHX has had huge tech growth over the past decade and many high tech manufacturers have moved or added plants from Asia and CA to the PHX area. Again, a 787-8 would be perfect and starting with 4 days a week would be a good start. Remember AA started LHR as seasonal and went 7/365 before the first flight took off.
It would make more sense for JL to launch this route. Likely, it will serve Japanese passengers to the US and Central/South America as well as bring pax from SE/East Asia to Miami. ESTA is available for Japanese passport holders.