Guys, this is an absolute mess. A couple of days ago, I covered how Lufthansa was dealing with back-to-back strikes from pilots and flight attendants. Well, I need to provide an update… we’re now seeing back-to-back-to-back strikes.
Continue reading: Oy: Lufthansa Pilots & Flight Attendants Stage Back-To-Back-To-Back Strikes
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
I’m sure they can fix their labor problems by installing a 1.5 ton weight in the negotiation room.
That would be SWISS. Lufthansa is the airline where only two out of ten seats at the negotiation table are filled because the other eight aren't certified for seating. 😀
Ben you can also mention, that on Wednesday is the big 100 years celebration here in Frankfurt, where also Merz is expected to take part. Its ruined by the strike. Spohr totally failed.
I hope the crews get what they are looking for, and that things return to regular operations as soon as possible. Fortunately, affected passengers should be eligible refunds or rebooking in addition to EU261 compensation, because this is most certainly under the airlines' control.
Oh no... sounds like management should resolve this before then (chop chop, two days!), you know, unless they want the party to be less-fun. Boo hoo...
I booked ONE flight this year by LH simply because that was the far most convenient time/destination (plus they allow waitlisting for 1st class with upgrade vouchers), and yeah, it is these upcoming days, I am already cursing my decision.
Finally a reason to test AF once.
They should hire 5 allegris-inspired CEOs, so they can choose the 'right' one for every strike. Some of them might come with a surcharge, though.
Unfortunately unions can be problematic in Germany. I used to work for a European multinational (as a payroll employee, not management at all) that closed down 80% of its manufacturing in Germany for this reason. Just to be done with it once and forever. Thousands of German colleagues lost their job.
Of course Lufthansa cannot do the same. But it is very hard to make a profit in Germany if you are in any low-margin business that requires a big workforce. The payroll and other employee benefits costs are too high. And unions are not willing to give in to make Germany more competitive.
I am afraid those strikes will keep coming back.
"No disrespect to Lufthansa management..."
Why not? Crappy management is worthy of disrespect, starting with Karsten Spohr.
Well, the 100th anniversary event is not "soon", it is precisely this Wednesday, 15 April. I guess Chancellor Merz has not planned to travel with LH, but many of the other invitees will probably see their flights to the event cancelled.
Hey, speaking of Chancellors, remember when Angela had to bum a ride on Iberia? Oof... Luft-woopsie.
You have to respect how shameless they are holding on to their positions after so long track record of pathetic management.
It took them over 7 years to launch a new product and a few more years flying empty because it's not certified.
How many years you think it will take them to resign, 30 or 40?
In a free society, every one of these employees would face the very real prospect of being fired if they don't show up for work. That's the way it should be. Unions, as they are currently structured in most countries, violate the rights of each individual and represent the antithesis of freedom.
Careful of what you ask for.
You might end up with a fancy tool. Still a tool. But also useless because they are not certified.
Or basically they just recline and do nothing useful for the company but keep wasting resources.
Haven't seen anyone report on this as yet.
This weekend saw a transatlantic award ticket with $1426.79 in taxes and fees on Lufthansa. So they raised they already exorbitant fees by yet another 40 to 45%.
All those taxes and fees so you can fly in a cabin that was state of the art in the 1990s.
Plus this kind of gouging should be outlawed. They make a mockery of award tickets.
I've said it before and I'll say it again - stop flying with this chickenshit airline.
It is a free society. Employees are free to team up together and say fire one of us and fire us all
There is nothing unfree about it
These entitled pricks need to be reigned in and these strikes should be illegal. Fliers are the ones ultimately paying the price while these lazy and overpaid people go unpunished. No idea what tf legislators are doing and allowing this to constantly plague the airline. Don’t ever see this happening in Asia, where we can actually get from point a to b on the actual flight we’re booked on, not a week later. What an absolute socialist hellhole Europe is, complete joke.
I am supposed to fly Lufthansa on May 2 and May 17, an airline the tour company I booked a trip with a year ago has put me on. I am actually contemplating canceling the trip because I have absolutely no confidence in this airline getting me to my destination, and/or back home again, safely.
No, it isn't, because employers are forced to "bargain" with a union of employees. They don't have the choice to say, "No, thank you". Additionally, most governments would likely deny the employer the ability to do exactly what you propose. The relationship is clearly one-sided and violates the employees' and employers' right of Freedom of Association. There's no way to avoid this fact.
Hey, Mike P, why not include a Mark Twain quote next time... Oh, and tell 'em about Uncle Tom Sowell. So great. /s
No, Eskimo, the American military and the Marshall Plan did, but unions make Europe even better, regardless.
Just wait until they privatize TSA in this country then all of those people will be private sector employees who will instantly unionize.
Chris ... Likely so .
But once unionized , they will be a lot rougher on the passengers .
How about this… don’t privatize, and stop sabotaging the public sector.
(By the way, this is about a German airline… eh, nevermind… relevance is overrated.)
Please, tell the workers how you really feel, ideally before meal service… eat up!
No, if the TSA workers are privatized, they would be considered "essential safety personnel" who would be forbidden to strike by federal law. For example, privatized air traffic controllers at small airports are forbidden to strike by federal law.
Unions shouldn’t exist. These workers should be fired or imprisoned. No excuse for disrupting travel like this. If they doesn’t the job I’m sure many would.
Lufthansa is working on its new concept, offering the most luxurious strikes of any European airline.
This. Let the free market do its job. If people don’t like working for the company they are free to go elsewhere. If the company can’t hire enough people due to poor working conditions the market will force the company to improve
Good luck with that designation. They would work for a private company....no magic wand will take their rights away. People need to eat. Should we designate anyone who works anywhere near food manufacturing or distribution as "essential" personnel? How about nurses?
@justinb @retired gambler and all others who adopt that stoopid mantra.
Tell me you are willfully ignorant of history without telling me you are willfully ignorant...
Can't debate my argument, so resort to weak-minded retorts. Business as usual.
Mike, P: Did you own a company and the employees treat you poorly? Did you work for a company with a union and didn’t like having to pay dues? Or did you just go on message boards and find friends who hates unions so you decided to hate them? Give us some background.
Sounds like Lufthansa is getting abused worse than Anna Kepner on a Friday night. Lol
On the plus side, all LX flights are completely full because of the strike, and they bumped me and a friend from J to F! The benefits of LH chaos
If Kanzler Merz doesn't have much faith in DB running their ICE trains between Berlin and Frankfurt on time (I am not talking about THAT ICE), he could always try one of trice-daily Condor flights instead of LH on strike. He may even like it more
Well, that's cutting it close. We head to Eze on the 17th. Makes my cheeks pucker.
Easier said than done when you‘re a LH hub captive and all but one of your regular intra-European destinations you have to fly to for work are LH monopoly routes …
I appreciate that puts you in a difficult position, but for many others there is a choice. If you travel by air within DE you’re pretty screwed.
Right off the top, I have skin in the game. Since being a ff with EAL, CO, and UA, and now with a lifetime Premier 1k, wife and I retired to Malta.
Since we travel extensively, we continued to fly with LH. While living in the States, we flew long haul LH from Seattle to Helsinki two or three times a year. I put those flights on Mileage Plus. And when we retired, we used those miles to fly around Europe on LH. And made extensive use of Star Alliance gold for lounge usage in FRA and MUC.
But, last year I saw the writing on the wall with UA. Since living in Europe, I can't avail myself of U.S. credit card programs. Last September, I signed us up for M&M. Earned Bus. status in three months. And will achieve Senator status later this month. Why do I fly with LH? Perhaps I am unique, but we have always been treated well. For the most parts, our flights are on time. The planes are clean, the food service better than U.S. flights. AND the FA's have been wonderful to us. And point in fact, the more senior FA's on long haul flights have treated us with fantastic service. But, from what I have seen, if you don't treat them with respect, you will eventually get what you deserve.
But, I will say, that the management sucks big time. Spohr is playing games with the Group. He keeps splitting them apart to create many subsidiaries, where, costs are lower, wages are, too. And yes, the re-allignment of the corporate structure is a nightmare, bringing all airlines down to their level. Last month we flew to NZ, and just beat a labor action. Friday we fly to EZE. Again, it looks like dodge the strikes. Who knows after that. But there is a pox on both their houses. Both sides are playing games where the losers are the PAX. But, for what it is worth, commenters that say there should be no unions or strikes have paper A**holes. You can see how Spohr treats his employees. So how can you say that? And, for a cheap SOB, Spohr made a stupid and ill-informed bet on Allegris. But, at theend of the day, I still will stay with LH. And before you say fly ME airlines, no thanks. And while Singapore has its distinct advantages, price is not one.
You raise an interesting point. Within Germany, there is an incredibly large rail network, that connects to LH long haul flights. They should do, as in France, not allow plane flights within France under three hours.
It's easy to bash the unions on this one, but frankly, having a successful airline it's about having good management. There are lots of unionized airlines that are profitable. I think a good case study is AF. Talk about an airline subject to multiple strikes...remember the executives that literally lost their shirts!
Ben Smith came in, developed vision and brought the unions on board. Is AF perfect, no. However, few if any strikes since Ben's been on board and as a customer, I have to say that AF has improved greatly.
If AF can be profitable, so can LH...but the change needs to be made at the top.
Well said, AlanZ. Hope all goes well for your Argentina trip! Agreed on those bashing unions (their reasons are often misguided, if not vapid). And, these days, ME carriers are not a viable option, if you care for safety. I also love SQ, but it ain't cheap!
There is a clear difference between air transport infrastructure elements (such as air traffic control and TSA) and your example of food distribution and nursing. Air transport infrastructure is a natural monopoly. Natural monopoly infrastructure cannot be allowed to strike because it would collapse the economy.
Food manufacturing / distribution and nursing are not natural monopolies. If one food manufacturer or distributor goes on strike, there are alternatives for consumers. Same for nurses. If one hospital is hit by a strike, patients are sent to another.
Alternatively, you can just drive to Canada and fly from there. Sure it's difficult but not impossible.
As a customer who is also navigating between multiple long haul flights, I share some of your concern. Hope flights do fly. But as to safely? LH has a good safety reputation. So "safely" is not a great choice of words.
I'm a victim . Lon to Fra April 13 . Flight canceled
I assume eu261 compensation likes in since it is airline's own crew.
Is that correct ?
Unions should be banned all over the world. They only represent their own and always create a mess for normal people!
Spohr: Expand subcontracting using LCA and Discover and pretending everything usual as normal.
totally agree with every single word you wrote, btw, i used to fly really a lot with SQ pre pandemic simply because that was much cheaper than LH (all in C) back then, but that’s not the case any longer.
service on LH is always great as long as you treat the FAs well. shocking to know that most of them suffer from lack of proper management—pain to know that those well paid CEOs seem to consistently lack the capacity to broadcast at least a few kind words to their most important employees….
Do they have an inflatable rat named Scabby over in Frankfurt? We can lend you ours from NYC if needed.
No. Greedy and incompetent management should be banned all over the world. These workers deserve better.
VladG meant to say “Yes, AND good luck!” As-in, we, as fellow passengers, agree that you deserve compensation and hope that you get it soon. It should be an eligible claim, even if the airline attempts to defy its obligation. Appeal. Keep at it.
so you know nothing about the issues yet automatically assume the workers deserve better? How idiotic and stupid.
why is it a failure of management? What specific issues is management being unreasonable about?
This may actually work out in view of high fuel cost. People probably booked cheaper price months ago while LH have to pay the higher cost now.
Julie, apparently, it is you who know nothing about the issues, and automatically prefer the workers be harmed. Who's really the idiotic and stupid one?
Julie, I got you covered. Succinctly, management keeps abusing "labor arbitrage" where operations are shifted to lower-cost subsidiaries. The pilots demand increases in wages and retirement benefits, and binding third-party arbitration; while, flight attendants are demanding salary increases, improved schedules, and protections for CityLine crews, because management has created yet another subsidiary to try to screw them over. Management has called everything 'absurd,' but supposedly remains open to arbitration. Now, you keep saying I'm uninformed, or calling me silly names, yet, maybe it is you who is projecting on here...
I'm very saddened by the Lufthansa strike as I was to make my 1st ever trip to Europe next Wednesday 4/22 for my 65th birthday. Now I'm debating canceling my trip with all the unknowns. I don't want to get stranded in MUC (flying from DEN in Colorado). Lots of prayers going up!
Sorry Ben. In the US we have strong consumer protections against this. It’s called the Railway Labor Act.
As far as consumer protections go, I’ll take the Railway Labor Act over EU261 all day long. Could you imagine these weasels doing this here?
It’s funny how “people” like 1990 always defend unions and blame management, but there’s never in the history of the world been a time when unions were unreasonable, apparently.
This is such a terrible argument. Akin to “it’s easy to bash an abusive husband, but that’s silly because my friend Vanessa was able to stop the abuse by just always listening to her husband and now they have a great relationship.”
oh... so the unions are unhappy about scope they gave up years ago or never had and now want back? And management is a "failure" due to utilizing scope language they paid for in prior negotiations... and that makes the management a "failure" when there are clearly workers out there happy to do the work at a European fair wage? We aren't talking about replacing LH flight crews with crews from Serbia or Malaysia or some other place with lower labor like Norwegian used to do. Your arguments are so tired, lazy, and poorly thought-out. But you have a habit of claiming knowledge on labor topics and praising workers, facts be damned, while simultaneously bragging all the time about flying the biggest union-buster in the western world -- Delta.
No supply/demand issue at play.. you just think the Union feels bad about giving up scope LONG ago and therefore should be able to claw it back and charge customers more for their own negotiating tactics... got it.
Tell us since you claim to know so much about this labor dispute. How do LH wages compare to BA or AF and KL? Do the hubs in FRA and MUC generate a yield premium to justify equivalent wages to LHR, CDG, or AMS based flight crews?
Let's clear this up: In the US, RLA is pro-industry; NLRA is pro-worker.
EU261 is for consumers.
Well, here is the latest news. Just received an email from LH. My flt LH 510 from FRA to EZE was scheduled to depart at 21:40 17 APR. Due to need to move planes in proper positioning, my flight was delayed to 18 Apr at 0700. It is scheduled to arrive EZE at 15:40 18 Apr. It was supposed to land at 06:25 on the 18th. So, at least I don't have to change my hotel in Buenos Aires.
On the bright side, are you listening 1990, I will be entitled to a hotel in Frankfurt the nite before because my flight from Malta gets in on the 17th at 15:30. That will also include dinner. I will let them off the hook for breakfast as I will eat it at the First Class Terminal. (So, I guess they will be paying for it anyway.
And since we will arrive in EZE nine hours late, that will cost LH E600 times 2= E 1,200. Thank you E261. Ah, the joys of a civilized society!
Well, here is the latest news. Just received an email from LH. My flt LH 510 from FRA to EZE was scheduled to depart at 21:40 17 APR. Due to need to move planes in proper positioning, my flight was delayed to 18 Apr at 0700. It is scheduled to arrive EZE at 15:40 18 Apr. It was supposed to land at 06:25 on the 18th. So, at least I don't have to change my hotel in Buenos Aires.
On the bright side, are you listening 1990, I will be entitled to a hotel in Frankfurt the nite before because my flight from Malta gets in on the 17th at 15:30. That will also include dinner. I will let them off the hook for breakfast as I will eat it at the First Class Terminal. (So, I guess they will be paying for it anyway.
And since we will arrive in EZE nine hours late, that will cost LH E600 times 2= E 1,200. Thank you E261. Ah, the joys of a civilized society!
Nervy that you would post this before your LH flight actually operates. Good luck.
We are flying CLT-Munich-Malaga on LH Monday April 20th. WTH should we do? Might the strike be over by Monday. I called LH was on hold for an hour and hung up. Any thoughts on a Plan B?
Nothing.
Wait until your flight is cancelled. Then contact LH to rebook you on a different flight.
CLT is AA hub: Lufthansa should rebook you on AA748 CLT-MAD and then with Iberia to Malaga.
Lufthansa management has decided to suspend Lufthansa Cityline flight operations effective immediately. Aside from the fact that many feeder flights will be canceled indefinitely, the flight attendants’ union is quite upset about this move by management. It remains to be seen how the strike situation will unfold.
Hey Sandy. I was supposed to fly FRA-Eze Friday. It was only delayed until Saturday. Positioning planes the issue. You should be fine.
It's really pretty awful for a lot of people. No idea if Lufthansa unions are more aggressive than others but overall it seems like extreme incompetence to let their business be shut down like this...