With so many reports of lost luggage over the summer, many travelers have gotten savvier and have taken matters into their own hands, by tracking their checked luggage. Lufthansa is now allegedly saying that this isn’t allowed, and that sets an interesting precedent.
Continue reading: Lufthansa Bans AirTags: Will Other Airlines Follow?
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
Lufthansa has far bigger issues to solve than allowing customers to actually know where this airline has (mis)placed their bags. It’s also a dumb, unenforceable rule. Idiots.
Ridiculous move by Lufthansa!
If they were proud of their ability to NOT lose luggage, they should welcome AirTags to prove how good they are at NOT losing luggage.
Or even better, fliers using AirTags are actually helping airlines track luggage to to be reunited with luggage promptly … essentially becoming unpaid workers for the airlines.
But I feel that Lufthansa just doesn’t want to showcase their bad luggage handling policy.
If Lufthansa offered better bag tracking like Delta provides, then perhaps passengers would not feel so inclined to spend $29 on an AirTag to track their bag, given the lack of visibility most airlines have provided.
These devices pose virtually no risk to avionics equipment. They are taking the easy way out, and it leads me to avoid choosing them whenever possible.
My question is-- can an AirTag be any more theoretically disruptive than a RFID checked bag tag? Because if so, then the airlines really can't say anything.
Lufthansa is just not willing to help people who have accurate location of their bags via AirTags/Tile. They are the least customer friendly airline out there. Plus their own bag tracking feature is virtually non-existent. Maybe they can create a separate app for bag tracking, just like the other 7 apps they have already released.
It's as simple as avoiding liabilities.
To LH it's simple, we suck at delivering bags. AirTags gives concrete evidence that LH sucks.
However if AirTags are banned, once you refer to your tags, you automatically violate your contract and voids any responsibility of LH because you carried 'dangerous goods'.
A-hole move, LH.
I predict this is based on a number of travellers arguing with lost luggage attendants/offices with passengers pulling out iPads/iPhones showing the staff “look my bag is here, now all you need to do is go and get it”. I will be very annoyed if this ban is expanded.
What Lufthansa is really saying is don't fly with them. So chose another airline everyone.
Why would apple and others, Deleon something for a specific use that would then be a potential danger ?
The second issue is that they are so small, it’s extremely easy to conceal them.
However, they do use lithium batteries.
If bags go missing, they do help the customers know the location, however are no use to the airline. They don’t assist with providing a speedier delivery. RFID technology may be used: https://www.iata.org/en/programs/ops-infra/baggage/rfid/
Obviously not in the airlines' best PR interests. Score a big win for the downtrodden traveler on this one. They will claim the AirTag could possibly "conflict" with the airplane's electronic guidance systems, which we all know by now is abject BS.
The tracking capability in AirTags is no different than the capability in AirPods (other Apple devices, like the watch?) will LH ban them in luggage too?
Most passengers will not know AirTags fall under this ban, and many/most that do will ignore it.
*So that our customers won't know their baggage haven't moved an inch in FRA/MUC in a week.
this is stupid. Last year I flew SFO-CPH-FRA and my bag got left in CPH. With the airtag I was able to see my bag was still in CPH when I was waiting at baggage claim in FRA and show them. I guess that's what they're trying to avoid...
I hope Apple gets into this fight. I got AirTags this summer explicitly because of the operational meltdowns this summer. If airlines ban AirTags, Apple loses the biggest legitimate reason for buying them.
My exact experience last month. My bag was checked from BCN to FRA. I arrived in FRA with no bag. We will immediately get on it. It will be here soon. 6 days later the baggage site said still looking for your bag. I called LH and said the bag is sitting in the NE corner of Terminal 1 at BCN and hasn’t moved since Sunday. The baggage guy tried to say your bag may be in FRA or BCN. We need the brand of luggage. I said look at the baggage report. PS - it is in BCN. A few minutes later I received an email that my bag had been found. Of course it took two more days to get to DEN.
This is stupid how would they even track this to know theres an air tag & is it only AirTags what about tiles? Outside of a visual review to see if a person has one attached to the outside of the bag im still perplexed on how they would know if one was inside because thats where mine are located as I figure anyone could grab my luggage and just pop the AirTag off and take it but if its inside in one of the pockets the person who takes it might not even know until they start going through the bag and by then its probably reported a general location.
This is so silly, and I'm not surprised to see LH do this. I had a situation this summer in MUC where LH listed the wrong baggage carousel for my flight and the baggage office was utterly useless. I showed the agent that I could see my bag was in the building and she walked down to the (not listed) baggage carousel with me and it turns out my bag had fallen off the belt in a secure area in a difficult to see spot. She originally told me to come back the next day when my MUC-DEN flight departed for my things!
So incredibly German of them. If they can interpret any rule remotely to their favor, they will. So I guess that means AirPods and even the little wallets Apple sells that attach to your phone are also forbidden. Completely unenforceable, illogical, and consumer unfriendly. But we're talking about Lufthansa here, so I guess it tracks.
Lack of accountability, manipulation…showing true colors! Good to know to avoid LH.
Absolutely silly! I want to see them on force such a stupid rule. Additionally super transparent that all they want to do is not be held accountable, if they tell you they cannot locate their luggage and you can just send them a screenshot of its location and one of their logistics centers.
First off nothing in aviation navigation and safety operates in the frequency band that Airtags use. Second, there are a range of of personal medical devices from blood glucose monitors to heart pacemakers to wireless headphones that communicate via Bluetooth. Is Lufthansa banning all these devices? They don't have the balls! Apparently they don't care how stupid this makes them look. Also to answer a few that asked the questing yes they can easily scan luggage for Airtags with a really available app. I hope Apple responds with a setting that can let an Airtag play dead for 'X' hours then wake up and resume operation. This would mess up Lufthansa's ill conconcieved mendacity.
A combination of no pax abiding by the rule and unenforceability makes this much ado about nothing.
The AirTag to work has to pair with any Apple iPhone nearby to send the information over the cloud to your device, at least that’s how it was explained to me. So, if that tag is “pairing” the threat is also iPhones within close range and curiously they are not banned. Is that next LH?
This is delightful, but these are not exactly large devices. How on earth do they plan on enforcing this? Of course they can ask, "are you sure Herr Andy11235 that you have keine AirTags in your bag?" But who is ever going to admit this? And will they now be rummaging through your clothing to see if you hid an AirTag in a pocket somewhere? And then when you confront them with a map showing where your lost bag is, they will complain, "you should not have put an AirTag." And you will reply, "ach so? Bring it to me and I will take it out."
They are doing this on purpose!!
What difference does it make if its sitting at the bottom of the plane or if its on board with you? Airtags use bluetooth technology. The same technology your phone uses to connect to your airpods. Lufthansa doesnt like this, because every bag owner knows exactly where their item is + puts the liability on the airliner vs the airport.
I think what Lufthansa is missing here is the fact that a lot of checked bags do not originate on Lufthansa. They originate on United, Thai, ANA, Air Canada and the myriad of other Star Alliance members whose passengers connect to Lufthansa flights around the world. Does Lufthansa expect their Alliance members to police this for them?
Good luck with that.
Good point. Or customers rebooked following cancellation of other flights. In that case they would have to refuse the carriage of interline baggage.
At least in Europe all checked luggage is x-rayed and they will find them via x-ray. Lithium power banks are similarly banned and when I flew from Japan they x-rayed checked luggage through a machine just before check in and instantly spotted one I'd left in my suitcase (the screen on the machine highlighted the power bank).
Enforcement could be a very scary Catch-22, actually. Do nothing until a customer calls to complain of lost luggage. As soon as the customer says "I know you're lying, I've tracked it to South Africa" they say you violated policy and now deny you help and possibly other rights you may have had for recourse.
Lufthansa didn't say anything about Lithium-ion batteries here but the graphic talks about turning off devices because these devices all have these types of batteries which are more prone to fires than other types of batteries. AirTags use traditional watch batteries - NOT Li-ion rechargeable batteries. There is zero technical sense in this, it's strictly an anti-customer move. Are they going to ban smart watches from luggage? What about an old pocket watch or hearing aids?
For reference - Apple's page on how to change the battery which lists the CR2032 battery type they use https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT211670
Only if you fly Lufthansa should you care about this issue. And, if you fly LH, you know it is a problem child and you deserve what you get.
(I really don't want to hear about how great its first class product is.)
Maybe Make them programmable to turn on after ETA. Or allow them not to transmit but responsive to remote commands to turn on transmission once airlines finally admit they messed up and lost your bag. Insurance companies?
They just don't want the hassle of their customers knowing where their bags are and demanding that they find them and get those bags to the customer. That's about it. These are not lithium batteries and the range of the AirTag is so short that there is no way that these could harm the plane in anyway. The bluetooth and Wifi on my phone (which they allow to be turned on) is twice as powerful.
I would think that it would be very helpful to the airline, if you can pinpoint for them exactly where the lost bag is. But that’s just me.
Won't name the place to not incentivize a bias, but back where i was born Lufthansa only flew to one airport and has been and still is notorious for losing luggage, both direct and connecting. Again, that's just what I heard, I flew Lufthansa out of there 5-6 times, never had any issues, but a lot more than one guy has a story to tell.
And in all honesty not surprising at all - Lufthansa is a messy place that wouldn't be around if the market was private free and fair. No sh*t they'd rather cover up their tracks vs actually fixing things.
Lufthansa is stretching it here by claiming this technicality. The fact is they don't want customers to know how broken their luggage tracking system is.
(My wife is German and I lived there for many years. What they are doing is a very German thing to do.)
I have used Tile in my suitcase for several years and now use AirTags. These are no different than being allowed to use BT headphones while taking off. When you change to airplane mode, BT does not turn off. Why is an AirTag different? As someone said, flights originate on United and connect through Lufthansa or even within the Lufthansa family. Swiss and Lot have different rules. How will that be managed?
Do you need to live in soviet union , Venezuela, China or other totalitarian s^hole, move out! People don't need spying, shame on you Apple!!!
The question I have is how are the tags allowed in checked luggage as they use lithium batteries? Isnt it the case that airlines don't allow lithium batteries in checked luggage?
After a summer of lost luggage my mind is blown. How can they possibly make a bad situation even worse instead of fixing the problems resulting in lost luggage.
I don’t even own AirTags, but I can surely tell you I won’t ever be flying Lufthansa anyway after this. Their reasoning isn’t even correct (battery/Wi-Fi isnt an issue with AirTags as many have pointed out).
This is 100% Lufthansa getting annoyed that they lost sooo many passenger’s bags, the pax located them via AirTags, and they’re fed up with helping customers get reunited with their bags. Call me crazy, but I’d be thanking those customers for being proactive and doing the work for me, but alas Lufthansa seems they’d rather just have bags lying around forever
I bet few people have any idea how to fully turn off a Kindle e-reader. Yet they get checked.
Did someone say Lufthansa is a four stars company? It’s time to lower it to one star. Just saying.
You would thiink that just MAYBE, Lufthansa would talk to apple about putting air tags in EVERY piece of luggage? And leveraging the technology to help fix THEIR PROBLEM!!
You can't have loose lithium batteries in your bag. They're OK if they are in a device.
Per FAA's Pack Safe page : "Devices containing lithium metal batteries or lithium ion batteries, including – but not limited to – smartphones, tablets, cameras and laptops, should be kept in carry-on baggage. If these devices are packed in checked baggage, they should be turned completely off, protected from accidental activation and packed so they are protected from damage.
Spare (uninstalled) lithium metal batteries and lithium ion batteries, electronic cigarettes and vaping devices are prohibited in checked baggage."
"I know your lying...my intelligence source say that it is in South Africa, Terminal 1, northwest corner....and my name is Bond, James Bond." Or is it "Felix Leiter"?
LH decided quite a while ago to follow Ryanair in terms of customer experience: Ultra dense seat pitch, no food in Y (intra EU), customer unfriedly terms and conditions, no EU261 or refund unless you littigate - and now, no AirTags.
@Lucky: Another decision this week follows the same line. They decided to restrict the rebooking on Classic and Flex (!) fare families. The change to Flex fares (making them unflex, actually) is the last nail into the coffin. I will not fly LH again.
This feels a lot more like LH is embarrassed that someone with a $20 dongle can find their bag faster than Lufthansa can.
Simple solution: Don’t fly on Luftwaffe Airlines, oops, I mean Lufthansa Airlines. If enough people drop them for that reason, they’ll change their rule, and invite people to AirTags in their luggage.
I’ve been using LugLoc and then Gego for years with no problem…..I’ve never been told they weren’t allowed.
Emirates has banned them for long time now. Sorry don’t think u have those info, u are outdated
There is one airline guaranteed to never ban AirTags: United. Every morning Kirby prays Apple will resume buying 50 daily polaris seats to China.
Are u sure u know about other airlines because Emirates has already banned air tags for some time now.
I never understand how Lufthansa stays in business. Yes they have good food on their international flights and let the wine and beer flow freely but they are very inflexible and polite to the point of being rude. That said how are they going to police this? Search all checked bags? Typical German inflexibility and coverup.
Flew Lufthansa Business this summer ARN-FRA-LAX. I was able to track with my AirTag the whole time. Luggage did not make it to LAX. When it finally did, sat for two days without moving. Four days after my arrival, my luggage was delivered. Suitcase and contents felt as though it had been baked in an oven. Needless to say, all my chocolates had melted. We also had to take a bus ride out to the plane where I had a hard time climbing the stairs to embark. After many years as a Lufthansa customer, I will most likely not fly Lufthansa again.
Exactly. We Actually used airpods pro just for that reason once.
So no Apple devices in checked luggage?
Also, in the past the mantra was "all devices with the on/off switch should have switch in the off position". Well, airtags do not have a switch..
My understanding is that they only transmitt when there is a Bluetooth connection close by. So if travellers have phones off during flights this should not be an issue
This is the edict of a very narrow minded middle manager of the company. They are banning a tool that is bought and paid for by their customers which helps them track lost luggage. They should be applauding the forward thinking customers.
Reminds me of the days when the banks would charge extra for banking electronically after the customer had invested in a computer and modem at no cost to the bank.
This brings up an interesting point. You cannot knowingly separate yourself from your bag. But I suppose one could put a bomb in their bag, change their (domestic) flight last minute, and then know which plane the bag ended up on.
Maybe AirTags can have a specific mode where it only transmits when stationary, might need an accelerometer and some intertidal guidance tech though. Then we can turn it on only when flying. Wonder what LH excuse they can use after that.
From an unbelievable 1st class company to a piece of sh*t. An old girlfriend of mine who was an Lufthansa stewardess for over 25 years says that not only have they backed off their promise with retired stewardess but they see when they fly on it how badly it has changed.
Stick to Turkish air and United and be happy! (most of the time)
Does any German-speaker know what Lufthansa translates to? My understanding is it means "the last vestiges of the nazi luftwaffe continue to hide out here". But again, that may not be an exact translation. I do know the nurses from the 'showers' took jobs at stewardesses but that's not related to the name of the airline. For any German person really mad at me and wanting to kick my ass, or sue me, spend that energy foraging for kindling wood to warm your home, you can come get me next year--if you haven't frozen, or started glowing, this winter. Then you'll forget all about me.
They'll know as soon as the passenger tells the Lufthansa employee the location of their lost bags as indicated by the Air Tag. And Lufthansa will then tell the customer that they cannot use the information to find their bags since the Air Tags themselves are against policy. In fact, they may even use this to deny any lost / delayed baggage payment to the customer who is admitting to violating the airline's terms by packing a dis-allowed item in the checked baggage. It's disgraceful.
Have there been any documented safety incidents caused by AirTags stashed inside of checked bags?
Have pilots (and/or their unions) officially taken a position against the use of AirTags based on any inflight incidents that they believe posed a significant risk to operating aircraft safely?
Has testing by reliable safety experts and/or government regulators documented any problems and/or risks to safe operations of aircraft?
These should be the determinative factors.
Thus far, I have not seen published reports indicating the use of AirTags to track checked bags has resulted in any significant risks to operating aircraft safely.
If anyone credibly knows of incidents, that information should be disclosed so that policies can be made based on facts instead of the whims of those in C-Suites seeking to cover their hinterteils for subpar performance!
I use my phone on take-off and landing all the time. The other day I had a signal out of a US airport for 2 mins after take off. On arrival into JFK, you can easily pick up a signal about 30 miles from landing. I've also had my phone not in airplane mode for whole flights. They lie to us constantly.
Do I have to turn off my wireless hearing aids and the Bluetooth on the pacemaker embedded in my body?
i hope someone sues the sh*t outta them and they reverse this idiotic decision.
“While this probably wasn’t the primary initial intent, these have become super popular for checked bags when traveling.”
It absolutely was the intent, when they came out with this product there were 2 accessories sold: keychains and luggage tags.
Absolutely ludacris of Lufthansa. As my flight was delayed by 2 hours and I missed my connecting flight from FRA to MAN. My baby’s stroller never made it to my final destination… it was apparently handed to eagle aviation who have not delivered it 17 days later and counting.
Lufthansa have refused to discuss anything with only telling me they can only email eagle aviation.
Considering I flew business class it is no way acceptable
They are not turned completely off. They never turn off. There's the point right there.
Honestly, I can understand the stance on the ban or requiring them to be turned off. With the ability to set a custom geofence range and have the device use an audible alert when you are out of range. Coming from an IT and security standpoint, that can be dangerous as those settings can be used in a dangerous manner. The issue with luggage handling is bad, but if I get told my electronic device has to be turned off. I'll turn it off for security reasons. Unfortunately we live in a world where bad people will do anything to hurt other people any way possible.
Emirates has had a ban on any smart bags (bags that have GPS, remote locking, battery charger) for a while. Granted AirTags are not GPS devices in that sense.
If it wasn’t for our AirTag recently, there was no way Lufthansa found our bag (took 4 days). In fact two weeks after collecting our bag, Lufthansa sent an apology email saying they still haven’t found our bag.
Lufthansa is now on the black list.
That's a different thing, that's because of the built-in rechargeable lithium battery. Rechargeable lithium batteries that are plugged in aren't allowed in checked-in baggage for a very long time.
https://www.iata.org/contentassets/05e6d8742b0047259bf3a700bc9d42b9/iata-guidance-on-smart-baggage-with-integrated-lithium-batteries-and-electronics.pdf
AirTags are different though, it uses a coin style CR2032 battery that, technically speaking, can explode if you really want them to, but in reality I highly doubt there's any practical safety concerns. And since it's not rechargeable it does not fall under the same rules.
But they are not the rechargeable kind of lithium batteries. Which means those rules don't apply. They are just CR2032. No different to what is used in Remote controls, Calculators, Watches, etc. Dumb watches, not smart. Just as an example - https://www.g-central.com/the-advantages-of-a-g-shock-watch-with-a-cr2032-battery/
They use CR2032 batteries. Tell us you have no idea what you're talking about without telling us you have no idea what you're talking about.
This would never happen cuz the moment the bag is loaded on a plane and the passenger does not board that plane the bag gets offloaded.
An RFID system consists of a tiny radio transponder, a radio receiver and transmitter. When triggered by an electromagnetic interrogation pulse from a nearby RFID reader device, the tag transmits digital data, usually an identifying inventory number, back to the reader. In other words, the RFID literally transmits nothing if they are not near enough to an RFID reader. That's also why it does not need power/battery (at least for passive RFIDs, which are what those baggage tags are).
AirTags on the other hand, are powered, and are actively "broadcasting" a bluetooth signal, so, strictly speaking, they are not the same.
Lufthansa is trying to embarrass themselves. They clearly have no one with even a first year university engineering knowledge or a lick of common sense. Putting aside the technical fail of their statements this is completely unenforceable.
Another reason (amongst many) not to fly Lufthansa. Since the soft and hard product onboard are well below their European competitors, they are now adding the ultimate rule to make sure they offer one of the worst experience from A to Z. I live in NYC and I carefully avoid Newark (hence United) so that will not be a big issue for me. I just feel for people living in a United hub and having to fly to Europe.
For a comment above - the magnetic cover wallets are not transmitting actively and have no battery included, so that’s not really this category
They tell you to turn it off to prevent any possible interference for everyone’s safety, that’s not a lie. Imagine a wrong software update on a phone makes some crazy radio stuff that interferes with the navigation system.. Intentionally ignoring the security insteuctions is selfish and entitled. What’s next, are you going to smoke or open a window during the flight?
Did Lufthansa forget that they have their own electronic bag tags as well? Are they banning those as well?
https://www.lufthansa.com/qa/en/smart-bags
Working at a hotel meant once a week I
Would have to deal with know-it-alls telling me they "knew" they know where their bags were and I had to move heaven and earth for them. "Knowing" that meant they would ask for a ride to "get" their bags. This was so disruptive to everyone, especially the people at the airport who didn't lose the bags in the first place. Let the system work. You won't change it. The people at your destinations airport are doing the best they can and your bag is no more important than a grandma who has never heard of air tags. Sheesh.
AirTags done use Lithium Ion batteries. Regular old lithium watch batters, CR2033 to be specific. Lithium Ion and Lithium Metal (both rechargeable battery types) batteries are the issue, plain Lithium non-rechargeable batteries are not. Are they banning watches in luggage too?
They also don’t have wifi, only Bluetooth. Which then really makes no sense because I can use my BT headset during all phases of flight but a BT device in my luggage is now somehow harmful?
Except the regulations are regarding a Lithium Ion and Lithium Metal rechargeable batteries that have the potential for runaway reactions due to their chemistry. Non-rechargeable Lithium watch batteries do not have this risk and if you ban AirTags in luggage citing this as your reason you’d also have to ban watches in luggage which last I checked also don’t turn off.
LH and all airlines should encourage the use of locator tags, not discourage it. Their own systems clearly aren't as sophisticated, or bags wouldn't get lost as much.
Instead, Apple should allow the TagID to be shared with the airline (controlled by owner), so they can integrate it into their tracking Ng system and make sure the bag makes it to it's intended destination.
You are correct. As a person that has a degree in electrical engineering, and was also an airline mechanic (avionics not A&P) prior to college, the signals don't interfere. I remember when they didn't even want you listening to music on takeoff and landing
Airtags can be easily found/detected by LH or anyone else. Apple has an anti-stalking app called Tracker Detect which will find airtags that have been away from their owners bluetooth device for 15 minutes. It makes the tag play a sound.
Interesting. They specify that those tags are ok because they have alkaline batteries, the lithium content is minimal.
This seems to apply to more than Airtags. I use Smart Tags, and even though it doesn't mention them in the article, the justification they use for not allowing Airtags, would apply to any tracking tags on the market.
They use passive rfid which is not a problem because it has no battery and doesn’t transmit.
Air rags in checked luggage is only one threat to airlines! Their customer satisfaction report so I believe that Lufthansa has become so Woke that they have now become fearful of the flying public! When a company fails to provide a quality service as expected the buyers must
often take charge to provide for their own security over their property!
I'll stop putting an Airtag in my luggage when they stop losing my luggage, seems fair
The rule for turning off cell-phones and other electronics does not make sense to me. I know that airlines don't want people actually talking loudly on their phones for any part of a flight (most of us don't want that). But, as an electrical engineer, I have to ask: what part of the transmission circuitry of a cellphone is actually... dangerous??? Do they mean to say that if my phone is left on and accidentally stumbled onto the right frequency or output code that some critical piece of airline electronics could fail and cause a disaster? Hope the bad guys don't find out about that (tongue in cheek).
My guess: the electroincs-off rule makes everyone on board feel comfortable that someone is doing something to make things safer even though it probably just a placebo. Now, one airline has found a fun way to use the rule their perceived advantage.
Are airtags a security threat? If not what's the harm? Or they fear their mismanagement getting exposed.
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- National consumer associations - for advice on problems in the country where you live
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Ah and here we see the blood sucking leech that is an administrator for Lufthansa
I thought they would go down the fire hazard trail on this. They haven't seemed to account for the many airtags in carry on bags. I have one in my backpack and one on my car keychain. Do I have to turn those off. What about my Apple watch or Garmin devices. Just remember this rule making pr stuff when they virtue signal climate change, transgender topics etc. It's all just bs and fluff.
Akos, the signals do not interfere. It is a complete and total load of crap. I never turn off my phone through hundreds of flights and refuse to do so. Stop being an ignorant sheep. There needs to be an actual reason for a "rule" otherwise they can stuff that rule where the loght doesn't shine.
Eagle is a general courier for most airlines. Therein lies the problem as they don’t have sufficient staff. You can call them and
if you buy a replacement LH sd reimburse you
They “may”, not necessarily will. Rather the vast majority being sensible, rather than the idiot following his flock causing disruption
What an idiotic and offensive statement. Comparing anything with the Holocaust as you did, is unbelievably stupid. I guess your am American Republican or similar clown
I'm curious to see how Lufthansa enforces this. If I'm doing a multi-airline flight with (say) Delta and Lufthansa, then how exactly is this to be enforced? OTOH, shouldn't Apple be certifying these as "acceptable for air flight use" through IATA or some such organisation? Why must passengers pay the price? Won't work in the auto industry if something is banned for use inside the car - the vendor has to pay to un-ban it not the consumer.
It sounds to me like Lufthansa has not upgraded their in flight telemetry systems in over a decade. If they are at all concerned about signal traffic then they must be using antiquated radios operating on obsolete frequencies. Every other major carrier has changed communications frequencies or adopted satellite based telemetry systems for their planes. Congrats Lufthansa, you managed to play the dirtbag game…
Mobile phones do not need to be turned off in the cabin, just in flight mode. Mobile phones in the US transmit on similar frequencies to TCAS, so may interfere.
I had a watch which became very hot, probably due to an internal short circuit. If it was packed in baggage it could conceivably starred a fire.
Perhaps air tags etc. need a possibility to turn them off for a specific period of time i.e. a few hours passed expected landing.
If the bag is in that airport then it's exactly the people there that lost it!
And while some individuals may be doing the best they can within the system, but the system is clearly broken, and most of the airlines won't fix it (invest in solutions) without noise being made.
What about air tags in the cabin?
Are we not allowed to have an AirTag on our kids?
This seems disingenuous- and won’t fly (pun intended).
Given AirTags use the same batteries as a quartz watches, it’s pretty obvious they are looking to escape the responsibility of taking proper care of passengers bags in the manner they should. What happens when a passenger’s bag originates on a codeshare airline? How are they going to police their own policy?
The AirTag process for me is to- 1. Put it in a hard case (Pelican makes some good ones) then 2. Put it inside a shoe in my suitcase then 3. Shove a pair of socks into the shoe so it stays there. So IMO pretty well and securely buried inside my suitcase.
Not necessarily on US domestic flights. I’ve had United voluntarily uncouple me from my checked bags when we were trying to stand by on an earlier flight during IRROPS.
This is mostlikely a move to avoid liability. On just about every commercial flight are tracking devices, tracking location, shock, humidity and temperature while on board. They work and record continuously and then upload even it’s data to the cloud, many are GSM enabled. So where is LH‘s logic as they even offer this tracking service themselves. This is how Pharma and semiconductor industry tracks shipment exceptions.
“@Lucky: Another decision this week follows the same line. They decided to restrict the rebooking on Classic and Flex (!) fare families. The change to Flex fares (making them unflex, actually) is the last nail into the coffin.”
Andy, may I ask where you heard this?
I’m having this same problem *right now,* and started a discussion on this over on FT about it, and I don’t think anyone knows about this.
Of course their intent is not pure……of course it is because they don’t want passengers being able to track their lost items!!! No doubt about it.
So LH doesn't want you to know just where your luggage is. "Just trust us." Anyone with this attitude obviously is not to be trusted... Not very good optics.
Unless they plan on dedicating staff too checking with an app, good luck to them stopping people. Id put two in all my bags just for spite.
I have a family member at Air Canada who state they will remove your bag if they see an air tag without you knowing until you arrive and wonder where your bag is. Air Canada another useless outfit.
AirTags are either a safety issue or they are not. If they are a safety issue, then logically there’s no difference between a Lufthansa plane and any other planes, and AirTags should be banned on all planes. If they are a safety issue, data should be provided to support that claim. I doubt an airline like JetBlue would bother to ban them because a) they aren’t a safety risk and b) that airline sends you messages about your luggage status much in the same fashion fedex and ups send tracking status.
They are afraid of pax actually knowing where their bags are and the incompetence of Lufthansa! MORONS!!
I think this only adds to the list of complaints that passengers have against airlines. If passengers cannot rely on airlines to get their checked bags, an added cost for most passengers, to their destinations as contracted by the airline, then they need to let passengers use whatever means are necessary to track their bags since it appears that the airlines are unable to do so.
American Airlines recently lost my luggage. After 4 months they informed me that I cannot get reimbursement for items lost that are over $100 dollars unless I have a receipt. I had electronic equipment $1800 in the luggage that I got nothing for as I did not have receipt. They said too bad and closed the search. This is after delivered to my house was someone else baggage that they thought was mine. I had to bring it back to the airport and tell them it was not mine. Wish I had the airtag in the luggage. From now on I will be tagging anything I check.
I guess Lufthansa lost the memo, that freight forwarders and the industry partners already use Bluetooth tags to track assets (cargo, pallets, etc). I guess next LH will be alienating their cargo customers too. "Hey there DB Schenker, we don't want your millions of € in revenue from cargo business if you will be tracking the location of your freight"
Morons.. It's not enough for them to have the bad publicity from delayed baggage situation,now they draw even more attention to themselves... Plus how in the whole world wide world are they going to stop it???
What is the source of this story? I couldn’t find any announcement by Lufthansa about banning Airtags and, since they don’t have lithium batteries, they don’t fall under any category of dangerous goods listed on their website.
AirTags use an alkaline watch cell, very different from a lithium rechargeable. No fire risk. They also do not actively transmit to anyone, they only reply to beacons from idevices, so Lufthansa is full of crap and desperately trying to avoid blame for stealing/losing bags, only.
Just flew lufthansa for the 8th time since 8/20 all with 2 checked bags and golf clubs all j class and all3 bags with air tags never asked once by lufthansa ( and they never lost a bag and every flight had a reasonable time delivery of luggage
examples
Yyz- Fra-vie
Muc-Fra-Jnb
Jnb-Fra-Muc
Lca-Muc and so on
Complete and utter BS, and also unenforceable. We were also told planes would crash if our phones were not in airplane mode, or we used a tablet before reaching cruising altitude. My tags will remain in my bags in useful mode thanks.
Mom used to make us wait 30 minutes after eating before we could go swimming too.
Given a choice I certainly wouldn't fly with this airline if they do indeed ban airtags (in my case I have smart tags, the Samsung version). If they were more responsible with our luggage we wouldn't have to worry where it is!
A further reason to avoid LH whenever possible. I say this as a German living in Frankfurt, but knowing their indifferent service I'd rather fly with BA or others when given the choice.
Given that airlines are irresponsible and don’t care about lost luggage, I’ll avoid this airline. I use Gego and the unit turns off when the plane is in the air, then turns back on when it’s not moving. I want to know where my bag is at all times.
Lufthansa will not win. They will engender a new type of device that conforms to the requirement not to transmit while on the airplane. Like a delayed transmit when the device does not show up for reset after a flight. Stupid move that will ruin their market.
LH (and others) should see the business opportunity of using airline air tags Stick one on each checked piece - next to the scanner bars. Partner with Apple or a competitor or devise their own. It would be a major PR win.
Excellent. This from the country (via Lufthansa) that gave us customer safety and peace of mind in the form of privacy laws that inhibited action regarding known mentally unstable aircrew (Germanwings Flight 9525). I’ve never had the pleasure of a Lufthansa experience but if I do at some stage in the future I’ll look forward to meeting their new employee “Poseidon” as he instructs the ocean (of Air Tags) to “go away”.
In the meantime, a Mark 2 Air Tag that the registered “keeper” could instruct to switch off between given date/time parameters would appear to get over the “flying” phase difficulties, and a vigorous social media campaign might discourage this airline and others from excessively “politically correct, company motivated” safety campaigns. I look forward to impartial comment from those with greater technical knowledge on this subject.
airtags don’t actually transmit any data. they are passive devices that are searchable by an ios device attached to cellular. they don’t transmit GPS, they don’t send out a signal. (technically)
they have about as much danger as leaving a flashlight on in your baggage
Luft being dumb as usual
Doesn’t surprise me. Lufthansa has all kinds of rules. My wife was in business and I was in economy. She carried hand cream from the amenities kit into economy to give me as she knows my hands get very dry. A flight attendant stopped her stating that what you receive in business stays in business. There was no concept that Lufthansa no longer owns the product, as my wife paid for the hand cream as part of the business class fare.
Recently I traveled from Honolulu to Singapore on Korean Airlines. My friend’s bag arrived at baggage claim more than an hour after the flight landed, but mine did not. Fortunately, I had an Airtag in it, showing my bag was at the airport. The Korean Air lost luggage representative took 90 minutes to return it to me from a storage area, and we finally left the airport at 3 am. Why it was in a storage area is a mystery!
Until these tags are banned, I will continue to put one in my checked bag.
I feel that they don't want people to regain their lost luggage because they're using a finders keepers losers weepers attitude I consider by banning people being able to track where their luggage is going who knows maybe the airline is making profits off of all the Lost luggages that they have. Probably selling all the stuff on eBay
I'm surprised that LH didn't say , "Due to passenger demand, we are banning Air Tags".
I just traveled by Lufthansa with the air tags. I was disappointed by the flight attendants’ service. Also after having gone through the Istanbul airport and through their thorough checkpoints we had to go through the same while connecting in Frankfurt. We never stepped out of the airport and had directly gone to the gate, yet had to go through security checkpoints and open our carry on baggage. Not flying Lufthansa again.
They aren't passive - AirTags actively transmit a bluetooth signal every 2 seconds.
With that said we aren't required to turn off bluetooth from other devices while flying.
It seems you empathize more with grandmas. If you were stuck in a hotel away from home without your luggage then you can make a comparison. People have to board cruises without any luggage because the airlines have lost them. They do not care nor will they reimburse you unless you have receipts for everything. Unless you put yourself into the shoes of people who have lost their luggage you cannot make this kind of unfeeling comment.
AirTags use a CR 2032 lithium battery.
However, the IATA rules say that checked "smart luggage" can contain lithium batteries containing less than 0.3 g of lithium metal. The CR 2032 lithium battery from Duracell contains 0.1 g of lithium.
On the other hand the IATA rules also say that tracking devices must be shut off during flight. Silly, since other Bluetooth devices are allowed throughout flight on most airlines.
Bluetooth or RFID?
To be fair, those are different: RFIDs do not have their own power source at all
Pacemakers and other medical devices transmit too. Pretty sure it's illegal to discriminate due to electronic device...
The main question is whether air tags have any potential whatsoever to interfere with navigational devices in the cockpit.n
Wouldn't surprise me to see these a*holes use a device to find air tags and purposefully pull the luggage if it contains one.
My hearing aids are portable electronic devices. Is Luftstansa going after them next?
Lufthansa lost my bags when I changed flights - landing in Gate 34 and Boarding on Gate 35 - terminal C in Frankfurt. Arrived in Cairo with missing luggage which didn’t turn up for 3 days. The business class I. Lufthansa was a joke - basically the same seats as Economy, instead they leave the middle seat unoccupied. I would love to avoid them AirTags or not.
Thought: pacemakers- they can communicate remotely now via cell towers. It is electrically powered technically, what of those?
i've flown all over the world many times. only once has my baggage been lost - by lufthansa.
They can't actually do this as another commenter has stated. Also why give airlines ideas? This article was unnecessary.
I think they should be banned. However, airlines should do a better job of tracking list luggage.
Why don't airlines use a similar technology to attach to your luggage. Then remove them at the baggage claim
Disclaimer: I'm not a techie and know nothing about airtags, so, with that in mind, here is my dummy question:
What's the problem? Couldn't you just put the airtags in your luggage, track it until your flight begins, then turn it off until you reach your destination? Then, after you deplane, turn it back on as you make your way to the baggage retrieval area?
Lufthansa is a terrible airline, they treat their passangers like cargo not people.
Air Canada and Qatar airlines lost our luggage in Heathrow airport. It was never scanned in. With out the AirTags in our luggage I don’t think we ever would have found it as they also put the wrong numbers on the the lost luggage form
If they can be turned off.. then keep them off until the plane lands..THEN, once the plane lands, and is on the ground, turn them on.. if they cannot be turned on, then Apple, should "update" the software which controls them for the units to be turned *on/off* through control on the cell phone.. just like turning *Airplane mode* on/off.. period.
Lufthansa really is an unfriendly bad airline that I will not be flying on anytime soon
You had to go through security again because you transited from a 3rd country (outside of the EU) into the Schengen States. Not only were you screened again, but so was your luggage and any cargo that you may have had.
It is simply that Lufthansa is the only airline not afraid of Apple. The other airlines and the FAA are afraid to upset Apple. LH is entirely right here to ban it until it has been demonstrated that airtags cannot interfer with airplanes critical safety items.
Maybe one single Airtag wouldn’t pose a serious threat to the aircraft systems, but imagine 200 of them…
You’re one person. Even though you have a degree in electrical engineering and might be mostly correct, the FAA has access to much more data and information than an individual, even though highly educated. One of the things that we were taught as flight attendants is it’s not necessarily that one cell phone it in airplane mode would do any harm but if there was no rule and 150 passengers all were sending and receiving a signal/texts etc. at the same time, that could cause a problem. So that’s the reason for the airplane mode rule.
good thing im in the samsung ecosystem, hope they dont ban samsungs's smarttags since my gf and i will be flying them this fall
Unfortunately this article is not true, Lufthansa said so in a statement when asked about the supposed ban.
Airtags are proving that airlines’ handling of the bags could be really bad. Before you couldn’t see or did anything, now is totally the opposite and airlines are exposed for their lack of control. Apple should step up and give an expert opinion that provides weight to the contrary. Airlines should take this as an opportunity to improve their systems.
So if I was to place an electronic wrist watch into my checking baggage will this be required to also be switched off??? After all it is an electronic device with a battery. Now try telling everyone to remove batteries from their wrist watches or to switch them off on boarding. Lufthansa needs to wake up and just do their jobs properly. Simply that.
I just flew Lufthansa internationally and had an AirTag in my bag. It sat at the airport for 3 days - I could see where it was- and I completed a lost bag claim. They claimed it was still not found when I could see it was on the bag claim area. It finally showed up 4 days later. The rep even asked me if I had an AirTag like she was agitated. This policy is not legit and not fair to the consumer. I will no longer be flying Lufthansa.
Well that’s really dumb since ithe AirTags only work if an active Iphone is near them. So they are not transmitting when in the belly of the plane.
I've seen videos where people have sent them all over the world and they kept transmitting.
That's not how they work. They only transmit when within range of Apple device, and then only bluetooth… which IS allowed in-flight, at least in the US.
But the iPhone needs to know it is nearby. Therefore it does need to broadcast its ID on a regular basis.
From what I read, it seems like they haven’t specifically banned them, but also said they are already regulated by ICAO. It seems like they are trying to hide behind ICAO to prevent public blowback.
Only the UWB radio would need to be disabled. The Bluetooth function likely could still stay on, as most (if not all) countries allow Bluetooth to be used in all phases of flight.
Many pacemakers don’t transmit, or if they do it is over Bluetooth, which has been proven safe.
They use (non-rechargable) lithium cell batteries. Very technically (per ICAO, FAA, etc.), these are allowed in checked baggage, but must be deactivated. The only way to deactivate them is to remove the battery, which then the battery must be placed in the carry-on luggage as it is a spare lithium battery.
Because the air tags are probably lithium battery powered there is possibly a potential thermal runaway problem.
I seem to recall that the capacity of the battery comes into play (below a certain mAh) before there is serious hazard so maybe one should cut a little slack unless more research is done?
They are just applying a real requirement in a very narrow context. Technically, devices in checked bags that have lithium batteries can be transported, but must be disabled.
By the way, bag tracking is done by using the barcode on your bag (or maybe in rare cases RFID, which only contains a passive device).
In short, no, at least in its current design. It would require the device to include GPS and be much, much more complicated. The battery life would be measured in days, and would certainly would be banned across the board (as smart bags were a few years ago).
They are allowed in the cabin. The rule that Lufthansa is trying to use is in regards to electronics in checked baggage.
The problem is, you likely wouldn't have the chance to turn it back on. Or off, for that matter. The range of AirTags is pretty low, and I'd wager there would be interference between the cargo area and passenger. This also assumes your luggage made it onto your flight to begin with. If airlines would focus their efforts on reliable baggage handling, there would be no reason to put an AirTag in there to begin with.
hello Lufthansa employee - its 225 mah. I appreciate that they double down on being a garbage company
It must be shameful for Lufthansa having the customers telling them where their bags are while they are unable to locate it!! I personally lost my bag in Frankfurt and remember how upset Lufthansa reps got every time I told them that I could see my bag at the airport on terminal C!!!!! Yet, it was with the help of the airtag that it was located!!!
If u combine all of their batteries into a single one, but that is not the case…
I flew Lufthansa in business from Dammam to Frankfurt, then 1st class to Miami and they still lost my luggage!!!!
But peacemakers go in the cabin not in the cargo bay. Here their argument is putting batteries in the cargo
Another brilliant move of LH management to make their customers move to turkish or the gulf carriers.
If they continue like this they will end up like pan am or twa. Just a memory from the past.
What about wearables such as wrist watches? Are they not the same? Today's wearables are a lot more powerful than an AirTag. Absolute nonsense on behalf of Lufthansa, utterly idiotic. Watch the movie "Those Magnificent men and their Flying machines", an absolute lough on everything and everybody including that on the Germans. I love Lufthansa!
What about wearables such as wrist watches? Are they not the same? Today's wearables are a lot more powerful than an AirTag. Absolute nonsense on behalf of Lufthansa, utterly idiotic. Watch the movie "Those Magnificent men and their Flying machines", an absolute lough on everything and everybody including that on the Germans. I love Lufthansa!
Lufthansa is little better than a third rate bus company. It’s a shame. Before COVID, they were reasonably reliable.
And yet another person who blindly follows the rule and regulation without any understanding and make complains when logic comes before rules.
Just like 2nd amendment doesn't mean they are taking your guns away, nor do they mean you should own a gun.
Wearable are fine on person because, unlike some of those electronics in checked bags, when your lithium batteries on your wrist catches fire you put it out before the whole plane catches fire and crash.
I bet that Apple can easily add a feature to the AirTag app that allows it to stop transmitting for a certain number of hours such as 8, 16 or 24. That will solve this problem! . Also, AirTags use BLE (Bluetooth low energy) communication and the power level of the transmission is extremely low.
I had the worst experience with Lufthansa. I won’t fly ever again even if it’s free with that Airline. I got missed connection,2x delayed flight, bogus meal voucher (zero money) and missed luggage.My assumption is Lufthansa is banning the AirTags since travelers are getting savvy and they can locate their check in luggage and Lufthansa doesn’t want the travelers know why their luggage location. And Lufthansa DOES NOT PAY FOR THEIR FAILED SERVICE,DESPITE WHAT THE EU. CUSTOMER PROTECTION SAYS IN BLACK AND WHITE.
IM ALSO WONDERING WHY NO ONE NEWS EXPOSING THE LOUSY WAY LUFTHANSA WORKS THEY SHOULD BE BANNED FLYING ANYWHERE IF THEY DONT CHANGE THEIR ATTITUDE AND PRACTICES.
It appears that Lufthansa is backtracking on this ban.
https://9to5mac.com/2022/10/10/lufthansa-not-banning-airtags-claiming-otherwise/amp/
Air tags use standard replaceable CR2032 batteries, same as in your car key fob, kitchen scale, smaller remote controls, etc. with a capacity usually about a tenth of an AA battery. A traveling alarm clock is probably much more dangerous in your bag.
This morning LH changed its course. Allegedly they requested the opinion of the German FAA, who see no problem. So with immediate effect active AirTags are allowed on LH flights as well.
The entire procedure was a typical example of German fear of failure. Customers? Who cares?!