Bilt is cutting its Bilt-to-Hyatt points transfer ratio from 1:1 to 4:3 starting January 2027, following a similar Chase Ultimate Rewards devaluation.
No surprise to me (been calling out these concerns for a while; in fact, I'm concerned Chase will pull a Citi and either directly or indirectly demand exclusivity on Hyatt transfers soon enough).
But, it might be a surprise to all the BILT sycophants, who will somehow have a great PR talking-point on how Hyatt isn't a key transfer partner (no, no... we're just there for Alaska, which certainly won't be devalued by BofA's influence, or United, see Chase again.) Anyway, dear shills, I eagerly await your personal attacks.
As for Hyatt, more broadly, yeesh, the hits keep coming; the redemption devaluations from earlier this year; the continued delays on a actual premium credit card product (looks like Chase-IHG is getting a head start on that for 2027 before Chase-Hyatt is doing anything). Not great, fellas.
I have gotten a lot of value from the BILT Palladium in one year. Signup bonus, both $200 hotel credits, 3x per dollar on $5000 of spend, and then maybe 15,000 in points that I would never have gotten elsewhere due to my mortgage payments.
I also transferred the bulk of my points to BA with a 60% bonus, which is higher than anything I could have gotten on Chase/Amex/Citi.
So you don't need to be a 'sycophant' to find the card valuable. It'll be worth keeping for another year I think, but I'll evaluate
James_K, I wasn't thinking of you in-particular, but you should already know that BILT 1.0 was a lot easier, simpler, generally cost less, and had most of the same transfer partners.
I, too, received 'value' from nearly every card I've ever had. However, whether that 'value' improves or not, over time, is another story, and varies wildly depending on the product, issuer, etc. I still hope BILT will stick-around for the long-haul, make some further improvements, and not devalue any further (though, with Hyatt, it seems they are.)
While Bilt 2.0 objectively had a disastrous rollout, the underlying products remain 'useful' for many (myself included). However, unlike some on these sites, I'm willing to speak-out when I see room for improvement. Specifically, I'd like to see more Accelerators for Palladium, but I probably won't get my wish. Like others, I remain concerned about a glut of expiring Bilt Cash and not enough ways to use it; yet, also I'm happy with Blade and Blacklane finally added to Bilt Cash redemptions. New transfer partners like Amtrak are also nice.
Anyway, glad the BILT to BA stuff worked out for you, regardless. Enjoy 'evaluating' paying your $495 renewal annual fee next year.
Yeah you know how it is - just be ruthlessly self-interested. Use the card if it's worth it to you, cut it if it isn't, and don't become a fanboy of a company -- any company -- since they don't care about you
everyone keep me in your thoughts today i have to admit that 1990 was actually right
anyway this is not super surprising but also this is going to crush their renewal rates when everyones palladium comes up in february/march. This now confirms my decision to cancel. Been a great year, will earn about 295k points in total between SUB/spend/mortgage/rakuten which is amazing for one card. Alas no point in holding it long term now
Here's the irony: Folks may think I'm "Bilt Enemy #1," but even I may still renew (especially if there's a retention offer). My only ask: I'd just like to see more options for gluts of expiring Bilt Cash. Like, if Ankur/Kerr remove B$ expiration (or add a few extra Accelerators for Palladium, even if they charges B$400 instead of B$200, like he increased the level-up for Amtrak in today's Oct 1 bonus), I'm still down-to-clown for a bit longer. Yeah, this new Hyatt devaluation is a low-blow for that brand (I donno whether to blame Bilt or Hyatt or Chase, more. All the above?). Still, if they keep Alaska and United at 1:1, there's still real value on the line there. I know some gawk over JAL, (or BA, like James, below). Great. Cool, too.
Were people really holding this card solely for the purpose of Hyatt transfers?
Oh, dear Chris... nice attempted insertion of plausible deniability. But, but... you said "solely"... uh oh... got'em... Yes, Hyatt transfers at 1:1 were a major selling point (regardless of Rent Day bonus, which there have been none for Hyatt so far). Also, American Airlines (before Citi secured exclusivity), Alaska (while BofA still allows it), and United (while Chase still allows it) were the main high-value, unique transfers. Sure, there were bonuses for JAL, BA, FlyingBlue, etc. that others found useful. Everyone's gonna have their own opinions and preferences.
I’ve made a few speculative transfers from Bilt to WOH anticipating this happening at some point- but along those lines I’m surprised/impressed they gave 3 months notice.
For all the crap we give Bilt, we can at least give them recognition for giving us 3 months notice on this. Not unheard of for programs to give little to no notice of these changes.
In economics, it's called price leadership. If a competitor does X, you do X.
In antitrust law, it's called signaling and it's illegal under both the Sherman and Clayton Acts, not that there is anyone enforcing those anymore.
This also means you cannot trust the banks that after you paid the annual fee that you will actually get the advertised benefits that you thought you paid for for one year.
Certainly a disappointment. I basically divested from Chase (downgraded from CSR to CSP and divested my remaining points to Hyatt before the CSP deval) because the CSR credits suck relative to AMEX Platinum and they had no exclusive partners of note. Guess that's now changed to some extent.
So far I've only transferred Bilt points to Hyatt (small amounts as needed). Will have to decide if I want to do a speculative transfer before the end of the year. As for Chase, this is not going to convince me to go back to their ecosystem.
This is why 4:3 other than CSR feels like a Chase decision not a Hyatt/Bilt decision - trying to get folks who are invested in Hyatt to keep the CSR. Obviously didn't work with you, but so many folks in that ecosystem who love Hyatt, so I could see it working with some.
Count me as one who also loves Hyatt (after ignoring it for years), but I don't love it enough to want to upgrade back to CSR (at least not yet). If they improve the Edit hotels to be more competitive with FHR/THC, then my math will change, but man it was such a pain to use.
The Edit is just not good and is so inflated. I got one OK stack with the $250 IHG credit and figured that was good enough for the year. Chase's own CSR magazine the other week marketed to do one Edit stack with the IHG stack with the general $300 off travel stack and you get $800 so you get your AF back with one trip. The marketing without that credit is going to be brutal.
But the CSR is primarily about access to CSR lounges, which remain excellent. So if folks want to drop the CSR so that I can get into LGA TB CSR lounge faster, that works for me for now, I guess.
I just could never get excited about any particular hotel chain and I'd rather spend my points on air travel. Decent hotels are all about the same - I care much more about individual properties and their specific location, and in most cities there are lots of properties that I would consider staying at. I don't really value big breakfasts. I just want a good cup of coffee and perhaps a pastry, and I can get that out in the world.
Whether I have an extra 100 square feet in the room - eh, it's nice sometimes, but not essential. Having a few extra square feet on a plane though...
I was able to use the Edit credit 3 times (one of the stacking w/ the other $250 credit) before my increased AF hit, though one of them was buying my brother and sister-in-law a room at the same hotel in Istanbul I was in. But that experience soured me on it.
Thankfully I have Sapphire Lounge access without CSR using the Ritz-Carlton card. As long as Chase continues to include access I'm in no rush to go back to CSR.
Still don't get the Bilt pitch to get people to sign up in Q4 - "here's all this Bilt Cash! Just uh... we're going to take it all away from you as soon as you get it. But don't worry, it's mostly monopoly money?"
Seriously. This is the real issue that they are simply ignoring, and it’s gonna bite even more than this disappointing devaluation with Hyatt.
Hoping to hear information on this supposed Premium Hyatt CC soon.
You and me both. Been waiting years and years for Hyatt to get its act together on that. Feels like it’s too little too late at this point. IHG just leapfrogged Hyatt by updating its cards yet again in a few years. Hyatt’s just been devaluing left and right this year instead. Oof.
So the real question after this drop is....how long will CSR remain at 1:1 or will they kill that too.
I guess I'll be transferring all of my points out before the end of the year to either Alaska or Hyatt, and consider closing my Bilt Palladium next year.
It's a shame since I've been a Bilt Platinum for 3 years in a row. I guess now I have more reason to put more spend on the Atmos Summit card and try for Platinum status there.
Good strategic pivot! Atmos Summit 3x on rent up to $50K through Bilt’s platform in a calendar year has been a great way to earn up to 150K Atmos points and spend 5/6ths of the way toward the $60K in a cardmember year to earn the Atmos 100K Global Certificate.
I can really see abandoning the Hyatt loyalty program all together and going to another where elite status and points are easier to get. I recently opened a Bilt card and will now have to use the points for their airline programs that provide more value.
(Recent opened one? Sheesh, what took you so long… all BILT sycophants were all supposed to have them back in February… guess you missed the memo. Next, tell us how it’s a “points earning machine.”)
So the real question after this drop is....how long will CSR remain at 1:1 or will they kill that too.
It seems like some folks have not yet received the memo informing the masses that all value proposition went out of UR to WoH points transfers when, following WoH's brutal devaluation, the costs of top-end awards jumped to as high as 75K points/night to numerically rival the costs of IHG and Marriott awards. What that means is that even 1:1 transfers of UR points to WoH points make as much sense as 1:1 transfers to IHG or Marriott points, which are universally considered to not be worth it.
Transfers of Chase UR points to WoH points never made much sense to me before, as I felt that using highly coveted transferable points to book hotel award stays was a huge waste, but at least the transfers were favorable when top-end WoH award costs were numerically low costs (better when they were capped at 35K, and still okay when capped at 45K). If you would not transfer UR points to IHG or Marriott points, why would you transfer them to WoH points even 1:1 at the jacked-up costs of high-end WoH awards since the devaluation? Inquiring minds wanna know!
i love how you dont even really engage with this site much anymore unless its just to spout incorrect math and then leave lol. respect!!!!!
i love how you dont even really engage with this site much anymore unless its just to spout incorrect math and then leave lol. respect!!!!!
The stupid and inane comment is Exhibit A for why I opt not to "engage with this site much anymore."
The canvas is large and clean. How about using it to factually support the inanity that I "just spout incorrect math and then leave"?
@1990_ DCS is definitely wrong. Having never previously bought hotel points, I recently acquired some Hyatt points at 2.08 cents and got great value from them, and I'm considering a further top-up before that price disappears. Not to mention that a night paid for with Hyatt points is much more rewarding in terms of,
a) earning milestones;
b) eligibility for other offers; and, for many,
c) earning status
than a night paid for with points from any of the other chains.
I've seen many comments complaining about WoH's direction. Maybe there's some justification there, but it's still far and away the best program of any hotel chain.
@mickyb, I think DCS's point above is that WoH has undergone painful devaluations recently (those higher 75K categories are brutal), and that transfers are worsening (from 1:1 to 4:3, a 25% loss); on that, we all can and should agree (it's not an improvement.)
If you and others are still finding outsized value, personally, with any of these programs, that's wonderful. I'll admit that there are still sweet spots with each of them. If even with the devaluations and transfer reductions, if you still find Hyatt better than Marriott, Hilton, IHG, Accor, etc., as a program, that's fine, too, but the math and mileage is gonna vary for most.
@1990_ while everyone refers to it as such, it's not clear to me that the Hyatt award chart changes were a "devaluation". Cat 1, 2, 3, 5 and 6 all got cheaper at the bottom end. Nerdwallet carried out a thorough analysis and left their valuation unchanged at 1.8cpp.
There is a tendency, when judging the value of points, to ignore other aspects of the program beyond the cost of the room. Unlocking Hyatt milestones and Globalist status has value, and, currently, any three-night Hyatt stay awards 3k points. Including these factors in one's calculations can have a big impact.
@mickyb Personally, I wouldn't rely on Nerdwallet (or TPG) for valuations of any kind these days.
As @DCS pointed out, the reason people started calling hotel transfers a waste is when the top-end started hitting that 75K+ bracket. The opportunity cost is the real killer. You can occasionally land a TATL or TPAC lie-flat seat for those kinds of mileage rates with a well-timed airline transfer.
That stings most for the aspirational properties. Sure, not everyone needs a Park Hyatt or an Alila. But when nearly every decent US Cat 1–4 property quietly creeps up to Cat 5 (Grand Hyatt SFO comes to mind), you feel that inflation directly. *waving goodbye to the WOH card* (seriously, Chase needs to get on them for an actual premium card. Way overdue.)
Look, if your travel style lives in the low-end sweet spots (under 10K/night) and you're pumping out status milestones, Hyatt may still work well. Loud and clear. For everyone else eating the higher rates and worsening transfer ratios, the loss is just too big to ignore.
@1990_ Yes, what you say is perfectly reasonable, but it's very different to some of the claims DCS made in his first comment that I took issue with.
I think we've kind of come at this backwards so far. In my circumstances, it's very clear that Hyatt has the best loyalty program, and IHG has the second best; so I choose to stay in their hotels, *then* decide whether paying with points represents good value. I imagine most do similarly.
I feel that the backlash against Hyatt's recent changes is disproportionate given they are still by far the most generous chain when it comes to those doing 60+nights per year. Given their milestones, stay bonuses, and the perks of Globalist status, I would recommend that anyone who can reach 60 nights without going too far out of their way give serious consideration to making Hyatt their primary chain, but I understand that their smaller footprint will make that impractical for many.
My hope was that the new award chart, which allows more control over pricing for peak dates, would lead to some Hyatts dropping a category in the next reshuffle, including some back into range for the 1-4 FNV. However, the worsening transfer ratios make me doubt this - it sounds like WoH are reducing the amount they pay per point to the card companies, so it wouldn't be a surprise if they are also intending to pay less per point to their hotels.
Btw, some of TPG's valuations look quite wrong to me, e.g. Virgin at 1.5 cents. NW figures roughly match my personal valuations. There was also an interesting article on NW showing that Hyatt points tend to show better returns on cheaper properties, which I guess makes sense given our differing views on their value. I can't find the article now, unfortunately.
Sorry, I was half asleep when I wrote that.
Hyatt are likely demanding more per point from the card companies, which may increase the chances of hotels dropping a category. Fingers crossed!
DCS is definitely wrong. Having never previously bought hotel points,
With those blinders firmly on, how can you possibly know when or if anyone is wrong?
I used to buy WoH points all the time when they were sold with a 40% or 30% bonus; stopped when the bonuses went below 30%, where they have remained. Moreover, paid Hyatt stays are definitely not more rewarding than any other program's, especially given point #2 below.; they are just more expensive.
The evidence that WoH is in a fast race to the bottom is quite clear and incontrovertible:
1. WoH awards now cost up 75K points/night, i.e., 67% higher than before the brutal devaluation, and within the range of IHG/Marriott award costs
2. WoH has not at all improved program members' base earn rate to rival the levels of IHG One or Bonvoy members, making the new WoH top-end award costs less affordable than for IHG/Marriott members with higher base earn rates.
3. 1:1 transfers of UR points to IHG/Marriott points are generally discouraged because of the high numerical costs of the awards, which exactly is where WoH award costs landed after the program's brutal devaluation.
4. Putting it all together, 1:1 transfers of UR points to WoH points are no longer the panacea that they were once thought be, with some justification.
Bottom line: Anyone who continues to sing the old tune about how 1:1 transfers of UR points to WoH points are wonderful does not play the game with a "full deck".
G'day.
"What that means is that even 1:1 transfers of UR points to WoH points make as much sense as 1:1 transfers to IHG or Marriott points"
@DCS this doesn't follow from your previous sentence. You can't consider one extreme scenario and judge the whole system from it (and I question your data regardless - there are IHG rooms costing 500k points and Hilton rooms well into the millions).
I will ask you to consider the other extreme of the Hyatt award chart - rooms at 3k points per night. According to rooms.aero, there are roughly 2,000 times more room nights on offer at 3k than at 75k, making it far more practically relevant.
What kind of room can you get for 3k points with any of the other schemes? Would such a stay be eligible for offers along the lines of Hyatt's "stay 3 nights, earn 3k points"? Would it potentially be unlocking valuable milestones?
Sadly, I wasn't in the points game back in the days of 40% discounts; but, in the present and recent past, I have had reason to buy Hyatt points at 2.08 cents, while I've never had cause to buy IHG points at 0.5 cents.
here are IHG rooms costing 500k points and Hilton rooms well into the millions)...
Totally irrelevant whataboutism.
When the view that transferring UR points to IHG or Marriott points was a waste solidified, both IHG and Marriott still had award charts that were capped at around 70K-80K per night, i.e., around where Hyatt awards are now.
Also, it's not like IHG or Marriott did not have awards that cost and still do cost in the 5K - 35K range and could be booked with UR points from Chase without breaking the bank. But what people care most about are high-end awards, and now Hyatt's cost up to 75K/night, just like IHG or Marriott's did.
Do not change the standards just because your program is now in a less enviable position. By the standards that made transfers of UR points to IHG and Marriott points wasteful, UR transfers to Hyatt points are now just as wasteful.
I am done here. If you're happy transferring your UR point to WoH points, by all means knock yourself out, especially given that it is probably the only way to raise enough Hyatt points to afford decent award stays.
Can’t wait to see how all the BILT shills on social media try and spin this program change as if it’s a net zero change…or even a valuable change (lolz).
Oh, they were out in full-force on the Bilt subreddit today, Baghdad Bob-style. (Best they got so far is to pivot to other transfer partners; but, let’s be real, Hyatt was top-dog for hotel transfers. Hilton ‘Rent Day’ promo today went off like a lead balloon. Bilt standard 1:1; Amex 1:2. C’mon.)
You answer it . Once they devalue Hyatt , they will offer better Hilton ration to spin it .
"I imagine it’s also driven by an overall desire to have more people directly apply for co-branded Hyatt cards, rather than just transferring points. "
If Hyatt wants people to engage more with their co-branded cards then they need to make them competitive. I stopped spending on my card last spring. Even prior to the devaluation it wasn't super competitive, but helped me earn elite nights and points. With the devaluation, why would I want to spend an extra $10k in unbonused spend on the card so I can have enough points to offset the 10k in points for the samecategory points redemption?
I'll probably go for the 15k in spend in early 2027 to get the free night and the elite nights, and sock drawer the card again. Maybe use it to top up elite nights if short of Globalist.
Hoping their supposedly promised premium credit card is competitive and interesting enough to maybe re-engage with the program, but I'm not super hopeful with the crap they've pulled this past year.