American Airlines is closing a flight attendant base, and I can’t help but wonder the real reason for this.
Continue reading: American Closing SFO Flight Attendant Base: What’s The Real Motive?
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ahhh San Fransisco, the armpit of America. This is a city spiraling straight towards financial ruin.
It is September and time to work on the 2023 budget. No surprise that closing a smaller and inefficient base is getting addressed now. It could have been postponed over the last couple years over the pandemic and gov't funding.
SFO & LAX are extremely senior bases. By forcing SFO based FA’s somewhere else, they’ll definitely see some people quit. The ones that don’t quit will struggle commuting, and will probably get fired for being late. This is all part of AA’s plan to reduce the number of FA’s at the top of the pay scale in order to save money. One Senior flight attendant earns more than Two new hires, so it’s financially lucrative for AA.
Unfortunately, this is just one of many toxic workplace changes that AA has recently implemented.
I’m so grateful I’m not with them anymore
AA has been cutting back at SFO so this makes sense. I would have to think that the city (not the SJU area) has taken a hit from losing conferences, conventions, trade shows, etc. Seeing pictures of junkies lying on the sidewalk with a needle stuck in their arm doesn't exactly encourage organizations to want to come to SFO.
other sources say the SFO base for AA (which also say it is actually a satellite and not a full base) had very high sick rates. It is impossible to make a satellite base work efficiently with high sick rates given the relatively small size of the base.
If the sick rates are true, then the AA SFO base did it to themselves.
The California crew rest laws just gave AA an excuse.
The bigger piece of news is that AA said that they don't intend to grow - or regrow - their presence at LAX. Not only will there be no more flight attendants but also no more flights.
Multiple plausible explanations for the move, some from the post and some from comments. On the labor law, I'd be interested what the larger FA community thinks inside and outside CA. Is this really the best way to deal with employee fatigue in a specialized line of work? Or is "specialized" an invalid concept? Should neurosurgeons pause their work after N minutes, for a legislated rest break? I'm a lot more liberal than Ben and I am tempted to think the law is silly, but it's FA opinion that would inform me most.
The State of California is getting exactly what they deserve. If you continue to implement business unfriendly laws, then ultimately businesses will choose to relocate or not open businesses. Thus the very people whom the law is supposed to help will be hurt by it.
That's what happens when California is a one party state
I am extremely glad to see the businesses pushing back against the California laws.
There's nothing nefarious going on here. AA has given up on the West Coast and has essentially put all its eggs in its code share with AS.
It's not surprising. There's nothing to be had for the airline. They aren't going to become a player north-south on the West Coast with UA overwhelmingly dominant in SFO and AS seeming to moderate its ambitions there in order to bolster SEA against DL.
SFO will become the end of a spoke from AA hubs, just as SEA has become for UA since it closed its pilot and f/a domiciles there.
AA has basically given up on a meaningful transpacific operation on the West Coast, both LAX and SFO are expensive places to do business, and AA/US/HP has never been able to get a north-south foothold there going all the way back to AA's SJC hub, the creation of Reno Air and AA's purchase of it, and HP's LAS operation.
AA is in trouble in ORD, they have seriously overlapping operations i JFK, PHL, and DCA and they are presumably going to be going up against a bigger B6, on the East Coast. It makes perfect sense to support where you are strong and cut your losses where you aren't and have no prospect to be.
AA also now has a strong alliance with Alaska, and SFO is a “decent” hub for AS. American can lean into AS to round out it’s network in the greater Bay Area.
I am curious what other airline Ben has heard rumors about CA flight attendant bases but, given that the lawsuit that led to this ruling came from Alaska - and I think Virgin America before - I wouldn't be surprised if that is who he is talking about. AS is considerably smaller than Virgin America was in SFO so pulling more crews will likely lead to a further pullback of service. The only way to staff first flights of the day in a non-base is with hotels and that gets expensive.
IIRC, DL also has a SFO FA crew base so Ben's rumors could be about them. AA and DL have been neck in neck in SFO for years. DL said in its most recent investor presentation that it is the largest airline at LAX by local market revenue (not connecting but passengers that end or begin at LAX) so AA might have fallen behind UA and DL in CA.
WN also has crew bases in CA and I wouldn't be surprised if they are looking at the costs of these moves.
Ultimately, competition works not just in economies but also in the marketplace of ideas. My neighborhood in a metro area 1500 miles from CA is full of those that have fled CA; one person yesterday sheepishly admitted they were former CA. CA wanted everyone that doesn't think like them out of the way and that is happening. The economic results are increasingly apparent.
California gets exactly what they vote for. Rules , regulation, expense, businesses fleeing. Enjoy!
United's AFA contract already has provisions in place for all-nighters over 4:30 flight time. Very few East coast flights qualify for this, namely JFK, EWR, BOS, etc. It's easier to manage splitting the crews off for a short break when the whole cabin is sleeping. But not sure how this will be applied during a day flight when the flight attendants are offering two-three services per flight. That 4:30 mark will be on descent into many airports.
Bull - "business friendly" is a made-up term from red states that don't regulate big businesses allowing them to skirt taxes and labor laws.
OMG AA closes a crew base that's been around for 50 years and everyone freaks out. SFO is not a hub for AA. It is a spoke with about 25 mainline flights. AA isn't giving up on SFO but it has AS to lean on there and has crew bases elsewhere. Not a big deal and the panic is overblown.
One could say the same for Florida at the next major hurricane to wash ashore and Texas, with its inability to provide consistent power during cold weather. Whatever dude. Tear your country apart.
just as a reminder, AA does not have a joint venture with a US carrier and, based on longstanding federal law, two US airlines cannot have a joint venture. The heart of the DOJ's objetion to the Northeast alliance between AA and B6 is the joint venture in the northeast.
As for AA and AS, they can codeshare on each other but once a passenger books an AS operated flight with an AA code, the money is AS' other than whatever loyalty program revenue AA might get for that customer.
Joint ventures between a US and foreign airline are legal and well-established but the notion that AA can give away its markets in either the northeast or on the west coast to other carriers and still financially benefit is not at all established as legal nor has it been shown to make strategic sense or on the bottom line
No, they won't. If you think that then you know very little about California. Businesses are not fleeing. There's way too large a population and too many industries there for businesses to pull up stakes and move. We're talking an FA based with a couple hundred FAs. That's a drop in the business bucket. California still remains in the top five of GDPs if it were itself a sovereign nation, right behind Germany. You don't know what you're talking about. I think that law shouldn't apply to FAs and I'm fairly liberal, but you're pulling bullshit out of your ass because you come from a Red state that's likely a drain on federal resources and, judging from your statements, lagging in education.
And then there are tax reasons why any airline would want to eliminate a crew base in California.
AA is relatively lucky they can just grow their PHX base. I could see United creating a Vegas base or something along those lines.
I couldn't agree more that the principal driver of this base closure is to "nudge" a lot of the senior FAs at SFO to retire and some of the younger ones who aren't eligible to retire (but still at the top of the pay scale) to just quit. The prospect of commuting to ORD or DFW for a FA in their 50s with 25 or 30 years of seniority with the company will be quite a burden. In any case it is a sad day for 403 AA employees who have made their homes in the Bay Area and are now faced with the prospect of quitting, retiring or commuting. AA has even added insult to injury by saying they won't pay for local parking at SFO/SJC/OAK for those who are now forced to commute even though they won't ever be using the "parking" benefit at their new bases.
I retired a year ago (after 31 years and over 26 of those years at SFO) with one of the "early out" packages and I thank my lucky stars that I got out when I did. I feel heartbroken for many of my former colleagues who are now dealing with this and the difficult choices they face.
The current airline that bears the name "American Airlines" is a pathetic shell of the company that hired me in 1990.
The increased costs of California laws upon airline bottom lines will naturally cause a retraction to create greater costs efficiencies in regards to crew bases within CA.
This can most likely be accomplished with
-downsizing of airline crew bases in California
-consolidating airline crew bases in California,
-“offshoring” crew bases to other states more business friendly
-reducing costs by creating airline crew bases in which crews can actually afford to live in or near
-creating more sustainable crew operations insulated from states that support the creation of frivolous lawsuits in the way California does.
The future does not look good for airline crew careers in California IMHO.
Based on experience, many crew members who are based in California do not actually live there so this may not be as significant an impact as it seems. It will impact some, perhaps not all. Nevada and Arizona are popular residents for crews based in California. Perhaps AA will see an influx of FA's based in PHX with perhaps the ability to bid the attractive routes out of LAX/SFO.
Exactly, we get just what we voted for, which I'm thrilled about. Great standard of living, high quality education, a safety net for our most vulnerable population, the fifth largest economy in the world, environmental protection and right to access for all, and so much more!
If by "armpit" you mean one of the most beautiful cities in the world, and by "financial ruin" you mean a budget surplus while ensuring that human beings aren't treated as disposable (or kicked out on planes and buses) like other cities and states, you're correct.
Let me guess, you have strong feelings about San Francisco, but have never been here. That's a great way to go through life!
AA barely competed out of sfo for a looong time. They didn't even tried to uphold a semblance of value. Their old lounge(now belongs to alaska) was tragic and embarrassing. I flew AA twice overseas on business. Once to lima and once to Manchester uk. Both were terrible both hard and soft products. Every FA on both flights that I talked to were super grumpy. Even a Hi were met with a "i hate my life" look. I certainly won't miss AA at sfo.
Yup. We get average salaries that the rest of the nation envies. And you all rely on us more than we will ever rely on you. Throw out your phone if you don't believe me.
Really California sucks the life out of states around it. LA destroyed the Owens valley and the Colorado river is an disaster because if California's lust for water. I can make about 30K more per year in Southern Cali, but my standard of living takes a crap. FYI I left the SF Bay Area because of rampant age descrimination. Ask most techie's over 40 how easy it is to find a job.
How come Intel, Samsung NEC and others no longer expand operations in Cali? Your "temporary taxes" are killing jobs along with wasteful spending to keep unions happy.
Balderdash!
Obviously you blue staters aren't in Texas and the rest of the business friendly world to see first hand all of the CA, OR, WA, IL etc. license plates driving around and moving into our neighborhoods.
Quite the exodus.
Like the billboards read along the highways into Texas, "Don't California My Texas".
Although it has improved the past few months you can’t possibly tell me there has not been a decline in the city over the past decade. The homelessness and drug issues are blatantly apparent when walking the streets of downtown. The once tolerant and accepting city I grew up in has become one of the most narrow minded and judgmental cities in the nation.
I think the only reason why they didn't close the FA base when they closed the pilot base was the exorbitant cost of hotels in the area. Now that tech biz traffic has gone off the cliff rates are coming back down to earth. Now the cost of blocking X rooms a night is attractive vs. leasing office space and paying support staff. Plus people at the top of the pay scale deciding to retire is gravy.
I think it is mostly about the laws surrounding the flight attendants. The trouble for the airline is I don't think these days the flight attendants are easy to replace.
Texas is so “business friendly” it doesn’t even have a functional power grid but go on…
And exactly whom do you think would finance such a monstrosity, not to mention the legal hurdles it would undoubtedly face.
"Really California sucks the life out of states around it"
Says someone who clearly has no clue how the western interstate power grid (see Skilling v. United States) or federal welfare for more than a dozen red states, works.
"The economic results are increasingly apparent."
Becoming the world's 5th largest economy, with a budget SURPLUS approaching $100 **B**illion in fiscal year 2022?
....oh no, the horror!
Why do you people not take the 0.5seconds necessary to actually investigate the financial doom&gloom you imagine this state to be facing, rather than pontificate on prevarications that you WISH were the case?
"How come Intel, Samsung NEC and others no longer expand operations in Cali?"
BETTER QUESTION: if Red states with no brakes on corporate malfeasance were some kind of business panacea.... then why don't we see major companies fleeing for the the likes of Alabama or Kansas?
Mississippi lets corporations absolutely drink its blood, but name a Fortune 500 company based there (hint: there are none).
"The once tolerant and accepting city I grew up in has become one of the most narrow minded and judgmental cities in the nation"
Ah cut the faux crocodile tears already. Oh no, someone may have asked you to use a different pronoun... big whoop.
Try growing up in the place where "faggot hunts" were considered a rite of passage, and segregation in all-but-the-actual-classroom was the norm for public schools until 2006.
....then maybe you'll come to appreciate what a place like SFO actually offered.
California gets what it votes for. Ail I get it. Then why the huge migration out of Cali?
Now the AA flight attendants will feel the sting that the Twa attendants went through to start your flying in another state at 40-50 yrs old with kids babysitters no parking and any kind of home life dead heading jump seats your best days of flying are kaput.
I grew up in a place like that, and while I used to enjoy visiting SF more, I don’t go as much these days because the hygiene and law and order situations have deteriorated so much.
you forgot to mention that CA is suffering one of the fastest shrinking populations among the top economies in the world.
People wouldn't be leaving California and buying up real estate all over the world if they were staying there; the evidence is abundantly clear that people are leaving Calfornia and for good ECONOMIC reasons.
AA's move to close its SFO satellite FA base is ALSO entirely ECONOMIC. They are a for-profit business
When you and whoever else Ben is hearing is considering doing the same come to grips with the fact that the QOL is falling as the cost of living is rising and businesses are acting, then you might be able to help explain why AA's move with its SFO FAs is exactly as expected and will continue.
As one of the impacted employees, this definitely has to do with CA labor laws. Beyond breaks and lunch breaks, we have CA Sick to take care of ill family members, and 40hrs of paid school leave to help in our childrens classrooms…LAX is about 2 yrs behind
"Texas Independence" is pretty hilarious. If anyone still thinks that Texas can survive as an independent state, they're ignorant, or stupid, or both. Good luck with that.
I'd point out that your anecdotal evidence of license plates driving around isn't proof of an imaginary exodus from California, but I don't think you'd understand that.
In 2021, the net migration out of California was 249,000 people, or a whopping 0.6% of the population. To call that "huge" or an "Exodus" is silly.
Here's a tip, Einstein: percentages usually tell a far more accurate story than just gross numbers.
"you forgot to mention that CA is suffering one of the fastest shrinking populations"
I forgot nothing. Yet again, in a rather comical display of predictability: you're saying what you wish to be true, but don't have the factual basis to back up.
As mentioned above, CA's out-migration is barely 0.6% of the population, which doesn't put it anywhere near the rates of the northeastern states with similar cost of living (NJ, NY, CT) or midwest (IL) domestic; and as for the world, though the UK has a small net migration gain, its rate is declining year-over-year now in double digits, with a similar decline for Japan, Australia, New Zealand, and more than anyone: Germany.
So tell us more about how imaginably dissimilar their experience is to CA.....
Tx power grid has been holding up better this summer than CA's. No rolling blackouts, no setting fires. How is CA going handle charging all these electric cars when the cant keep the lights on in the Bay area?
California has always been a difficult place for business to flourish because of their crazy laws and liberal policies that bankrupt businesses or at least challenge them on every level. It's also noted that the SFO FA's might not be working as much as they should and thus the flights suffer as the staffing issues become a major headache for anyone in business but especially airlines who have to operate with set staffing.
Businesses are pulling out of CA despite was DCAWABN might say as they are the only ones expected to support the economy with CA's f'up policies and handouts. There's a reason for CA license plates showing up everywhere but CA - thinking they should put a border up and keep them all from leaving.
The days of the widebodys to Chicago Dallas jfk and Miami are long gone. I was EXP for 10 years coming to and from Bay Area and I recently looked at the schedule and was shocked to see how gutted it has become. I suppose I’ve been flying delta and United the last 12 years or so in retrospect
California citizens need to wake up and see what their leadership is doing. This is one more example of businesses and citizens leaving this once beautiful state.
AA downsized PHX couple years ago, and has been wanting to close it down as well!
Ummmm....because she is one of the SF based affected employees.....do you not think she knows something that isn't publicly available to you, an internet commentor?
LOL. And your using talking points from pre-pandemic. Just wait. DFW and Houston and Austin have taken many Fortune 500 companies from CA in the last 10 years that will never be created again. I hear another mythical CA based company is moving to DFW in the next few months too. Have fun in CA, the shrinking state!
Fortune 500's that California DOESN'T have anymore: Hewlett-Packard, CBRE, Charles Schwab, McKesson, AECOM, Toyota, ORACLE, Coremark, Pabst Brewing, TESLA, GreenDot, Chevron, have ALL left for TEXAS. Palantir for Colorado, Norton/Symantec & Align for Arizona, Global Foundries for NY. Wells Fargo and MANY others are next. Numbers don't lie Concorde.
Why the bickering, fellas? You have no control over CA politics, and we’ll all watch it play out. If it turns out your expectations (whatever they may be) don’t match reality, maybe you’ll choose to learn something. In the meantime, it is positively silly to argue about what will happen … it will be what it will be. Chillax.
Remember when red state governors were telling Californians to move to TX and AZ? Well those transplants just tuned AZ Blue. Texas is Next!
4th largest economy in the world with a $100 billion surplus. SF still gets picked as one of the best cities to vacation. Your dollars continue to come here to fund the technology you use everyday of the week. Thanks!