Virgin Atlantic will soon be launching its first route to South America. The airline was initially supposed to fly this route as of March 2020, but you can guess what happened to those plans. 😉 Fortunately the route is finally happening, just over four years after initially scheduled. While the airline announced this route back in June, tickets will finally be going on sale shortly.
In this post:
Virgin Atlantic adds London to Sao Paulo route
As of May 13, 2024, Virgin Atlantic will be launching a daily, year-round flight between London Heathrow (LHR) and Sao Paulo (GRU). The flight will operate with the following schedule:
VS193 London to Sao Paulo departing 12:45PM arriving 8:20PM
VS194 Sao Paulo to London departing 10:10PM arriving 1:25PM (+1 day)
The flight will cover a distance of ~5,900 miles, and is blocked at 11hr35min westbound and 11hr15min eastbound. The airline will operate the flight with a Boeing 787-9, featuring 258 seats. This includes 31 Upper Class seats, 35 premium economy seats, and 192 economy seats.
Virgin Atlantic will be going head-to-head against both British Airways and LATAM, which also operate the route.
Virgin Atlantic will put tickets for this flight on sale as of September 6, 2023. So if you’re interested in booking this flight you’ll want to mark your calendar, especially if you want to snag a business class award. Keep in mind that Virgin Atlantic has an award seat guarantee, and promises at least 12 award seats per flight. This includes two business class award seats, two premium economy award seats, and eight economy award seats.
Where Virgin Atlantic will get connectivity for this route
London to Sao Paulo is an interesting route for Virgin Atlantic, in the context of the carrier’s overall route network and strategy. Virgin Atlantic exclusively has wide body aircraft that operate intercontinental flights, so Virgin Atlantic has limited connectivity within Europe.
That’s why Virgin Atlantic’s strategy is so heavily focused on flying across the North Atlantic. Not only does Delta own a 49% stake in Virgin Atlantic, but the airline also has a lot of connectivity in the United States through Delta.
In the case of the Sao Paulo route, the airline will have some connectivity from destinations to the east, including Delhi, Shanghai, and Tel Aviv.
The other thing to keep in mind is that Virgin Atlantic will also have connectivity in Sao Paulo, as the airline has a codeshare agreement with LATAM. This will give customers access to 12 domestic airports in Brazil, including Rio de Janeiro, Salvador, Florianopolis, and more.
Bottom line
Virgin Atlantic will be launching daily flights to Sao Paulo as of May 2024. The airline will use a Boeing 787 for the route, and it will be the carrier’s first flight to South America. This service was initially supposed to launch in March 2020, so it’s cool to see it finally happen. Flights will be going on sale as of September 6, 2023.
What do you make of Virgin Atlantic’s new route to Sao Paulo?
Not realy off topic but... Can someone enlighten me (and surely others) why the heck not one Carrier is connecting BRU to GRU non-stop since ages? VASP and VARIG did, baaaaack in time. Why the heck we always have to connect in any other European country to fly to GRU. I know there is a HUGE business between Brazil and Belgium. Not sure if they couldn't fill up a Business-Class only daily flight between BRU...
Not realy off topic but... Can someone enlighten me (and surely others) why the heck not one Carrier is connecting BRU to GRU non-stop since ages? VASP and VARIG did, baaaaack in time. Why the heck we always have to connect in any other European country to fly to GRU. I know there is a HUGE business between Brazil and Belgium. Not sure if they couldn't fill up a Business-Class only daily flight between BRU and GRU.
Almost every Western European country have daily -some multiple ones- flights into GRU.
Well I'd have to say that with Air Belgium being a mess that doesn't fully know what it's doing and Brussels Airlines' growth being very limited as a result of the LH Group focusing on LH/LX (their only TATL flights being JFK and IAD, the latter not even daily), BRU is very much dependent on foreign carriers serving it. LATAM probably sees their airplanes being used more efficiently elsewhere, don't think they'd be able to...
Well I'd have to say that with Air Belgium being a mess that doesn't fully know what it's doing and Brussels Airlines' growth being very limited as a result of the LH Group focusing on LH/LX (their only TATL flights being JFK and IAD, the latter not even daily), BRU is very much dependent on foreign carriers serving it. LATAM probably sees their airplanes being used more efficiently elsewhere, don't think they'd be able to get particularly high load factors and yields in comparison to any of their other European routes. If only the A321XLR had the range to connect GRU and BRU then maybe... but it's not the case
@ Ben Holz;
True, Air Belgium is surely not an option, that's a leisure "Carrier" and GRU is not a leisure destination. And for Brussels Airlines, regarding the mess going on in Africa, they'd better focus on other markets. However, I would rather make a connection anywhere else than fly them to GRU but LATAM would surely be the best option. Be sure, there would be demand, there's a huge business between both countries,...
@ Ben Holz;
True, Air Belgium is surely not an option, that's a leisure "Carrier" and GRU is not a leisure destination. And for Brussels Airlines, regarding the mess going on in Africa, they'd better focus on other markets. However, I would rather make a connection anywhere else than fly them to GRU but LATAM would surely be the best option. Be sure, there would be demand, there's a huge business between both countries, not to mention the quantity of Brazilians living in Belgium and vice versa.
Whether some people understand it or not, Delta is the linchpin that will help link Virgin Atlantic and Latam and help ensure the success of this route.
The AF/DL/KL/VS joint venture does not just involve the US and Europe but to several countries in Latin America. As Latam further strengthens itself post bankruptcy, they will strengthen their relationship with the DL/AF/KL/VS JV just as Delta helped Aeromexico do before its own bankruptcy.
The...
Whether some people understand it or not, Delta is the linchpin that will help link Virgin Atlantic and Latam and help ensure the success of this route.
The AF/DL/KL/VS joint venture does not just involve the US and Europe but to several countries in Latin America. As Latam further strengthens itself post bankruptcy, they will strengthen their relationship with the DL/AF/KL/VS JV just as Delta helped Aeromexico do before its own bankruptcy.
The route makes sense on many levels but the Delta influence in the markets on both ends of the route should not be dismissed.
Did you really repost this just because people mocked your DL obsession in your previous comment?
1. It's not a repost and
2. I don't post what I do dependent on what people think and
3. Whether some people can accept it or not, Delta has created the world's most successful group of airlines built on equity rather than the traditional alliance structure. It is clearly obvious that Delta has created strength between its equity partners even when it doesn't directly involve itself. It is beyond naive to think...
1. It's not a repost and
2. I don't post what I do dependent on what people think and
3. Whether some people can accept it or not, Delta has created the world's most successful group of airlines built on equity rather than the traditional alliance structure. It is clearly obvious that Delta has created strength between its equity partners even when it doesn't directly involve itself. It is beyond naive to think that DL is not working to make Virgin Atlantic and Latam, two of its largest investments, benefit each other to the greatest extent possible - which ultimately does help their owner, Delta.
He posted factual comments. What’s wrong with that? Have you considered some people on here work in the industry, therefore may know more about their organisation. It’s not an obsession. You obviously know very little
Icarus- Tim clearly knows a lot, and regularly offers valuable insights. He's also myopically obsessed with a single carrier—to a level that kind of discredits much of what he says.
I don’t work in the airline industry but gave followed from a business standpoint for 45 years. I know of which I speak
@Tim I agree with you that DL is the anchor that will underpin VS expansion into South America however let’s not gloss over the fact that although Delta is a majority shareholder VS during the pandemic embarked on a restructuring effort securing angel investment and these “silent” investors to some extend are pulling the strings and hampering efforts by VS to begin modernising its sub par Upper Class product on the B787 and A333 prioritising...
@Tim I agree with you that DL is the anchor that will underpin VS expansion into South America however let’s not gloss over the fact that although Delta is a majority shareholder VS during the pandemic embarked on a restructuring effort securing angel investment and these “silent” investors to some extend are pulling the strings and hampering efforts by VS to begin modernising its sub par Upper Class product on the B787 and A333 prioritising dividend payments. I fear unless DL and VS buy out these entities allowing capital investment in the hard and soft products offered any expansion plans are doomed to fail just like the seasonal route to DXB which is not gaining any momentum and sales are well below expectations.
it's so nice to talk w/ someone that understands the issues and addresses them frankly but respectfully.
I don't disagree w/ you.
Remember DL had stakes in Aeromexico, Latam, and Virgin Atlantic that were all circling the drain during the early days of the pandemic. DL simply could not have saved 3 distressed carriers even while saving itself. Even w/ WheelsUp, DL called in help - and there are those that still will...
it's so nice to talk w/ someone that understands the issues and addresses them frankly but respectfully.
I don't disagree w/ you.
Remember DL had stakes in Aeromexico, Latam, and Virgin Atlantic that were all circling the drain during the early days of the pandemic. DL simply could not have saved 3 distressed carriers even while saving itself. Even w/ WheelsUp, DL called in help - and there are those that still will invest in aviation.
VS is an extraordinarily valuable part of DL's overall system but, like AM and LA, has a strong identity of its own.
Remember that VS is adding Seoul which clearly connects w/ DL's partner, Korean as does their Shanghai service with China Eastern.
DL obviously has no clout in DXB.
The more global VS becomes, and there will be more routes to Latin America, the more DL will benefit as will consumers. VS delivers a very unique and pleasurable travel experience.
They will do fine in Brazil and undoubtedly deliver traffic onto Latam's network.
Virgin Atlantic has interline agreements with BA and SK and many other airlines at LHR - they get a surprising amount of traffic from those airlines on their long haul routes.
It’s very rare tickets are sold involving a combination of BA and VS.
I think it’s exclusively U.K. domestic feeds into and out of LHR from MAN, INV and EDI etc
It's not rare at all.
Virgin has interline and baggage agreements with pretty much every airline at LHR. They get a lot of feed to/ from BA and Aer Lingus. More than you’d think, especially with BA. I have friends who routinely fly virgin upper class from Miami to London connecting directly to aer lingus to Dublin, all sold through virgin. Very common. They’re not just limited to themselves and their partners
And let’s not forget that they are now part of SkyTeam - the vast majority of SkyTeam airlines fly to LHR!
I would avoid Virgin in upper class on any route operated by a 787
Apparently VS are also going to restart their DXB route along with a route to Bengaluru?
Possible, though it somewhat begs the question of "how," since they're only going to have about a 6 aircraft net fleet growth through most of he remainder of the decade.
Virgin Atlantic stopped flying to Pakistan recently, which consisted of 3 routes, with about 11 weekly flights between them. They all began when the pandemic happened, but they were pulled (with government approval cited as the reason).
The LHR - GRU route has been seriously underwhelming for years, both BA and Latam don't offer any reasonable service with old planes and poor comfort (my experiences). There is a large market with both Brasiliero and Brits, for me it's great news.
BA has been flying the A350-1000 with the new Club Suites for the past few years, so not sure I'd call them old planes - it's the newest they got :)
Virgin's 789 are also not exactly top spec.
But more competition is very welcome - prices are sky high!
LATAM is actually quite ok nowadays with their refurbished 77W.
Hard product is on par with the current competition and better than BA imo.
Soft product did improve a little bit.
I recently flew from LHR to GRU and BA use an A351! Wouldn't say that's an old aircraft! I would rather fly in J with BA/LA as Virgin are using those awful seats in a 787! This is a welcome addition as LHR-GRU is notoriously expensive and the flight both ways were full! Will be interesting to see how busy those flights are with Virgin.
Delta is clearly the link and largest investor between VS and LA and will ensure the route does well.
What kind of illegal activity are you suggesting?
there is nothing illegal when you are the major shareholder and you encourage cooperation between your investee companies.
You only wish that other US airlines, cough, cough, were as smart as Delta in creating its own network of equity holdings.
Delta is the major shareholder with VS, they are no more than 20% with latam. While delta has JVs with both carriers, that does not allow them the legal ability to coordinate revenue between VS and LA as an intermediary or coordinate anything as a shareholder in both.
take a chill pill.
It is only in your 345345 mind that anyone suggested that anything was illegal.
Delta has the ability to enhance coordination between its alliance, joint venture, and equity partners.
You are simply jealous that Delta and Delta alone can do that.
Tim, you're the one who directly suggested and insinuated revenue/profit coordination "Delta is clearly the link... and will ensure the route does well" on a route that Delta has zero ability to coordinate anything on since they have ZERO JV that allows coordination on a route they don't even touch between the UK & Brazil.
However, suggesting their equity stake allows them a special ability to ensure profitability. You can say what you like,...
Tim, you're the one who directly suggested and insinuated revenue/profit coordination "Delta is clearly the link... and will ensure the route does well" on a route that Delta has zero ability to coordinate anything on since they have ZERO JV that allows coordination on a route they don't even touch between the UK & Brazil.
However, suggesting their equity stake allows them a special ability to ensure profitability. You can say what you like, but expect to be called out on it when you suggest Delta will break the law via its equity stakes.
What am I jealous of with Delta? Such a dumb thing to say. Delta can't coordinate anything between VS & LA. And lest you've forgotten, LATAM's primary European partner is still IAG, not AF/KL/VS.
The person who posts incoherent 6 paragraph rants whenever Delta is mentioned, suggests someone "take a chill pill"? loll...
Take the L for suggesting that DL was anywhere close to the majority owner of LATAM, it's not.
Other than essentially say "Hey Virgin, are you aware that LatAm flies this route and may be interested in discussing a codeshare" (which BTW any airline can do, not just Delta), any further attempts to coordinate the unrelated carriers in schedule or finance would be in direct violation of anti-trust. Delta has LIMITED antitrust immunity with both carriers independently, but under no civil aviation authority nor agreement are they currently authorized to barter internal coordination...
Other than essentially say "Hey Virgin, are you aware that LatAm flies this route and may be interested in discussing a codeshare" (which BTW any airline can do, not just Delta), any further attempts to coordinate the unrelated carriers in schedule or finance would be in direct violation of anti-trust. Delta has LIMITED antitrust immunity with both carriers independently, but under no civil aviation authority nor agreement are they currently authorized to barter internal coordination between these two carriers.
ImmortalSynn, you simply don't understand that Delta stands alone in the aviation industry in its ability to walk on water.
when you sit on the board of a company, you have the ability to do things that airlines that work solely under commercial joint ventures can do.
Regardless of whether you can see it or not, Delta has facilitated a number of types of cooperation between its equity carriers and will continue to do so.
you have the ability to do things that airlines that work solely under commercial joint ventures can do.
Yes, but (as you've now been told by three different people, but will proceed to ignore anyway) you can only do so WITHIN THE CONFINES of the immunity granted to that specific joint venture, within each civil aviation jurisdiction.
Thus, even if airline "A" has an immunized venture with airline "B" and also "C"... airline A...
you have the ability to do things that airlines that work solely under commercial joint ventures can do.
Yes, but (as you've now been told by three different people, but will proceed to ignore anyway) you can only do so WITHIN THE CONFINES of the immunity granted to that specific joint venture, within each civil aviation jurisdiction.
Thus, even if airline "A" has an immunized venture with airline "B" and also "C"... airline A can't just go to any old venue, and oversee strategic cooperation on pricing or scheduling between "B" and "C," without prior and PUBLICIZED legal authorization. That'd be highly HIGHLY illegal.
you and others clearly have no idea what owning equity allows you to do.
The bigger issue is that Delta has created a network of airlines in which it owns equity which is unlike anything any other airline has and so does not play by the rules that you THINK apply to them.
@ Timmy - If you were less hyperbolic you'd get less vitriolic responses.
And the fact is...while DL has equity investments, EVERY alliance connects the dots of their member hubs. Good route connecting dots, but nothing more brilliant or inventive than what the other alliances do.
It's NOT a new concept invented by DL, so get over it.
And from a financial perspective, pursuit of JV's versus equity stakes is a safer investment. With...
@ Timmy - If you were less hyperbolic you'd get less vitriolic responses.
And the fact is...while DL has equity investments, EVERY alliance connects the dots of their member hubs. Good route connecting dots, but nothing more brilliant or inventive than what the other alliances do.
It's NOT a new concept invented by DL, so get over it.
And from a financial perspective, pursuit of JV's versus equity stakes is a safer investment. With a JV you can share in profit without sharing in losses...especially important given different economic dynamics in every market. DL doing well with equity stakes, sure...but how did it play out when they first invested in Aeromexico?
Sorta surprised that a carrier with such a comparatively small fleet would commit to this level of ship expenditure; but cool to see.
Sorta surprised they'd launch this, before reopening their longtime destination of Hong Kong though.