United Airlines seems to be cracking down on employees who are requesting (federally protected) medical leave. There’s no doubt some abuse with this, but I can’t help but feel like this message is about intimidation, more than anything else.
In this post:
United may use medical leave information against employees
Recently, JonNYC reported how United is starting to delay and even reject medical leave requests from crew members, particularly flight attendants. The Family and Medical Leave Act (FMLA) mandates the kind of leave that companies are required to provide, but of course there’s always some level of abuse, that companies are looking to minimize.
Along those lines, JonNYC reports on the latest method United is apparently using to make employees think twice about using this feature. After submitting an FMLA request, flight attendants receive the following message:
Please submit substantial medical facts to support how your condition incapacitates you on an unforeseeable/intermittent basis for up to 4 times per month/up to 3 days which is a total of 12 days per month. This information is not only required to determine approval of your FML request but also to determine if you are fit to work as a Flight Attendant.
That last part is the most interesting. As you can see, medical information won’t just be used to determine if a medical leave request can be approved, but also to determine whether someone is fit to continue working as a flight attendant.
I’m curious what comes of this development
Obviously the concept of medical leave is a touchy subject for major companies, especially airlines. Not only are some rights federally protected, but frontline employees are also unionized, so they have contracts that clearly spell out what they’re entitled to.
Of course it’s important that employees get access to FMLA without intimidation. At the same time, it seems like abuse of FMLA is a big problem in the airline industry. For example, just recently I wrote about how United spied on a flight attendant who was on medical leave, and then fired him, after deciding he was abusing the policy.
While a bit different from an FMLA request, it’s worth noting that in 2024, United tried to update its sick policy, requiring that flight attendants “provide verification of an incapacitating illness from an accredited physician when making a sick call.” Previously they could just self-report.
This came at a time where United claimed it saw a significant increase in sick calls over weekends in summer, suggesting people are misusing the company’s sick leave policy. As you might expect, this ended up causing quite a conflict between management and the union.
Bottom line
United is trying to crack down on employees abusing the company’s medical leave policy. As part of this, the company is now warning flight attendants that the information they submit as part of their medical leave request could also be used to determine if they are fit to work as a flight attendant. I can’t imagine all that much will actually come of this, though it’ll be interesting to see how the flight attendant union responds.
What do you make of United’s medical leave policy updates?
United is known for being poor at employee relations; they picked that up from their namesake in the merger with Continental. This also translates to how they treat customers; dont get me wrong they do well with marketing, mobile apps and price (especially since they fly out of the low cost Newark hub). But you can't fake being genuine they are all about bottom line so should be no surprise.
United airlines has continued to operate without a sick policy. At this point, I think the federal government should come after the airline industry for blatantly forcing their employees to use FMLA to save their jobs. The employees have no choice but to call out FMLA because United Airlines does not have a sick policy any form of a callout. The employee is punished with points so to avoid the points and being terminated the...
United airlines has continued to operate without a sick policy. At this point, I think the federal government should come after the airline industry for blatantly forcing their employees to use FMLA to save their jobs. The employees have no choice but to call out FMLA because United Airlines does not have a sick policy any form of a callout. The employee is punished with points so to avoid the points and being terminated the employee uses FMLA yes it is blatant abuse of the family medical leave act but the employee is forced to do it because otherwise they will not be employed.
lol, so the person needs up to 12 days extra off per month on top of the 10-12 days off they contractually get were they on Reserve. So she’s telling United in a 30 day month I’ve got about 6 days I’m willing to work
This is not uncommon
FMLA affords recipients 75 extra days off a year, can be used on weekends and Holidays with no repercussions. Most have it for “migraine’s” but generally any ailment that can’t be easily dispelled by an X-ray or mri will do, Think soft tissue and myriad mental disorders. 90% scam and those denied initially scream bloody murder.
Well I think it is fair to make sure the flight attendant is still fit to be a flight attendant. I've seen too many 70 year old grannies who can barely walk down the aisle serving me in business class. This needs to change. I am afraid for their safety. My most recent flight on AA, I had a 75 year old lady with the shakes, thought she was gonna spill my drink!
HIPPA doesn't apply to the FMLA Application process. HIPPA only
protects against the involuntary disclosure of medical information by 3rd parties. The application process for FML is voluntary process and it's initiated by the flight attendant, not a 3rd party.
I used to work in a casino in Vegas, felt like every other person was trying to get FLMA so they can call out/leave early and squat in a union position where they didn't really want to work. Next to none of these people were actually disabled or anything, pretty much all of them were abusing it.
I wish United well in culling these people from the ranks and opening up positions for people who actually have a solid work ethic. Totally get where they are coming from.
I don't believe in using FMLA for what ever your heart desires.. but this issue has come up because FAs are penalized for using the sick time they have accrued. Example: I have 126 hours/28 days of sick time. If I were to use those, the attendance points I would receive would cost me my job. So I have earned sick time but could lose my job using it if I needed to.
This is JonNYC bringing up something sent by one flight attendant for their one specific intermittent FMLA request for their own need. Nothing says this is a form letter sent to every single person who applies. And it isn't threatening to fire anybody.
But clearly a lack of understanding of FMLA combined with a rabid want to bash airlines is at play. FMLA is regulated by the US Department of Labor and the "problem"...
This is JonNYC bringing up something sent by one flight attendant for their one specific intermittent FMLA request for their own need. Nothing says this is a form letter sent to every single person who applies. And it isn't threatening to fire anybody.
But clearly a lack of understanding of FMLA combined with a rabid want to bash airlines is at play. FMLA is regulated by the US Department of Labor and the "problem" alleged here is so common and absolutely legal that the DOL actually addresses all of this in its FAQ on the public website, not even buried.
FMLA is either for a continuous block absence for care of self or a family member, or for intermittent periods of some specified interval. A medical doctor has to provide a certification stating why, based on medical facts, someone needs leave for X number of days at a time and X often... like 3 days at a time, up to 4 times a month, and whether it's pre-planned or something that can just happen like a flare up of a medical condition.
So yes, under the FARs if a person employed as airline crew that has physical requirements for performance of the job due to safety factors (own safety as well as others) reveals a condition that may cause them to not meet those requirements, they can be asked to do a fitness for duty.
This flight attendant requested leave on an intermittent basis for something that could, with little notice, cause them to be out of work for several days at a time and on a weekly basis - for their own medical condition. So clearly there's a question - are they fit for the job? Are they in danger of having a flare up of whatever it is (doesn't have to say what it is, but a doctor who knows has to judge that) while on duty? Are they going to fall out in the middle of a flight? Or in a hotel room in Majuro?
It is 100% legal for United to have the flight attendant provide documentation based on medical facts (DOL's exact language) that they can fulfill their duties. If not, United can and MUST by FARs remove them from duty. They can't be terminated from the company but can be put into another role that has same pay and has similar requirements to attain, and at a location that does not add significant commute time or alter work hours significantly. For example, at my airport where UA is outsourced, there is a mainline flight attendant working (in uniform) as a gate assist boarding flights while on a medical leave of some sort. Actually it's probably better for them as they don't have to commute to their base to work (which the company could legally make them do - DOL even specifies this right in its most basic FAQs that this assignment can be at a domicile where they normally start/end trips, even if they don't live anywhere nearby).
United can make employees go for a second or even third opinion at doctor of its choosing if it doesn't like what the employee's doctor said or isn't getting documentation needed. It can even mandate, all legally, they go to company chosen doctor for initial certification - all of this is legal as long as the company pays for it and does not charge the employee.
Years ago I won a DOL complaint as multiple flight attendants were getting handicap tags in order to use those spaces in our airlines employee parking lot. The car was registered to them, the parking lot was a SIDA lot (meaning only the badgeholder can drive the vehicle with that tag inside as it was "inside" the airport security perimeter), and by law handicap tags could only be used when the holder is in the vehicle. Therefore anybody legally parked in a handicap spot in the parking lot was the employee. And the same cars would be there for 3-6 days at a time. Some local administrative employees with legitimate mobility challenges could never get one of these spaces - to the point I had to send a van to go get them from where they could find parking - not that this was a legal obligation, but the right thing to do. Every one of those flight attendants received a fitness for duty request. Several complained to government - who stood by the company that if you claim you have a medical condition that you cannot walk more than a couple hundred feet in a spell or walk even that far very easily, you can't be a flight attendant who has to not only make it to the plane, but spend the flight in the aisle, and evacuate a plane meaning get out and move quickly away.
This whole story is something out of what is legally nothing.
Ben makes a good point about some U.A. flight attendants taking advantage of medical leave, but there has to be a better way to handle it.
Though, it makes me think how United flight attendants threatens the passengers by going on power trips or misidentification of a passenger which ended up with the wrong passenger being offloaded (those who defended her also got offloaded). U.A. management should respect and work together with their employees...
Ben makes a good point about some U.A. flight attendants taking advantage of medical leave, but there has to be a better way to handle it.
Though, it makes me think how United flight attendants threatens the passengers by going on power trips or misidentification of a passenger which ended up with the wrong passenger being offloaded (those who defended her also got offloaded). U.A. management should respect and work together with their employees just as U.A. flight attendants should respect and provide actual guest service for the passengers.
Agree that there needs to be a balance here. UA wants to make sure that people are using it for legitimate purposes. Many probably try to take advantage of the system.
As I read this it seems to me to be more about employees that are using FMLA as sick leave. United wants to know why you are invoking FMLA for say a three day trip and then showing up to work your next trip. In a sense they are using FMLA like it’s sick time. If you run out of sick days in a given year you could, in theory, apply for FMLA so that you continue to get benefits. I could see why an airline wouldn’t like that.
I wouldn't be surprised if it is the same power hungry FA's that love to kick people off flights that also abuse the system for leave, resulting in this kind of action and making it worse for everyone that honestly does need leave but now thinks twice because they are worried how they will look.
It's easy to confuse the details here. This policy doesn't involve sick leave - Flight Attendants can still call in sick. The flight attendants get an allotment of sick hours to use for unplanned / unexpected illnesses. There have been complaints about how freely United lets flight attendants use that sick leave. That's a separate issue.
What this involves is the use of the Family Medical Leave Act entitlements. Federal law (under the FMLA) allows...
It's easy to confuse the details here. This policy doesn't involve sick leave - Flight Attendants can still call in sick. The flight attendants get an allotment of sick hours to use for unplanned / unexpected illnesses. There have been complaints about how freely United lets flight attendants use that sick leave. That's a separate issue.
What this involves is the use of the Family Medical Leave Act entitlements. Federal law (under the FMLA) allows time off to take care of a sick family member - but there are requirements on providing appropriate documentation. FMLA is usually used for chronic issues - like care of a special needs child, or a parent with dementia.
What this issue involves is someone triggering FMLA-entitled leave to take care of themselves. An employee who points the "FMLA qualified time off" finger at themselves is self-disclosing that they have a recurring, repeating condition that makes them unable to work for certain periods of time each month, month after month. Again, an employee would be volunteering this information. So the company is then asking - "If you have conditions that make you occasionally unfit to do your job, are you actually physically fit to do your job at all?"
It may seem cruel or uncaring, but it is actually a fair issue to bring up. It's part of the risk in using FMLA for yourself in a job that has a requirement to perform a physical function. It's not limited to flight attendants, and it's not limited to United. Pilots (at any airline) can put their first class medical at risk, if they ask for an FMLA absence for themselves.
None the less, this doesn't change the fact that UA management appears to continue to treat their flight attendants as an inconvenience, is trying to put lipstick on this pig of a latest contract agreement, and they show no respect to the one employee group that interacts with customers the most.
The same employee group does not respect the customers who pay their salaries.
Yes, Matt because all 29,000 do not respect customers. You seem to have a micro pen
United Airlines down seven places in the World Rankings this year. Some believe that it is the management leading the way down towards American, while attempting to blame the frontline staff. Poor management will always find a scapegoat.
In large employee groups this has been an issue for years, years and years. Adding or enforcing letters from Doctors is a common practice. The approval of the absenses should be a transparent process, and it should apply to everyone equally. It's a big diverse world out there, someone out there has to make sure the gates open and and close exactly as they should.
lol.
I'm in my 60s now and have *never* been asked by any employer for a note from a physician. this includes top 10 universities, fortune 500 forms, small businesses, and startups. physicians' offices largely don't have staff for this nonsense.
This just seems yet another ill-conceived anti-FA move by Kirby. I know the guy's a weasel but maybe, just maybe, it might be in the company's best interests to try to work with employees rather than viewing them as the enemy.
seems like a basic concept in a service industry where you want to succeed but Kirby has never learned it
I secretly think Kirby hates women and his frequent mistreatment is to act like he has power moves and to show hatred
I find these veiled threats counterproductive. In my experience, employees abusing policy brush off these threats and just continue to abuse policy or find another way to abuse policy. It's the conscientious workers who take this to heart and think they're doing something wrong. With all the technology UA has, they know who the suspects are and can target the message appropriately.
If an employer ever made me work while I am sick, I would find a way for them to pay for it one way or another, this is all very counterproductive.
Seems like fertile ground for a lawsuit...
The first legal protection for pregnant flight attendants was in New York, under the court opinion Brooklyn Union Gas found at 41 NY2d 84 (Dec., 1976). The New York law requires that employers provide the same terms, conditions, and privileges of employment to employees for, amount other bases, gender.
If United is going to require this kind of documentation and procedures for pregnant flight attendants, it is going to have to apply the same standards...
The first legal protection for pregnant flight attendants was in New York, under the court opinion Brooklyn Union Gas found at 41 NY2d 84 (Dec., 1976). The New York law requires that employers provide the same terms, conditions, and privileges of employment to employees for, amount other bases, gender.
If United is going to require this kind of documentation and procedures for pregnant flight attendants, it is going to have to apply the same standards for all flight attendants for all reasons for requesting the leave.
Meanwhile AAL middle management *actively encourages* FA's to obtain FMLA to avoid punitive action under their own draconian sick policy....
Shocking another article about United and threatening their flight attendants. Ever since Kirby has taken over it’s been one article after the next…
and yet Kirby has beat the rah-rah drum and how great UA is doing drum and many UA employees have bought into it.
It won't be very long before many UA employees lose interest in UA's quest for success when it comes at those employees' personal cost.
Kirby inherited the best UA in terms of employee relations in decades. His history in the industry showed that it would only be a matter of time before he dismantled what Oscar built.
Very accurate.
When flight attendants gain, the customers lose.
Go United!
That memo isn't about FMLA in general--it's about *intermittent* FMLA. This is the piece of FMLA that's the hardest for employers to deal with, because it's day-to-day unpredictable. I have some sympathy for United wanting real documentation that a condition requires this accommodation while not affecting job performance.
I work with the HR team of a much larger company than UA. Intermittent is not that hard to oversee, it's a rather simple process...and if my company can handle it with 1m+ more employees than UA, I have no sympathy for what is poor management. In fact, we are aggressive with our accommodations for staff....
@grichard; totally agree. Intermitent FMLA is very cumbersome on employers and very easy to abuse. Some doctors don't care and will sign anything the employee asks from them. The employer cannot ask specific medical questions but can definitely send an FMLA note back to the physician for clarification. How much time off, how many times a week/month. It get even trickier when employees add on a "reasonable accomodations" request to the mix. Without seeing all...
@grichard; totally agree. Intermitent FMLA is very cumbersome on employers and very easy to abuse. Some doctors don't care and will sign anything the employee asks from them. The employer cannot ask specific medical questions but can definitely send an FMLA note back to the physician for clarification. How much time off, how many times a week/month. It get even trickier when employees add on a "reasonable accomodations" request to the mix. Without seeing all the details (which of course, we will not), I am not sure how much to fault United. And "dealing with the abusive employees" is easier said than done. Many times everyone pays the price when some employees are abusing the company that employs them.
as much as some people are convinced of UA's continued upward trajectory, UA mgmt has clearly decided they cannot afford higher labor costs and so are going to poison the employee relations that Oscar Munoz repaired more than 10 years ago.
AA and UA have long been in a cyclical relationship with each other; when one is down, the other is up.
As hard as it is for some to accept, AA might be...
as much as some people are convinced of UA's continued upward trajectory, UA mgmt has clearly decided they cannot afford higher labor costs and so are going to poison the employee relations that Oscar Munoz repaired more than 10 years ago.
AA and UA have long been in a cyclical relationship with each other; when one is down, the other is up.
As hard as it is for some to accept, AA might be the one that is on the upswing in product and employee relations while UA will fall.
It's not like DL employee doesn't fake being sick.
But a sick person fake being normal is you Tim.
Define “Normal” bro, some might believe that you “Fake” being a normal human the way you bully others who post herein, yes?
@AeroB13a : glad someone said it. I've noticed Eskimo likes to hide behind the guise of wanting to improve aviation safety and "save lives", by insisting we replace Aviation professionals with AI, when in reality the M.O for his commentary is to get off on demeaning other people and their careers. Were this not the case, he'd at least be advocating for best possible conditions for those professionals in the interim before AI takes over...
@AeroB13a : glad someone said it. I've noticed Eskimo likes to hide behind the guise of wanting to improve aviation safety and "save lives", by insisting we replace Aviation professionals with AI, when in reality the M.O for his commentary is to get off on demeaning other people and their careers. Were this not the case, he'd at least be advocating for best possible conditions for those professionals in the interim before AI takes over (which-as I've stated before- is unlikely to be in the next couple decades, if not longer).
But nope, he's just here to take a dump on people.
One finds it necessary to call into question your assessment of the ‘Ups and Downs’ of the AA and UA, if you are referring to customer satisfaction ratings Tim?
Both airlines are ranked lower this year than last.