The introduction of Lufthansa’s new Allegris cabin concept hasn’t been without drama, to put it mildly. As I covered in late 2024, Lufthansa has a bunch of Boeing 787s that are ready to be delivered, with only one small problem — the airline is struggling to actually get the seats certified. I want to take an updated look at this situation, to reflect the current reality.
In this post:
Lufthansa’s 787 business class certification issues
In 2024, we saw Lufthansa introduce its new Allegris concept, with the most exciting development being the introduction of the new Allegris business class, finally offering direct aisle access from all seats.
This product debuted on the Airbus A350-900, but that wasn’t without its challenges. First there were supply chain issues with getting the new seats. But even when the new business class, premium economy, and economy, were ready to go, the new first class wasn’t. So Lufthansa started flying these planes with the space of the first class cabin empty. Fortunately that has since been resolved, and the new first class has been in service for some time.
However, for several months, Lufthansa has been facing a much bigger issue with its Boeing 787s, which are also supposed to feature the new Allegris cabins (though without first class). Lufthansa currently has 15 Dreamliners that are in storage in the United States, and many of them already have the full cabins installed.
What’s the issue? The United States Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) hasn’t certified these new seats. You might be thinking “wait, aren’t these the same seats as on the A350?” Sort of. The A350 seats are produced by Thompson Aero, while the 787 seats are produced by Collins Aerospace (yeah… don’t ask). On top of that, individual certification is required for seats on every aircraft type.
So, what’s the latest on this? Runway Girl Network quotes a Lufthansa executive as stating that these seat tests have now concluded. That being said, the results are being analyzed, and it’s not yet clear if Lufthansa has passed the tests or not.
At an event in December 2024, a Lufthansa executive acknowledged that a “scenario in which the seats are not approved at all is not out of the question.” Yowzers. It’s not clear if there’s more confidence now in terms of passing the test, or not.
Lufthansa hopes for 787 deliveries in coming months
Lufthansa is already dealing with a major aircraft shortage. The airline was relying on the Boeing 777X for its fleet renewal, but that plane has been delayed by at least six years. Then Lufthansa had delays with its new Airbus A350s due to the Allegris cabins. Now Lufthansa is dealing with issues on the new Boeing 787s — the general Boeing delivery delays aren’t even an issue, but just the seat certification.
So, what’s the latest on these 787 deliveries? Lufthansa executives reportedly now hope that they can start to take delivery of these 787s this summer, with plans to have the planes flying before the end of the year. Again, there’s no guarantee that the new seats will actually be certified, or that this timeline will stick, but that seems to be the goal.
In the past, Lufthansa considered putting stored 787s into service, but just not seating anyone in business class, so instead just using the planes for economy and premium economy. Honestly, whether you fly these planes or park them, the economics just can’t be great.
Bottom line
Lufthansa’s new Boeing 787s are delayed. Roughly 15 of these jets have been ready to go for quite some time, but the issue is that Lufthansa can’t get the new Dreamliner business class seats certified. That’s because the seats are from a different manufacturer than on the Airbus A350.
These seat tests have now been concluded, but Lufthansa doesn’t yet have the results. The hope is that the planes can be delivered as of the summer of 2025, and then enter service as of later this year.
This Allegris rollout really hasn’t been very smooth, to put it mildly. First the airline had to fly A350s with the space of the first class cabin empty. Now Lufthansa has parked brand new 787s for many months due to not getting the seats certified. Never mind that SWISS is introducing the same product, and will have to install a 1.5 ton weight in the back of A330s, because first class is too heavy.
What do you make of Lufthansa’s Dreamliner drama?
The first new 787 (line 1170, first flight just about a year ago) has flown to Paine field for final delivery processing
characteristically Lufthansa doing LH things... they will never ever catch up to the charm of QR, SQ or CX.
What a win for the environment, flying planes around half empty.
Unpopular opinion but I'm thankful for the delay ... I think the whole concept is misguided. Their old inferior business class lie flats priced competitvely ex-US and supported their F product with accessible upgrades and demand for cash buy-up or outright to keep justifying decent sized (open layout) F cabins. Their new 3.2 seat closed F gimmick seems dumb and I suspect a vanity project or a way to make F no longer justifiable going...
Unpopular opinion but I'm thankful for the delay ... I think the whole concept is misguided. Their old inferior business class lie flats priced competitvely ex-US and supported their F product with accessible upgrades and demand for cash buy-up or outright to keep justifying decent sized (open layout) F cabins. Their new 3.2 seat closed F gimmick seems dumb and I suspect a vanity project or a way to make F no longer justifiable going forward.
Disclosure: I'm not a fan at all of the enclosed 'suites' and 'doors' gimmicks flooding premium cabins and blogs, so the old LH/LX J/F worked well for me. I much prefer open premium cabins, which are becoming a rarity! The open Cirrus/Cathay/Airways Envoy reverse herringbone open seat is still my favorite J product...but if you have that you run into the BA problem of destroying demand for your F product.
I suspect we will look back on the days of 8/16F open cabins with big CW/Diamond seat lie-flat J as a golden age for premium travel overall...I know I will.
Couldn’t have said it better
Agreed. I don't like the doors and have left mine open. Spent years flying next to total strangers in 2 abreast F and J. I do not like the confined feeling of today's pods with doors.
Has there ever been a more incompetant seat launch in the history of aviation?
I’ve tried the throne and “true” window seats on Allegris. Nothing to write home about. QSuites, which was launched years ago, is still a far superior product. Heck, I’d even just take QR reverse herring bone to Allegris.
The throne looks awfully tight around the shoulders. Did you find that to be an issue, especially while sleeping?
I'm surprised LH Group hasn't spun up a new subsidiary to fly these while they await certification.
LOL, SpohrED
These seats were "introduced" in 2024 but they were actually announced years and years before that.....I think it was actually 7 years ago. LH has not made this upgrade a priority and for this reason I haven't been in Business Class seat on one of their planes in ages. Last time I had to fly LH, the Business Class seat was so worn out that I likely would have sat and slept better in a...
These seats were "introduced" in 2024 but they were actually announced years and years before that.....I think it was actually 7 years ago. LH has not made this upgrade a priority and for this reason I haven't been in Business Class seat on one of their planes in ages. Last time I had to fly LH, the Business Class seat was so worn out that I likely would have sat and slept better in a bus. Never thought I would say this but I prefer UA (and SQ) on the NYC-FRA route and generally try to book Austrian as a first choice for flights to Europe. This is a case study in how NOT to run an airline!
Honestly a joke. This is why you pick an off the shelf seat (yes I’m aware this is a modified version of one - but it’s basically bespoke)
Can’t they just put economy seats in lieu of Allegris and leave the middle seat blocked ;)
An old Lufthansa saying is that 1.5 economy seats are as good as an angled flat seat ( for those who ever flew to Poona)
Bite your tongue! Someone at LH likely has already suggested this as an alternative at a board meeting in FRA.
Who conducted the tests? Who is reviewing them? Does this involve the FAA, which fired 400 staff and now has 2,700 wanting to take early retirement? Is this story actually about a President who must not be named?
Have you ever been part of an FAA certification process?
I have and it was for a startup airline several years ago.
The table top exercises took twice as long because twice as many FAA inspectors were included and all were allowed to ask questions/pose scenarios/review responses.
On the first live certification flight an FAA inspector walked down the aisle and began pulling and pushing so hard on the pax seats that he broke several...
Have you ever been part of an FAA certification process?
I have and it was for a startup airline several years ago.
The table top exercises took twice as long because twice as many FAA inspectors were included and all were allowed to ask questions/pose scenarios/review responses.
On the first live certification flight an FAA inspector walked down the aisle and began pulling and pushing so hard on the pax seats that he broke several (not one...several) before he was told to stop.
On the last day of live flying, and after at least one diversion scenario had been completed, the FAA decided to throw another diversion at the airline just because they could.
So yes, the FAA was in desperate need of a housecleaning.
Great point! What FAA? Cut, cut, cut!
Tests are conducted at an FAA and integrator approved test facility. That can be the manufacturer's in-house facility or they might send it to an approved third party. Review is done internally at the manufacturer for seats (TSO process) and is done between the manufacturer and the integrator for furniture (ODA process). The integrator is still involved in the whole process for seats, even if they don't put ink to paper on the testing. The...
Tests are conducted at an FAA and integrator approved test facility. That can be the manufacturer's in-house facility or they might send it to an approved third party. Review is done internally at the manufacturer for seats (TSO process) and is done between the manufacturer and the integrator for furniture (ODA process). The integrator is still involved in the whole process for seats, even if they don't put ink to paper on the testing. The FAA will sign off on the final product but is generally not involved prior to that.
These seats look gah aweful. Maybe the FAA is doing Lufthansa a favor.
LH did it to themselves. They have these variants of the seat (for price differentiation). I would imagine that each variant is individually certified. And, if one variant fails certification, the whole ship fails certification. What a mess.
I'm sure if the German government or LH makes a deal with Trump, that might speed up the approval process.....
I think you are making this all a bit more dramatic than it needs to be. We get the problem but your coverage seems to seek to turn a problem into a disaster which this is not. Let’s at least try some objectivity please.
Really? You don’t think LH handling of Allegris is a disaster? What about installing LX having to install a 3000lb dead weight at the back of the A330 to balance the Allegris F seats? Is that also just business as usual?
Can't blame LX; they had that seat design forced upon them. On a side note, that picture makes the center "throne" look VERY tight. Can't wait to see these seats in person.
@Jeff C, I wouldn't say Ben is being dramatic. Please keep in mind this saga has been ongoing for literal years. It's not like the Global Airlines thing where it seems like Ben is trying to stir the pot a little.
It is a disaster for anyone that WAS an LH frequent Business Class flyer! There are airlines out of third world countries that have a better J product than they have been forcing on pax for years now.
The biggest problem with Lufthansa is complacency and lack of competition.
The demise of Air Berlin means the largest nation in Europe and third biggest economy in the World has only 1 major international carrier.
Did you just forget Condor?
Sorry but they aren’t a genuine competitor. They are more like a leisure carrier.
Hi Frederik,
Lack of competition? Where? Transatlantic? To Asia?
Your comment doesn’t seem to be very well reflected. Internationally, Lufthansa is competing with many, many airlines.
And domestically? Lufthansa is competing with the Autobahn and Deutsche Bahn.
Yes, there are some Romanian cities (Cluj, Sibiu, Timi) where Lufthansa doesn’t have competition…but other than that, competition is strong.
Hi Frederik,
Lack of competition? Where? Transatlantic? To Asia?
Your comment doesn’t seem to be very well reflected. Internationally, Lufthansa is competing with many, many airlines.
And domestically? Lufthansa is competing with the Autobahn and Deutsche Bahn.
Yes, there are some Romanian cities (Cluj, Sibiu, Timi) where Lufthansa doesn’t have competition…but other than that, competition is strong.
I agree that there is most certainly complacency at LH. Heck for that matter pretty much every German I know books LH blindly as they seem to think it's the only safe airline out there. In all seriousness, I know people that won't get on another carrier and I am certain there are numerous German companies out there that book LH for all their employees regardless of the J product being outdated.....so yes...LH knows this and there is complacency.
You're exactly correct, Christian. It's the same as BA out of London, Qantas out of Australia, etc - a wealthy, rusted-on customer base that's addicted to the frequent traveler program and books them by default every time. There's no incentive to innovate, because the most commercially valuable customers choose them by default anyway.
What is the worst case scenario? Having to drop Allegris and install any 787 J seat they can find asap?
Sounds like the best case actually
They already have 5 787s in service and that is sort of the case for those 5. Not sure what they will do with the 2 whitetails they ordered though.