There are a lot of things that make Southwest Airlines unique among US airlines, and I’d consider most of those to be competitive advantages. There is one strange quirk that makes Southwest unique, though — the airline doesn’t operate redeye flights. I thought it would be interesting to take a closer look at why, and…
Continue reading: Why Doesn’t Southwest Airlines Fly Redeyes?
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
This is just an opinion of mine, but WN has certain quirks that help them stand out and often, these quirks usually come to benefit me when I fly with them. And most cases, their "business" fares come cheaper than the Big Three's Y fares for my routes with better benefits, like two checked bags flying free.
Southwest crews do layovers all the time everywhere. They're not like Allegiant, which just flies flights out and back from bases and crews never layover.
It really surprised me that this didn't change when they started in Hawaii. As it stands, their departures from Hawaii end up being really early to allow some connections on the west coast. That's miserable for a leisure destination.
YMMV but for my family the SW flight is the only one we want home from the islands. My wife detests red eye flights. SW is the only airline to not fly red eyes from the islands back to the west coast.
Yes, we leave hawaii fairly early, and return home to NM fairly late, but its a single long travel day instead of a long night of poor sleep on a plane and grumpy family the next AM on the day.
Redeyes are a valuable convenience, especially if you live on the west coast. Boarding a flight at SFO at 11 p.m. and arriving at JFK at 7 a.m. it is fantastic. I would fly WN a lot more if they offered such flights.
Is it too much to ask for an answer in the article to the question posed in the headline? Shame on me for thinking an article with a headline "Why Doesn't Southwest Airlines Fly Redeyes?" on a travel blog would answer the question "Why Doesn't Southwest Airlines Fly Redeyes?".
I remember when Delta did not fly red eye flights.
SWA is not in the transcon market for the most part.
-700 = 3,445 nautical miles with regular blended winglets, 3,510 with split scimitar winglets.
-800 = 3,085 nautical miles with regular blended winglets, 3,150 with split scimitar winglets.
-800 MAX= 3,550 nautical miles.
It makes sense with the WN model (or at least previous model). I know at a time it was rare to see WN offer a flight segment longer than a couple of hours. So, for a "redeye" from let's say LAX to LGA, a WN flight would probably have two or three stops along the way, which would be at odd hours of the morning.
However, as WN offers more long routes, I could see this becoming a possibility. I know for WN's routes, one of the big issues is because WN does not do redeyes, the connection possibilities from Hawaii to mainland US destinations are limited.
SWA pilot here.
The primary reason is the pilot contact prohibits redeyes.
SWA would need to negotiate with the union for it to ever happen. (Unlikely)
Seriously. ~5 hours is a poor night sleep in a bed, forget trying to sleep on a plain
Uhh, you might want to reread our contract. We already have red eye pay overrides. There are no contractual prohibitions to red eyes.
I had thought it was a good way to reset the schedule, also most of their flights were 1 to 2 hours it was rare for Southwest to operate a 5hour coast to coast flight.
Now that Hawaii is in the schedule they probably add some at least add west coast connections.
Maybe your phrasing is confusing me. Most airlines have options that leave Hawaii late morning or early afternoon and land on the west coast the same evening. They *also* have red eye flights but they aren't exclusively red eyes.
Perhaps So West has thought about the people "working" the red eye flights. Is it possible that those flight wreck their bodies the same you mention it affects passengers?
If that is the case, then high accolades to So West management.
OK I have worked in the travel industry for years, retiring in 2007. Southwest ( WN ) was most definetly on SABRE ( AA ). I know this because only SABRE automated travel agencies could book WN flts using teh GDS. Global Distribution Systems. Lucky, this does not make historical sense. SABRE I know has different levels of engagement ( TOTAL ACCESS etc ) but its SABRE ... THE premiere booking system ( sorry Apollo users LOL )
What Gives ?
The real question is: why would anyone ever want to fly Southworst in the first place. They are a bunch of lying, thieving, cheating scum. After what those miscreants did to me 6 years ago, I’ll never get on that bus with wings again, and I’ll gladly tell the world why…
Seems you're in favor of Southwest, but there are many disadvantages and annoyances. No assigned seats. "Friendly service" - I don't think it is friendly at all. While they are not rude I think it is a bit overly done. This reminds me of being in a restaurant when the server introduces themselves and tells us their name, etc.
It would be nice to see a west-east overnight option on redeye. Changing the subject, Southwest is no longer a low-fare airline. Southwest is living off its reputation. I have a companion pass but can't often use it - even with the second ticket free the base price is more than double what I can find elsewhere. The only thing I like is the easy ability to cancel and rebook, especially when I am using points. Aside from that - bah, humbug.
Tow words: Civilized Airline.
They also don't charge for checking bags, so they turn a plane in 35 minutes: American (the airline who introduced the fee) can't do a turn in 50 minutes without leaving late!
I agree with Bickleinny down there. WN is simply living off their reputation. I average 100,000 miles a month in the air, fly 6 days a week and I *might* fly WN 1 time every other year. Overpriced cattle class, that's all WN is anymore. WN is basically F9/NK but automatically charges you for checked bags even if you don't need them and no option to choose your seat. No thank you.
Exactly.. SABRE is the best of them all, the post made me think: 'wait a minute, there's NO WAY in this world that WN was using KIU' LOL.
Southwest does operate redeyes, if you charter the whole flight!
The proposal they sent me several years ago covered plane, crew, and fuel. I wanted to fly a 737 into local backwards airport. $80k could have flown me and 136 of my closest friends to Vegas for a conference.
The proposal stipulated in no uncertain terms that the charter must happen overnight (during normal off-time for the planes).
20+ years ago, I was asking this question. There was and is no good way on WN to leave a West Coast city at end of business and get to work on time the next morning on the East Coast. I know they don't think of themselves as a hub & spoke system, but there are enough connections in their system that red-eyes from PHX or LAS to BWI could connect a lot of California to a lot of the Northeast.
I now live in flyover country, but when I was living in the coasts, there were plenty of times when I wanted to fly Southwest but they just weren't flying at night when I needed to travel.
Mike,
That only holds true if you’re traveling to the west coast itself.
A quick google flights search from Maui to anywhere east of CA with only one stop has no results that do not include a red eye from Hawaii with an early AM arrival on the west coast and a AM flight to the final destination.
Or you can leave Hawaii around 1300, add two stops, and still get home at 10am the next day.
OTOH SWA departs between 0700 and 1100 getting me home between 1900 and 2230.
So no there are no early AM departures from the islands on any other carrier than SWA.
I recent chose a United redeye in 1st vs a daytime Southwest flight in “business.” They were the same price one way which is absurd.
Pilots hate redeyes! Because they often mean you are trying to switch from day to night but then right back again. Doing them frequently is a long term health risk.
Yes, SWA is a different model. They always have been. The difference is, they once featured the Midas Touch of Herb Kelleher. Since Herb is gone, the magic has ebbed away. They are now just another big airline, which sometimes tries to hang on to Herb's legacy. I always believed that without Herb's mojo, the success would end. And it has.
It's weird. Airline ticket prices are through the roof this past year, up hugely. So what has happened? The planes remain packed to the gills every flight to everywhere.
I'm a retired airline guy that gets "passes" on flights. That's great with retirement right? Finally there's time to travel for fun! Nope, every flight every day to everywhere is full, full, full.
My peers over at American say the same thing, they are mostly unable to use their travel privileges due to full airplanes.
Great for the bottom line, depressing for the employees.
Yeah, to avoid a redeye home on Delta, we booked a stay in Los Angeles on the way home since they do fly HNL-LAX during the day. We didn't mind, as we had friends and family to visit.
I might consider the HNL-MSP nonstop as that's long enough to maybe sleep (I manage just a couple hours on MSP-AMS flights) but it is _very_ expensive. The somewhat less costly red-eye options thru SEA, PDX or LAX mean interrupted 'sleep' and early morning plane change. All are undesirable options to us.
I work in the industry too for a large carrier. Big big big levels of agreement. Disappointing but definitely not the end of the world.
Always use different AL from West to east coast. Never mind. They will never get my business with a day flight from la to mia.
I fly Southwest airlines because they don't have redeye flights I hate them. I can't sleep on a plane. I quit flying Delata to Hawaii because theirs are all redeye.
I thought the real reason why many airlines fly red-eyes was to reposition aircraft for the next day. I used to fly United’s SFO-BNA red eye very often and that thing was almost always empty (like - I got an entire row of Economy Plus to myself empty). No way that made economic sense in isolation.
Perhaps Southwest’s decreased hub emphasis reduced the need for red-eyes?
That strategy may 180 as Climate Dysfunction continues to steadily destroy the planet. Not mentioned is red eyes don’t have to deal w often deadly summer thunderstorms that pop up across the country as HUGE violent cells that cook up quickly w rapid convection daytime heating. Heavy rain bombs, wind shears, dry cell thunderstorms w tornado winds and funnels. While not impossible to have these weather issues @ nighttime, it’s far less likely & much safer to fly @ night & less congested, you breeze thru security in seconds. It’s also an excellent money saver for cruise pax. Don’t have to spend overnight on a hotel, when U red eye.
That’s BS. On a recent SWA return to DEN, we waited for a hr. on the tarmac for the plane @ our gate to push. Then, another 48 min. to get bags. SWA is being subjected to the same issues as other carriers. Finding, retaining and paying quality high salaries. Particularly after Covid. NOBODY in the airline biz. wants to be as assaulted, spat on, catch Covid and receive pay. A lot of people are taking the YOLO path, & bailing on the BS.
The juice just ain’t worth the squeeze anymore…
No red eye flights give them a few hours for maintenance and cleaning. If planes are always in the air, there's no time for even a basic maintenance check. Just my opinion.
Ever been to most of the airports SWA operate? There is no services past about 9PM. Even flying into DFW 4:30 AM the food court isn’t even open. Some of the Admiral clubs close early.
Our “red eye” pay is a complete joke. $1 extra. No thanks. And we haven’t had a new contract in 4 years and I haven’t gotten a raise in 10. Going to have pony up big bucks all around to even get us close to where we should be. Maybe then we can talk overnight flights.
Different flyers experienced differ I'm sure, but Southwest does a good job of flying the routes it sells. It doesn't serve some smaller cities, but at least you know that when you buy the ticket. I've had several trips booked on the legacy airlines where I buy a trip that includes a connection, and I take the 1st flight only to discover the connecting flight is cancelled or greatly delayed. I end up renting a car & driving the rest of the way. The legacies don't identify when those routes are served by a regional airline operating as part of the legacy, but it's a near certainty that any thing on a regional jet is a codeshare. If I'm going to have to drive the last segment anyway, I'd prefer to know that before I take the 1st flight. Unreliable service on codeshare flights eliminates a major reason to book with a carrier that supposedly has a more extensive network.
I was under the impression that there was no charge for 2 checked bags on WN. How many bags do you typically take on your travels? More than 2 checked and 2 carryon? I believe you would have to pay an additional amount for more bags than that on every airline.
Southwest flies to Miami from Nashville and Charlotte and I'm sure other cities as well.
Hours of operation are 3 am to 2:59 am and allegedly a request to the FAA was made in 2013 to change their operating hours to the 24 hour clock, but was declined in 2015. Redeyes are covered in contracts.
As a SWA retiree, why should we? It always struck me as dangerous. People should be asleep in the middle of the night including pilots, flight attendants and customers.
It's the only time that scheduled maintenance can be accomplished. These scheduled checks take hours to finish and the downtime at night is the only time to finish them. It's that simple.
Great article ... When you stated that Southwest listens to their own drummer and does not seem to care about what others think is simply Not true.. Spirit Airlines, especially when they were in the infant stages of development of the ULCC, did exactly what they wanted to do. They began charging for almost everything to become " different" and despite the bad press continue to keep their ULCC strategy.... Now, most airlines are offering " no frills" ticketing or have tried it in the past decade.
southwest Economy seats are no worst than any other airlines that does redeyes.
have you been on a united/american economy product? Its worst than SWA.
While we don't operate traditional red eyes we do fly very late and very early flights. Typically, we park the airplane around midnight (if it is on time) and the first departure will be around 5 am. That's not a lot of sitting around for the equipment. If it is parked at a maintenance base, the aircraft is being worked on. If it is at an outstation it doesn't leave much time or need for a red eye.
Additional pay for pilots performing red eyes is addressed in our contract and is negligible in terms of the cost of operation.
One of the main reasons flight attendants and pilots are so happy at Southwest is because they get a good night sleep. Happy crew turns into happy customers and excellent customer service.
Introduce red eye flights and the turnover rate will be through the roof. The culture will change, and customer service will be horrible with tired and unhappy crew.
Please don't make changes that will ruin such a wonderful and happy airline!
No red eye flights!!!!
A few weeks ago my new lab result shows that I tested negative for I am HSV1&2after using WHC Herpes, so happy I did gave it a try. Currently, my 65 years old mom is using " herbs" to eliminate her diabetes and the recovery process is amazing. I am recommending this product for those that are willing to give it a try as these holistic remedies do not have any side effects. It’s also crucial to learn as much as you can about your diagnosis. Seek options check out: ( worldrehabilitateclinic. com )