When airlines introduce innovative new seating products, the focus is almost always on premium cabins. Over the years, we’ve seen countless airline executives tout how they’re working on developing a revolutionary new economy product, but almost nothing ever comes of it.
Continue reading: Emirates Designing “Game Changer” Economy: Will It Become A Reality?
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
I suppose if you raise the height of the seat, and if you make the seat itself flexible and movable, the seat could allow for more legroom in the sense that people can stretch by pushing up on their feets and against their seats. it could also be a more alternative way to sleep if one could extend their legs vertically to some body-conforming ergonomics/materials.
This is going to be interesting to see, as they certainly have the money to do something radical. I wonder if there might be alternating high/low seats, with the lower ones able to have some kind of angled lie-flat like the previous generation of J seats, perhaps in a hard shell? That might not look pretty overall in the cabin though, and where would that leave the premium economy product
Lots of Y concepts out there, one that might appeal is the non recline shell seat that slides under the seat in front to form a flat bed, how a stranger as your seat pal feels about stepping over someone in that position would be a challenge for sure.
"Emirates President Tim Clark is one of the industry’s brightest guys."
He is. Just ask him!
It is interesting but I wonder, what happens to that vertical height when the seat is reclined? I'm trying to picture myself behind a seat like that which is reclined.
How intrigued are you? Intrigued enough to test it out from LAX-DXB? Would love to see that review.
I don't understand why more airlines don't offer Air New Zealand's sky couch concept.
Emirates needs to chill with the “game changer” label. Their new first class, while a great product, is hardly a game changer as only one other airline is offering something similar. Qatar’s suites on the other hand are a legitimate game changer since business class seats with doors is now the industry standard.
Not one airline installed existing solutions like staggered economy seats, hopefully something comes from this idea.
The EK economy product is already quite good, there's not much room for them to get better.
In soft product maybe. Their economy seat itself is fundamentally identical to everybody else’s.
The brass neck on that chap, who led the charge making economy class so much denser and arguably responsible for the the class's downward spiral (Emirates was the first to bring in the 10-abreast Economy Class layout on the B777).
If they dont increase the seat pitch and seat width, it doesnt matter what they do with economy.
However, that awful advert with the actress in it was enough to put me off emirates economy lol.
There have been several attempts at trying to come up with a better longhaul economy product but they all involve some sort of geometric contortions in getting in or out of the seat - which is why they get shot down by regulators.
As airlines fly further and further distances, and that is the heart of what the Middle East airlines do, it becomes more and more necessary to somehow figure out how to improve the economy seat.
Maybe a single airline can do it and patent it but I would imagine that a seat manufacturer will not give long-term airline exclusivity to a product that they could make billions on.
Emirates already added the 10th seat across on the 777. What are they looking to revolutionize next ?
The vertical comment may not be necessarily referring to the seat itself but rather how seats are positioned. There have been designs like this floated around for the past two years that straddle the height of the seat itself from one row to another to create more space and comfort.
Whaddaya mean by making seats taller? So does that mean, my feet will no longer be able to reach the floor when sitting? And heavens forbid if you have to assume the brace position...
At least in the US and probably Europe I just don't see airlines spending money to make the coach product much better beyond the US3 and their Economy Plus schemes that give a bit more legroom and a free drink(s). AA tried MRTC and that failed. Jetblue tried to create a better coach product and you see how that played out. Americans and Europeans love to fly the ULCCs/Basic Economu then go on social media and complain about the horrible experience.
Premium economy is exactly what better economy is...while lots of people are willing to pay for premium economy...many folks just look at the price.
As a tall person I disagree with the "the height of the seat isn’t typically the limiting factor in terms of seat comfort" statement.
I have noticed that European airlines are usually better at it with slightly higher seats or vertically moveable headrests. The impact on comfort is most notable when the seat is not high enough. The head leaning back over the seat is very uncomfortable. Notably some older Delta First class seats are not as high as the economy seats and the width does not make up for the fact that you cannot lean back your head.
Actually, I think ME airlines have largely maxed out their stage lengths, at about 15hrs. There's pretty much no 2 places on earth that can't be connected through the ME with 2 flights of 15hrs or less.
Longer stage lengths are coming from hub bypass strategies like Singapore's JFK/EWR flights and Qantas's direct London flights.
I bring this up because I don't think it's the ME that needs to innovate on seats. People have largely accepted their seats on those flights and they won't get longer.
It will have to be other airlines pursing ULH hub bypass nonstops that will need to think about how to keep a passenger happy for 18hrs or more.
Why reinventing the wheel? Just match JAL & ANA international Y-cabin density on long-distance flights... Oh, wait... The hell will freeze first...
My view is that, assuming it is possible to add say 3" of effective leg room by raising the height of the seat(or something similar in a vertical direction) the airlines would just use this as justification to add even more economy seats to the airplane, and nothing would change at all.
This is just what they did with the slimline seats that are everywhere now. Instead of keeping the same number of seats and allowing the passenger to enjoy a couple inches of more legroom, they decreased the pitch of the seats to keep the effective legroom the same, while allowing them to add additional rows of seats.
I don't see any tech innovation that will increase the actual comfort of economy class in the future.
I guess if you raise the seats (height of the cushion you sit on) high enough and add a fixed shell behind it, you could have them recline and slide under the space of the seat in front of them into an angle flat seat like the first gen business class seats!
Free WiFi is already a game changer and a mutual win, no need to install IFE and pay insane fees on them, just a simple webpage for login + flight info display.
In most economy seats, my shins hit the bottom of the seat in front when I try to recline and stretch my legs (and I am not a super tall person). Worst case is when there is a foot rest that, in the raised position, decreases the vertical space even more and creates a hard metal edge that hits your legs.
So the vertical enhancement that I would want the most is the ability to lower the floor section under the seat in front of me - the opposite of a footrest. Or have a permanent foot well there in combination with existing foot rests, so people of different height can be more comfortable (or at least less miserable). Basically, improving legroom without increasing seat pitch.
But it is still just lipstick on a pig - nothing you can do with a 10-abreast 777 that would make it even close to JAL 8-abreast economy on 789 (that also has longer pitch than most).
I'm not saying that the ME airlines are adding longer and longer routes - they are already operating, on average, some of the longest routes in the world.
It is the needs of the ME airlines that have pushed the capabilities and range of a number of recent aircraft models.
I am saying that the ME airlines have perhaps a higher motivation to find a new solution and deploy it quickly - and exclusively if they can - because of the long flights they operate.
Maybe he’s talking about the “standing” seat that Ryanair or some other LCA tried to patent. Pack the peasants in like sardines.
As a fellow tall person, I am surprised I had to scroll this far to find an actually relevant comment. Economy seats are made for 5'7"-5'9" people, and are supposed to be designed with those ergonomics in mind. This means anyone who is even vaguely tall will have to sit in a way that ignores most of the back rest and gives us back pains the entire time.
Just like the Business Plus row concept we've seen at the front of the Business cabin, this extra tall economy seat will be the last row in each Economy cabin where the extra height doesn't matter. Give it extra legroom and sell it for a premium to tall people, who will happily pay extra for ergonomics designed for them. And then watch some obnoxious 5'3" person take it instead, just like the front row + exit rows do now :eyeroll:
I'd like clarification on what he means to make the seat taller. When I read it, I thought of taller seat backs, but comments here seem to think a bottom seat cushion higher from the floor. Which is it? Or, is it a combination of the two?
So, seats that are no wider, have no improved pitch, and presumably have no better padding than the current seats? While I'd dearly love for these to make flying better I'm exceedingly dubious. Remember the last time an airline adopted coach seats that are actually more comfortable? Me neither. It's been a race to the bottom.
Taller ? Hmmm. I confess that I can't imagine what that would improve. How about more bottom padding and lumbar support ? My wish flying Y in the USA. Which is why I usually buy F. And F is not at all what it used to be, as we all know. I miss the big fat thick seats LOL !
Yes, thank you Sir Tim..economy seats definitely needs some cushion on the seats..traveling 12 hours from N America on a seat with no cushion is not good and it gives us a severe backache..
Greatly appreciated..
As a tall person. Making the seat taller would make a HUGE difference to me bc the headrest would acc be on my head not my shoulders
They should focus on 34" pitch, 3-3-3 seating on their 777s. But what they will be focusing on is getting more seats in the same space and trying to make it look like a comfort enhancement.
Clarke made a remark along the lines of "if you give the passengers great entertainment and good food, they'll forget the more narrower seats" when 3-4-3 on the 777s came along. I don't think he really has the comfort of his economy class passengers in mind.
As long as their primary goal is to pack the plane like a can of sardines.. there's no magic seat that will make economy not horrible. 2-4-2 in economy would be all I need.
Many rave about Emirates. I was not impressed. 3-4-3 economy and 2-3-2 business but they charge the same or more as everyone else for business....Doesn't NZ Air have some sort of laying down ability in economy?
Revolutionizing Economy Class I think it’s the hardest aim ever and after over 45 years of traveling no one has managed to shock be yet. But I have been positively surprised. For instance Etihad didn’t want to follow Emirates path with the Premium Economy and has instead introduced Economy Space (I believe Delta has had the same since long time). Economy Space in terms of comfort is close to the Premium Economy but costs pennies over the Basic Economy.
In terms of feasibility I believe we are no way near seeing a game changer any time soon for Economy with any airline. I wish I’m proven wrong.
The only way to "revolutionise" economy is to reverse the negative changes that have made it so uncomfortable for long-haul flying. Like anything less than JAL's generous seat pitch and only 8 seats per row is not revolutionary at all. Also thing there is something in Zipair's basic barebones business offering long-term.
Emirates already innovated once on economy seating. They were the pioneers in 3-4-3 long haul 777 economy. I personally believe such things should be and should have been out-regulated. So this is quite discouraging to me at least.