Emirates has this week taken delivery of its first Airbus A350-900, as the airline has 65 of these on order. It’s an exciting milestone for the airline, as it’s the first new aircraft type the Dubai-based carrier has taken delivery of since 2008. Up until now, we haven’t known exactly what the interior of the…
Continue reading: Emirates A350 Business Class: Expected But Disappointing
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As you said, the seat is good enough. Pretty comfortable and does the trick if you get one if the “true” window seats. If they stay focussed on their soft product, EK will have a winning product for years to come.
I get that the industry has come up with all kinds of fancy new J seats - I’m just coming off a 12-hour flight in an LH Allegris “throne” seat, but a lot of that seems unnecessary. I think EK is doing the right thing by focussing on getting the basics right.
Looks like a huge improvement from the ‘90s, when they were installing 2-3-2 layout in business class on A300/310/A330s!
They don’t need to innovate at the moment, they have a loyal customer base who like the seat and as you said the soft product.
Correction - these seats are from Stelia, not Safran.
These seats are the Solstys layout.
Yeah Emirates is definitely going to lose ground in the connecting game as we move towards the second half of the decade soon.
Qatar wins in all aspects for business class from the seats, lounges, service, and by being part of Oneworld.
Emirates is delusional if they think they can continue growing at this pace and building their DWC airport. Their marketing and hype is only going to last for so long, especially as Turkish Airlines modernizes its fleet. TK has better geography, Star Alliance integration, and generally better food.
Given that almost every Emirates itinerary requires connecting, I have no interest in flying them at all when the other one stop options are so much better. Even if I were flying to or from DXB, Qatar would be preferred due to the Al Safwa lounge and better seats.
@Ben
Emirates does not care to introduce a competitive business class seat because they know very well that they were and are still making huge profits selling their old 7-abreast 2-3-2 business class. People were flying with them and will still fly with them even if they continue flying the 2-3-2 business class till 2040s. So the new 1-2-1 seats is a big improvement over their old 2-3-2. As Ben mentioned food on Emirates is great. Also it is nice to see premium economy to be 2-3-2 instead of the industry norm 2-4-2 on the A350s.
On the other hand Qatar Airways and Etihad have very good industry leading seats in business class. All they need to do is to embrace the premium economy product and introduce the cabin on their aircraft.
You need only look at the LH debacle with getting new seat products approved and EK probably made the right choice.
The fact that they have had as many planes as they do without direct aisle business class for as long as they have says volumes about the halo effect of the brand - and even more so about the fact that EK has dominated the Middle East market for so long that they can do what they want.
There will be more competition, hugely innovative new lie flat products in either first or business don't necessarily translate into a revenue advantage, and the rollout of the 777X will take far longer than the delays on the MAX 7/10. Hoping for innovation on the 777X, as many airlines are doing, will result in lost opportunities.
Agree with Turkish, and worth noting they have a growing & better US network as well, reaching points like DEN and DTW, which EK hasn't kept up with. But QR obviously has a superior product as of now.
Only case left for flying EK is on a route where there would be only narrowbodies on TK and QR; very rare, but there are a handful
I am a gold member with emirates and fly them every few weeks. Their business class on the A380 is fantastic and the retro fitted planes are top notch. The design for the A350 is very similar yes and that doesn’t bother me as they have upgraded the tech. For me personally I don’t really care about a door. Even flying First Class my door is always open.
Tell us you have never flown EK biz while not telling us you have never flown it
If I'm being honest, the premium-economy sections at just 21 seats looks like it may be more enjoyable than business-class. Sure, you won't get the same wine selection. And sure, the food is going to be different. But I imagine there's at least one dedicated flight attendant for premium. If that's the case, the service may be more attentive. And for a daytime flight, premium-economy -- outside the middle seat -- would be fine.
Kudos to Emirates for doing 2x3x2 in premium-economy. Delta squeezes a fourth seat in the middle section on the same A350. I still think there should be some sort of divider between the seats in the center section for privacy. But still, this configuration is very spacious for premium-economy.
You don't need to develop a seat completely from scratch (e.g. Allegris) to have a competitive product. There are plenty of seat manufacturers that offer significantly more competitive business class seats, which have all regulatory approval and have already been installed on other aircraft.
Heck, even minor modifications to existing seats from manufacturers can go a long way and don't require significant investments (see BA's Club Suites -- based on the Collins Aerospace Super Diamond reverse herringbone seat with a door added; all while having a relatively smooth implementation of this new product).
the majority of airlines have premium economy at 8 abreast on the A350 and 7 abreast on the 787.
I don't think you will see privacy dividers in premium economy for certification reasons - unless they are of the small type seen in DL's new domestic FC seats. and if any airlines do that, it most likely will be between all premium economy seats.
as for the comment below, DL does have a dedicated flight attendant at least on the A350s for premium select.
Premium economy is a great product that many airlines are just now figuring out how. I agree with you that a daytime flight under 12 hours in PE is very sufficient.
It looks like an adequate seat for short-medium hops. I would not be surprised if later frames with crew rests are more posh with doors and other creature comforts. A 'privacy shield' on the side of the seat is actually adequate on medium-haul length flights with the perfect balance of privacy for resting, getting work done and watching TV. The important thing is it's a bed with aisle access and what regular Emirates fliers are familiar with. The seat seems like a better version than what SQs regional/medium haul seat especially with that 'shield' blocking the window.
Looking at Premium Economy, that is one huge aisle! Way better than the competition with one less seat. I wondered why they went with a 2-3-2 configuration opposed to the industry standard 2-4-2. Even JAL who are known to go for premium heavy, low density configurations went with 2-4-2. Qantas could have gone for 2-3-2 for Project Sunrise. Same with SQ on their ULRs.
While Economy is still Economy, I like how they're customizing their colour combinations for their seat covers as opposed to choosing solid colours. SQ is a perfect example.
I have flown it many times but not recently. For the routes I fly I normally take QR or NH instead - from SE Asia to North America, over EK. In my opinion both are better than EK and both Doha and NRT/HND are better transit points in my view.
Interesting that the Q suite is being enhanced....my experience when I booked four trips on Q suites and actually travelled only ONCE in a Q suite has meant I will never book with Qatar ever again..
I think that what stands out the most is how Premium Economy is in a 2-3-2 config instead of the usual 2-4-2. That's one cabin where I *do* want to see a 7-abreast layout!
I agree... but there is no assurance that the manufacturers of those seats have production capacity available.
EK buys planes in high quantities on top of a pretty healthy order book for multiple airlines.
There simply is not a huge supply chain to crank out lots of seats esp. the "hottest models"
and I still think that the real issue is that EK wants to keep FC on its largest aircraft and the A350 is in their second tier size... remember that the majority of their aircraft have been 400 seats plus. they are still getting used to the idea of aircraft w/ less than 300 seats which is comparable to the majority of global airlines.
If they ever order the A350-1000, they might take a different approach.
The way I see it, Emirates play the “halo effect” game better than anyone! I will go as far as saying they are the masters and they plan and deploy it intentionally to sell seats. It’s nothing to do with aircraft delays, they know how to send the internet into a frenzy with certain products and use that pretty much for free to get publicity. Absolute genius but for being so disingenuous they lose my custom. Which of course they will lose no sleep over! I am small fry!
I think the reason why they got the new First Class in the first place is the same for why they can get away with angled seats in Business Class – halo effect. You have all these bloggers trying the new First Class (when it was first introduced) and raving about it, writing that it is the best First Class product of all. This created a huge halo effect for them. So no need to install the less efficient First Class on more planes. From a marketing perspective extremely smart strategy
Ceo Tim Clark said that this firsts A350's are going to be the regional ones that can fly up to 12 hours the long range that can fly 16 + hours will arrived in the Summer with crew rest areas.
One thing that captured my attention was 5 camera views. Currently, the A350 has 2 standard views being the tail and landing camera. I would like to know where the got the other 3 views from!
Agreed. There are several cases where I voluntarily select PE over business. Daytime VS 787 and daytime BA non-CS are two good examples where PE is the better value/trade-off.
Emirates finally features a 3-3-3 configuration on its planes.
So excited to see diversity in such a mundane fleet. =).
#LoveTheA350
Love how spacious that business class looks and feels,.with high ceilings and none of the claustrophobic gimmicky tiny sheets with doors that other carries offer. Can't wait to fly on them, and yes, Emirates gets it right by not going the way of tiny office cubicles but offering an amazing experience door to door instead.
This is there CI outshines BR when it comes to the premium economy cabin. CI is 2-3-2 whereas BR is 2-4-2. I would prefer the 7 abreast seating.
I've been based in the Middle East (Riyadh) for a year now and my go-to airline is Qatar Airways, not Emirates. The 2008 srars on Emirates - zero privacy, way too gaudy- are a major turnoff. The QSuites are a dream with fully closed in space. Can't imagine paying for Emirates with zero privacy. Plus the al Safwa lounge in Hamad International easily surpasses the "cafeteria-like" lounge Emirates has at DXB. Very sorry to see Emirates is resting on their laurels with zero imagination. Just wait til Riyadh Air comes on line (would love to see more articles on them please Ben) - they will force Emirates to advance if it's not too late.
Flown ek for 30 years plus..agree biz class very average hard product ...380 bar and comfort good ICE system amazing service can be very varied and pxs through the roof
The first 15 aircraft will have 312 seats same as this one which has been delivered. They do not have crew rest compartment because they will be used on short and medium haul flights.
The remaining 50 aircraft will have 298 seats with crew rest compartment and will be used on longer flights.
To be completely honest I think Emirates has found a sweet spot with their business class. It is heavily substance over style: it is made from expensive good quality materials with plenty of space for each passenger and perfect functionality. The seat leather, tablet and minibar do not make the seat any cheaper, I’d say it probably costs as much as Qsuite (per unit) and has the same space efficiency. So this is not a cost saving measure. It is Emirates knowing that many passengers value consistency and general comfort over superficial seat features (even though the door is popular with many passengers). So for me, while not the best business class seat in the sky, this is hardly a disappointment, nor a huge missed opportunity from Emirates. I feel like the reviewer community is a little out of touch with what most business class passengers really value in their experience. It’s not all about cheap Wi-fi and suite doors.
How many Qatar birds feature the Qsuites? What's the probability of your flight being changed to a non-Qsuite equipment??
Happy enough with Emirates B Class - Auckland - London. Next trip we will take Q Suite as privacy a much appreciated bonus.
@Ben - Head for Points reports that the later batches of A350 deliveries will be coming with a new Biz seat....
As you said, the seat is good enough. Pretty comfortable and does the trick if you get one if the “true” window seats. If they stay focussed on their soft product, EK will have a winning product for years to come.
I get that the industry has come up with all kinds of fancy new J seats - I’m just coming off a 12-hour flight in an LH Allegris “throne” seat, but a lot of that seems unnecessary. I think EK is doing the right thing by focussing on getting the basics right.
Looks like a huge improvement from the ‘90s, when they were installing 2-3-2 layout in business class on A300/310/A330s!
It’s ugly. Emirates is overrated.
They don’t need to innovate at the moment, they have a loyal customer base who like the seat and as you said the soft product.
Correction - these seats are from Stelia, not Safran.
These seats are the Solstys layout.
Yeah Emirates is definitely going to lose ground in the connecting game as we move towards the second half of the decade soon.
Qatar wins in all aspects for business class from the seats, lounges, service, and by being part of Oneworld.
Emirates is delusional if they think they can continue growing at this pace and building their DWC airport. Their marketing and hype is only going to last for so long, especially as Turkish Airlines modernizes its fleet. TK has better geography, Star Alliance integration, and generally better food.
Given that almost every Emirates itinerary requires connecting, I have no interest in flying them at all when the other one stop options are so much better. Even if I were flying to or from DXB, Qatar would be preferred due to the Al Safwa lounge and better seats.
Agree with Turkish, and worth noting they have a growing & better US network as well, reaching points like DEN and DTW, which EK hasn't kept up with. But QR obviously has a superior product as of now.
Only case left for flying EK is on a route where there would be only narrowbodies on TK and QR; very rare, but there are a handful
There’s some synergy between EK and UA in this regard.
@Ben
Emirates does not care to introduce a competitive business class seat because they know very well that they were and are still making huge profits selling their old 7-abreast 2-3-2 business class. People were flying with them and will still fly with them even if they continue flying the 2-3-2 business class till 2040s. So the new 1-2-1 seats is a big improvement over their old 2-3-2. As Ben mentioned food on Emirates is great. Also it is nice to see premium economy to be 2-3-2 instead of the industry norm 2-4-2 on the A350s.
On the other hand Qatar Airways and Etihad have very good industry leading seats in business class. All they need to do is to embrace the premium economy product and introduce the cabin on their aircraft.
You need only look at the LH debacle with getting new seat products approved and EK probably made the right choice.
The fact that they have had as many planes as they do without direct aisle business class for as long as they have says volumes about the halo effect of the brand - and even more so about the fact that EK has dominated the Middle East market for so long that they can do what they want.
There will be more competition, hugely innovative new lie flat products in either first or business don't necessarily translate into a revenue advantage, and the rollout of the 777X will take far longer than the delays on the MAX 7/10. Hoping for innovation on the 777X, as many airlines are doing, will result in lost opportunities.
I am a gold member with emirates and fly them every few weeks. Their business class on the A380 is fantastic and the retro fitted planes are top notch. The design for the A350 is very similar yes and that doesn’t bother me as they have upgraded the tech. For me personally I don’t really care about a door. Even flying First Class my door is always open.
If I'm being honest, the premium-economy sections at just 21 seats looks like it may be more enjoyable than business-class. Sure, you won't get the same wine selection. And sure, the food is going to be different. But I imagine there's at least one dedicated flight attendant for premium. If that's the case, the service may be more attentive. And for a daytime flight, premium-economy -- outside the middle seat -- would be fine.