American Airlines is in the news once again for threatening to kick someone off over their clothing choice.
American Passenger Forced To Cover Up Shirt
As reported by BuzzFeed News, Swati Runi Goyal and her husband were traveling from Florida to Nevada on October 30, when the crew advised her that she had to change her shirt or would be kicked off the plane.
Goyal was wearing a “Hail Satan” shirt.
Goyal isn’t a “satan worshipper,” but rather is a member of The Satanic Temple, which is a non-theistic religious group. They’re recognized as a church for the purposes of tax exemption, and are active in 13 states in the US. The stated mission of the group is “to encourage benevolence and empathy among all people.”
As Goyal described the shirt:
“It’s an ironic shirt. People usually laugh at it, or they give me a thumbs up because they understand the meaning behind it.”
So how did this all unfold? Goyal got settled into her seat and was approached by a crew member and told she had to change her shirt or get off the plane:
“He said, ‘Our crew has found your shirt to be offensive.’ We initially just thought it was a joke. But he repeated the directive, and there was another female crew member who was behind him with her arms crossed looking very angry.
“The man said, ‘Your shirt is offensive. Do you know what that means?’ I said, ‘I’m a foreign-born minority woman, I understand ‘offensive,’ and this shirt is not offensive.’”
Her husband was wearing layers, so she covered up the shirt with one of his shirts, and they were allowed to stay onboard.
What Is American Airlines’ Dress Code?
American Airlines has a vague and lax dress code, as follows:
Dress appropriately; bare feet or offensive clothing aren’t allowed.
What American Airlines Says
When Goyal first contacted American Airlines to complain, she was dismissed. She got a response saying that they “have policies in place to ensure that no passengers are subjected to objectionable situations while on board.”
The response went on to say that “our flight attendants have a responsibility to all passengers in our care, and we must sometimes make difficult decisions associated with the application of our policies.”
Only once this made it to social media yesterday did American take it seriously. An American spokesperson said the following:
“We apologize to Ms. Goyal for her experience, and we are reaching out to her to understand what occurred.”
The airline allegedly contacted her and offered to refund her tickets.
My Take On This Situation
It’s completely ridiculous that this lady was threatened over her t-shirt. It seems pretty obvious that it’s intended to be ironic. Also, American’s dress code policy might seem lax on the surface, though more than anything else just seems vague. Suggesting that people can’t wear “offensive” clothing is very open-ended.
Could wearing a cross be considered offensive to someone of a different religion? Where is the line drawn?
I’m happy that social media ended up being what exposed this story, because otherwise it seems like American wouldn’t have taken it seriously.
What do you make of this situation?
@ Chris
As an ex 5th grade teacher, I'm appalled with your poor grammar. I would not have accepted any of your messages to pass without multiple red marks and serious re-writes.
You say you're a lawyer?
@pete
Let's hope you're right and that Satanists will be free to share their peaceful, law abiding views.
And that AA will be forced to apologize and pay.
Have a Satanic day!
Hail Satan!
@Patrick
I don’t know why you are so worked up. You hold all the trendy beliefs and people who agree with you hold all the corporate institutional power. I’m sure this person will get a big reward from AA for getting kicked off the flight.
If you think this is mad, insane or unbelieveable, check out how securities at Guangzhou metro ask for girls in lolita to change...
@Jason - there's a difference (beyond the fact that you demonstrably don't understand what The Satanic Temple actually does).
You see, Hitler actually existed.
@Pete
Your original point, like all subsequent posts you make, is rife with errors.
While it’s tempting to mock your religion, a tale invented by nomads about human sacrifice and cannibalism, that is hardly the point of the upside down cross.
Not my problem that you’re so disabled by your superstitions that you cannot understand the idea. That’s on you and the intellectual darkness you spread through your cult.
But get used to...
@Pete
Your original point, like all subsequent posts you make, is rife with errors.
While it’s tempting to mock your religion, a tale invented by nomads about human sacrifice and cannibalism, that is hardly the point of the upside down cross.
Not my problem that you’re so disabled by your superstitions that you cannot understand the idea. That’s on you and the intellectual darkness you spread through your cult.
But get used to it, you’ll be seeing a lot more of us. And we don’t much care if it bothers you.
Hail Satan!
To all those saying she should be allowed to wear this shirt...I suppose she should also be allowed to wear a shirt that says HAIL HITLER on a flight to Germany? Because, you know, it's just a joke.
Hitler...Satan...both the epitome of evil & suffering. It's not funny. Stop being a moron.
@Patrick
Actually, that was my original point before I stopped to debunk the claims that the upside down cross is not intended to mock the death of Christ. If the shirt was mocking, say Islam, this story would be about the Islamophobic bigot rightfully removed from the plane. However, since the shirt mocks Christianity, we get a story about the discrimination this poor person faced from the Satanphobic crew, and a massive chorus of agreement...
@Patrick
Actually, that was my original point before I stopped to debunk the claims that the upside down cross is not intended to mock the death of Christ. If the shirt was mocking, say Islam, this story would be about the Islamophobic bigot rightfully removed from the plane. However, since the shirt mocks Christianity, we get a story about the discrimination this poor person faced from the Satanphobic crew, and a massive chorus of agreement from all corners of polite, progressive, society. And I’m sure we will see more upside down crosses...
@Pete, your fixation on your Christian sky daddy is tiresome.
The upside down cross is a powerful reminder of our calling to prevent the spread of dominant religious symbols associated with state power, a history and political iconography you conveniently reduce to “mocking” your chosen superstitions.
It’s not all about you, Pete, or even about your religion. While I consider your sky daddy religion idiotic in virtually every aspect, is of interest to...
@Pete, your fixation on your Christian sky daddy is tiresome.
The upside down cross is a powerful reminder of our calling to prevent the spread of dominant religious symbols associated with state power, a history and political iconography you conveniently reduce to “mocking” your chosen superstitions.
It’s not all about you, Pete, or even about your religion. While I consider your sky daddy religion idiotic in virtually every aspect, is of interest to Satanists for its abuse of political power, not for its ridiculous beliefs.
You’ll be seeing more upside down crosses, Pete. Get used to it.
@David
Are you disputing that the upside down cross is intended to mock the death of Christ, or disputing the crew’s contention that the shirt was offensive? I don’t care what does or doesn’t offend you, or what AA’s dress code is. I’m just not going to be gaslit by Patrick into believing that the upside down cross is some arbitrary symbol chosen by Santanists for no specific reason.
@Pete
I dislike Christianity because of the crusade. People who wear anything related to Christianity must necessarily be mocking me and intentionally offending me. Anyone who wishes others Merry Christmas should be removed from the flight.
See how absurd it is when you cherry pick which religion to favor and punish others for intentions that you have no proof of?
@Patrick
In this context, the obvious meaning of the upside down cross is to mock Christ’s death on the cross, and those who believe it had any significance. It wasn’t some arbitrary symbol chosen at random. I’m sure this person got exactly the reaction for which they were hoping.
@Pete, you are incorrect. The inverted cross is hardly intended to mock Christianity. It is a legitimate and entirely different symbol of another religion.
Whatever your personal beliefs, you can’t just dismiss those of others, even if you disagree. Satanism is now one of America’s leading religions and it did not achieve this status by merely mocking other religions.
Hail Satan!
Some people like to wear things to test things. This woman is one of those people.
@Patrick
He was alluding to the upside down cross on the satanist’s shirt, which is obviously intended to mock Christianity. If the Santanist was wearing a shirt mocking Islam or Judaism, we wouldn’t even be having this discussion.
@craankwilhelm
Are you actually attacking this courageous Satanist because she did not wear a t-shirt espousing your beliefs? Or are you suggesting that we should ditch our secular rule of law and adopt religious rules as in Qatar or the UAE?
Why is Satanism the equivalent of an upside down image of Mohammed? This makes no sense at all.
Either way, your point is hard to understand or accept.
What if you...
@craankwilhelm
Are you actually attacking this courageous Satanist because she did not wear a t-shirt espousing your beliefs? Or are you suggesting that we should ditch our secular rule of law and adopt religious rules as in Qatar or the UAE?
Why is Satanism the equivalent of an upside down image of Mohammed? This makes no sense at all.
Either way, your point is hard to understand or accept.
What if you had to pass a basic test of general knowledge, including major world religions and history, to obtain US citizenship, rather than just granting it by birth.
We’d be rid of so many idiots.
@Patrick,
Who would like to see this little vegan snowflake try to wear a similarly oriented t-shirt with an upside down character of Mohammed boarding an Etihad flight in Abu Dabi or a Qatar flight in Doha? Wouldn't that be a fun one to see.
Anyone who goes around wearing a shirt like this is looking to give offense and wants confrontation.
Looks like she got both.
Who thinks the comment section would be full of support for AA, if instead of an upside down cross to disparage Christians, the shirt attacked *any* other religion.
@Dave
We really do appreciate your interest in Satanism.
Thank you also for recognizing that Satanism is America’s leading religion and that we are also leading the way in our volunteer efforts. I’ve personally logged more than 1000 hours of volunteer service since becoming a Sa tanist. I distribute Satanic coloring books to elementary schools, provide meals for the homeless and help with efforts to put pedophile priests behind bars. I also get to...
@Dave
We really do appreciate your interest in Satanism.
Thank you also for recognizing that Satanism is America’s leading religion and that we are also leading the way in our volunteer efforts. I’ve personally logged more than 1000 hours of volunteer service since becoming a Sa tanist. I distribute Satanic coloring books to elementary schools, provide meals for the homeless and help with efforts to put pedophile priests behind bars. I also get to tell high school kids about Satanism and its importance in civic life.
Let me know if you would like help channeling what i hope is a genuine desire to help others. If you’re serious about helping put Christian child abusers/rapists behind bars, there are organizations in literally every state that could use your help.
Please be inspired to live your best, most Satanic life!
Hail Satan! And may Baphomet be with you.
@Dave
Thank you for recognizing that Satanism is America’s leading religion and that we are also leading the way in our volunteer efforts. I’ve personally logged more than 1000 hours of volunteer service since becoming a Satanist. I distribute Satanic coloring books to elementary schools, provide meals for the homeless and help with efforts to put pedophile priests behind bars. I also get to tell high school kids about Satanism and its importance in civic...
@Dave
Thank you for recognizing that Satanism is America’s leading religion and that we are also leading the way in our volunteer efforts. I’ve personally logged more than 1000 hours of volunteer service since becoming a Satanist. I distribute Satanic coloring books to elementary schools, provide meals for the homeless and help with efforts to put pedophile priests behind bars. I also get to tell high school kids about Satanism and its importance in civic life.
Let me know if you would like help channeling what i hope is a genuine desire to help others. If you’re serious about helping put Christian child abusers/rapists behind bars, there are organizations in literally every state that could use your help.
Hail Satan! And may Baphomet be with you.
@Patrick, come at the Christians for scamming old people any time. Right after we stop off and volunteer at all the Church of Satan soup kitchens, hospitals, and homeless shelters. Oh, wait...
@David
From an etiquette point of view, when someone tells you to have a “blessed day” or whatever, you should assume good intent. You should also respond in kind, with equally good intent by wishing them a Satanic day, by wishing them a day filled with Satanic joy or by saying “may Baphomet be with you”.
That shows them you understand their intentions and wish to reciprocate the kind wishes in your own way.
Hail Satan!
I just want to say “Hail Satan and happy holidays!!!”
I’m glad Chris feels blessed by his sky daddy. When s/he pretends to have legal knowledge I like it even more because it’s super funny to watch.
Even funnier: AA apologized and I’m guessing it won’t end there. As a long time Satanist, I’m guessing some highly theatrical legal work will force a settlement and public statement.
To those who support AA because...
I just want to say “Hail Satan and happy holidays!!!”
I’m glad Chris feels blessed by his sky daddy. When s/he pretends to have legal knowledge I like it even more because it’s super funny to watch.
Even funnier: AA apologized and I’m guessing it won’t end there. As a long time Satanist, I’m guessing some highly theatrical legal work will force a settlement and public statement.
To those who support AA because they want to ban “evil”, maybe focus your time/attention on all the Christians who abuse children or scam old people? Get a life.
Have a Satanic day!
@Chris
<>
Remain blessed implies I am already blessed? I am hearing this more frequently, and from strangers. What exactly does it mean when someone says "have a blessed day" or similar such instruction, and since I don't know what it means, how should I respond? Saying "don't tell me what to do" seems rude.
Good for AA. No one needs to be around that kind of evil statement, and I'm glad at least some people are still asking other humans to be decent people. Those of you defending the Satanic Temple as an "ethical organization" might consider the ethics of intentionally offending and disturbing people who just want to get on a plane and fly somewhere in peace, and not be forced to look at phrasing that is grotesquely...
Good for AA. No one needs to be around that kind of evil statement, and I'm glad at least some people are still asking other humans to be decent people. Those of you defending the Satanic Temple as an "ethical organization" might consider the ethics of intentionally offending and disturbing people who just want to get on a plane and fly somewhere in peace, and not be forced to look at phrasing that is grotesquely offensive to their being.
As to being a "foreign born woman" - I've never gone to a foreign country and not adjusted my behavior and dress to fit the culture. She should do the same without complaint.
@ Chris
The crew made a decision totally incorrect and not understandable under the US constitution. One of the most important freedoms under the constitution are free speech and the freedom of religion. This tangles both. The woman was absolutely allowed to wear this shirt according to both freedoms and the shirt was not a threat to security so there was absolutely no excuse for this decision and NO reasonable court (which unfortunately is...
@ Chris
The crew made a decision totally incorrect and not understandable under the US constitution. One of the most important freedoms under the constitution are free speech and the freedom of religion. This tangles both. The woman was absolutely allowed to wear this shirt according to both freedoms and the shirt was not a threat to security so there was absolutely no excuse for this decision and NO reasonable court (which unfortunately is not always the case in the US) would decide otherwise.
These reports about flight attendents runnig wilde on a power trip are one reason, why I have not flown US airlines since 9/11 and will not do so in the future. This would never happen with a European or Asian airline. The flight attend would loose his job very quickly. US flight attendents have forrgotten they are doing a service job. As President Lincoln once said: to get to know the character of someone, give him power....
Again, this is the reason I have yet to set foot on an AA flight in 3 years. This airline is a disgrace to the US and the flight attendants are an embarrassment to flight professionals around the world.
@ARJ "Jesus christ, can we put aside desperately trying to be the victim for 5 seconds…?"
Yeah, I thought the same thing about the crew members who were offended
Last year or so I made a post on Flyertalk and used the expression "Car rental from Hell in Argentina" or something like that. A mod found it objectionable and edited out the word Hell wherever I wrote it.
Was not informed. I was as furious as can be. I eventually just deleted the entire content of the post which had nice photographs, etc...made a nice effort to make a nice post and the FT...
Last year or so I made a post on Flyertalk and used the expression "Car rental from Hell in Argentina" or something like that. A mod found it objectionable and edited out the word Hell wherever I wrote it.
Was not informed. I was as furious as can be. I eventually just deleted the entire content of the post which had nice photographs, etc...made a nice effort to make a nice post and the FT moderator ruined it. A-hole.
Snowflakes - young or old. Funny..if you trace the roots of all this politically correctness.
Alternative snowflake term only started in the last 10 years or so? Coincide with Smartphones or what not. Brain damage...radiation is probable.
Politically correct - late 1980s...cordless / cell phones? Hmm...needs a little more investigation. Maybe in combination with something else. Caffeine? Here - see for yourself when PC started.
https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=politically+correct&year_start=1800&year_end=2000&corpus=15&smoothing=3&share=&direct_url=t1%3B%2Cpolitically%20correct%3B%2Cc0#t1%3B%2Cpolitically%20correct%3B%2Cc0
Delta once made me cover up my American Can Suck My Balls shirt. Just saying.
Incorrect, Contract of Carriage condition for the offensive material would be overruled by the Common Carrier terms because the satanic temple is recognized by the IRS as a religious organization. All she would have to do in link the shirt to the religious practice. What matters is what's on paper. You can argue they're all atheists, but that has a large amount of subjectivity and a dangerous precedent for the court to even consider such...
Incorrect, Contract of Carriage condition for the offensive material would be overruled by the Common Carrier terms because the satanic temple is recognized by the IRS as a religious organization. All she would have to do in link the shirt to the religious practice. What matters is what's on paper. You can argue they're all atheists, but that has a large amount of subjectivity and a dangerous precedent for the court to even consider such a defense by the airline.
Common carrier guidelines are supreme to the contract of carriage. Even the contract of carriage states "If these Conditions of Carriage conflict with applicable laws, rules or security directives from U.S. or foreign government agencies, the applicable laws, rules or security directives will govern". If the shirt wasn't able to be linked to an actual religious practice or recognized religious group, then the whole thing would be fair (or fare) game.
I love that people on here are quoting a Wiki page... stupid millennials. Hate to see what kind of world they will leave to their future generations. Fortunately I won't be alive to find out.
I love that the idiot in question needed to call-out that she's foreign-born, a minority, a vegan, and that she was wearing vegan boots. Missed some worthwhile name-dropping though.
Perhaps AOC will invite her to speak to a Congressional committee.
Good on American.
AA's plane. AA's rules.
Pretty straight forward. She wore a shirt to get a reaction. She got one. She was told to cover up. She did. AA should not give her a penny or a mile. Everyone got where they were going.
As for the 'milk is rape' hat or 'praise Jesus shirts', if someone was offended by these, and the FA's agreed and tells you to cover-up/take it off, cover-up/take it off.
@schar, 2 things:
1. You've demonstrated that you know nothing about The Satanic Temple - ignorance helps no one - the person in question is actually an atheist and the mission of the organisation her clothing referenced is far more ethical than that of many religious institutions.
2. There is no evidence that any deity exists, including whichever one you're referencing in your statement. You look quite foolish.
@Ed
Personally nothing offends.
But the discussion is not me.
However I do believe in Equal justice under law . The cabin crew made a decision which in my opinion is correct and until it reaches the hall of Justice we are merely speculating.
Me included. Remain blessed everyone.
Good on American, there's no room for satanic negativity in this world. She clearly wore it to be provocative. May God have mercy on her soul.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/08/14/business/airlines-dress-code-travel.amp.html
@Chris
What if someone wears "Praise the lord" shirt and I'm offended by that because I'm a Muslim? Should I get them removed? Ridiculous.
Their airline ..their rules ... like it or not you are always subject to T’s & C’s - perhaps wear clothing that is suitable for a confined public space that won’t offend anyone , relaxed and comfortable but no “statements “ ?
@Ross
I could do a screenshot, but I'm too lazy. But if you go here: https://www.aa.com/i18n/customer-service/support/conditions-of-carriage.jsp and click on contract details, it states that TX law is the governing law of the ticket. Not sure why they would choose TX law, since its weird and not the most corporate friendly in general, but i can imagine that their lobbyists have made it somewhat AA friendly over the years.
MIA to LAS tells you all you need to know..... Snore-
There is no finer entertainment than seeing some entitled Christian frothing at the mouth because someone had the audacity to make fun of their idiotic sky daddy.
Well, with one exception: entitled Christians frothing at the moyputh because someone made fun of their sky daddy religion who also pretend to have legal knowledge. That might be the only exception to this rule. If “Chris is a lawyer, I can guarantee he’s never been paid...
There is no finer entertainment than seeing some entitled Christian frothing at the mouth because someone had the audacity to make fun of their idiotic sky daddy.
Well, with one exception: entitled Christians frothing at the moyputh because someone made fun of their sky daddy religion who also pretend to have legal knowledge. That might be the only exception to this rule. If “Chris is a lawyer, I can guarantee he’s never been paid for his services. Not his legal services.
She should sue. Satanism is a religion, as you will discover if you read the case history around the Satanic Temple. Want to find out? Try handing out bibles in schools. We’ll be there the next day distributing Satanic coloring books to elementary school kids. The American crew violated her rights by deeming her religion offensive. The crew in question should be fired and made to do community service for the Satanic Temple, America’s leading religion.
God bless the Satanic Temple.
Hail Satan!!
I’m an old guy raised as a Christian who flies AA a lot and have ABSOLUTELY no problem with her wearing it. Was the flight attendant a bible thumper or something. As you noted begat about people that find a cross offensive. BTW I have seen people on AA flights wearing shirts with the “F word” and the “C word” fully spelled out and they were allowed to fly so this seems very petty on the part of the AA crew.
@Andre: I think a lobotomy definitely helps to become a worshipper of the now almost 2000 year dead Palestinian and if you're a fan of the apparatus by which first-century Romans put to death and tortured Jewish insurgents you must be rather bonkers. To me all the people wearing it publicly are rather offensive ...and I would guess even the dead Palestinian wouldn't want to see the device again with that he was tortured to death.
You will live longer if you pick and choose your battles and let things like this go. No need to get worked up about everything. You will have health problems later in life if you feel stressed out and offended by everything.
Hilarious that so many commentators here basically validates the need for the existence of The Satanic Temple. It's purpose isn't to offend or promote the biblical Satan. If that's what you think, then you're woefully uninformed on the subject.
Do yourselves a favor and at least read the wiki entry first before engaging, Lucky even linked it in his post.
American has the most inconsistent service I’ve ever seen! I’ve had wonderful FAs on transcon flights like LAX-JFK (Especially in business) but absolutely craptastic staff on less prestigious routes. I’ve even been on local flights (SAN-PHX, which is a hub of theirs) where sometimes the planes are new and epic and the staff is cool and sometimes the tray tables literally had grimy gunk in the hinges and the staff could not have possibly given...
American has the most inconsistent service I’ve ever seen! I’ve had wonderful FAs on transcon flights like LAX-JFK (Especially in business) but absolutely craptastic staff on less prestigious routes. I’ve even been on local flights (SAN-PHX, which is a hub of theirs) where sometimes the planes are new and epic and the staff is cool and sometimes the tray tables literally had grimy gunk in the hinges and the staff could not have possibly given less of a damn. I don’t recommend American unless it’s transcon business: you’re never sure if it’s going to be awesome or cringeworthy.
Lots of first time/last time posters came here courtesy of news feeds. Nothing like a good trigger warning to get the various Christians frothing for extra and delivering extra ad revenue. I'm thankful every day for people who are easily manipulated :)
@chasgoose
Show me where in the Contract of Carriage it says Texas law applies.
No, I didn't think you could.
Good for her for simply covering it up and moving on. Waiting to have the cops called is could have made this obnoxious.
Move on in the moment, let social media deal with it later.
It seems some American Airlines flight attendants are triggered quite easily.
Perhaps these snowflakes should look for jobs where they don't have to, y'know, see other people.
If our lawyer commenters were actual lawyers, they'd know that the airline is subject to common carrier guidelines by DOT.
They cannot discriminate against passengers for religious, gender, race, etc reasons. It's a fact that a foreign carrier cannot operate flights to/from the US, if they discriminate against passengers. Common carriers are required to fly passengers because they operate in the public spaces and allow ticketing for non-chartered flights. The idea that she was on...
If our lawyer commenters were actual lawyers, they'd know that the airline is subject to common carrier guidelines by DOT.
They cannot discriminate against passengers for religious, gender, race, etc reasons. It's a fact that a foreign carrier cannot operate flights to/from the US, if they discriminate against passengers. Common carriers are required to fly passengers because they operate in the public spaces and allow ticketing for non-chartered flights. The idea that she was on a plane doesn't matter whether AA owns the plane as private property or if a regional carrier operates it. They're common carriers and must adhere to DOT guidelines
Ross,
The Satan shirt was satin.
With that said, Beezelbub and Pazuzu couldn't get me on AA again.
@Chris
What’s the deal with far right American idiots and random capitalisation and ridiculous punctuation? Are these the types of oinking troglodytes who think immigrants should respect “are” language? These subliterate morons are the exact reason the nickname “seppo” is as applicable to Americans now as it was during the 1940s. Just the absolute scum of the earth: outraged by everything and ashamed of nothing.
@Andre
Your personal beliefs about whether "all religions are not created equal" doesn't matter. Under the eyes of the Constitution, in the US all religions must be treated equally.
@Andre - you have zero evidence to support your statements about spiritual forces.
Delusion is best treated with professional psychiatric intervention.
@Andre, do you remember the brand of the detergent that was used to wash your brain?
@ Matt, it's debatable that religious freedom is in effect in the US.
The amount of religionist idiocy introduced into law by elected officials, discrimination against people based on their faith (or lack thereof) and placing "In God We Trust" everywhere speaks to this.
There are plenty of examples of people refusing to realise that freedom of religion also includes freedom from religion - this does need to be corrected.
AA was right in this case. The comments above, sadly, reflect what happens when a nation completely loses its moral bearings and is no longer able to tell the difference between right and wrong. Anyone who is ignorant of the reality that there are spiritual forces around us, some working for good and some working for evil, should do a bit of research on the topic. Not all religions are created equal. Satan is not...
AA was right in this case. The comments above, sadly, reflect what happens when a nation completely loses its moral bearings and is no longer able to tell the difference between right and wrong. Anyone who is ignorant of the reality that there are spiritual forces around us, some working for good and some working for evil, should do a bit of research on the topic. Not all religions are created equal. Satan is not a force that any sensible person should mess with--let alone advertise publicly in the narrow confines of a plane.
I believe we should amend the US Constitution to remove religious freedom and go one step further and ban all religions.
The number of people staying objections to this shirt on the basis of their preferred religious myths is ridiculous.
Satanism is more moral and ethical than all of the other religions out there, Christianity included. I applaud the man's courage for wearing that shirt and I am offended by AA's attempt to silence him. We need more people like him and maybe the world would be a better place.
Sorry, perhaps I'm missing the point ... what was the issue? As far as the lecture of this posting tells me, she was not attacking any crew, staff or fellow pax, not even threatening to do so. I personally don't like the design of her shirt and would never dress that way, but hang on, I don't expect anyone to follow my taste.
@D3KingAmerican,
What do you anticipate they would do?
Anyone wearing a shirt that says hail Satan took a wrong turn at some point in life. I wouldn’t feel comfortable on a plane with them. Good job American.
Chris must have gone to a law school with a pretty poor legal writing program if he's making this many basic errors in spelling, grammar, and punctuation.
So the woman wore a shirt to get a reaction, got a reaction, then invoked the "I'm a minority woman, only I can define what is offensive!" card?
Jesus christ, can we put aside desperately trying to be the victim for 5 seconds...?
American can be sued anywhere they do business. A real lawyer would know that.
Do they make special fabric shirts that say HAIL SATIN ? I wonder how the average Texan would take that.
@Chris
Texas law does apply, but not because AA's HQ is in TX, but because the contract of carriage states that Texas law applies. That said, I have to imagine that Texas has fairly robust laws prohibiting private businesses from discriminating against people on the basis of religion. The Satanic Temple is recognized as a religion by the federal government and, as a result, wearing the t-shirt should be protected under those laws. Given that...
@Chris
Texas law does apply, but not because AA's HQ is in TX, but because the contract of carriage states that Texas law applies. That said, I have to imagine that Texas has fairly robust laws prohibiting private businesses from discriminating against people on the basis of religion. The Satanic Temple is recognized as a religion by the federal government and, as a result, wearing the t-shirt should be protected under those laws. Given that AA is a publicly traded corporation that does not and cannot have a professed religious identity (unlike, say, Hobby Lobby), it would be hard for them to argue any justifiable reason for their actions. It would and should have the same result if American had forced someone to remove a crucifix necklace, or a yarmulke, or a hijab.
I don't unterstand, why people have to wear this in public. I had a lady on my last American flight wich a cap saying "milk is rape" . Really?
They probably let her fly because they were afraid that she would complain too.
She should have removed her satan shirt.
American Airlines once made me cover up a cardboard sign I was carrying aboard. It was a strike poster for AA workers.
@ Icarus.
I am not saying I am right. That is left for the halls of Justice to decide. What I am saying as I have a better chance of presenting the facts.
Lastly my reference to Texas. Is due fact number 1 American Airlines is headquartered in Fort Worth, Texas, adjacent to the Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport. So the plaintiff lawsuit needs to come here first. After which the crew will invoke...
@ Icarus.
I am not saying I am right. That is left for the halls of Justice to decide. What I am saying as I have a better chance of presenting the facts.
Lastly my reference to Texas. Is due fact number 1 American Airlines is headquartered in Fort Worth, Texas, adjacent to the Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport. So the plaintiff lawsuit needs to come here first. After which the crew will invoke several instances protected and guarded by the Texas Constitution.
This is not about my view or yours. Its about the view of the defendant ( who I stand by ) and the plaintiff who you stand by.
That's the beauty of our amazing Nation.
Is the shirt provocative? Yes. Can they wear it under the freedom of expression? Yes. Must they wear it? No.
I don't understand why people feel an urge to be provocative just because they can. Can't they just wear a plain shirt while on the plane? Why kick up a fuss? Just get on the plane, be nice, and get off. You get to go where you want to go without drama. Easy.
The world...
Is the shirt provocative? Yes. Can they wear it under the freedom of expression? Yes. Must they wear it? No.
I don't understand why people feel an urge to be provocative just because they can. Can't they just wear a plain shirt while on the plane? Why kick up a fuss? Just get on the plane, be nice, and get off. You get to go where you want to go without drama. Easy.
The world is going to shit because of attitudes like this. And blogs like this that gives these issues needless attention.
@Chris
I'm not sure what the Texas Constitution has to do with this. Yes, American (a Delaware corporation) has some offices there, but this was a flight from Florida to Nevada. Are you saying that if a plane crashes in London, the survivors must come to Dallas for compensation? It's true that American owns that private space. I suppose you are trying to remind us that it can prohibit black or brown passengers from occupying...
@Chris
I'm not sure what the Texas Constitution has to do with this. Yes, American (a Delaware corporation) has some offices there, but this was a flight from Florida to Nevada. Are you saying that if a plane crashes in London, the survivors must come to Dallas for compensation? It's true that American owns that private space. I suppose you are trying to remind us that it can prohibit black or brown passengers from occupying it. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a special provision in the Texas Constitution for that. Probably against the law for American to have apologized, now. MAGA Americans (whose clothing is offensive to me) should join in a class action against it.
@ Chris. Typical trump supporter response. Being a lawyer doesn’t mean you’re correct. And you allude to Texas. What has that to do wit anything ? I guess if she was carrying a gun and wearing a t shirt saying praise to Jesus , you would support her
Anyhow I vented.
@Icarus.
As a lawyer . I can assure the plaintiff Goyal, that it will not pass muster in the halls of Justice. The space occupied by her is private property and American Airlines owns that space. The potential of the plaintiff creating a commotion is real and the crew made a good valued judgement , if you dig deeper into this the Texas Constitution will offer protection to the Crew. As for your accusation of me. I can only say God Bless America.
I Can’t ever remember taking note of what another passenger was wearing on a plane. Especially not a nondescript black shirt with fairly small lettering.
The purpose of the shirt was obviously to be provacative. I'll gladly give my money to American airlines next time I fly.
Wonder what would happen if I wore my HAIL MALTHUS tshirt on board?
Also: is this a new strategy for mileage running? Wear something controversial and hope to get your cost per mile down to 0.
@Chris,
How exactly was this woman a "trouble maker"?
@ Chris - I guess you are one of the above as I described. Why is it acceptable for some Americans to wear t shirts saying “ praise the lord “ or “ Jesus “ ?! That’s also offensive to many
Americans. Understand if it was abusive or profane language
Some people there go apoplectic if they see a woman’s breast or ankle
"I’m a foreign-born minority woman." Good grief. Modern Western culture is nothing more than various aggrieved and offended people trying to one-up the other party's offendedness level.
For what it's worth, these FA's need to calm the hell down. Her shirt was an obvious joke.
@Claus Andersen.
We love our country stay where you are. Good job AA. We don't need trouble makers on board. Let them fly on European Carrier's.
Dude probably should’ve flown United seeing that they allowed someone to fly with them that was wearing a t-shirt calling for the lynching and execution of journalists and I’d like to think that’s way more offensive than saying hail satan (sadly I don’t think that’s the case to many many folks though)
Another reason not to fly this lousy airline. I'm sorry for my American friends that they have to put up with such a crappy standard whenever they have to fly. The US sued to have some of the best airlines in the world. But these days, it's the continent where I dislike flying the most, because of the arsewipes who run US aviation these days.