Sheesh: Unprofessional Toronto ATC Argues With British Airways Pilot

Sheesh: Unprofessional Toronto ATC Argues With British Airways Pilot

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Canadians have a reputation for being friendly, but perhaps that doesn’t apply to at least one of the tower controllers at Canada’s busiest airport…

British Airways pilot angry over air traffic controller behavior

VASAviation has the air traffic control audio and a visualization of an event that recently happened at Toronto Pearson International Airport (YYZ). It involves a British Airways jet, as it approached the airport.

On the approach frequency, the British Airways flight was given clearance for the ILS approach on runway 6R. The pilots were then told to switch over to the tower frequency, as is standard… and that’s where things went downhill.

Once they switched frequencies, they announced their presence — “Speedbird 9ZY heavy, established 06R.” There was no response from the air traffic controller, so they made another call. Here’s how that went from there:

British Airways pilot: “Speedbird 9ZY heavy”
Air traffic controller: “Continue.”
British Airways pilot: “Speedbird 9ZY heavy, confirm we’re cleared for the approach?”
Air traffic controller: “Go back to arrival, please, Speedbird.”
British Airways pilot: “Speedbird 9ZY heavy, we’re established 10 miles for 06R.”
Air traffic controller: “Continue.”
British Airways pilot: “Speedbird 9ZY heavy, confirm we’re cleared the approach?”
Air traffic controller: “Speedbird 9ZY, go back to arrival, please. Arrival frequency. Go back to arrival.”
British Airways pilot: “Can you give me the frequency, please, for 9ZY.”
Air traffic controller: “Your last assigned arrival you were on, go back to them.”
British Airways pilot: “Can you give me the frequency, please? Because we will be transfered over.”

The British Airways pilot was then ignored, so he followed up, and then here’s how that went:

British Airways pilot: “Speedbird 9ZY heavy, request.”
British Airways pilot: “Tower, Speedbird 9ZY heavy.”
Air traffic controller: “Speedbird 9ZY, that’s what happens when you don’t listen to arrival. What can I do for you?”
British Airways pilot: “We were transfered to this frequency from arrival, you sent us back there, we haven’t got the frequency.”
Air traffic controller: “Okay, you’re asking if you’re on the approach. I don’t do the approach, arrivals does that. So did arrivals give you the approach for 06R?”
British Airways pilot: “They gave the approach for 06R, affirm, fully established.”
Air traffic controller: “Okay, so you were asking if you had the approach and you have been given the approach, so Speedbird 9ZY, number two, cleared to land 06R.”

Once the plane was on the ground, the British Airways pilot asked for a phone number to call, to speak to the supervisor. He ended up getting a bit of a runaround there, as well as some criticism on the frequency for talking for so long.

The air traffic controller has such an unnecessary attitude

Air traffic controllers have incredibly stressful jobs, so I can never make sense of when they intentionally make their lives more difficult than necessary. For those less familiar with air traffic control, what actually happened here? Let me explain:

  • When the British Airways pilot first reached out to the tower controller, he was obviously confused, because the controller simply responded with “continue,” without mentioning the callsign (the air traffic controller should always use callsigns, because he could’ve just as easily been referring to another plane)
  • The British Airways pilot then slightly misspoke, and asked if they were cleared for the approach; the tower controller doesn’t issue approach instructions but only issues landing clearance, but the pilot’s intention was clear (like “can you confirm the ‘continue’ was intended for Speedbird 9ZY, and that we can continue our approach?”)
  • But then the air traffic controller became even more of a smartass, and told him to go back to the arrivals frequency, even though the pilot obviously knew they had approach clearance, but just wanted to be sure that the air traffic controller was acknowledging their transmissions
  • Then the air traffic controller outright ignored his request to get the frequency for approach, so that he could scold the pilot

This is bizarre. The air traffic controller was playing a pride game here, wanting to exert his dominance over the pilot. But seriously, why make this kind of extra work for yourself? Did he really start his day thinking “how can I make someone’s day worse today?” Do they train these guys at JFK, or…?

Now, I also thought it was inappropriate for the British Airways pilot to have the lengthy conversation on frequency, after asking for a phone number to call. That should’ve happened off frequency.

Bottom line

A Toronto air traffic controller and British Airways pilot got into a rather heated exchange, after the controller wanted to pick a fight for no good reason. The controller wasn’t using the British Airways plane’s callsign, as he should have, and this caused the British Airways pilot to seek clarification. But rather than clarifying things, the controller made things more complicated, to prove a point.

What do you make of this air traffic control interaction?

Conversations (8)
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  1. Eskimo Guest

    Humans.

    Or to be specific, two obsolete roles that should have been replaced by now.

  2. Icarus Guest

    Canadians have a reputation for being friendly. Lol. Some of the rudest clients I deal with are Canadian. Good and bad everywhere, however I would say well over 50% of the Canadians I deal with are obnoxious. Tabarnak !

  3. Bradley Guest

    I don't agree with the controller's attitude but why is BA asking the tower controller for an approach clearance? That's approach's job as per the name. I'm sure if the tower controller used more standardized phraseology and said, "Speedbird 9ZY, continue approach 06R", it would have cleared everything up. And then why is Speedbird asking for the frequency? They just came off from approach. They just need to switch back.

    Makes me wonder what's...

    I don't agree with the controller's attitude but why is BA asking the tower controller for an approach clearance? That's approach's job as per the name. I'm sure if the tower controller used more standardized phraseology and said, "Speedbird 9ZY, continue approach 06R", it would have cleared everything up. And then why is Speedbird asking for the frequency? They just came off from approach. They just need to switch back.

    Makes me wonder what's going on with that long hauler pilot.

  4. 1990 Guest

    I love a good ole 'sheehs' also an 'oof' and occasionally a 'yikes'... or all the above.

  5. Dick Bupkiss Guest

    Meh, both of them were being idiots. Both of them contributed to making things more complicated than needed.

    Technically, the controller was right. Technically, the pilot messed up (terminology) slightly. But "going back" should have been a simple, single press of one button for the pilot (radios store the frequency of the last channel they were on, so all the pilot needed to do was press the "back" button). Still, unless they were super, super...

    Meh, both of them were being idiots. Both of them contributed to making things more complicated than needed.

    Technically, the controller was right. Technically, the pilot messed up (terminology) slightly. But "going back" should have been a simple, single press of one button for the pilot (radios store the frequency of the last channel they were on, so all the pilot needed to do was press the "back" button). Still, unless they were super, super busy, the controller should have just clarified things and be done with it.

    Both were in the wrong here. No big deal.

    Slow news day?

    1. Ben Schlappig OMAAT

      @ Dick Bupkiss -- The controller messed up terminology first, though, no? He didn't use the callsign when telling the British Airways pilots to continue the approach.

      And no, it's not a slow news day at all, as you can tell based on the volume of posts. Personally, I always enjoy these ATC audio clips, which is why I share them. OMAAT isn't just a news site, it's also a site about the industry things...

      @ Dick Bupkiss -- The controller messed up terminology first, though, no? He didn't use the callsign when telling the British Airways pilots to continue the approach.

      And no, it's not a slow news day at all, as you can tell based on the volume of posts. Personally, I always enjoy these ATC audio clips, which is why I share them. OMAAT isn't just a news site, it's also a site about the industry things I find interesting, and I hope that people enjoy them (at least more often than not!).

    2. Marc Guest

      I llove when Ben reports on these ATC interaction stories and am sure most readers find them equally interesting.

      It was also interesting hearing Dick Bupkiss’ response as he shed some additional information not known to me. It’s such a shame he had to end his last sentence with a snide remark. I respected his reply up until the unnecessary swipe at the end.

      What a way to go from hero to loser...

      I llove when Ben reports on these ATC interaction stories and am sure most readers find them equally interesting.

      It was also interesting hearing Dick Bupkiss’ response as he shed some additional information not known to me. It’s such a shame he had to end his last sentence with a snide remark. I respected his reply up until the unnecessary swipe at the end.

      What a way to go from hero to loser with such an unwelcoming comment after a huge amount of respectable information.

  6. ATC Member

    Sigh. That was utterly cringeworthy to listen to.
    Tower and Terminal have hotlines to each other for instant communication, it would have taken literally 5 seconds for the Tower controller to confirm with the Arrival controller that he was cleared for the approach and then none of this would have happened.
    I feel second hand embarrassment from having to work alongside individuals like this who seem to forget that we provide a service.

    ...

    Sigh. That was utterly cringeworthy to listen to.
    Tower and Terminal have hotlines to each other for instant communication, it would have taken literally 5 seconds for the Tower controller to confirm with the Arrival controller that he was cleared for the approach and then none of this would have happened.
    I feel second hand embarrassment from having to work alongside individuals like this who seem to forget that we provide a service.

    They are the types who have never made a mistake in their entire career, think they can do no wrong, the entire system would fall apart without them and that they are Gods gift to ATC. They are absolutely awful to work with and the reality usually is they are the weakest at the job, so they use the bluster and arrogance to cover the fact they just aren't very good.
    The best controllers I've ever worked with never get into arguments. They just calmly, confidently and professionally go about their business. Deal with curveballs, clear up confusion and give clarification with no fuss when required.

    As for the other idiot pilot who wanted to complain about what he perceived as unnecessary conversation clogging up the ground frequency by clogging up the ground frequency further with unnecessary conversation, I can only assume that irony isn't his strong suit.

    I can only apologise to the BA crew for the ridiculous way they were treated. I thought they did an exemplary job in handling it and thankfully avoided the temptation at a number of points where they were provoked to escalate things.

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ATC Member

Sigh. That was utterly cringeworthy to listen to. Tower and Terminal have hotlines to each other for instant communication, it would have taken literally 5 seconds for the Tower controller to confirm with the Arrival controller that he was cleared for the approach and then none of this would have happened. I feel second hand embarrassment from having to work alongside individuals like this who seem to forget that we provide a service. They are the types who have never made a mistake in their entire career, think they can do no wrong, the entire system would fall apart without them and that they are Gods gift to ATC. They are absolutely awful to work with and the reality usually is they are the weakest at the job, so they use the bluster and arrogance to cover the fact they just aren't very good. The best controllers I've ever worked with never get into arguments. They just calmly, confidently and professionally go about their business. Deal with curveballs, clear up confusion and give clarification with no fuss when required. As for the other idiot pilot who wanted to complain about what he perceived as unnecessary conversation clogging up the ground frequency by clogging up the ground frequency further with unnecessary conversation, I can only assume that irony isn't his strong suit. I can only apologise to the BA crew for the ridiculous way they were treated. I thought they did an exemplary job in handling it and thankfully avoided the temptation at a number of points where they were provoked to escalate things.

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Ben Schlappig OMAAT

@ Dick Bupkiss -- The controller messed up terminology first, though, no? He didn't use the callsign when telling the British Airways pilots to continue the approach. And no, it's not a slow news day at all, as you can tell based on the volume of posts. Personally, I always enjoy these ATC audio clips, which is why I share them. OMAAT isn't just a news site, it's also a site about the industry things I find interesting, and I hope that people enjoy them (at least more often than not!).

1
Marc Guest

I llove when Ben reports on these ATC interaction stories and am sure most readers find them equally interesting. It was also interesting hearing Dick Bupkiss’ response as he shed some additional information not known to me. It’s such a shame he had to end his last sentence with a snide remark. I respected his reply up until the unnecessary swipe at the end. What a way to go from hero to loser with such an unwelcoming comment after a huge amount of respectable information.

0
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