There’s currently some drama in the points world, which is giving reality TV and/or your local homeowners association meeting a run for its money…
In this post:
There are two Chicago Seminars events in 2023
Over the years there have been all kinds of miles & points conferences, whereby people can get together to discuss our hobby and share tricks. These are popular with beginners, experts, and everyone in between. The single most consistently run event over the years has been the Chicago Seminars, held in October of each year at the Holiday Inn Elk Grove.
This event has been put on since 2010, and while the Holiday Inn Elk Grove is no St. Regis, the whole experience is fun and kind of charming.
The 2023 edition of the Chicago Seminars has just been announced… and there are two of them. The same weekend. Organized by different parties. Specifically, these are described as:
- “The 13th Annual Chicago Seminars @ The Holiday Inn – October 13-15, 2023: The Original” (tickets here)
- “The 13th Annual Chicago Seminars @ Delta Hotels by Marriott – October 13-15, 2023” (tickets here)
Both events have tickets on sale through Eventbrite with the same name for the event. And the events even list some overlapping speakers, though that seems to be in the process of being corrected. You can check the above threads to see who is involved with each event.
What on earth is going on here?!
Quite a public feud is emerging as a result of all of this. I mean, I suppose that’s to be expected, because usually two parties don’t otherwise organize competing events with the same name in the same city at the same time. For context, Stefan Krasowski of Rapid Travel Chai was initially supposed to be the primary organizer behind the Chicago Seminars.
Now JT Genter is one of the people behind the Chicago Seminars event being held at the Holiday Inn (the initial venue). Here’s how he explained what happened, in a comment on View from the Wing:
As he’s publicly acknowledged, Stefan dropped the ball on organizing the 2022 Chicago Seminars, disappearing for months and failing to do any planning. Late last summer, Marty reached out to me to ask for my assistance in helping save the event, and I was happy to do so. It was a ton of work, but I’m thrilled with how 2022 turned out. Stefan re-engaged at the last minute, and we let him save face by leading the seminars. All was good.
I share that as a preface for what comes next: Stefan disappeared again. The last contact that I had from Stefan was in December 2022. For more than three months, he failed to respond to our WhatsApp messages, emails, texts, and calls.
Assuming the same situation was playing out as in 2022, Chris, Marty, and I moved forward with planning the event. In March 2023, after having not heard from Stefan since November 2022, the hotel set an ultimatum for signing the contract or releasing it to another conference. Still no response from Stefan. So, Chris signed the venue contract to save the event. All along, we reached out to Stefan to invite him to re-engage when he was ready.
Unfortunately, instead of re-engaging and helping us plan Chicago Seminars, Stefan decided to announce a competing conference. He began selling tickets even though he didn’t have confirmed speakers or a venue. In fact, he locked us out of the shared planning account that had all of the speakers and sponsors that Chris, Marty, and I had confirmed and were working with. Even though he had no contact with any of those speakers, he announced them as his own.
Stefan continues to act in bad faith, continuing to advertise speakers who have expressly told him that they wouldn’t be speaking at his event. Then, he has publicly lied about getting this notice.
It’s a really unfortunate — and highly avoidable — situation. Unfortunately, he let his ego get in the way of helping make a single Chicago Seminars event be successful. By signing another venue contract — knowing full well that Chris already had a binding contract — Stefan locked the community into having two different events in Chicago on the same weekend.
Stefan (who is now behind the event at the Delta Hotel) says he’s choosing not to engage in public attacks. As he describes it, he’s continuing with the 2023 event with the team he hired, which does not include the people who are now running their own event. Stefan claims there were lengthy reconciliation attempts, including with a mutually agreed moderator, in which he made offers that were declined.
He then concluded that the event needed to move forward as best it could, with a new venue. Stefan says he’s not asking any speakers to choose sides, and the attendees that he posted are speaking at the event are ones that have confirmed their attendance for the event in the past.
Suffice it to say that this whole situation is just unfortunate. It’s sad that the two sides couldn’t come to an agreement. Instead you have two contracts signed with hotels for events, and I can’t imagine this is going to end well.
I respect several of the people involved here (on both sides), and obviously I wasn’t there when this all went down, and when the reconciliation attempts happened. One thing is for sure — everyone loses with this setup.
Bottom line
There’s drama involving the Chicago Seminars this year, as there will be two events held at the same time and with the same name. I’m sure both sides have their valid reasons for what they’ve done and feeling the way they do, though it’s unfortunate that this couldn’t be resolved in an amicable way.
What’s your take on this whole situation?
The irony of all this is that both events are in conflict with the Ring of Fire annular eclipse which occurs on October 14th with the center line running from Oregon to Texas. Looks like I may miss Chicago Seminars for the first time since it started.
Stefan comes off looking horribly in this situation, as he should. Creating a 2nd event the same weekend after the fact shows you couldn't care less about your attendees. Michael T trying to mediate is laughable as well.
Hopefully they both fail and these things come to an end.
It’s shocking that Michael Traeger, of Zorkfest, still puts on these seminars. He consistently loses money at it, because there is no real interest in casino gaming, AND points/miles. He gets the same 50 people every year, and from what I hear, it’s a big credit card sales event, I like gardening and long-distance running, you don’t see me, putting together a seminar, trying to encapsulate those two things.
I had already booked flights on points and a pre-conference hotel night on points and was waiting a bit for the dust to settle on which conf to attend. I decided to cancel and vote with my wallet and not bother to attend either. I'm not exactly sure of the root cause of the political infighting but I'm staying away.
Good people on both sides!
Wow reading those flyertalk threads it looks pretty acrimonious. If I were going to one of those seminars it would be the one organised by Jt genter. His articles have always struck me as being well written and thought out. For me poor communication or people going missing in action is one of the first things where I’d strike someone off my list of people that I deal with. Which appears to have been the...
Wow reading those flyertalk threads it looks pretty acrimonious. If I were going to one of those seminars it would be the one organised by Jt genter. His articles have always struck me as being well written and thought out. For me poor communication or people going missing in action is one of the first things where I’d strike someone off my list of people that I deal with. Which appears to have been the problem with the person organising the second seminar on the same dates.
It’s amazing that they are trying to drum up raffle donations for their event on flyertalk. Anyone who has done any fundraising knows that you have to hit up your contacts to do that with any success.
No one has brought up the fact that both seminars (and the ZorkFest) ignored that the prior weekend is a three day weekend for many folks. Columbus Day/Indigenous People’s Day is Monday, October 9. That weekend might have made a better choice to hold one of these events.
Columbus Day weekend is when the Chicago Marathon is held - hotels are more expensive that weekend.
Having them both on the same weekend is a loss for everyone. At least have them at different times.
"One thing is for sure — everyone loses with this setup." Actually, Chicago wins!
Go Cubs! Go Bears! Go “13th Annual Chicago Seminars @ The Holiday Inn – Original.” Have fun! Go get a Novi’s Beef Sandwich and an Al’s Pizza – They’re the best!
There’s nothing like Chicago! Just be careful where you don’t go.
Bring home some tips and tricks for us. Can’t wait to read your event!.
I attended years ago (2011? 2012?) and it was worth the trip, although the FOMO was painful when the most popular session, boasting a very young speaker (what WAS his name....?), sold out before I could sign up, and when concurrent sessions had compelling topics. I had to choose just one. I was beginner-intermediate I guess, so the content was largely new and valuable. I'm told it's different now ;-)
Seems pretty obvious that, no matter who is "at fault", when you create a second event with the same name on the same weekend, you have zero interest in the audience. If you have a problem with the original, you create a second, better event with a new name at a different time. I've seen this exact behavior with online sessions too, and it's usually obvious by the content that petty feuds are driving these...
Seems pretty obvious that, no matter who is "at fault", when you create a second event with the same name on the same weekend, you have zero interest in the audience. If you have a problem with the original, you create a second, better event with a new name at a different time. I've seen this exact behavior with online sessions too, and it's usually obvious by the content that petty feuds are driving these things, not bettering their deliveries, messages, or information.
Huh, didn't know Stefan Krasowski was my group partner in every college group project for my undergrad
That's because he was also in another group during your undergrad the whole time?
That is all certainly very bizarre. By choosing to essentially stay silent Stefan doesn't help his cause.
I attended this event several years ago. Parts of it were interesting but it seemed very cliquish to me. If you weren't already an insider you were a bit left out.
I agree that staying silent doesn't help one's cause, but staying silent doesn't necessarily hurt it either.
I also attended a similar type of event, and I must agree that it seemed somewhat cliquish to me as well. I'm certainly not interested in either of these Chicago Seminars.
What drama?
In the peddling community that is specialized in churning, you'd expect they start churning their own conferences sooner or later.
I’m attending Chris and JT’s at the holiday inn. It is unfortunate that there are two conferences on the same weekend, because I think there’s plenty of demand for multiple conferences, and people would stay in Chicago if they were in back to back weekends. But with the current distance they are, I have to choose one and I think that the Chris and Jt version has more confirmed speakers.
POPCORN!
Who cares. Either one of these seminars are for mid-career salespeople at Russell 2000 component companies -- people who are discontent with their jobs, discontent with their spouses, discontent with their poor real estate investments, discontent with their station in life, and hoping to squeeze as much as they can out of their Bonvoy points before the Bonvoy program is cut completely, because it's a cost center in a time when millennials have wisened up...
Who cares. Either one of these seminars are for mid-career salespeople at Russell 2000 component companies -- people who are discontent with their jobs, discontent with their spouses, discontent with their poor real estate investments, discontent with their station in life, and hoping to squeeze as much as they can out of their Bonvoy points before the Bonvoy program is cut completely, because it's a cost center in a time when millennials have wisened up and stopped caring about hotel loyalty.
This comment is epic.
“This comment is epic.”
Epically illiterate.
Yep. I usually attend a miles and points conference once per yr or every other yr. I went to the Chicago Seminars years ago pre covid since I had been shut out of earlier ones last min. Great conference and I met some great people. I dont play hard like some but always like to brush up on things. I am not a mid career salesperson and have owned my own company for 35 yrs....
Yep. I usually attend a miles and points conference once per yr or every other yr. I went to the Chicago Seminars years ago pre covid since I had been shut out of earlier ones last min. Great conference and I met some great people. I dont play hard like some but always like to brush up on things. I am not a mid career salesperson and have owned my own company for 35 yrs. Let Husch tell me that stuff to my face. I am one of the people that can run the Chicago Marathon the prior week as well. And I have no bad real estate investments or any of that other weird stuff.
Millennials and wise. That’s one for the books.
Ben, will you and your ghost writers be attending? If so, which event?
@ Montey Salmon -- I'm flattered you think I have ghost writers. Yes, I'm sending all of them to both events.
What's really interesting about that reply is that it does not deny the existence of ghostwriters.
Ben Schlappig 2024? I will register as a Republican if need be to make it happen during the primaries.
@ Husch Blackwell -- If it wasn't clear, allow me to clarify. There are no ghostwriters.
Ben, I love your site and content - my comment was tongue-in-cheek, especially considering what people write on FT.
One thing I'm amazed about is how you're able to write so much day-in-day-out without burning out or losing interest after all the years. Have you thought about writing an article on a typical day in Ben's shoes: how you maintain productivity, find information, look after your family, what you like writing about and don't like?
@ Montey Salmon -- Hah, you're too kind! Most people commenting that unfortunately aren't being tongue-in-cheek. I appreciate the question, so let me work on a post about that!
As a loyal reader that doesn't comment a lot I would live to see such a post. I go crazy for your consistency. I mean you don't even get to see your real loyal readers
Ben you are the most prolific writer in the game. Thats for sure.
The travel, miles and points space is big enough for more than one venue. The two of these conferences combined would barely amount to a single DEF CON village, much less any of the official speaker tracks. Growing the pie is often a good thing, and I'm happy to see that so many people are passionate about the space. See you in Chicago!