I recently covered how United States Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy warned that we could start to see airspace in the United States close as of next week, as a result of the government shutdown. That raised questions as to whether that was a prediction or a threat.
We then learned about an update that could start to impact passengers before the end of the week. The list of airports that will see traffic reductions has just been published, so we now have a better sense of what this will look like.
In this post:
Airlines will be forced to cancel flights due to ATC staffing
It has been announced that flight capacity in the nation’s top 40 high-traffic markets will be reduced by 10% as of Friday, November 7, 2025, assuming the government shutdown continues. The Transportation Secretary claims this is “data based,” though exact details as to how the cuts will be implemented remains to be seen.
“Markets” is seemingly being defined as “airports” here (rather than city pairs or airspaces), with the following 40 airports expected to see flight reductions:
- Anchorage International Airport (ANC)
- Atlanta Hartsfield-Jackson International Airport (ATL)
- Boston Logan International Airport (BOS)
- Baltimore/Washington International Airport (BWI)
- Charlotte Douglas International Airport (CLT)
- Chicago Midway Airport (MDW)
- Chicago O’Hare International Airport (ORD)
- Cincinnati/Northern Kentucky International Airport (CVG)
- Dallas Love Field Airport (DAL)
- Denver International Airport (DEN)
- Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport (DFW)
- Detroit Metropolitan Wayne County Airport (DTW)
- Fort Lauderdale/Hollywood International Airport (FLL)
- Honolulu International Airport (HNL)
- Houston George Bush Intercontinental Airport (IAH)
- Houston Hobby Airport (HOU)
- Indianapolis International Airport (IND)
- Louisville International Airport (SDF)
- New York John F. Kennedy International Airport (JFK)
- Newark Liberty International Airport (EWR)
- Las Vegas International Airport (LAS)
- Los Angeles International Airport (LAX)
- Memphis International (MEM)
- Miami International Airport (MIA)
- Minneapolis/St Paul International Airport (MSP)
- New York LaGuardia Airport (LGA)
- Oakland International Airport (OAK)
- Ontario International Airport (ONT)
- Orlando International Airport (MCO)
- Philadelphia International Airport (PHL)
- Phoenix Sky Harbor International Airport (PHX)
- Portland International Airport (PDX)
- Salt Lake City International Airport (SLC)
- San Diego International Airport (SAN)
- San Francisco International Airport (SFO)
- Seattle/Tacoma International Airport (SEA)
- Teterboro Airport (TEB)
- Tampa International (TPA)
- Washington Dulles International Airport (IAD)
- Washington National Airport (DCA)
It’s going to be very interesting to see how this is actually implemented. Will all flights touching these airports be reduced by 10%? It’s not easy for airlines to just rebuild their schedules, given the domino effect of flight cancelations, so this could prove very tricky for airlines.
So while we don’t know how many total flights will be canceled, a 10% reduction in overall flights in the United States would translate to roughly 5,000 flights per day, give or take, and could impact hundreds of thousands of air travelers per day.
Officially, the logic here is that this is because air traffic controllers aren’t getting paychecks right now, so there’s an increase in fatigue and sick calls. That being said, one wonders what data is being used to determine the optimum number of flights to cancel, since for the most part, flights are still operating pretty smoothly. Furthermore, air traffic controllers not showing up to work is pretty hard to predict.
For example, Tampa Airport has been running smoothly, with no operational issues. So how does canceling a flight from Tampa to a non-congested airport help?
If this shutdown drags on much longer and we see air traffic controllers call in sick on a very widespread basis, then a 10% flight reduction won’t do squat. So I guess the idea is to do something, though this strikes me as rather random.
The political implications here are going to be fascinating
There’s no denying that mass flight cancellations will frustrate the public, and in terms of optics and things people agree on (in other words, not food assistance programs), may be the most widespread impact of the shutdown to date. It’s not just those people booked on 10% of flights who will be impacted, but this will of course make it much more difficult to book flights, since flights will be booked out, they’ll be more expensive, etc.
Our air traffic ecosystem is really the thing that has the ability to end the shutdown, given the importance of it to so many people. So it’s going to be worth watching how this plays out politically. Of course in virtually all official communications, the Trump administration is referring to this as the “Democrat Shutdown,” as that’s the narrative they want to portray.
The issue is, that’s not necessarily how the public sees it, and for that matter, it’s not even seemingly how the Trump administration views it:
- The polling I’ve seen all shows that more people blame the Republican party than the Democratic party for the shutdown (again, that’s the polling I’ve seen, and I’m just reporting that — if people see reputable polling that says otherwise, please share it)
- Following yesterday’s elections (a victory for Democrats), Trump blamed the loss of Republicans partly on the government shutdown; that suggests that he acknowledges that the shutdown continuing is worse for Republicans than for Democrats
My point is to say that these flight reductions will create immense political pressure. It sure seems like the Trump administration hopes that Democrats just cave when the public becomes angrier, but that seems highly unlikely.
We’re all entitled to our opinions, and have our own takes, so I’m not trying to change anyone’s mind on how they should feel about who is responsible for the shutdown. I’m simply sharing what polling shows, and what Trump himself acknowledges, and the implications that could have on how this plays out. After all, none of us want our aviation system to be a mess for any longer than it has to be.
Bottom line
Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy has announced that the FAA will force 10% flight reductions in the nation’s 40 biggest markets as of this Friday. The reason being given is reduced air traffic control staffing due to the shutdown.
Obviously the Trump administration feels pressure to end the shutdown ASAP, and significant flight reductions will increase public pressure on the shutdown ending. That being said, more people seem to view Republicans as being at fault rather than Democrats, so I don’t necessarily see how this is supposed to play out, unless Trump starts to compromise.
How do you see this flight reduction situation playing out?
From outside it appears that the Democrats are winning the social media battle, as did Hamas. If there is no way to save face then this could continue for an extended time. I have a flight MIA-SEA direct in December after 7 PM. I wonder how this will affect it.
One broad, general hallmark of the current regime is that it's very, very incompetent. There's been lots of disruption, purposeful and accidental harms done, greedy two-handed grifting no matter the outcome- and almost none of the typical "best people who'll take the job" that every other administration in recent history has aimed for.
So it's no surprise we've gone from a completely functional if creaky system from 10 months ago to one on the verge...
One broad, general hallmark of the current regime is that it's very, very incompetent. There's been lots of disruption, purposeful and accidental harms done, greedy two-handed grifting no matter the outcome- and almost none of the typical "best people who'll take the job" that every other administration in recent history has aimed for.
So it's no surprise we've gone from a completely functional if creaky system from 10 months ago to one on the verge of collapse. Vote for clowns, get a clown show.
They should cancel all the flights to DCA and IAD as punishment to the legislators
I guess Washington is going to use Thanksgiving as a bargaining chip. I expect more people to drive instead of fly.
The situation with the shutdown is perfectly representative of a declining country with neither the imagination nor common sense. For all the talk about a mandate last year, it doesn't seem to be so today. Oh, and remember this quote?
"If there is a shutdown ... I think it would be a tremendously negative mark on the president of the United States. He's the one that has to get people together" - Donald Trump
Not from the US but I hear every year, usually just after being inundated with Black Friday adds, that your November Thanksgiving is the biggest travel day. Good luck.
Travel for no sensible purpose . Purposeless people ought to stay home .
Hey Alert. Who decides which purposes are sensible?
A grandmother flying to hold her grandchild. Friends reuniting after years apart. Someone seeking peace by the ocean. A person visiting a dying parent. Someone who simply needs to breathe different air for a few days.
Every journey carries purpose to the traveler, even if it's invisible to others. What seems purposeless from the outside may be profoundly meaningful to the person making it.
People aren't losing...
Hey Alert. Who decides which purposes are sensible?
A grandmother flying to hold her grandchild. Friends reuniting after years apart. Someone seeking peace by the ocean. A person visiting a dying parent. Someone who simply needs to breathe different air for a few days.
Every journey carries purpose to the traveler, even if it's invisible to others. What seems purposeless from the outside may be profoundly meaningful to the person making it.
People aren't losing flights because there's too much travel. They're losing flights because of a manufactured political crisis over healthcare negotiations.
Good points , yet I observe there are too many flights . How many more flights do you want? 800,000 ?
What criteria do you use to define "too many flights"?
My hot take is that the airlines should kill all relevant DCA flights, shut the DCA lounges, and for everyone but AA consider just suspending DCA entirely (AA presumably can't drop a hub). UA and WN have IAD/BWI hubs that they should be able to justify redirecting traffic to.
To be clear, this would be about pressuring DC to get its act together...basically, eating a week of DC losses in exchange for ripping this band-aid off.
Here's another timely quote from DJT: "The United States' President has to get this done. It's pretty sad because the whole world is looking at us and laughing at us." Well said, Dear Leader.
Good grief! Almost every time Donny Trump speaks on how government functions, he sounds like he's just briefly scanned a synopsis of a wikipedia article thrust into his little hands by an aide.
Speaking of which, I can only imagine his reaction the first time he was told he had aides when he first got to the White House. "Aides! I'm a happily married man!"
The airlines have been making profits on the backs of the U.S. taxpayers for too long . FAA has supported airline expansion by providing free infrastructure .
No, privatization is not the answer. Republicans break it, then steal it. It’s a trojan horse.
We can say the same of American farmers.
Not right now if course. Those farmers are getting zip while the govt is shut down.
Pity on your ATC and other staff. But the USA is withholding payment to a couple of 100k employees worldwide.
And those people are by every law applicable due their payment.
Call your Republican Senators and demand that they actually ‘earn’ bi-partisan support. Done.
The pundits are saying that now that air travel is being affected and the elections have passed, an agreement will come shortly. I certainly hope they are correct and an agreement is reached. However, why is it that a disruption of air travel is the driving force? Doesn't anyone care that tens of thousands of people are working but not being paid and others are not receiving their full SNAP benefits? It seems to me...
The pundits are saying that now that air travel is being affected and the elections have passed, an agreement will come shortly. I certainly hope they are correct and an agreement is reached. However, why is it that a disruption of air travel is the driving force? Doesn't anyone care that tens of thousands of people are working but not being paid and others are not receiving their full SNAP benefits? It seems to me that those are the reasons to come to agreement rather than being inconvenienced because your flight time has changed.
upper middle class people who consume a lot of media and are politically-influential fly a lot
Politicians in both parties could care less about their "underlings" not being paid, parts of the population not receiving SNAP benefits, etc.
Interrupt the politicians (and their rich donors) ability to travel and suddenly things will start moving forward because THEY are the ones being inconvenienced by the shutdown
There were a few good people left in Washington, Scott. good luck finding them. Well, you’re probably right. And 305, sadly I think you’re definitely right.
United email says International and Hub-to-Hub domestic flights will not be impacted. Also the slow down starts at 4% on Friday, 11/6/25, and works it way up to 10% mid-next week.
“Oh no… does that mean flights to Aspen won’t be as timely?! But, but… how will I take my G700 to my fourth ski chalet…” — Bill (h)Ackman
Teterboro listed!
Watch the shutdown suddenly end within a week because certain oligarchs can’t use their private jets
I’ve been saying… there’s a cold going around at TEB… *cough*
Route it through White Plains baby!
Ben, I am long time reader and follower but I do not agree with your assertion that the Republicans are causing this prolonged shut down, to the contrary it looks to me that the Democrats are playing political games and have voted for the shutdown 14 times so far. Please look at things objectively and not through the lens of your own party preference.
@ Travel-One-Mile — I appreciate you reading! I am trying to be objective, so please read the post again. Where did I say which party is causing the shutdown? What I said is that public perception (based on polling) is that Republicans are causing the shutdown, according to a larger percentage of the population. That’s a major distinction. And it matters, because obviously politicians are very focused on public perception, since that’s how they stay in power.
This is the first time in history that a no strings attached CR has been voted down (in this case by Democrats). Obama care was originally a mandatory pooled insurance for all non- insured. But younger people disobeyed the law and did not enroll. Then they made it optional, and more spent than came in. Many big companies self insure. This is a difficult problem, yes there needs to be affordable health - perhaps expand...
This is the first time in history that a no strings attached CR has been voted down (in this case by Democrats). Obama care was originally a mandatory pooled insurance for all non- insured. But younger people disobeyed the law and did not enroll. Then they made it optional, and more spent than came in. Many big companies self insure. This is a difficult problem, yes there needs to be affordable health - perhaps expand Medicaid if premiums are unaffordable. Maybe go back to pre-Obama care situation - welfare and medicaid. But get the govt back in Operation.
Randy did you just forget about when the republican controlled house rejected the clean CR from the senate demanding attachments to defund the ACA in 2013? Convenient that you forget when republicans do what you’re complaining about.
Let a few Congressmen and Senators get stuck at a DCA Lounge for hours on end and the budget issue will be resolved immediately. Or at least there will be funding for ATC.
I would imagine the US3 will get regional flying. Gonna big a ouch for smaller airlines and ULCC that will have a harder time to reaccommodate or reroute passengers.
Honestly? Shut the DCA lounges for a week. Hit their flights with reduced priority. Let them stew in the concourse. Heck, you might even get enough of them stuck down there annoyed enough to actually talk to one another and do a deal!
No, George, not all politicians are bad; enough with the attempts to 'both sides' this. It's the Republicans fault; they've failed to earn the votes to pass a bi-partisan budget. That's it. Period. And until they do, it'll be shutdown; it's on them; it's on the President.
If this drags on big losses coming to the airlines in Q4.
Yeah, historically, like, maybe, industrialists shouldn't back fascists. Just sayin'... it usually doesn't end well for anyone.
Time for Senate Republicans to actually 'earn' the votes for a bi-partisan budget. That's the solution. Otherwise, it's 361 days until midterms.
Bingo 1990!
International flights are safe. This will only apply to domestic.
...for now.
Only three more years of retribution to endure.
361 days, 18ish hours until the midterm elections. 'Hope is alive.'
Interesting choice to use pictures on UA planes for this. Should we be reading something into that?
We need @Tim Dunn and @MaxPower to interpret for us. Sirs! Assemble!
Thank you Ben for initiating this click-bait topic.
Thank you the supporters of both parties. The entertainment value immense, but, will all of your bluster and banter make America great again?
Doubtful.
You sure showed 'em AeroB13a! You're clearly superior to all the "supporters of both parties" who have provided you with immense "entertainment value"
You're definitely not engaging in "bluster and banter" of your own
Oh wait...no...when you decided to comment you became just as much a part of the circus as the rest of us
Still stand with Israel and for genocide and child killing too, AeroB13a?
The details of the cuts is that they will all be in cities in blue states, regardless if it makes operational sense or not. LAX, OAK, SFO, SEA, PDX JFK, EWR, LGA, ORD, MSP. I should find a way to bet on this
Bingo. Secretary Real World Road Rules is gonna dance to the tune the Orange Drag Queen POTUS whistles
The list floating around includes blue and red states. It seems to correlate more with those having staffing issues.
I’m not buying it, MoreSun. This administration does not have a reputation for credibility.
If your news sources are NYT, NBC, MSNBC, CBS, WP, Reuters, AP, PBS, CNN, FOX, etc of course that’s what you think “people are saying”. In reality the majority knows and understands the Dems are blocking this thing, yet they spin it in a way that educated but gullible people believe it’s the other way. I’m a Dem and it’s incredible how far down stupid road my party has gone just because we don’t like...
If your news sources are NYT, NBC, MSNBC, CBS, WP, Reuters, AP, PBS, CNN, FOX, etc of course that’s what you think “people are saying”. In reality the majority knows and understands the Dems are blocking this thing, yet they spin it in a way that educated but gullible people believe it’s the other way. I’m a Dem and it’s incredible how far down stupid road my party has gone just because we don’t like one guy, instead of being the common sense party people that we were 20+ years ago. We are now the crazies and even AOC has to remind the herd that “we are not insane, they are” …we elect people like Mamdani and Newsom, Jesus we praise Bernie…OMG how can we come back from this??
Uh, 'people are saying,' is literally your Dear Leader's go-to for when he's lying.
Take it from him: "If there's a shutdown it means the President is weak." --DJT. LOL.
Alex is clearly a sock, puppet, dismiss.
The election results from 2 days ago made it very clear who people are blaming right now. No NYT needed to tell you that.
It's ok, he will ramble on about Biden's Autopen to distract from the truth.
At what point will people realize that "they" were not "eating the cats, eating the dogs" and that this entire MAGA movement is meant to exploit the weak minded. If you don't get it now...well, you deserve to be called deplorable. Probably worse.
Sadly there are people who already know, but will not admit it because the pain of being exposed as gullible would be too strong.
I’m sure last nights election results had nothing to do with this farce. Pfffft. Keep blaming democrats, fucking MAGA losers
Those elections *should* have nothing to do with any of this. But, yeah, the Trump era has been all about corruption, bad-faith, and outright lies.
Senate Republicans need to actually 'earn' Senate Democrats votes to pass a bi-partisan budget (likely, by simply re-adding the healthcare subsidies they took away in the BBB), or the government will simply remain shutdown indefinitely (unless, Republicans 'flip the game board,' and change the rules, aka, the 'nuclear' option,...
Those elections *should* have nothing to do with any of this. But, yeah, the Trump era has been all about corruption, bad-faith, and outright lies.
Senate Republicans need to actually 'earn' Senate Democrats votes to pass a bi-partisan budget (likely, by simply re-adding the healthcare subsidies they took away in the BBB), or the government will simply remain shutdown indefinitely (unless, Republicans 'flip the game board,' and change the rules, aka, the 'nuclear' option, aka 'cheating').
After Tuesday's results, there is no good reason for Democrats to back down. Trump will cave. TACO.
You get what you vote for America.
Keep being subservient to AIPAC and Israel, funding a genocide and protecting Epstein whilst you can't even fly around your country anymore. MAGA!!
Both parties are obviously to “blame”. They both dug in and made their choices. Both sides have the power to roll over. Neither are exercising that power.
With a majority, Republican senators aren’t going to sign onto a Democrat plan, so it’ll have to end up the other way around. Which means Republicans will have to convince a few more Dems at a minimum.
Say what you want about who is right or wrong....
Both parties are obviously to “blame”. They both dug in and made their choices. Both sides have the power to roll over. Neither are exercising that power.
With a majority, Republican senators aren’t going to sign onto a Democrat plan, so it’ll have to end up the other way around. Which means Republicans will have to convince a few more Dems at a minimum.
Say what you want about who is right or wrong. In the end, Republicans have failed to convince enough Dems to sign on. That’s the whole game.
Side note… Good for Republicans for not going nuclear too… better for the country long-term to not have such wild legislative swings every couple years the majority changes by a vote or two.
But it’s now the longest shutdown in history. The longest failure to come to an agreement. No one will remember Schumers name. The longest two shutdowns in history will be listed in the left column. On the right it’ll just say “Trump”. No one will put “could bring the parties together” under his strengths. He’ll have the receipts to show he was one of the worst at that.
No. Republicans are in-charge of all three branches of government; the other party is not. You can 'spin' and 'distract' all you want; those facts remain.
Trump himself has said: "A shutdown is a tremendously negative mark on the President." The American people (and the world) know who is to blame; it's not 'both sides,' it's Trump and Republicans at fault here.
Republicans are choosing not to throw away the filibuster. Democrats are choosing not to cave. They’re obviously both deciding to continue on.
My point is Republicans will be blamed. It’ll just go under Trumps name in the history books.
I'm sorry you received such a poor education in Civics. Maybe you skipped school the day they talked about the fillibuster. We have a minority in one house who are holding the US hostage because they can't stand the fact that Trump won the election
@David
Sorry you skipped your civics lesson. The filibuster is a voluntary rule the senate adopted, not law. They can change it at any point with a simple majority, and already have done so for multiple other pieces of Trump's agenda. If Repubs want to pass their agenda without funding ACA, they can do it today without D help. They haven't because they know their agenda is historically unpopular and they're desperate to pass the blame for it onto Dems.
@Dusty
Sorry you skipped your critical thinking lesson. Yes the filibuster was adopted as a voluntary rule years ago, and both sides have taken advantage of it and exploited it throughout the years. That said, at this time Dems are exploiting this rule, so we agree it's not all Republicans fault for the government closure.
What do you have to say about this quote, David?
"If there is a shutdown ... I think it would be a tremendously negative mark on the president of the United States. He's the one that has to get people together" - Donald Trump
I agree with Donald Trump on this one, which is not something I say often.
@David
Simple majority to overturn the filibuster. Repubs don't need the Democrat vote, they need the optics of Dems signing on to healthcare cuts. But I understand it's hard to admit the people you cheerlead for are horrible people and horrible leaders.
>Side note… Good for Republicans for not going nuclear too… better for the country long-term to not have such wild legislative swings every couple years the majority changes by a vote or two.
Disagreed. The filibuster is a relatively new thing. It has not been present for much of our nation's history. It obfuscates which party is responsible for what to voters, making it harder for voters to assign blame correctly. It also gums...
>Side note… Good for Republicans for not going nuclear too… better for the country long-term to not have such wild legislative swings every couple years the majority changes by a vote or two.
Disagreed. The filibuster is a relatively new thing. It has not been present for much of our nation's history. It obfuscates which party is responsible for what to voters, making it harder for voters to assign blame correctly. It also gums up the legislature, to the point that the executive has felt it necessary to take more power to keep the country running. Will it suck to lose the filibuster initially? Sure, but it already sucks that MAGAts got a trifecta and SCOTUS won't check their utter disregard for the law. But you bet your ass voters will figure out who's to blame when the majority screws them and will vote accordingly. Which, is what the GOP is actually afraid of. They can't fathom having to take responsibility for their awful policies.
All to avoid releasing the Epstein files.
It's amazing how spineless the GOP is when they could get rid of Trump and save the country from him literally with one neat trick.
That they are spineless, 'tis true: 'tis true 'tis pity;
And pity 'tis 'tis true: foolish figures.
Everyone whining about dems holding government and Americans hostage probably don’t know, that they are simply following what the world’s 2nd smartest man told them to do, in Sept’24 - Yeah, man. Why shouldn’t we be trying to force this government shutdown fight to get something out of it that’s good for the American people? Like, why have a government, if it’s not a functioning government?
That’s a lot of words… to say… it’s the Republican’s fault.
It’s all a sham to get Donald’s name back in the news. He truly can’t stand it when he is not the center of attention.
What’s this about Epstein??
The operational stress is real, but the FAA has been managing it through standard procedures (delays, rerouting, flow restrictions) that they use routinely for staffing shortages. Those procedures work - they've been handling 4x normal staffing triggers without implementing cuts.
The choice to escalate to unprecedented 10% capacity cuts - rather than continuing proven mitigation strategies - at the exact timeline Duffy threatened while explicitly blaming Democrats is political weaponization.
Bedford himself admits they're acting...
The operational stress is real, but the FAA has been managing it through standard procedures (delays, rerouting, flow restrictions) that they use routinely for staffing shortages. Those procedures work - they've been handling 4x normal staffing triggers without implementing cuts.
The choice to escalate to unprecedented 10% capacity cuts - rather than continuing proven mitigation strategies - at the exact timeline Duffy threatened while explicitly blaming Democrats is political weaponization.
Bedford himself admits they're acting on "early indicators" to "prevent things from deteriorating" - meaning it hasn't deteriorated yet. And Duffy already said they'll stop traffic before it becomes unsafe, so this isn't about imminent danger.
They're manufacturing maximum disruption to force Democrats to abandon healthcare protections that:
- 72% of Americans support
= Primarily benefit Republican constituencies (57% of recipients in GOP districts)
- Will cause 114% premium increases if they expire
It's inflicting pain as a negotiating tactic when they could either: (1) continue managing operationally, (2) negotiate with Democrats, or (3) pass their CR with the nuclear option.
Well said, All Due Respect. It's all a manufactured crisis. The saddest part is that Trump and the Republicans are doing this 1) to avoid releasing the Epstein files, which incriminate them, 2) to continue to grift, to steal from all of us to give to the rich in a reverse-Robin-Hood. We need accountability and real Progressive reforms when these horrors are finally over.
This is being caused by the democrats and their hostage taking.
Might be time to turn off FOX News.
Right, dumbass
Republicans control the White House, House, and Senate. They can pass their CR with the nuclear option without a single Democratic vote. They choose not to.
The FAA has been managing staffing issues with standard procedures (delays, rerouting) that handle these situations routinely. They're choosing to escalate to unprecedented 10% cuts at the exact timeline Duffy threatened, before things have actually deteriorated.
When you have total power, refuse to use it, and instead manufacture a...
Republicans control the White House, House, and Senate. They can pass their CR with the nuclear option without a single Democratic vote. They choose not to.
The FAA has been managing staffing issues with standard procedures (delays, rerouting) that handle these situations routinely. They're choosing to escalate to unprecedented 10% cuts at the exact timeline Duffy threatened, before things have actually deteriorated.
When you have total power, refuse to use it, and instead manufacture a crisis to blame the other side, calling that "hostage taking" is projection.
LOL!!!!!!!!!11!!!!!
Keep livin’ that incel life, very low IQ individual AndyS!
I'm a lifelong Democrat and I'm looking for a hostage to take. You mind stepping up, Andy? I've got some interesting things that I'd like to try on you.
They say, don’t ‘yuck’ someone else’s ‘yum’ *sizzle*
Trump is supposed to be such an expert “deal maker”, but seems as effective as a 2024 Biden in this shutdown.
Can only negotiate with people who want to cut a deal. Schumer is trying to pander to his progressive base to stop a primary from AOC. The dems were offered a vote on the ACA Covid subsidies and turned it down.
No, they weren't offered a vote unconditionally. They were offered a vote if they gave in on the CR, and only after the CR. Repugnant promises are written in the wind.
If memory serves, Democrats lost in a sweeping referendum in November 2024, ceding control of the Executive branch as well as the House and Senate. Democrats are not in a position to legislate, as Americans broadly rejected their platform. They are now attempting to petulantly hold the American public hostage to force through policy that was voted against in a democratic election. If they wanted to direct policy in 2025, they should have put up...
If memory serves, Democrats lost in a sweeping referendum in November 2024, ceding control of the Executive branch as well as the House and Senate. Democrats are not in a position to legislate, as Americans broadly rejected their platform. They are now attempting to petulantly hold the American public hostage to force through policy that was voted against in a democratic election. If they wanted to direct policy in 2025, they should have put up better candidates and a less radical platform. Lord knows it was a winnable election.
@Tyler
The pendulum just swung back. What little "mandate" the GOP had was squandered on tariffs and grift. Americans aren't happy about the healthcare hikes that are coming and they know the GOP is the cause.
Trump never had a mandate. He certain didn't the second time. He hoodwinked a bunch of people, some (cough cough Dearborn) who learned almost immediately that they had been fooled. He's an old fashioned traveling huckster, The Music Man, if he had less morals and more dictatorial ambition.
And Republicant’s have lost all momentum. They think they are winning when it’s really about serving the voters. Can’t wait for the mid-terms!
And Republicant’s have lost all momentum. They think they are winning when it’s really about serving the voters. Can’t wait for the mid-terms!
Right, Brian W. Here's what actually happened. John Thune told the press that he offered Democrats a vote on extending the Affordable Care Act premium subsidies, but that he couldn't guarantee an outcome. His exact words were, "I've told them. I said, and I've said, 'We are willing to have the conversation.' I've said, 'If you need a vote, we can guarantee you get a vote by a date certain.' At some point Democrats have...
Right, Brian W. Here's what actually happened. John Thune told the press that he offered Democrats a vote on extending the Affordable Care Act premium subsidies, but that he couldn't guarantee an outcome. His exact words were, "I've told them. I said, and I've said, 'We are willing to have the conversation.' I've said, 'If you need a vote, we can guarantee you get a vote by a date certain.' At some point Democrats have to take yes for an answer."
Chuck Schumer has indicated that the GQP hasn't actually made a sincere proposal to vote to extend the ACA subsidies. His exact words, "Look, we're not negotiating in public. Plain and simple," Schumer said when asked if Thune had made the offer. "Leader Thune has not come to me with any proposal at this point."
Trump and the GQP have stated flatly that they do not want to make a deal. It's their way or the highway. Democrats continue to ask for a real negotiation.
Also, if it's "pandering" to advocate for millions of Americans who may have to choose between food and healthcare, or rent and healthcare when costs skyrocket due to the expiration of these ACA subsidies, then pander away Chuck.
They aren’t just whacking passenger. Cargo, biz, space launches are supposedly also going to be hit as are VFR flights if this article is accurate
https://www.flyingmag.com/faa-orders-10-flight-cut-at-40-airports-amid-shutdown/
Trump and Republicans are bad for the economy. It's clear. We're all worse off thanks to them.
Sounds like Republicans need to actually 'earn' Democrats votes for a bi-partisan budget.
I hope there is ZERO BACKPAY to all those who DID NOT REPORT to work each and every day. No reason for people to get paid doing squat. Every financial adviser I have met in my life tells the same story: you should have at least enough cash to sustain the next 6-months if you were to be fired. We are at month one. Controllers are not minimum wage jobs unlike TSA. Zero reason for that to happen at this stage.
Huge ‘blame the victim’ vibes… yikes.
Minos,
you really do sound like you lead the most boring life I've ever heard of...
This is welcome news , as there are already too many flights .
No, it’s not ‘welcome’ news; and it’s not just flights affected; it’s peoples’ livelihoods; it’s their healthcare on the line.
Republicans should negotiate with Democrats to reopen the government immediately.
1990 meet alert. The troll that promotes propaganda for a buck anywhere. That called Jose Andres a greasy Mexican. Homophobic, xenophobic and an ugly racist. They must be scraping the bottom of the barrel.
Maryland, yeah, I’ve noticed. The d-listers are out in full-force… oof.
The Dems were offered a vote on the ACA subsidies and turned it down.
To Brian W: Republicans "offered" a vote they knew would fail, then refused to negotiate. That's not a good-faith offer—it's theater.
Democrats are demanding the subsidies be included in the CR because waiting until December means 20 million people will see 114% premium increases during open enrollment starting November 1st. By the time a separate vote happens, the damage is done—people will have already dropped coverage due to sticker shock.
Republicans could include the subsidies...
To Brian W: Republicans "offered" a vote they knew would fail, then refused to negotiate. That's not a good-faith offer—it's theater.
Democrats are demanding the subsidies be included in the CR because waiting until December means 20 million people will see 114% premium increases during open enrollment starting November 1st. By the time a separate vote happens, the damage is done—people will have already dropped coverage due to sticker shock.
Republicans could include the subsidies (which 72% of Americans support and primarily benefit GOP districts) or pass their CR with the nuclear option. They choose neither because they're losing the political fight and need a scapegoat.
Nice talking point but no dice. A vote guarantees nothing.
If they wanted guarantees, they should have put forth a platform Americans wanted to vote for in 2024. Democrats LOST control of the Executive, House, and Senate. They do NOT direct policy as a result. Tough cookies.
Hey there Tyler. If Republicans won and "direct policy," why can't they pass a budget? They control everything and have the nuclear option. They choose not to use it because they're losing the political fight (52-42 in blame polls).
Democrats are demanding healthcare subsidies that 72% of Americans support. That's what Americans want. Republicans respond by threatening airspace closures instead of governing.
Winning an election means you have the power to govern, not that the...
Hey there Tyler. If Republicans won and "direct policy," why can't they pass a budget? They control everything and have the nuclear option. They choose not to use it because they're losing the political fight (52-42 in blame polls).
Democrats are demanding healthcare subsidies that 72% of Americans support. That's what Americans want. Republicans respond by threatening airspace closures instead of governing.
Winning an election means you have the power to govern, not that the minority has to surrender on popular policy. If you can't pass legislation despite controlling all three branches, that's not the minority's problem. That's yours.
So...Tyler...what's their excuse then?
If you think there are too many flights, wait until you see healthcare premiums more than double for 20 million Americans when the subsidies Republicans are blocking expire in December.
At least flight reductions are reversible. People losing health coverage because premiums jumped 114% isn't.
You mean those temporary Covid subsidies?
Quote from Ben - “this may be the most widespread impact of the shutdown to date”.
Errrr, there are 42 million people on SNAP who are missing their food stamps this month. I think the impact on them is bigger and more widespread than the cancellation of just approximately 5000 flights?
Maybe those 42 million people on SNAP should start working like a good hardwroking American?
Eric, many do, some can’t; lest you ever need any assistance of any kind, you should want a robust social safety net for everyone. A country is judged, not by how it treats its wealthy, but by how it treats its least fortunate.
Especially the very elderly, the disabled, and the sick.
Eric, loosen up that MAGA hat.
It's obviously on your head too tight.
Eric - Sixty-three percent of SNAP households include someone who's working. The rest are primarily elderly, disabled, or caring for young children.
Of the 76 districts with the highest SNAP participation rates (20%+), 43 are Republican-held. When Republicans cut SNAP, they're cutting their own constituents who are already working but don't earn enough to feed their families.
Maybe the question isn't why people need food assistance, but why full-time work doesn't pay enough to live...
Eric - Sixty-three percent of SNAP households include someone who's working. The rest are primarily elderly, disabled, or caring for young children.
Of the 76 districts with the highest SNAP participation rates (20%+), 43 are Republican-held. When Republicans cut SNAP, they're cutting their own constituents who are already working but don't earn enough to feed their families.
Maybe the question isn't why people need food assistance, but why full-time work doesn't pay enough to live on.
Most of them do. They work for businesses that don’t pay the a living wage and the taxpayer subsidizes the business by supplementing the worker’s pay with SNAP.
Socialism for corporations and the rich.
Performative cruelty is how a good chunk of America identifies themselves as part of an "in group"
Sadly this is very, very true Speedbird.
Republican President, Republican Senate, Republican Supreme Court.
Republicans control all three branches of government; they are the ones holding the country hostage, just so the ultra-rich can get tax cuts, while the rest of us suffer, starve, and can’t fly. If Republicans want Democrats support for a bi-partisan budget, they should negotiate and compromise with them in good-faith.
As Donald Trump himself has said before:
“A shutdown falls on the President’s lack of leadership....
Republican President, Republican Senate, Republican Supreme Court.
Republicans control all three branches of government; they are the ones holding the country hostage, just so the ultra-rich can get tax cuts, while the rest of us suffer, starve, and can’t fly. If Republicans want Democrats support for a bi-partisan budget, they should negotiate and compromise with them in good-faith.
As Donald Trump himself has said before:
“A shutdown falls on the President’s lack of leadership. He can’t even control his own party and get people together in a room. A shutdown means the president is weak.”
“If you say who gets fired, it always has to be the top. Problems start from the top and they have to get solved from the top…”
“The fact is that the President… is not leading and not getting people into a room.”
Hold the line, friends. Keep fighting the good fight.
Democrats are holding everyone hostage.
Please inform yourself. Control is not possible in the senate where a supermajority (aka filibuster proof majority) is needed to end the stalemate. As in 60 votes in favor of opening the government. There is a majority in favor (55) including 3 democrats. All the opposition votes except for one are democrats. So they need 5 more democrats to get to 60 votes. There have been at least 14 votes so far that failed to open the government.
@Ernesto
The Senate GOP does not have to have 60 votes to remove the filibuster. The filibuster is a rule change, and they've already removed it for other legislation and appointments this year to push Trump's agenda. Focusing on the filibuster is a red herring. Trump and the GOP from the outset refused to negotiate, assuming that the shutdown would be seen as the Dems fault. They were wrong, and no amount of damage...
@Ernesto
The Senate GOP does not have to have 60 votes to remove the filibuster. The filibuster is a rule change, and they've already removed it for other legislation and appointments this year to push Trump's agenda. Focusing on the filibuster is a red herring. Trump and the GOP from the outset refused to negotiate, assuming that the shutdown would be seen as the Dems fault. They were wrong, and no amount of damage control on your part is going to change that. Mostly because your dear leader can't freaking help but put the lie to every talking point you come up with.
Ernesto. Inform yourself: Republicans need to negotiate with Democrats. Period.
My tax cuts were codified in the BBB. You are way out of your depth here. You should watch some school house rock episodes that teach you how the senate works.
Hi Pilot93434. Alrighty then, big-earner. You’re set for life, I guess. Congrats, big dog. Ignore all this noise, then. Enjoy your mega-yacht. Would’ve been nice if you looked out for your fellow man, but, we get it, you got yours… remember to lift up that ladder behind you!
To AndyS: Republicans control everything and can pass their CR with the nuclear option (which they've already used this year for Trump's agenda). They refuse to negotiate. Democrats are demanding healthcare subsidies that 72% of Americans support and that primarily benefit Republican districts (57% of recipients). When you have all the power but won't use it or negotiate, blaming the minority is just admitting you can't govern.
To Ernesto: The filibuster is a Senate rule,...
To AndyS: Republicans control everything and can pass their CR with the nuclear option (which they've already used this year for Trump's agenda). They refuse to negotiate. Democrats are demanding healthcare subsidies that 72% of Americans support and that primarily benefit Republican districts (57% of recipients). When you have all the power but won't use it or negotiate, blaming the minority is just admitting you can't govern.
To Ernesto: The filibuster is a Senate rule, not a constitutional requirement. Republicans already eliminated it for Supreme Court appointments and used reconciliation multiple times this year. They can eliminate it for this CR anytime they want—they choose not to because they're losing the political fight (52-42 in blame polls) and need a scapegoat.
To Pilot93434: Your tax cuts being "codified in the BBB" doesn't change that Republicans are bailing out Argentina with $20 billion, freezing $28 billion in blue-state infrastructure, and threatening to close airspace rather than negotiate on healthcare subsidies that would prevent 114% premium increases for 20 million Americans. Schoolhouse Rock didn't cover weaponizing Thanksgiving travel as a negotiating tactic.
@Pilot93434 - I agree with 1990. The belief that other people not starving or receiving healthcare comes at the cost of your success is a very, very special line of selfish thinking.
The republicans have a majority in the Senate and voted to pass the CR. It is the Dems 60 vote filibuster iz stopping it. Just look at the 15 attempts to pass a clean CR.
Brian W, have you considered that your party (the Republicans) need to earn votes (from Democrats) by negotiating, compromising, and actually proposing a bi-partisan budget together? Because, so far, your team doesn’t seem to want the government open with all your my-way-or-the-highway nonsense…
Your way or the highway? Republicans have put forth a COMPLETELY clean CR, with absolutely no new policy attached to it. It is Democrats who lost complete control of our government in 2024, due to candidates and a policy platform that was wildly unpopular, who are now holding Americans hostage over a “my way or the highway” bad faith ploy. Try winning elections if you want to dictate policy.
Hey Tyler. It's not a "clean CR" if it lets healthcare subsidies expire, causing 114% premium increases for 20 million Americans starting during open enrollment on November 1st. Democrats are demanding the subsidies be extended because waiting until December to address them separately means the damage is already done.
Republicans could: (1) include the subsidies that 72% of Americans support, (2) negotiate with Democrats, or (3) pass their "clean CR" with the nuclear option they've...
Hey Tyler. It's not a "clean CR" if it lets healthcare subsidies expire, causing 114% premium increases for 20 million Americans starting during open enrollment on November 1st. Democrats are demanding the subsidies be extended because waiting until December to address them separately means the damage is already done.
Republicans could: (1) include the subsidies that 72% of Americans support, (2) negotiate with Democrats, or (3) pass their "clean CR" with the nuclear option they've already used this year. They choose none of these options.
When you control all three branches but refuse to either compromise or use your power to govern, calling the minority's leverage "hostage taking" is just admitting you can't lead. That's why you trail by 10 points in shutdown blame polls.
Try governing if you want to win elections. Tuesday showed what happens when you don't.
The policy to cut SNAP is clean?
The only people saying "My way or the highway" is the GQP.
which party controls all three branches of the government that can't keep itself open?
I got you! It's the Republicans' fault.
Please inform yourself. Control is not possible in the senate where a supermajority (aka filibuster proof majority) is needed to end the stalemate. As in 60 votes in favor of opening the government. There is a majority in favor (55) including 3 democrats. All the opposition votes except for one are democrats. So they need 5 more democrats to get to 60 votes. There have been at least 14 votes so far that failed to open the government
Ernesto, you’re still wrong, no matter how much you copy-and-paste your disinformation. Republicans need to negotiate with Democrats to reopen the government. That’s it. Not hard. Go tell them.
You show you don't understand how the senate works and how budgets are passed.
Dude, AndyS, you're not even trying anymore.
Andy, you've proven time and time again that you're part of the poorly educated that Mango Mussolini loves.
Banks and insurance companies will start ratcheting up pressure on them to reopen when they have to pay out a ton of travel insurance claims.
100%
I'm traveling tomorrow. I've had a travel insurance policy (purchased before this shutdown). Hope to not have to use it, but, if I do, I can't wait to see their attempt to deny claims... like, fellas, this is the type of thing you're supposed to cover (why else would we pay for the darn premiums!)
Oh, and we seriously generally need better consumer protections, too. Like, we need an EU-261 equivalent. Once the adults...
100%
I'm traveling tomorrow. I've had a travel insurance policy (purchased before this shutdown). Hope to not have to use it, but, if I do, I can't wait to see their attempt to deny claims... like, fellas, this is the type of thing you're supposed to cover (why else would we pay for the darn premiums!)
Oh, and we seriously generally need better consumer protections, too. Like, we need an EU-261 equivalent. Once the adults are back in-charge, we need reforms on all sorts of important things.
1990, Better read the fine print on that policy!
Hiya, upstater. I have, and hope you do, too. That’s why I do not recommend AIG; those scoundrels. Others have paid, thankfully, including prior shutdowns. As with anything, ‘it depends.’ Gotta fight.
@1990
how old are you? who buys travel insurance in the age of no fee cancels and travel credits?
The percentage of people who buy travel insurance for domestic trips is low. And those of us who rely on premium cc insurance are screwed as this is not in the Covered reasons lists for delays in the various Guides to Benefits.
"...and will be the most widespread impact of the shutdown to date." Perhaps it isn't this, but rather the tens of millions of people losing enough food assistance that will be the most widespread impact.
@ Jarrett -- You're of course 100% right, and I updated the wording on that. My point was to say that in terms of optics, it may have the most widespread impact (especially since a not-insignificant percentage of the population doesn't think food assistance programs should exist).
The reality is that whenever anything goes wrong with the airline industry, it makes the nightly news, so this will no doubt get disproportionate coverage.
I agree with you, and I see how you're saying it in that basically everyone (widespread) will agree on this one.
This is not a good look for the Administration. The GOP has been trying to stop people from getting healthcare through the ACA since before it even launched. So, here we are 14 years later and the GOP would rather bring our country to a screeching halt rather than give people free or reduced-cost access to basic healthcare. They'd rather that our military who is fighting all fights the GOP has started go without pay...
This is not a good look for the Administration. The GOP has been trying to stop people from getting healthcare through the ACA since before it even launched. So, here we are 14 years later and the GOP would rather bring our country to a screeching halt rather than give people free or reduced-cost access to basic healthcare. They'd rather that our military who is fighting all fights the GOP has started go without pay than give people better access to healthcare and nutritious food. Meanwhile, Dear Leader has spent over $70 million US tax dollars on golf trips since returning to office.
And, somehow, some people of very deep religious convictions (like the preachers who wave automatic weapons during their sermons) seem to think this is all okay and aligned with the teaching of Jesus.
Well said, Parker.
As the commentator David Frum once said: "If conservatives become convinced that they can not win democratically, they will not abandon conservatism. The will reject democracy."
It is the Democrats who did not win democratically, and are attempting to subvert the democratic will of the American people. Your many, many posts seem to take the viewpoint that Democrats are in power. News flash - the American people loudly rejected their agenda in 2024.
Its the democrats that are causing this because they are trying to have a minority lead.
What they are doing is sedition.
To AndyS: Using minority leverage to demand popular policy isn't "sedition"—it's how the Senate has always worked. Republicans did the identical thing in 2013 (demanding ACA delays) and 2018-2019 (demanding wall funding). Both times they lost because their demands were unpopular.
Democrats are demanding healthcare subsidies that 72% of Americans support. Republicans control all three branches and could pass their CR with the nuclear option (which they've already used this year). Instead, they're threatening airspace...
To AndyS: Using minority leverage to demand popular policy isn't "sedition"—it's how the Senate has always worked. Republicans did the identical thing in 2013 (demanding ACA delays) and 2018-2019 (demanding wall funding). Both times they lost because their demands were unpopular.
Democrats are demanding healthcare subsidies that 72% of Americans support. Republicans control all three branches and could pass their CR with the nuclear option (which they've already used this year). Instead, they're threatening airspace closures and manufacturing a crisis.
Calling standard legislative tactics "sedition" when the minority does it—after your party did the same thing twice in the last decade—isn't an argument. It's projection.
No, that’s hyperbolic at best, and downright malicious. Vile, AndyS, like usual.
@AndyS
No, January 6th was sedition. But I know y'all love to ignore that day.
What those who oppose opening the Government are doing is a peaceful approach to assuring that there is a democracy still left in our country. That those with little voice have a voice and will be protected.
Well said, Antwerp. Garland was too sheepish in prosecuting Trump for J6 and the stolen documents cases. Just as the post-civil-war governments allowed Jim Crow, we're not learning from our history, and allowing these cancers to return. 'Same sh*t, different hat.'
You realize this issue is about expiring Covid subsidies that, among other things, allowed subsidies to people making hundreds of thousand dollars a year? So, are you uninformed or just a liar?
Taking a redeye from LAX-JFK friday night and flying back Monday. Quite concerned. But if the flight is canceled outbound we will just bail.
Hope your flight still happens, Nate. We're rooting for you!
On the bright side it seems we will know before we have to go to airport.
Finally, climate leadership from the white house
Zing!
LMAO
Well played
Time to start negotiating like a democracy.
e pluribus unum
'Out of many, one'
Let's get it done!
Democracy is cracy; as alluded to by the term itself. And an object failure on all levels...
How can you trust to have every mom, nook, and grannie vote every four years on complex issues?
They can't; they don't have a clue. So they vote Trump and GOP: aka, twice convicted felon and his mafia cabal.
That's how we ended up w/ masked ICE agents in our cities. And w/ terror in our streets...
Democracy is cracy; as alluded to by the term itself. And an object failure on all levels...
How can you trust to have every mom, nook, and grannie vote every four years on complex issues?
They can't; they don't have a clue. So they vote Trump and GOP: aka, twice convicted felon and his mafia cabal.
That's how we ended up w/ masked ICE agents in our cities. And w/ terror in our streets and neighborhoods for everyone w/ a darker skin shade, or an accent. Even worse if they can speak a foreign language...
Hey there Matt. Not to be "that guy" at the party, but democracy is derived from the Greek demos (the people, as in common people) and kratos (power or rule). So your breakdown doesn't quite work.
Also, thank you for introducing the rest of the class to the rare liberal argument against political self determination. No one who operates in the American spirit of representation should argue against the principal of one person, one vote.
...Hey there Matt. Not to be "that guy" at the party, but democracy is derived from the Greek demos (the people, as in common people) and kratos (power or rule). So your breakdown doesn't quite work.
Also, thank you for introducing the rest of the class to the rare liberal argument against political self determination. No one who operates in the American spirit of representation should argue against the principal of one person, one vote.
There's no doubt that the outcomes you are describing are terrible, but it is not an argument against liberal democracy. It's an argument for doing a better job of persuading the populace.
We don't negotiate with hostage takers.
To AndyS: Republicans hold the hostages: the White House, House, Senate, and the nuclear option. They can end this anytime without a single Democratic vote.
Democrats are demanding healthcare protections 72% of Americans support. Republicans respond by threatening airspace closures, freezing $28 billion in infrastructure, and bailing out Argentina while claiming there's no money for SNAP.
When you control everything but refuse to govern unless the minority surrenders, you're not fighting hostage-takers. You are the...
To AndyS: Republicans hold the hostages: the White House, House, Senate, and the nuclear option. They can end this anytime without a single Democratic vote.
Democrats are demanding healthcare protections 72% of Americans support. Republicans respond by threatening airspace closures, freezing $28 billion in infrastructure, and bailing out Argentina while claiming there's no money for SNAP.
When you control everything but refuse to govern unless the minority surrenders, you're not fighting hostage-takers. You are the hostage-taker.
Republicans are the hostage takers; the American people are the hostages.
Lie all you want, here and elsewhere; we’ll keep saying the truth, every time.
Hmmm! Republican presidents are always lawless and hypocrites. Reagan negotiated with Ayatollah Khomeini to release American hostages and Trump negotiated with Hamas to release alive Israeli hostages -- two of the three greatest members of Axis of Evil.