Aircraft manufacturing of large commercial jets is basically a duopoly (assuming we don’t consider China’s COMAC to be a global player). Both Airbus and Boeing have as much business as they can handle, and aren’t in a position to ramp up production.
As you’d expect, this also means that there’s not much of an incentive to innovate beyond what’s currently on the market. However, that doesn’t mean we’re not going to see new variants of existing aircraft. Along those lines…
In this post:
Airbus plans to make the Airbus A350 bigger, eventually
Airbus CEO Guillaume Faury had an interesting discussion with Aviation Week about the company’s general product line evolution. Faury was asked about if/how Airbus plans to compete with the new Boeing 777-9, which is the largest passenger jet that will be manufactured (though it has already been delayed by six years).
While it sounds like this is still a long ways off from becoming a reality, Faury suggested that Airbus’ plan is to simply “stretch” the existing A350, rather than pursuing a clean sheet design for a new jet.
As he explained, “if our production capacities are limited, it would be counterproductive to create even more product diversity.” He suggested that competing with the 777-9 would “probably be a natural evolution of the product line – from the A350-900 to the -1000 and then to something that is a bit longer, bigger and more capable.”
As a reminder, currently there are two Airbus A350 variants — the smaller A350-900 (which is 66.8 meters long), and the larger A350-1000 (which is 73.8 meters long). As a point of comparison, the 777-9 is 77.6 meters long.
For context, the longest commercial jet currently in service is the 747-8 (which is 76.25 meters long). so the 777-9 will be longer than the 747-8. So if the A350-1000 is stretched by several meters, it should be able to have a capacity that competes with the 777-9.
This seems logical, but don’t expect it anytime soon
There’s of course merit to creating different variants of the same type of aircraft. There are upsides to that kind of streamlining, especially when it comes to crew training and fleet planning.
That being said, I wouldn’t expect to see this stretched version of the A350 anytime soon. For one, there’s just not the incentive to actually create a new product at the moment, given that demand for existing Airbus planes is through the roof, and a vast majority of airlines find that the A350-1000 offers sufficient capacity. Even when the 777-9 actually enters commercial service, I don’t anticipate some huge rush for airlines to order more of the jet.
Second, stretching an existing plane might be easier than creating an all-new aircraft, but it also comes with its challenges. We’re going to need to see more incremental improvements with the existing A350, so that the plane can be stretched without compromising range.
The good thing is that the A350 is still new technology, so evolving that product line probably makes a lot of sense. It’s different than what Boeing did with the 737 MAX, where it essentially tried to update decades-old technology.
Bottom line
Airbus plans to eventually stretch its flagship long haul aircraft, the A350, to compete with Boeing’s new 777-9. There’s no timeline for this happening, but it sounds like some number of years down the road, we’ll see something longer than the A350-1000, which can seat several dozen more passengers.
This is a logical development, eventually. Though for the time being, there’s not much incentive to introduce such a product, given that Airbus has all the business it can handle, and it’s not like Boeing is really posing much of a threat to the European giant.
What do you make of the concept of a stretched Airbus A350?
It'll need more gear, remember the single centre set on the 340-600?
Who else remembers certain airlines were very vocal 10+ years ago that Airbus should have done the A350-2000 right there and then?
The wing width will be the issue, a339 have an aspect ratio of 11, 359 got 9.5 while a35k only has 9, they can't decrease it further.
Looks like this is their plan B. Their plan A was to encourage a lot of airlines to configure economy like how 777 economy cabins are configured
Airbus seems to hit the sweet spot in regards to cabin width and comfort e.g. A330/340, A350. If they were to add another seat, that would be LCC territory e.g. Cebu, Lion Air, etc.
The 777 and 787 were initially designed for 9 and 8-abreast respectively. Now if you add another seat, that's still full service territory.
So far, a few airlines have put 10 abreast on an A350. They are LCCs Air Caraibes and French Bee. They have also gotten their first full service A350 customer that will follow suit, which is Philippine Airlines.
Philippine Airlines is an oddity as they were trying to be more of a hybrid airline from about a decade ago or so hence the 9-abreast A330s. When the previous conglomerate sold their stake back, they reconfigured some of their A330s back to a more "status quo" configuration in line with FSCs.
In regards to the A350, Airbus seems to be mimicking the B team by redesigning the sidewalls and increasing the cabin width...
Philippine Airlines is an oddity as they were trying to be more of a hybrid airline from about a decade ago or so hence the 9-abreast A330s. When the previous conglomerate sold their stake back, they reconfigured some of their A330s back to a more "status quo" configuration in line with FSCs.
In regards to the A350, Airbus seems to be mimicking the B team by redesigning the sidewalls and increasing the cabin width similar to the 777X. I guess they're the first FSC (assuming their seating configuration is finalized) to go 10-abreast as they seem to cater more to their own Filipino diaspora than westerners.
So Airbus, you mean like the A340-600? That was a resounding success wasn't it...
You can’t compare the a340 and a350. The a340 was outdated and no model was successful really.
The A346 was a quad and meant to replace earlier 747s. The 777-300ER came later. Now, if the A346 were a twin and/or the 300ER was non-existent, it would've gotten more sales.
I am confused ... I thought the general consensus (the wishful thinking of Airbus fanboys) was that B777-X would never see the light of day! Then why is Airbus trying to compete with such phantom?
@VS
Well isn't that a reasonable assumption? Isn't it like 10 years or almost 10 years delayed EIS now?
Well, Airbus doesn't seem to think "that is a reasonable assumption", though. As is indicated in the article, they are trying to compete with 777-X with a stretch to A350-1000. He
Hey Ben,
Honest question - do you moderate the comments section? The reason I ask is because my posts seem to disappear after a few minutes. It is customary for the moderator to drop a note to the poster of the deleted post as to which of your rules the post violated. After all, you do have the e-mail address associated with every post.
Airbus has grown as much as it has by waiting for Boeing to develop nearly every new model after Boeing has completed its corresponding model.
The A350 was designed after the 787 and with considerably more growth potential.
Airbus had the A380 at the top of its production line; Boeing had the 747-8. Both were economic and sales failures
Boeing stretched the 777-300ER to create the 777X including by addition of a new carbon...
Airbus has grown as much as it has by waiting for Boeing to develop nearly every new model after Boeing has completed its corresponding model.
The A350 was designed after the 787 and with considerably more growth potential.
Airbus had the A380 at the top of its production line; Boeing had the 747-8. Both were economic and sales failures
Boeing stretched the 777-300ER to create the 777X including by addition of a new carbon fiber wing while the A350 and B787 are more than 50% carbon fiber.
The A350-1000 has considerably more range than the 777-9 and has been in service for almost a decade.
A stretch of the A350-1000 is possible but would require new engines to offset the larger fuselage w/o losing as much range compared to using current generation engines.
Since Rolls-Royce is actively working on the Ultrafan, it is possible that a stretched A350 could be available for sale in a few years with delivery in the early 2030s - which is well within airline planning timeframes.
Airbus might also want to clean up the A350K wing even more improve its aspect ratio to reduce the induced drag.
Many people believe that the A350-1000 is an ideal passenger friendly aircraft. Not too big, or, small and uncomfortable.
One knows that it is the individual airlines who determine how comfortable, for example a Y cabin, will be depending upon seat pitch. However, after somewhere between 200-250 passenger hours per year on board the BA A350, I have never felt uncomfortable.
One would always choose an A350 over a B777, with one exception...
Many people believe that the A350-1000 is an ideal passenger friendly aircraft. Not too big, or, small and uncomfortable.
One knows that it is the individual airlines who determine how comfortable, for example a Y cabin, will be depending upon seat pitch. However, after somewhere between 200-250 passenger hours per year on board the BA A350, I have never felt uncomfortable.
One would always choose an A350 over a B777, with one exception …. a B777 of AF decked out in the New La Premiere suite.
It's fantastic that A350-1000 is superior to B777. However, that's off-topic. The plane that the proposed A350-2000 is trying to compete with is B777-X.
CX was always interested in a stretched A350 for flights to Miami.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-06-01/cathay-interested-in-bigger-airbus-a350-to-reach-miami-non-stop
https://www.ch-aviation.com/news/46738-cathay-pacific-weighs-up-a350-8000-potential
The A350-1000 has the range to reach Miami from Hong Kong.
The A359 as well, but the key word in the first article is "bigger". So my guess would be using a 779 sized aircraft for passengers and cargo as the A350 family is a lighter airframe.
I thought the general consensus (wishful thinking of the Airbus fanboys) was that B777-X would never see the light of day! I wonder why Airbus wants to compete with a phantom!? Confused...
It's not gonna happen. Plain and simple.
Please explain Avgeek?
Eventually it will happen but they need a new engine the RR Ultra its the logical candidate to replace the Trent.