Singapore Airlines has announced a schedule update for 2023. It’s good news for Australia, and bad news for the United States.
Continue reading: Singapore Airlines Pulls A380 From New York Flight
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
Not a good opening paragraph. Too broad regarding Australia and the US. Happy thanksgiving buddy.
I think the opening paragraph is fine. The good news/bad news is clearly in the context of air travel. And given the SIA A380 is leaving the US entirely and being added to two of Australia's biggest cities, I don't think it's too broad.
Interesting development, but I can understand that demand from SYD and MEL would push SQ in this direction. They have several daily frequencies between SIN and both cities, and I'm not surprised that bigger jets would make more sense than additional flights and something had to give for them to do that. Disappointed I can't fly on an A380 all the way from SYD to JFK, but that's a first world problem. The trade-off is more options on one of them to SIN.
Sorry if I misunderstood something but is it only the second sector a Fifth Freedom?
Welp, I have a Suites flight booked on the A380 for July 2023. For now my booking online still shows as being on an A380. It’s too bad, I also had an A380 Suites booking in July 2022 but I had to cancel it to come back early from Europe for a funeral. I guess I’ll make do with the 77W and hope to try the new A380 product another time. I’ve done Suites in the previous configuration and had a blast.
Ok…officially bummed! Finally schedule for my first A380, and first Suites Experience in May. Yup first still good, but…. Worth the extra miles/points for an overnight flight in a flat bed seat?
Booked for a couple of days before the change, so hope that May 15 date stands….
If I'm not mistaken, only the sector between JFK and FRA sold as a stand-alone ticket is 5th freedom. Tickets that originate or terminate in SIN are 3rd/4th freedom (if it's on the same through ticket to or from SIN, the FRA-JFK segment is still 3/4 if there's a stopover in FRA.)
The JFKFRA is the fifth freedom flight. Quick background. There are 9 "freedoms of the air" defined in the international aviation treaties that govern foreign airlines in foreign airspaces. Each freedom grants a specific right.
The fifth freedom is the right to fly between 2 foreign countries on a flight that eventually ends up in your home country. In this case, this A380 starts in the US, flies to Germany, and ends up in Singapore. The USGermany leg is a fifth freedom flight. The Germany->Singapore flight is a 4th freedom flight, and the Singapore->Germany flight is a 3rd freedom flight.
You can look up the different freedoms on wiki. It's eye opening to see how much negotiation must take place between countries to allow international flights, something we take for granted.
Just flew the FRA-JFK leg last week in suites.
Definatelt nice, but our 2017 flight in old suites (JFK-FRA-SIN-BOM) was far more memorable an experience (one other person in the cabin, quiet, personal). With a full cabin, was quite a bit noisier the whole time, making sleep impossible.
This change makes things slightly easier on me, since I was still trying to figure out our SYD return to the US next year. Might still try for suites up to SIN (want to see the Jewel), and then figure something else out to the states.
Thank You Lune for your accurate description of the 9 freedom routes. Enjoy the day.
many international carriers around the world are adding capacity to Australia in part because Australia is counter-cyclical to northern hemisphere transatlantic travel and because Qantas has reduced capacity to so many parts of the world that there are significant gaps in capacity from Australia to other parts of the world - remember the discussion here about QR's "ghost" domestic flights beyond Melbourne.
Also, SQ is not competitive with other carriers in winning premium demand by having only one flight - on a very large aircraft - compared to UA and LH which have much more frequent flights including with a joint venture.
There are also competitive and strategic dynamics with your alliance partners of operating the A380 in a 5th freedom market that is dominated by your alliance partners.
I'm glad I got to take a trip in Suites before this happened - my first premium redemption ever. Which of course has spoiled me for travelling in J now (don't even talk about economy)
So you’re saying they pulled the A380 during peak transatlantic season for off-season in Australia? Makes no sense
Sad to see this development as we had planned on a early 2024 trip in the 380 suites.
Not sure that I understand. What's too broad about it? It's talking specifically about A380s being moved from the SIN-FRA-JFK route to fly to SYD/MEL instead. Since it was the only option for flying Singapore Suites from the U.S., it is indeed good news for Australians (more Suites options for them) and bad news for the U.S. (none for us.)
Also, I would argue that this is bad news for Suites redemptions in general. SIN-FRA-JFK is by far the longest Suites route, so most time to enjoy it. It's about 21 hours in the air vs. only 7 to SYD or MEL. Just the JFK-FRA part of the JFK-FRA-SIN is longer than SIN-MEL and only about 50 miles less than SIN-SYD. Seems like kind of waste to deploy Suites on routes that barely more than medium-haul vs. on ultra-long-haul ones.
And, aside from Qantas reducing capacity, Virgin exited the long-haul market entirely. While Virgin + Delta used to have several daily non-stops between Australia and the U.S. West Coast, it's now down to just the one Delta flight between SYD and LAX, leaving the Aus/NZ-U.S. market almost entirely to Qantas + AA and ANZ + UA.
Considering that premium cabin award space at save rates is limited (business class) to impossible (first/suites) to find I'm surprised. If the prime cabins are that full, then why not keep flying them on the longest routes where they can charge the most?
go back and reread ALL of the reasons I noted including that SQ's changes are posted out to infinity which means they don't just impact next northern hemisphere summer.
2024? Not sure if you will only have the chance to fly in Economy on the A380 by then. But I'm quite sure some of them will be on sale. 😉
Business class award availability is pretty easy to find on it, from my experience
Wow i will miss Singapore Airlines back and forth from JFK to Manila I just few on Singapore Airlines couple of months ago. pretty good airline. What airline will replace Singapore Airlines From JFK to Manila
I'm glad I got to fly the double first class suite jfk-sin before it is gone (and 2 saver seats to boot).
Separately, it seems like a surprising decision. The flight is always full in F.
PR is already serving JFK-MNL. PR is definitely no SQ so don’t expect too much.
Delta is starting an additional flight 3x/week and both are on A350s which seat more passengers than the 777LRs that DL used to use.
American also used to operate their own flight and have been absent for most of the time since DL and UA returned their schedules but they are restoring their flight.
I'm not sure that SQ really competes in the US to Australia market although they would certainly like to
I doubt that the decision was based on suites usage, SQ is more likely looking at passenger demand across all premium cabins and probably economy as well, and traffic from SYD and MEL is high. QF only has two daily flights to Singapore from Sydney, one of which is an A380 and goes on to LHR, the other an A330, and only an A330 from Melbourne (MEL to LHR is via PER not SIN). SQ would also factor in that they have two daily non-stops to the NY area and consider the total demand when deciding to reduce capacity on the flight via FRA.
I just booked my July 2023 trip last night without knowing this was happening. Had the website been updated, I would have chosen a different airline. Hoping SIA honors those flights already purchased for the Airbus A380.
VA didn't just exit the market, they terminated their joint venture with DL in favor of a j/v with UA, who back-filled some of the lost capacity with an additional flight to SFO, and bringing back IAH-SYD sooner than initially anticipated.
PR's "Business" class is beyond unacceptable by any standard. They don't even have fully lie flat seats. So hardly can be called a business class. Sad. I avoid them like the plague despite being hundreds of dollars cheaper on many routes.
I’m actually really disappointed. I’ve been diligently saving points, to transfer to Singapore Airlines, specifically to travel from JFK to SIN in one of those suites. Was planning upon recreating the Crazy Rich Asians scene with my husband. Guess I’ll have to fly to Europe first ….
We literally booked our first ever first class flight to singapore from UK via Frankfurt just last week specifically choosen the A380 to experience the double suites.....imagine just a few days after managing to get the seats we wanted to get an email to say the aircraft was swapped for the 777. Gutted!!
We booked for October 2023 and got an amazing price compared to flying direct from UK (seriously cheaper) via Lufthansa. Still first class is going to be good so can't complain really. At least we know now what happened.
Was booked for connecting suites with my wife jfk-fra-sin on our way to ktm, in September ‘23. Got the dreaded call and email from SQ with the bad news a couple days ago. Have done both old and new suites but not the 777 product. Disappointing, but at least one of you liked the 777 experience better. Same soft product I assume?