There’s quite some drama right now at the Allied Pilots Association (APA), which is the union representing American Airlines’ 16,000+ pilots. Somehow it involves election interference, and pilots who are ”pro-pilot choice.” We really have the same issues everywhere, eh?
Continue reading: American Pilots Union Ousts President, And It’s Getting Messy
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Perhaps its a Texas thing but Southwest pilots also do not belong to ALPA.
As for the ouster of the APA president, he overstepped the bounds of supporting an independent union to being willing to punish those that sought choice.
The practical difference between the APA and ALPA represented global carriers DL and UA is scope. AA has succeeded at flying a higher percentage of its system on regional carriers and AA continues to push that strategy; APA has failed to stop the company's strategy. UA had the highest percentage of its domestic system on regional jets but has been surpassed by AA and UA has long had lots of longhaul international flying.
And while pilot union battles don't usually impact customers, FA battles do. AA finally settled with its warring FA union - also independent - but UA has not even though there are no other large airline unions left to settle.
UA clearly wants to eak out one more quarter of strong earnings before having to account for a massive retro payment to FAs and hundreds of millions more in higher labor costs - or the labor unions haven't done their jobs.
Office politics in a regular office is bad enough. I can only imagine what its like in a large union.
Southwest is a Southwest thing.
ALPA at UA/DL have done much better with controlling regional creep. While UA has lots of regional jets, large amount of 50 seats that they know won't practically replace mainline flying, there is plenty of higher pay/value long haul with growth headed that direction. DL with the lowest capacity aircraft operated by mainline crews has ensured plenty of jobs and kept regional growth at a certain percent (and brilliant superhub at ATL that enables mainline flying in/out of locations that only see a 50-seater at best by anybody else). AA is the worst of both worlds: tons of RJs, very little long haul flying, and a goal of being the best airline in El Paso. No great upward mobility or guarantees there.
I like Ben but unions are NOT run like a business. They are endogamous and totalitarian. Evidenced by the President’s actions.
Tim Takes never cease to amuse.
"APA has failed to stop the company's strategy." because APA gave AA/US that scope at the merger in exchange for a higher cost contract than AMR was offering. So "failed to stop" doesn't really mean much outside your extremely lame attempts to paint some disgruntled story at non-DL airlines when APA gave it to the company in the first place. APA probably has asked for it back at the table to show they tried just like any union asks for the moon to show they tried, but there's no meaningful data anywhere to suggest APA has put "DL/UA scope" at their top of their asks. Why would they? most of that scope is flown by AA-owned regionals and likely future APA members and, in theory, should be able to fund larger APA costs if AA believes what it tells investors, rightly or wrongly.
"And while pilot union battles don't usually impact customers, FA battles do. AA finally settled with its warring FA union" What do you view as the customer impact from any unionized Flight Attendant group in the last 20+ years? Are you suggesting APFA acted illegally within the confines of the National Railway act while in mediation or negotiation? Wearing an APFA pin doesn't impact customers as much as you seem to think it does. And you only think it does because you have that weird Delta-drivel nonsense behind every thing you say trying to make Delta look amazing while their competitors are "warring" or "APA has failed"...
You really show your true colors at every post and it's just so dumb and only betrays your own ignorance. But yet you're out here every day proving that ignorance to others in a cloudy murk of nonsense to make yourself seem smart.
and yet AA pilots don't make more than DL or UA pilots but have to put up with much more outsourcing of domestic flying to regional partners. Are you going to deny that AA doesn't have many, many more 2 cabin RJs?
and you JUST LAST WEEK were crowing about how EI's new BNA-DUB flight would be so great for oneworld - and yet not a single American pilot or flight attendant will work onboard that flight.
all of your attempts to denigrate me and the evidence is overwhelming that AA employees have gotten the very raw end of the deal with domestic and international outsourcing and everyone except you knows it.
Unions are not supposed to be run like business, what are you on about? Also nothing to do with Biden…
Totalitarian? A body that allows member votes and, in this situation, has a board who recalled the president after these shenanigans? There’s nothing more dictator like then a petty manager and executive.
Leave it to you to reply with two things that have nothing to do with what I said, yes. Of course AA has more large RJs, that’s the entire point of what I said, you Moron, scope given to AA at the merger by apa. What point do you even think you’re making? Are you trying to repeat what I said as though I’m contradicting what I said? Lol
And EI’sflight to BNA is different to how delta and United operate in their JVs? You seem to think you’ve caught me in some comment mixup but you really just don’t have any mental comprehension for what others write. The aa JV just has better European hub cities in LHr/DUBfor mid tier US cities. Delta has JV language scope requiring them to fly more in their JVs but so? Doesn’t seem too important to APA, just to you and your nonsensical and lame attempt to find discord where there isn’t any. Delta just does a bad job in their alpa negotiations. So what? Delta pilots are paid more than aa via profit sharing amount, but little else. Their contracts are nearly identical minus the profits of the respective carriers. Try better, tim. You only better your ignorance
Get a life loser, you can’t even read what others write much less reply in a coherent manner
Hilarious that this survey of 600 pilots (16,000+ company wide ~3-4%) is considered worth posting the survey results