Aircraft Seat Certification Delays: Why Has It Become Such A Mess?

It would be interesting to know why/how UA is so good at this. They completed a complete Polaris suite, Premium Plus & Economy Plus installation in six years (including Covid) on 204 int'l wide body aircraft fleet including 763s (2 configurations), 764s, 772s, 773s, 788s, 789s & 78Xs. They did this at 3X the rate DL has been doing it on their int'l wide body aircraft. I wonder if it is related to which party is contractually liable for delays as referenced in the article.

LH basically chose a slight variation of Safran Optima but from 3 different vendors. Most of the seats are already worse than competetion from 10 years ago and the front seats are easy to certify. Much ado about nothing so they deserve the result of their incredible incompetence. They could have chosen any off the shelf good staggered or reverse herringbon seats or if the really wanted high density there's the Recaro or the Optima.

If only Lufthansa had chosen a decent off the shelf reverse herringbone seat (like BA or Etihad did) their entire fleet could have been reconfigured by now instead of the mess they are in.

Lucky timing. Surely seat certification was much easier before the pandemic.

What are the current supply chain issues with aircraft seats? While there were supply chain issues across the board during covid, this is the only item I can recall recently that is still suffering issues.

I'm fine with bespoke seats (Qsuite!) but at least Qsuites stick to one manufacturer lol

chris w says, "Lucky timing. Surely seat certification was much easier before the pandemic."

No doubt, but DL started their D1 mods at about the same time.

that you picked up someone else's comment and my reply to build an article.

I always want to keep you with a long list of things to write about, Ben. keep up the good work.

As to your point about risk with contracts, in general with any product, if it is customized by one customer beyond the ability of the manufacturer to incorporate those designs at their structural core into other products for other customers, the customer assumes the risk.

LH heavily customized beyond what their multiple seat manufacturers were willing to do.

Manufacturers will test for multiple screen sizes, doors and also for combinations of trim but other items such as cupholders and added cubbyholes inside the suite increase risks.

this will get sorted out and airlines and manufacturers will learn

the pandemic didn't change the calculus. It was the change in complexity of seats and the realization - undoubtedly supported by data - that many current seat designs do not pass crash tests.

This is a good point, and I think highlights just how awful Lufthansa’s strategy and planning have been. As I recall, BA when they selected the Club Suites product, specifically cited concerns about certification and installation when asked why they went for an off-the-shelf option.

This was AFTER Lufthansa had announced Allegris, and pre-pandemic… so despite the current situation being a ‘perfect storm’, clearly many airlines could see it coming.

Who needs all of this regulation?

We should be reducing burdens on businesses and costs on consumers in order to increase the United States' global competitiveness and prosperity. This reduction on compliance costs means that businesses can redirect resources toward innovation and productivity.

Sure, that will cost the life of a few thousand of people every year, but who's kidding - the government is not for the people, it's for the corporations!

-MAGA

Ben, you make good points. For instance, Hawaiian had the J suite approved and flying, while AA was still awaiting approval of the exact same seat in its 787-9P. AA had to go through some sort of armrest lowering evacuation application BS. The FAA is getting overly cautious after THEY screwed up on the max. i’s dotted and t’s crossed. That will make it safer! Good luck to UA when they install the exact same seat in their 787’s.

This is a good example of how incompetent the Trump administration is. A normal Republican administration 15 years ago would have installed competent regulators at DoT and whatever other agencies regulate this stuff and then they would have instructed staff to relax the certification process to shorten delays.

Trump comes in and installs a reality TV star who wants to go on TV and argue and then DOGE fires a ton of staff at the agencies so they can no longer get any work done and here we are. Even though they think they are pro-business, it really just makes it so government can't function in the essential things it does. We see this with oil and gas leases, FEMA response to disasters etc.

As this is an aviation/travel blog, we'll stay on point. So, let's not forget the attempted dismantling of NOAA, the National Weather Service, the National Hurricane Center, and the Space Weather Prediction Center. But, my favorite is the de-orbiting of billions of dollars of operational meteorological satellites.

This is ironic because as a passenger and not a seat design expert, it seems that business class seats are getting *more* standardized: these days everyone seems to be converging on reverse herringbone.

Aside from doors I personally don't see much difference in any of the reverse herringbone seats out there (not that I've tried them all, or that I can compare side to side).

So I'm surprised that the reason for delays is from increasing customization. If my passenger experience applies to most pax, then it make more sense to just go with off the shelf. Unless you have something truly radical like a q-suite, no one is going to care about some slight change you make to your otherwise bog standard reverse herringbone seat that will only cost you extra money and delays while doing nothing to actually differentiate your product in passengers' minds.

If only airlines would staff their executive ranks with people who came up through the ranks instead of generic business grads and lawyers they would anticipate these issues.

Delta just keeps screwing up over and over again. Poor Tim can't come up with any new ways to pretend it's not a disaster.

Tom, This rule went into affect during the Bush Administration. The Trump Administration has had no impact or effect on this rule. What an ignorant comment. Get some help for your TDS. My God, not everything in life is Trump's fault. BTW, his DOT/FAA administrators are actually doing something to fix and modernize ATC, fcats!