While I’m sure some people are very happy about this, others are really angry and feel unappreciated, and I don’t blame them…
Continue reading: Air Traffic Controllers Furious Over $10K “Patriot” Bonus For Perfect Attendance
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
3 more years of this circus. Alright, let’s game it out. Next shutdown, a sickly ATC insists on going to work to not miss out on a potential $10k bonus. S/he makes poor, clouded judgement that then imperils the lives of passengers and crew of an aeroplane or two. What then?
Maybe we’ll find out
I’m in total agreeance with you and I believe it’s something to worry about. Who does these things to such an important workforce oh yeah .. right
Perhaps we’ll see 9000+ controllers call out sick this weekend in protest of this horribly-executed policy…?
I guess it's similar to when the Biden administration decided to forgive student loans of a certain group of people (basically giving them a bonus) and not having any plan or consideration for those who didn't take out loans, or paid years before, or would be the next batch of students to pay.
Should they have counted overtime shifts against a "miss"? Yes.
Was this a good idea in principle and a good precedent to set? Also yes.
Incentives matter.
Reddit is a far left echo chamber. If Trump ends wars, saves lives, solves hunger, or does anything nice, he will still be blamed at reddit.
@ Eric -- Is there somewhere public online where air traffic controllers are having conversations that you don't think is a "far left echo chamber?" Because I'd be curious to see differing takes as well. Reddit is just the biggest site for getting the pulse on these kinds of things.
I have to imagine that most air traffic controllers who took time off work because they were sick and then picked up extra shifts would be pretty unhappy to not get anything, regardless of political affiliation, no?
@ eaci -- Incentives absolutely do matter, but I think this actually sets a bad precedent. As many controllers point out, this is basically encouraging everyone to come into work if they're sick in order to get a potential bonus, which seems counter productive (since they can get other people sick as well, causing even bigger issues).
Is it me or is 776 a small number. I would have hoped most ATC would show up for work every day. I have gone multiple years without calling in sick. I am fortunate that I am healthy but don't believe it is that abnormal.
I actually think it is not a bad idea to give a bonus to the healthy people.
Yeah, that number is crazy low. If that's the real number, then there's a huge lack of professionalism in the ATC community.
It's just stupid for people who didn't get the bonus to be angry. Giving the bonus to those who had perfect attendance doesn't harm the others in any way.
This might be the first time, sans possibly on 4chan, where anyone has EVER described twitter as a left leaning echo-chamber, nevermind fat left.
What you have are a bunch of people pissed, venting their fustrations on the worlds most famous forum/series of forums.
Did they end up getting back pay for the hours they worked during the shutdown?
If so, this is truly a bonus.
If not, is this even a bonus? It seems like those that came in are being "rewarded" with less than they would've earned in 40 days anyway!
Incentives matter only to those who make work amongst their peers competitive in for-profit organizations. ATC is NOT that. What should the in-office (in-control tower) scoreboard look like: the fewest numbers of accidents or lives lost per ATC controller, or just those with perfect attendance even when said controller is under the influence of a prohibited substance to be able to stay awake during the next shutdown?
No - this was another terrible idea in a never ending parade of stupidity and recklessness.
A federal employee with 15 years of tenure gets 8 hours of annual leave and 4 hours of sick leave every two weeks. over a six week shut down, that is 36 hours of leave earned. And many of the ATC controllers likely had "use it or lose it" subject to loss at the end of the year.
Under these circumstances, taking one day off (22.2% of the leave earned) over six weeks (which would disqualify one from the bonus) is not remarkable.
That's 5.3 borrowers for $188 billion while he was half awake.
Trump just used $7.7 million I taxpayers money.
Are we looking at another bonus for (obsolete) patriots who are not sick this weekend?
Indeed.
Even the most junior ATC's would have earned 24 hours of leave during the shut down. With that in mind, 24 hours would have been quite ordinary leave use. Perhaps the bonus should have been extended to those who took modest amounts of leave.
How is this even remotely controversial? Reddit-lunatics cries aside, what in here is controversial?
That is preposterous.
Incentives, including but not limited to bonuses and being allowed to keep a job at all, drive workplace behaviors in all organizations. Your concern is apparently that incentives can encourage pernicious behaviors. But that, as Oprah would say, is for another show.
Amazing how those who think this was wrong assume illness was the reason these workers didn’t show. Just look at these comments about next time and what happens when a sick controller works. You are missing the point, 92.75% of the workforce missed a shift in a 43 day period. There is no way almost 93% of them were sick over that time. Most of them made a choice not to work when they were physically able. Would love to see the missed work rate over the same 43 days the year prior.
A bunch of complaining losers who are sore they missed the bonus. The bonus did not exclude women or Latinos, just those without perfect attendance records for 6 weeks. I go years without a sick day. Some are not so lucky but 6 weeks isn't that long to be free from illness.
What about VA Hospital neurosurgeons? Did they get any bonus? No. Brain surgery is more complex than ATC. Brain surgery patients die yet air traffic is mostly safe and orderly. A near kiss can mean a few miles apart.
You do realise that people don't choose when they get sick, and that making people show up at work when they are sick is bad for everyone?
anyone that can't see the problem when less than 10% of the ATC workforce calls in sick over a 40 day period is blind to reality.
Of course, in a month and a half, some people will legitimately be sick in any job but 90% taking sick time proves the entitlement that controllers took during the government shutdown.
Let's see the numbers for TSA and other mandatory government workers but I wouldn't be surprised if controllers were well above average.
Good for whoever begins to put accountability into government employees and that process has nothing to do with party; the problem w/ ATC even outside of a shutdown clearly is less about the total number of employees and the work ethic of those that actually are employed.
ATC and TSA and other essential government jobs should be protected from missing pay during a shutdown - which happens because of the dysfunctionality of Congress.
but if this shutdown proved how abusive ATC has been of their sick time and changes take place to turn that around, then it was worth it.
If you showed up even when not getting paid you're being rewarded. If they had showed up they'd be $10K richer.
What sort of miserable asshole gripes about less than perfect attendance during a six-week period of unpaid labor?
IS this $10,000 before or after tax? Because if it's before, they will only be receiving roughly $6,000.
Ready, Fire, Aim. Backwards like every unplanned move this administration has taken. Should have made the Patriots Bonus clear before scolding the rest of ATCs. Having a goal or target to work towards helps keep the team on track.
Reddit comments are NOT representative of the sentiments of the vast majority of people.
They are a collection of statements from a small group of people who feel aggrieved enough to vent on an anonymous forum.
I'm saying this as someone who works for a company that frequently faces online opprobrium. We find that in reality, online views do NOT reflect how most people feel.
except they weren't unpaid; sadly, this scenario has happened before and we all agree (or anyone with sensibilities) that mandatory employees should not have their paychecks withheld during a government shutdown.
but that doesn't change that 90% of controllers called in sick over a 6 week period - a ratio that is far in excess of what should happen during that period for any employee in any industry.
if there are controllers that are miffed because incentive pay for doing the right thing was given to less than 10% of the workforce, then it not only shows how bad the work culture among controllers is and how even "regular" air travel delay days in the US are very likely aggravated by excessive sick callouts.
Unions and esp. the government never like accountability; when people are being paid top tier salaries and also are hired based on having top tier levels of health, it is not unreasonable to demand accountability and to reward the very few that do the right thing.
that is true w/ every type of pay. Not sure why this is any different.
let us know what type of income you legally do and not pay taxes on .
In theory, true but 90% of people being sick in a 6 week period seems like abuse. These are not people I the general population but presumably able bodied people who are not elderly.
If you are worried about one person showing up sick, do you get annual covid and flu shots and wear masks on all flights and crowded places, like the supermarket and airports? Probably not.
I understand the impetus for the gesture, but these people have no idea how to do anything that motivates other human beings. We, as a society, select the absolute worst leadership characteristics. And it isn't just politics.
and yet plenty of companies do provide financial incentives for people that do their job.
It is beyond stunning that you don't see the problem w/ over 90% of employees in any workforce calling in sick at least one time in a 6 week period.
and let's not forget that ATC controllers must have some of the best health in the country - huge numbers of Americans wouldn't even qualify because of their health.
It is high time that government workers - esp. high paid ones - be held to high standards of accountabiity.
It has nothing to do with politics but about the taxpayers getting what they pay for.
"It is beyond stunning that you don't see the problem w/ over 90% of employees in any workforce calling in sick at least one time in a 6 week period"
Having contracted sick days that you are expected to use to top up (pathetically stingy) annual leave is "beyond stunning" to other parts of the world. American workers deserve better.
Tim, you do realize the controllers were not being paid during the shutdown, right? 90% sickout (if that is even a real percentage) is not normal.
All ATC should have received bonuses; none of them should’ve been used as pawns during this shutdown; pay them all more; hire, train, invest in people and better technology.
And there’s likely to be another shutdown in February when the current CR ends. So, Trump set up what is basically an illusory promise (if you show up, you get bonuses; if you take vacation, you get screwed.) However, this con-man won’t ‘pay up’ later. It’s a set-up.
You sound less like a John Doe, and more like John Galt… please, take this corporate shill, libertarian nonsense elsewhere. Companies should treat their workers better. Pay them more. Period. CEOs do not deserve 600x pay.
I’m surprised Trump didn’t call those who merely used their vacation days ‘traitors’… yet, he’s the laziest, most corrupt President we’ve ever had. The irony.
Naw, Tim, folks don’t have to share their 1040s just to prove you wrong.
Justindev is correct to remind us that this $10K figure is misleading for many reasons.
except they did get paid and will get paid in the future.
While he threatened to withhold pay from those that didn't show up, he gave bonuses to those that did - which he argues he has the right to do.
Given that the remedy if he is proven wrong is for the courts to take pay away from employees of the federal government, let us know what Congress idiots will push legislation to claw back the bonuses.
their pay was deferred - which I have repeatedly said is wrong to do to any mandatory employee.
Their paid was deferred; they were not UNPAID and they did not work for free.
This isn't the first government shutdown that resulted in deferred compensation for government employees. Every controller should have known what was going to happen the day it became apparent that Congress could not pass a budget.
“Perhaps surprisingly, this is actually happening.” Hmmm….seems like a political point of view.
Naw, George, you know better. Law passed in 2019 guarantees they get paid, even if after-the-fact; the problem is that the delays add up, and so do folks bills. Would the bank or landlord ‘understand’ if a mortgage payment is gonna be late? Maybe. But, legally, they don’t have to, and that’s part of the problem here. ATC and other government workers should not be used as pawns in this or future shutdowns. There should be bipartisan legislation to continue their pay at the prior rate, regardless of whatever Congress does or doesn’t do. Yet, what’s more likely is that this’ll just keep happening again and again. We all deserve better.
Actually, 90% called in sick OR otherwise used earned annual leave. One day would have been a fraction of the leave they earned and accrued over six weeks.
The federal government has perhaps the most generous leave policies of any employer in the US. That may be a separate issue for you, but taking a day of leave earned as part of a compensation package over a six week period really is not remarkable.
You’re absolutely right, Ben L.
Tim’s just nursing his jet lag after flying 25,000 miles around the world, and wants to take it out on others, including you and ATC.
These workers deserve better. All of them. Their livelihoods and the safety of the flying public should not be threatened by any President.
Tim, how is Trump paying these bonuses, legally, without appropriations? This is yet another issue; there’s no money for things he doesn’t like, yet there unlimited money for whatever he says; that’s not our system of self-governance, representative government, checks and balances; that’s the whims of a mad-man dictatorship. If Obama did it, you’d ‘blow your stack.’ You’re rallying for a bad cause here.
What about the controllers that took a vacation they had to plan for more than a year in advance? They have to bid on vacation time for the entire next year in October/November. How is that fair? They're not supposed to go on a planned vacation because of an unforeseen government shutdown?
Payment that is deferred with no knowledge of when it'll be coming does not pay the bills that are due now, which you are smart enough to know. I cannot convince you to care about others, clearly, but you still should try.
No, that’s why we have rules, and laws, and try to make it fairer. And when our leaders don’t follow those rules, we’re all worse off.
Or, go somewhere nice instead with the people you actually wanna spend time with.
you clearly can't accept that it was less than 10% of the ATC workforce that played by the rules and showed up for work - and they got rewarded.
Nothing happened to the 90% that didn't follow the rules.
You and socialists, government workers and unionizers can't stand that incentives were given to the 10% who did the right thing while the 90% still get to keep their jobs even while breaking the rules.
Agreed. And he’s gonna use it as a false promise during the next shutdown, but, unlike this one, he won’t pay out. Either way, these bonuses were never appropriated, so it’s probably illegal to begin with. I wish Congress would pass legislation to pay them all more and ensure ATC is not ever used as pawns again during future shutdowns.
kinda like what unions do with unionized airline employees ALL THE TIME. and UA has been doing it for 4 years to its FAs?
UA didn't stop the cost of living from going up for its FAs.
It is amazing how some people are so incapable of seeing beyond their anger of their own situation to see how institutionalized some organizations have created a system they rail against.
He’s bribing voters. Wouldn’t be surprised if it’s taxed too.
Imagine living in a country where a government can shut down, and employees are not paid but are supposed to work. Hoping for the US government downfall as it can’t carry on like this.
Tim, when they use sick days or vacation days, they are ‘playing by the rules.’
You can call me whatever names you want; it doesn’t help. I like it, though.
Tim, we get it; you’re a shill for these big businesses; punching-down on workers, ATC or with the airlines, is not the answer. I can’t wait for Delta’s flight attendants, mechanics, and baggage handlers to join its pilots (since 1934!) and dispatchers in organizing. Unions built the American Dream. CEOs don’t deserve 600x pay.
Let me ask you what would you do in below situations
One worker comes to job and do 8 hour shift for 40 days without sick days during shutdown and get rewarded for total of 320 hours of work.
And another employee took 5 sick days during shutdown but did 10 hour shift for 20 days and regular 8 hour shift for remaining 15 days for total of 320 hours of work
Should second individual be denied of bonus while the first one gets for perfect attendence
Or should they equally receive as they both put the same effort and output
I personally believe reward is based of output and effort not just on attendence
you do realize that US government shutdowns have occurred under both parties?
and government employee compensation was DEFERRED, not unpaid, under every one of these shutdowns.
Do you really not know these facts or just argue against reality because of a political motivation?
sick days are for being sick, 1990
You can use vacation days or FMLA or other mechanisms to not work based on the rules of your employer.
Calling in sick when you are not sick is wrong at every employer even if they choose not to take discipline.
and, again, no one is being punished for calling in sick.
less than 10% of the workforce is being rewarded because they showed up for work every day of the shutdown with the certainty they would get paid in the future.
I could care less about names. I do genuinely wish you could see reality for what it is.
This is about putting accountability into a workforce that has clearly abused sick time for years and it has been accepted under the guise of the US having poor technology.
All the best technology does no good if people don't show up for work.
hello, Below,
presumably controllers do have required performance requirements when they are on the job which makes your argument pointless.
No controller has succeeded at coming to work and saying that they are only willing to work at 20% or 50% or even 80% of the capacity of their position and qualifications.
no, I am a "shill" for people doing the job they are paid to do and not socialism that guarantees compensation work or no work.
again, tell us how you managed to make the money you use to fly around the country and world in premium cabins.
You didn't get that money because of socialism. You got it under the free market system.
Why people like you suddenly lash out at the system that you have massively benefitted from is beyond comprehension.
The topic is not CEOs but about every day workers including you. If you were an exec at a company, it makes your arguments even more hypocritical
Under Trump they have lasted longer. He’s a narcissist misogynist Christian nationalist. He’s done nothing for anyone who is not wealthy.
Employees get paid in Europe and this shutdown is uniquely American. It doesn’t matter if it was deferred.
Hopefully he will be gone and won’t last four years.
Icarus, more specifically, he’s only doing things for those who are ‘wealthy, straight, white, male, Christian, living in a ‘red’ state and city, and a vocal, loyal, donating supporter.’ Missing anything else?
Tim, “just argue against reality because of a political motivation” describes you perfectly.
Republicans holding basic government function hostage has been the cause of every shutdown during this century. Maybe stick to pretending to not be Ed Bastian @Tim Dunn
Tim, like usual, continues to “just argue against reality because of a political motivation”…
If you actually cared about transparency and accountability, you’d be demanding this administration do this through the proper appropriations process; instead, you’re just pro-business, pro-administration, because you want the ‘Dear Leader’ to not punish your airlines or industry, regardless of the law or fairness.
The bigger issue for the industry is that Trump’s economic and geopolitical blunders are going to have outsized impact on aviation as less will be able to afford to travel and more foreign visitors no longer want to come here. Anyway, sure, you keep tootin’ this admins’ horn…
Trump spending someone else's money on some BS is certainly not surprising. Call me when he spends his own money making a payment that he actually owes.
Tim, no one here needs to share their 1040 or financial statement to prove their points; you won’t; I’m not. Get over it.
I fly premium cabins when it’s good value. Like many of us here, we ‘play the game’ with cards and miles and points, and it pays off sometimes. Other times, if you really want it, you gotta pay for it. A few are lucky to fly OPM (other peoples’ money) for work, etc., but employers are not as generous these days (best they can do is Comfort+, MCE, etc.)
Socialism? Like public roads, public schools, the military? Huh. Yeah, awful.
derek, while there’s no more widespread reporting like during the height of the pandemic in 2020-2021, there has been a rise in covid and flu cases this fall. Clearly, some workers used their sick and vacation days, as is their right. The folks who hate workers so much on here as to want them to work while sick, not use their PTO, and also get significantly delayed pay, have apparently not worked in a while, or are horrible bosses.
If you follow that analogy, then neither the ATC bonus nor the loan forgiveness should happen, because each should have been legislated by Congress, not mere executive action.
Well said, Winston.
He has no money; it’s all locked up in crypto grifts… *facepalm*
ATC and infrastructure are a financial obligation of the airlines , and not the taxpayers .
To those ATCs claiming they were sick. Do you have a doctors note? Thank you for your hard work during the shut down despite being sick one day. To those who showed up perfect attendance; congratulations on the 10k bonus.
who do you think pays for everything related to commercial air transportation whether provided by the government to an airline or by the airline themselves but you the consumer?
all I have to do is stick the facts which is how I win every debate
1. there isn't a shred of evidence that any of these bonuses were given to people for any reason other than attendance including for the race and gender labels that people have thrown out here.
If the evidence is there to show otherwise, then present it.
2. The President - no President - can shutdown the US government. Government shutdowns happen because Congress fails to act. and it takes more than a simple majority to spend money in the US - which means that it takes far more than simple majority for any party in Washington to push a budget through - unless the safeguards to prevent single party dominance of the process are eliminated - which has yet to happen.
3. Cherrypicking data to blame one side more and excuse the other is the height of what is wrong. The US government has been shut down by both parties.
The process is broken and needs to be fixed.
Trying to throw assertions about who got these bonuses absent facts is the height of bias.
Solve the problem and debate the issues instead of generating useless noise.
So 93% of Air Traffic Controllers took sick time over the course of a month? Hard to believe this is real. I don't just willy nilly take sick time every month.
I agree with how the administration decided who to give bonuses to.
I think rewarding those who suffered through this is a good idea. The $8 million can be found under couch cushions aat the federal level. A bright person could cone up with a formula that balances missed shifts and overtime shifts. A bright person would come up with a plan that doesn’t make so many who truely sacrificed angry because they were cut out. I know Trump has access to bright people. Maybe use them.
This is your friendly reminder that Congress has still not passed a budget, and another shutdown threat looms on January 20th.
The members of Congress (the people responsible for the shutdown) should be paying this $776,000 bonus. Not me, the US taxpayer.
Apparently you aren't an air traffic controller, TSA agent handling airport security, CBP agent processing passengers entering the country, etc.
Alert, let's be clear: it's both, taxpayers and airlines (and passengers, through fares, fees.)
Haven't forgotten. And Trump's doing this 'bribe' as an illusory promise to force folks to work without pay during the next shutdown, with the 'trick' that there 'could be' another bonus then (but there won't be... he'll do a rug-pull, con-man special. )
life isn't always fair
tired of being harassed by your stupid parents? act now! move out, get a job, pay your own bills while you still know everything!
i'm not sleeping, i'm just resting my eyes
i'll give you something to cry about
you gonna take a swing at your old man? is today the day?
close the door, we're not heating the whole neighborhood
we're just doing crusty dad sayings, right peter?
For the people on here saying 90% of controllers taking one sick day or more (and presumably approved vacation) in a 6 week period is fraud ... I can only hope you never get ill and/or develop a chronic illness and be treated with the same disdain ... the way life will humble you will be brutal. Sociopathic perspectives like this is why people truly don't care about their employers anymore.
What a mess. Even if they had announced from the beginning, “hey, tough times but if you make it through with a perfect attendance record you’ll be eligible for a special bonus,” there would still be the issue of genuine, uncontrollable sick leave (what parents haven’t had their kids sent home sick from daycare?) and OT comp hours. My kid was home sick a day in the middle of the shutdown; if I were a controller, would it really have been fair for that to cost me $10,000?
I may be in the minority, but I don't think the bonuses are necessarily a bad idea- just the execution was a bit unwise in my opinion. Instead of a flat $10K for each ATC with a perfect record, it could have been a scale. Something like this:
$8K for perfect attendance
$5K for 1 absence
$3K for 2 absences
$1K for 5 or less, etc.
Doing it this way would not cause the problems and discord we are observing now, and no one would be "furious." Also, it likely would not cost much more compared to what was actually paid.
The way I am raised , I see nothing here .
776 people that went above and beyond are getting bonus check , this should be the case in any company . The rest of them are bitching about with dull excuses out of pure jealousy. If they knew in advance , I bet most of them wouldn’t be sick, lol.
I am confused. Why we keep using the term “they didn’t get paid”, I thought all of them eventually get paid???
In terms of financial difficulty. Except for new employee, if one does not have 6 months of savings. I have no sympathy.
Federal employees come with lots of benefits and this is a free world. Knowing that your job could be affected by yearly budget crisis, if you don’t want to prepare for it or don’t like it, then quit.
They are still there because they can’t find a better paying job.
Furthermore, most high paying jobs are stressful. If you don’t like it, then quit. Don’t whine like a baby.
The problem is their "jealousy" is ultimately going to cost you, as the employer, in lost productivity over time. They will make you pay for it one way or another. These sort of tactics actually take away the incentive to go above and beyond and shape the organizational culture towards lower productivity.
When you start listening to actual air traffic controllers, they say, ‘this incentivizes (them) to stop showing up once they miss a single hour. Makes it much worse next time.’ Remember this in February 2026 if another shutdown occurs…
Exactly. The lack of transparency is not good for stability. Clearly defined ahead of time is the way to go.
However, even so, this current bonus structure actually ‘incentivizes (ATC) to stop showing up once they miss a single hour. Makes it much worse next time.’ Remember this in February 2026 if another shutdown occurs…
Not to mention, such a bonus structure ‘incentivizes (ATC) to stop showing up once they miss a single hour. Makes it much worse next time.’ Remember this in February 2026 if another shutdown occurs…
To be fair. 2 or more absences in a 43-day period is pretty high. But some people have a lower work ethic than others.
Over 90% of the work force missing 1 or more days of normally scheduled shifts in a 43-day window seems abnormally high.
“Do you have a doctors [sic] note?”
You are unreal.
Do you go to the doctor when you’re sick for two days to get a note for your employer? If you do, your employer sucks.
And how would you suggest that the ATCs who were sick pay for that doctors note?
You really do seem to hate people who live in the real world.
Some are angry and I don’t blame them.
WOW one the most jerky comments you have made. It’s called work and life saving work. Those that showed up deserve the bonus.
Without taking a side here, seems impossible to reward folks for going above and beyond without pissing someone off. Taking as a given that some subset of employees was going to get a bonus, there's always a line. Could have bonused folks who didn't miss more than a day, or two days, or whatever. There always would be a group that just missed it.
This in no way made anyone worse off. Sort of like us who don't get targeted for a hotel promotion, folks will get over it and move on.
Former PATCO controller here. ATCs under appreciated 44 years ago; nothing meaningful has changed. (This is more a congressional / budgetary ongoing issue than a White House / executive issue.). Why are we surprised? Yes, this $10k bonus action will be devisive. Yes, next shutdown will result in a different outcome.
I wish they were all getting the bonus. They all kept us safe and worked together to keep the skies running without a paycheck. How many of you would do the same?
Like in healthcare, rewarding those who perfectly work their scheduled shifts and not a second more often backfires against those who may be more collaborative in switching shifts and picking up weekends and OT where there is a need. Staffing a 24/7 job relies on much more than following the schedule, and good managers know that. This is truly poor management techniques at its worst.
Does working your schedule perfectly and not a minute more mean going above and beyond?
What about the people who swapped when necessary or took weekends, nights and OT?
That's exactly the problem. 24/7 jobs require collaboration and flexibility in scheduling for safety. Bad leaders incentivize the wrong behavior.
He should have followed Regan’s example in the 80’s when they went on strike and he fired them all! Those that chose to not show up should be glad they still have a job.
You are 100% correct. Oversimplified solution by the executive branch; wait til next time.
That's exactly what I'm suggesting. And that presidential power is getting out of our envisioned limits, as well as Congress forgetting how to do its job any more.
@Eric: Are you advocating for the west to become like North Korea, in terms of saluting to, bowing down and praising the ultimate cult leader? MAGA is now spreading to Europe under the new name MEGA (Make Europe Great Again) and just hit Japanese shores under the new female PM. The greatest threat from TikTok has been neutered and coming soon the drastic transformation in the US news media and communication landscapes when Ellison controls TikTok, Warner Bros., Disney Discovery, CBS and Paramount. Journalism will no longer speak truth to power. All the Ivy League colleges, powerful law firms and Fortune 500 companies have capitulated to his demands. Few pretend to fight back in public but secretly negotiate in private to curry his favors, in CA, NY and MA. Good things happen to those who wait so you will not need to bitch anymore. What wars did Trump supposedly end and how? Educate yourself by reading the below analysis
https://www.vox.com/politics/466269/trump-peace-deals-ended-wars
You must be bitter that Trump did not win the Nobel peace prize. But the winner shamed the Nobel committee by publicly declaring that Trump deserved it better than her. Her hope is to have Trump installs and recognizes her as the next Venezuela's President after he regime changes Maduro. The biggest blunder of the Nobel Peace Prize was to award it to Kissinger in 1973. How long will the war end and how lasting will peace be? The answer to the most two consequential wars of Israel-Hamas and Israel-Iran is not even ten days. Israel is never at peace with its Arab neighbors until Iranian ayatollahs collapse, the rest has no ability to counter its aggression and the Greater Israel modern dream is realized from the sea to the Jordanian River, or the more ambitious historic dream from the Nile River to the Euphrate Rivers. He saved lives like 1M American deaths reportedly by Covid? Dissolving USAID and suspending SNAP are the only two tactical solutions to solve hunger?
You mixed up the fact. Reagan , Regan was Treasury Sec., fired them for staging an illegal strike. This time, Congress shut down the country. People like you have no courage to say it straight to the pilot's face the next time you board the airplane. You are nobody but already displays an authoritarian character. Imagine how far you will go when you are drunk on power. Like those in power right now--lawless and ruthless with impunity and flaunt it.
My logic is opposite. All of Trump's decisions are divisive and chaotic because his intent is to incentivize those who align with his agendas while punishing who do not. We must not engage in tribalism, perpetrated by the wealthy and powerful, if we consider ourselves civilized. Those who did not show up for work when the government was shut down would see their paystub deducted for missed workdays. Those who showed up received regular pay in lump sum for missed paycheck plus bonus courtesy from the politicians' pay, regardless of political affiliation, because both parties wanted to settle score while the public suffered. Nobody questioned why politicians continued receiving full pay on regular basis when they shut down the government. Nobody advocated them suffer the same way they inflicted on the working class and working poor. Are they public servants who serve the country or public masters who enrich and empower themselves at the same time dictating and impoverishing the working class and working poor?
Awww. Here’s your participation ribbon. A commemorative one. Thank you for your patriotic efforts of 88% attendance without pay .
They were probably exhausted and spent most of the sick day napping and snacking in front of the tv. They did a great service to their country. Nothing wrong with a sick day but the 10k bonus was for perfect attendance. Theres no gray area.
@D3SWI33
I'd say better than pissing off a good number of ATCs who missed one shift for legitimate reasons.
To each their own, I suppose.
My friend lost their father during the shut down, and will not be getting a bonus because she went to the funeral.
That’s not right. They really should give such bonuses to all ATC for what they’ve been put through lately. And it should be properly appropriated, not on a whim.
Well said, globetrotter. Thank you. And the folks that were affected in the 80s haven’t forgotten. Ruined entire families. Petty stuff. Was also the beginning of the right’s attack on workers and organized labor. Gotta rebuild strong unions to fight for folks like these controllers. Wish those that were ‘selected’ for bonuses would show some solidarity here. All or none.
Yes! 100%. This is the way. All controllers deserve a bonus. They should never be treated like pawns again.
Eric, they haven’t forgotten; it’s by design. Washington warned of factions, political parties loyal to their ‘team,’ over their duty to the Constitution, their constituents, or even their self-interest in their own positions of power (institutions like the Senate, etc.) Yet, now, it’s all cult of personality behind a demagogue; far worse than mere seeking to legislate vis executive order (or the bench, because, the Supreme Court is also complicit at this point.) And one party has fully embraced that ‘unitary executive’ theory (just a euphemism for dictatorship). Lotta work to do to clean this all up.
Tim sticking to facts?
Such a hypocrite.
You're using irrelevant facts for the wrong debate.
So fluffy there is no point to debate.
That's why you think you win every debate but when in "fact" you lose so badly there is no more point to debate.
Fact: Delta is profitable.
Tim: Therefore Delta is premium.
Only in your mind Timmy.
An incentive is mostly effective if provided proactively not retroactively. Even proactively this isn’t a great incentive. Even if it prevents some people from taking fake sick days during a government shutdown (next one tentatively scheduled for this January), do we really want to incentivize genuinely sick air traffic controllers to decide to come into work anyways for fear of missing out on a bonus? ATC has life or death consequences and is hard enough if you are fully healthy. Not to mention this risks getting colleagues sick as well when we are already dealing with massive understaffing issues.
Well, my question is what about those who put in their regular work week and then are directed to do overtime shifts? If they decline, is that considered an ‘absence’?
So if you missed a day you are not a Patriot? Why is "everything" dressed up in "Patriotism"?
Our world is changing more rapidly than we can see. Many things are out of order, nor not what they used to be, from 2024 to 2025 in one years times since last November, it is Dramatic.
I am not talking political, nothing about that.
By the way, for Astronomers and Astrologers, both who looks outside the Earth, know about these changes. Hang on everybody.
I spent many fiscal years working without pay for indefinite periods under numerous administrations. As DoD employees most of us never considered not coming to work to support our men and women in uniform. Their sacrifices were always much greater than the civilians who support them and their mission. The anti moonlighting laws actually prevent us from taking another job and furlough does not qualify for unemployment. Not sure if ATCs are legally allowed to moonlight. I hope not as I don’t want them coming to work fatigued. Nothing heroic about ATCs coming to work. Never before were any government workers given a bonus for doing their jobs when the Congress didn’t do theirs. Check your pocket Constitution. The House has ONE job, pass a budget. And they frequently don’t get it done.
But the military didn’t keep you safe? Don’t they all deserve bonuses? How about the Secret Service? FBI? Food inspectors? The list goes on and on if “keeping us safe” is the criteria.
I'm tired of the whiners. Thank you to the Professional Air Traffic Controllers who had perfect attendance. You, and only you, deserve the $10K Bonus.
Yes Bill, none of these people should go without pay or have their jobs ended (like food inspectors right now). Again, it's the worst management example from the very top.
And LOL - Did the secret service keep me safe? Did you know they kept getting paid?
We can usually count on this regime doing things the wrong way. Especially deciding this after-the-fact. Never mind, where is the non-budgeted $8M coming from?
Cute, I bet you've never missed a day. Or were you the guy who got everybody sick because you didn't stay home?
You speak with limited life experience. Are you still in college, or high school?
So, let's say you run a company and an employee has previously scheduled a vacation day. They take that day, then you ask them if they can work overtime every week for 5 weeks, and not get a check until sometime in the future. They do what you ask. Are they a valuable employee to you? Perhaps worth some additional compensation?
What if with the overtime they worked more hours than someone who did not take a day off?
Not 776 controllers. 300 and how many are front line controllers? If supervisors are included in the 300, not many!
How insulting!
Then add every overtime shift! Each one offsets a day of sick or preapproved leave!
Greedy controllers
Trump did not cause this shutdown, democrats did. Many govt. workers affected showed up for their jobs, and were paid in full when the left democrats finally ended their little show. There should be some exceptions for those controllers who had logical reasons to be absent, but others are spoiled greedy.
how did they go "above and beyond"? They simply did their job. There should be no bonus for anyone. Government should pay everyone interest on the late salaries, that is all.
it is not life saving work. They manage flights. Next we'll call GM workers life savers because they build police cars, fire engines and ambulances?