There’s a huge ongoing battle between the big US carriers and the big Gulf carriers,specifically about whether Gulfcarriers should be able to participate in air treaties allowing the ”freedom” of routes, given that they’re heavily government subsidized.
Continue reading: Delta Throws Shade At Qatar Airways’ New Flight To Atlanta
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yeah i wonder how big the demand is in johannesburg to fly to atlanta and not connect anywhere else. agree that this is a silly argument
How about we take a look at Delta's AMS routes? I would bet they have about 5 O&S passengers on ATL-AMS every day too. A complete failure of an argument.
"How about we take a look at Delta’s AMS routes? I would bet they have about 5 O&S passengers on ATL-AMS every day too."
Then you would lose whatever you bet.
Such silliness. Focus on improving the product and your loyalty program Delta.
I know that keeping the Delta International FF agent on the line long enough to go thru 6 months of fares and availability, nothing was available but full fare/ top dollar for an upgrade with miles, and NO SEATS for a free ticket. The agent said that the flight is always full. Finally in order to end the call, the agent said "it must be a glitch in the system and I will report it. Some one will call you back as soon as the problem is corrected." Still waiting. I had an incredible flight on Qatar. My only problem was trying to decide whether to get the pink or white champagne.
The real question is, of course, should the Middle Eastern carriers have the protection of Open Skies agreements when they are government subsidized? There is no question whatsoever that these carriers are operating many, many routes ar a loss to gain market share. They have already decimated many carriers in other countries (QUANTAS for example), are we willing to let that happen here too? Pretty shortsighted.
@Mark H
Define government subsidized?
Chapter 11 gives US airlines great advantages verses EU airlines when it comes to shedding debt and future obligations, does this mean that the US3 should not be allow to operate in to Europe?
Open Skies was pushed heavily by the US GOV and US airline industry on the rest of the world, to give US airlines access.
Be careful what you wish for, you just might get it comes to mind.
Both the Chapter 11 and post 9/11 loan program arguments are huge red herrings. Comparing Chapter 11 to direct government cash subsidies is absurd. In Chapter 11, the people actually subsidizing the airline are the employees, in the form of lost wages and pensions. There is zero transfer of cash from the government. As far as the post 9/11 loan program, which I'm sure someone will bring up, they were loans not cash gifts which is what the ME3 are getting. Secondly, the government made a profit off of all the loans that it made. Thirdly, and most importantly, none of the four largest carriers in the U.S. received a dime from that program.
China Eastern, in which Delta holds 5% shares, is heavily subisidized by the Chinese government.
"yeah i wonder how big the demand is in johannesburg to fly to atlanta and not connect anywhere else. agree that this is a silly argument"
O&D demand for this route is actually very high. There is a large South African community here in Atlanta as well as a lot of business ties with several major Atlanta companies I know of who have a South African presence which requires frequent travel. The fares and load factors stay high on the route as a result. Premium cabins are consistently full.