Earlier, I covered some rumored World of Hyatt program changes, including an overhaul of award pricing, plus the introduction of a premium credit card. This was based on a very detailed but unsubstantiated report on Reddit. So along those lines, there’s an interesting update…
In this post:
Hyatt rumor spreader claims details were totally made up
The same Reddit user who posted the original rumors about the World of Hyatt program changes now claims that those details were completely made up. In a follow-up post titled “well this escalated quickly,” the person writes the following:
Time to clear something up.
The entire “Hyatt overhaul leak” post was not real. None of it.
It was all part of an experiment for a college class. It was trying to see how easily unverified information spreads online when it’s plausible, uses insider language, includes specific operational details, and confirms existing anxieties or expectations
I fed some plausible award changes into ChatGPT, hit post, and was curious to see what happened.
Didn’t expect literally every award travel blog to make this their Friday morning headline
Sorry for giving everyone anxiety. Hopefully Hyatt doesn’t do anything worse than what I cooked up
It’s hard to know what to make of this exactly…
So this was an experiment for a college class, to see how easily misinformation spreads? I mean, if you post something salacious and believable enough on a platform like Reddit, then yes, it’ll spread quickly. Is that really surprising? This seems kind of douchey to me, but whatever.
Understandably, some people might say “you dumb bloggers, why spread this kind of unverified information?” It’s a fair criticism, though let me note a few things:
- As much as people are annoyed when information doesn’t end up being correct, people love when there are leaks and they prove to be correct; that falls in the category of “you win some, you lose some”
- In a vast majority of situations when we do see detailed leaks, they end up being accurate, or mostly accurate; this applies to a vast majority of credit card and loyalty program leaks
- Usually we apply some logic in judging how reputable leaks are, based on the level of detail provided; when someone intentionally makes it detailed to trick people, well, that makes it a little more complicated
- People are obviously very invested in these programs, so when people hear rumors, they want to read more; every time there’s a rumor on Reddit and I don’t post about it, some people will reach out to ask if I’ve seen it, and ask for my take
- Of course it’s important to emphasize when a post is based on unsubstantiated rumors, so you have to read these topics with the right expectations
Lastly, call me a conspiracy theorist, but I wonder if there might actually be more to this. Is this actually all fully made up, as is claimed? Or is the real lie claiming that the original post was a lie? Make of it what you will, but I’m not convinced this second post is fully truthful either.
Bottom line
Earlier there were rumors on Reddit about how Hyatt is planning major changes to its World of Hyatt loyalty program. Now the person who posted those rumors claims that they’re totally made up, and that this was a school experiment.
This is all very strange, so I’m not sure what exactly to make of it, at this point. Believe it or not, I’m not sure whether to believe the first post or the second post…
What do you make of this Reddit Hyatt rumor situation?
The first Reddit post seems more believable than the second.
First travel blogs are not news organizations, also Ben did clearly call out this was unverified and based on a Reddit post so don't think Ben or the other bloggers really did anything wrong in reporting this. As the author of that post said the whole point of the initial post was to see if he could deceive readers into believing information by sprinkling a bit of authoritative sounding terms into the prompt - it...
First travel blogs are not news organizations, also Ben did clearly call out this was unverified and based on a Reddit post so don't think Ben or the other bloggers really did anything wrong in reporting this. As the author of that post said the whole point of the initial post was to see if he could deceive readers into believing information by sprinkling a bit of authoritative sounding terms into the prompt - it would seem the answer to that is a resounding YES. I can see that being a somewhat reasonable thesis for an undergrad paper, so while the follow up post from the OP certainly doesn't get any extra credibility points for sounding plausible given the circumstances, it does seem more likely than Hyatt doing some sort of trial ballon to gauge reactions so on the whole I am inclined to believe the explanation.
To whoever started the rumour:
Well done, kiddo. Well done indeed.
M fer got my Hopes up High!
I've posted in the second thread asking for a copy of the report.
I agree, though - this feels like a well-covered trial balloon more than a college kid managing a hoax.
Category 9 is definitely coming :)
ChatGPT agrees with you.
I input the reddit post into a ChatGPT instance without access to the internet (so no bias via the retraction today) and got the following assessment:
***
While the post is polished and well-structured in a way that is consistent with LLM capabilities, the depth and accuracy of program knowledge, combined with the nuanced, insider-oriented explanations, suggest that if an LLM was involved, it was likely used for editing/cleanup rather than content generation. The...
I input the reddit post into a ChatGPT instance without access to the internet (so no bias via the retraction today) and got the following assessment:
***
While the post is polished and well-structured in a way that is consistent with LLM capabilities, the depth and accuracy of program knowledge, combined with the nuanced, insider-oriented explanations, suggest that if an LLM was involved, it was likely used for editing/cleanup rather than content generation. The post most likely originated from a human with direct knowledge (or access to internal communications), though some minor post-processing by an LLM (e.g., to improve clarity or formatting) cannot be ruled out.
***
At the end of the day, notwithstanding the above, I'm less skeptical of the retraction than Ben is (and less inclined to think it's "douchy" in the context of a college course, though I'd consider it unethical if done by a professional researcher). IMHO it is incumbent on everyone to be wary of rumors, though as noted, no one is going to get this right 100% of the time, and accepting some inevitable failure rate is better than ignoring rumors altogether.
@Ben -->. What's the difference between a "blogger" and a journalist?
--> As much as people are annoyed when information doesn’t end up being correct, people love when there are leaks and they prove to be correct; that falls in the category of “you win some, you lose some”
Uh, no. Or rather, at least if you were a journalist, you would have called Hyatt for a comment before publishing the story. As a blogger,...
@Ben -->. What's the difference between a "blogger" and a journalist?
--> As much as people are annoyed when information doesn’t end up being correct, people love when there are leaks and they prove to be correct; that falls in the category of “you win some, you lose some”
Uh, no. Or rather, at least if you were a journalist, you would have called Hyatt for a comment before publishing the story. As a blogger, however, you hit "Post" with no attempt to authenticate the information or the source.
As far as college experiments are concerned, this is exactly the sort of thing undergrad classes do...again and again, year after year.
even journalists with major outlets often cannot simply call a subject organization for comment; you need to send an inquiry via email to the appropriate media contacts and/or request that an on-the-record conversation be scheduled with a spokesperson.
this takes time and it's often (as here) not appropriate to delay publication waiting for the response (especially considering that the Hyatt PR team has clearly not been on its game enough today to even issue a...
even journalists with major outlets often cannot simply call a subject organization for comment; you need to send an inquiry via email to the appropriate media contacts and/or request that an on-the-record conversation be scheduled with a spokesperson.
this takes time and it's often (as here) not appropriate to delay publication waiting for the response (especially considering that the Hyatt PR team has clearly not been on its game enough today to even issue a generic denial given the media attention).
One could argue that Tucker Carlson is a journalist.
Do you still care about categorizing people?
Still, likely not fake, just testing waters, getting initial negative reactions for devaluations. However, we consumers should continue the negativity if these do take affect. The issue is that there really is no safe-haven anymore. Hyatt was the rescue from Marriott. Once live, might as well just stay home. 100K WOH points for a Hyatt Place incoming!
I hear Hyatt is offering a path to Marriott Ambassador Elite after five stays at Wyndham. You heard it here first.
Given that folks commenting here are highly knowledgeable, you must be right!
i mean 1) the bilt leak was 100% accurate so of course people will cover future "leaks" and 2) most of these changes are likely to happen in the next couple of years anyway, other than probably making it easier for globalist
And thanks to Redditor/DoC commenter/sleuths like sullim4 who singlehandedly found much of those details via BILT’s sloppily public code.
In the world of AI, the blogger reaction of "it's very detailed and specific so it must be real" may not work anymore. It's just too easy to create things that sound real these days.
Well the 'only the Park Hyatt Kyoto' will be the top tier, and the explicit tying of the peak dates to a 1.5 cent per point valuation seemed a little too specific and 'off.'
We'll see!
There are rumors, then there is Reddit. The most delusional self righteous spreaders of complete lies keep Reddit in business. Nothing on Reddit should ever taken at face value.
Ben - you clearly, upfront, labeled those posts as rumors. Good on you. The rumors seemed credible and they sparked productive discussion on the value of Hyatt status, points, and benefits. I see nothing wrong here. Blog long enough, accept enough "rumors" and some are bound to turn out fake - that's the law of large numbers.
Blog on. Travel on.
It's well established that 99% of your commenters are complete and total losers. (Not...
Ben - you clearly, upfront, labeled those posts as rumors. Good on you. The rumors seemed credible and they sparked productive discussion on the value of Hyatt status, points, and benefits. I see nothing wrong here. Blog long enough, accept enough "rumors" and some are bound to turn out fake - that's the law of large numbers.
Blog on. Travel on.
It's well established that 99% of your commenters are complete and total losers. (Not me though as a V10 equity partner - I won't belabor those details.)
The Hyatt card rumor was NOT credible or even reasonable. Duh.
This is not the first time that Ben got hit by "real" fake news and it won't be the last. In the blogosphere we are always on our own to sort out the crap.
It's okay, you're a blogger, not a journalist. I don't mean that in a bad way...I'd like to hear about rumors and speculation even if it ends up being wrong n
We all suspect Hyatt plans to do something like this. Hopefully they take the feedback and maintain the exclusivity (it’s not really) of Globalist and don’t try to leverage it with a high fee credit card.
Well, boy am I glad you got to make two slop posts about this! The quality of this blog is going downhill super fast this year. OMaaT and VFTW are basically the same now - blogging about social media posts, taking political stances, posting about things completely unrelated to travel (Tucker & Israel?).
I bet you were foaming at the mouth to be able to post another slop article about an unsubstantiated rumor.
Hey...
Well, boy am I glad you got to make two slop posts about this! The quality of this blog is going downhill super fast this year. OMaaT and VFTW are basically the same now - blogging about social media posts, taking political stances, posting about things completely unrelated to travel (Tucker & Israel?).
I bet you were foaming at the mouth to be able to post another slop article about an unsubstantiated rumor.
Hey Lucky, how about some quality journalism for a change instead of posting BS?
Long time reader, long time supporter, recently disappointed.
You're expecting journalism from a guy who posts hotel and airline reviews and offers commentary on travel industry events?
I suggest your expectations are a bit misplaced if you're expecting hard hitting journalism (what industry stories exactly have you seen broken on this blog, like, ever?). Informative reviews, maybe but that's still opinion, not Woodward and Bernstein breaking Watergate.
I don't confuse travel bloggers for journalists. I am clear-eyed when I read this blog.
I have a couple rocks you can kick around, if you like.
Hahahahahaha
You run fast and loose with facts when you quote from social media and
pod casts. However, it hurts nobody but it will ding the integrity of the method you use to collect news/ info.
I'm with you, Ben. Hyatt's silence is supicious.
Suspicious.
Seems you can’t trust anything unless it comes from JonNYC.
Or Timmy.