Several months back, there were rumors that Delta Air Lines would place a Boeing 787 order, a major departure from the carrier’s current all-Airbus wide body fleet renewal plan. There’s now a major update, as the order is official…
In this post:
Delta places a big Boeing wide body aircraft order
Delta has placed an order for up to 60 Boeing 787 Dreamliners. This includes a firm order for 30 787-10s, plus options for an additional 30 of these planes. The major catch here is that these planes will only be delivered as of 2031, so it’ll be at least five years until the first of these aircraft joins the fleet.
For context, the 787-10 is the largest variant of the Dreamliner. While it has the least range of any Dreamliner variant, the per-seat economics are great, given how it’s “stretched.” Delta claims that it will use these planes to operate flights across the Atlantic, as well as to South America.
Here’s how Delta CEO Ed Bastian describes this order:
“Delta is building the fleet for the future, enhancing the customer experience, driving operational improvements and providing steady replacements for less efficient, older aircraft in the decade to come. Most importantly, these aircraft will be operated by the best aviation professionals in the industry, providing Delta’s welcoming, elevated and caring service to travelers worldwide.”
Up until this point, Delta’s wide body fleet renewal has just been focused on two aircraft types:
- Delta’s flagship aircraft is the Airbus A350, with 40 A350-900s currently in the fleet (and four more more on order), plus 20 A350-1000s on order; these planes are used primarily for transpacific and other ultra long haul flying
- Delta’s secondary long haul aircraft is the Airbus A330-900neo, with 39 in the fleet, and no more on order; these planes are used primarily for transatlantic flying
Beyond that, there are the more outdated aircraft that Delta will have to replace over time:
- Delta operates 42 A330ceos, with 11 A330-200s and 31 A330-300s; these planes are an average of 16-20 years old, which is downright young by Delta standards, and they’re likely here to stay for some time
- Delta operates 59 Boeing 767s, with 38 767-300ERs and 21 767-400ERs; these planes are an average of 25-30 years old, and the 767-300ERs are expected to be withdrawn from international operations by the end of the decade, give or take
My take on Delta placing a Boeing wide body aircraft order
I don’t think this aircraft order from Delta should come as much of a surprise. Delta has over 100 “last generation” wide body jets, and the airline needed a plan to eventually replace the 767-300ERs, A330-200s, 767-400ERs, and A330-300s (probably in that order — it seems the A330-300s are here to stay, as Delta is planning new cabins for these jets). With that in mind, a few thoughts:
- Unlike American and United, Delta hasn’t ordered the A321XLR (admittedly not a wide body, but it is a long haul aircraft); it seems executives at the carrier aren’t crazy about the plane, but as Delta increasingly upgauges long haul aircraft, there are some markets where the economics may become more challenging
- The 787-10 has fantastic economics; it’s a bit bigger than the A330-900neo, while still being able to operate Delta’s entire Europe and South America network
- Focusing on three different kinds of long haul aircraft is more of a diversified strategy than what you’ll find at American and United, but that’s not necessarily a bad thing, given that the scale of the fleets we’re talking about
- Eventually, Delta’s smallest long haul aircraft may be the A330-900neo, with 281 seats, and that’s 30%+ more seats than you’ll find on the 767-300ER, with 211-216 seats
- 2031 is still a long time from now, so we’ll have to be patient for these planes; I guess that also confirms that the 767-300ERs will keep flying until at least that point… bleh!
The 787-10 seems like a good fit for Delta, given the number of planes that Delta will eventually need to replace. It’s quite a different strategy than you’ll find at United, where the airline has plans for an eventual fleet of 200+ Dreamliners. For that matter, there are also rumors of American eventually placing a 787-10 order, to eventually replace older 777s.
Bottom line
Delta has just placed a Boeing 787-10 order, with a firm order for 30 Dreamliners, and options for 30 more. The planes are expected to be delivered as of 2031, so we’re going to have to be really patient.
While Delta has been a loyal Airbus wide body customer in recent years, it’s logical enough that the airline may eventually want to diversity from the A330neo and A350. The 787-10 seems like a good fit for Delta, given its excellent per-seat economics, making it a great jet for Europe and South America flying.
I think the only questionable thing is that Delta’s smallest long haul aircraft will eventually be the A330neo, which has 30%+ more seats than the current smallest long haul aircraft, the 767. That might make some markets challenging.
What do you make of Delta’s Boeing 787-10 order?
DL has long had the advantage of more cash on hand by extending the lives of their fleet. I don't know the financing details of this Boeing order but I do hope that DL can maintain its healthy balance sheet. AA over-extended itself with their massive orders in the mid 2010s. And UA followed suit. Let's hope DL doesn't get caught in any debt spiral. Way too many US businesses from small to large do...
DL has long had the advantage of more cash on hand by extending the lives of their fleet. I don't know the financing details of this Boeing order but I do hope that DL can maintain its healthy balance sheet. AA over-extended itself with their massive orders in the mid 2010s. And UA followed suit. Let's hope DL doesn't get caught in any debt spiral. Way too many US businesses from small to large do this. I doubt DL will trigger the trip wire but... the airline industry ain't known for stability.
Through Q3 25 UA added 68 new aircraft while improving their net debt, exceeding DL in op cash flow and making $2.4B in profit. In fact, UA has exceeded DL in op & free cash flow and capex over the last two years and is doing so well their credit rating has been upgraded by Fitch in November and Moody's in December. UA is doing great and their future has never been brighter.
Here's what puzzles me about DL's plans. They are losing the 753 and have the 321 now, and the Max10 later, in that "almost 200" seat category. But consider these planes and (seats) ordered by my guess of time remaining:
763 (211-6)
753 (234)
764 (238)
332 (223)
Pull them from the fleet, they have no plane in the 200-275 seat range. The have not ordered the only one of...
Here's what puzzles me about DL's plans. They are losing the 753 and have the 321 now, and the Max10 later, in that "almost 200" seat category. But consider these planes and (seats) ordered by my guess of time remaining:
763 (211-6)
753 (234)
764 (238)
332 (223)
Pull them from the fleet, they have no plane in the 200-275 seat range. The have not ordered the only one of the above that still exists (in the 338 form). The 35M and 78M are certainly at >300 seats. This means, if DL lives up to their desire to fly only widebodies to Europe, will the smallest be 275 seats?
let us know what model is available and is selling w/ 200-275 seats in a mixed US intercontinental configuration.
The answer is none which is why DL has no plane in that category.
The 787-8 and 338 are shortened versions of much more successful longer aircraft.
There is no reason to bear 90% of the costs and get 60% of the revenue with the 338 or 787-8
Thanks, I knew the 338 was not being ordered and the 788 was not a high seller, but the 789 does offer (based on other airlines) a 225 to 260 range.
TD, "et us know what model is available and is selling w/ 200-275 seats in a mixed US intercontinental configuration."
The 787-9. Too funny.
UA: 1,070 aircraft, (230 WB), 185 WB/483 NB on order (15.5 average fleet age)
AA: 1,013 aircraft, (137 WB), 19 WB/268 NB on order (14.1 average fleet age)
DL: 988 aircraft, (180 WB), 54 WB/235 NB on order (14.9 average fleet age)
yes, we know your tools are bigger than every one else's. But you can't demonstrate that you can use it any better than anyone else's.
Get back w/ us in a week and let us know how UA's profits compare to DL's.
you harped endlessly that DL would not be able to get enough aircraft and yet they continue to grow capacity second only to UA - and yet posts far better revenue numbers.
...yes, we know your tools are bigger than every one else's. But you can't demonstrate that you can use it any better than anyone else's.
Get back w/ us in a week and let us know how UA's profits compare to DL's.
you harped endlessly that DL would not be able to get enough aircraft and yet they continue to grow capacity second only to UA - and yet posts far better revenue numbers.
You really don't know - or won't admit - what really matters in the airline industry, do you?
UA is growing and DL is leveling off. The airlines are simply on different paths. 2031? UA's A359s are scheduled for delivery before that. That would be DL's 8th fleet. UA: 5, AA: 4.
let me refresh you and share with the rest of the world since you desperately want to avoid admitting reality.
UA's consolidated passenger RASM in the 3rd quarter was down 5% on 7.2% more capacity.
UA's operating income fell 10.8% and its net income fell 1.7%
profitable and successful companies don't shrink their profits as they add capacity.
UA simply has thrown capacity into the market which the market could not absorb at UA's...
let me refresh you and share with the rest of the world since you desperately want to avoid admitting reality.
UA's consolidated passenger RASM in the 3rd quarter was down 5% on 7.2% more capacity.
UA's operating income fell 10.8% and its net income fell 1.7%
profitable and successful companies don't shrink their profits as they add capacity.
UA simply has thrown capacity into the market which the market could not absorb at UA's costs.
Many of us saw this coming years ago but had to listen to UA execs - and you -tell us that UA would be at the top of the industry.
UA simply is generating the most capacity and far less than the best revenue or profits.
and UA is doing all of this with a massive labor cost advantage because of not settling w/ its flight attendants and mechanics and UA's own execs say their costs will go up in 2026 as they settle w/ these labor groups.
UA's strategy is not delivering the results that matter.
and when you consider that UA touted endlessly that it was driving ULCCs out of business and yet the most capacity has come out of NK markets which overlap the most with DL, you once again prove you have no idea what really matters in the airline industry - but then clearly neither do UA execs.
You are just their mindless troll that parrots what they tell you.
UA's financial results will trail DL in the 4th quarter and 2025.
and UA will be parking larger and larger numbers of aircraft because of engine issues - so even this massive growth that you cling to won't happen.
You truly don't know what matters in the airline industry.
ignorance is NOT bliss
TD, "profitable and successful companies don't shrink their profits as they add capacity"
Successful companies focus on the long term and don't fixate on one metric, quarter or data point. Through Q3 25 UA added 68 new aircraft while improving their net debt, exceeding DL in op cash flow and making $2.4B in profit while dealing with the EWR issues from which you said they would never surpass DL in NYC again. You were wrong,...
TD, "profitable and successful companies don't shrink their profits as they add capacity"
Successful companies focus on the long term and don't fixate on one metric, quarter or data point. Through Q3 25 UA added 68 new aircraft while improving their net debt, exceeding DL in op cash flow and making $2.4B in profit while dealing with the EWR issues from which you said they would never surpass DL in NYC again. You were wrong, as usual. In fact, UA is doing so well their credit rating has been upgraded by Fitch in November and Moody's in December. UA is doing great and their future has never been brighter.
UA: 1,070 aircraft, (230 WB), 185 WB/483 NB on order (15.5 average fleet age)
AA: 1,013 aircraft, (137 WB), 19 WB/268 NB on order (14.1 average fleet age)
DL: 988 aircraft, (180 WB), 54 WB/232 NB on order (14.9 average fleet age)
UA includes those 350s that keep getting delay?
NickW, "This isn’t just about flying planes; By pushing deliveries to 2031, Delta is perfectly timing the retirement of the 767-400ER fleet right as they hit their max cycle limits, maximizing the CASM-ex fuel efficiency of those paid-off assets for another five years."
I agree, this is about not having enough planes to fly.
NickW, "United is taking 787-10s now and flying them heavy on edge-of-envelope routes out of SFO, taking a payload penalty."
...NickW, "This isn’t just about flying planes; By pushing deliveries to 2031, Delta is perfectly timing the retirement of the 767-400ER fleet right as they hit their max cycle limits, maximizing the CASM-ex fuel efficiency of those paid-off assets for another five years."
I agree, this is about not having enough planes to fly.
NickW, "United is taking 787-10s now and flying them heavy on edge-of-envelope routes out of SFO, taking a payload penalty."
You are confused. Maybe you are thinking about the DL A330s. UA's 787-10s are infinitely more capable and not taking any payload penalties like the A330s. And you need to do the math on DL's deliveries vs retirements. Kirby nailed it ordering 150/50 787s and 500+ NB aircraft. UA is set and DL is behind the eight ball.
NickW, "While other carriers are aggressively cap-ex spending on frames they can’t even staff"
What? Confused indeed.
as usual, you can't stand that actual people - not you hiding in your UA cubicle while posting on the clock - recognize that DL's international fleet is about far more than the 787.
DL has 40+ A350s in service that arrived on time and at least 20 more A350s - of the 1000 variety that will be coming over the next 3 years followed by a likely 20 more Airbus widebodies - likely mostly...
as usual, you can't stand that actual people - not you hiding in your UA cubicle while posting on the clock - recognize that DL's international fleet is about far more than the 787.
DL has 40+ A350s in service that arrived on time and at least 20 more A350s - of the 1000 variety that will be coming over the next 3 years followed by a likely 20 more Airbus widebodies - likely mostly 20 more 35Ks.
that will bridge DL to the arrival of the 787s.
and DL has still retired older aircraft including the 767s.
You seem pretty quiet about the 2nd story in weeks about UA's Pratt 777 issue that is grounding airplanes and has the potential for the FAA to pull all or part of the ETOPS on UA's Pratt powered 777 fleet as reported by Gary and Jon - and confirms what Cranky said recently.
UA also has many 319s and 320s grounded also for engine issues.
DL doesn't have a shortage of airplanes. now or in the future
DL has managed its fleet better by far than any other US airline and certainly better than UA that has binge ordered 787s and 737s and has kept older aircraft in service because they "needed" to add capacity.
Not only did UA trash its revenue numbers in the 3rd quarter but their aggressive fleet plan is falling apart by the day.
UA has multiple looming fleet issues - not DL.
UA will have to use large portions of its deliveries over the next few years for fleet replacement rather than growth.
YOU are the only one that is confused because you can't admit the reality that DL has played its fleet hand right - unlike DL's competitors.
TD, "...multiple looming fleet issues - not DL."
Do seven new A321NEOs parked without engines or approved 1st class seats or 717 monthly wing inspections ring any bells?
The cognitive dissonance in this comment section is staggering. Everyone is so focused on the passenger experience or the delivery date that they are completely missing the asset utilization strategy, which Tim correctly alluded to regarding the engine selection.
This isn’t just about flying planes; it’s about Delta TechOps securing the MRO rights for the GEnx-1B. By pushing deliveries to 2031, Delta is perfectly timing the retirement of the 767-400ER fleet right as they hit...
The cognitive dissonance in this comment section is staggering. Everyone is so focused on the passenger experience or the delivery date that they are completely missing the asset utilization strategy, which Tim correctly alluded to regarding the engine selection.
This isn’t just about flying planes; it’s about Delta TechOps securing the MRO rights for the GEnx-1B. By pushing deliveries to 2031, Delta is perfectly timing the retirement of the 767-400ER fleet right as they hit their max cycle limits, maximizing the CASM-ex fuel efficiency of those paid-off assets for another five years. United is taking 787-10s now and flying them heavy on edge-of-envelope routes out of SFO, taking a payload penalty. Delta will receive mature frames in 2031 and deploy them strictly in the -10’s "sweet spot" (JFK/ATL to LHR/AMS/CDG), where the seat-mile economics obliterate the A350-900.
Tim is right to point out the nuance here. While other carriers are aggressively cap-ex spending on frames they can’t even staff, Delta is securing high-margin MRO revenue streams while effectively getting a bespoke replacement timeline that protects their balance sheet. It’s a masterclass in capital discipline.
thank you, Nick.
It is also worth noting that DL has exclusive US airline maintenance rights on every western built engine that is in service now - the Pratt and Whitney Geared Turbofan that powers some 321NEOs, the A220 and E2 jets; all Rolls Royce new generation widebody engines; the LEAP engine that powers 737MAXs and now the GEnx that powers the majority of 787s.
DL not only saves tens of millions of dollars per...
thank you, Nick.
It is also worth noting that DL has exclusive US airline maintenance rights on every western built engine that is in service now - the Pratt and Whitney Geared Turbofan that powers some 321NEOs, the A220 and E2 jets; all Rolls Royce new generation widebody engines; the LEAP engine that powers 737MAXs and now the GEnx that powers the majority of 787s.
DL not only saves tens of millions of dollars per aircraft over their life by being able to do their own overhauls but also make money on their MRO business and expect that to grow in the next few years as GTFs and LEAP engines enter their normal overhaul cycles.
Also, DL does not have the space to take on the GEnx engines right now so they will have to move things around.
Getting rid of the 767-300 and -400 (which are separately types) minimizes pilot movement since all 3 will be separate categories for DL.
And UA really did good some good deals on its 787 and MAX order but that is because Boeing offered them compensation for all of the delays they got on their first order.
AA and WN have been much more measured in ordering new aircraft.
and DL is very savvy at using options so as to limit the amount of firm order aircraft on its balance sheet.
Even with DL's order today, UA probably has as many aircraft on order as the entire rest of the US industry combined.
AA and DL have clearly been able to get the aircraft they need when they want them. There simply is no advantage to having massive order books.
and the real question for the industry is what UA does with its A350 order. DL clearly has the performance advantage over the Pacific with the A350. UA can take seats off the 787-9 to get range but DL has the most capable fleet among US airlines.
and UA, like DL will face alot of operational complexity if they take the A350 before they get rid of their 767s.
AA has the best operational situation with widebodies but a much smaller fleet
Tim,
You called the order announcement! Do you know if the DL -10s will be the IGW version?
Also DL does not have exclusive maintenance rights on the LEAP or GenEx engines in the US. DL is an (CFM/GE) authorized MRO provider, there are many others as well.
The 787-10 current version has more range than the -300ceo and all 767 versions with the lowest seat mile cost of any widebody. Good choice to replace those old birds.
TD says, "UA really did good some good deals on its 787 and MAX order" but then moments later says, "There simply is no advantage to having massive order books." You really are funny.
"AA and DL have clearly been able to get the aircraft they need when they want them."
Just yesterday you were literally speculating/hoping/manifesting? that DL was going to take over Riyadh Air's close in 787 deliveries. You also repeatedly claimed...
TD says, "UA really did good some good deals on its 787 and MAX order" but then moments later says, "There simply is no advantage to having massive order books." You really are funny.
"AA and DL have clearly been able to get the aircraft they need when they want them."
Just yesterday you were literally speculating/hoping/manifesting? that DL was going to take over Riyadh Air's close in 787 deliveries. You also repeatedly claimed DL could get deliveries in a couple of years because they are Delta and the need them. With all DL's supposed clout the first delivery isn't for 5+ years because as I said the backlog is so huge, other airlines have been waiting and the production rate is so limited. Sorry, wishful thinking isn't airline analysis nor is it good airline management.
Sorry Tim, what do you mean by "exclusive MRO rights"? CFM provides no exclusivity just "Premier" designation... It is also not like MRO capabilities are unique to Delta, both United and AA can do MRO too.
Also weird statement to say "Delta has the most capable fleet among US airlines" - despite it having a much lower freight capacity in its fleet. Just some very cherry picked takes here Timmy boy...
UA does not fly any 787-10s out of SFO. Soooooo
Hi Nick,
Can you name some of the routes UAL schedules the 787-10 out of and also when United last took a delivery of a 787-10? Just trying to put your "United is taking 787-10s now and flying them heavy on edge-of-envelope routes out of SFO, taking a payload penalty" in context. United hasn't taken a 787-10 since 2023 (even then they only got a couple that year) and their deliveries for the foreseeable future...
Hi Nick,
Can you name some of the routes UAL schedules the 787-10 out of and also when United last took a delivery of a 787-10? Just trying to put your "United is taking 787-10s now and flying them heavy on edge-of-envelope routes out of SFO, taking a payload penalty" in context. United hasn't taken a 787-10 since 2023 (even then they only got a couple that year) and their deliveries for the foreseeable future are 787-9s. Also they don't have any current regularly scheduled 787-10 flights out of SFO across the Pacific (they do occasionally throw it on to SFO-PPT I believe but its certainly not the main show there and they wouldn't take much of a payload penalty given that is well within range). Maybe do some research before posting and criticizing everyone else in the comments section?
The real question which all are avoiding is very simple:
Will any new aircraft purchased by Delta, improve the airline sufficiently to elevate it to a World Class carrier?
2016:
Delta cancels 787.
Tim: Masterclass by Delta
2026:
Delta orders 787.
Tim: Masterclass by Delta
Don't argue with Tim.
1. Tim is never wrong.
2. If Tim is wrong, repeat #1.
as usual, you never are capable of grasping context.
DL inherited the 787 order from NW which was for only 18 aircraft and was for early model 787s that ended up being overweight.
DL converted that 787 order for end of production line 739ERs; I believe DL is now the largest 739ER operator.
DL avoided Boeing products including the MAX and 787 for the decade when Boeing was going through its worst crisis ever. DL...
as usual, you never are capable of grasping context.
DL inherited the 787 order from NW which was for only 18 aircraft and was for early model 787s that ended up being overweight.
DL converted that 787 order for end of production line 739ERs; I believe DL is now the largest 739ER operator.
DL avoided Boeing products including the MAX and 787 for the decade when Boeing was going through its worst crisis ever. DL embraced Airbus products and Airbus delivered for DL far better than Boeing did for any other airline.
It isn't hard for anyone with a modicum of intelligence and common sense to understand.
and the bigger issue which you clearly STILL CANNOT grasp is that you won't have to see as many replies to me if you simply reply to the facts instead of your incessant need - like a few others here - to accept that maybe I do understand what I am talking about.
MaxPower has already sum it up for you and you still try to twist it here.
It starts with...
"dude... you've spent YEARS on this website and others saying how awful the 787 is vs the A350."
You probably already read the rest of it. Now eat your humble pie, say you were wrong and move along.
People who are actually informed about a topic don't feel the need to constantly remind others of their supposed genius. They are secure in their knowledge, and don't have to show off.
Airlines change strategies all the time. It's the nature of the industry. But when a commentator injects their own personal genius into the matter - "I knew it and nobody else saw it coming," - it just goes off the rails.
and yet you can't argue with the facts I present - so you argue against ME.
Ben bothered to write an article about the DL 787 order citing me and I have written on the topic on other sites. My page views are doing quite well today.
The real issue is that you and others can't stand that someone else does understand the issue and also counters all of those people that desperately try to...
and yet you can't argue with the facts I present - so you argue against ME.
Ben bothered to write an article about the DL 787 order citing me and I have written on the topic on other sites. My page views are doing quite well today.
The real issue is that you and others can't stand that someone else does understand the issue and also counters all of those people that desperately try to discredit him.
The comments section here would be half the size if it weren't for people like you that incessantly need to try to discredit me.
You clearly haven't figured out that I am not walking away.
and, on the subject that Ben wrote about, DL has ordered the 787-10, go the GE engine maintenance contract, and is retiring 767s.
and Gary has an article - following one by Cranky not long ago - about engine problems on UA's PW 777 fleet. DL has managed its fleet well and still managed to grow.
AA walked away from growth just when international surged while UA has stretched its fleet and faces a very likely possibility of having to limit how it can use its Pratt powered 777s and will have to use large percentages of its new aircraft deliveries over the next few years for fleet replacement.
Of course, no one wants to hear that reality but it most certainly is reality
Tim
Nobody except you are arguing the facts.
Fact is, your own statement are contradicting.
Tim I constantly argue with the facts you present, because they are always generalized and wrong and then you refuse to respond Timmy and it just makes me sad....
like here you said "DL inherited the 787 order from NW which was for only 18 aircraft and was for early model 787s that ended up being overweight."
Delta cancelled that order in December 2016. Boeing had produced more than 500 787s by that point. The...
Tim I constantly argue with the facts you present, because they are always generalized and wrong and then you refuse to respond Timmy and it just makes me sad....
like here you said "DL inherited the 787 order from NW which was for only 18 aircraft and was for early model 787s that ended up being overweight."
Delta cancelled that order in December 2016. Boeing had produced more than 500 787s by that point. The early overweight 787s were in the first 100 produced. So maybe you just have a warped view of time and space or something?
So, if someone thinks XYZ is a bad stock to invest in and ten years later thinks it's great, they must be stupid or a hypocrite? Is this your contention, or is this just a chance to take a swipe at Tim? Situations change; smart people adapt.
Ben, did you notice the "hint" of Emirates’ new 777X business class on it's latest youtube?
787 is the ideal transatlantic and North America to South America plane … can operate basically everything except California to Eastern Europe (not routes delta flies) and at the lowest seat cost of any plane — excited for this development
It might actually be able to make that hop to eastern Europe. I was on United's 787-10 service from San Francisco to Auckland, NZ in 2020. The 787-10 was a downgrade from the 777-300ER. According to data, that trip is 5662 air nautical miles from San Francisco to NZ. Eastern Europe shows barely reaching 5000 air nautical miles from San Francisco so it's well within reach for the 787-10. Either way, it's good decision by...
It might actually be able to make that hop to eastern Europe. I was on United's 787-10 service from San Francisco to Auckland, NZ in 2020. The 787-10 was a downgrade from the 777-300ER. According to data, that trip is 5662 air nautical miles from San Francisco to NZ. Eastern Europe shows barely reaching 5000 air nautical miles from San Francisco so it's well within reach for the 787-10. Either way, it's good decision by Delta because I was very comfortable on the 787-10 to NZ.
Justin, it is my understanding that the A330neo has a lower seat cost pre mile in certain situations, i.e: short to mid length sectors, with high density seating.
DL back to some aircraft, that makes me one of the many moving away from this company, making the WRONG decision and not considering an aircraft maker that proofs reliability, instead of risking paying passengers lifes.
DL you make it easy for me to not only decide against this airline with crazy award pricing and now going back to an aircraft maker that really is only interested in $$$$ but not save passenger planes,...
DL back to some aircraft, that makes me one of the many moving away from this company, making the WRONG decision and not considering an aircraft maker that proofs reliability, instead of risking paying passengers lifes.
DL you make it easy for me to not only decide against this airline with crazy award pricing and now going back to an aircraft maker that really is only interested in $$$$ but not save passenger planes, should have never built anything else but military planes!
DELTA . . . was nice to get to fly with your airbus fleet.
It will be interesting which aircraft the first 30 replace. It seems like the first batch will be replacing the 11 A332 and 21 764, with the rest replacing the 31 A333. The former makes more sense, but the A332 and 764 play an important role serving business markets from JFK and ATL. This leads me to believe that the A333 will be configured with a higher premium configuration to replace the A332/764 role as...
It will be interesting which aircraft the first 30 replace. It seems like the first batch will be replacing the 11 A332 and 21 764, with the rest replacing the 31 A333. The former makes more sense, but the A332 and 764 play an important role serving business markets from JFK and ATL. This leads me to believe that the A333 will be configured with a higher premium configuration to replace the A332/764 role as these 787-10 start to come in. The incoming 787-10s can then replace the role the A333 play as the TATL people mover. The second batch can then eventually replace those higher premium A333. At that point (mid to late 2030s), the A339 could then be reconfigured with more D1.
DL has 20 confirmed A350-1000s which will be arriving in the next 3 years and DL has 20 Airbus widebody options which they are likely to take and those Airbus aircraft will likely be the actual one for one replacements for the 767-300ER fleet.
Also, DL's 321NEO transcons will be in service in a few years when they get the Delta One seat certified.
Delta is already using aircraft other than the 763 on...
DL has 20 confirmed A350-1000s which will be arriving in the next 3 years and DL has 20 Airbus widebody options which they are likely to take and those Airbus aircraft will likely be the actual one for one replacements for the 767-300ER fleet.
Also, DL's 321NEO transcons will be in service in a few years when they get the Delta One seat certified.
Delta is already using aircraft other than the 763 on transcon routes and will likely operate a combination of various widebodies and the 321NEO transcons so there will be a net reduction in widebodies on transcons but the widebodies that remain will be larger.
since every widebody DL puts in service is larger than either version of the 767, DL will be increasing capacity as 767s are replaced and esp. on international routes where DL does not have any plans for an international narrowbody
I'm talking about actual roles in the network. An A350-1000 is clearly not going to be put on JFK-FRA or JFK-ZRH. There are certain routes Delta likes to use the 764/A332 on as they are more premium heavy and don't have the Y demand that would warrant an A333/A339. Reconfiguring the A333s in a more premium heavy would allow them to upgauge the 764 and A332 routes, and you are right the incoming A35K would...
I'm talking about actual roles in the network. An A350-1000 is clearly not going to be put on JFK-FRA or JFK-ZRH. There are certain routes Delta likes to use the 764/A332 on as they are more premium heavy and don't have the Y demand that would warrant an A333/A339. Reconfiguring the A333s in a more premium heavy would allow them to upgauge the 764 and A332 routes, and you are right the incoming A35K would allow other higher Y capacity planes to fill in for the A333 on routes like JFK/DTW/MSP/ATL-AMS or JFK-FCO in the summer. Not sure why you're bring up the 763 or transcons.
the 763 is primarily used on domestic flights including Hawaii... THAT is why it is relevant to the discussion.
and DL is reportedly looking at increasing the number of Delta One seats on the 333s but that is a function of perhaps a different seat than the seat on the 339 and also as DL reworks lavs and galleys.
The 332s are only about 15 years old and will likely be in service until...
the 763 is primarily used on domestic flights including Hawaii... THAT is why it is relevant to the discussion.
and DL is reportedly looking at increasing the number of Delta One seats on the 333s but that is a function of perhaps a different seat than the seat on the 339 and also as DL reworks lavs and galleys.
The 332s are only about 15 years old and will likely be in service until the mid 2030s. Those will be DL's smallest widebodies and will be used, as they are now, esp. to other alliance hubs including LHR and Star hubs in Europe.
and the A350-1000s are predominantly being acquired for very long haul Asia - South and East Asia - and Africa. The 20 confirmed 35Ks won't cover a whole lot of routes on top of the new routes that plane is expected to launch.
They are not going to be used heavily for transatlantic flights. The 787-10 will likely have a similar number of seats as the A350-1000 perhaps with slightly lower D1 and Premium Select - but the 787-10 weighs a whole lot less which will make them better suited for the Atlantic and S. America.
Remember when Boeing forced Delta into a messy public legal dispute over the C-Series/A220? And Delta won in the end, but still had to spend a fortune on lawyers and Trump bribes? At the time, analysts said it would be YEARS before Delta placed another Boeing order.
I guess they were partially correct.
Delta ordered the MAX10 several years ago and will be the launch customer in the US because DL will wait for the MAX 10 to be certified while UA has converted its MAX 10s to -8s and 9s.
Boeing and Delta are businesses; they both do what they need to do for business.
Rational businesses do not hold grudges; they focus on what matters to their businesses - which includes their bottom lines.
Tim, a serious question:
Does Delta pay you for your CONSTANT corporate shilling? You're up and down every single one of Ben's posts, day after day after day, carrying water for that airline. You even defend them on posts that have nothing at all to do with DAL. Why do you do this? Do they own your soul? Do they pay you by the word?
Or are you just neurotically obsessed with Delta Air...
Tim, a serious question:
Does Delta pay you for your CONSTANT corporate shilling? You're up and down every single one of Ben's posts, day after day after day, carrying water for that airline. You even defend them on posts that have nothing at all to do with DAL. Why do you do this? Do they own your soul? Do they pay you by the word?
Or are you just neurotically obsessed with Delta Air Lines and willing to do all of this for free? That would be pathological and sad, if true.
And even Lucky himself has had to comment on your behavior over the years. You haunt this blog like a bad cheese burp, and your obsession with Delta is unsettling and easily mocked.
I participate in multiple discussions regarding multiple airlines.
I'm not sure why you or anyone find providing facts and accuracy so objectionable.
Debate the facts and not the people.
DL and UA attract controversy and comparisons between each other more than any other two airlines.
The difference is that DL just runs a better business and airline.
Plenty of people including Scott Kirby himself said that other airlines would not be...
I participate in multiple discussions regarding multiple airlines.
I'm not sure why you or anyone find providing facts and accuracy so objectionable.
Debate the facts and not the people.
DL and UA attract controversy and comparisons between each other more than any other two airlines.
The difference is that DL just runs a better business and airline.
Plenty of people including Scott Kirby himself said that other airlines would not be able to grow because UA locked up growth.
DL just reported its finances and very likely will, once again, be the most profitable US airline. DL is growing but is managing its growth better than any other US airline - including UA which destroyed its own revenue performance in the 3rd quarter because of excess capacity growth.
DL has more than enough aircraft on order including to bridge DL to the 787 deliveries.
So, your response to a question of your Delta fixation is not to answer the accusation, but to parrot even more Delta corporate talking points that have nothing at all to do with what I just asked. I didn't ask about Scott Kirby or which airline has the greatest growth potential. I asked about YOU. Do you have a legitimate neurological condition? Are the words not reaching the speech center of your brain? Or are...
So, your response to a question of your Delta fixation is not to answer the accusation, but to parrot even more Delta corporate talking points that have nothing at all to do with what I just asked. I didn't ask about Scott Kirby or which airline has the greatest growth potential. I asked about YOU. Do you have a legitimate neurological condition? Are the words not reaching the speech center of your brain? Or are you just a severe crackpot? I notice when Ben has called you out in the past, you pretend you didn't read his words, too. We're not houseplants or toddlers. You can't deflect us so easily.
I wonder what you're like in a restaurant. The waiter asks for your order, and you launch into a tirade about Delta's in-flight catering. The bill comes, and you argue that you should be able to pay with Delta luggage tags.
Ben had to write an entire post about the harm you cause to his blog, and that didn't cause you to reflect or adjust your behavior in the slightest. You're still here, talking to yourself and verbally steamrolling anyone who tries to communicate like a sane adult.
I sure hope Delta pays you for all the shilling you do. That mind has to make a living somehow.
my response is to note that it is precisely people like you that fixate about how much anyone participates in any forum and YOU can't figure out that a big chunk - probably 10% of the replies to this discussion so far - are accusations about me and not discussions of the topic.
If you were smart AND want to see less of my posts, just post replies regarding the discussion and not other users, including me.
@JamesW
Don't fall for this.
"If you were smart AND want to see less of my posts, just post replies regarding the discussion and not other users, including me"
As we can always see.
Tim is always dragging in irrelevant discussions to the topic.
Time never answers the question even with regards to the topic.
Because in his mind everything DL is part of the topic.
Your character and mental state are on full display for everyone here. If you didn't want to become the focus of ridicule and concern, then you'd behave differently and not allow yourself to become the center of attention. But you like the nasty attention. You like to pick fights. You're the troll living under Ben's bridge.
You churlishly insult anyone - including Ben - who dares to disagree with you.
You boast endlessly about...
Your character and mental state are on full display for everyone here. If you didn't want to become the focus of ridicule and concern, then you'd behave differently and not allow yourself to become the center of attention. But you like the nasty attention. You like to pick fights. You're the troll living under Ben's bridge.
You churlishly insult anyone - including Ben - who dares to disagree with you.
You boast endlessly about your own genius and foresight. ONLY YOU saw this coming years ago!
You condescend to the rest of us when we call you on your nonsense and bad attitude.
I'd tell you to get your own blog and stop hijacking every single one of OMAAT's posts, but a blog controlled by you would be a digital hellscape. If you're this rude and controlling on someone else's site, just imagine how toxic you'd be on your own property. Yikes.
Tim is definitively not “right”, and most assuredly compensating for something(s)
He also pops up on other sites to shill for DL as well.
Ben,
The A330-900NEO is already not the smallest gauge aircraft of the “new generation” planes. The new A350-900H more premium version seats only a total of 275 pax (40/40/36/159), compared to the A339’s 281 pax total.
As CX isn't finished shopping, I can see them ordering a ton as well to replace their 773As as they're pretty ripe now for replacement. While the neos will replace the ceos, the 773As don't have an adequate replacement annd the 78X is the next best thing.
I just like to compare everything to an L1011-250 Tristar to give things relevancy.
787-10s are significant investments, and I am sure Airbus is not too pleased
Well, we'll see whether Boeing can actually deliver anything on-time... see the 777X and Max10...
Delta announced last quarter that the 767-300s would leave international service in ‘28. The 400’s will stick around a while longer. While I’d always book away from the -300 D1 cabin, the -400 D1 cabin doesn’t seem that bad. I think I’d prefer the 6 and 7 abreast seating in Premium Select and Economy on the 767 to the 7 and 8 abreast seating of the 330/350.
and, yet, as I have noted multiple times, most of the Delta 763 fleet is used domestically including on transcons and to Hawaii.
Its competitor on transcons is B6 Mint which is a smaller aircraft, AA's 321Ts in which AA carries about half of the traffic that DL does (to be replaced by their XLRs which will be nice aircraft but still smaller than widebodies), and a mixture of UA narrowbodies and widebodies on...
and, yet, as I have noted multiple times, most of the Delta 763 fleet is used domestically including on transcons and to Hawaii.
Its competitor on transcons is B6 Mint which is a smaller aircraft, AA's 321Ts in which AA carries about half of the traffic that DL does (to be replaced by their XLRs which will be nice aircraft but still smaller than widebodies), and a mixture of UA narrowbodies and widebodies on transcons and esp. to Hawaii. The 763ER seat on DL is superior to UA's 757s - which is predominantly where DL's 763ERs compete internationally - and UA's high density 777-200s.
DL knows full well that the 763 is its weakest product. What alot of people can't accept is that DL knows how to use its 767s to still be at par or better than the competition.
and DL still has an 80 aircraft headstart w/ Delta One Suite equipped aircraft; if people like you would spend as much time arguing about how much better DL's 339s and 359s are compared to what AA and UA offers, we might take your complaints about the 763s more seriously.
None of which changes that DL is replacing its 767 fleet w/ much larger aircraft - the 35Ks and 787-10s are both likely to have 75 to 100 more seats than the 767s.
DL will be significantly upgauging its international fleet which will add capacity and efficiency.
I would respectfully disagree. While D1 on 339s and 359s is better than current AA and UA widebodies, that “glow” doesn’t make the 763 D1 cabin any better. For my money, I’d prefer Mint or F on AA 32Bs over 763 D1. I would certainly agree that 763 D1 is far better than the narrow bodies AA and UA put on their Hawaii service.
nobody is telling you that there is a shine on the 763s.
I AM telling you that DL manages to use the 767s to compete against other carriers' products which is largely UA's 757s and domestic 777s.
given that more than half of DL's 763s do fly domestic service and about 1/4 more of the fleet flies in the summer competitive with UA 757s, there are less than a half 767s that fly in...
nobody is telling you that there is a shine on the 763s.
I AM telling you that DL manages to use the 767s to compete against other carriers' products which is largely UA's 757s and domestic 777s.
given that more than half of DL's 763s do fly domestic service and about 1/4 more of the fleet flies in the summer competitive with UA 757s, there are less than a half 767s that fly in otherwise competitive markets....largely to markets in Europe which DL serves primarily for summer seasonal traffic which is heavily leisure focused.
as others have noted, the incessant ragging on the DL 763 is nauseating from Ben and others because it lacks context or comparative facts.
and DL's 767s are not any older or younger than UA's. The difference is that DL is retiring its 767s while UA, so far has not.
Polaris on UA 767s don't improve cost efficiency or maintenance reliability or the costs to keep the planes flying.
the 767s are what keep DL and UA much larger across the Atlantic than AA
I’ve been avoiding 787 like plague, due to narrower seat and aisle. Unpleasant flight. Same for (10-abreast) 777. That made Delta the prestige choice. Not anymore.
Yeah 787 economy seats width are usually 17.1" and prepare for the crew to lock up the electronic windows.
Having flown on both a 787 and A350 back to back in Y, I can say that they both suck. Both feel very tight. Surprisingly, I thought the 787 felt more open due to the 'lighter' looking cabin thanks to the natural light that came in from the huge windows.
Also, the bin architecture on the 787 and moodlighting is way better designed, making the cabin feel less claustrophobic. The only A350 pro is that it's a little bit quieter.
Great no more old 767 to Barcelona and Madrid lol
You say that now, but as a frequent BCN O/D traveler, I'm going to miss 2-4-2 in C+. PS is fine and D1 on the 764 is good. But if you spend any time in the rear of the plane, you're in for a shitty surprise.
The first 787-10 delivery will be in 2031, a full 5 years away, but these birds appear to be poised to replace the 767s on TATL and South America and possibly some of the older ex-NW 332/333s, which are early 2000s builds. Makes sense for them to order the plane and in keeping with Delta's incremental orders philosophy.
Whether they can keep capturing premium revenue is an open question. The US Economy is headed for...
The first 787-10 delivery will be in 2031, a full 5 years away, but these birds appear to be poised to replace the 767s on TATL and South America and possibly some of the older ex-NW 332/333s, which are early 2000s builds. Makes sense for them to order the plane and in keeping with Delta's incremental orders philosophy.
Whether they can keep capturing premium revenue is an open question. The US Economy is headed for a recession and a deep one. Only a matter of time. K shaped economies don't last.
I would place my guess the 78M would replace the 339s and 359s on a number of TATL routes, giving them more seats. The 339s and 359s could then be used on international former 767 routes. Just the guess of an unqualified speculator.
Realistically, what is a 767 replacement in today's era of aircraft, not even Delta specifically?
Nothing quite seems to match the range and capacity in today's widebody lineup.
Narrowbodies about 30 to 40% smaller. The 787-8 fills a completely different niche from the 763s and 764s. The 763s have been great for Delta in terms of premium transcon capacity, allowing them to fill more seats than a narrowbody like AA and JetBlue, as well as...
Realistically, what is a 767 replacement in today's era of aircraft, not even Delta specifically?
Nothing quite seems to match the range and capacity in today's widebody lineup.
Narrowbodies about 30 to 40% smaller. The 787-8 fills a completely different niche from the 763s and 764s. The 763s have been great for Delta in terms of premium transcon capacity, allowing them to fill more seats than a narrowbody like AA and JetBlue, as well as secondary Europe markets that don't warrant a full A330.
I guess one assumption could be that air traffic and passenger volume will continue to grow, at least in the near term, and smaller sized aircraft like the 767 simply aren't necessary anymore.
As long as American pilot salaries remain outrageously high the American companies will not be in the market for small wide-bodies. And if they are not in the market no one really is.
Looks like the Delta fanboys who kept bragging about how DL made the right choice (not having the 787) was wrong.
Awkward...
As I said, the 787 would be part of DL's fleet. It was always a given that DL would not go with a 100% Airbus widebody fleet; the economics of the 787 are best in class across the Atlantic.
They have 20 A350-1000s on order and they will certainly take the 20 options for widebody options.
Most significantly, as AA and UA bet on the A321XLR, DL will continue to upgauge its international fleet just...
As I said, the 787 would be part of DL's fleet. It was always a given that DL would not go with a 100% Airbus widebody fleet; the economics of the 787 are best in class across the Atlantic.
They have 20 A350-1000s on order and they will certainly take the 20 options for widebody options.
Most significantly, as AA and UA bet on the A321XLR, DL will continue to upgauge its international fleet just as it led the legacy industry in domestic upgauging. Given that DL's widebody fleet has takeoff performance as good as the A321XLR flies if not better, the notion that the XLR will allow airlines to operate routes that widebodies cannot is not operationally true.
However, you were wrong about the engine choice
dude... you've spent YEARS on this website and others saying how awful the 787 is vs the A350. Just generally. You never ever specificied the 788 or the 789 vs the A350 variants -- it was always the 787 aircraft family vs the A350 family.
Just eat some humble pie, say you were wrong and move along. stop trying to act like you predicted this or knew it all along. You've been obnoxious for...
dude... you've spent YEARS on this website and others saying how awful the 787 is vs the A350. Just generally. You never ever specificied the 788 or the 789 vs the A350 variants -- it was always the 787 aircraft family vs the A350 family.
Just eat some humble pie, say you were wrong and move along. stop trying to act like you predicted this or knew it all along. You've been obnoxious for years about how superior Delta was for not having the 787 in their fleet. Now you're trying to pretend you weren't.
"It was always a given that DL would not go with a 100% Airbus widebody fleet"
Also the opposite of what you said before the 787-10 rumor broke about year ago
For once in your life, just own your stupid dogmatic statements. There's a reason the rest of us don't make such stupid dogmatic statements about how smart x airline was for not ever buying the 787.
Great order for Delta
Max
we were doing so well - for about 3 articles - and then you had to return to your usual personal attacks because you can't stand the truth that I know.
I REPEATEDLY have said that the A350 is the most capable and efficient aircraft across the Pacific and on the longest haul routes -and that is true.
I have REPEATEDLY said that the 787-10 is the most efficient aircraft across the Atlantic...
Max
we were doing so well - for about 3 articles - and then you had to return to your usual personal attacks because you can't stand the truth that I know.
I REPEATEDLY have said that the A350 is the most capable and efficient aircraft across the Pacific and on the longest haul routes -and that is true.
I have REPEATEDLY said that the 787-10 is the most efficient aircraft across the Atlantic and to S. America - and DL's order confirms that.
and yes I most specifically did say the 787-10. Ben's own article says that.
Airbus has delivered more new widebodies to DL since covid than Boeing has to American, United or Hawaiian/Alaska. DL was completely smart to stay away from Boeing while it was in its growing pains.
and planetavgeek,
I have said that DL would order the GEnx engine and that is what they ordered and they also have the maintenance rights for those engines which is a huge advantage over AA or UA.
and picking up aircraft from Riyadh in order to get aircraft early does not seem to be the case; pretending that getting one element of a rumors wrong precludes all of the things that I got right is what childish people do who can't admit that I was more right than not.
none of which changes that DL will once again have the best economics on its TATL fleet while delivering the best revenue performance.
Timmy,
your ignorant talking points about the 787 vs the a350 for YEARS are well documented -- all related to how not having the 787 was somehow a great advantage for Delta, no other reason for such silly and ignorant points about the 787.
Just own it, say you were wrong, and move on.
You don't need to spend 8 paragraphs trying to obfuscate from your very plain and obvious statements.
The 787...
Timmy,
your ignorant talking points about the 787 vs the a350 for YEARS are well documented -- all related to how not having the 787 was somehow a great advantage for Delta, no other reason for such silly and ignorant points about the 787.
Just own it, say you were wrong, and move on.
You don't need to spend 8 paragraphs trying to obfuscate from your very plain and obvious statements.
The 787 has always been a great plane, so is the A350. You're the only one that made it into some weird Delta vs the world thing
Max,
for someone that talks incessantly about how much you hate seeing me on this and other sites, you prove that you have no skills of logic or reasoning to immediately jump into this discussion solely to try to trash me.
Ben wrote an article about the 787 order citing me. I am right that it would come and I am right that it was the 787-10. I also said DL would get maintenance...
Max,
for someone that talks incessantly about how much you hate seeing me on this and other sites, you prove that you have no skills of logic or reasoning to immediately jump into this discussion solely to try to trash me.
Ben wrote an article about the 787 order citing me. I am right that it would come and I am right that it was the 787-10. I also said DL would get maintenance rights on the GEnx engines and I am right about that.
you don't need to spend 8 paragraphs trying to manipulate and distort what I said correctly by adding in a few pieces that I and others got wrojg - the delivery timing and souring of some orders from RX.
you have proven over and over that you can't stand that I am right about anything; at least have the common sense to realize that your incessant attempts to prove me wrong not only elevate my position but highlight that I did get the majority of this deal right.
A key factor that weighs upon XLR economics for larger carriers is cargo revenue (or lack thereof). At the same time, off-season passenger demand would likely not command a wide-body to secondary cities and the XLR is the only ship that would allow year-round service. And, for airlines with lighter overall passenger and cargo demand, perhaps the XLR is the only thing that makes financial sense.
You have also hinted that DL is picking up orders from Ryadh Air but the 2031 delivery date hints that there was no substance whatsoever in this statement.
Like any economist you say a lot of things and then only remind us of the rare ones that become right. A broken clock is right twice a day.
"It is very unlikely that many airlines will order both the 787 and an A330/350 combination."
Hah, well the list just grew even more!
lol you said it was going to be announced 3 months ago and they didn’t do it. Also you said they would order the 787 as it was reported on here and by many other analysts, you were not delivering breaking news, just getting the timing completely wrong.
You were right (on the 787), Tim!
(Personally, I wish they'd just double-down on 220, 339, 350, but, ok...)
thanks, 1990.
DL will keep ordering more 350s and will likely be a launch customer for the 220-500 when Airbus launches it.
The chances of more 339s is low.
and the real issue is that DL is more than able to place decent size but not "world largest" orders. A whole lot of people argued that DL - and AA - were behind in the number of aircraft orders and yet both AA and DL...
thanks, 1990.
DL will keep ordering more 350s and will likely be a launch customer for the 220-500 when Airbus launches it.
The chances of more 339s is low.
and the real issue is that DL is more than able to place decent size but not "world largest" orders. A whole lot of people argued that DL - and AA - were behind in the number of aircraft orders and yet both AA and DL can and are getting enough new aircraft to grow.
The fact that UA has placed massive orders that go out for a decade doesn't stop the fact that this DL order was expected and there was plenty of internet chatter - including by me - that got key parts of this announcement right.
THAT is what a whole lot of people can't stand.
I'd love to see more 220s, including the 500, when it's ready. That's ok on 339; ideally, interior cabin upgrades to existing 330ceos would be nice, kind of like what DL did with 764.
UA got screwed by Boeing's delays. DL got very lucky with Airbus.
TD was right !!
TD said just yesterday, “ and third, those that want the Safran Unity seat will probably get it on the 787 which could be announced tomorrow w/ DL's earnings. Reportedly, one aircraft is already in production which aligns w/ the rumors that DL is picking up orders from one of its partners, which I suspect is Riyadh Air - which is waiting for certification for its seats and has several aircraft ready to enter service. Their 787s have the Safran Unity product.”
see above to Max.
Ben wrote an article about my expectation and I was right.
Like Max, you can't stand that I am right about so many things so you focus on the much smaller list of things that appear not to be true.
You should be worried about how UA's financial results will compare to DL's for the 4th quarter and 2025.
I don't have to go very far out on any limb...
see above to Max.
Ben wrote an article about my expectation and I was right.
Like Max, you can't stand that I am right about so many things so you focus on the much smaller list of things that appear not to be true.
You should be worried about how UA's financial results will compare to DL's for the 4th quarter and 2025.
I don't have to go very far out on any limb to know, not guess, that UA will, once again underperform DL despite flying more ASMs and paying its people less than DL.
You were completely wrong on the timing which I have been telling you would be 4-5 years. You were wrong about your bizarre Riyadh prediction and UA never regaining the passenger lead in NYC among many other things. Kirby played a master stroke when he ordered 150/50 787s and over 500 narrow body airliners coming out of Covid. Delta’s conservatism has become a big negative in these days of supply chain struggles and aircraft delivery...
You were completely wrong on the timing which I have been telling you would be 4-5 years. You were wrong about your bizarre Riyadh prediction and UA never regaining the passenger lead in NYC among many other things. Kirby played a master stroke when he ordered 150/50 787s and over 500 narrow body airliners coming out of Covid. Delta’s conservatism has become a big negative in these days of supply chain struggles and aircraft delivery delays. Maybe DL can give Riyadh Air another call.