The problem here isn’t the seat, but instead, the strange instructions that American Airlines is giving its flight attendants.
Continue reading: New American Business Class Seats Restrict Service While Watching TV
Share your questions, experiences, and thoughts below.
Is there some stupid reason they made the seats face the aisle instead of window?
Can someone give me one good reason why an airline would opt for seats that face away from the windows?
If it’s the middle seats in a 1-2-1 I can understand for passengers flying together, but on a narrow body????
Not at all surprised. Anything involving minimizing work in the name of "safety and security" is something AA crew loves to hide behind. If they are friends with the Captain they'll get that seat belt sign kept on as much as possible so they don't have to do anything.
Bit of a tangent, but that tablecloth looks so sad on that tray table relative to the size of the tablecloth vs the tray table. If you're gonna give a tablecloth, at least make it bigger than the tray table itself so it can properly drapes over the sides. Otherwise, it just looks like a napkin that got left behind.
Am I understanding you can’t look out the window either? Hope they don’t advertise window seats.
@ CF Frost -- Since this is a herringbone seat, you do face away from the window, yes (though if you turn your neck far enough, you can look outside).
@ Xavier -- Totally agree. American's premium cabin meal presentation more generally is very bland/uninspiring.
@ Jacob -- The short answer is that herringbone seats utilize space more efficiently, so it's to cram in as many seats as possible.
It's all for the density.
Stelia Opera, the only reverse herringbone seat currently installed on A321, is pitched at 38".
On the contrary, Collins Aurora seat installed on AA A321XLR is pitched at 32".
38" vs 32" is a huuuuuge difference.
AA's Collins Aurora seat is also denser than Jetblue Mint(Thompson Vantage Solo @36" pitch) or Iberia(Thompson Vantage Solo @34" pitch).
American Airlines will never shy away from an opportunity to use the specter of safety to deny service. Their 80-year-old flight attendants wouldn’t have it any other way!
Ben, one of your potential solutions is to have the FAs briefly move the screen so they can serve. Aren't they holding trays of food, or do they use a cart for service? And will the dazed traveler with headphones in or on know what's happening, like why is the FA moving my screen while I am watching a movie? And it's more work for the FAs, so it will slow down service. This seems like a poop show about to begin.
I thought we were past the herringbone seat designs that make you crane your neck to look outside, but no we are apparently not. Anything to cram as many seats in as you can get away with, passenger comfort be damned.
Agree with Xavier and would add that the seat finishes look extremely ugly. Unless the picture is distorting the colours, that seat has way too many colours and patterns and textures going on- what a mess!
If you prefer Oasis recliners over lie-flat, you do you.
Fine, reverse herringbone would probably have been better for viewing out the windows.
I'm still excited by these upgrades, regardless of this whining over meals, TVs, doors, whatever. Lie-flat 1-1 is an upgrade from 2-2 recliners; a321T was getting dated; these are very similar to B6 new Mint on TATL and JFK-LAX. I think this is the future of narrow-body premium hard-product. SQ has done something similar/interesting with their 737max, adding lie-flat there. If you're operating 5-6+ hour flights, redeyes, you should offer lie-flat if you're a true 'premium' airline.
If you're going to use 'hyperbole' why not say 105-year-old... (nice 'hot take,' Viraj).
CF Frost, you *can* and it is a window & aisle seat. If you prefer Oasis recliners, please, do avoid this nice, new lie-flat suite product, and opt for a 1-stop via DFW or ORD for your JFK-LAX route.
B6 new Mint on TATL and JFK-LAX use this design as well, and it's never been an issue on the many times I've enjoyed those routes and aircraft. You can still look out the windows if you want. You can still get served meals and drinks with ease (and continue to enjoy entertainment on screens or otherwise). What is up with all the haters here, Ben?
The design is very similar to jetBlue newer Mint, as S_LEE describes, which is a really nice product. These lie-flat options on narrowbodies should be celebrated, not whined about. Like, fellas, would you really prefer a recliner on these routes instead (redeye, 5+ hours). Gimme lie-flat, every time, please.
With the current T-Birds, the Flagship First seats are also herringbone except that your head is by the aisle and your feet are by the window. Wide-body J as well. Other airlines as well. In this configuration, someone could complain that one is sitting too far away from the window to see out. There will always be something for someone to complain about. But, if one has flown this enough times, one gets used to it.
American Airlines has the most pathetic service and most entitled flight attendants. The board should fire management which enables their awful service culture and new management should fire the entire union and start over.
Flew transatlantic with them in J earlier this year. Never again. (As a LHR-based BA flyer)
A "window" seat facing away from the window is just ridiculous. Claustrophobic issues require that I be able to look out the window.
Now comes this poorly thought out screen/service issue.
Is maximizing capacity really more important than alienating their
their premier revenue stream?
Thanks S_LEE, that’s very informative.
@1990: I’m not whining about it being lie-flat, I’m whining about it not facing the window. I’ve flown Stelia Operia with ITA which was fantastic. Having the seats facing away from the window looks really claustrophobic to me. I don’t understand why a “premium” carrier would make this choice. But then again question is if American is as premium as they sometimes claim.
AA seems to exist to botch the simplest elements of flying.
Installing a premium herringbone product where the TV can't be used during meal service and the customer needs to be an owl to enjoy the view seems like the airline went with "airline convenience" instead of "passenger experience." Complaints about such a product are legit, and a good subset of pax (non-status chasers with AA) will opt for the DL or UA offerings over AA.
(Some master or mistress of the obvious will now explain that it's a business, and businesses need to be profitable. You're now spared the labor or typing out such rubbish.)
If you're charging an extremely high premium, then offer an extremely high-end product that's not customer-hostile, which CAN BE done!
Yup, I was on the inaugural myself and the FA and I both joked about the mild inconvenience of having to close the screen, since yeah, even open, it’s almost impossible to deliver a tray and drinks. That and the flimsy table are the only 2 issues I had with my seat
The bigger issue for me is making the window completely useless. I don’t want to stare at a screen 24/7
Key word: "mild"... this post and the other bloggers freaking out over this is just content-farming, outrage-bait, nothing-burger. Hope you had a nice flight!
"TV can't be used" ... oh no, what will we do without view of the TV for 2 seconds...
Most folks shut the windows throughout the flights anyway. Open and enjoy for takeoff, landing, etc. You can still see just fine out these windows, regardless.
I'm happy to be critical of greedy corporations, but this is not the situation where that is worth it. Like, please, let's advocate for worker rights and consumer protections, and do so meaningfully. AA has FA unions, and even so, crews should get paid more; the US should have air passenger rights legislation like EU261 and Canada's APPR, where we, passengers, get paid when airlines significantly delay or cancel flights under their control.
All that said, these seats are an improvement we should be welcoming, not poo-poo-ing. If you prefer 1-stop transcon in Oasis recliners, please, book that instead. I'll take the nonstop XLR.
Lee, a321T First is reverse-herringbone (facing window). These new a321XLR are herringbone (facing aisle). Regardless of the semantics, either lie-flat is better than Oasis recliners. Yes, the complainers on here are being silly.
If it wasn't herringbone, it would be reverse herringbone. And, if it wasn't reverse herringbone, it would be herringbone. So, if it's not a fit, then fly another airline. Just move on. It's really that simple.
What a stupid, ignorant question.
If you want to gossip about someone's personal life, please go to facebook.
I have no problem with 2-2 lie flat business class (doesn't have to be an OASIS recliner). Neither does, uh, Starlux. This blog gave 5*s to their lie flat seat - the Collins Aerospace Diamond - on the Starlux A321neo. As noted by this blog, same seat as AA has on its 757s (albeit one that actually has TVs and looks nice of course). AA could have installed those same seats on the XLR - for the "missions" they are primarily going to fly the XLR on (transcon), they are perfectly acceptable lie flat business class seats for ~5 hour flights. Instead we get these shoehorned and cramped herringbone things that just look and feel tight and closes off the spaciousness of the cabin especially with the huge overhead bins. And if they ultimately are not maintained well by AA (a la 321T), they are going to start to feel a bit "janky" in 4-5 years.
Everything doesn't have to be a suite with a closed door! On a widebody, yeah, great. On a narrowbody, just select a good product and actually maintain it and provide decent service on board and a nice lounge at the airport. Just my $0.02.
Yeah me too i flew Jet Blue Mint in 2023 to CDG and had no problem with the crew and TV. AA crew has to be better.
Seat facing away from the window, video monitors that obstruct the table, abysmal customer experience, also there are the proletariat to contend with …. then people wonder why U.S. airlines are so poorly regarded around the globe.
How to make a perfectly reasonable aircraft into a pig’s ear …. sell it to a U.S. low cost carrier.
Americans don't like looking out of windows. That's why no one opens the windows for take off/landing, it's depressing
IN related news, another policy is coming up: FAs will not serve you dessert until you finish your main!
American putting the burden on customers because of its poor planning, operations, and service?
American, not thinking about the customer when it designs a plane or a service flow?
Shocking! I've never heard of American doing such a thing.
Oh, wait.
That seat somehow reminds me of the Virgin Atlantic and Air NZ old business class seat. 🙁
I'm not a fan of those coffin seats and prefer the openess of even the old business class seats on the 321T, though I'm likely in the minority. To me, the bigger issue is they've taken out the plentiful extra legroom coach seats found on the T (except for bulkhead, exit rows) and reduced standard coach seat pitch vs. the T. This is likely not the plane for me.
Everything AA does seems to be purposely hostile to passengers. They can have luxury king sized mattresses with high-end linens for every seat, a master chef onboard every flight cooking meals made-to-order, but if the service is delivered by AA employees, it is going to suck.
I used to fly weekly on AA shuttle from DCA-LGA where the product offering is free beer and wine in coach. Without fail, every flight in both directions, the crew would say, "Due to the short duration of today's flight, we will only be offering water." The flight duration is the same 40 minutes every time and this is the service your company expects you to offer, knowing what the duration is. If you can't handle it, don't bid that route.
This is how we know we're in a simulation. Airlines are just one of the social experiment modules through which the simulations tests the various people in the simulation, to see what degree of humiliation the people in the simulation are willing to endure. Thanks again, Stanley Milgram
lets call it as it is. these "new" seats look already dated. the colors look ATROCIOUS and dont even fit Americans brand colors. the charcoal and the brown are SUPER unappealing imo compared to a lot of other color schemes you see out there.
and now this? what a hassle. united and delta are really leaving American in the dust. the airline needs to be rebranded, needs a new CEO, and someone with a much stronger vision for the company. Yikes.
Thankfully AA haven't had to worry about serving people in old style Club World - the FAs pass food over your head and lean over folk all the time!
Lucky, you should update your article since AA clearly made a design mistake here. The AA design has the TV monitor folding into the wall and being concealed when shut. Your JetBlue photo clearly shows a different design where the monitor faces out and is visible whether folded or open. The hinge is in a different location on each. AA should have flipped the monitors and they would not have this issue. This explains why JetBlue has no issues, but AA does. It's a bad design on AA's part, not an inherent issue to Herringbone seats. AA should really switch this around for future planes if they can.
American Airlines far and away has the worst hard and soft product of the big 3. And jet blue passes them if we’re talking big 5, I suspect southwest will pass them in about 2 years.
I always take of my headphones and pause the entertainment when someone is serving me, just to be polite and acknowledge them properly. So it's not an issue for me.
In terms of design only Air New Zealand's 787-9 business class beats this ridiculous seating arrangement, facing away from the window, and everybody's feet sticking out into the aisle. Definitely a 'NO' for me, because looking at the wonderful world through the window is just what I do. I can look at screens all day long, when I am not on a plane.
In a past life, I worked for a major airline in Product Development and we were responsible for core pax experience components like seats, lounges, IFE/IFEC, etc.
The proper way to roll out a new product is to run full-scale tests and scenarios of something new to catch issues like this. If AA had smart people working on this team, they would have included a core group of FAs to be involved *from the start* and work with them to develop the service and simulate it to ensure it works. And if they did things the right way, they’d also have their leaders sit in seats for hours on end (and even sleep in them overnight) to test them out. Only by simulations and cross-functional teams (ie a panel of FAs to build the product with) you would get this right and avoid nuances and embarrassing quirks like this.
Don’t forget AA was so proud of their 78P a few months ago and invited media to view it, while “787-900” was splashed across the IFE screens — uhhh, you really need an AvGeek or two to be on your product team to catch incorrect information like this because you just look a bit foolish using the aircraft the wrong (and a non-existent) model designation (it’s a 787-9, there is no -800 or -900 for the 787).
Little things matter, and so does collaborative teamwork with those who have to deliver the service. Too bad this is all foreign to AA (and other airlines) — if they embraced this, they’d discover this how to build some really solid airline products and win real (not pay-to-play) awards (ie $kyTrax). That’s what I did with my team years ago - and that was the secret to our success. Sadly, airlines like AA will probably throw money at a big name consulting company for canned decks and Millennials consulting on how to be better - when they could just take a look inside with their own employees and top-tier customers and get it right from the start.
Oh boo freaking hoo. If you have the capability to be even flying in such a cabin, you should consider yourself lucky. Get the hell over it already.
I guess it's too much to have the FAs simply ask politely (if the passenger hasn't already done so out of courtesy) "may I move your monitor for a moment"? And the passenger gets the point obviously / hopefully for the next instance.
That would be asking too much of American flight attendants, to do something that with other carriers would be just normal polished courtesy.