Recently, I wrote about how we’re seeing a general softening of demand for travel to the United States, for a variety of reasons. There’s no denying that the most contentious situation is between Canada and the United States, and we now have some data that shows just how extreme the change in demand is.
In this post:
Transborder flight bookings are down by 70%+
We’ve known that travel demand between Canada and the United States has been decreasing, both by air and by roads. We’ve seen some airlines scale back their flight schedules between the two countries, and we’ve also seen a substantial decline in road border crossings. However, it looks like what we’ve seen so far is just the tip of the iceberg.
Aviation analytics company OAG has published some data on the decline in flight bookings between the countries, and it’s worse than most people probably imagined. Specifically, the company compared summer season bookings in March 2024 vs. March 2025. In other words, at this point in both years, how many people have booked transborder flights in April through September?
Well, I hope you’re sitting down. For that six month period, the number of tickets booked is down anywhere from 71.4% to 75.7%. Just as an example, April is less than a week away, and here’s how bookings between the two countries are looking:
- In March 2024, 1,218,570 tickets had been booked for April 2024
- In March 2025, 295,982 tickets have been booked for April 2025
- That represents a 75.7% reduction in tickets booked
I knew it was bad, but I didn’t expect it would be that bad, as that level of demand shift is something you almost never see.
Everyone can draw their own conclusions as to what’s causing this. It’s also anyone’s guess if we’re at rock bottom in terms of consumer sentiment, and if we’ll see more close-in bookings than in past years. But either way, April is right around the corner, and those drops are massive.
When will airlines slash more transborder capacity?
We’ve seen airlines cancel a bit of capacity between the United States and Canada, but nothing that nearly reflects the decline in future bookings that we’re seeing. According to OAG, so far airlines have slashed anywhere from 1.6% to 3.5% of their schedules between the two countries for April through September.
However, based on current data, that doesn’t even begin to cover the adjustments that will need to be made, unless something drastic happens soon. Obviously one would assume that Air Canada would be most impacted by these changes, given that the airline has the largest transborder network. Perhaps we’ll see Air Canada shift more capacity domestically, or to countries other than the United States, to account for where consumers want to travel to.
This can’t be an easy situation for those in airline route planning, since it’s hard to know for how long demand will remain so depressed. It’s not easy to just totally rework your route network, especially when it’s anyone’s guess how this evolves.
Bottom line
We’ve known that there has been a decline in travel between Canada and the United States. However, the situation for future flight bookings looks much worse, with an over 70% reduction in flight bookings for the summer season. So far airlines have slashed at most 3.5% of their schedules, so presumably some significant changes will still have to be made.
What do you make of these statistics on future transborder flight bookings? Are you surprised by the size of the decline?
Nothing to do with the fact our currency is worthless. A US charge on a credit card now comes with a 48% premium.
70 percent?! The sky is falling and prices must be crashing too, right? Not so much. Flights from my local airport to YYZ are as expensive as ever (400+). And the airport's web site says that DL will start direct flights to Vancouver this summer. Something is not adding up.
All we can pray for is that this momentum continues and Canadians speak with their wallets . 95% of the world’s population lives outside USA, let’s go visit our true allies and send a message to our once true allies with our feet and wallets.
I can't stand Trump.
But there sure are a lot of optimistic Canadians for a country that is headed for a recession and that seems enthralled about losing the ally that has defended them for 80 years. Sure. Travel elsewhere. Go to Europe. Then come back and pay the bills in a declining economy while you give the middle finger to your neighbors, the vast majority of which still value you as neighbors though...
I can't stand Trump.
But there sure are a lot of optimistic Canadians for a country that is headed for a recession and that seems enthralled about losing the ally that has defended them for 80 years. Sure. Travel elsewhere. Go to Europe. Then come back and pay the bills in a declining economy while you give the middle finger to your neighbors, the vast majority of which still value you as neighbors though Canadians sure are changing that perception with Americans at an astounding rate.
I don't support these actions toward canada but you all seem to give 2 Sh*ts about how reliant you are on the US economy and how you seem to think simply transferring capacity to Europe or Mexico is going to make things the same, or even better. You guys need to see reality.
I have zero desire to do this to Canada. They're our friends, neighbors, and allies. but some of you seem weirdly ignorant about where your country is geographically.
Some Canadians seem blissfully ignorant about the state of their military and the reality of what Russia has been doing to your territory the last 30 years. Google it. Even your own government talks about it but just cut military funding as a percent of GDP even more. You know who has been deterring the Russians? Your own military isn't. It's the US. Your military is ancient.
I like our neighbors, but I have to admit it's kind of ridiculous how little you all care about your own territory and defense.
Some of you don't even seem to realize how much you're reliant on the USA for your defense. Your entire idea of geographical territory ownership is based off the Brits claiming white superiority and assuming no inuit or local populations should have a voice. Perhaps you all could not kidnap native Canadians to make them "white" and then claim some kind of moral superiority to your neighbors. You seem to ignore your own history in your supposed moral superiority.
But again. Since some of you live in a blissful foreign policy world (which even the UK finds you all stupid and strangely anti-American in your simplistic views about the world that have zero basis in pragmatism), that shouldn't make you a new state. No one voted for that in 2024 and I didn't even vote for the orange man.
Who do we need protection from? Our country is surrounded by three oceans, that's our best protection. The notion America has done any of the things it's done over the last 80 years for our benefit is laughable.
Close your eyes and pretend for one moment that another country’s leader threatened to annex america. How would americans feel, what would the uprising mean to Americans. But here you are calling Canadians blissfully ignorant and jumping on Trumps insult wagon on Canada & Canadians. Our error is we have failed as a nation to diversify the trade of our valuable natural resources . This is a must , business fail when they have a...
Close your eyes and pretend for one moment that another country’s leader threatened to annex america. How would americans feel, what would the uprising mean to Americans. But here you are calling Canadians blissfully ignorant and jumping on Trumps insult wagon on Canada & Canadians. Our error is we have failed as a nation to diversify the trade of our valuable natural resources . This is a must , business fail when they have a single customer, countries will as well. Here’s a news flash for you 95% of the worlds population lives the USA. This isnt planet USA. While you are the biggest super power, you closely managing to piss off much of the rest of the world and some how to you Julie, Canadas response to constant threats is not okay. Your critical lens on this issue is rather titled in the wrong direction. Just ask all the individuals in Canada who are about to lose their jobs because of YOUR leader.
Close your eyes and pretend for one moment that another country’s leader threatened to annex america. How would americans feel, what would the uprising mean to Americans. But here you are calling Canadians blissfully ignorant and jumping on Trumps insult wagon on Canada & Canadians. Our error is we have failed as a nation to diversify the trade of our valuable natural resources . This is a must , business fail when they have a...
Close your eyes and pretend for one moment that another country’s leader threatened to annex america. How would americans feel, what would the uprising mean to Americans. But here you are calling Canadians blissfully ignorant and jumping on Trumps insult wagon on Canada & Canadians. Our error is we have failed as a nation to diversify the trade of our valuable natural resources . This is a must , business fail when they have a single customer, countries will as well. Here’s a news flash for you 95% of the worlds population lives the USA. This isnt planet USA. While you are the biggest super power, you closely managing to piss off much of the rest of the world and some how to you Julie, Canadas response to constant threats is not okay. Your critical lens on this issue is rather titled in the wrong direction. Just ask all the individuals in Canada who are about to lose their jobs because of YOUR leader. And I’ll wait right here while you go find ONE instance where canada was attacked in anyway and required USA military to come to our rescue. One time in history? Oh there was that time we sent our troops in solidarity with USA to lose their lives in the Middle East. But you keep ignoring every contribution Canada has made to its once closest allies and go on with your one sided narrative.
Troll.
Enjoy your status as pariah state. Your military will start to lose a lot of orders that they been counting on for years. You've never had to defend anyone since WW2 (you were late to the game there by the way). But you are the only country to invoke the NATO mutual defense if attacked clause (Sept 11). The U.S. only ever acts out of self interest. And you insult all of your...
Troll.
Enjoy your status as pariah state. Your military will start to lose a lot of orders that they been counting on for years. You've never had to defend anyone since WW2 (you were late to the game there by the way). But you are the only country to invoke the NATO mutual defense if attacked clause (Sept 11). The U.S. only ever acts out of self interest. And you insult all of your past allies who served along side you in Afghanistan when you needed help. And died for the cause. A digusting take when others gave their lives.
If we were to create a list of the morality of the two nations, the U.S. would be 1st prize winner (as in morally questionable). I could mention about 40 (you didn't handle your native population very well either did you?) but how about I just mention one: Sandy Hook. What did you do about Sandy Hook? Absolutely nothing.
You are a pathetic individual. Funny how the U.S. is now the biggest threat to Canada. Try out our defence and see how we do. Oh sure you'll steamroller in early but then you'll lose interest as always (Vietnam, Afghanistan etc) and you won't like the attrition you'll suffer through the ensuing guerilla war. As in the past you'll run away with your tail between your legs. The last war you won was Grenada. So impressive.
Take your ugly American arrogance and put it where the sun don't shine.
I don’t see why anyone would want to come visit the US at this point. Why risk getting locked up on vacation? And the people going “we’ll be fine without them” yeah your shit town in the midwest no one wants to visit might be, but Canadian tourist dollars are a huge part of the economy in places like Florida, coastal areas of Texas, etc. Most tourist towns rely on a good summer to get...
I don’t see why anyone would want to come visit the US at this point. Why risk getting locked up on vacation? And the people going “we’ll be fine without them” yeah your shit town in the midwest no one wants to visit might be, but Canadian tourist dollars are a huge part of the economy in places like Florida, coastal areas of Texas, etc. Most tourist towns rely on a good summer to get them through the rest of the year, so even if things improve next year, a lot of businesses are pretty fucked. And the tariffs will take care of fucking over anyone who isn’t in a tourist town, don’t worry. We’re barreling straight towards a massive recession and Trump is just slamming his foot on the gas pedal.
Not a trump fan - or hater - but your statement is full of incorrect statements. Florida is overrun with tourists. Canada represents a few percentage points of tourism. And many are still coming.
Lol. No, Canadian represent over 30% of floridas tourist. The largest. And the bottom is falling out. A decline of just 2% of Canadian tourist in florida = 10,000 job losses. Not to mention you have pissed off the other nations who make up your tourist group as well. But dont believe the stats. Sit back and watch this shit show impact
Lets hope the cruise act gets amended.
People in Victoria absolutely hate hordes of American cruisers descending on their city. It would be nice to end that.
Is this the most commented OMAAT post ever?
If All of Canada stopped coming to the US, the US would still survive just fine, however I doubt Canada would...
No one wants to go to US. A country is so broken, divided and hopeless. Go fool y ourself you are just fine. PATHETIC
You clearly are not seeing the record crowds.
We’re going to vacation in England instead. We’re flying on a Canadian carrier. It’ll be a minimum of 4 years before I return to the US. I have American friends that are appalled that they got stuck with this felonious orange cancer
I thought Canada would be at least somewhat pleased with the offer that we will happily allow them to join the States with full democratic rights and statehood. We wouldn’t want any of the southern countries to join. Now it feels like they are just throwing it back in our faces and being rude to us.
keep it coming... we can get to 500!
We are a sovereign Country. Why would we want to join another country - that is just ludicrous. We certainly wouldn’t want to join one of the 3 most hated countries in the world. You have got to be a joker.
Wake up. No country wants to join you. NOT CANADA NOT GREENLAND. Learn to respect others and stop being rude.
Well maybe El Salvador would?
Or maybe some other shithole? Creat one mega shithole with the US?
just think we will have our own problems soon, as now we will have to BAIL OUT Air Canada when they have to cancel so many flights to USA
The economy will get smashed, you get what you vote for.
Yes. Canada already booted their PM
Lol, Hopefully ours goes away naturally after he crushes the economy. I want all asset classes crushed.
Lol, Hopefully ours goes away naturally after he crushes the economy. I want all asset classes crushed.
Tim Dunn, I finally see why others rightly point out how dumb you are
The PM stepped down and wasnt booted, and good thing he did. The election has been turned upside down. A month ago, the Cons and their slimy leader were assured of a majority. With the new PM, the Liberals will now have a 100% majority government.
Well, guess what will happen to Canadian Air Carriers? Nothing like seeing Canadians kill off their only hope of air travel in the future than by bankrupting them… not many US carriers fly to Canada due to the high cost the Canadian government imposes on them. You can’t have your boycott and expect your airlines to survive too.
Canadians are traveling just as much. They go to Europe, Mexico, Cuba, Dominican Republic, etc. The Canadian airlines are doing just fine with new routes.
So ru but actual scheduled capacity shows otherwise. Canadian airlines have moved nowhere near enough capacity to overcome a 70% decline to the US
Either this will all be shown to be a big hoax or Canadian airlines will lose a lot of money
Actually the Canadians that make up that 71% haven’t stopped flying Tim. They just stopped flying to the US. They are spending their dollars flying to Dominican, UK, Mexico etc and not in the US. We really do not care where we vacation and are having lots of new adventures. So Air Canada has dropped some flights to the US and picked them up in other locations. Not a loss at all. Thanks for your concern for us Canadians though. Much Appreciated.
Lol, do you think they spend more on their flight or their vacation?
Ya ding dong…. We’re just not traveling there. There is a whole other world out there to see ya know
Ignorant about Canadian Air Carriers? Can Porter fly across the Atlantic in their E-195s, NO. They will be the first airline in bankruptcy. Can Jazz? No, they too are a regional carrier. How about Flair? Nope, they just announced deep cuts to their flying. Air Transat just went through a bankruptcy. With exception of Westjets 787, they too rely on the USA market. Only Air Canada has a relatively diverse network, but they too have...
Ignorant about Canadian Air Carriers? Can Porter fly across the Atlantic in their E-195s, NO. They will be the first airline in bankruptcy. Can Jazz? No, they too are a regional carrier. How about Flair? Nope, they just announced deep cuts to their flying. Air Transat just went through a bankruptcy. With exception of Westjets 787, they too rely on the USA market. Only Air Canada has a relatively diverse network, but they too have a good percentage of US flights. You, the traveler may elect a non-US destination, but your airlines will suffer dearly vs US air carriers who have very little exposure to the Canadian market…
That’s rich
They’ll pivot to new routes people want to fly to. Case in point is Porter, who’s expanded domestic and international destinations, and scrapped US flights no one is buying.
You’d be better off directing your concern to US tourism markets which have already started to hemorrhage.
Canadians are some of the best travellers in the world this wont change. But heads up to a fact you might not know. 95% of the worlds population lives outside the USA. There is a whole planet out there and Canadians and Canadian airlines will change routes and increase flights to destinations Canadians will travel to , including domestically.
The unprovoked attack on Candian sovereignty by a Convicted Criminal, who regularly wears orange paint in an effort to disguise his unsightly appearance, will have far reaching effects on the American economy.
As Canada, and many other countries around the world adjust their economic partners, excluding the USA, American economic development will stagnate all thanks to the Orange MAGA cult now running American politics.
The mid-term elections offer the American population an opportunity...
The unprovoked attack on Candian sovereignty by a Convicted Criminal, who regularly wears orange paint in an effort to disguise his unsightly appearance, will have far reaching effects on the American economy.
As Canada, and many other countries around the world adjust their economic partners, excluding the USA, American economic development will stagnate all thanks to the Orange MAGA cult now running American politics.
The mid-term elections offer the American population an opportunity to adjust this incredible oversight in judgment.
Let's get that to 100%. Please stay there. Sincerely, Non-Communists of the World.
At first, I didn't want to go to the States this year just because I was mad at Trump. Now, you can add the risk of being "detained" for no reason with no due process. Forget it. I go down for vacation every year at least once for probably the last 20 years. Not any more. Next time I go it will be to piss on Donald Trump's grave.
I agree!
Hopefully that will be soon.
Good.
Go to any US International airport and look at the flocks of people coming off international flights and going through customs. Literally thousands every day.
Compare that to the few cases that are being publiceized by the media, and tell me that there’s a problem.
In every case presented by the media, these folks had prior convictions in the US.
And it’s not new to the trump administration. CBP has been revoking...
Go to any US International airport and look at the flocks of people coming off international flights and going through customs. Literally thousands every day.
Compare that to the few cases that are being publiceized by the media, and tell me that there’s a problem.
In every case presented by the media, these folks had prior convictions in the US.
And it’s not new to the trump administration. CBP has been revoking visas and flagging green cards at the airport for years.
You realize this article isn't about "isolated" cases of non-crowds at the airport, right? It's not as though Ben extrapolated the 70% downturn in bookings from a day trip to MIA?
It's about actual bookings being down 70% from real data. This is an issue. You can watch Fox News every day and think Hegseth has the coolest tattoos on earth (though they're really more the most white trash things I've ever seen on...
You realize this article isn't about "isolated" cases of non-crowds at the airport, right? It's not as though Ben extrapolated the 70% downturn in bookings from a day trip to MIA?
It's about actual bookings being down 70% from real data. This is an issue. You can watch Fox News every day and think Hegseth has the coolest tattoos on earth (though they're really more the most white trash things I've ever seen on skin). Go for it... but that doesn't change plain data that shows a very large shift in bookings.
Frankly, anyone would have to be a bit obtuse to not realize JVs work two ways -- to Europe and from Europe. AA/DL/UA all share those revenues going both directions with their respective partners. United also has a JV with AC that goes both ways between Canada and the US. Even if Americans are just DYING to go to Athens this year, it doesn't change that your average European seems FAR less likely to visit the US this year. That means the European Point of Sale will be significantly lower than normal.
And all of this completely ignores that, even if you think tariffs are god's gift to your future career in a 19th century steel plant, it doesn't change that nearly EVERYTHING you buy as an American is about to be 25% higher for the short term, at least. That infrastructure simply doesn't exist to replace much of what the tariffs will restrict. If you're all of a sudden paying 25% more for your Canadian oil/gas, your new Car, or the Canadian timber you use to build your new home in the suburbs of MJT's district, your ability to travel to Europe is just lower. This shouldn't be controversial. It isn't. If your goods are more expensive, a luxury like air travel isn't as in demand.
This is all a fun chat and some seem blindly gleeful at the VERY likely announcements coming during the airline first quarter earnings calls, but it's not going to be pretty. Airlines aren't stupid, even if you believe that tariffs will eventually make your life cheaper (hey, we can all dream), they're 100% going to make your life more expensive this summer. That means demand will absolutely be lower this summer meaning yields will be lower meaning either a cut in capacity or reallocation of existing capacity but all with fixed costs based on a different business plan for these carriers (i.e. more crew or more pilots than they needed but those costs don't go away).
This will cause dramatic changes for the Airline industry and the economy, not just in Canada and Europe, but especially in the US as we all pay significantly more than we did in October 2024 to the US government in the form of Tariffs. This is just an incremental tax on Americans with a hope and prayer from a team that has very few economists in the administration and certainly not one in the White House.
first, this is still a single snapshot for a single time period.
airline bookings are not falling off by 70%. Canadian arrivals for April won't even be off 70%.
If they were, AC and other Canadian airlines would be pulling down massive lines of credit and capactiy. 1/3 of AC's capacity is to the US.
When actual flown data comes in for more than just spring break, get back w/ us w/ that number. Or Ben should since he brought up the subject.
Keep dreaming, MAGA-Tim
Facts don't lie, just your brain.
This must be the only time you've been thrilled the DL-WS JV was denied due to Delta now giving up LGA slots. ;)
yeah... it was pretty smart of DL to get back those 8 slots that it had to give up.
and, yeah, a JV w/ a Canadian seems like a really bad idea. UA probably wishes it could cut the cord if things are as bad as many here act like it is.
I am still waiting for the flown traffic for April between the US and Canada. It won't be down 70%.
I'm glad. AMERICA is not safe. My family and I will not travel to the USA. Our dollars are better spent in Canada or with our allies, not in America
Does Canada still accept migrants trying to flee a brutal dictatorship? Asking for a friend.
https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/26/yale-professor-fascism-canada
I am not surprised at all by 75% reduction in flight bookings and it will get even worse. A majority of grocery & department stores now have large tags clearly indicating what is made in Canada, and American goods will see a huge loss of across border sales. Canadians are truly nice polite people, but when such terrible insults and exceedingly rude remarks are made about Canadians, they will have a very long memory of...
I am not surprised at all by 75% reduction in flight bookings and it will get even worse. A majority of grocery & department stores now have large tags clearly indicating what is made in Canada, and American goods will see a huge loss of across border sales. Canadians are truly nice polite people, but when such terrible insults and exceedingly rude remarks are made about Canadians, they will have a very long memory of this.
trump thinks that when he cancels the tariffs all will be well. It won't !!! Shame on America, shame on their politicians for not taking a stronger stand. I am part Canadian and I am ashamed of the U.S. Born in Niagara Falls, I have always seen tremendous goodwill on both sides.
In conclusion, Canada is probably one of the most respected countries in the world. What is wrong with trump (and vance). Shame on them. History in the long term will tell the truth re this idiot !!
I don't think it'll get that much lower; Americans are still flying to Canada and need flights to get back home.
I would rather spend my US dollars in Canada.
Canadian Jasmine Mooney: "One minute, I was in an immigration office talking to an officer about my work visa, which had been approved months before and allowed me, a Canadian, to work in the US. The next, I was told to put my hands against the wall, and patted down like a criminal before being sent to an Ice detention center without the chance to talk to a lawyer."
She was shackled and chained at...
Canadian Jasmine Mooney: "One minute, I was in an immigration office talking to an officer about my work visa, which had been approved months before and allowed me, a Canadian, to work in the US. The next, I was told to put my hands against the wall, and patted down like a criminal before being sent to an Ice detention center without the chance to talk to a lawyer."
She was shackled and chained at her ankles waist and wrists, thrown in an ICE prison cell for two weeks for no reason at all.
One of the biggest stories in Canada.
No wonder they don't want to cross the border.
ask Canadians about their country's relationship w/ India and China. anyone see a pattern?
Yes. Canada doesn’t sell out its principles every time a large economy engages in autocratic bullshit. Good for them.
Ask anyone (including Americans) about your own relationship with Russia and (yes) China!
we had hoped to get rid of the Liberals and the nightmares they have created. Oh well its will get worse before it gets better
I used to route Brazil to Europe via United States. I usually had more than 12 hours (usually a day) that I would go on a full shopping spree (eletronics, clothes,).
But I am afraid of being detained at the border (even though I have GE).
So now I will do Brazil to Europe via Canada.
you know you can fly direct to Europe, right?
Sorry. I wanted to be the 400th comment ;)
Perhaps the need to look at more flights across Canada.
Also add more flights to Europe and warm destinations.
If i go to visit my neighbor , and he throws me out with the vicious dogs, I will never return, That is exactly what happens in the USA now, you go to visit and they put you in jail and they deport you , It all depends on the mentality of the RAMBO Immigration officer on duty,... What an irony , The insecurity of a country is the government itself. Visit the USA!! Thanks but no Thanks.
Lol. I'm not surprised. Trump tariffs are a big deal to Canadian. This is what Canadian patriotism looks like vs. meaningless and silly American flag waving.
I do have to say. I love canada, but belittling normal Americans isn't a good look for anyone.
I have ZERO interest in land grab from Canada much less making them a 51st state, but Canada has existed as the 2nd largest geographic nation on earth with millions of Square miles of natural resources with little military or people to defend it for nearly 80 years now.
The reason for that is the...
I do have to say. I love canada, but belittling normal Americans isn't a good look for anyone.
I have ZERO interest in land grab from Canada much less making them a 51st state, but Canada has existed as the 2nd largest geographic nation on earth with millions of Square miles of natural resources with little military or people to defend it for nearly 80 years now.
The reason for that is the US that has historically deterred our common enemies and helped Canada defend large swathes of land that, by historical standards, such a small and militarily weak nation has never defended on their own for so long.
Maybe Canadians could cool it with their rhetoric. Get pissed off with Trump, sure, but the rest of us are getting a little annoyed how quickly Canadians are throwing away decades upon decades of friendship over the orange man. Many of us don't like him either. And he certainly DID NOT campaign on annexing Canada, I'll add.
To be clear, I realize Canada has existed for far more than 80 years. I was referencing the time the US and Canada have jointly defended North America.
well said.
thinking that Canadians are going way overboard w/ someone that has made his career in business and politics about stirring up controversy should learn how to deal those kinds of people.
seeing able to see the forest for the trees matters a whole lot.... and some clearly are not capable of doing that.
can we get to 500 before the end of the day?
Why would anyone invade Canada? We aren't a murderous cancer on Earth like the US, with its countless wars and coups that it imposes around the world.
Defend us from what? No one despises us. It's you that a majority of the world despises.
Stop with the BS "I love Canada". No, you don't. And it's mutual.
Canada has never benefited from US “defense.” It has benefitted from the US not wanting to invade it, I suppose. But no one else was ever going to invade Canada but for US “defense.”
You’re an idiot if you think the US hasn’t defended Canada. Truly stupid. What do you think norad is and does?
But live your fantasy foreign policy. You go running to the UK that has been in lockstep with most US foreign policy for decades and in many cases the ones convincing the US to act in these policies you despise
I have nothing against our northern neighbors, but many of you truly live in...
You’re an idiot if you think the US hasn’t defended Canada. Truly stupid. What do you think norad is and does?
But live your fantasy foreign policy. You go running to the UK that has been in lockstep with most US foreign policy for decades and in many cases the ones convincing the US to act in these policies you despise
I have nothing against our northern neighbors, but many of you truly live in a fantastical reality brought about by the defense your southern neighbor provides
I guess tRUMP didn't expect Canadians to fight back.
Elbows up, eh.
Little brother popping off about it's #22 world GNP status..kinda cute
We cancelled our March 3 week family vacation (6 people) to Florida
Just couldn’t handle the 51st state disrespect
Sweet! We'll be fine though. Enjoy the Northern Territory.
Love,
America
Or enjoy the Caribbean, Mexico, South America, Europe...
Love and keep it up!
Rest of the World
Enjoy the coming job losses in the coming weeks! Lol. Don't mess with your number one spending customers. In the end it's bad for USA and Canada. Trump and his cabinet are incompetent idiots! Dumbest trade war in history. China is loving this
Good argument but stop trying to convince this person with words and logic. All they see is its “it’s the media’s fault”. I doubt they read your reply because they would have to put down their beer first then think a bit.
As someone who owns rental properties in Florida, I don't think this is sweet, and I don't think you understand that this hurts us and not them
This Northern Territory is really nice in the summer so yeah, we will.
I like this mutual respect between northern Canadians and southern Canadians.
gg does not speak for all Americans, and quite frankly, we'll not be fine with Herr Drumpf in the White House.
Sad to hear you're not not coming tho. Consider the Cayman Islands as an alternative.
Great 6 less people in Florida
In life we should cherish our neighbors whenever possible. Never know what you might need. When these relationships are damaged it's not so easy to fix. Many here seem to think it's a completely transactional with Canada. I believe the damage done is not all tariffs but something quite different. Respect and pride repair will take a some groveling I fear. So the boycott will continue on, in the end taking down small and independent...
In life we should cherish our neighbors whenever possible. Never know what you might need. When these relationships are damaged it's not so easy to fix. Many here seem to think it's a completely transactional with Canada. I believe the damage done is not all tariffs but something quite different. Respect and pride repair will take a some groveling I fear. So the boycott will continue on, in the end taking down small and independent hospitality businesses. From there the spiral will continue. Sad.
Holy hell, cry harder snowflake!
No snowflake here. Just someone understands the value of respect. I see that escapes you.
As a Canadian and an American, worked very hard to become American and now the rest of Canada has the opportunity to also become American, count yourself lucky, America is better than Canada in ever way, yea people will day fee healthcare, no you pay with it in 15-25 more in taxes and a 50% reduced salary for the same jobs and less of those jobs... This is all just a pure emotional response.
Wow, that's rich coming from someone who apparently is in the cult of the president who does literally nothing but cry and complain. He is the snowflake in chief.
I am really surprised that the drop is at 70%! A little worried as I have two Air Canada pilots in the family....
the actual flown capacity very likely is NOT going to be 70%. Measuring advance bookings at one point in time.
I challenge Ben to come back w/ the load factor and flown capacity on all US-Canada flights for the same period the data in this article covers.
I doubt it will happen but that would be the only rational and honest way to approach this topic.
It was clearly never Ben's objective to have a...
the actual flown capacity very likely is NOT going to be 70%. Measuring advance bookings at one point in time.
I challenge Ben to come back w/ the load factor and flown capacity on all US-Canada flights for the same period the data in this article covers.
I doubt it will happen but that would be the only rational and honest way to approach this topic.
It was clearly never Ben's objective to have a data-driven discussion but rather to have an emotionally driven response to a few select data points.
I challenge Tim Dunn to never come back.
I would like to know if the demand is bilateral or unilateral. In other words, is the demand lower only amongst Canadians traveling to the US, or does it go both ways?
We booked a flight from Toronto to Paris on Air Canada, but we live in Buffalo. It's much easier for us to fly from Pearson than LaGuardia or another east coast airport. What the US is doing to Canada is insane.
I was going to Vagas for a week. Not anymore.
I feel the tensions will subsided in time.
The USA cannot be the Mom and Dad with deep pockets forever to most countries in this world.
I love Canada and have a home there as well. I have always paid our fair share of taxes to Canada with no regrets at all.
I pray all subsides soon and that everyone can enjoy life. Life is fleeting, death is certain!
"The USA cannot be the Mom and Dad with deep pockets forever to most countries in this world...."
Funny how the decision to actually stick their nose in throughout history is nearly always America's idea and not the rest of the world asking them to show up.
Stick their nose in throughout history? Would think you'd be grateful we did a couple of times in the 20th century or you'd all be speaking German right now.
I am American, I love Canda and love Europe. But it's a difficult argument that we spend our tax dollars to defend the rest of the world so Canada and Europe can supply their citizens with a social safety net that we don't have.
While I...
Stick their nose in throughout history? Would think you'd be grateful we did a couple of times in the 20th century or you'd all be speaking German right now.
I am American, I love Canda and love Europe. But it's a difficult argument that we spend our tax dollars to defend the rest of the world so Canada and Europe can supply their citizens with a social safety net that we don't have.
While I am not thrilled with the rhetoric by either the US or Canada government, these are discussions that should be had.
@David Canada would be speaking German? That's a stretch. Are you grateful that Canada sent (and lost) troops to Iraq and Afghanistan on our behalf after 9/11?
You say we spend our tax dollars so Canada and Europe can have a social safety net that we don't have. Umm...if you vote Republican, you vote against a safety net. It's not because of Canada, it's because of greedy politicians. America could have a robust social...
@David Canada would be speaking German? That's a stretch. Are you grateful that Canada sent (and lost) troops to Iraq and Afghanistan on our behalf after 9/11?
You say we spend our tax dollars so Canada and Europe can have a social safety net that we don't have. Umm...if you vote Republican, you vote against a safety net. It's not because of Canada, it's because of greedy politicians. America could have a robust social safety net, Republicans vote against it every time.
Additionally, Canada and European countries tax their residents much more heavily to pay for those safety nets. If you want more social protections, demand the wealthy pay their fair share of taxes. Stop picking fights with our allies, especially when so uninformed about how they pay for things.
The USA has structured trade this way to ensure global dependence on its dollar. A successful strategy to date.
However, if it is successful in driving away “complacent” trade partners it will only serve to strengthen the Euro, Yuan and even Sterling.
A weaker dollar may improve export markets, but not in an environment of tariff wars
You nailed it.. once the dependence on US dollar goes away, what is the value of US $? Can we keep on printing as much as we want without inflation? If Europe, Canada, China & Russia starts trading oil in some basket currency, US is doomed.
Keeping the world dependent on us keeps our economy afloat... Reagan and every other president that came after him understood it...
your vision of mom and dad is ridiculous. We are the richest and most powerful country in the worldf. We didn't get there by being "mom and Dad". We got there by being better educated, amart, hard working, FREEDOM to accept diversification, hire best minds from around the world, being a bully when it got us what we wanted, and looking after number one. The idea that the world is taking advantage of poor U.S.A....
your vision of mom and dad is ridiculous. We are the richest and most powerful country in the worldf. We didn't get there by being "mom and Dad". We got there by being better educated, amart, hard working, FREEDOM to accept diversification, hire best minds from around the world, being a bully when it got us what we wanted, and looking after number one. The idea that the world is taking advantage of poor U.S.A. ignores the reality of our position. I know that the "everybody is picking on me" sells to people of limited emotional understanding but holy cow who is the richest most powerful country in the world. How can you think that we are some poor, defenseless, stupid, country that the other wicked countries are misusing!
So sad. We really need them and they need us. What to do?
Drain the swamp in the 2025 White House would be a good start. No-one wants to work with those pricks.
Your administration and fellow citizens are turning off an entire generation of Canadians. Check this out.
https://torontolife.com/real-estate/real-estate-florida-snowbirds-fleeing-trump-tariffs/
More than tariffs, snowbirds are fleeing mistreatment.. We are well known for being polite and kind. When we are treated unfairly or harassed, perhaps we will bite our tongue …but it will take a whole lot of diplomacy to convince us to visit again. Your administration is vilifying Canada and that will be very difficult for...
Your administration and fellow citizens are turning off an entire generation of Canadians. Check this out.
https://torontolife.com/real-estate/real-estate-florida-snowbirds-fleeing-trump-tariffs/
More than tariffs, snowbirds are fleeing mistreatment.. We are well known for being polite and kind. When we are treated unfairly or harassed, perhaps we will bite our tongue …but it will take a whole lot of diplomacy to convince us to visit again. Your administration is vilifying Canada and that will be very difficult for America to repair.
We are not vilifying Canadians, we still love Canadians regardless of your intransigent government whipping you up into an emotional fervor. We are able to separate people and their governments and recognize they are different entities, apparently you are not. Good luck to you all, you are going to need it!
We do see that Americans differ from their government, but heck you guys voted the idiot in. Among republicans Trump has a significant majority who think he is doing a good job.
You let him try to overthrow your government by any means necessary, you let him make a mockery of your system of justice
You have the intransigent government and we have the rule of law and diplomacy on our side and the respect of the rest of the world which your country is losing
Dan77W. I promise you, Dan, I have family in Ontario, and it is NOT the politicians ramping up the Canadian citizens. It is individual nice people who have been insulted beyond anything in their past! What trump has done is just terrible. Canadians are so hurt by this.
Canadian here. And no, I have not been "whipped up by my intransigent government". ( Frankly that sounds like what Trump does to his MAGA trolls.) I am personally incensed that Trump has set tariffs in contravention of the USMCA trade deal he negotiated and signed. Canada is a loyal ally that has spilled blood in American wars specifically Afghanistan and Korea. We don't deserve to be economically attacked or threatened with annexation by a...
Canadian here. And no, I have not been "whipped up by my intransigent government". ( Frankly that sounds like what Trump does to his MAGA trolls.) I am personally incensed that Trump has set tariffs in contravention of the USMCA trade deal he negotiated and signed. Canada is a loyal ally that has spilled blood in American wars specifically Afghanistan and Korea. We don't deserve to be economically attacked or threatened with annexation by a bully in the White House. I will never travel to a red state again and will wait and see about going to blue states once Trump is out of office.
Suzanne, I think it's awful how Trump is speaking about Canada and Canadians, I truly do.
However, this has gone from Trump's normal inability to control his mouth to now Canadians completing ruining my view of them and their reputation. I fully understand why you all would be upset with trump but, to be blunt, most americans have been listening to his bluster for almost ten years now and we deal with it. If you...
Suzanne, I think it's awful how Trump is speaking about Canada and Canadians, I truly do.
However, this has gone from Trump's normal inability to control his mouth to now Canadians completing ruining my view of them and their reputation. I fully understand why you all would be upset with trump but, to be blunt, most americans have been listening to his bluster for almost ten years now and we deal with it. If you think the US congress has any desire to invade Canada, you're kidding yourself, certainly a vast majority of the US congress has no desire for that and would stop Trump from that action, I believe.
Perhaps you all don't care and view the EU as your future, but perhaps dial down the rhetoric before an entire generation of Americans gets sick and tired of defending Canada just to have them throw it in our face when we have an idiot in the white house. There are real countries that violate your territorial integrity all the time. The US is the one that has deterred Russia with you and protected Canadian territory for decades including very recently.
Take a look at the meager Canadian military spend all the while you love to joke about American healthcare that we can't afford.
It gets old.
I would guess the current vibes of Canada-US relations are doing 65-70% of the damage, and an absolutely brutal CAD-USD exchange rate is doing the rest.
Tourists visting the US are not getting handcuffed and deported. Such comments come from radical people who prefer a wide open border under the last President. That doest have anything due to tourism. If Canadiens dont want to come here, we should not bother going there either. If they want to freeze in the winter and not come to FL , there will be less traffic from cars driving 30mph. Shorter lines at the theme parks.
right on... congestion on I-75 in Detroit and Atlanta is already better if we believe some people here and I doubt anyone in those cities is complaining
There is an entire planet out there with warm weather outside of the USA to travel too. Those numbers will dramatically increase. Additionally business conferences are being directed to other counties. Canada ,is USA largest tourist group and many states GDP is primarily tourism , this will matter. Job losses will commence quickly. The poorer Canadian dollar is somewhat of an influence but it’s been lower and is not what is driving this. florida home...
There is an entire planet out there with warm weather outside of the USA to travel too. Those numbers will dramatically increase. Additionally business conferences are being directed to other counties. Canada ,is USA largest tourist group and many states GDP is primarily tourism , this will matter. Job losses will commence quickly. The poorer Canadian dollar is somewhat of an influence but it’s been lower and is not what is driving this. florida home listing are sky rocketing as Canadian snow birds find alternative destinations . This may be a shock to USA people but it isnt to Canadians as they have learned who their true allies are now.
Said by someone who clearly has nothing to lose when the Canadians stay home. Those tourists not coming (shorter lines) means lost money for the people who depend on them.
They go to Mexico you fool. lol
I hope lots of people lose their jobs.
When shall we start seeing a reduction of airline and hotel prices globally... That's what I'm looking for. If there is a material drop, I just may take a trip somewhere...
If Canadians do not want to travel to the US then they will travel elsewhere. Canadian airlines will simply shift capacity to somewhere else, mainly Europe.
US Carriers aren't that exposed to Canada to make a material difference. Moreover, Americans will simply also travel somewhere else and airlines will shift capacity.
Capacity shifts all the time based on a number of factors. Political instability, weather, currency movements, etc.
This is nothing more than the wokies...
If Canadians do not want to travel to the US then they will travel elsewhere. Canadian airlines will simply shift capacity to somewhere else, mainly Europe.
US Carriers aren't that exposed to Canada to make a material difference. Moreover, Americans will simply also travel somewhere else and airlines will shift capacity.
Capacity shifts all the time based on a number of factors. Political instability, weather, currency movements, etc.
This is nothing more than the wokies getting their panties into a bind. Other than the moronic far left no family is putting aside vacation plans because Trump made a remark about Canada becoming the 51st state. Grow up people.
well said other than that Canadian airline capacity will be redeployed elsewhere.
Many Canada-US capacity is on narrowbody aircraft which cannot realistically fly beyond N. America. Canadian airlines can shift capacity to the Caribbean and Mexico but drops in demand to the US will lead to more economic harm to Canadians than to Americans.
and Air Canada's business plan is heavily dependent on siphoning off US demand to fill its transoceanic flights from Canada...
well said other than that Canadian airline capacity will be redeployed elsewhere.
Many Canada-US capacity is on narrowbody aircraft which cannot realistically fly beyond N. America. Canadian airlines can shift capacity to the Caribbean and Mexico but drops in demand to the US will lead to more economic harm to Canadians than to Americans.
and Air Canada's business plan is heavily dependent on siphoning off US demand to fill its transoceanic flights from Canada to Asia, Europe and beyond including S. America.
Economies shift, demand shifts. Airlines will adapt. consumers will do what economically makes sense.
snowflakes will melt. they always do
No one is putting aside vacation plans, merely altering them and travelling to far friendlier countries. Also do you even know what the definition of "woke" is?
I thought not.
Yeah, I agree.
There are plenty of places to explore in ruzzia – the only U.S. ally pretty soon.
First, it is clear that Ben desperately wants to prove that the Trump administration is wrong and he managed to find an isolated data point to prove his point.
Perhaps there will be lasting economic damage to tourism but that is unlikely. and the data point that was used to justify the article - and get some people wound up - on both sides of the argument - doesn't show it.
and second, Canadian airlines...
First, it is clear that Ben desperately wants to prove that the Trump administration is wrong and he managed to find an isolated data point to prove his point.
Perhaps there will be lasting economic damage to tourism but that is unlikely. and the data point that was used to justify the article - and get some people wound up - on both sides of the argument - doesn't show it.
and second, Canadian airlines carry 2/3 of the traffic to the US. They will be hurt far more than US airlines. And they cannot redeploy all of what is cut to international routes or to elsewhere in Canada because much of the transborder capacity is on narrowbody aircraft which only work for a handful of Canada-Europe flights.
and third, the stock market is far more rational than 99% of the comments here. DAL and UAL stock is down about 20% since the start of the year. AC and AAL stock are both down over 30%. LUV is one of the few airline stocks that is positive year to date based on it predominantly a domestic airline and also because it is implementing strategies that investors believe will turn it around in 2025 and beyond.
Tariffs on the auto industry are far more consequential to global trade - not just for US-Canada but also for other nations.
A higher percentage of automobiles sold in Canada were built in Mexico than were built in Canada. Asian manufacturers - including from China - dominate the Canadian automobile market.
Whether you like him or not, Trump recognizes that the power of western economies no longer is based on service industries including tourism but on their ability to manufacture what they consume.
Auto manufacturers have move more and more auto production to Mexico even if those use US and Canadian parts.
It is Mexico that is far more exposed in Trump's tariff threats and yet most of the manufacturers that build cars in Mexico also have US plants that - in time - they can shift production to.
Canada's economy is far weaker than the US' and the latest shots will hurt Canada. Canada needs to fix what is wrong w/ the Canadian economy. Running to Mexico or the Caribbean instead of the US won't fix anything that needs to be fixed in Canada.
Economics will ultimately determine the outcome of all of this - for Canadian consumers and for the US and Canada and Mexico.
Being insulted by another country's president might hurt but the reaction is and will be irrational.
Shut up ChatBot
Lot of smart republicans and democrats in the world, but Tim Dunn being hardcore maga explains so much. Given your personal life, it's even more amusing that you have such self-loathing.
Is Aerob13 also maga or is he a Nigel Farage guy?
No wonder you don't let facts and data bother you, it's your entire life.
The only issue "Trump is trying to address" is his own solvency. He's doing this to make money for Trump and settle some scores, because he's a vindictive arsehole. No other reason and certainly not because he's trying to benefit the rest of Americans.
Does Tim Dunn ever shut up? So many boards, so much baloney.
Well Ben now knows that if he finds a MAGA travel related story and even better if it has a DL narrative he’s got his daily click quota .
You really think this kind of rhetoric is helpful and that citizens in these countries will not have a change of view regarding encounters ;
Latest post from Trump;
"If the European Union works with Canada in order to do economic harm to the USA, large scale tariffs, far larger than currently planned, will be placed on them both in order to protect the best friend that each of those two countries has ever had!"
Well stated and factual
I am not that surprised ... there is a huge push back to traveling to the USA here in Canada right now due to tariffs and 51st state talk going on right now. The weakness of the Canadian dollar as well as cases of people having problems at the border and snowbird registration etc. that have been in the press also add to sentiment to stay away from the USA right now. Until things improve,...
I am not that surprised ... there is a huge push back to traveling to the USA here in Canada right now due to tariffs and 51st state talk going on right now. The weakness of the Canadian dollar as well as cases of people having problems at the border and snowbird registration etc. that have been in the press also add to sentiment to stay away from the USA right now. Until things improve, Canadians are planning to spend their vacations in Canada or other International destinations and sunseekers are looking to Mexico, the Caribbean instead of Florida and Arizona. It's not only air traffic that is down, land crossings into the USA by car are also at levels seen during Covid.
That being said the OAG data doesn't include direct bookings on airline websites so the -70% is not reflective of the overall market number.....but as far as leisure travel from Canada is concerned, many are holding off booking for the summer and/ or looking at alternative destinations.
Most of us in the US are appalled at what is happening in our country and the negative effects on people all over the world.
Um, no we aren't. America first, always!
Yes we are.
@gg: As an American, I am appalled.
Re: “Um, no we aren't. America first, always!”
John Cleese (A Fish Called Wanda, Fawlty Towers):
I don't think that Trump supporters care about what the rest of the world thinks.
That's because they don't know where the rest of the world is.
The US is a scary place for many people. Even citizens.
That’s because you are hysterical Peggy.
No she isn't. She is being realistic.
You should try it.
Really - If you are here illegally it is scary - not if you are legal. You are just a mindless drone listening to whatever fools tell you and you believe it - hook, line and sinker - maybe you should learn to think for yourself and not be so scared and believe everything that you weak loser democratic leaders tell you.
It is about time the US - starts to worry about the US...
Really - If you are here illegally it is scary - not if you are legal. You are just a mindless drone listening to whatever fools tell you and you believe it - hook, line and sinker - maybe you should learn to think for yourself and not be so scared and believe everything that you weak loser democratic leaders tell you.
It is about time the US - starts to worry about the US first. If you put tariffs on our goods it is only fair that we put them on yours - it is called fair trade.
As the author wrote ‘I knew it was bad, but I didn’t expect it would be that bad…”
That number far exceeds my expectations too, but the reasons are only too clear to see for all.
It’s not only the new tariffs that fly in the face of what once was called NAFTA that was renegotiated during Donald Trump’s first term into the United States–Mexico–Canada Agreement (USMCA).
It’s also the newly aggressive United States...
As the author wrote ‘I knew it was bad, but I didn’t expect it would be that bad…”
That number far exceeds my expectations too, but the reasons are only too clear to see for all.
It’s not only the new tariffs that fly in the face of what once was called NAFTA that was renegotiated during Donald Trump’s first term into the United States–Mexico–Canada Agreement (USMCA).
It’s also the newly aggressive United States Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) attitude that has seen Canadian and European citizens arrested, kept in custody for several days or weeks, and then. deported for what used to be considered minor infractions.
All that serves as a deterrent to travel to or even via the United States.
Airlines will respond by downscaling the equipment when warranted and on lower demand routes terminating services.
I would also expect that many of those passengers who might once have travelled on US carriers will now prefer to travel on non-US carriers in a new-found gesture of patriotism.
Of course, airlines is only part of the picture, you can imagine what it will do to the hospitality business in US tourist destinations.
Am surprised that Trump hasn't nominated Kristi Noem to also be in charge of tourism and Marjorie Taylor Greene in charge of Arts and Culture.
MTG has been on Sky News and said ''We don’t give a crap about your opinion and your reporting'' to a British reporter. She should crawl under her rock with the rest of every other republican nazi.
The US government are absolute fascists, and we need to boycott...
Am surprised that Trump hasn't nominated Kristi Noem to also be in charge of tourism and Marjorie Taylor Greene in charge of Arts and Culture.
MTG has been on Sky News and said ''We don’t give a crap about your opinion and your reporting'' to a British reporter. She should crawl under her rock with the rest of every other republican nazi.
The US government are absolute fascists, and we need to boycott the world cup next year and potentially the Olympics in 28, let alone us companies.
Cry harder snowflake
Exactly this, Europe and the wider world has not yet felt the impact of any potential tariffs, once it starts to impact the general public there will be issues. It wouldn’t surprise me if later on Trump includes a cessation of Visa Waiver as another tool in his arsenal.
Also the daily threats to Canada's very existence.
Considering Donald Trump won the popular vote, clearly "most of us" are in fact not appalled.
"...seen Canadian and European citizens arrested, kept in custody..." Please provide a source for this.
Try reading overseas newspapers (e.g The Guardian), or watching TV stations that are not FoxTV (e.g BBC, CBC, etc.).
They all are in English BTW.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/u-s-detention-of-european-and-canadian-tourists-creates-fear-over-traveling-to-america
Air Canada is asleep at the wheel and have not made changes that will see them get through this downturn. WestJet has flights to Central America that bypass the US but Air Canada uses the US as it's hub. This will come to not them in the behind very soon.
Air Canada has long been screwing over Canadians and price gouging us. They sell cheap ex-US flights to Europe and Asia to fill their (dirty) planes.
They deserve anything thats coming their way if US traffic collapses
Ben maybe it is time you start putting timeout on comments by registered users? I know TD provides engagement but at what cost? Creating brain rot and anger amongst the community! I love your blog and you are free to post anything but you have to be on top of TF and his delusions. It is annoying and the only thing I don’t like about his website
You realize half of the commenters are equally obsessed with him right?
Half the time you have people salivating for him to show up before he even types a letter and the other half of the time, they type back in an equally obsessive manner in real time.
People need to stop acting like they're above it when they're just as bad.
LOL, do you believe your brain rot has to do with paragraphs of Tim or you actually consuming Tim's fluff give you brain rot.
No one is forcing you. You're just equally obsessed with him like the rest of us.
The difference is many of us accept his OCDelta mental issues.
You on the other hand let your brain rot.
@Eskimo how do you agree while insult the people you agree with? No wonder a lot of people put you in the same boat as TD, you are insufferable. And please learn grammar if you cannot understand the nuances of sentences. Do better
@Eve
Learn grammar, why do I. Me not grampar. His job to learn about grammar not me.
Learn to reed, you should.
Agree with you, I have not.
Insult you, that I have.
Brain rot, that you have.
Dysfunctional Tim Dunn fan, you are.
And I'm just doing this to help Ben with clicks and engagements. The least I could do at 5/24.
@yolo
you're hardly one to talk on the matter.
Not really, you're literally one of the top Tim Dunn Derangement Syndrome users here. You pretend to hate it so much, but reply back to him endlessly.
It's hypocritical at best and equally delusional to think you're any better than him.
Actions have consequences, and airline bottom lines will be hurt as will the hotels and restaurants which have depended upon travel to the US by Canadians. This observation is Economics 101 and not Political Science 101 (although someone failing Economics is unlikely to do well in Political Science either).
How can we benefit from this? Lower fares? Points deals? Empty flights?
Are there good deals flying USA/Europe via Canada? Or Canada/Europe transiting USA?
“We don’t give a crap about your opinion and your reporting. Why don’t you go back to your country,” Marjorie Taylor Greene addressing a UK journalist today. This isn’t going to end with Canada.
MTG is a 100% pure, base distillation of MAGA douchebaggery at its most primitive and repulsive. The question is why a British journalist is wasting time asking questions of that frothing, batshit crazy piece of fly-speck when there are people of real consequence they should be talking to. Jewish space-lasers, Marjorie! Whooooo! MAGAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!
In fairness to MTG, she represents her district of northern Georgia quite well.
MAGA fan, cheated on her husband with her Tatted up personal trainer, tells people to "go back to their country"... she couldn't be more representative of her district. The only thing that would've been more on point is Delta using her as their 1950s flight attendant model in the new safety video. She's pretty much the essence of corporate delta racism in the 50s.
I am a Captain with a major Canadian airline and I don't agree. Every flight I have been doing from Canada to the USA since these tariffs were threatened until 2 days ago has been full, or at worst 90% capacity, this is from every region in Canada. You can draw your own conclusions as to why this is being reported otherwise.
Have you checked load factors on every airline for the past month ?
I believe the author was discussing future bookings into the summer. And I would expect airlines would try to fill each flight but fly fewer of them so the flight crew should still see fullish flights while overall demand drags.
Agree, 70% down?? Does not make any sense. I recently flew back from Toronto back home to Las Vegas on Air Canada and it was a full flight.
Hmm who should I trust? A random person on the internet who says they are a captain of a major Canadian airline, or cold, hard data by a trusted company? hmmm...
@Fudencio
Most feedback I received points to people trusting a human pilot more than computerized hard data.
I usually go to the USA at least twice per year. I will never go again as I consider the USA an enemy. Only an enemy would say they would weaken us to make annexation easier.
Go or not. It makes no difference to us. We'll be ok.
Let's not forget plenty of Canadian residents aren't citizens, but rather Permanent Resident status holders (akin to a Green Card), or on long-term study or work permits, hailing from China, India, Iran, the Philippines, and so on. Even if they may have multiple-entry US visitor visas, they may be extremely cautious where it comes to travelling to the US anytime soon. Hence drop in flight bookings, but also in simple land border crossings.
AC...
Let's not forget plenty of Canadian residents aren't citizens, but rather Permanent Resident status holders (akin to a Green Card), or on long-term study or work permits, hailing from China, India, Iran, the Philippines, and so on. Even if they may have multiple-entry US visitor visas, they may be extremely cautious where it comes to travelling to the US anytime soon. Hence drop in flight bookings, but also in simple land border crossings.
AC is switching capacity to domestic, as many of us will opt for trips across Canada, rather than south.
Great to see the Canadians put their money where their mouth is. Why should they come here? We deserve this. Just too bad that, as usual with Trump et al, ordinary people will suffer the most.
I hope we see the same stats out of Europe and Asia. If I was a person of color I would think 10x before planning a trip here.
The Republican administration seems to be doing great things for the environment! Less plane travel is excellent news for CO2 emissions, as is less international shipping. No environmental activist could accomplish this level of greatness.
Wait till Europe to the US gets the same way - it WILL happen
When China put embargoes on Australian exports of wine, fresh seafood, beef, and other products, Aussie producers realised that they’d become complacently over-dependent on the Chinese market, and had to get out there and start developing new markets. The world will soon learn the same lessons about selling to the United States. It will be tough to wean from a market of 330 million voracious consumers, but things will pick up, and it won’t be...
When China put embargoes on Australian exports of wine, fresh seafood, beef, and other products, Aussie producers realised that they’d become complacently over-dependent on the Chinese market, and had to get out there and start developing new markets. The world will soon learn the same lessons about selling to the United States. It will be tough to wean from a market of 330 million voracious consumers, but things will pick up, and it won’t be the end of the world. Be careful not to overplay your hand, America - it won’t take long for everyone to realise they can actually live without you.
Yes, it seems Canadians for once took the lead in embargoing the US, but I fully expect citizens of European and possibly Asian countries to follow.
I’m actually finding it kind of sad some posters on here, seem to think Canada ranks of equal importance to Russia or China in the hierarchy of the world diplomatic power brokers.
In economic and population scale REALITY, Canadian importance ranks even behind the failed liberalism and mediocrity of the state of California.
This cannot be chalked up to TDS, but maybe a complete lack of wisdom and insight upon the true size of...
I’m actually finding it kind of sad some posters on here, seem to think Canada ranks of equal importance to Russia or China in the hierarchy of the world diplomatic power brokers.
In economic and population scale REALITY, Canadian importance ranks even behind the failed liberalism and mediocrity of the state of California.
This cannot be chalked up to TDS, but maybe a complete lack of wisdom and insight upon the true size of the air travel market that is actually being affected between the US and Canada.
The Canadian Airline industry will be interesting to watch during the next nine months in my opinion as we see which way the chips may fall.
Canada's GDP is higher than Russia - but here you are
Also far more integrated with the US economy and supply chains, lol.
“Also far more integrated with the US economy and supply chains…”
Quite true and I think this the reason why many Canadians are so upset with the Trump administration. Years ago, NAFTA was sold to them as an integrated economic market (just look at the automotive industry) that during Trump’s first turn it was scaled down and renamed and is now killed with presidential decrees that fly in the face of NATFA’s spirit. Sure, he...
“Also far more integrated with the US economy and supply chains…”
Quite true and I think this the reason why many Canadians are so upset with the Trump administration. Years ago, NAFTA was sold to them as an integrated economic market (just look at the automotive industry) that during Trump’s first turn it was scaled down and renamed and is now killed with presidential decrees that fly in the face of NATFA’s spirit. Sure, he has the right to do so, but people feel cheated and the cross-border production chains are in tatters.
Fun fact, that failed state of California has the 5th largest GDP in the world.
Reading comprehension fact, Klima referred to the "failed liberalism" of CA not it's GDP.
I was just pointing out that for a state that suffers from “failed liberalism and mediocrity” they have a GDP that is greater than India, the UK, France, Italy and even your mother Russia.
California is exceptionally prosperous and contributes/subsidizes more financially to the U.S. than it takes on nearly every measure.
As for Canada, your analysis is rather poor when you consider Canada exceeds Russia in total GDP and trailing growth. But even if it didn’t, your statements are still pretty disingenuous. Canada has been the U.S.’s steadfast friend and neighbor. We somehow decided to start a trade war and spew nastiness toward our ally for basically...
California is exceptionally prosperous and contributes/subsidizes more financially to the U.S. than it takes on nearly every measure.
As for Canada, your analysis is rather poor when you consider Canada exceeds Russia in total GDP and trailing growth. But even if it didn’t, your statements are still pretty disingenuous. Canada has been the U.S.’s steadfast friend and neighbor. We somehow decided to start a trade war and spew nastiness toward our ally for basically no reason. If there were issues, diplomacy would solve them. But instead we double and triple down on “51st state rhetoric.” Can you imagine how deeply angry the U.S. would be if someone spewed such deep disrespect our way, with no provocation?
Another loser MAGA Republican with false facts.
These numbers are all based on a single GDS. Don’t you find it at least possible that the discrepancy could also be in part due to other variables (I.e. airlines moving to NDC which may cause shift in the numbers between Sabre/Amadeus/TravelPort YoY), especially when we’re only looking at a single undisclosed GDS?
Retired AC here. Oh how I wish I had still had access to AC's advance booking reports!
I haven't seen much of a reduction by AC - generally AC reacts quickly and has the ability to do so - downgrade equipment, sub to Rouge, cancel flights. Not much so far.
The 25% auto tariffs imposed by their Dear Leader is not only further going to harm traffic but will also throw the US into a complete recession.
Good, we could use a good recession. Truck payments are like mortgages right now. Bring it on!
Wow..so fortunate to come across a retired pilot who is also a professional economist. Thanks for insight..dumping all my stock now !!
Maybe if the airlines slashed the price of airline tickets, and or luggage prices, it might be an incentive for people to book flights again to the USA. Something is better than nothing isn't it? After all the airlines should have plenty of cash from never honouring refunds for cancellations and delays.
My wife and I were planning a Niagara Falls-Toronto-Montreal-Quebec road trip this summer, but are postponing. We’re not concerned about safety, but we don’t want to be around people who are hostile to Americans right now. *We just got back from an 11-day trip to England/Scotland. The British were very friendly and welcoming.
Exactly what Benedict Arnold said about the British.
It is comical to read these obituaries of the USA economy. As a preface, I love Canada and its people, but Canada has to read the room and understand that all of this boycotting will only hurt their country more then it will the one to the south. Carney will win the snap election and he will be the 'hero' that pushes back against Donald Trump. In the process, he will send his economy into...
It is comical to read these obituaries of the USA economy. As a preface, I love Canada and its people, but Canada has to read the room and understand that all of this boycotting will only hurt their country more then it will the one to the south. Carney will win the snap election and he will be the 'hero' that pushes back against Donald Trump. In the process, he will send his economy into a tailspin and create economic turmoil for the vast majority of the country. The only airlines that will be hurt by this decline in airline bookings are Canadian. This is going to have major ramifications for Air Canada but devastating effects for WestJet, Flair and Porter. There is just not enough Canadian destinations to fly all those planes. Still early, but furloughs could be around the corner for some of the airlines. Bankruptcy is not off the table either if the decline in revenue is great enough.
Exactly! These Hosers can talk all the shyte they want. US will be absolutely fine.
UA has got to be thanking its lucky stars that it has a TATL JV to help recoup some of the lost revenue from this mess; AA and DL are gonna have to just hope BA/AFKL can help close the gap.
And what about UA's transborder JV with Air Canada?
"draw your own conclusion"? LOL, man you are dumb. We all know the reason.
Good Lord, I just checked the comment section only to see many replies from TD. Dude doesn't have any other things to do? Even if he's providing legit info, it gets irritating. Dude please just stop
let Ben know how many replies ANY person should be able to post and see if he agrees.
it takes zero energy while I watch sports
@Tim Dunn Perhaps you should read more rather than just watch sports? You might actually broaden your thinking as a result
Nah let Tim be happy watching sports.
It keeps him busy figuring out how can a jug of water throw a baseball.
And tim Dunn is an ill informed maga guy
The lack of information processing and analytical skills all make sense now.
Why is no one surprised
Did you vote for Donald Trump?
Dude is chronically online and needs to touch grass lol
A simple assignation would cure the problem.
if someone can't plan a crime any better than you can spell, there should be no threat to anyone.
@Tim Dunn Perhaps your starting to construct better sentences would inspire other's spelling.
that's laughable
Perhaps "your" starting
aah, the irony of the smug correction... that is incorrect. subtleties of the english language are tough, to be fair. It's not an intelligently constructed language, but it is a beautiful one! @Antwerp appears to have an actual grasp on it.
So sorry to hear what is happening at border. No one should be treated with disrespect, but ignorance is bliss in Government with hate in their hearts and their power games. Glad I didn't vote for the 3. Our friends in Canada and other parts of the World don't deserve the threats that are happening now or in America. It's beginning to look like a Authoritarian government.
Well.. I can only assume that the people who're travelling made their reservations long ago, and just couldn't cancel because of the losses they could encure. After this set of booking, we'll know for sure how bad it really is.
I could not blame them if they never set foot in the USA again.
It is sad that our friends in Canada and other Countries of the World have to deal with ignorance of a Government I didn't vote for. Friends will be missed. America use to be like a beacon of hope for others, that light will never shine as bright ever again. Sorry for how you Canadians and others are treated at border. Ignorance is bliss right now in Government..
Canada is the tip of the iceberg.......the rest of the world will follow, except for the third world countries.
and given that airlines invariably pull from their hone country, this will only shift the market share between the US and those countries to US airlines.
Nowhere have we seen that US tourists are going to stay home. The strong dollar is sending them overseas in record numbes.
You really want to see how this plays out?
@Tim Dunn In a comment above you insulted someone for a spelling error. Yet here you are typing, "hone country."
Oh, and of course, 'record numbes." Unless of course you type with a Jersey accent. In which case the spelling is correct.
I'm global. thank you
Hone? Your spelling isn't any better :)
It is a shame that we are no longer welcome as friends. The rise and fall of American leadership has begun. The world has begun to turn its back. In all, a shame that will be difficult to erase.
why can't Canadian companies just pony up some cash and invest in US manufacturing?
Taiwanese and S. Korean companies - among others - have figured out how to win in the new world order.
The US didn’t threaten to take over Taiwan or South Korea. That’s why Canadians are boycotting. If some egomaniac threatened to seize the US, I wouldn’t be rushing to visit his country either.
if anyone seriously thinks that Canada will end up as part of the US, they need their head examined.
regardless of what anyone said.
and Taiwan would love to have the assurance that the US would respond to a threat to Taiwan just like it would respond to a threat to Hawaii
@Tim Dunn Are you serious? Just like pulling out of Afghanistan and the chaos that followed?
Tim, many of us here have been saying the same thing for years, albeit a bit differently.
"If anyone seriously thinks whatever Tim Dunn says here is even remotely accurate, they need their head examined".
Why are other countries advising their travelers not to visit the US? Why are US universities discouraging their facility and staff from traveling abroad, even on their dime?
You're best off taking off that little red hat that's giving you...
Tim, many of us here have been saying the same thing for years, albeit a bit differently.
"If anyone seriously thinks whatever Tim Dunn says here is even remotely accurate, they need their head examined".
Why are other countries advising their travelers not to visit the US? Why are US universities discouraging their facility and staff from traveling abroad, even on their dime?
You're best off taking off that little red hat that's giving you brain rot and sitting this one out, champ.
I have no red little hat.
You and others simply are wedded to your narrative so badly that you can't accept that Trump is determined to remake global trade.
Air travel is simply not any where near on the radar in terms of importance - and if these boycotts really happen, it will hurt airlines of other countries far more than it will hurt US tourism.
@Mark
The US didn’t threaten to take over Taiwan or South Korea. Because the US has already occupied these 2 countries with armed forces.
South Korea until this day, and Taiwan until US cease to recognize it as country.
But Tim would fluff all day long now about how they win the new world order? Nukes win the new world order.
@Tim What four letters are written on your hat?
@Stanley C
DLTA
@Stanley C. "LNLY"
LAFF at U
@Tim Dunn all I asked for was just four letters on your hat but you are adding to it with ‘at U’.
the last time a Taiwanese company (Foxconn) promised a large investment in US manufacturing, we got screwed big time. Foxconn never ended up investing what they promised, and this is after the city / county invested heavily in infrastructure to support an manufacturing site that never happened. So I wouldn't necessary count on TSMC ending up investing beyond what they have already planned
Let's be honest, Taiwan got a lot of chip business because they got the work culture to make it work cheaper than anywhere else. A toxic work culture IMO but that's a them problem.
Now they are strong armed into building factories in the US that will never make money.
What Trump is doing is giving busy work to whoever is building those factories. Others would have used taxpayer money to build bridges,...
Let's be honest, Taiwan got a lot of chip business because they got the work culture to make it work cheaper than anywhere else. A toxic work culture IMO but that's a them problem.
Now they are strong armed into building factories in the US that will never make money.
What Trump is doing is giving busy work to whoever is building those factories. Others would have used taxpayer money to build bridges, roads, grids, power plants. Those at least would stay useful to Americans after they were built. All those factories will be unprofitable, will close and rust, like the others.
There's a reason America is only strong on exporting services.
Americans put in a lot of hours by showing up at work, but what about productivity ?
If we're talking about making something well, cheap and consistent, businesses have been voting with their investing wallets for decades and they have not voted for the United States of America.
It will be interesting to hear how US tourists find overseas travel over the coming months, obviously the hotels and hospitality industry welcome Uncle Sam and the money but it’s becoming clear others not so, speaking with US friends they feel like Israeli and Russian citizens cautious to disclose country of origin with 1 family just returned from Amsterdam telling locals they were from Canada. What a sad state if affairs.
I would honestly imagine that the vast majority of people in the European tourism industries will be professional enough to keep their thoughts to themselves and serve their customers.
It would be interesting to know but I'm not interested in reading a bunch of anecdotes... there are always bad experiences so some type of context and year over year change is necessary to know if anything is really happening.
@Tim I fear the experience that was articulated to me over the weekend will not be an isolated experience, I do hope it doesn’t become the norm but I personally can feel worrying remarks and undertones both professionally and while out socially.
@Creditcrunch - Unfortunately, I have to agree with you. I've seen the same things on my two recent trips abroad and I've sensed the same sentiment talking with non-Americans. It seems to be a common theme that when people hear you are American, they don't know if you supported the current President. However, he was elected which leads people to believe it is more likely than not that you are a supporter of him. Then...
@Creditcrunch - Unfortunately, I have to agree with you. I've seen the same things on my two recent trips abroad and I've sensed the same sentiment talking with non-Americans. It seems to be a common theme that when people hear you are American, they don't know if you supported the current President. However, he was elected which leads people to believe it is more likely than not that you are a supporter of him. Then they often assume that you are a hardliner and and like one of his loyal extreme supporters (even if none of the above apply to you). There may be a part of them believing that you may not be as such, but at first glance, it is better to play it safe and those thoughts do enter everyone's minds.
It's the same thing as westerners chalking up all Muslims to be extremists, or all immigrants to be criminals. I do hope this doesn't continue but if it does, it will be quite unfortunate.
Just returned on Sunday from overseas. Not a single case of ill will or feeling of hatred. I get it, there are A LOT of people rooting for Americans to be treated badly and turned away, but no one cares in most of these countries. They don't follow politics and just want to make money for their families.
I spent 3 weeks in Norway last June and lots of locals would ask us what's going on in the US. They were concerned about Trump and what that would mean for NATO, Russian aggression in Ukraine sits differently when there isn't an ocean separating you.
Anecdotal but not universal by any means. Recently returned from a trip to BeNeLux and France, including Amsterdam. Americans stick out like a sore thumb but when we encountered locals they were nothing but cordial and hospitable, and when conversations did occur they were more curious and horrified rather than hostile or distant. Obviously, they rightly assumed that most Americans who travel have a more global outlook than red-hats. Certainly could change over 4 years,...
Anecdotal but not universal by any means. Recently returned from a trip to BeNeLux and France, including Amsterdam. Americans stick out like a sore thumb but when we encountered locals they were nothing but cordial and hospitable, and when conversations did occur they were more curious and horrified rather than hostile or distant. Obviously, they rightly assumed that most Americans who travel have a more global outlook than red-hats. Certainly could change over 4 years, but not the reality now by any means.
I think you are missing the point.
Americans travelling abroad are by and large still the same people they were before the current US administration took over.
A surprising large number of them are at pains to point out that they do not agree with the current incumbent in the White House.
That could be their true attitude or a desire to stay away from a political debate, but in this context I also have...
I think you are missing the point.
Americans travelling abroad are by and large still the same people they were before the current US administration took over.
A surprising large number of them are at pains to point out that they do not agree with the current incumbent in the White House.
That could be their true attitude or a desire to stay away from a political debate, but in this context I also have to think about what John Cleese (A Fish called Wanda, Fawlty Towers) apparently wrote: “I don't think that Trump supporters care about what the rest of the world thinks. That's because they don't know where the rest of the world is."
Almost 200 comments and not a single one mention that Elon Musk is Canadian?
He's about as Canadian as Coke is American
He is actually born and “educated” in Pretoria, South Africa. His mother is Canadian.
So is Ted Cruz, think they would take him back?
Colour this how you will:
• yes the CAD is a little weaker these days,
• tariffs are stupid and an annoyance,
• calling the Prime Minister "Governor" is middle-school bullying,
• threatening to annex Canada and make it the 51st state is an outrageous provocation, not to mention an insult and a violation of international law.
US tourism authorities were worried about a 10% drop in Canadian tourism. 70%? Just getting started.
your first 4 bullet points are accurate.
your conclusion is not.
Let us know the real drop in US tourism. Honestly, Canada is a fraction of total US demand.
and this data involves a small period that involves spring break when there are plenty of replacement travelers.
The real cost if this is all will be negligible. but some Canadians might feel better that they made a statement.
Canada is the biggest tourist market outside of the US.
And you already know being a weird Delta fan boy that domestic confidence is sinking.
You probably don't work for tourism but it will be felt lol
we're not going back to a manufacturing based economy. that's ghetto like you
yes, mocking guest that is too much of a coward to use your own distorted name.
Canada is the largest source of US tourism.
The issue is whether Canadians will really feel the same way when the mercury drops in the fall - many own property in the US - and whether others, including Americans, replace the Canadian visits
and, while this is an aviation forum, there are issues like auto tariffs that have the...
yes, mocking guest that is too much of a coward to use your own distorted name.
Canada is the largest source of US tourism.
The issue is whether Canadians will really feel the same way when the mercury drops in the fall - many own property in the US - and whether others, including Americans, replace the Canadian visits
and, while this is an aviation forum, there are issues like auto tariffs that have the impact to harm Canada far more than tourism regulations do.
and you are clearly incapable of putting anything together which is why you don't think Americans are capable of assembling anything.
You know who the poorest group of people are?
People in manufacturing lol like in the rust belt. Deepest red counties you'll ever find making minimum wage of $7 lol
Yeah, America will be SO great if we move all service based jobs like high end hotels/restaurants into manufacturing lumber and semi conductors lOL
embarrassing
I don't need to put anything together. That's why we hire people. I'm not poor like you...
You know who the poorest group of people are?
People in manufacturing lol like in the rust belt. Deepest red counties you'll ever find making minimum wage of $7 lol
Yeah, America will be SO great if we move all service based jobs like high end hotels/restaurants into manufacturing lumber and semi conductors lOL
embarrassing
I don't need to put anything together. That's why we hire people. I'm not poor like you would want me to be
Lol luckily for US property owners, the housing market is crazy and they can profit off to the nose against our own citizens.
Maybe you haven't read global sentiment but no one wants to go to the US and even I as an American are looking into places such as Newfoundland rather than Miami or New York lol
no wonder you won't post under a real name.
Anyone that thinks that the auto plants throughout the south pay $7/hr is beyond delusional
Hyundai will invest more in a single plant in Louisiana that all of the boycotting Canadians could ever hope to spend in the US.
The mercury fall is inevitable. I work in the travel business and have already seen retuning, regular US snowbirds start looking to Europe, Australia and now Uruguay for next winter.
It is a noticeable and remarkable shift in the market.
Tim aren't there DL articles you can do mental gymnastics in?
"this data involves a small period that involves spring break when there are plenty of replacement travelers"
This is year-over-year data. Spring Break has nothing to do with it. Provide a link to a similar declination in business YOY.
"The real cost if this is all will be negligible"
Show me an example where -70% YOY data managed to be negligible, in...
Tim aren't there DL articles you can do mental gymnastics in?
"this data involves a small period that involves spring break when there are plenty of replacement travelers"
This is year-over-year data. Spring Break has nothing to do with it. Provide a link to a similar declination in business YOY.
"The real cost if this is all will be negligible"
Show me an example where -70% YOY data managed to be negligible, in any major industry, in any period in the 20th or 21st centuries.
You continue to entertain, buddy.
Actually your statement is incorrect. It is not only Canadians that are not travelling, neither are travellers from all over the world. Why would they? Air New Zealand recently put an ad on Facebook about travelling to New York, 99% of the comments were about how they were not travelling to the US any more while this present government is in power. Other countries have given out warnings not to travel to the US, such as the UK and Germany, the tip of the iceberg.
The United States can push countries like Canada and Mexico whose GDP dwarfs. But they can't with the BRICS and the EU. I'm looking forward to more verbal diarrhea from the current administration in the next couple years to see what traffic is going to be.
Let’s stop pretending Canadians are avoiding the U.S. out of political principle. They’re broke. The CAD is in the toilet, household debt is the worst in the G7, and Trudeau’s turned the economy into a slow-motion car crash wrapped in a diversity slogan. Food prices are up, taxes are crushing the middle class, and national debt just blew past $2 trillion. But yeah, it’s Trump’s fault that Canadians can’t afford a weekend in Cleveland. Give me a break.
I can afford vacations in America. I had two planned for this year. I’m not going because I don’t want to visit your country right now.
Coucou, you are cuckoo. You are clueless about Canada and Canadians but are pontificating here without any modesty. There is huge anger against Trump and his MAGA gang in Canada and a desire to go toe to toe with the vulgar orange bully. How else can you explain the 70+ % year on year drop in traffic? You cherry pick data trying to support your conclusions but you fail spectacularly. The CAD may be down...
Coucou, you are cuckoo. You are clueless about Canada and Canadians but are pontificating here without any modesty. There is huge anger against Trump and his MAGA gang in Canada and a desire to go toe to toe with the vulgar orange bully. How else can you explain the 70+ % year on year drop in traffic? You cherry pick data trying to support your conclusions but you fail spectacularly. The CAD may be down against the artificially inflated USD but, during recent travels in Asia, it was doing pretty well against the local currencies. Food prices are up because Canadians are not buying cheap American imports. Canada's taxes pay for universal health care; guess you have not had to mortgage your house for an operation. It will come, cuckoo! And you talk about national debt? How much does Uncle Sam owe China? Give all of us a break from your ignorant bantering! Thank you.
I can afford to go to USA. Everyone I know can. I always go in winter, at least once. But I won't. It's not "political principle", it's rage at the betrayal by a friend and ally. Everyone I know agrees. Extrapolate my admittedly anecdotal observation, and you have your 75% reduction in Transborder traffic. Your point about the poverty-stricken Canadians doesn't take into account the land crossings by anyone with a car or RV. They're...
I can afford to go to USA. Everyone I know can. I always go in winter, at least once. But I won't. It's not "political principle", it's rage at the betrayal by a friend and ally. Everyone I know agrees. Extrapolate my admittedly anecdotal observation, and you have your 75% reduction in Transborder traffic. Your point about the poverty-stricken Canadians doesn't take into account the land crossings by anyone with a car or RV. They're down by a similar amount. That's working class people in their small sedans, on cheap overnights or day trips for shopping. Inexpensive Vegas packages? Nobody's buying. They did last year.
So you are all for bankrupting your own Air Canada, that will suffer the most of all airlines because of travel decline. Very logical, kinda like sick Palestinians boycotting Israeli medications.
I think this is the worst take yet. Literally everyone I know who is cancelling or boycotting trips to the US is rebooking it to other places in the world and spending the same amount of money. This is a very deliberate strategy as is the buy Canadian strategy in supermarkets.
I had a great time in Portugal and Ireland last week. I could have gone to the US but, nah, not till you deal with the toddler at the top.
We hear about stupid Americans parroting whatever ridiculous talking point they last heard on their propaganda vehicle of choice all the time, but it's weird to actually see it in person.
Seriously - how on earth can you be so utterly ignorant while having access to the internet? The mind truly boggles...
So much hate in so many words. Against the US dollar the CAD is weak, but against most of the world it’s doing just fine. You must be one of those MAGA ( Make Alberta Great again ) Canadians. Just like PP you spew populist crap without checking your facts.
I live in Quebec. I was going to go to Disneyland this year with my wife and two kids. Now I will go spend my hard earned money in Disneyland France instead.
Just wait for the figures for visitors from the EU, the UK and AU/NZ come in.
I'm British, have visited the US many times (think I'm up to about 20 states visited) and have no plan whatsoever to visit - or even transit - in the next four years.
I hope there will be a Trump baby blimp v2 (the original is in the Museum of London!) -for his visit to see our King. I'll...
Just wait for the figures for visitors from the EU, the UK and AU/NZ come in.
I'm British, have visited the US many times (think I'm up to about 20 states visited) and have no plan whatsoever to visit - or even transit - in the next four years.
I hope there will be a Trump baby blimp v2 (the original is in the Museum of London!) -for his visit to see our King. I'll certainly help crowdfund it.
And I've just read the Signal transcript where it appears that the powers that be were happy to bomb a civilian building.
Yikes.
I feel slightly lightheaded at the prospect of His Majesty and The Donald in the same room. It's a comfort to know that The President will leave happy, as everyone does. It's not possible The King isn't furious at the US President for openly musing about annexation of an important Commonwealth country. Saying Canada shouldn't be a country, in serious tones, is not cool.
What was that saying?
“Everybody brings joy to this ˜office˜ palace.
Some when they come; some when they leave.”
Always fun to see comments on these kinds of things.
Canadians are not broke and belligerent. Typical MAGA oblivion.
Donald will back up when that stupid expression comes over his face and he realizes he bogged up a significant percentage of the global economy because he was hangry or had a hemorrhoid or something. Then he'll walk it all back and claim expertise in negotiating.
All this time I'm directing money to...
Always fun to see comments on these kinds of things.
Canadians are not broke and belligerent. Typical MAGA oblivion.
Donald will back up when that stupid expression comes over his face and he realizes he bogged up a significant percentage of the global economy because he was hangry or had a hemorrhoid or something. Then he'll walk it all back and claim expertise in negotiating.
All this time I'm directing money to my financial advisor to value-buy stocks so my kids can retire that much earlier. Surf the insanity, people. Don't wipe out.
What will happen to the Alaska cruise season? Some routes either start in YVR or end in YVR
Frankly, given the amount of sewage dumped by these cruises, a collapse of that industry might not be a bad thing. Hard on YVR, though it might free up capacity for flights to Asia.
It seems rather prescient that Sheila Broflovski was orange as well...
These latest attacks on our neighbors seems about as well-thought out as her campaign.
I hope somebody is watching our for poor little Ike.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bOR38552MJA
What a way to celebrate the 25th anniversary of Robin Williams' epic Oscar's performance. It sure was funny at the time before this comedy became a miserable reality.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXeWT8CQ6uc
My husband works as an on demand waiter at a major hotel in Fort Lauderdale. He hasn’t been needed for weeks because the Canadians are not coming down.
Who can blame them?
Canadian are cheap and don’t tip, so he’s not missing cash from them.
Have you been looking over their shoulders when the pay and tip and thus know it first hand?
Or are you a waiter?
Wait till EU numbers come out. Why would anyone visit when even an ESTA which was approved does not guarantee entry. Would not be surprised if AC makes YYZ a hub and Poaches US Intl marketshare on price. As we all know money talks why why not create a North American Dubai.
ETSA has never guaranteed entry. The final entry decision has always been in the hands of the CBP officer.
But cuffing and deporting rejected European arrivals instead of just putting them on the next flight home...yes, that's new and alarming and a reason not to visit.
Interesting point. Look at prices on AC from Mexico or Central/South America via MEX to Europe. significantly higher than shorter itineraries with connections in USA. Yet loads are higher. What latino wants to deal with a CBP officer, just to transit MIA, IAD, IAH etc when he can deal with a Canadian in YYZ, YUL instead? People pay more to avoid the USA. This has been going on for many years.
Born in the USA 72 years ago. l want out here. This country has gone to HELL. God bless Canada! A great nation.
Canada is 40% poorer the the USA per capita
Yet the prices are ridiculously high. I priced MIA to Ottawa for mid April.
Canada charges outrageous tariffs for years and you were silent. Now you are getting to taste your own medicine and all of the sudden you snowflakes cry. LOL, all will be resolved as soon as you are part of the beautiful, mighty Union.
"Canada charges outrageous tariffs for years and you were silent."
Canada has had a free-trade agreement with the US for nearly 40 years. There were and there are no "outrageous tariffs" on US goods entering the US.
Oops, "entering Canada"
Dairy products from the US to Canada have had a 200%+ tariff for years...
Endre, "I only pay full-fare, and never use miles."
Wouldn't "all of a sudden" be correct, as opposed to "all of the sudden?"
Hello, btw :)
Your comment right there reflects everything that needs to be said. It’s not just about the tariffs. Your president, and his supporters in people like you, want to literally end Canada‘s existence as a country through annexation. That 51st state talk is causing more anger in Canada than the tariffs are. Imagine if the President of China repeatedly said he wanted to take over the US through annexation? Imagine the anger? This is the main...
Your comment right there reflects everything that needs to be said. It’s not just about the tariffs. Your president, and his supporters in people like you, want to literally end Canada‘s existence as a country through annexation. That 51st state talk is causing more anger in Canada than the tariffs are. Imagine if the President of China repeatedly said he wanted to take over the US through annexation? Imagine the anger? This is the main part of what’s generating a USA boycott that I anticipate will be very long-term.
I would not travel to visit an unfriendly country like the USA!
This would be a good time for a few facts to put this whole discussion in perspective.
The TSA screened over 900 million passengers in 2024; even if this decline continues on an annualized basis, it amounts to about 1% of traffic from or within the US.
Florida is the largest destination for Canadians and most travel by air. Most airline seats from Canada to the US are on Canadian airlines. Florida's economy is one...
This would be a good time for a few facts to put this whole discussion in perspective.
The TSA screened over 900 million passengers in 2024; even if this decline continues on an annualized basis, it amounts to about 1% of traffic from or within the US.
Florida is the largest destination for Canadians and most travel by air. Most airline seats from Canada to the US are on Canadian airlines. Florida's economy is one of the strongest in the country.
The CAD has declined 8% since Trump was elected.
Taiwan Semiconductor (TSMC) is investing $100 billion more to construct plants in the US for a total of more than $160 billion.
Hyundai (S. Korea) just announced it will invest $21 billion in a new steel plant in Louisiana to avoid potential US tariffs. Samsung and LG are both ready to move appliance manufacturing from Mexico to S. Carolina and TN if necessary to avoid tariffs.
Korean Air just finalized tens of billions of new Boeing aircraft purchases.
Taiwan and S. Korea both have much larger percentages of trade imbalance with the US than Canada but the Asian countries - who depend on the US for security and defense - are willing to move more and more manufacturing.
----
why do Canadians throw a temper tantrum only to have their boycotted vacations in the US be replaced by other visitors and hurt Canadian airlines while other countries invest in US manufacturing?
Shut. Up. Timbits.
Thanks for the facts. Honestly imo, this will hurt Canada long term than it will hurt the US
thank you, Joe.
some people simply don't want facts.
and the far bigger story is about the auto industry.
Trump wants manufacturers to build cars for the US market to be built in the US.
Canada has built more cars for the US market than the US builds for the Canadian market.
As it stands, US manufacturers will have to shift production back to the US or pay tariffs.
There honestly are far bigger...
thank you, Joe.
some people simply don't want facts.
and the far bigger story is about the auto industry.
Trump wants manufacturers to build cars for the US market to be built in the US.
Canada has built more cars for the US market than the US builds for the Canadian market.
As it stands, US manufacturers will have to shift production back to the US or pay tariffs.
There honestly are far bigger issues between US-Canada trade than the Canadian tourists that come to Florida and will be easily replaced by US tourists as well as those from other countries.
As much as some want to believe otherwise, the foot stomping exercise by Canadians will hurt Canadians more than anyone else
US auto manufacturers have PARTS made in Mexico and Canada because they are cheaper and probably better made. If these parts are to be made in the USA, the cost of vehicles in the USA will cost far more. That is the other side of the “facts” you are talking about. South Korea does not have a local source for iron ore or chromium for Stella so it makes a lot of sense to locate...
US auto manufacturers have PARTS made in Mexico and Canada because they are cheaper and probably better made. If these parts are to be made in the USA, the cost of vehicles in the USA will cost far more. That is the other side of the “facts” you are talking about. South Korea does not have a local source for iron ore or chromium for Stella so it makes a lot of sense to locate a mill nearer to the source of the raw materials. By the time any new factories or plants are in production, who knows who will be in power in the USA?
Ah yes, the Maple MAGA couldn't help themself, Just had to put their spin on it. It's not just Canada, the EU is also avoiding US travel. The situation with Ukraine is top of mind (nothing like backing the aggressor eh?) Should be fun to follow now that the auto tariffs have been confirmed as well.
Tim Dunn, you're pulling your "facts" from out of your *ss or Fox fake news. Canada imports more...
Ah yes, the Maple MAGA couldn't help themself, Just had to put their spin on it. It's not just Canada, the EU is also avoiding US travel. The situation with Ukraine is top of mind (nothing like backing the aggressor eh?) Should be fun to follow now that the auto tariffs have been confirmed as well.
Tim Dunn, you're pulling your "facts" from out of your *ss or Fox fake news. Canada imports more cars from the US than vice versa. They manufacture a fraction of the cars the US does. Canada will "invest" in their own manufacturing (not just of cars) to become reduce dependence on the US. Threats and abuse don't motivate anyone to spend money to their abuser's profit.
Would you care to guess how much a Chevy Suburban would cost if it was build entirely in the USA, based on the prevailing UAW wage scale?
Time to turn your lights out and tax your gas 100% tariff you tool
Ya Canada unimportant until you need resources
You Americans are as stupid and arrogant as the world sees you
Because they have principles beyond "money! Money money money! I need more money!"?
Perhaps an alien concept to you?
It's exactly how Canadians imagined it. We've sustained threats for months from Trump. People have actively stopped buying anything American. And now this fingerprinting and registration for stays over 30 days and all these permanent residents and green card holders being detained....no more USA. Damage will be long term. Canadians are willing to suffer to stand up to a bully.
I get it.
but the notion that a country that is about 10% of the US and needs the warmth of the US is going to make a difference on the US economy is beyond ridiculous.
I don't minimize your frustration. I do laugh at the notion that, even if all Canadians stayed away, it would do any significant difference. Virtually all of the major destinations where Canadians will want to go when the thermometer...
I get it.
but the notion that a country that is about 10% of the US and needs the warmth of the US is going to make a difference on the US economy is beyond ridiculous.
I don't minimize your frustration. I do laugh at the notion that, even if all Canadians stayed away, it would do any significant difference. Virtually all of the major destinations where Canadians will want to go when the thermometer drops are in US states that have very strong economies.
We aren't talking about a vacation in Mexico... we are talking about places in the US where Canadians have owned property in years. and are not selling it on the turn of a dime.
Lol you're honestly very embarrassing.
Do you think people who work in hospitality will feel the effects of semi conductors and steel?
Why are you trying to move back to a manufacturing based economy? Are you trying to be poor like China and India?
There's a roughly 900k ticket decrease. If each person with a ticket were to spend roughly $500 on a trip, that's 450,000,000 wiped away in a month lol...
Lol you're honestly very embarrassing.
Do you think people who work in hospitality will feel the effects of semi conductors and steel?
Why are you trying to move back to a manufacturing based economy? Are you trying to be poor like China and India?
There's a roughly 900k ticket decrease. If each person with a ticket were to spend roughly $500 on a trip, that's 450,000,000 wiped away in a month lol People who work at hotels, tourism, they're not going to be making semi conductors and steel? You're honestly really embarrassing
economies shift.
If you haven't figured out that people in manufacturing make more than people in the hospitality sector, you really don't have any business contributing to this discussion.
and, btw, you do realize that manufacturing has higher levels of unionization than service industries?
Unions could see a huge increase in membership over the next few years if Trump's plans to increase US manufacturing go through.
but that clearly went well over your head...
Ricardo's economic theory of comparative advantages has been proven again and again and is the foundation of modern day capitalism. Coercitive policies and government nudges can catalyse it but USA moves much further than that : it reverts from capitalism to autarky. It has been proven again and again that protectionism leads to lazy corrupt and bloated businesses that are unable to compete globally. France's industry free fall in the 1990s is a good example...
Ricardo's economic theory of comparative advantages has been proven again and again and is the foundation of modern day capitalism. Coercitive policies and government nudges can catalyse it but USA moves much further than that : it reverts from capitalism to autarky. It has been proven again and again that protectionism leads to lazy corrupt and bloated businesses that are unable to compete globally. France's industry free fall in the 1990s is a good example of such, but the comparison can be pushed to autocratic regimes with Soviet Union a prime example.
USA's allies and adversaries still understand traditional capitalism and will play aside. Soon immigration will stop being an issue, like it isn't in Russia's dwarf and corrupted economy.
given that the US has elections every 2 years and Trump's team could lose it all then, I doubt seriously that the US will fall apart.
many of Trump's policies are tied up in federal court.
If it all falls apart as bad as some thing it will, the Republicans will be unemployed in a couple of years.
Hey dummy Florida relies on tourism hence no state income tax. What will you hill Jack's do when Canada, UK and Australia stop coming.
It's all Trump's fault.
Nothing to do with the Canadian dollar being in toilet.
Nothing to do with a lockdown-induced cost-of-living crisis.
It's all because orange man bad.
Correct, December travel, same as last year, January travel, down a bit from last year, Orange Man arrives on scene, January down 20%, February down 40%, April (that people didn't have to cancel and lose money) down 70%. Exchange rates, pretty much even across that time. Inflation in Canada, roughly 2% during that time. Hmmm, what could it be?
The numbers don't align with currency fluctuation. I have colleagues, family and friends throughout Canada and am a former resident myself. The cultural pushback to Trump's—frankly—insanity around this has been profound and unprecedented. Canadians will ghost America for as long as needed, no second thoughts.
I know the MAGA crowd would spin hell itself as warmer weather but look, this guy has upended the most stable diplomatic relationship on Earth for no discernible reason....
The numbers don't align with currency fluctuation. I have colleagues, family and friends throughout Canada and am a former resident myself. The cultural pushback to Trump's—frankly—insanity around this has been profound and unprecedented. Canadians will ghost America for as long as needed, no second thoughts.
I know the MAGA crowd would spin hell itself as warmer weather but look, this guy has upended the most stable diplomatic relationship on Earth for no discernible reason. Own it if you guys love chaos so much.
All Trudeau had to do was to secure the borders when asked by Trump… He didn’t and still hasn’t, that’s why the tariffs are there. But in reality the US is getting burned by Canadians. Blame ur government for the tariffs. I’m a Canadian but I love the USA. Bring on the 51st state, I can’t wait.
Found the Russian troll
What nonsense! Trump doesn't care about the fentanyl or illegal immigrants. There is more fentanyl going from US to Canada than the other way around. It was just an excuse to be able to break the law and apply tariffs!
This must be bot
He's not even prime minister any more, numbnuts. If you were Canadian, you would know this basic fact.
Trump and Vance were on a call and told Trudeau that the 45lbs of Fentanyl that made it into the USA from Canada was killing all their junkie friends, so you can see why they were so upset. 45lbs of Fentanyl is a lot man. Reminds me of parties at Mar-a-Lago.
Hello Ben-
It seems that the article actually isn't talking about transborder crossings as whole (traffic both directions), just "Canada to the US: Forward Bookings Collapse."
Any idea what the Us to Canada forward bookings look like?
I'm heading up to Montreal next week to support their economy. Can't stand the POS POTUS down here in the US and what he is doing to so many allies
You are very welcome, as you always have been. You will see that we Canadians know quite a bit about your country and we get that all the moves are supported by a small minority of the population. Like you, we dread the next move and we wish this hadn't happened. It's a comfort to hang out together and reassure each other. Enjoy the superb exchange rate, the empty planes, the appallingly bad weather (what possessed you to come at this time of year?).
Any chance you just stay brother?
We also just booked a summer vacation in Vancouver to support our Canadian friends. Trip budget is US$4,000, and that will all be spent up there. We were going to go to Cape Cod, but Vancouver Island will be better.
Why does everyone need to draw "their own conclusions"?
There only one conclusion: the Canadians are not tolerating the beligerant behaviour of the American government threatening annexation.
I love that the article was confused why the demand has fallen off a cliff.
Maybe when you threaten your neighbour's existence he quits coming over for coffee? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
So where are all of our neighborly Canadians traveling to lately if not the US?
I am sure the good Canadian economy isn’t so dependent upon the US titHE that there are not some awesome places for Canadians to go traveling to. Perhaps Greenland for an example? I’ve never been.
As Canadians seek out better places to visit than the reddish US states, where their Canadian dollars used to go so much further perhaps...
So where are all of our neighborly Canadians traveling to lately if not the US?
I am sure the good Canadian economy isn’t so dependent upon the US titHE that there are not some awesome places for Canadians to go traveling to. Perhaps Greenland for an example? I’ve never been.
As Canadians seek out better places to visit than the reddish US states, where their Canadian dollars used to go so much further perhaps we can encourage the diversity and balance of Africa. Yes we know it does not quite match the diversity and balance of Atlanta, Detroit, or Los Angeles culture, but folks north need to realize the population exodus of Americans from the blueish states have ruined and misbalanced the costs and vacation prices in the vacation reddish destinations for you and us alike, as equalibrium slowly returns a bit during these next 40 months.
Gulf of America regards and happy travels where ever you all are going and vacationing all the same, and we all do hope to see you back in the US visiting us soon neighbors. Do let us know where you decided to go!
I'm enjoying my time on the Gulf of Mexico.
I cancelled Florida and am going to Newfoundland in May. Probably will cancel Florida in September and go to Thailand. Will probably go to Europe in December instead of our usual trip to the US. We usually got to the US 4 times a year, it will now be one or two at the most
The Caribbean and Mexico.
London
Paris
Dublin
Lyon
Dijon
Barcelona
Malaga
Madrid
Lisbon
Egypt
Jordan
Cuba
Jamaica
Barbados
Saint Maartin
Mayan Riveria
New Zealand
Tahiti
Guadaloupe
Martinique
Vienna
Budapest
Croatia
Italy
Greece
Well, duh, its pretty simple. The US wants us to hand over our country. And they have no respect for our culture and have become very bad neighbours. And we don't want to get thrown in jail for no good reason. So we're done.
Your culture? You're a "post-national" state remember? Or are you talking about your Indian culture now. Your culture used to entirely consist of displaying Canada flags on your luggage so you wouldn't be mistaken for an American. Now it's fighting for entry-level jobs against hordes of Indians.
This just demonstrates how little you know about Canada.
Vegas service industry is reporting that it feels like 2020 in terms of arrivals
@OMAAT Can you confirm this?
This probably has less to do with Canada and more to do with the fact the resorts have lost their collective minds and priced everyone out of visiting.
I thought this blog was about travel and mileage tips, not about political and anti American statements. Sad. Very sad. Dude, re-focus on what you are good at.
@ Hug -- Right, this blog is about travel, and I'd say a 70% reduction in travel demand between two countries would be described as a travel topic, no? It'll no doubt have an impact on travelers. What did I say in this post that was political or anti-American?
You did fine, Ben. Some people interpret inconvenient facts as an assault on their position. Likely due to insecurity and a creeping dread that they've bet on the wrong horse.
The author did a good job not mentioning the obvious. You people gave us a felon molester that picks fights with our closest neighbor while making life better for the Russians. Own it, bro. Don't act like you can't see it.
I was never anti-American until Mango Mussolini left me with no choice.
The utter betrayal by these filthy MAGAts (maggots, get it?) has made me virulently anti-American.
I hold nothing but utter contempt for Orange Hitler.
Hey, leave Hugs alone! Don’t you know that facts are merely liberal constructs?
I would like to see the stats for Canada to the UK, Europe, Japan, and Mexico. Are Canadians not traveling or not traveling to the US?
I can’t speak for the whole country. But for me, I just cancelled a trip from Toronto to Las Vegas. Cost me $1000 in cancellation fees. I just rebooked to Vancouver. The bookings I would normally make over the summer and December to California and Florida will never be made. In the summer we will go to Halifax. In December we will travel to Spain.
One Canadian data point: my spouse and I just booked a trip to Japan. We have been pondering a number of US destinations. All off the list now.
I LOVE my winter trips to Palm Springs, where we stay in a gay Men's resort. It's bliss and it's my happy place each winter. I wrote to the hotelier explaining that I'm not coming, that I won't go anywhere in USA until the aggression stops, that I'll miss it and I wish them well. They replied that they fully agree with me. We went to Playa del Carmen and Tulum instead, spending a third...
I LOVE my winter trips to Palm Springs, where we stay in a gay Men's resort. It's bliss and it's my happy place each winter. I wrote to the hotelier explaining that I'm not coming, that I won't go anywhere in USA until the aggression stops, that I'll miss it and I wish them well. They replied that they fully agree with me. We went to Playa del Carmen and Tulum instead, spending a third of the budget, so we can go to mexico again, or save the money for Thailand, Japan later. But not USA. My typical annual spend, on the ground in USA, is in the thousands. Now it's zero.
Seville or the canaries is my tip if you're expecting warmth. As nice as the rest of the country can be single digit temperatures will still be disappointing
"Everyone can draw their own conclusions as to what’s causing this"
It's very simple:
So long as the orange shitgibbon continues to hurl feces everywhere with his tiny, tiny hands.. Canadians are going to stay the fuck away from Amerikkka.
I don't know if Americans realize what sort of visceral hatred we have for Orange Hitler over here.
#ELBOWSUP
We do. Lots of Americans do, too. You're not alone. I don't know what the US variant of #ELBOWSUP is, but as someone who spent formative years in Alberta, I'll take an honorary #ELBOWSUP.
we absolutely do ! I am so ashamed of my (USA) country. trump is an unhinged dictator. The majority of us LOVE Canada and the amazing people there. I have traveled extensively all across the great nation. I am so very sorry and sad.
Yes, the Canadian should avoid red states by all cost. Instead, they can visit Mexico or Caribbean. Then, AC will adjust equipments and schedules.
I hope Florida will not lose so much money.
Poor them.
Orange is the new blackout.
Everything Donmentia touches turns to dust.
Florida is a RED state.... Thanks to that dimwit governor of theirs. Certainly one to avoid at all costs.
C'mon my friend, you know exactly why demand collapsed. Pussyfooting around the Trumpist fascism and annexation threats hurt your credibility.
Lucky will avoid being political until he's the one in the firing line.
I wonder what he will say when republicans take a shot at the lgbtq community.
Republicans have been taking shots at the LGBTQ community since 1854, the year they were founded. In 13 Republican states, sodomy laws remain on the books in anticipation of the day that Lawrence can be overturned by the Supremes, just like with abortion laws. The day that Lawrence is overturned, I start doing a conceal carry.
@ Ashe @ DrDisrespect -- Well of course I know what caused this, and I've made that clear in other posts. Just look at my post from a few days ago:
https://onemileatatime.com/insights/united-states-tourism-decline-trump/
Why did I leave it out here? Well, I thought it would be interesting for Trump supporters to perhaps come to their own conclusions, without claiming that I'm injecting liberal bias into something (which... some people are accusing me of anyway).
@ Ashe @ DrDisrespect @ Ben - facts have a liberal bias apparently.
For the cult, Trump isn't just a politician; he's a grievance avatar, a symbol of their resentment. No scandal, failure, or hypocrisy will change that.
It's not about facts or policy failures-it's about identity.
“since it’s hard to know for how long demand will remain so depressed.”
I will hazard a guess this will last around 4 years.
Unfortunately, it will likely last considerably longer than 4 years. Canadians are slow to anger, but even slower to forgive or forget. And though the marmalade muppet MAY be gone in 4 years, the people who elected him, knowing what he is, will still be there
Nope. It will last forever. Just because this fascist might leave in 4 years - which I doubt, he almost didn't leave last time regardless of election results - it doesn't mean I would ever want to go back to a place whose population overwhelmingly put him there, by choice or by omission, after all that's been shown about him.
For 15 years my wife and I have traveled and stayed in the SW US states of Tx, NM, and AZ. Over this period of time we have spent $350K USD. We did not go in 2025 nor will we ever return in the future to that odious country. The US homeland security, TFSA, and CBS have become increasingly aggressive and abusive to tourists at their entry points. The world is large and there are...
For 15 years my wife and I have traveled and stayed in the SW US states of Tx, NM, and AZ. Over this period of time we have spent $350K USD. We did not go in 2025 nor will we ever return in the future to that odious country. The US homeland security, TFSA, and CBS have become increasingly aggressive and abusive to tourists at their entry points. The world is large and there are many other wintering choices available. We will take alternates from now on, Trump or no Trump.
I'm sad it's come to this, but you're justified in making that choice. Best wishes.
Canadians are broke, their tax policies draconian, and their currency is weakened due to horrible policy by their own government. I find it rather hilarious / convenient that Canadian Liberals can foist all blame onto their evil orange man.
These policies were the same a year ago. What has changed? Tr*mp's relentless taunting of Canada's sovereignty, and threatened/enacted tariffs.
How is your life, Jon? Do making comments like this enrich it?
Bless your heart, Jon.
Thank you for the substantive rebuttals, everyone!
Russian bots on OMAAT?
Most of the loss of CAD vs USD is concommittent to Biden. CAD has done well against USD when Trump was in power.
Why do you think they're broke when you're probably living paycheck to paycheck in a red state
lmfao
The issue has to do with tariffs or the potential of increased tariffs for Canada by the USA. This has caused the Canadian dollar to weaken more as it will hurt the Canadian economy more than the U.S. Also, the Canadian economy has been weakening for the past several years during the Trudeau government which has reduced the value of the Canadian dollar. The median income Canadian really can't afford to vacation in the States...
The issue has to do with tariffs or the potential of increased tariffs for Canada by the USA. This has caused the Canadian dollar to weaken more as it will hurt the Canadian economy more than the U.S. Also, the Canadian economy has been weakening for the past several years during the Trudeau government which has reduced the value of the Canadian dollar. The median income Canadian really can't afford to vacation in the States now so hence more willing to head to Mexico or cheaper countries abroad.
Good article. Insightful. Don't engage the trolls operating in bad faith. A quick scan of this and other comments sections indicates that much of their lives are dedicated to Sisyphean sh!t posting. You have one life. Find your joy in meaningful pursuits.
100% agree. Don't feed those trolls. The terminally online live to suck other people into the quicksand of their misery.
Happy to read this. You're right.
You've inspired me to stop responding to them. They'll tilt at windmills for a while and find someplace else to befoul if people ignore them for long enough
This is more true than it was yesterday. Lotta MAGA trolls seem to have found this article. Probably got posted on the daily stormer or Jason Miller's unTruth Social page.
I'd be interested in knowing what flight bookings are like to the USA from other markets. I know so many friends here in Australia who swear they will not travel to the USA while its current leadership remains. Great words, but will they be corroborated by action, or in this case, inaction, in booking flights to the USA?
As a Canadian I can tell you exactly what is causing this: tariffs and threats of annexation.
I live in Munich, and while walking my dog through the English Garden today, I met a really nice family from Indiana. They almost apologized for being American, explaining that they needed a break and an escape from everything happening in the U.S. We also talked about Canada, and they admitted they wouldn’t have the courage to vacation there right now—fully understanding the Canadian perspective.
"Escape from everything happening" lmao, escape from what? Reality? People act like buildings are collapsing and the roads are sinking.
That family from Indiana needs to drink more, eat more gummies and up their Persocset dosage.
@Alanzo....typical type of MAGA excrement statement. Typical display of hatred for fellow Americans.
@Leigh go back to English class donkey.
What's wrong to escape from a red state as Indiana? They need peace and want to live happily, not under controls of rotten, brainless government.
At least they know what is wrong and right. Unlike stubborn MAGAs, make American GRACELESS again.
What an incredibly rude comment. Do better!
“Everyone can draw their own conclusions as to what’s causing this.”
Really? Would these be alternate conclusions, like all of those alternate facts talked about during the first Trump reign? We all know what is causing this decline in cross border travel, but it is cute reading how you are trying to tiptoe around the obvious fact.
Reckon Ben is trying to engage in this news without inflaming the hardcore partisans. Sadly, this is not the world that we live in. Bless him for trying tho - he seems a good sort and he'll find there's no pleasing some people
Big J. B. needs to make it legal to shoot at cars with red state license plates. Start with Wisconsin if they fail to vote the right way in that state Supreme Court election.
He won't do that because that is insane.
Don't stoop to Trumpist level posting.
I'm not joking. The Trumpelinas deserve everything I'm allowed to give them. I may be old, but when Civil War II happens, I'll sign up to legally shoot rednecks.
It's anyone's guess.... God you Americans live to put your head in the sand. It's because of your government. The sooner you start saying it the sooner you can fix it...
We booked a Canadian vacation for May/June back in January. We've had several schedule changes already and I monitor our flights every day. We can see Vancouver Island from our house and we have enjoyed many vacations and shopping trips to Canada.
Unless you own and operate a business that depends on Canadian tourism, who cares? Who cares if ANY country is booking less tickets to the US. NYC & Miami are still packed, I can assure you.
I'm booking more tickets to travel to other countries while their currency is getting absolutely pounded.
a) A lot of people are employed in the tourism industry. Once those people lose their jobs or their wages stagnate/drop, the businesses they used to visit will also lose money and then those people lose their jobs and so on. That’s how you get a recession.
b)NYC and Miami will always look packed but there any even minor drop in tourism is noticed and felt by local economies.
c) The value of the U.S....
a) A lot of people are employed in the tourism industry. Once those people lose their jobs or their wages stagnate/drop, the businesses they used to visit will also lose money and then those people lose their jobs and so on. That’s how you get a recession.
b)NYC and Miami will always look packed but there any even minor drop in tourism is noticed and felt by local economies.
c) The value of the U.S. dollar has actually dropped compared to major currencies in the past few months.
Agree with Ken. Who cares are the subset of Americans who rely on tourism especially northern states including swing stated like Michigan, Minnesota etc who see lots of tourism. Also, with the dollar so strong domestic tourism is already at risk to international tourism, so it's a double sided decline for the tourism industry that is at least in part driven by the 51st state rhetoric
@Mika, ok that I understand.
with point c) you can see the person above is not speaking honestly. which is par for the course for someone who wants people to believe there is any positive aspect of having an openly fascist administration
Tourism is cyclical. Folks in those industries (who used to be myself in NYC) are used to periods of time where business is much slower. That's why OnlyFans exists.
Lol because Canadians spend billions of dollars.... but if you run a business and do t care about money then you are correct.
Exchange of people between countries is almost always a good thing. Fosters understanding and new connections.
Did you read the part by Delta where it says consumer confidence is waning and domestic demand is dropping too :)
Enjoy :)
The tariffs that the US government has imposed is the main reason for this decline. As a Canadian, this makes me happy to see that we are choosing to spend our dollars elsewhere (me included).
To my american friends, good luck. Your votes have put your country in this position, and only you have the power to change that.
Elbows up!
"The tariffs that the US government has imposed is the main reason for this decline"
Please do perpetuate this idea. The US news does that enough. It's *not* the tariffs - it's the constant threat of invasion or annexation.
Are Montreal-style bagels any good? I've always wanted to try one.
Yep. They are excellent.
Any chance of getting back rent for this Stanley Cup we've been holding since '93 ? That might make a dent in your national debt.
Hopefully that number is mainly ashamed Americans (like me) who are deciding to vacation in Canada and Europe this year instead of the US.
And I am happy to announce that the following uBlock Origin filter is greatly enhancing my experience around here:
"onemileatatime.com##li.comment-author-tim-dunn"
Regardless of your political beliefs, there is nothing of value in this comment section. Turn back while you still can.
Amen to that Steven
Ethiopian Airlines is also suspending its 3 weekly flights to EWR from the 15th of April till June. I can only imagine that bookings have been very low/ cancellations that ET decided to cut those flights on such a short notice.
Fantastic to see! I'm hoping other countries start to do the same. If the USA wants to be on their own and destroy all their relationships, let them.
True but sad as a minority in the US are responsible for this. Trump and his cult don’t care. Yesterday I watched something on the news about a library that straddles the US CA border. The residents on the US side abhor what’s being done to their neighbours.
Like Brexit, we have to suffer because of a bunch of idiots who thought it would create so many benefits.
Icarus, Trump won the popular vote….
49% of 59% (voter turnout) is only 29% of the voting population, less than 23% of the total population, definitely elected my a minority of the US
Reagan would say absolute free trade. No tariffs on anything in either direction on products wholly sourced from either country. That is fair. But, that's not the objective. A political commentator on Russian state media expressly stated that Trump's position on Ukraine was both shallow & predictable once mineral resources came into play -- it's about him making money. The interest in Canada & Greenland is also about natural resources (money). Bless the Canadians.
Reagan would say absolute free trade. No tariffs on anything in either direction on products wholly sourced from either country. That is fair. But, that's not the objective. A political commentator on Russian state media expressly stated that Trump's position on Ukraine was both shallow & predictable once mineral resources came into play -- it's about him making money. The interest in Canada & Greenland is also about natural resources (money). Bless the Canadians.
One bright side to all this is the security and immigration lines at YUL should be shorter.
elect a clown, expect a circus.
I don't blame canadians one bit for not visiting the USA. It's pathetic that the mango mussolini wants to annex Canada and slapping senseless tariffs on them.
Either you're a clown or a Canadian.
Canada has been ripping us forever. Its time we add tariff to them.
It's a fair game. FAFO.
I think he is both a clown and a canadian
Canada buys more from the US than vice versa if you exclude oil, and I don't think the US needs to be taxing energy right now...
You are absolutely right and it was President Trump 1.0 who negotiated the trade deal that has allowed them to rip us off. Consider this, Red states are enacting legislation to prohibit chem-trails that the government uses to mind-control people. What about Jewish space lasers? Why doesn't the President do anything to stop it? Unless he has been behind it all along. Commander Thor from the Ice Wall wants answers . . . now.
The current trade relationship is based off treaties that Trump himself negotiated and signed during his first term as president.
Enjoy the tax. Cuz that's what your orange emperor is doing, taxing you not Canadians. Why can't brilliant Americans like you understand that. Also no, we have not been ripping you off. You have been whining ever since the implementation of NAFTA in the 1980s. What Trump whined about was the agreement he fostered when in office and was touting it being the best agreement in the world while doing his accordion hand gestures. Now...
Enjoy the tax. Cuz that's what your orange emperor is doing, taxing you not Canadians. Why can't brilliant Americans like you understand that. Also no, we have not been ripping you off. You have been whining ever since the implementation of NAFTA in the 1980s. What Trump whined about was the agreement he fostered when in office and was touting it being the best agreement in the world while doing his accordion hand gestures. Now he's trying to blame us for it???? Your propaganda sources have you so hooked that they could tell you we are hiding unicorns and you would believe it.
Pls stay back home. Still way many Candadians in South Florida this winter. Hopefully next winter they will be gone.
Sure, come back next year and tell us how many small business have closed because no more Canadians. You're an idiot.
@BC
I am all in favour of annexing Canada, but only if we can then give Florida and Texas to Mexico.
I am believing that this is all overblown, that things will return to normalcy soon enough.
The USA consumes more than it produces in what world is that being ripped off? We get away with it becausethe dollar is the reserve currency - which allows us to just print money to pay our debts. If the playing field was level and we had to produce as much as we consume - we would be poorer. By pissing off the world we are encouraging them not use dollars as the reserve currency. The more that happens the more we lose.
It likely won't last for any large amount of time as countries eventually settle disputes. I would imagine this is impacting Canadian carriers far more. Not sure for the US3 how much of their volume is Canada.
exactly.
a bunch of Canadians got their panties twisted by some comments that Trump made including the ridiculous notion that Canada would become part of the US.
Canadians have booed the American national anthem more at major sporting events than the other way around.
They cancelled their spring break trips to Florida.
Costs will be lower for Americans that go there.
and Air Canada and United, AC's joint venture partner, will be most affected.
Not sure if your examples are supposed to showcase American fragility, or Canadian fragility? You complain about Canadians getting their "panties twisted" by Trump and his regime lackies referring to Canada as the "51st state," but then jump to being butthurt about more Canadians booing at hockey games at "the Star Spangled Banner" than Americans booing at "O, Canada" (ignoring the fact that the booing crowd has been clearly provoked). Great that Americans will pay...
Not sure if your examples are supposed to showcase American fragility, or Canadian fragility? You complain about Canadians getting their "panties twisted" by Trump and his regime lackies referring to Canada as the "51st state," but then jump to being butthurt about more Canadians booing at hockey games at "the Star Spangled Banner" than Americans booing at "O, Canada" (ignoring the fact that the booing crowd has been clearly provoked). Great that Americans will pay less for spring break in Florida - but ignore the impact those discounted prices and decreased demand will have on hotel owners, restaurant owners, and their employees? And of course, couldn't help to end with a predictable speculative dig at the airline you as a Delta fan boy are constantly threatened by - United (spare us the predictable rejoinder with all the redundant bulletpoints you constantly harp on about how Delta is the greatest airline that ever lived SMH).
Dan,
Canadian hockey fans were the ones doing the most booing.
and it is a fact that UA carries more US-Canada traffic along w/ its JV partner AC. It has nothing to do with DL.
My statement is made specifically to note that it will be UA on the US side that is most impacted.
Aw, Timbits, you're just mad because Delta is a nonentity north of the 48th.
ORD, DA is rated 21 in the World Airline Rankings, AC on the other hand is only rated 29, therefore, your “Nonentity” is nonsense, yes?
Look at "aero" posting in defense of Tim Dunn again.
Aero, you lose credibility when you stay up so late in the UK so often.
It's almost like you're a fake profile of Tim Dunn. Oh wait. You are. Get a life, Tim. Defend your own statements. You seem too stupid to do anything but use a fake profile to defend your idiotic statements.
Tim, Get a life. Everyone knows you're aero (among your many fake guest names with no sense of time zones)
Agree that this likely isn't a long term. I think the Canadian carriers can significantly undercut the us big 3 on routes to Europe and Asia though.
Impacting Canadian carriers far more but impacting the travel industry in the United States far more. Travel is often one sided (Canada > to the U.S.).
I believe this ~70% number is regarding O&D US-Canada traffic. I wonder how Air Canada is doing with 6th freedom traffic on these routes - i.e. going between the US and Europe/Asia via Canada. Admittedly it can't make up for such a drop in O&D demand.
I would assume that for travel during this time period is dominated from the US. If it is, this would not be good for the Canadian tourism industry.
No. Canada is a mid tier destination at best. Travel has always been fueled by outbound travel rather then inbound not just to the United States but with anywhere in the world.
This is not good for the U.S. tourism industry.
In my "city" friend group it would be close to social suicide to do a big trip to the US for leisure. Anecdotal and I'm sure currency has something to do with it but I'm not surprised. I anticipate AC and WS will alter pricing strategies to undercut American carriers transporting all the Americans going to Europe and Asia with their strong dollar.
I hope Trump gets smart and releases tariffs. Unfortunately, I believe the damage is already done. Canada know hates the US, and it may take a long, long, time to get that trust back. Thanks again, Trump!!! Even though I'm a US citizen I have to still say this: please don't deport me!!!!!
To paraphrase what European(s) succinctly stated: "Americans haven't learned their lesson" ..
Maybe this second time around it'll sink in during/after the recession.
Sadly, a lot of us are slow learners!
The TDS is strong with you if you think the lack of Canadian leisure travel will push the US into a recession. I'm saying this as a disinterested observer btw.
No it will be tariffs, lack of confidence in any american company or government to live up to the terms of agreements, lack of workers to replace those that are deported, lack of confidence by domestic consumers and businesses (lowest in 12 years), and the wealth effect of having investments in the US rapidly evaporate. Oh, and a lack of international travelers.
So disinterested that you felt it necessary to reply, VladG?
@VladG: anyone who uses the term "TDS" is not disinterested.
Your use of TDS shows that you are not a disinterested observer. Only MAGA supporters use that acronym.
Anyone’s guess to what is causing this!? Threats of annexing, tariffs, urban gestapo detaining and deporting with no due process, verge of losing position of democracy based country etc. anyone’s guess though!
"urban gestapo detaining and deporting with no due process"
I thought the complaint about the Canadian visa fraudster being detained was that she was in custody for a week or two. Not that she was deported immediately.
No one wants to travel to a evil country and risk being deported, handcuffed and treated like an animal if the immigration officer is having a bad day or is a brainless MAGA.
Glad to hear you're not coming, you won't be missed
@TX, from a fellow TX.
Your shallow-mind is clear to see. You understand nothing about economics and geopolitics... your feeble-minded kind are doing the opposite of making America great again. You're making America an embarrassment, and poorer.
Sounds like a win-win then! I'll be taking my tourism dollar elsewhere for sure. I just don't like travelling to places with unstable regimes and iffy rule of law. I didn't think the US will ever be on that list, but hey, things change.
"and risk being deported, handcuffed and treated like an animal if the immigration officer is having a bad day or is a brainless MAGA."
Which case are we referring to?
1. The Canadian visa fraudster that had her visa revoked, tried to apply at the Canadian border, was rejected, then tried the same thing at the US-Mexico border?
2. The British woman that was working on a tourist visa which was why she was rejected...
"and risk being deported, handcuffed and treated like an animal if the immigration officer is having a bad day or is a brainless MAGA."
Which case are we referring to?
1. The Canadian visa fraudster that had her visa revoked, tried to apply at the Canadian border, was rejected, then tried the same thing at the US-Mexico border?
2. The British woman that was working on a tourist visa which was why she was rejected from Canada then was red flagged in the US for the rejection whereupon her visa fraud was discovered, and she was detained?
3. The German tattoo artist that was travelling with her supplies and had publicized her services, time, and location that she would be in the US violating her tourist visa?
Perhaps you believe that visa fraud should be a protected human right or something equally ridiculous.
P.S. Expedited deportations take about a week even in Europe if you cross a land border. So don't try that they were detained for too long.
If I'm ever denied entry to a country, I expect to be turned back to where I came from.. not sent to a MATA-t (maggot, get it?) gulag for no reason other than the brown shirts - err.. red hats - are sadistic assholes.
It would have been better if she had denied access immediately and not kept for two weeks in a cell without any explanation. How come this take two weeks? Haven’t you seen any borders patrols shows when people are denied access for visa problems then deportation is immediate or at the maximum the next day. Otherwise if it is something to do about crime like drugs smuggling then yes of course this requires detention and...
It would have been better if she had denied access immediately and not kept for two weeks in a cell without any explanation. How come this take two weeks? Haven’t you seen any borders patrols shows when people are denied access for visa problems then deportation is immediate or at the maximum the next day. Otherwise if it is something to do about crime like drugs smuggling then yes of course this requires detention and prosecution. Treating a visa problem as a criminal is not right.
The US does not rely on tourism to prop up its economy. Sure, it's unfortunate for the US hospitality industry, but domestic tourism will still be there and it won't cripple the American economy. A drop in the bucket, so to say.
Tariffs means the price of everyday goods will increase which means Americans will have less money to spend on travel.
The stock market dropping (whether you believe in it being an indicator of the economy or the country) means layoffs and wage stagnation.
So please don’t think Americans travelling within America will make up for all of this lol. Americans won’t be able to afford it and those who do travel internationally.
The Democrats, rightfully so, have long argued that the stock market is not the economy. However, if one chooses to ignore our skilled professionals on this topic, you will see that the Dow Jones closed today higher than it did in early October. The stock market is an emotional reactionary game. We would all do best to ignore it's daily ups & downs. Notice that whenever it's reported by media, they always say "Dow Jones...
The Democrats, rightfully so, have long argued that the stock market is not the economy. However, if one chooses to ignore our skilled professionals on this topic, you will see that the Dow Jones closed today higher than it did in early October. The stock market is an emotional reactionary game. We would all do best to ignore it's daily ups & downs. Notice that whenever it's reported by media, they always say "Dow Jones or S&P closed up or down 0.5% today" but more importantly they never give you the opening number. They often times never give the closing number. There's never a true comparison. It's always just reported as an absolute with no reference points. In any case, people tend to stick in their mind what they heard two weeks ago without doing any research on the current day. The stock market is a long game. Park your $ there for a few decades and forget about it.
"but domestic tourism will still be there"
Economic indicators point towards a recession. National parks are now understaffed and undermaintained. Tourism is already in decline due to post-COVID bump normalization AND increasing credit card debt causing belt tightening among the populace (which is being compounded by interest rates that may need to raise again). Domestic tourism IS BEING negatively impacted already.
What was it the other day. Westjet using a MAX to fly YHZ-BCN?
God knows why the orangeman is the way he is and it's an embarrassment the way he's treating our northern friends and neighbors, but just ouch.
Flying YHZ-BCN on a MAX?
No thank you.
Better an all-American from a blue state MAX than a foreign Airpus.
ORD, your post is clearly an attempt at disseminating click-bate.
No thinking person would actually risk a MAX flight if there was a safer Airbus alternative flight available, yes?
Aero, just post as Tim or don't post. You aren't fooling anyone. And Tim, your usual Airbus nonsense is still just that, nonsense.
ORD, there's no need to stoop to Tim's level of stupidity.
Strange how most AMERICAN airlines fly those awful Airbuses. Cry more.
Why are the prices still expensive if demands are down? Still seeing similar prices SFO-YVR compare to last year
Given the uncertainty induced by the on-again-off-again tariff situation, executives with cross-border interests have stated that they will not make strategic changes for fear of being whipsawed.
Your assumption is that price will make people want to travel to and from Canada whereas the assumption airlines are operating on is that price is irrelevant to this drop in travel. Hence why prices haven’t changed.
I compared some round-trip fares MIA-YVR and MIA-YYZ April thru August and like Joe, have not seen a big drop in airfare, maybe just a bit. But money talks and you would think that airlines would consider cheaper fares that would make people reconsider?
Would've thought if demand drops the prices will follow since the number of flights per day seems the same, just seem odd that the prices are similar or even more expensive now
I would love to see Air Canada use their 737s and 220 to add new routes to secondary European and Mexican cities
The OAG artice linked noted a shift by Westjet of 114 flights to Europe, with Edinburgh and Dublin benefitting, while Air Canada has not, possibly due to slot constraints at continential Europe airports. As Canada pivots closer to the EU, and the Trump regime continues a more hostile stance towards Europe, I wonder if we will see a time in the future where, due to political reasons, US airlines lose slots at European airports to...
The OAG artice linked noted a shift by Westjet of 114 flights to Europe, with Edinburgh and Dublin benefitting, while Air Canada has not, possibly due to slot constraints at continential Europe airports. As Canada pivots closer to the EU, and the Trump regime continues a more hostile stance towards Europe, I wonder if we will see a time in the future where, due to political reasons, US airlines lose slots at European airports to Canadian airlines, or Canadian airlines gain preferential status over US airlines.
A lot of this demand is from tourism or business travelers - the Canadian economy has neither the scale, technology, skill level, or companies to replace a fraction of the U.S. private and government sector or American spending.
After all, the Canadian economy is 8.5% the size of the U.S. and 62% of the nominal per capita income, so unless the EU wants to really shoot itself in its own foot and reduce its revenues...
A lot of this demand is from tourism or business travelers - the Canadian economy has neither the scale, technology, skill level, or companies to replace a fraction of the U.S. private and government sector or American spending.
After all, the Canadian economy is 8.5% the size of the U.S. and 62% of the nominal per capita income, so unless the EU wants to really shoot itself in its own foot and reduce its revenues and growth would be very unlikely. I hate the rhetoric, but let’s be real about the alternatives (or lack thereof) that currently exists vs the US. It’s either China who will keep dumping goods, engaging in IP theft, and continue decimating their manufacturing industries or the other American bully.
In the near term, this is true. But I just don't understand the shortsightedness of Trump regime supporters with regards to the long term economic impact of regime policies. I can think of 3 things off the top of my head that would collapse the US economy in the next decade, including a unified effort to drop the US Dollar as the world's reserve currency, refusing to buy/flooding the market with US Treasury bonds/debt, and...
In the near term, this is true. But I just don't understand the shortsightedness of Trump regime supporters with regards to the long term economic impact of regime policies. I can think of 3 things off the top of my head that would collapse the US economy in the next decade, including a unified effort to drop the US Dollar as the world's reserve currency, refusing to buy/flooding the market with US Treasury bonds/debt, and sanctioning US companies for collaboration with the illiberal regime (Europe already highly regulates the internet, so just as the US may ban TikTok, its not impossible to see them ban Meta, Google, etc). None of these thing are impossible, especially if US enemies and jilted former allies are on the same page. The "America is the greatest nation on earth" crowd unfortunately is rather poorly educated in global macroeconomics. We (I speak as an American) are NOT invincible.
First off I am not at all a Trump supporter. Secondly, most of what you mentioned is completely irrational and says something about yourself proclaiming others as poorly educated in global macroeconomics and then stating what you just did.
What would be the reprecussions of dropping the US Dollar as the world reserve currency? Every country would use their own currencies for global trade? There's a reason why the world shifted away from that, and...
First off I am not at all a Trump supporter. Secondly, most of what you mentioned is completely irrational and says something about yourself proclaiming others as poorly educated in global macroeconomics and then stating what you just did.
What would be the reprecussions of dropping the US Dollar as the world reserve currency? Every country would use their own currencies for global trade? There's a reason why the world shifted away from that, and it was to boost global trade and allow countries w/ weaker currencies to boost their reserves and participate. What would be the alternative? It won't be the euro b/c no one in Asia nor the US is interested in it which accounts for >50% of the global economy.
Similarly, foreign investors only own 29% of US debt (including Treasury bonds / debt) and this share is dropping. These investors don't purchase this debt out of the goodness of their hearts - it's considered the most reliable safe haven investment in the world. What would be the alternative? Will Japan and Saudi Arabia and other major debt holders join in on this cause? Why?
The reason why a blubbering idiot like Trump can get away with what he does is because the harsh reality is as polarized and frustrated as the American public is with the US and how it's done, Western (European, Canadian, and Australia) economies have done even worse whether it was Bush, Obama, Trump, or Biden, and all economist expect this to continue. There simply is far less major innovation, growth, and productivity from the West, and the most productive immigrants continue to flock away from Europe and to the US since that's where the $ and opp. is. Until that changes, the US can irritate and frustrate its allies, but if they're bringing less to the table then there's little they can do.
For instance, if the EU bans US tech companies, it will destroy Ireland's economy overnight. 75% of Ireland's corporate taxes are from US multinationals that operate in the country simply b/c it is a tax haven the majority of which comes from Apple and Google. It is estimated that these revenues drive ~20-25% of the country's GDP - do you think they'll be happy to see this disappear overnight?
Well, almost all of what the US is doing is irrational too from an economic perspective but it is happening right now with great fanfare.
Which means that things that might seem irrational from an economic perspective are not so much from a political.
What you are underestimating is the gigantic shift in public opinion in Canada and Europe away from granting the US the benefit of the doubt to putting them in...
Well, almost all of what the US is doing is irrational too from an economic perspective but it is happening right now with great fanfare.
Which means that things that might seem irrational from an economic perspective are not so much from a political.
What you are underestimating is the gigantic shift in public opinion in Canada and Europe away from granting the US the benefit of the doubt to putting them in the category as Russia and China, or worse, granting China more credibility as an honest broker than the US. Just look at Tesla: Sale in Europe are plummeting regardless wether the car is good and gets you good value for your Euro. You just dont want to be seen in one, and the US are becoming the Tesla in international politics. Sorry, but not sorry
I don't disagree that the US's current actions are irrational economically. Tariffs and global upheaval can and will disrupt and trust in the US, but as I mentioned, no global power is a good-faith actor. China has continued taken advantage of Europe and Asia and destroyed many of their domestic manufacturing industries and dumps their goods.
The part no one on this thread or elsewhere wants to confront is we have a global order based...
I don't disagree that the US's current actions are irrational economically. Tariffs and global upheaval can and will disrupt and trust in the US, but as I mentioned, no global power is a good-faith actor. China has continued taken advantage of Europe and Asia and destroyed many of their domestic manufacturing industries and dumps their goods.
The part no one on this thread or elsewhere wants to confront is we have a global order based on a world that no longer exists. The EU and US were about the same size economically in 1993 when the EU was formed. Today, EU states make up ~60% of US GDP - add UK, other non-member states, and Russia to count for all of mainland Europe, and you get to 90% of US GDP. These %'s are dropping by 5% every 5 years, and this is projected to continue. Add Canada and Australia to all of mainland Europe (inc. Russia), and you just about get the entire US economy today. That won't be true in 2030.
Why does that matter? Well France and the UK have UN Security Council seats today for no reason other than their colonial histories at this point. They are no longer in the top 5 most important countries in technology, innovation, economy, military strength, or other relevant metrics. Same holds for many other European states, yet we have institutions where they get disproportionate say (e.g., NATO, other UN orgs, etc.).
This is why we see a push from the Global South and BRICS. Ironically apart from the US (and Scandinavia), the issue is the West has stagnated post '08 yet expects to continue to be treated as they've historically been as equal peers. Well, the fundamental issue is unfortunately many of those countries are no longer peers bringing much to the table - a place like the Netherlands is basically a rounding error afterthought today despite being a major global power as late as the 70's. And if they don't get their house in order and countries like India and Vietnam keep growing, 2050 will be even uglier.
lol...just watch us.!!
Anecdotally, I have friends in Canada, and none of them would fly to the US on leisure travel. And yes, it's because of Trump, and who could blame them?
Absolutely!! USA is becoming a crap-whole of a country filled with Bubba's and rednecks under the Cheetoh regime. Get me outta here!!!!
I was just in TO two weeks ago, visiting friends on my way to the UK...talking to everyone, was whew! Are they bigly mad! And rightfully so...
Canadians have been anti-American for decades. They are jealous that Canadians like to rip each other off with high prices.
Canada bans Americans from buying a house in Canada. The US should retaliate by banning Canadians from buying a house in the US or even threaten to bomb Canada unless they start allowing Americans to buy a house there.
Trump complains that the Europeans are not spending their fair share in defense but...
Canadians have been anti-American for decades. They are jealous that Canadians like to rip each other off with high prices.
Canada bans Americans from buying a house in Canada. The US should retaliate by banning Canadians from buying a house in the US or even threaten to bomb Canada unless they start allowing Americans to buy a house there.
Trump complains that the Europeans are not spending their fair share in defense but Canada is even worse. They are a bunch of jealous freeloaders.
Lots of countries and places don’t allow foreign citizens to purchase property. You would have to bomb lots of Europe as well.
Also the USA is free to ban foreigners from purchasing property in the U.S. as well! Ironically that’s a policy that leftists and liberals like AOC fight for as a way to drive housing costs down lol. Your idea to ban Canadians from being able to purchase property would actually be welcomed...
Lots of countries and places don’t allow foreign citizens to purchase property. You would have to bomb lots of Europe as well.
Also the USA is free to ban foreigners from purchasing property in the U.S. as well! Ironically that’s a policy that leftists and liberals like AOC fight for as a way to drive housing costs down lol. Your idea to ban Canadians from being able to purchase property would actually be welcomed by many, and I bet not by the people you like but the ones you don’t.
So it’s an anti-American country of “jealous freeloaders” but you wanna buy a house there so badly that you’re suggesting the US threaten to bomb them into submission?
There’s really no critical thinking with you people, huh? Don’t blame the Canadians here.
Bomb someone over not being able to buy property? Why not nuke them?
Canadian here. I've always liked the US and Americans. The tariffs are one thing, we've had tariff spats before. What we aren't cool with is the 51st state rhetoric. We can't support you folks when you are questioning our sovereignty. Would you travel to a country that's threatening yours?
Canada bans all non-Canadians from purchasing homes here due to our housing crisis. It's nothing against Americans. Your country should consider a similar policy, and we'd...
Canadian here. I've always liked the US and Americans. The tariffs are one thing, we've had tariff spats before. What we aren't cool with is the 51st state rhetoric. We can't support you folks when you are questioning our sovereignty. Would you travel to a country that's threatening yours?
Canada bans all non-Canadians from purchasing homes here due to our housing crisis. It's nothing against Americans. Your country should consider a similar policy, and we'd be fine with it, aside from a few complaining snowbirds. Bombing us over a difference in domestic policy would be a bit nuts, don't you think? Are you really that desperate to buy a 500sq ft condo in Toronto for a million bucks?
As for our NATO commitments, yeah, we aren't doing enough. We should meet our 2% commitment because that's what we signed up for. I've never liked that we don't pay our fair share. That will definitely get fixed now, but we can't even spend our money on US equipment, because we can't buy from a country that's threatening to invade us. We'll have to ramp up our own domestic production, which the US has historically been super against. Canada is freeloading, sure, but only because the US benefits from it. The more Canada spends on security, the more the US will spend to counter the perceived threat of an armed country on its border. Canada re-arming costs the US way more than it saves. Do you want us to build nukes too? The US got pretty tetchy when Cuba did that back in the day.
All the best from this not-jealous Canadian. I'd prefer not to fight y'all in an insurgency that'll make Afghanistan look tame, but I'll give my life to defend my country if I have to. The fact that the US is forcing us to think of them like an enemy is why travel is down 70%+.
Canadian here too. Great balanced comment.
But I actually don’t get the 51st rambling by Trump being something Canadians are upset about.
We always colloquially teased we are Americas 51st in practice due to economic links. Say the loud part out loud….and everyone gets mad. It’s just cuz Trump said it. It’s also he never said he would bomb Canada in submission to get it. It was a rambling musing by a senile...
Canadian here too. Great balanced comment.
But I actually don’t get the 51st rambling by Trump being something Canadians are upset about.
We always colloquially teased we are Americas 51st in practice due to economic links. Say the loud part out loud….and everyone gets mad. It’s just cuz Trump said it. It’s also he never said he would bomb Canada in submission to get it. It was a rambling musing by a senile man. Keep your eye on the economic prize. That’s where the issues lie most. Don’t let these insults take Canada off the game and focus on getting rid of the tariffs.
we know who you voted for :-(
Listen to Derek. He has all the solutions. Let's just bomb Canada. Terrific.
Want some twisted to go with that bitter?
290,000 bookings too many
Trump hates Canada so you gotta hate them too. Same with Ukraine.
Loving Russia is OK 'cause Trump loves them bigly.
Them's the rules if you're a patriot.
probably a good idea for free countries to begin disentangling their economies with the US to the extent reasonably possible
LOL good luck with that